Years later, someone reached out to me about something I should've done in the first place: They'd looked up the 1UP article mentioned in the wayback machine. Link is in the description!
Years later I found this video and wanna give my 2 cents. I do agree on the general point that game controls are contextual more often than not but. Something I don’t really appreciate is the analogy. Saying that games control are like learning a new language. It makes it sound like any control scheme is well paradoxically universal may be a bad analogy on your end, or I admit a bad interpretation on my end. Edit: To elaborate I think theres an implication that you can make any control scheme to any game expect the player to ‘get used to it’ and assume it wouldn’t hamper the experience. I think its a bit of a disservice to games that are renowned for their traditionally good controls
I hate how much I lowkey needed the tank control demonstration. No one ever actually explains them in their videos and I haven’t played a game that used them since I was probably very little lol. I totally exposed that I’m a fake gamer nerd but anyway it was funny as hell and helpful
yeah i noticed that. For example when people play old first person games on console like king's field or doom, people say the controls are clunky when it's just a matter of adjusting yourself to it
No it doesnt. Do you know how many games are called clunky today? Cuz they are and they are bad.... concord for example. Are you gonna die on that hill that we arent used to it? The tank controls stockholm syndrome is crazy 😂😂
Something people often overlook about the tank controls in the original resident evil is how they control the pace of the gameplay, and give it a deliberate, methodical feel. Enemies can be slow because you aren't highly maneuverable, and your movement is less about twitch reflexes and more about preparation and planning, in a similar way to the inventory management system. It comes down to preference but personally I love that style of gameplay
Then why did they throw in dogs and crows and other enemies that fly all over the place while you fight with the player to get them to aim at the thing before it moves.
@@Guciom It's been awhile since I've played Resident Evil, and I've since reconsidered my opinions on tank controls. I'll keep this in mind if and when I revisit the game. I may try the Gamecube remake instead of the PS1 game.
I agree I have yet to see any new games with modern controls that take care of that “Flickyiness” that takes you out of the rooted reality of the movement Maybe some day there will be something done about it but I have to see it yet
>when you push the stick forward, the character you're playing as will always go in the direction their nose is pointing my brain just suddenly got it, and got use to the controls really quickly after that line... almost like magic
I honestly think that people who hated tank controls just suck at playing games. Like, I’m not even a total hardcore gamer but I’ve adjusted well to all types pov in other games.
That it's related to people being bad at games in general, I'd say is some heavy generalizing. I'm bad at flight games, that doesn't mean that I'm bad at all other games. People learn and adjust differently.
RE4 uses tank controls even with the different camera perspective and it works so well. The game is actually so good because of it. Never had a problem with tank controls to be honest both in the classic games and RE4. They’re responsive, functional, and easy to understand. They just feel “tight” and fun to play.
Very fun and insightful video! I'm currently writing about an old obscure 3D platformer with tank controls, and I was never quite able to put into words why the controls work fine in the context of its level design. Your explanations are super helpful 👍
Glad I could help! The video sounds interesting! You’re more than welcome to link to it here when it’s up (unless UA-cam automatically removes stuff like that?)
@@pimscrypt Oh thank you! It's most likely going to be a while before it's done, I rarely do analysis videos unless I find a subject I really want to talk about. And I this is a game I have a LOT to say about, haha It's going to be about the odd "Redcat Spookkasteel", a game I played when I was very young that only ever released in the Netherlands (as far as I know). It has tank controls, but combines it with a strafing mechanic and linear level design. It's particularly interesting to me as it's from a developer who made loads of bargain bin games, but this one has a surprising amount of charm and effort put into it.
Stumbled upon this vid while randomly researching about what are tank controls haha. Great content, felt interesting to watch from beginning to end, felt like finding a gem. Simply amazing talent you got there, keep up the good work. Subscribed, hope your channel grows!
I think if you're doing a fixed camera game in the vein of Alone in the Dark or Resident Evil, then it wouldn't hurt to have both a modern and tank control option.
@@maskednil God yes! One of the main reasons I never got into the Red Dead games, or the last couple of GTA titles, is the controls. I could certainly get used to them, but those games aren’t very high on my priority list anyway.
@@pimscrypt A fact devs often forget when they talk about immersion is that it's more immersive if something is smooth and quick. I'm more immersed when I'm able to play things in a snappy manner and get things done and get a move on. RDR2 completely fails in this regard. In fact, RDR1 soars leagues above it. It completely does things far better and I don't care if my horse's balls don't shrinks during winter, because John controls far better than Arthur. Also, one of the snappiest 3rd person movement system that completely beats many games comes from Capcom as well. Dragon's Dogma has the best combat and movement system, especially for a melee combat game. And it beats Arthur's movement in many regards. I pick up carcasses quicker. I don't waste time skinning animals as loot are dropped and picked up. I don't have to position myself by a hairs breadth to pickup the correct item. Items glow so I know that they can be picked up. I don't have to slowly browse a catalog to purchase items. Even when there's no targetting or lock on system my character seems to soft lock on the enemy I want and actually attacks them correctly. I run and turn in a snappy manner, without feeling like I'm fighting my controller.
i am playing silent hill 2 with my friend and she gets SO frustrated with the controls, hahaha. in our last play session she said she felt "feeble and vunerable" -- and honestly all I could think was 'ain't that the point of this game?". great video!!
I literally couldnt finish ANY silent hill game because navigating around didn't feel natural with tank controls so I quickly gave up. This video did give a good run down on how to move your character with said controls so I think I'm gonna try silent hill again. I mean, I adore the music and lore! Just made me sad that I couldn't comprehend tank controls till now xc
Thank you for the excellent video. This was what I searched for. I agree with pretty much everything you say here, and especially with "controls should not always be easy". Too many people say things like "tank controls should never be used", "if a modern game used controls like this it would be heavily criticised" and so on. As proven by Getting over it, controls can be "horrifying" and still good, if that serves a purpose in the game. The reason I looked for a video like this is because I got into an argument about Tomb Raider (1996) controls. I love them. I understand many don't like it but that challenge of navigating is wonderful. In the early TRs combat was more automatic because Lara aims by herself and you just have to press the shoot button. In modern Tomb Raider games the challenge is more about aiming and navigating is more automatic because you pretty much just have to jump into the general right direction. It's all about what kind of game it is. In TR games I prefer challenging movement over challenging combat (aiming), and that's why I think the "awful tank control system" is great in those games. Btw, I love your hair.
I started playing the original Resident Evil last week. I'd grown up with modern, analog control schemes and the only game with tank controls I'd ever played was the original Tomb Raider, which I somewhat adapted to but never really enjoyed. I expected playing it would be just as clunky, eye-rolling, and frustrating. It took ten minutes and a switch to the D-pad for it to feel way more comfortable than TR ever did, because RE does not expect you to be a nimble, acrobatic action hero.
The best explanation I’ve given people for tank controls is that just imagine you’re a camera man walking behind the character on screen. When you move forward so do they, as well as left, right, and back.
I haven't played many 3D games in my life, so the controls of old Tomb Raider PS1 games feel natural to me. One good thing they had compared to other similar systems is there was a roll/reverse button /key. The result was that the character could face the opposite direction with just one key. Also there were backflips and sideflips. (Try to make a demonstration of that!) I also have the impression that camera relative controls often were not implement properly, or at least that was the case when they started becoming predominant. Not sure about today.
I don’t know if this is accurate, but I believe that one of the reasons why (some) people find games like Resident Evil 4 hard to play today is because they don’t realize that there are button inputs for turning 180 degrees, so instead the turn all the way around and get frustrated.
Glad there are still people sensefully shedding light on this topic. The damnation of tank controls is one of the oddest things that happened to games for me. I say that as huge Dead Space fan (except 3) and a lover of 3rd person control schemes in general. But, you can not have movie'esque cinematography with a constant over the shoulder angle only. For me, Tank Controls with fixed angles or dolly along walk is the symbiosis of games and cinema.And I wonder how much potential was wasted banning them from modern day graphic capabilites.
I loved this video. I'm a big fan of the control scheme and I've got some friends that treat me like a crazy person when I try to explain why. This video may be helpful for that in the future lol. I wish gamers weren't so dismissive of anything other than what they deem to be "good" in regards to things like controls. imo it leads to samey design and its kind of a bummer to me that most 3rd person games released in the last decade may as well be reskins for how similar they all play. I'll always have my classic RE games to replay of course but I do wonder how many new fans those old games could have if the general gaming zeitgeist wasn't so dismissive of their control scheme.
