Honestly, this is wrong. I have a degree in Electrical Engineering and years of experience for reference. While yes the alternator is a crucial part of the system, It's 1: laggy, meaning the moment the system pulls power there is a delay between when it will produce more power for the system and 2, its far from the source(higher resistance, and technically longer travel time for current to reach it's destination). The alternator is a charging point for the batteries. The batteries are not backups to the alternator. The batteries run the system, the alternator charges the batteries. When we look at devices that use batteries(phones, remotes, laptops, etc) batteries are the primary point of power with chargers or replacement batteries used to keep the product functioning, in gaming laptops regulations dont allow the battery to be big enough to use on its own but a car audio system is different. But the batteries are your primary point of draw from the amplifier from the point of being able to provide current. IF you have a 270A Alternator and you don't have a battery that can sustain 270A draw from the system, your system will not perform as well as having stock alt and a battery that can handle the current draw. Even more important, music is dynamic, it is not always pulling max current. The battery is the most vital part of the system's ability to put out X amount of current INSTANTLY. The alternator allows the batteries to stay charged or produced sustained current draws for longer periods of time.
I also have an engineering degree; glad to have you here. But in all honesty; all three should be installed whenever possible. I simply favor the alt as the primary choice.
From an automotive technician standpoint....it really depends on the vehicle. Newer vehicles have far more modules(computers), components and electronics relying on it's power source. I normally recommend an upgraded/ secondary battery first for 2 reasons. It's an easier option/can be installed at home by most ppl and most can be used universally as a secondary.
@BudgetBassHead Look here I agree with you 💯 ..setup: (2) Skar EVL 15's and a Taramps 3K MD 2ohm on my stock alternator my headlights were dimming and whatnot BUT isn't the alternator the ❤ of you car audio setup? 🤔
Big 3 should be first then battery then alternator. Big 3= $50 battery= 250-$400 Alternator for a really good one= 300-$600. If you have the money just do all 3 but if you on a budget do the big 3 and battery I’ve had no issues with my voltage on a stock alt 3k never drops below 12v and lastly I finally got a 320 alt and will be putting that in shortly. But I do think all of these should be in your vehicle but you do not need to alternator first ALTHOUGH it will help tremendously. In my opinion it’s the money 🤷♂️
I get it most will say the battery is key it is but strain on alt leads to premature death alt charge battery battery runs the system and produce as needed
You can buy a bigger alt but if you don’t have the wire to support it aka big 3 enjoy replacing those cables and fuses bc they aren’t going to handle the current of that new alt. Hence y I say big 3 then alt or do both at same time.
he said first in theory yes u will need big 3 to support but some ppl actually think big 3 go help big on stock electrical tru but spend the money on both in theory u need the alt which requires big 3
Kind of absurd to say. So I guess your implying that the stock wires are gonna magically demand more power on them because its available. And with a notion that they also are not designed with headroom. Sure under the right situation you can be correct but to blindly state this without details of the loads and equipment installed you must be psychic.
Every HO Alternator website I've visited has EXPLICIT instructions to also buy the Big 3 upgrade to go With the HO Alternator. Not to mention that an alternator will only produce the amperage that the car demands. (It will not over charge the system) 🤦🏻
Good video... everything u explained was accurate i had to upgrade my alternator from a 220amp to a 320amp..my amplifier blew my stock alternator it couldn't keep up so bigger alternator plus the big 3..plays flawless now.. voltage stays around 14.3 before it would dip to low 12's so it's a must to upgrade on larger systems
I like this because I was going to get the batteries ECT first and this just made hell I'm mean hell of since 🤔👍 now getting a alternator before my XS battery d3400 ,🤗
Dont buy the D3400 at all lol. Can get a well made LifePo4 bank or build your own for $400-500 nowadays and be better off than 5 or 6 of those d3400s. Do your big 3 first, then your alt, then upgrade your battery reserve. Think about what batteries you are going to run before upgrading your alt either way, let the alternator company know what voltage you need to charge at, they will make sure the right regulator is installed.
Im 57 years old I have my system setup for daily driving?I have a 2021kia soul s with a 150 stock alternator with a big 3 upgrade?I just bought a 300 amp alternator?I have a jp63 amplifier on a 99Dd 18 ? For back up I have 400ah of reserve ?I don't want to hear about what can't be done?My gain is set correctly at full tilt it drops from 14.4 to 13.8 and I been driving like this for a year now without any problems Another thing is i don't abuse my equipment
This is y I like lithium. Being that they don’t take half as long to charge to full as an agm or lead acid it’s not as taxing on the alt. I had huge improvements on stock alt switching from my lead acid to lithium and I feel my alt isnt getting taxed that much. However I still think that the alt is a good start but switching to a lithium bank is right up there with it.
This makes a lot of sense but if you're going to upgrade your alternator you MUST do a big 3 upgrade right along with it so your electrical can handle the current flow.
The problem with your logic is you are using an amp that should easily be powered by the stock wiring to start with. The alternator may provide more power but only what the max amperage of the stock wiring. You are also assuming that the stock alternator is already too small for the car it is installed in. The alternator at stock should provide at least 20% more than what would be required to power every electrical system in your car at the same time. Upgrading the alternator without providing wiring that is capable of carrying more current is a potential hazard from overheating the wiring. The alternator can only supply what the stock wiring is capable of carrying. If you have a 300 amp alternator you will be lucky to see half that with stock wiring.
I guess i didnt understand your intentions with your question. I'd still do the Big3 to prep for the HO alt. I personally wouldnt bother installing a HO alt with stock electrical.
@nicholasdillworth7428 the only reason I might NOT upgrade the wiring before the alt arrives is if I'm adapting an alt that was never designed for my vehicle... so if the posts/connections are configured differently, I may wait until the HO alt arrives so that I can make sure to measure twice and cut once. I guess this whole concept might seem silly to people nowadays, but back in the earlier oughts, it wasn't uncommon for budget-SPL guys to fab brackets and run multiple junkyard minivan or SUV alts in their vehicles 🤷
BUDGET THEY SAID THE COMMUNITY APPRECIATES THE FACT THAT YOU PUT SO MUCH EFFORT INTO YOUR VIDEOS AND EXPLAINING WHAT'S GOING ON WHILE YOU'RE DOING YOUR VIDEOS MAN KUDOS TO YOU🎉🎉🎉
Anytime I add an amplifier to a car, I always add a big 3 wire upgrade at the same time. It barely addd any cost to the wiring that I’m already putting in.
