@@RunkleOfTheBailey As a new canadian rPAL owner, I'm devouring your videos and wanted to say thanks for all the incredibly informative videos you've made throughout the years.
It shouldn't be a surprise that your channel is growing, you are doing good work. Canadian gun laws are very vague and hard to get a legal perspective on for the average folk. You can get many conflicting opinions on Canadian firearm related forums on wide range of firearm related topics. Your channel proves to be very informative by brining previous cases and how you derived to your conclusions from the context in an easy to understand format. When a life changing criminal charge is pending for the average folk just trying to abide laws set by policy makers intentionally left unclear. it is no surprise many would listen to your opinion. Thank you for your great work.
First time commenting. Canadian tire and or Cabela’s has a gun safe sale, I’m presuming they’re all legal. Everything sold to the public should have been reviewed fully by law, NO EXCEPTIONS. The consumer should be able to trust those safes without giving it a thought. Laws themselves, create criminals, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND! Great show as always my friend Thank you for taking the time to inform.
I seem to recall a case, in Toronto I believe, where a safe ( A really well built safe, I recall) was worked on for an entire weekend, and they eventually breached it, and stole the guns. He was charged with unsafe storage. Crazy stuff. Like you said, given time, skill, and tools, you can breach a bank vault, and there is plenty of instances where this has happened. Burglary rated safes have time rating, tool ratings, etc, and an expensive box can have a TL-15 rating, and thats just rated for 15 minutes of work. Not very long. The better the rating, the more expensive it gets.
I recall a person - bid on a real BANK safe - and he had to pour a concrete pad - for a 2 ton safe. We as owners of firearms - have tried to follow the law. We use the commercial safe's as we can only TRUST - that those SAFE's - Vault's or other special rooms we build to protect our property and firearms. Thank YOU Sir for Your work and the explanations of our laws. Cheers!
I'm a former soldier (90's). I'm not new to firearms but only got my civilian PAL last year. I had some cheap choices but thought fk it, I'll buy a legit gun safe. For $450 on sale at Bass Pro in December 2019 I bought a manual combo lock safe. 238lbs good for my apartment, fire rated etc. There is no question that it is a safe. I wasn't going to screw around with that. I have my non-restricted stuff in there and I can also store some of my hunting ammo on it's shelf. Glad this video cleared some things up but make easier and buy something sold as a "safe". When police come to inspect, I have no doubt they come with the intent to charge.
Harry Barnes aka 'Johnny Sombrero' was a pretty cool guy and always gave great advice! I keep the Nov 2016 news clipping of his death at 81 due to heart disease on my bulletin board, right over my reloading bench! RIP Johnny!
If the law is vague, any uncertainty should be construed to the defendants’ favor. If you ask a military man the difference between a “tank” and a “tank destroyer,” he will explain the difference is NOT in the construction but in the doctrine. Apply that here: A cabinet is a safe when used as such, and a locker when used as such. The other container sounds like the tool chests found on construction sites. As one manufacturer calls his brand “SiteSafe,” I’d say that makes the box a safe. If the intent was to mandate certain features, installation, or certification, then it is for the law to specify. After all, every building code has no problem bwing so specific.
Only a small percentage of Canadians own firearms. The majority live in their urban bubbles and are the ones who vote people into power who don’t care that they have to abuse the most good-natured and well-behaved group of citizens in the country in order to satisfy the people who have no idea what they’re talking about.
Mr. Runkle, I have recently discovered your channel and was very impressed with both the quality of your videos and the topics you cover (absolutely fascinating!!!). I immediately subscribed and will recommend your channel to everyone I know. The legalities surrounding firearms and other weapons as it relates to Canadian laws are rarely covered in such a comprehensive manner elsewhere, and I appreciate your insight on this. Good luck with your channel, and keep up the good work! P.S. Very impressed with the lockpickinglawyer reference, I also follow him :)
I know for the US Army they want metal cabinets with 16 gauge steel, seams welded every few inches not just with bolts and chain able to the floor or affixed to the floor. Then having the lock hardware for the pad lock also welded. That was also inside the armsroom, everything was to to be locked inside the room.
I have only recently come across your videos. I am extremely impressed with the educational value I glean from them and I anticipate your channel will be very successful. There are very few methods to find Canadian firearms case law and an easy to understand explanation that is omnipresent in your presentations. BZ!
Safes can range from a steel locker to a 20 ton built in vault. Conforming to firearms storage laws a safe can be a steel locker. Firearms owners can’t be expected to pay $5k to get a quality safe. Locking up a firearm is not intended to prevent theft, only quick access that may result in a discharge. The $1500 gun safe is not a quality safe that can prevent forced entry. Safes can only extend the time required to gain entry. Expensive safes only prevent attacks by tools for a short time. This is where an alarm 🚨 paired to a good safe is the best defence. A safe is something that requires dedicated attacks to defeat. Not something that just pulling on the door hard opens it. The person who breaks into a safe is the problem not the person who uses the safe to retain firearms. You can’t say that the owner is at fault and the thief is not, absurd. Do they lay charges against banks when they are robbed?