I've always felt a bit of umbrage toward the idea that tank controls were ever "bad" controls. A great many of my favorite games use tank controls. They become intuitive as you play the games. It's just that the initial hurdle of devloping the hand-eye coordination and spatial awareness is intimidating for people. Still, I think it was the perfect system for those types of survival horror games, because it allowed for the fixed camera angles that created claustrophobic spaces out of simple rooms. I had a girlfriend that enjoyed Mario Kart, but whenever I put a first-person game in her hands she'd always be pointing toward the sky or the floor, because she couldn't grasp moving and looking as two different inputs from two different joysticks. Something like a racing game was much simpler, because you really only had to control the character in relation to a track using a fixed camera. And finally, with regard to Getting Over It, I'm pretty sure the popularity on Twitch was based on schadenfreude. People love watching streamers flip out, and I don't believe that most of the audiences grasped the intent behind Bennett Foddy's design choices. That's pure conjecture on my part though. For what it's worth, Errant Signal's video about that game is one of my favortie game essays, and the game itself - for me - is actually almost meditative. But I'm going off on a tangent here, hehe. Great video, I really enjoyed it!
Thank you for the comment! And yeah, I do agree that people liked watching streamers play Getting Over It because of the pain that it caused the streamers. But even if they didn't know about the authorial intet, it's worth noting that the "bad controls" were the reason why streamers had such trouble with the game and as result why viewers enjoyed watching it! I didn't know that Errant Signal made a video about it! Thanks for the tip! :D
“When you push the stick forward the character your playing as will always go in the direction their nose is pointing.” Well when you put it like that, it makes a lot more sense.
@@pimscrypt I only completed the first one this week. I like the game a lot but it does really suck if you don't use a guide all the way though. I recommend you check out 2 if you can.
I dated an intellectual elitist narcissist with a penchant for survival horror. He was also a video game savant. I found Siren by chance with no foreknowledge and knew it would appeal to his taste and deemed "worthy" - it was worth every penny. Since he was 'above' using walkthroughs because of his 'talent' watching his gameplay was one of the most satisfying experiences I ever had. (Until I was able to GTFO that relationship at least.) Still it's a memory I *deeply* treasure. Shout out to Siren!
I remembered the controls being slightly different in that game, but then again I just played the demo and that was years ago. Might've been a mistake on my part!
I think you're completely right with how it's all contextual with the other aspects of a game and what you're trying to get out of the game. And to show how to do it all incredibly wrong, I'm always reminded of Power Drill Massacre with its slow tank controls, uncooperative fixed cameras, an enemy that's way faster than you with no obvious tells as to his location, a screen that will flash and scream at you when you're being chased, chases that pretty much always result in one or two hit deaths because it's nearly impossible to escape when you're found, and I just go...please stop.
The only games I've played from Puppet Combo at this point is The Glass Staircase and the beginning of Babysitter Bloodbath. Sad to hear that the controls are slow and awkward in Power Drill Massacre. I thought the controls in The Glass Saircase were handled really well, so I just assumed it would be in most of their games.
I go back to Tombraider 2 in 1997. I love the remastered versions as Tank Control is fully working. Youngsters are either going to have to learn this or wait and hope a patch is released to fix a lot of bugs in the 'modern' controls
Yeah the action button does not work when getting out of the water with modern controls so you have to switch back to tank controls currently just to get out of the water on the tb remastered.
I didn’t even realize the og resident evil games used tank controls. I got used to them pretty quick, but the one game I can’t get a grasp on is classic tomb raider. I tried to take time in croft manor and get a grip but the tank controls are hard in that game
There are very rarely such a thing as bad controls as much as there are unconventional controls. I believe unconventional controls that have been designed to accommodate a games mechanics are far more preferable to ensuring a game is accessible to someone who exclusively plays call of duty
Thank you for the easy the understand example of tank controls i just subbed you’re great lol, i don’t know why but every e plenary of someone gave online i just couldnt understand for some reason lol
I believe whoever invented tank controls should be stripped naked and stoned. there is a better option than making artificial difficulties such as controls you could have just given us a combat knife, less healing items a creepy atmosphere, normal control along with puzzles and the game would have been just as good. At bare-bones minimum they could have at least given us the option at least use the Damned controls or not
I grew up with tank controls so they are very nostalgic for me. But, I am fine with modern controls. The only thing I would nitpick is how in ports of the gamecube RE1 Remake they added the ability to use modern controls. This gives you the ability to kite enemies way too easy and looks very unnatural.
Re4 was first game i played on pc and im glad that i am used to tank controls.I played some cods(dont judge me i just played mw2 and 3)and i played all of new residents.I also play csgo and i have no problem with any controls now.
I grew up back then, and honestly I never understood the hate. Back in the day, it felt like only two kids had a problem with it. The first were the kids who are all action and no storytelling. They either refuse or are literally uncapable of "getting in the mood" of a game, the kids who didn't get scared playing Silent Hill and even thought it was a silly game or something. No shit the non action game wasn't a great action game, up next tetris is a horrible fighting too. The other were the very slow kids. The premise has always been very simple, because it is the same in RL and real language - forwards means the character moves forwards from their perspective, backwards they go backwards from their perspective, and left and right turns them left or right from their perspective. You know, just like forwards, backwards, right and left are all relative to the subject, not the speaker (unless the subject is the speaker). Anyone mentally capable to look at someone else and give descriptions based on that person's direction rather than their own, "John, pick the box on your/the right [from your perspective] for me" has the mechanism to grasp how it works. Anyone who absolutely (i.e. not mere preference) can't coop with the idea that "up" in the controller isn't "up" in the 2D screen showing 3D simulations in front of them, probably because understanding anything but their own perspective be too hard, needs to go sit with the doctor and have a talk. Also, no one complains about it in 1st person games - every true 1st person game is tank controls. Up moves you forward from the perspective of the character, down moves you back from said perspective, left and right either turn you in those directions or make you step to the left or right of the character's perspective (in which case the mouse/second analogue does the rotating instead). Same shit, different camera.
I remember firt time trying original RE1 when I was 12, it was weird but picked in quiackly. That felt like a skill which added a unique touch to the game. People become lazier and lazier in time...
Ace combat and Armored core are the games i use to demonstrate this to players that have never used a clunky control scheme. At first i hated it. For 20 minutes and fell directly in love with it. Most people dont make it the 20 minutes it takes to fall in love. Its really fucking sad.
Right, tank controls are supposed to be janky and unintuitive. If it feels awkward, that means it works. Jk sorta... For real, though. I just started REmake for the first time as someone going further into the series (I've played REVII and RE2R), first playing the tank controls nearly broke my brain. You really have to almost rewire the way your brain thinks about directional controls. But while I still hold that modern controls for directionally controlling human characters makes far more intuitive sense, it really helped to just consider the name itself, "tank" controls. Thinking like you're literally comtrolling a tank and not an actual human character actually made it easier to at least begin to figure out.
How are you supposed to successfully rewire yourself in a high-stress game of being scared? That's what has stopped me from finishing silent hill. I can't even navigate my character let alone prepare myself for the puzzles and monsters. Gonna give it a go again after watching this video though.👍
To be fair, Silent Hill is arguably less precise than Resident Evil in terms of controls. Especially when you're chased by those damn monkey demons, or when Harry just abruptly stops every time you hit a wall. But, as someone who grew up with OG RE games, tank controls suck, and are outdated. Being able to get used to them doesn't make them good.
The change in tank controls from resident evil changed drastically from 1996 to 2002 which makes me think why can I play resident evil remake hd remaster but not Code Veronica X.
Resident Evil 5 never had tank controls. The movement was very much that of a modern third person shooter. The only thing old was standing still while aiming. Or maybe the remaster changed that.
Tank controls don't require the use of the d-pad. Many games have tank controls where you can or have to steer the player character with a thumbstick. However, it's arguably *easier* to use tank controls with a d-pad!
Im definitely mid asf fuck at video games with “good” controls. So I SUCK at resident evil. It took me 10 minutes to walk through the dining room, even after figuring out where to go 💀💀 but I can’t stop trying it’s crazy
I have tried playing the OG Resident Evil games and I hate the controls! Even tried Code Veronica and it’s still the same. I love the game play for Revelations for PS3. I’ll be tryin the other games (4&5) to test them out for their gameplay.
this video kind of gave me a new appreciation for tank controls i didnt have before. i still dont like playing games with tank controls (im so used to modern FPS-style controls because im only 19 and started playing video games like FPSs when i was 13 or 14) but i can appreciate what theyre meant to do for certain games. i think RE4 in specific wouldve benefitted from a more modern control scheme because of how much more action-oriented it was than previous titles, and for that reason ive still never finished it for myself. but i can still appreciate that even though theyre not for me, a lot of people do like them.