So I’m currently HAVING this ultimatum 🤦🏻♂️ and I have searched and researched and called everyone! I was and STiLL kinda am under the same impression as this/you in this video! BUT…when I call the alternator company’s they actually recommended and steered me Away from buying a HO Alt from them and recommended me upgrading my battery 1st, I feel they would know best, but I still kinda feel like a HO alt would be best but, they mentioned you have to make sure your current battery can take the draw or something from the new alt, still not quite sure what that or it all means! I would think I would need enough amperes to cover what my amp(S) use ATLEAST musically, bc no single battery, in my opinion would put out the kinda amperes I would need, under the hood! Agm atleast! I’m still conflicted and can’t quite get a definitive answer, bc other shops/pro installers I call recommend ALT! 😩
We forgot a couple of things. 1. Efficiency rating of the amp. The correct amp draw calculation for a 1000 watt amplifier at 14.4 volts has to compensate for the efficiency of the amplifier. Most amplifiers operate at around 70% efficiency. So the correct calculation is (1000/14.4) / .7, which gives you an actual amp draw of 99 amps. So we understated the amount of power that we need. Now it is true that because of the dynamic nature of the musical sound signal, we are probably not going to see a consistent 99 amp draw from the amplifier, we still want to upgrade to a point where the electrical system can withstand a draw of that amount should it become necessary. 2. The alternator takes time to get power to where it's needed. It's not capable of providing power to a device that uses the power at the moment that the device needs it. For that reason alone, a lithium battery is the first upgrade that should be done. That gives the device a bank of stored power that it can access at will while allowing the alternator time to replenish what was used. Lithium is cheap now. You can get a 74 amp hour lithium battery that puts out 400 amps continuous for $199 right now. Here's the link. jag35.com/products/fully-assembled-12v-lev60f-battery-lifepo4 You can connect that to your vehicle's system right after the initial charge it's plug n play. Lithium has big storage capacity and big discharge capability. And the price drop makes it the go to option from an Electromechanical and budgetary standpoint. I appreciate you though man. Been watching you from day 1. Just wanna do my part in helping to get the info out.
I've been told of or referred to this exact setup a few times. My issue is that for every one person telling me that this will suffice for my 1500w Amp and 110a alternator, with plug n play. I then run into 3 or 4 other people saying that 600a isn't enough to bother spending the money on. I have mad voltage drop going on in my car whenever the Bass drops. It goes from 14v down to 12.2v whenever the lights and a/c are on (while it's raining) and I know that this can't be good for my car. I already have the Big 3 upgrade in 1/0 OFC. Would this really work in my situation? Also, the link shows it's $399 What's the difference between the Pro and the Plus versions besides the almost $200 gap!
bro enjoyed the class know about it but u explain it to a key tried to help a few frinds out they got 5k amps with stock electronics 2 ahms with 150alts they loud but in time they ran threw alt and batteries and they didnt even top off attery at night or any night lol
Man, it appears to me that you did not take into account the efficiencies of the stereo equipment or normal usage of the car electronics. Your analysis is based on running the amp, sub, speakers and the rest of the car at full power all the time thus stressing the alternator. Where that might be accurate for a competition setup it's not the same for everyday use. Rule of thumb is a sub when used normally draw roughly 50% power and the speakers draw 25%. Using this method and let's say your amp has an 80% efficiency rating so you're not drawing the full amperage that the equation determines. The car does not have everything electrical running all at the same time full tilt as well.
Great video! I have to admit, it was a stupid idea, but I had some ultra capacitors to test what they'd do to a stock system. The 500 F bank did so well. It's using your alternator of course to full capacity, all the time :-) and it's not a good idea to demo this setup. ( 25 min max then you need to chill) Everything musical outside of sinus wave works. I've been able to use a fairly big amp in that car with stable volts
This is completely wrong as the intire in qoute experiment . 2014 kia Optima. You upgrade the alt all you want but it wont help. What about needs? What about pwm controlled alts. If your alt can handle the needs but the stock cables in that car specifically are to small for the stock alt and had tons of electrical problems. Next the big 3 is only opening the gate allowing full flow i stead of residence holding it back. So now let do like you said i put a 360 ho alt in. What did it do. Nothing. Pwn controlled. So in all youd need all off them to make a complete difference. 80 percent is what the car draws. Youd need a second battery as well. So when this question comes up it all depends on your needs.
@BudgetBassHead- The proper way is to do the big three, with the appropriate sized wire/cables, while putting in the upgraded alternator.Then batteries for more reserve, and voltage stability, for quick amperage surges, that the alternator cannot react quickly enough to. I understand your example/diagram, but for the average 1k, 1-ohm stable amp, if wired to 1 ohm, will only be pulling about a max of 60% of that 70 amps= 42 amps, because of impedance rise, while playing music. Furthermore, "MOST" people will not drive around with all of there accesories on. Just turning off the A/c unit frees up approx. 40 amps of current, and that along with the 15 amps figured into the factories surplus amperage= 55 Amps available, to power this amp with the 42 Amp requirements, @ max volume.
I have a 1995 F250. It came with a 90 amp alternator. I had an old man ( at an alternator shop in Detroit) rebuild a junkyard alternator I got to 135 amp. What a HUGE difference all the way around! Only bad thing is the truck needed additional chassis grounds, Ford does a poor job by using braided straps to ground. I added 3 additional 0 gauge chassis and battery grounds.
I would increase the standard batterie to a AGM size around 50-100% + an capacitor min. 1F -1.5F for 1000wrms. Maybe a 50% bigger alt as standart. And if you dont drive a lot you should charge you battery or control it 1x a week. Cause not anyone want 2 run a second battery or a splitter between the battery.
Uhhh, this is wrong lol. Every single HO alt I've ever installed literally required the big 3 to be done before installation or you void the warranty. Dont try and trust factory wiring to handle 300+ amps of charging current. Do the damn big 3 first.