It would be interesting to see some analysis on what constitutes a secure container for purposes of transporting restricted firearms to and from a range. Fro example, there are cloth cases that are lockable (lockable zippers).
In NZ, the definition used to be 'A Lockable container of Stout and Sturdy construction', which apparently harkens back to Victorian style wooden Gun Cabinets, but also allows for things like an old Steel Work Locker.
Future current subscriber - thanks for this video Ian. I am inheriting some non-restricted rifles and shotguns, and am going through the old videos for anything that pertains to the transportation and storage of said firearms. Even though this video doesn't completely apply, it did help me find the correct regulation and confirm that I am dotting my I's correctly. Albertan by the way, but not anticipating needing your services ;)
Regarding ventilation of the safe • All ammunition should be stored in a cool, dry place, preferably in a vented container. This will reduce the chance of corrosion or breakdown of the ammunition components that could cause the firearm to jam or misfire. Page 93 - RCMP Canadian Firearms Safety Course Manual
Amazing video! May you get millions of subscribers, one for every firearm owner in Canada! I wish my lawyer would have used this case in my trial, I had a handgun with no trigger lock in a Canadian Tire gun "cabinet" and the RCMP said that "because it wasn't bolted to the wall/floor that makes it a portable travel container" and I was convicted of unsafe storage :( Woot, thanks for the shout out at 25:46! yay
@@wilfdarr Plus with the 20 guns in it and tons and tons of ammo it would take 3 people to carry it! RCMP couldn't get it out of my house until they asked me for the key for it so they could remove all the contents! Travel container? yeah... lol :(
@@toysareforboys1 No where in the law does it say the safe must be bolted: the law says they must be locked in the safe, but there is no guidance suggesting the safe must be secured to anything: the law does not require it. It's not even suggested in the RCMP guidance. A safe doesn't become a "travel container" just because it's not bolted to a building: it remains a safe by definition. I take a "travel container" to be a lockable container with carry handles (no this is not a legal definition but as long as they are pulling definitions out of their but you can too!) You should have appealed that ruling (with a new lawyer of course!). Who was your lawyer? Does this affect your ability to have a PAL?
@@wilfdarr I was being held reverse onus with bail denied due to being a "threat to the public", even after I had raised the $1M they were originally asking for. When you're being held reverse onus you have no priority for your court case so I had to plead out if I didn't want to sit in jail for 3 years or more waiting for my court date. They had me on 86 charges with 33 witnesses so they wanted a continuous 3 week block of court time, not easy to obtain and would constantly be pushed back. They came up with a plea deal for four of the 86 charges but when the judge asked me "so you're pleading guilty to unsafe storage, possession of prohibited device, import without authority, over import explosives limit" I said no, I don't agree with any of them, gun was in a safe and safely stored. Prohibited device? The 50rd magazines were disassembled and could hold ZERO rounds so no, not prohibited. Import without authority? I had import certs that the RCMP revoked (the day I went to pickup the firearms at the border) because the RCMP employee I called to verify the firearms wasn't allowed to verify restricted, only non-restricted, how can that be my fault?! Shouldn't I just be able to call the RCMP again and re-verify the firearms with the proper verifier? "ummm, no, that's not how it works, they must be destroyed"... and the explosives import limit, you're measuring the entire weight of the AMMUNITION including the case and bullet, not just the powder and primers for explosive TEQ limit!?! "the manufacturer doesn't list weights for the explosive compound weight in the primer nor the weight of the powder in the case" well just because they don't, doesn't make it illegal! Weigh it yourself if you have to... The charges were an absolute joke but when I said that to the judge she said "ok, so you can sit back in jail and come back in 2 weeks for another bail review then". They would drag me to court every 2 weeks for a bail review and if I didn't plead guilty would just say "reverse onus, threat to the public, bail denied", so was useless for me to even go. The other problem was bail review was always on pancake tuesdays and f me if I was missing breakfast on that day so eventually I had to plead guilty (so NO APPEAL) :( I won't name my lawyer but he is supposedly #1 or #2 firearms layer in Ontario, at least he billed like he was $$$! I was sentenced to 1 year in jail (the minimum sentence on conviction of prohibited device, the rest of the charges could have just got off with fine and/or community service) and was released after 6 months on provincial parole (which I'm told hardly anybody gets). They melted down my $30k worth of guns (which they originally said I would be able to have an agent sell them to pay for my lawyer) and I received a 10 year firearms and explosives prohibition which recently expired. I have my PAL again and my Pyro and Display Fireworks licenses so other then not being able to touch guns or fireworks for 10 years it hasn't specifically affected me. My PAL application sat on the CFO's desk for many months until after calling his extension 188 times (actual number, I recorded every call) I finally got through to him, he did a phone interview "so you didn't rape or murder anyone? ok, looks good, stamp stamp" had my PAL# an hour later. My explosives license was approved almost instantly, I assume because your PAL allows you to manufacture some binary explosives (tannerite, etc.) so if you have that they must just clear you for the pyro stuff. I hope that answered all your questions. ecuflashking.com/rcmp/