I'm glad that the video could give you a new perspective! Luckily, since there's a remake of Resident Evil 4 in the works, you'll hopefully be able to play a version of that game with more updated controls someday.
@@pimscrypt ill definitely be keeping my eye out for when it finally releases! i adored the RE2 remake and thought that they put the game into a new, VERY frightening perspective and it worked beautifully, and RE4R could be phenomenal!
if you think controls of any game suck, it means you have a skill issue. there is no learning curve, people don't even understand what that means. up is always forward,left and right are always left and right and down is always behind you. children AGE 8-10 can play it easy enough. people need to stop acting like it is difficult to do. it is extremely easy..... Also use the D-PAD not joystick.
There is nothing wrong with tank controls. I remember when NOT having tank controls all of a sudden was weird. Now though, going back to them is jarring.
I've never heard anyone complain about remote controlled toy cars having tank controls. It makes sense in real life, why is it hard for people to apply that logic to a game?
Each time I see "mur, Tank bad, outdated, u old" I die a little in the inside. I never understood the hate cause it always felt like an easy thing to grasp, since its not as complex as operating a real tank (the idea is the same, but the gamepad is different, at least as it looks with the reference provided) What's ironic is its the most simplistic control scheme I believe, cause you don't need to figure out where the controls need to go next each perspective change (the Alt scheme used in the REmastered games for example just felt strange because of the control jitter, where the character goes 180° & back, which makes the games jarring & could make for a frustrating time if you run into an enemy because of it). If tank was bad, the RE series would of died off by 2 at best & games like Grim Fandango & AitD would be completely forgotten. I appreciate this video, cause its not just about tank controls, its about how all controls aren't all bad but it CAN be bad if not understood or designed with it in mind. I like Tank, but I don't want to play it in games like Halo.
I'm not big on tank controls as a personal preference, but I never really understood the people who want to talk like they're inherently bad. I think they *can* be bad if implemented in a game clearly built with the intent of using 3D controls, but if the game was built with the tank controls as the intended way or (even better) the developers had the forethought to build it in a way both work equally well, then it's a perfectly valid way to function and just a matter of what you prefer. 🤷🏻♀️
So the best argument has to do something with how the camera is still and doesnt move. This is the worst argument i havr ever read in my life. I play dark souls games and more often than not i will straight up not move my camera and see nothing and i will still run thru a level or kill what im fighting. Galsighting yourselves into thinking tank controls are good is crazy. They are outdated period. You could play a game with modern controls and a fixed camera. Shit theres probably quite a few games like that now. Shit even fortnite has a fixed cam and do you know how often i just move sideways? Tank controls were a limitation of hardware - we are past that hurdle and now we must agree that anyone who "likes" tank controls over modern ones is just a low skill player like how they would call us for not being able to adapt to an anicent control scheme Also.... if tank controls were good.... why did shinji mikami say hes embarrassed about them.... why dont more games have them. Ahh right. Cuz they suck
As someone who likes playing new types of the games all the time( I have the asinine goal of getting good at all video game genres), I like tank controls. Playing through the survival horror greats currently, tank controls while initially cumbersome, felt good to get a degree of control in and it is always consistent even if Tank Controls with a stick will always feel wrong(its why I use exclusively dpad.)
To me, the challenge should not come from fighting with the game for control of the character. That is just silly. The challenge should come from tactics, reaction time, staying cool under pressure, etc.
Play the game for a few hours and you will figure it out. Nobody should expect to play a game and have the controls mastered right out the box, unless of course the game is designed for babies.
@Vesper F Yeah, I was speaking from inexperience before. After playing the game for a while, it did become easier. It was really frustrating to be jumped by two zombified dogs and be completely unable to get my character to aim in the right direction. After trying a game that allowed normal joystick control as an option with fixed camera angles, tank controls are definitely the best fit for this kind of game.
Hey, homie. Finally got around to watching some of your fantastic work. This video was great! I do ultimately think you are correct in saying that controls should crafted towards an intended experience. Grow Home would not be fun or even a memorable game if climbing was as simple as Assassin's Creed or Uncharted for example. One example I could bring up in terms of unnecessarily cumbersome controls is the Metal Gear series, though. I have tried 3 different Metal Gear games (2, V:GZ, V:PP), and I literally found all of them unplayable. I never grew up playing them, which could be a factor in my issues with it, but HOLY FUCK. There's intent behind design, sure, but I found them needlessly complicated, which is sad because I genuinely want to like them. Figured I'd throw my hat into the ring on that. Loved the vid though. Cheers!
They never got rid of tank controls per se. They just moved them around. Dual thumb sticks are tank controls. Up and down on the left stick are up and down on the dpad while turning left and right on the right stick are left and right on the dpad.
That’s not entirely accurate. At least if we’re talking about the later Resident Evil games, since the right stick only turns the camera and not the character.
People who claim they "don't get what the problem of tank controls is" are like those whose first driving experience was with a manual transmission car, and are saying to people who are used to automatic, "I don't get what is the problem of manual is" or those who used paper maps and are mocking the new generation who use google maps. You cannot reasonably expect someone who drove "automatic" for ten years, to suddenly excel at "manual". Gamers in the nineties, when they were young, before the age of online distractions, had unlimited gameplay time. And since each gamer only had one or two games to play at a time, they didn't mind spending hundreds of hours to master something as simple as walking. Now things are different. Many gamers have less time and attention span. Any game should be intuitive for first timers. You should pick up the controller and play immediately without spending your entire childhood learning how to move a camera or walk. The challenges should come from other aspects of gameplay (inventory management, puzzles, exploration, bosses, enemies, platforming, etc.) not from basic mechanics like character movements and camera. They just cannot afford it. It is not rewarding to invest in hours to learn those archaic techniques.
Not sure this is what you’re claiming, but nowhere in the video do I say that I “don’t get the problem with tank controls”, apart from the opening gag. The point is that anyone can get used to them, not that getting used to them would be as easy for anyone. I believe it’s ultimately worth it though, since it opens up so many new possibilities. Saying that kids today has shorter attention spans feels slightly unfounded, and out of touch. And just because there are way more games to choose from, and more platforms to buy them from, that doesn’t mean that kids can afford more games than in the 90s. Hell, games have only gotten more expensive! Sure there are kids who prefer to play nothing but Fortnite, but saying that kids wouldn’t want to spend months on a single game, trying to learn the ins and outs of it, I feel couldn’t be further from the truth. It’s giving kids way less credit than they deserve.
LOL, no Games should have some kind of challenge. Controls are one of many options. Tank controls are neither bad nor outdated, you use them all the time in modern games when driving a car, for example. The car always drives forward and it would actually be awkward if camera angle affected the directions so all of a sudden you look behind and your acceleration button becomes a break/reverse.
Personally when I design a video game, I want the gameplay, if nothing else, to age like fine wine and an important aspect of that is the controls. Clunky and unintuitive controls do NOT make or substitute for engaging gameplay in my eyes, the only exception being, as you pointed out, is in games like Octodad, QWOP, and Getting Over It where mastering the clunky and unintuitive controls IS the point of the game. When it comes to games like Resident Evil, the tank controls weren't necessarily the hardest thing you had to learn to master in that game, it was learning how to survive a hostile environment that had danger lurking around every corner using a limited inventory system and low combat capabilities, and if RE7 and the REmakes are anything to go by, that kind of gameplay philosophy can still be accomplished without the need for tank controls or fixed camera angles. It's like playing chess. Do you prefer to use the easiness of your hands and fingers so that you can place the pieces exactly where you want to on the board? Or do you prefer to use the clunkiness of your feet and toes so that you can sometimes accidentally place the pieces not what where you want them to be? The vast majority would heavily prefer the former, because the point of chess isn't mastering the ability to put pieces where you want them to be, it's mastering the ability to use those pieces in strategic ways to help you win the game. The only game I played that I think I genuinely terrible controls was Prey 2017, specifically the console version because the first person aiming had this weird acceleration issue that made certain combat scenarios, especially ones you were forced into, a bitch to deal with. On PC it's fine.
Such a perfect analogy! "Clunky" controls make sense for SUPER specific games. There's a cute game called Moving Out, which utilized silly movements. That's appropriate for that game. But when the stakes are already super high, you have inventory to manage, you want to immerse in the story, and there is suspense/horror, then there's no need to add unintuitive controls on top of everything. I desperately tired to play silent hill a few years ago and dropped it because I couldn't focus on trying to figure out tank controls on top of everything else. Instead I indulged in the music & lore on the internet to feel like I've soaked in the story. Found this video trying to research how to even use tank controls and I'm now wanting to try silent hill again. The helpful tip of, where ever your characters nose is pointed is where you will go should help a noob such as myself. 🤞🤞🤞
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Is it bad for one to say that one played the RE games (1 through 8 and loving the series and its characters) and love the new controls more than the controls of old because one thinks it didn't age well????