I always say get the biggest alternator available for your vehicle because you can never over supply your system with amperage. Then since you are spending $300-$400 on an alternator you might as well spend $50 on that BIG3. With all that you will still be spending less than you would on a decent battery
Keep in mind that the biggest alternator for your vehicle isn't always the best option. You have to look at the pros and cons. Typically the highest max output is going to give you the least amount of output at idle. So if you spend a lot of time at idle you might want to go with a slightly lower powered alternator so that you have more output at idle speeds. You also want to take into account how much belt wrap you have. I could fit a 400 amp alternator on my vehicle but due to the small amount of belt wrap, it would just slip under heavy load. So in my case I'm limited to about 250 to 270 amp.
@@JasonWW2000 ^ this right here!! A high output alternator was the WORST upgrade I ever did for my system. They put out way LESS amperage at idle then the stock alternator. Headlight dimming (and hence power compression on the bass hits) was horrible at red lights. Unless you make a custom overdrive pulley system for a HO alternator you will be sorry you ever got one.
My only question is wouldn't upgrading the alternator without upgrading the wire burn up The wire? And what happens if you do both at the same time but don't upgrade the battery? Wouldn't you overload the battery? Serious question.
This is an accurate video. The real truth is that alternators, or as we were taught in school "the AC generator", is an expensive part to upgrade. I am a dinosaur. I run old stuff and in my personal opinion when working on old vehicles the BIG 3 is the way to go. Modern vehicles don't experience as many problems when keeping the power under a 1000w as you demonstrated. You are one smart cookie and I love your content. Second batteries work, too; as it relates to sustained stiffening of on longer bass notes. You guys run so much power these days I don't understand the efficiency as it relates to wasting interior vehicle space when you could otherwise add more woofers.. lol The alternator is the most expensive best ROI hands down.
Just a note guys , unless you driving around playing test tones, your equipment wont be demanding that amperage constantly, music is dynamic some notes will demand power in small tiny few second bursts, the rest of the time its not pulling much
The saying goes it takes power to make power. I have 320 amp alternator, two agm batteries, and jp630 Supercap bank. I’m running two skar rp 4500 strapped at half ohm on a fi audio mt 12.
@BrianWaller-qe7gr- Did you mean you have your rp-4500s strapped @ 1 ohm= each amp then sees a 1/2 ohm load internally? I ❤️my Fi Built subwoofers as well.
@@evilinside5984 yep. Technically this amps are only stable at 1ohm but i metered it and confirmed it’s half ohm and amps barely warm after 30 minutes full tilt
I don't see how getting the bigger alt should come first. If the stock wiring can't handle the current demand. Adding a higher output alt can only help a bit. Think about it like a water line into your house. If they put a half inch line into your house no matter how much pressure you have pushing water to the line the half inch pipe can only flow so much. Putting a large alt cannot make the electrical handle more. The wires in the car from the manufacturer are designed to handle the load of the car plus the ten to fifteen%. You are better off getting the big three and bigger batteries. Then bigger alt. Think about it even the people with three 400 amp alternators still have massive battery banks. Adding a bigger alt to inadequate wiring will heat things up.
My 2018 Impala came stock with a 150A alt. The stock, chassis, ground wire was 4ga @38in long. That cable can withstand over 250A at that length; far exceeding the stock alt. So how is the stock wiring not efficient? Simply do the math and upgrade whatever is necessary.
Cleaning the connections first is what one should do, if the alt is on the way out, replace it and also upgrade it and the wires, there is no such thing as big three, its a myth, the short runs of the wires are usually enough for the current the alternator can provide, the only thing you could do is get a battery as a first upgrade
@eustahijelifetips well that's not true. The wires are short but are only like 8 gauge at best. Depending on the car. Not ment to handle an extra 100 + amps. That's why you need to upgrade the wire first. Unless your just adding a 200 watt or do amp to your door speakers.
@BudgetBassHead you're absolutely right. The stock wiring exceeds the stock alt. So if your adding a moderate upgrade to your stereo you're fine. If you're putting in a 600 watt amp for mids and highs. Plus a 2000 watt amp for your subs. Then you need to upgrade or add to your electrical. Which means exactly what you said. Upgrade what is necessary. Wires, alt, batteries. If you just upgrade an alt. You could still be starving your amps for power and inducing premature clipping. Even in your house that takes power from the power lines. Ample power. They still base the breaker box and wiring on the current load of your home.
Keep in mind that small wires in a short length can handle a lot of current, but they heat up and can reduce your voltage. This is why people that do the big three end up seeing an increase in their overall voltage.
Zero gauge power from battery to distribution block. Then 4 gauge from block to amp if they don't take zero gauge.. zero gauge your ground to chassis 🤔🤗
I still disagree. When i replaced my stock wires, i cut the old ones open. 10 yrs in the rust belt and honda having bare wire grounds proves, to me, that the wires should be 1rd. They were corroded, 12 inches into the wire sheath and the core of the wire was burnt looking. So yes i would do the big 3, then battery, then alt. Also if money dont grow on trees, you can take a battery and wires to a new car. But the alt gets left, or sold. Just something extra to take into consideration!!
The batteries primary purpose is to start the engine. Once the engine is running you can disconnect the battery and drive from California to New York if you wanted to.
The electrical system runs off the battery. The alternator charges the battery. The higher output alternator helps keep the battery charged under a heavy load. Your formula is correct. I believed; big 3 ,highest cold cranking amp battery that fits . Or lithium, then Alternator.