I don’t think that’s a bad thing to say, no. If you get used to the newer controls and prefer them that’s just how it is. I don’t think that makes tank controls inherently bad though.
I think games like get over it and snake pass are really bad games made only for one intention , there are many other games like that, there not fun and alot of gamers i know hate it them, its got nothing to do with tank controls? i don't mind tank controls. it doesn't clash with the game? so comparing the two is silly, im not ranting at you , im just trying to make sure you don't confuse the two....
I’m not sure that you understood the point. The point isn’t that the controls in Get Over It and Resident Evil are identical, the point is that the reason why people would find tank controls or any kind of controls bad might have less to do with the game itself and more with the player not being used to them. That doesn’t mean that people can’t dislike a game like Get Over It for other reasons.
@@pimscrypt I watch people on youtube complain about the PS1 , N64 era of gaming and its controls, i have the ps1 and to me its not a problem, it takes getting used to i you're a modern gamer, get over it is really frustrating in its gameplay, to it wasn't a fun game to play, it felt like a real chore to get through, plus those game were made purely for that reason it a cheeky good way . But getting back to tank controls , to me it does take getting used when different console contoller's are confusing lol , if you know what i mean.....
I have played resident evil games with fixed camera and tank controls and they are not that hard to learn and I have also played the games with 3rd person and first person controls but the tank controls are obviously objectively outdated. It is a relic of the past. It is a bad gameplay design. People who criticise tank controls and fixed camera dont criticise them because they are hard to learn. That is your assumption. They dislike the tank controls and fixed camera because of how unintuitive and unimmersive they feel. Tank controls and fixed camera were designed to side step the limitation of the hardware at the time but that is not really the case amymore. I have no doubt that this felt immersive back in the day and if you have been living under a rock and havent kept up with the upward trajectory of the industry, you probably still feel that they are immersive. See people dont have a problem with tank controls and fixed camera being hard. They are not. We have a problem with the gameplay not feeling engaging and immersive. When you move, your eyes move with you and if you hold a gun you can aim it in any direction and you can walk while holding the gun. That is realistic. That is what makes the 3rd person controls better than tank controls. Resident evil had always been scary because of resource management and scarce ammo. Puzzles. Narrow and dark alleyways and hallways. Monsters that dont die easily. You can do all of that with 3rd perosn
@@pimscrypt It is not inherently bad. It is bad relative to the controls where the camera moves with you. I feel that that is inherently more natural. When you walk in real life, your eyes move with you. You can aim the gun wherever you want. You can also walk while aiming the gun. Cant you? That is very natural and not being able to do that makes the game hard in a limited and unintuiitive way. I have always liked resident evil because of low ammo count, puzzles, dimly lit narrow spaces with zombies in them who take a lot of bullets. In the older games, bcause the camera was fixed, boss fiights were also limited. Bosses had few animations and subsequently few attacks. But boss fights, character movement and player agency and choice is much more prevalent in the newer games. Which one did you like more RE 2 remake or the old re 2? And dont tell me that they are both good in their ways. You cant hurt a games feelings so tell me which one did you think was more real and therefore more immersive?
@@pimscrypt Sure but which one do you like more? Again you cannot hurt a gameplay mechanic or a video game? Resident evil 2 is a game and not a real person so you have every right to prefer one over the other. We dont often like all things equally
I'm not saying that because I'm afraid of hurting a video game, or its developers. I just fundamentally disagree with the idea that a game's quality is based on it's realism - or that realism is the only thing that can make a game immersive. the reboot of Alone in the Dark aimed for realism, and it's one of the worst horror games I've ever played. Whether I like the original Resident Evil 2 over the remake is irrelavent, because the point I'm trying to make with this video is that it all comes down to personal preference - and what you are used to. I think that tank controls work perfectly in the original RE2, and I think the new controls work perfectly in the remake - because, again, they were designed with these different control schemes in mind.
I don't think the Getting Over It argument works here. That game is designed to have unintuitive controls as the main attraction. Resident Evil needed tank controls due to the camera angles because they were more reliable then switching direction at each break. They only used those camera angles because the Playstation hardware was too weak to do first person with detailed environments. Resident Evil 4 used tank controls since it was one of the first big steps into 3rd person shooters. Although it's fair that you need to stop to shoot accurately, it seems unreasonable that Leon can't walk sideways. Resident Evil 5 kept tank controls, technically, likely because RE4 was so successful and they built on that formula closely, but RE5 included the ability to strafe which overcomes the main limitation of tank controls. We don't see them anymore because they're a product of their time and they limit the player's ability to control the character in an unreasonable manner.
It seems to me that you might be missing the point here. Yes, the controls in Getting Over it and the first Resident Evil were implemented for different reasons, but the point I'm trying to make is that neither of the control schemes are bad. Because the games are designed around the controls, and vice versa. That tank controls limit players ability to control the character is a valid complaint, but the reason at least I find them to be good is because they can also be used to enhance the intended player experience. If it's a horror game, maybe having less control over the situation can be a good thing? Not all horror games should have them, of course, but even if tank controls are out of style at this point I still feel that they can be of use.
Perhaps tank control can be good if used in the right game but please give the character a reason to move like a tank like octodad gives à reason why the character is bad at moving like a human,i mean the easiest way i can think of to do that is to put the character in a wheelchair
Years later, someone reached out to me about something I should've done in the first place: They'd looked up the 1UP article mentioned in the wayback machine. Link is in the description!
Years later I found this video and wanna give my 2 cents. I do agree on the general point that game controls are contextual more often than not but.
Something I don’t really appreciate is the analogy. Saying that games control are like learning a new language.
It makes it sound like any control scheme is well paradoxically universal may be a bad analogy on your end, or I admit a bad interpretation on my end.
Edit: To elaborate I think theres an implication that you can make any control scheme to any game expect the player to ‘get used to it’ and assume it wouldn’t hamper the experience.
I think its a bit of a disservice to games that are renowned for their traditionally good controls
The tank control demonstration segment was golden.
My proudest moment so far.
Seriously. I was thinking that's the best way to actually show it, but I wasnt sure if he would actually do it and he did 🤣🤣
I hate how much I lowkey needed the tank control demonstration. No one ever actually explains them in their videos and I haven’t played a game that used them since I was probably very little lol. I totally exposed that I’m a fake gamer nerd but anyway it was funny as hell and helpful
We had a lot of fun recording that part. I'm really glad it was helpful!
And fake gamer nerd or not, you're very welcome here!
That classic Resident Evil tune in the beginning, tho.
Absolute banger, honestly.
Transparency I know I wanted that song the second I started putting in the music!
Dual Shock soundtrack really is a so-bad-it's-good kinda thing. I even like that abomination now hahaha
Clunkyness usually means "something I'm not used to"
yeah i noticed that. For example when people play old first person games on console like king's field or doom, people say the controls are clunky when it's just a matter of adjusting yourself to it
literally couldn't have said it better
No it doesnt.
Do you know how many games are called clunky today? Cuz they are and they are bad.... concord for example.
Are you gonna die on that hill that we arent used to it?
The tank controls stockholm syndrome is crazy 😂😂
@@Lemontarts01 just say you can’t adapt and step out of your comfort zone lol
@@Lemontarts01 Have you played concord? Yes I will because people get used to a certain genre or control scheme any thing else is shit. It's not.
Something people often overlook about the tank controls in the original resident evil is how they control the pace of the gameplay, and give it a deliberate, methodical feel. Enemies can be slow because you aren't highly maneuverable, and your movement is less about twitch reflexes and more about preparation and planning, in a similar way to the inventory management system. It comes down to preference but personally I love that style of gameplay
Then why did they throw in dogs and crows and other enemies that fly all over the place while you fight with the player to get them to aim at the thing before it moves.
@@flyingfireballmaster1816 Those enemies are:
1. Low health.
2. After an attack the slow down giving you a window to counter.
@@Guciom It's been awhile since I've played Resident Evil, and I've since reconsidered my opinions on tank controls. I'll keep this in mind if and when I revisit the game. I may try the Gamecube remake instead of the PS1 game.
I agree
I have yet to see any new games with modern controls that take care of that “Flickyiness” that takes you out of the rooted reality of the movement
Maybe some day there will be something done about it but I have to see it yet
@@GuciomDogs and crows are not slow lol. The only problem I got with tank controls is the hardship in evading and dodging enemies.