Storage my freind...so when that big bass drop you will have that voltege right there ready to respond. it dont all just come from the alt.the alt is the supplier the batts are the distributeur to the amps And BOOM GOES THE BASS HIT😅
@@BudgetBassHeadin ol scool..Def not todays trucks and cars..yuo got to stop for gas and will need to turn the engine off!!!! But i get what your saying tho
Jaye BASS IN ORDER TO GET A SUCCESSFUL UPGRADE IN ELECTRICAL THE BIG THREE THE ALTERNATOR AND THE BATTERIES MUST BE UPGRADED IN ORDER TO RUN YOUR SYSTEM PROPERLY MY LAST SOUND SYSTEM WAS OVER 10,000 WATTS OF POWER DIY GUY AND I'LL JUST SAY THIS ONCE I UPGRADED MY ALTERNATOR TO A 350 AMP PUT TO A GM BATTERIES IN AND RAN ALL DOUBLE ZERO GAUGE WIRES AND DID MY BIG THREE I WAS SLAMMING HARDER THAN MOST DUDES THAT SPENT 15 GRAND ON INSTALL PLUS EQUIPMENT JUST SAYING IT DOESN'T TAKE AN ENGINEERING DEGREE TO FIGURE THESE THINGS OUT IT'S CALLED COMMON SENSE
Yeah doing a big three alone is not enough. Even if you put in a higher amperage alternator you still have to do a big three for that alternator as well. Only then Will adding a second battery actually make some kind of sense. That's just my opinion. Just a self-taught audio guy like everybody else. A lot of trial and error
Everyone should note that a HO alternator will most likely make LESS current at idle then your stock alternator. They really need some RPM's to make their rated power. You will have worse headlight dimming at idle and red lights then you do now.
WELL IN MY OPINION SHOULD YOU REMOVE THE ALTERNATOR AND PUT THE BATTERIES IN AND TRY TO START YOUR VEHICLE WHAT WILL BE THE OUTCOME BECAUSE IT DEFINITELY WILL NOT START SO THE BATTERIES DO NOT RUN ANYTHING AND THIS RESPONSES TO THE ELECTRICIAN THAT'S BEEN AN ELECTRICIAN FOR SO MANY YEARS😂😂😂
I think your whole explanation in this video is theoretical and not realistic. In the real world, your automobile is not being maxed out. In fact, my navigator typically only uses 25 amps to run the vehicle and then there is additional amperage being drawn to recharge the battery. That amperage might start off high such as 40 amp and then it gradually goes down as the battery becomes charged up. I encourage everybody to buy a DC clamp meter and see what kind of amperage your vehicle is actually drawing as well as their amplifiers and battery. Your typical 1000 watt amplifier is very rarely ever being maxed out. Most people don't load down the amplifier to get all the power in the first place and then the music is dynamic so you're getting small surges of current draw. In order to measure the amplifier current you want to look at it's efficiency. A 1000 watt amplifier at full power may actually draw 1300 W if it's 70% efficient. At 14.4v that's around 90 amps of current, not 69. As I said though, most people are rarely maxing out the amp.
That being said, it is good for people to understand the theory of what's going on. As far as theory goes, I think you did a good job on this video. I just wanted to make a distinction between theory and reality because there can be quite a big difference. I myself have had systems with several thousands of watts and ran them just fine on the stock electrical system because of the dynamic nature of music and I didn't push my amplifiers really hard.
Well spoken. But not everyone drives an Escalade and practices proper gain control. Most vehicles I've seen from my subscriber's videos are 10 years old with every amp setting maxed out 😄.
@@BudgetBassHeadI'm not sure how to respond to that. So let's say they only care about maximum volume. I can still recommend they buy an inexpensive DC clamp meter and see what kind of amperage they're actually drawing. They can still learn by doing that. They might think their system is loud, but measure half the amperage that their amp is rated for. That can tell them that their impedance is a little too high and lowering it can produce more power. It's basically about educating yourself and understanding what your system is doing, then you can make changes to improve it. The same concept is true if you're into SQ, SPL or whatever. Knowledge is power.
@@JasonWW2000- I clamped a pair of strapped "3500" watt amplifiers, wired to a .6 ohm load= each strapped amp was seeing .3 ohms internally @ rest! Each amp pulled just over 550 amps x 2= the pair of "3500" watt amps pulled over 1,100 Amps 👀of current, @ 14.0 volts, starting voltage was 18.0 volts= i can't believe i didn't blow up the 2 xs power, XP1000 16 volt batteries! Nothing like a 4 volt drop😉😁😆😂 I fixed that by getting rid of those and running 20 Batteries in total, and 19- XS Power, D1600, agm, 16 volt batteries, of which were in the back, next to my bass amp(s).
@@evilinside5984That's a good example of the difference between theory and reality. Some people build a system and have no idea what amperage they're pulling. Some don't even monitor the voltage! 😅 I wish more people thought like a scientist. First learn the theory and then start measuring things. You learn about your system and can make it louder, better, more efficient. 👍
Honestly, this is wrong. I have a degree in Electrical Engineering and years of experience for reference. While yes the alternator is a crucial part of the system, It's 1: laggy, meaning the moment the system pulls power there is a delay between when it will produce more power for the system and 2, its far from the source(higher resistance, and technically longer travel time for current to reach it's destination). The alternator is a charging point for the batteries. The batteries are not backups to the alternator. The batteries run the system, the alternator charges the batteries. When we look at devices that use batteries(phones, remotes, laptops, etc) batteries are the primary point of power with chargers or replacement batteries used to keep the product functioning, in gaming laptops regulations dont allow the battery to be big enough to use on its own but a car audio system is different. But the batteries are your primary point of draw from the amplifier from the point of being able to provide current. IF you have a 270A Alternator and you don't have a battery that can sustain 270A draw from the system, your system will not perform as well as having stock alt and a battery that can handle the current draw. Even more important, music is dynamic, it is not always pulling max current. The battery is the most vital part of the system's ability to put out X amount of current INSTANTLY. The alternator allows the batteries to stay charged or produced sustained current draws for longer periods of time.
I also have an engineering degree; glad to have you here. But in all honesty; all three should be installed whenever possible. I simply favor the alt as the primary choice.
From an automotive technician standpoint....it really depends on the vehicle. Newer vehicles have far more modules(computers), components and electronics relying on it's power source.
I normally recommend an upgraded/ secondary battery first for 2 reasons.
It's an easier option/can be installed at home by most ppl and most can be used universally as a secondary.