>when you push the stick forward, the character you're playing as will always go in the direction their nose is pointing
my brain just suddenly got it, and got use to the controls really quickly after that line... almost like magic
Very glad I could help!
Always nice to see a defence of tank controls. Especially one with nuance.
Thank you for the kind words!
Man this video is soo good, I actually searched for this type of video, you practically said everything I thought about tank controls!
Thank you so much! I'm glad I could provide what you were looking for!
I honestly think that people who hated tank controls just suck at playing games. Like, I’m not even a total hardcore gamer but I’ve adjusted well to all types pov in other games.
That it's related to people being bad at games in general, I'd say is some heavy generalizing. I'm bad at flight games, that doesn't mean that I'm bad at all other games. People learn and adjust differently.
@@pimscrypt Oh wait, I meant bad at playing RE games. The ones with tank controls.
RE4 uses tank controls even with the different camera perspective and it works so well. The game is actually so good because of it. Never had a problem with tank controls to be honest both in the classic games and RE4. They’re responsive, functional, and easy to understand. They just feel “tight” and fun to play.
The explanation of tank controls made me realize that the original Metroid prime uses tank controls
Very fun and insightful video! I'm currently writing about an old obscure 3D platformer with tank controls, and I was never quite able to put into words why the controls work fine in the context of its level design. Your explanations are super helpful 👍
Glad I could help! The video sounds interesting! You’re more than welcome to link to it here when it’s up (unless UA-cam automatically removes stuff like that?)
@@pimscrypt Oh thank you! It's most likely going to be a while before it's done, I rarely do analysis videos unless I find a subject I really want to talk about. And I this is a game I have a LOT to say about, haha
It's going to be about the odd "Redcat Spookkasteel", a game I played when I was very young that only ever released in the Netherlands (as far as I know). It has tank controls, but combines it with a strafing mechanic and linear level design. It's particularly interesting to me as it's from a developer who made loads of bargain bin games, but this one has a surprising amount of charm and effort put into it.
Stumbled upon this vid while randomly researching about what are tank controls haha. Great content, felt interesting to watch from beginning to end, felt like finding a gem. Simply amazing talent you got there, keep up the good work. Subscribed, hope your channel grows!
Thank you so much, that makes me really happy to hear! Hope you'll enjoy my future stuff just as much!
I think if you're doing a fixed camera game in the vein of Alone in the Dark or Resident Evil, then it wouldn't hurt to have both a modern and tank control option.
Red Dead Redemption 2 is one example of where you have a "modern" movement system yet Arthur controls like a drunkyard and his horses too.
@@maskednil God yes! One of the main reasons I never got into the Red Dead games, or the last couple of GTA titles, is the controls. I could certainly get used to them, but those games aren’t very high on my priority list anyway.
@@pimscrypt A fact devs often forget when they talk about immersion is that it's more immersive if something is smooth and quick. I'm more immersed when I'm able to play things in a snappy manner and get things done and get a move on. RDR2 completely fails in this regard. In fact, RDR1 soars leagues above it. It completely does things far better and I don't care if my horse's balls don't shrinks during winter, because John controls far better than Arthur.
Also, one of the snappiest 3rd person movement system that completely beats many games comes from Capcom as well. Dragon's Dogma has the best combat and movement system, especially for a melee combat game. And it beats Arthur's movement in many regards. I pick up carcasses quicker. I don't waste time skinning animals as loot are dropped and picked up. I don't have to position myself by a hairs breadth to pickup the correct item. Items glow so I know that they can be picked up. I don't have to slowly browse a catalog to purchase items. Even when there's no targetting or lock on system my character seems to soft lock on the enemy I want and actually attacks them correctly. I run and turn in a snappy manner, without feeling like I'm fighting my controller.
Amazing video. Even if the arguments are not new, as you have pointed out, this video presents them in an exceptionally clear and articulate manner.
i am playing silent hill 2 with my friend and she gets SO frustrated with the controls, hahaha. in our last play session she said she felt "feeble and vunerable" -- and honestly all I could think was 'ain't that the point of this game?". great video!!
I literally couldnt finish ANY silent hill game because navigating around didn't feel natural with tank controls so I quickly gave up. This video did give a good run down on how to move your character with said controls so I think I'm gonna try silent hill again. I mean, I adore the music and lore! Just made me sad that I couldn't comprehend tank controls till now xc
@@thesourstation636 Modify the control scheme to 2D Type and finish your game .
This is a great video, def deserves more views and attention
Thank you for the excellent video. This was what I searched for. I agree with pretty much everything you say here, and especially with "controls should not always be easy". Too many people say things like "tank controls should never be used", "if a modern game used controls like this it would be heavily criticised" and so on. As proven by Getting over it, controls can be "horrifying" and still good, if that serves a purpose in the game.
The reason I looked for a video like this is because I got into an argument about Tomb Raider (1996) controls. I love them. I understand many don't like it but that challenge of navigating is wonderful. In the early TRs combat was more automatic because Lara aims by herself and you just have to press the shoot button. In modern Tomb Raider games the challenge is more about aiming and navigating is more automatic because you pretty much just have to jump into the general right direction. It's all about what kind of game it is. In TR games I prefer challenging movement over challenging combat (aiming), and that's why I think the "awful tank control system" is great in those games.
Btw, I love your hair.
I started playing the original Resident Evil last week. I'd grown up with modern, analog control schemes and the only game with tank controls I'd ever played was the original Tomb Raider, which I somewhat adapted to but never really enjoyed. I expected playing it would be just as clunky, eye-rolling, and frustrating.
It took ten minutes and a switch to the D-pad for it to feel way more comfortable than TR ever did, because RE does not expect you to be a nimble, acrobatic action hero.
It seems like Tim Rogers has changed a lot of minds recently.
Also, catching up on your older work is a good time, thank you!
'The Lone Wanderer', lol.
Game controls are _absolutely_ languages!
i didn’t need to see the speakers face…. and hair. but i guess it’s cool they included it in the video 😳
Just give it a dislike and move on lmao
Great work on the video. I really enjoyed this.
Thank you!
awesome video keep up the amazing content
It's weird, i can play RE1R and RE4-5 but i just can't get used to RE2 and RE3 (keyboard) despite playing RE1R, there is just something about it
The best explanation I’ve given people for tank controls is that just imagine you’re a camera man walking behind the character on screen. When you move forward so do they, as well as left, right, and back.
I haven't played many 3D games in my life, so the controls of old Tomb Raider PS1 games feel natural to me. One good thing they had compared to other similar systems is there was a roll/reverse button /key. The result was that the character could face the opposite direction with just one key. Also there were backflips and sideflips. (Try to make a demonstration of that!)
I also have the impression that camera relative controls often were not implement properly, or at least that was the case when they started becoming predominant. Not sure about today.
I don’t know if this is accurate, but I believe that one of the reasons why (some) people find games like Resident Evil 4 hard to play today is because they don’t realize that there are button inputs for turning 180 degrees, so instead the turn all the way around and get frustrated.
Tank controls are intuitive to me. There's a Mario Party 6 mini game called Tricky Tires that utilizes tank controls. I always won that mini game.
The tank control and camera on the wall are why RE1, 2, and 3 were so scary when i was a kid. Not seeing around the corner is nerve racking.
Boy george is doing video game reviews now
My fav game with tank controls is godzilla that came put on the ps4 man i want to play that game agian
I really want to give that game a try some day!
@@pimscrypt at game stop its 70$ and on ebay 100 and something $
Glad there are still people sensefully shedding light on this topic. The damnation of tank controls is one of the oddest things that happened to games for me. I say that as huge Dead Space fan (except 3) and a lover of 3rd person control schemes in general. But, you can not have movie'esque cinematography with a constant over the shoulder angle only. For me, Tank Controls with fixed angles or dolly along walk is the symbiosis of games and cinema.And I wonder how much potential was wasted banning them from modern day graphic capabilites.
I loved this video. I'm a big fan of the control scheme and I've got some friends that treat me like a crazy person when I try to explain why. This video may be helpful for that in the future lol. I wish gamers weren't so dismissive of anything other than what they deem to be "good" in regards to things like controls. imo it leads to samey design and its kind of a bummer to me that most 3rd person games released in the last decade may as well be reskins for how similar they all play. I'll always have my classic RE games to replay of course but I do wonder how many new fans those old games could have if the general gaming zeitgeist wasn't so dismissive of their control scheme.
Thank you!!! keep on doing ure stuff!!!
I've always felt a bit of umbrage toward the idea that tank controls were ever "bad" controls. A great many of my favorite games use tank controls. They become intuitive as you play the games. It's just that the initial hurdle of devloping the hand-eye coordination and spatial awareness is intimidating for people. Still, I think it was the perfect system for those types of survival horror games, because it allowed for the fixed camera angles that created claustrophobic spaces out of simple rooms.
I had a girlfriend that enjoyed Mario Kart, but whenever I put a first-person game in her hands she'd always be pointing toward the sky or the floor, because she couldn't grasp moving and looking as two different inputs from two different joysticks. Something like a racing game was much simpler, because you really only had to control the character in relation to a track using a fixed camera.
And finally, with regard to Getting Over It, I'm pretty sure the popularity on Twitch was based on schadenfreude. People love watching streamers flip out, and I don't believe that most of the audiences grasped the intent behind Bennett Foddy's design choices. That's pure conjecture on my part though. For what it's worth, Errant Signal's video about that game is one of my favortie game essays, and the game itself - for me - is actually almost meditative. But I'm going off on a tangent here, hehe.
Great video, I really enjoyed it!
Thank you for the comment! And yeah, I do agree that people liked watching streamers play Getting Over It because of the pain that it caused the streamers. But even if they didn't know about the authorial intet, it's worth noting that the "bad controls" were the reason why streamers had such trouble with the game and as result why viewers enjoyed watching it!
I didn't know that Errant Signal made a video about it! Thanks for the tip! :D
This was such a great video i didnt expect you to have so few subscribers
“When you push the stick forward the character your playing as will always go in the direction their nose is pointing.” Well when you put it like that, it makes a lot more sense.
I love the tank controls in Siren 2. One of the only games where the crouch walking speed is almost as fast as running and practically silent.
I really wanna play through the Siren series one day. I've only played the first one years ago, but didn't get that far.
@@pimscrypt I only completed the first one this week. I like the game a lot but it does really suck if you don't use a guide all the way though. I recommend you check out 2 if you can.
I dated an intellectual elitist narcissist with a penchant for survival horror. He was also a video game savant.
I found Siren by chance with no foreknowledge and knew it would appeal to his taste and deemed "worthy" - it was worth every penny.
Since he was 'above' using walkthroughs because of his 'talent' watching his gameplay was one of the most satisfying experiences I ever had.
(Until I was able to GTFO that relationship at least.)
Still it's a memory I *deeply* treasure. Shout out to Siren!
Yo, Resident Evil Revelations had tank controls and it came out in 2011 or 2012 I believe.
I remembered the controls being slightly different in that game, but then again I just played the demo and that was years ago. Might've been a mistake on my part!
Noice production value
Thank you!
I think you're completely right with how it's all contextual with the other aspects of a game and what you're trying to get out of the game. And to show how to do it all incredibly wrong, I'm always reminded of Power Drill Massacre with its slow tank controls, uncooperative fixed cameras, an enemy that's way faster than you with no obvious tells as to his location, a screen that will flash and scream at you when you're being chased, chases that pretty much always result in one or two hit deaths because it's nearly impossible to escape when you're found, and I just go...please stop.
The only games I've played from Puppet Combo at this point is The Glass Staircase and the beginning of Babysitter Bloodbath. Sad to hear that the controls are slow and awkward in Power Drill Massacre. I thought the controls in The Glass Saircase were handled really well, so I just assumed it would be in most of their games.
@@pimscrypt For what it's worth, it was one of the developer's first few games. And when you've got such a high output, they can't all be good.
I go back to Tombraider 2 in 1997. I love the remastered versions as Tank Control is fully working. Youngsters are either going to have to learn this or wait and hope a patch is released to fix a lot of bugs in the 'modern' controls
Yeah the action button does not work when getting out of the water with modern controls so you have to switch back to tank controls currently just to get out of the water on the tb remastered.
@@stevennunez6013 neither do sideways jump, backward jump, or drop and grab
I didn’t even realize the og resident evil games used tank controls. I got used to them pretty quick, but the one game I can’t get a grasp on is classic tomb raider. I tried to take time in croft manor and get a grip but the tank controls are hard in that game
Finally someone appreciate tank control.. 😎👍
There are dozens of us. DOZENS!
There are very rarely such a thing as bad controls as much as there are unconventional controls. I believe unconventional controls that have been designed to accommodate a games mechanics are far more preferable to ensuring a game is accessible to someone who exclusively plays call of duty
"How do you speak English?"
It's my native language and I even have a degree in it, but idk.
Thank you for the easy the understand example of tank controls i just subbed you’re great lol, i don’t know why but every e plenary of someone gave online i just couldnt understand for some reason lol
I believe whoever invented tank controls should be stripped naked and stoned. there is a better option than making artificial difficulties such as controls you could have just given us a combat knife, less healing items a creepy atmosphere, normal control along with puzzles and the game would have been just as good. At bare-bones minimum they could have at least given us the option at least use the Damned controls or not
Nice vid. thanks for making and sharing
I grew up with tank controls so they are very nostalgic for me. But, I am fine with modern controls. The only thing I would nitpick is how in ports of the gamecube RE1 Remake they added the ability to use modern controls. This gives you the ability to kite enemies way too easy and looks very unnatural.
Re4 was first game i played on pc and im glad that i am used to tank controls.I played some cods(dont judge me i just played mw2 and 3)and i played all of new residents.I also play csgo and i have no problem with any controls now.
I grew up back then, and honestly I never understood the hate. Back in the day, it felt like only two kids had a problem with it. The first were the kids who are all action and no storytelling. They either refuse or are literally uncapable of "getting in the mood" of a game, the kids who didn't get scared playing Silent Hill and even thought it was a silly game or something. No shit the non action game wasn't a great action game, up next tetris is a horrible fighting too. The other were the very slow kids. The premise has always been very simple, because it is the same in RL and real language - forwards means the character moves forwards from their perspective, backwards they go backwards from their perspective, and left and right turns them left or right from their perspective. You know, just like forwards, backwards, right and left are all relative to the subject, not the speaker (unless the subject is the speaker). Anyone mentally capable to look at someone else and give descriptions based on that person's direction rather than their own, "John, pick the box on your/the right [from your perspective] for me" has the mechanism to grasp how it works. Anyone who absolutely (i.e. not mere preference) can't coop with the idea that "up" in the controller isn't "up" in the 2D screen showing 3D simulations in front of them, probably because understanding anything but their own perspective be too hard, needs to go sit with the doctor and have a talk.
Also, no one complains about it in 1st person games - every true 1st person game is tank controls. Up moves you forward from the perspective of the character, down moves you back from said perspective, left and right either turn you in those directions or make you step to the left or right of the character's perspective (in which case the mouse/second analogue does the rotating instead). Same shit, different camera.
In the early games. When you can ridiculously put your character in an instant non stop spin. LoloL 😂
It's quite beautiful!
I remember firt time trying original RE1 when I was 12, it was weird but picked in quiackly. That felt like a skill which added a unique touch to the game. People become lazier and lazier in time...
Ace combat and Armored core are the games i use to demonstrate this to players that have never used a clunky control scheme. At first i hated it. For 20 minutes and fell directly in love with it. Most people dont make it the 20 minutes it takes to fall in love. Its really fucking sad.
Right, tank controls are supposed to be janky and unintuitive. If it feels awkward, that means it works.
Jk sorta...
For real, though. I just started REmake for the first time as someone going further into the series (I've played REVII and RE2R), first playing the tank controls nearly broke my brain. You really have to almost rewire the way your brain thinks about directional controls. But while I still hold that modern controls for directionally controlling human characters makes far more intuitive sense, it really helped to just consider the name itself, "tank" controls. Thinking like you're literally comtrolling a tank and not an actual human character actually made it easier to at least begin to figure out.
How are you supposed to successfully rewire yourself in a high-stress game of being scared? That's what has stopped me from finishing silent hill. I can't even navigate my character let alone prepare myself for the puzzles and monsters. Gonna give it a go again after watching this video though.👍
To be fair, Silent Hill is arguably less precise than Resident Evil in terms of controls. Especially when you're chased by those damn monkey demons, or when Harry just abruptly stops every time you hit a wall.
But, as someone who grew up with OG RE games, tank controls suck, and are outdated. Being able to get used to them doesn't make them good.
@@thesourstation636 you act as if you're constantly under high stress. There's plenty of quiet time in silent hill you can use to get used to them.
The change in tank controls from resident evil changed drastically from 1996 to 2002 which makes me think why can I play resident evil remake hd remaster but not Code Veronica X.
I was wanting to watch i video about bad controls and got jumpscared by your methed up skinwalker face
I think you should give makeup a try, actually. It might make you feel better about yourself.