@BudgetBassHead Look here I agree with you 💯 ..setup: (2) Skar EVL 15's and a Taramps 3K MD 2ohm on my stock alternator my headlights were dimming and whatnot BUT isn't the alternator the ❤ of you car audio setup? 🤔
Big 3 should be first then battery then alternator. Big 3= $50 battery= 250-$400
Alternator for a really good one= 300-$600. If you have the money just do all 3 but if you on a budget do the big 3 and battery I’ve had no issues with my voltage on a stock alt 3k never drops below 12v and lastly I finally got a 320 alt and will be putting that in shortly. But I do think all of these should be in your vehicle but you do not need to alternator first ALTHOUGH it will help tremendously. In my opinion it’s the money 🤷♂️
I get it most will say the battery is key it is but strain on alt leads to premature death alt charge battery battery runs the system and produce as needed
You can buy a bigger alt but if you don’t have the wire to support it aka big 3 enjoy replacing those cables and fuses bc they aren’t going to handle the current of that new alt. Hence y I say big 3 then alt or do both at same time.
You cant upgrade the alt without upgrading wires!
You should be upgrading the alternator and big 3 at the same time.
he said first in theory yes u will need big 3 to support but some ppl actually think big 3 go help big on stock electrical tru but spend the money on both in theory u need the alt which requires big 3
Gonna be a whole bunch of melted charging and ground wires out there after this video. Hope y'all have fire insurance lol
Kind of absurd to say. So I guess your implying that the stock wires are gonna magically demand more power on them because its available. And with a notion that they also are not designed with headroom. Sure under the right situation you can be correct but to blindly state this without details of the loads and equipment installed you must be psychic.
@TyGeer I might be. Just from personal experience and friends that's all. Some people get away with stock wiring never have issues. I did.
Every HO Alternator website I've visited has EXPLICIT instructions to also buy the Big 3 upgrade to go With the HO Alternator. Not to mention that an alternator will only produce the amperage that the car demands. (It will not over charge the system) 🤦🏻
Good video... everything u explained was accurate i had to upgrade my alternator from a 220amp to a 320amp..my amplifier blew my stock alternator it couldn't keep up so bigger alternator plus the big 3..plays flawless now.. voltage stays around 14.3 before it would dip to low 12's so it's a must to upgrade on larger systems
Good stuff
how many watts are you using
@@rmyrie5963 I'm running just a single vxf skar 2 stage enclosure box on a ct sounds 3200.1 amp with extra battery
@@rmyrie5963 potentially, 8,000+. But I only fed it about 5,000 dynamically
I like this because I was going to get the batteries ECT first and this just made hell I'm mean hell of since 🤔👍 now getting a alternator before my XS battery d3400 ,🤗
Dont buy the D3400 at all lol. Can get a well made LifePo4 bank or build your own for $400-500 nowadays and be better off than 5 or 6 of those d3400s. Do your big 3 first, then your alt, then upgrade your battery reserve. Think about what batteries you are going to run before upgrading your alt either way, let the alternator company know what voltage you need to charge at, they will make sure the right regulator is installed.
Im 57 years old I have my system setup for daily driving?I have a 2021kia soul s with a 150 stock alternator with a big 3 upgrade?I just bought a 300 amp alternator?I have a jp63 amplifier on a 99Dd 18 ? For back up I have 400ah of reserve ?I don't want to hear about what can't be done?My gain is set correctly at full tilt it drops from 14.4 to 13.8 and I been driving like this for a year now without any problems Another thing is i don't abuse my equipment
Yep I was using my 500w LeigesAudio and the lights were like a strobe when the bass hit.
Great teaching and getting people to understand the facts.
Super cool video, thank you for expaining it in simple terms.
This is y I like lithium. Being that they don’t take half as long to charge to full as an agm or lead acid it’s not as taxing on the alt. I had huge improvements on stock alt switching from my lead acid to lithium and I feel my alt isnt getting taxed that much. However I still think that the alt is a good start but switching to a lithium bank is right up there with it.
are you running a battery delete or running in parallel
@@scottbe1 never mix lithium chemistry no matter what
@@rmyrie5963 I don’t see a problem with doing lishen and headway or something similar being they r lifepo4
What lithium you go with and how much power?
@@rmyrie5963 I don’t see an issue with mixing headway and lishen being they r both lifepo4
This makes a lot of sense but if you're going to upgrade your alternator you MUST do a big 3 upgrade right along with it so your electrical can handle the current flow.
The problem with your logic is you are using an amp that should easily be powered by the stock wiring to start with. The alternator may provide more power but only what the max amperage of the stock wiring. You are also assuming that the stock alternator is already too small for the car it is installed in. The alternator at stock should provide at least 20% more than what would be required to power every electrical system in your car at the same time. Upgrading the alternator without providing wiring that is capable of carrying more current is a potential hazard from overheating the wiring. The alternator can only supply what the stock wiring is capable of carrying. If you have a 300 amp alternator you will be lucky to see half that with stock wiring.
I guess i didnt understand your intentions with your question. I'd still do the Big3 to prep for the HO alt. I personally wouldnt bother installing a HO alt with stock electrical.
Understood
I second this, big3/4 with 1/0 OFC wire, none of that cca wire
Definitely agree.Every HO alt, requires big 3 anyways. Might as well do it first so it's already there when you install a HO alt.
Yea it needs go in at the same time...if possible
@nicholasdillworth7428 the only reason I might NOT upgrade the wiring before the alt arrives is if I'm adapting an alt that was never designed for my vehicle... so if the posts/connections are configured differently, I may wait until the HO alt arrives so that I can make sure to measure twice and cut once. I guess this whole concept might seem silly to people nowadays, but back in the earlier oughts, it wasn't uncommon for budget-SPL guys to fab brackets and run multiple junkyard minivan or SUV alts in their vehicles 🤷
BUDGET THEY SAID THE COMMUNITY APPRECIATES THE FACT THAT YOU PUT SO MUCH EFFORT INTO YOUR VIDEOS AND EXPLAINING WHAT'S GOING ON WHILE YOU'RE DOING YOUR VIDEOS MAN KUDOS TO YOU🎉🎉🎉
I appreciate that
Aye I’m still gonna my big 3 with the stock alternator and then in the future add a 250 amp
100% correct got to have power to make power.
Great video
I would go for lithium and big 3.
There's no need for a bigger alt in my case...
I just monitor the voltage and let it charge.
So your on a stock alt???😮
@djkeys415s Yes, of course!
There is no need for a bigger alt when i have this lithium package.
@@lassediscovers1813 to each his own
@@lassediscovers1813 which lithium are you using
@@rmyrie5963 used cells from a Prius. Around 100ah
Anytime I add an amplifier to a car, I always add a big 3 wire upgrade at the same time. It barely addd any cost to the wiring that I’m already putting in.
So I’m currently HAVING this ultimatum 🤦🏻♂️ and I have searched and researched and called everyone! I was and STiLL kinda am under the same impression as this/you in this video! BUT…when I call the alternator company’s they actually recommended and steered me Away from buying a HO Alt from them and recommended me upgrading my battery 1st, I feel they would know best, but I still kinda feel like a HO alt would be best but, they mentioned you have to make sure your current battery can take the draw or something from the new alt, still not quite sure what that or it all means! I would think I would need enough amperes to cover what my amp(S) use ATLEAST musically, bc no single battery, in my opinion would put out the kinda amperes I would need, under the hood! Agm atleast! I’m still conflicted and can’t quite get a definitive answer, bc other shops/pro installers I call recommend ALT! 😩
We forgot a couple of things.
1. Efficiency rating of the amp. The correct amp draw calculation for a 1000 watt amplifier at 14.4 volts has to compensate for the efficiency of the amplifier. Most amplifiers operate at around 70% efficiency. So the correct calculation is (1000/14.4) / .7, which gives you an actual amp draw of 99 amps. So we understated the amount of power that we need. Now it is true that because of the dynamic nature of the musical sound signal, we are probably not going to see a consistent 99 amp draw from the amplifier, we still want to upgrade to a point where the electrical system can withstand a draw of that amount should it become necessary.
2. The alternator takes time to get power to where it's needed. It's not capable of providing power to a device that uses the power at the moment that the device needs it. For that reason alone, a lithium battery is the first upgrade that should be done. That gives the device a bank of stored power that it can access at will while allowing the alternator time to replenish what was used.
Lithium is cheap now. You can get a 74 amp hour lithium battery that puts out 400 amps continuous for $199 right now. Here's the link.
jag35.com/products/fully-assembled-12v-lev60f-battery-lifepo4
You can connect that to your vehicle's system right after the initial charge it's plug n play.
Lithium has big storage capacity and big discharge capability. And the price drop makes it the go to option from an Electromechanical and budgetary standpoint.
I appreciate you though man. Been watching you from day 1. Just wanna do my part in helping to get the info out.
I've been told of or referred to this exact setup a few times. My issue is that for every one person telling me that this will suffice for my 1500w Amp and 110a alternator, with plug n play. I then run into 3 or 4 other people saying that 600a isn't enough to bother spending the money on.
I have mad voltage drop going on in my car whenever the Bass drops. It goes from 14v down to 12.2v whenever the lights and a/c are on (while it's raining) and I know that this can't be good for my car.
I already have the Big 3 upgrade in 1/0 OFC. Would this really work in my situation? Also, the link shows it's $399
What's the difference between the Pro and the Plus versions besides the almost $200 gap!
bro enjoyed the class know about it but u explain it to a key tried to help a few frinds out they got 5k amps with stock electronics 2 ahms with 150alts they loud but in time they ran threw alt and batteries and they didnt even top off attery at night or any night lol
Man, it appears to me that you did not take into account the efficiencies of the stereo equipment or normal usage of the car electronics. Your analysis is based on running the amp, sub, speakers and the rest of the car at full power all the time thus stressing the alternator. Where that might be accurate for a competition setup it's not the same for everyday use. Rule of thumb is a sub when used normally draw roughly 50% power and the speakers draw 25%. Using this method and let's say your amp has an 80% efficiency rating so you're not drawing the full amperage that the equation determines. The car does not have everything electrical running all at the same time full tilt as well.
I don't have a high output alternator and I'm in the high 140s I'd say get a good decent AGM battery and you will be fine
Great video!
I have to admit, it was a stupid idea, but I had some ultra capacitors to test what they'd do to a stock system.
The 500 F bank did so well. It's using your alternator of course to full capacity, all the time :-) and it's not a good idea to demo this setup. ( 25 min max then you need to chill)
Everything musical outside of sinus wave works. I've been able to use a fairly big amp in that car with stable volts
Great tip!
This is completely wrong as the intire in qoute experiment . 2014 kia Optima. You upgrade the alt all you want but it wont help. What about needs? What about pwm controlled alts. If your alt can handle the needs but the stock cables in that car specifically are to small for the stock alt and had tons of electrical problems. Next the big 3 is only opening the gate allowing full flow i stead of residence holding it back. So now let do like you said i put a 360 ho alt in. What did it do. Nothing. Pwn controlled. So in all youd need all off them to make a complete difference. 80 percent is what the car draws. Youd need a second battery as well. So when this question comes up it all depends on your needs.
@BudgetBassHead- The proper way is to do the big three, with the appropriate sized wire/cables, while putting in the upgraded alternator.Then batteries for more reserve, and voltage stability, for quick amperage surges, that the alternator cannot react quickly enough to. I understand your example/diagram, but for the average 1k, 1-ohm stable amp, if wired to 1 ohm, will only be pulling about a max of 60% of that 70 amps= 42 amps, because of impedance rise, while playing music. Furthermore, "MOST" people will not drive around with all of there accesories on. Just turning off the A/c unit frees up approx. 40 amps of current, and that along with the 15 amps figured into the factories surplus amperage= 55 Amps available, to power this amp with the 42 Amp requirements, @ max volume.
And nobody mentions the deck amp draw.. I'm sure that's another 15A
I have a 1995 F250. It came with a 90 amp alternator. I had an old man ( at an alternator shop in Detroit) rebuild a junkyard alternator I got to 135 amp. What a HUGE difference all the way around!
Only bad thing is the truck needed additional chassis grounds, Ford does a poor job by using braided straps to ground. I added 3 additional 0 gauge chassis and battery grounds.
I would increase the standard batterie to a AGM size around 50-100% + an capacitor min. 1F -1.5F for 1000wrms.
Maybe a 50% bigger alt as standart.
And if you dont drive a lot you should charge you battery or control it 1x a week.
Cause not anyone want 2 run a second battery or a splitter between the battery.