Resident Evil 5 never had tank controls. The movement was very much that of a modern third person shooter. The only thing old was standing still while aiming. Or maybe the remaster changed that.
Does resident evil 5 really use tank controls? Wasn’t it on the thumb sticks to move? I don’t remember using the d pad to move in re5
Tank controls don't require the use of the d-pad. Many games have tank controls where you can or have to steer the player character with a thumbstick. However, it's arguably *easier* to use tank controls with a d-pad!
@@pimscrypt interesting I thought that disqualify it from being tank controls
Thank you so much for this video. I was getting so frustrated trying to play RE4 and this helps me understand how it works. 🤘
I'm glad it was helpful! Hope you enjoy the game!
Im definitely mid asf fuck at video games with “good” controls. So I SUCK at resident evil. It took me 10 minutes to walk through the dining room, even after figuring out where to go 💀💀 but I can’t stop trying it’s crazy
Great video!
I have tried playing the OG Resident Evil games and I hate the controls! Even tried Code Veronica and it’s still the same. I love the game play for Revelations for PS3. I’ll be tryin the other games (4&5) to test them out for their gameplay.
💀I’m playing all the original 3 resident evils on my ps3 and it’s so weird to move for me 😂
this video kind of gave me a new appreciation for tank controls i didnt have before. i still dont like playing games with tank controls (im so used to modern FPS-style controls because im only 19 and started playing video games like FPSs when i was 13 or 14) but i can appreciate what theyre meant to do for certain games. i think RE4 in specific wouldve benefitted from a more modern control scheme because of how much more action-oriented it was than previous titles, and for that reason ive still never finished it for myself. but i can still appreciate that even though theyre not for me, a lot of people do like them.
I'm glad that the video could give you a new perspective! Luckily, since there's a remake of Resident Evil 4 in the works, you'll hopefully be able to play a version of that game with more updated controls someday.
@@pimscrypt ill definitely be keeping my eye out for when it finally releases! i adored the RE2 remake and thought that they put the game into a new, VERY frightening perspective and it worked beautifully, and RE4R could be phenomenal!
if you think controls of any game suck, it means you have a skill issue.
there is no learning curve, people don't even understand what that means.
up is always forward,left and right are always left and right and down is always behind you.
children AGE 8-10 can play it easy enough.
people need to stop acting like it is difficult to do. it is extremely easy.....
Also use the D-PAD not joystick.
Children from 8-10 have no sense of what a bad game is.
There is nothing wrong with tank controls. I remember when NOT having tank controls all of a sudden was weird. Now though, going back to them is jarring.
I didn't know that re4 had tank, lol. It didn't felt it.
I always felt there something wrong about it, now i know :))
I've never heard anyone complain about remote controlled toy cars having tank controls. It makes sense in real life, why is it hard for people to apply that logic to a game?
I am so bad. I awful at tank controls, but I can use a Nintendo 64 controller no problem.
Each time I see "mur, Tank bad, outdated, u old" I die a little in the inside. I never understood the hate cause it always felt like an easy thing to grasp, since its not as complex as operating a real tank (the idea is the same, but the gamepad is different, at least as it looks with the reference provided)
What's ironic is its the most simplistic control scheme I believe, cause you don't need to figure out where the controls need to go next each perspective change (the Alt scheme used in the REmastered games for example just felt strange because of the control jitter, where the character goes 180° & back, which makes the games jarring & could make for a frustrating time if you run into an enemy because of it). If tank was bad, the RE series would of died off by 2 at best & games like Grim Fandango & AitD would be completely forgotten.
I appreciate this video, cause its not just about tank controls, its about how all controls aren't all bad but it CAN be bad if not understood or designed with it in mind. I like Tank, but I don't want to play it in games like Halo.
I'm not big on tank controls as a personal preference, but I never really understood the people who want to talk like they're inherently bad. I think they *can* be bad if implemented in a game clearly built with the intent of using 3D controls, but if the game was built with the tank controls as the intended way or (even better) the developers had the forethought to build it in a way both work equally well, then it's a perfectly valid way to function and just a matter of what you prefer. 🤷🏻♀️
So the best argument has to do something with how the camera is still and doesnt move.
This is the worst argument i havr ever read in my life.
I play dark souls games and more often than not i will straight up not move my camera and see nothing and i will still run thru a level or kill what im fighting.
Galsighting yourselves into thinking tank controls are good is crazy.
They are outdated period. You could play a game with modern controls and a fixed camera.
Shit theres probably quite a few games like that now.
Shit even fortnite has a fixed cam and do you know how often i just move sideways?
Tank controls were a limitation of hardware - we are past that hurdle and now we must agree that anyone who "likes" tank controls over modern ones is just a low skill player like how they would call us for not being able to adapt to an anicent control scheme
Also.... if tank controls were good.... why did shinji mikami say hes embarrassed about them.... why dont more games have them.
Ahh right. Cuz they suck
As someone who likes playing new types of the games all the time( I have the asinine goal of getting good at all video game genres), I like tank controls. Playing through the survival horror greats currently, tank controls while initially cumbersome, felt good to get a degree of control in and it is always consistent even if Tank Controls with a stick will always feel wrong(its why I use exclusively dpad.)
Nice
2:35 This is painful to watch. 9 shots fired, maybe 2 landed. lol
I might've missed some shots, but you missed the point of the whole video.
Tank controls are best for dpad, not joystick
To me, the challenge should not come from fighting with the game for control of the character. That is just silly. The challenge should come from tactics, reaction time, staying cool under pressure, etc.
Play the game for a few hours and you will figure it out. Nobody should expect to play a game and have the controls mastered right out the box, unless of course the game is designed for babies.
@Vesper F Yeah, I was speaking from inexperience before. After playing the game for a while, it did become easier. It was really frustrating to be jumped by two zombified dogs and be completely unable to get my character to aim in the right direction. After trying a game that allowed normal joystick control as an option with fixed camera angles, tank controls are definitely the best fit for this kind of game.
I just think certain games do it better than others
Viva la tank controls❤
Hey, homie. Finally got around to watching some of your fantastic work. This video was great!
I do ultimately think you are correct in saying that controls should crafted towards an intended experience. Grow Home would not be fun or even a memorable game if climbing was as simple as Assassin's Creed or Uncharted for example. One example I could bring up in terms of unnecessarily cumbersome controls is the Metal Gear series, though. I have tried 3 different Metal Gear games (2, V:GZ, V:PP), and I literally found all of them unplayable. I never grew up playing them, which could be a factor in my issues with it, but HOLY FUCK. There's intent behind design, sure, but I found them needlessly complicated, which is sad because I genuinely want to like them.
Figured I'd throw my hat into the ring on that. Loved the vid though. Cheers!
Thank you so much!
They never got rid of tank controls per se. They just moved them around. Dual thumb sticks are tank controls. Up and down on the left stick are up and down on the dpad while turning left and right on the right stick are left and right on the dpad.
That’s not entirely accurate. At least if we’re talking about the later Resident Evil games, since the right stick only turns the camera and not the character.
While the tank controls were disgusting in all RE games, I have fond memories of Dino Crisis 2 for some reason.
It was just so much smoother.
What the hell 😐
mass effect 1 kills me
💀❤️💀
People who claim they "don't get what the problem of tank controls is" are like those whose first driving experience was with a manual transmission car, and are saying to people who are used to automatic, "I don't get what is the problem of manual is" or those who used paper maps and are mocking the new generation who use google maps. You cannot reasonably expect someone who drove "automatic" for ten years, to suddenly excel at "manual".
Gamers in the nineties, when they were young, before the age of online distractions, had unlimited gameplay time. And since each gamer only had one or two games to play at a time, they didn't mind spending hundreds of hours to master something as simple as walking.
Now things are different. Many gamers have less time and attention span. Any game should be intuitive for first timers. You should pick up the controller and play immediately without spending your entire childhood learning how to move a camera or walk. The challenges should come from other aspects of gameplay (inventory management, puzzles, exploration, bosses, enemies, platforming, etc.) not from basic mechanics like character movements and camera. They just cannot afford it. It is not rewarding to invest in hours to learn those archaic techniques.
Not sure this is what you’re claiming, but nowhere in the video do I say that I “don’t get the problem with tank controls”, apart from the opening gag. The point is that anyone can get used to them, not that getting used to them would be as easy for anyone. I believe it’s ultimately worth it though, since it opens up so many new possibilities.
Saying that kids today has shorter attention spans feels slightly unfounded, and out of touch. And just because there are way more games to choose from, and more platforms to buy them from, that doesn’t mean that kids can afford more games than in the 90s. Hell, games have only gotten more expensive! Sure there are kids who prefer to play nothing but Fortnite, but saying that kids wouldn’t want to spend months on a single game, trying to learn the ins and outs of it, I feel couldn’t be further from the truth. It’s giving kids way less credit than they deserve.
LOL, no
Games should have some kind of challenge. Controls are one of many options.
Tank controls are neither bad nor outdated, you use them all the time in modern games when driving a car, for example. The car always drives forward and it would actually be awkward if camera angle affected the directions so all of a sudden you look behind and your acceleration button becomes a break/reverse.
Personally when I design a video game, I want the gameplay, if nothing else, to age like fine wine and an important aspect of that is the controls. Clunky and unintuitive controls do NOT make or substitute for engaging gameplay in my eyes, the only exception being, as you pointed out, is in games like Octodad, QWOP, and Getting Over It where mastering the clunky and unintuitive controls IS the point of the game.
When it comes to games like Resident Evil, the tank controls weren't necessarily the hardest thing you had to learn to master in that game, it was learning how to survive a hostile environment that had danger lurking around every corner using a limited inventory system and low combat capabilities, and if RE7 and the REmakes are anything to go by, that kind of gameplay philosophy can still be accomplished without the need for tank controls or fixed camera angles.
It's like playing chess. Do you prefer to use the easiness of your hands and fingers so that you can place the pieces exactly where you want to on the board? Or do you prefer to use the clunkiness of your feet and toes so that you can sometimes accidentally place the pieces not what where you want them to be? The vast majority would heavily prefer the former, because the point of chess isn't mastering the ability to put pieces where you want them to be, it's mastering the ability to use those pieces in strategic ways to help you win the game.
The only game I played that I think I genuinely terrible controls was Prey 2017, specifically the console version because the first person aiming had this weird acceleration issue that made certain combat scenarios, especially ones you were forced into, a bitch to deal with. On PC it's fine.
A survival horror game that you control solely with your feet unironically sounds kind of amazing though.
Such a perfect analogy! "Clunky" controls make sense for SUPER specific games. There's a cute game called Moving Out, which utilized silly movements. That's appropriate for that game.
But when the stakes are already super high, you have inventory to manage, you want to immerse in the story, and there is suspense/horror, then there's no need to add unintuitive controls on top of everything. I desperately tired to play silent hill a few years ago and dropped it because I couldn't focus on trying to figure out tank controls on top of everything else. Instead I indulged in the music & lore on the internet to feel like I've soaked in the story.
Found this video trying to research how to even use tank controls and I'm now wanting to try silent hill again. The helpful tip of, where ever your characters nose is pointed is where you will go should help a noob such as myself. 🤞🤞🤞
AAAAHH!!!
....hmm.... sorry but I just can't look at that face for 20 minutes....
(i got 29 seconds in)
Weak.
same 🤮🤮
ahh
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Is it bad for one to say that one played the RE games (1 through 8 and loving the series and its characters) and love the new controls more than the controls of old because one thinks it didn't age well????
I don’t think that’s a bad thing to say, no. If you get used to the newer controls and prefer them that’s just how it is. I don’t think that makes tank controls inherently bad though.
@@pimscrypt thank you for answer. :)
I think games like get over it and snake pass are really bad games made only for one intention , there are many other games like that, there not fun and alot of gamers i know hate it them, its got nothing to do with tank controls? i don't mind tank controls. it doesn't clash with the game? so comparing the two is silly, im not ranting at you , im just trying to make sure you don't confuse the two....
I’m not sure that you understood the point. The point isn’t that the controls in Get Over It and Resident Evil are identical, the point is that the reason why people would find tank controls or any kind of controls bad might have less to do with the game itself and more with the player not being used to them. That doesn’t mean that people can’t dislike a game like Get Over It for other reasons.
@@pimscrypt oh my goodness , o.k im out , i gave you time to watch you're video and completely ignore my point
I’m not sure you understood mine and I’m getting increasingly unsure that I understand yours.
@@pimscrypt I watch people on youtube complain about the PS1 , N64 era of gaming and its controls, i have the ps1 and to me its not a problem, it takes getting used to i you're a modern gamer, get over it is really frustrating in its gameplay, to it wasn't a fun game to play, it felt like a real chore to get through, plus those game were made purely for that reason it a cheeky good way . But getting back to tank controls , to me it does take getting used when different console contoller's are confusing lol , if you know what i mean.....
I have played resident evil games with fixed camera and tank controls and they are not that hard to learn and I have also played the games with 3rd person and first person controls but the tank controls are obviously objectively outdated. It is a relic of the past. It is a bad gameplay design. People who criticise tank controls and fixed camera dont criticise them because they are hard to learn. That is your assumption. They dislike the tank controls and fixed camera because of how unintuitive and unimmersive they feel. Tank controls and fixed camera were designed to side step the limitation of the hardware at the time but that is not really the case amymore. I have no doubt that this felt immersive back in the day and if you have been living under a rock and havent kept up with the upward trajectory of the industry, you probably still feel that they are immersive. See people dont have a problem with tank controls and fixed camera being hard. They are not. We have a problem with the gameplay not feeling engaging and immersive. When you move, your eyes move with you and if you hold a gun you can aim it in any direction and you can walk while holding the gun. That is realistic. That is what makes the 3rd person controls better than tank controls. Resident evil had always been scary because of resource management and scarce ammo. Puzzles. Narrow and dark alleyways and hallways. Monsters that dont die easily. You can do all of that with 3rd perosn
Sorry Batman, but I don't agree that it's inherently bad design and I'll stand by that til the day I die.
@@pimscrypt It is not inherently bad. It is bad relative to the controls where the camera moves with you. I feel that that is inherently more natural. When you walk in real life, your eyes move with you. You can aim the gun wherever you want. You can also walk while aiming the gun. Cant you? That is very natural and not being able to do that makes the game hard in a limited and unintuiitive way. I have always liked resident evil because of low ammo count, puzzles, dimly lit narrow spaces with zombies in them who take a lot of bullets. In the older games, bcause the camera was fixed, boss fiights were also limited. Bosses had few animations and subsequently few attacks. But boss fights, character movement and player agency and choice is much more prevalent in the newer games. Which one did you like more RE 2 remake or the old re 2? And dont tell me that they are both good in their ways. You cant hurt a games feelings so tell me which one did you think was more real and therefore more immersive?
They are both good in their own ways.
@@pimscrypt Sure but which one do you like more? Again you cannot hurt a gameplay mechanic or a video game? Resident evil 2 is a game and not a real person so you have every right to prefer one over the other. We dont often like all things equally
I'm not saying that because I'm afraid of hurting a video game, or its developers. I just fundamentally disagree with the idea that a game's quality is based on it's realism - or that realism is the only thing that can make a game immersive. the reboot of Alone in the Dark aimed for realism, and it's one of the worst horror games I've ever played. Whether I like the original Resident Evil 2 over the remake is irrelavent, because the point I'm trying to make with this video is that it all comes down to personal preference - and what you are used to. I think that tank controls work perfectly in the original RE2, and I think the new controls work perfectly in the remake - because, again, they were designed with these different control schemes in mind.
I don't think the Getting Over It argument works here. That game is designed to have unintuitive controls as the main attraction. Resident Evil needed tank controls due to the camera angles because they were more reliable then switching direction at each break. They only used those camera angles because the Playstation hardware was too weak to do first person with detailed environments.
Resident Evil 4 used tank controls since it was one of the first big steps into 3rd person shooters. Although it's fair that you need to stop to shoot accurately, it seems unreasonable that Leon can't walk sideways.
Resident Evil 5 kept tank controls, technically, likely because RE4 was so successful and they built on that formula closely, but RE5 included the ability to strafe which overcomes the main limitation of tank controls.
We don't see them anymore because they're a product of their time and they limit the player's ability to control the character in an unreasonable manner.
It seems to me that you might be missing the point here. Yes, the controls in Getting Over it and the first Resident Evil were implemented for different reasons, but the point I'm trying to make is that neither of the control schemes are bad. Because the games are designed around the controls, and vice versa. That tank controls limit players ability to control the character is a valid complaint, but the reason at least I find them to be good is because they can also be used to enhance the intended player experience. If it's a horror game, maybe having less control over the situation can be a good thing?
Not all horror games should have them, of course, but even if tank controls are out of style at this point I still feel that they can be of use.
What the fc?
Yes.
wtf is that
Perhaps tank control can be good if used in the right game but please give the character a reason to move like a tank like octodad gives à reason why the character is bad at moving like a human,i mean the easiest way i can think of to do that is to put the character in a wheelchair