Wicked video, i used to watch you alot before i started my audio journey🙂
Uhhh, this is wrong lol. Every single HO alt I've ever installed literally required the big 3 to be done before installation or you void the warranty. Dont try and trust factory wiring to handle 300+ amps of charging current. Do the damn big 3 first.
I always say get the biggest alternator available for your vehicle because you can never over supply your system with amperage. Then since you are spending $300-$400 on an alternator you might as well spend $50 on that BIG3. With all that you will still be spending less than you would on a decent battery
Keep in mind that the biggest alternator for your vehicle isn't always the best option. You have to look at the pros and cons. Typically the highest max output is going to give you the least amount of output at idle. So if you spend a lot of time at idle you might want to go with a slightly lower powered alternator so that you have more output at idle speeds. You also want to take into account how much belt wrap you have. I could fit a 400 amp alternator on my vehicle but due to the small amount of belt wrap, it would just slip under heavy load. So in my case I'm limited to about 250 to 270 amp.
@@JasonWW2000 ^ this right here!!
A high output alternator was the WORST upgrade I ever did for my system. They put out way LESS amperage at idle then the stock alternator. Headlight dimming (and hence power compression on the bass hits) was horrible at red lights. Unless you make a custom overdrive pulley system for a HO alternator you will be sorry you ever got one.
My only question is wouldn't upgrading the alternator without upgrading the wire burn up The wire? And what happens if you do both at the same time but don't upgrade the battery? Wouldn't you overload the battery? Serious question.
It all depends on the condition of the wiring. Play yes this is possible. In short, upgrade all of them if possible.
This is an accurate video. The real truth is that alternators, or as we were taught in school "the AC generator", is an expensive part to upgrade. I am a dinosaur. I run old stuff and in my personal opinion when working on old vehicles the BIG 3 is the way to go. Modern vehicles don't experience as many problems when keeping the power under a 1000w as you demonstrated.
You are one smart cookie and I love your content. Second batteries work, too; as it relates to sustained stiffening of on longer bass notes. You guys run so much power these days I don't understand the efficiency as it relates to wasting interior vehicle space when you could otherwise add more woofers.. lol
The alternator is the most expensive best ROI hands down.
Just a note guys , unless you driving around playing test tones, your equipment wont be demanding that amperage constantly, music is dynamic some notes will demand power in small tiny few second bursts, the rest of the time its not pulling much
I drive around listening to Rebassed music so it may as well be "test tones" lol
I read that too much amperage can cause other things to over heat . .
The saying goes it takes power to make power. I have 320 amp alternator, two agm batteries, and jp630 Supercap bank. I’m running two skar rp 4500 strapped at half ohm on a fi audio mt 12.
Man those mts hit hard fi makes a different type of animal
@@1904audio yep beat subs I’ve own. They can handle nearly double rms.
@BrianWaller-qe7gr- Did you mean you have your rp-4500s strapped @ 1 ohm= each amp then sees a 1/2 ohm load internally? I ❤️my Fi Built subwoofers as well.
@@evilinside5984 yep. Technically this amps are only stable at 1ohm but i metered it and confirmed it’s half ohm and amps barely warm after 30 minutes full tilt
@@BrianWaller-qe7grWhat coils are on your 12" MT?
Yeah I have a 99 Toyota 4Runner with the stock alternator. Can’t wait for my new alternator to come in. Little 80amp alternator going through it!! 😂😂😂
Yours ain’t no worse then mine😂 70 amp going thur hell I burn one up already. Got a 250 coming soon
Changing the alt ground is the most important
I don't see how getting the bigger alt should come first. If the stock wiring can't handle the current demand. Adding a higher output alt can only help a bit. Think about it like a water line into your house. If they put a half inch line into your house no matter how much pressure you have pushing water to the line the half inch pipe can only flow so much. Putting a large alt cannot make the electrical handle more. The wires in the car from the manufacturer are designed to handle the load of the car plus the ten to fifteen%. You are better off getting the big three and bigger batteries. Then bigger alt. Think about it even the people with three 400 amp alternators still have massive battery banks. Adding a bigger alt to inadequate wiring will heat things up.
My 2018 Impala came stock with a 150A alt. The stock, chassis, ground wire was 4ga @38in long. That cable can withstand over 250A at that length; far exceeding the stock alt. So how is the stock wiring not efficient? Simply do the math and upgrade whatever is necessary.
Cleaning the connections first is what one should do, if the alt is on the way out, replace it and also upgrade it and the wires, there is no such thing as big three, its a myth, the short runs of the wires are usually enough for the current the alternator can provide, the only thing you could do is get a battery as a first upgrade
@eustahijelifetips well that's not true. The wires are short but are only like 8 gauge at best. Depending on the car. Not ment to handle an extra 100 + amps. That's why you need to upgrade the wire first. Unless your just adding a 200 watt or do amp to your door speakers.
@BudgetBassHead you're absolutely right. The stock wiring exceeds the stock alt. So if your adding a moderate upgrade to your stereo you're fine. If you're putting in a 600 watt amp for mids and highs. Plus a 2000 watt amp for your subs. Then you need to upgrade or add to your electrical. Which means exactly what you said. Upgrade what is necessary. Wires, alt, batteries. If you just upgrade an alt. You could still be starving your amps for power and inducing premature clipping. Even in your house that takes power from the power lines. Ample power. They still base the breaker box and wiring on the current load of your home.
Keep in mind that small wires in a short length can handle a lot of current, but they heat up and can reduce your voltage. This is why people that do the big three end up seeing an increase in their overall voltage.
Moral of the story upgrade your alt and wire and have a nice reserve lithium preferably!
I would like to know what size box would be good for two 15" nvx subwoofers?
Just go to the website and the manufacturer specification should be there
Have you ever thought about a capacitor
14.4 is charging standard is 13.2
What size wire do you have on your alt to battery & the size wire from the positive to your amp and speakers?
And the size of all your fuses. I have an 14 Impala
Zero gauge power from battery to distribution block. Then 4 gauge from block to amp if they don't take zero gauge.. zero gauge your ground to chassis 🤔🤗
@dthebest9319 All my wires are zero gauge. I think the fuses are 300A.
@@BudgetBassHead thank you
@@BudgetBassHead is 350 alt good for 2Evl Skar 12s1250rms but they can do more but🤔 on 2 Rp 1200 RMs amps with a XS power battery d3400 with big 3 ECT
I agree 💯
I still disagree. When i replaced my stock wires, i cut the old ones open. 10 yrs in the rust belt and honda having bare wire grounds proves, to me, that the wires should be 1rd. They were corroded, 12 inches into the wire sheath and the core of the wire was burnt looking. So yes i would do the big 3, then battery, then alt.
Also if money dont grow on trees, you can take a battery and wires to a new car. But the alt gets left, or sold. Just something extra to take into consideration!!
I ask why do we have a battery if the alternator can produce the power ?
The batteries primary purpose is to start the engine. Once the engine is running you can disconnect the battery and drive from California to New York if you wanted to.
OK, if you do that trip, please take a spare alternator .and a battery so you don't burn up the second alternator.
The electrical system runs off the battery. The alternator charges the battery. The higher output alternator helps keep the battery charged under a heavy load. Your formula is correct. I believed; big 3 ,highest cold cranking amp battery that fits . Or lithium, then Alternator.
Storage my freind...so when that big bass drop you will have that voltege right there ready to respond. it dont all just come from the alt.the alt is the supplier the batts are the distributeur to the amps And BOOM GOES THE BASS HIT😅
@@BudgetBassHeadin ol scool..Def not todays trucks and cars..yuo got to stop for gas and will need to turn the engine off!!!! But i get what your saying tho
Jaye BASS IN ORDER TO GET A SUCCESSFUL UPGRADE IN ELECTRICAL THE BIG THREE THE ALTERNATOR AND THE BATTERIES MUST BE UPGRADED IN ORDER TO RUN YOUR SYSTEM PROPERLY MY LAST SOUND SYSTEM WAS OVER 10,000 WATTS OF POWER DIY GUY AND I'LL JUST SAY THIS ONCE I UPGRADED MY ALTERNATOR TO A 350 AMP PUT TO A GM BATTERIES IN AND RAN ALL DOUBLE ZERO GAUGE WIRES AND DID MY BIG THREE I WAS SLAMMING HARDER THAN MOST DUDES THAT SPENT 15 GRAND ON INSTALL PLUS EQUIPMENT JUST SAYING IT DOESN'T TAKE AN ENGINEERING DEGREE TO FIGURE THESE THINGS OUT IT'S CALLED COMMON SENSE
Well yea
You mean 400to600 on a QUALITY ALT OVER 300AMPS
Yeah doing a big three alone is not enough. Even if you put in a higher amperage alternator you still have to do a big three for that alternator as well. Only then Will adding a second battery actually make some kind of sense. That's just my opinion. Just a self-taught audio guy like everybody else. A lot of trial and error
Everyone should note that a HO alternator will most likely make LESS current at idle then your stock alternator. They really need some RPM's to make their rated power. You will have worse headlight dimming at idle and red lights then you do now.
WELL IN MY OPINION SHOULD YOU REMOVE THE ALTERNATOR AND PUT THE BATTERIES IN AND TRY TO START YOUR VEHICLE WHAT WILL BE THE OUTCOME BECAUSE IT DEFINITELY WILL NOT START SO THE BATTERIES DO NOT RUN ANYTHING AND THIS RESPONSES TO THE ELECTRICIAN THAT'S BEEN AN ELECTRICIAN FOR SO MANY YEARS😂😂😂
I think your whole explanation in this video is theoretical and not realistic. In the real world, your automobile is not being maxed out. In fact, my navigator typically only uses 25 amps to run the vehicle and then there is additional amperage being drawn to recharge the battery. That amperage might start off high such as 40 amp and then it gradually goes down as the battery becomes charged up. I encourage everybody to buy a DC clamp meter and see what kind of amperage your vehicle is actually drawing as well as their amplifiers and battery.
Your typical 1000 watt amplifier is very rarely ever being maxed out. Most people don't load down the amplifier to get all the power in the first place and then the music is dynamic so you're getting small surges of current draw. In order to measure the amplifier current you want to look at it's efficiency. A 1000 watt amplifier at full power may actually draw 1300 W if it's 70% efficient. At 14.4v that's around 90 amps of current, not 69. As I said though, most people are rarely maxing out the amp.
That being said, it is good for people to understand the theory of what's going on. As far as theory goes, I think you did a good job on this video. I just wanted to make a distinction between theory and reality because there can be quite a big difference. I myself have had systems with several thousands of watts and ran them just fine on the stock electrical system because of the dynamic nature of music and I didn't push my amplifiers really hard.
Well spoken. But not everyone drives an Escalade and practices proper gain control. Most vehicles I've seen from my subscriber's videos are 10 years old with every amp setting maxed out 😄.
@@BudgetBassHeadI'm not sure how to respond to that.
So let's say they only care about maximum volume. I can still recommend they buy an inexpensive DC clamp meter and see what kind of amperage they're actually drawing. They can still learn by doing that. They might think their system is loud, but measure half the amperage that their amp is rated for. That can tell them that their impedance is a little too high and lowering it can produce more power. It's basically about educating yourself and understanding what your system is doing, then you can make changes to improve it. The same concept is true if you're into SQ, SPL or whatever. Knowledge is power.
@@JasonWW2000- I clamped a pair of strapped "3500" watt amplifiers, wired to a .6 ohm load= each strapped amp was seeing .3 ohms internally @ rest! Each amp pulled just over 550 amps x 2= the pair of "3500" watt amps pulled over 1,100 Amps 👀of current, @ 14.0 volts, starting voltage was 18.0 volts= i can't believe i didn't blow up the 2 xs power, XP1000 16 volt batteries! Nothing like a 4 volt drop😉😁😆😂 I fixed that by getting rid of those and running 20 Batteries in total, and 19- XS Power, D1600, agm, 16 volt batteries, of which were in the back, next to my bass amp(s).
@@evilinside5984That's a good example of the difference between theory and reality.
Some people build a system and have no idea what amperage they're pulling. Some don't even monitor the voltage! 😅
I wish more people thought like a scientist. First learn the theory and then start measuring things. You learn about your system and can make it louder, better, more efficient. 👍
Awesomeness ³
Thanks 😉
You are absolutely wrong. Please learn something before trying to teach others!!