@@toysareforboys1 Well, you took it rather well I'd say by the way you refer to 30k in guns, 6 months in prison, and a 10 year prohibition as "other than that"! Also, the one "40mm Military Grenade Launcher" wasn't even prohibited at that time (it really bothers me the way they add stuff to all their press releases that are obviously only there to scare an uneducated public (when a press release should in my mind be FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF EDUCATING THE PUBLIC!): the 'nades are the weapons, the launcher is a modified sewage pipe): if they had found the WEAPONS it is designed to launch that would have been a much different story... Of course there was no "Go fund me" back then so it would have been difficult to get the word out to the gun community to help you out. I am sincerely sorry about your troubles. Anyways, I'm glad you're back and active in the community. Take care. PS thanks for supporting Mr Runkle: I'm not in a financial position to do so at this time so I'm very grateful to those who chose to support him so he can continue to make this content which is so important for the public to have at this time.
LPL has opened two of my three safes on his channel. One of them took him about 1:40 to enter and the other took him almost 4:00 to get into. I rely on multiple layers of security including obfuscation being the best. If you can’t find it you can’t break it. (Obviously I won’t reveal their contents or my other security but I’m certain that information in the wrong hands would allow entry in less then 10 minutes for my toughest safe all without raising an alarm. Worst part is I have spent well over $1,000 to prevent this but some Princess Auto tools and a quick $50-$100 Amazon purchase could allow this.
So in the eyes of this judgement, am I correct in thinking the metal containers sold as gun cabinets by the likes of Canadian Tire and Cabelas would be considered as safes?
My personal rule is that if it isn't advertised and sold as a safe by the manufacturer then it isn't a safe. Regardless of what this ruling says , if it is advertised as a cabinet then it is not a safe and the last thing I want to do is have to defend myself in court so I spent the extra money and bought an actual safe.
Bassdeff follow the spirit as well as the letter and you can hold your head high. Further it is our obligation not to turn petty criminals in to murderers by supplying them with our legal guns. (It is a moral obligation as well as a legal one, my morals rank much higher then the law in my eyes because of its uneven handedness).
That's what the judgment says but I would air on the side of caution as stated earlier in the video, this was a provincial ruling so there is a reasonable chance that another court may disagree. Why put yourself through the legal battle, trigger locks aren't THAT expensive. Might be the kind of thing that, in a pinch your lawyer could use to fight on your behalf but your already up shits creek at that point. Just my 0.02 and I'm not a lawyer so you can just basically ignore me if you want :)
@@john-paulsilke893 You MUST MUST do MORE than the reg's say. Unless you've got money to burn and time to sit in jail it's not worth just trying to get by on the minimums. I was convicted of unsafe storage because my stuff was in a Canadian Tire gun "cabinet" (that wasn't bolted to the floor/wall, that seemed to be the big issue with the RCMP). Follow @Bassdeff 's avice, if the manufacturer doesn't call it a safe, don't use it as such.
What was the surrounding story to this? Seems to me this was a massive fishing expedition, one that while ended well certainly cost the victim a LOT of money.
Harry Barnes aka " Johnny Sombrero" was the leader and founder of the Black Diamond Riders Motorcycle Club. Here's a nice little write up of what happened ... yourwardnews.wordpress.com/2013/07/18/the-black-diamond-riders-m-c/
@@Eastford Thanks for sharing that. Obviously not a Saint, not really someone I want representing the firearms community, but also, they spent 5 hours in his home and that's what they got him on, so maybe they should have done their homework better.
Thinking on this - I suspect it's the Air Vents that are the difference between a Safe and Not-a-safe. In the event of a Fire, a proper Safe (with seals) provides a degree of protection to the contents, protection that is nullified by the Air Vents.
I was relieved to hear the ending and I often wondered how picky the courts would be about the ambiguous "not easily broken into " (just like most of the firearms act) :)
Hey Runkle, wonder if you could make a video on Firearm insurance in Canada. I'm still waiting to get my PAL/RPAL but I'm curious as to how the insurance policies work (that are offered thru the CCFR etc). I know that every policy is different, but i'm just curious as to what the general exclusions of the policies are for the most part and when the policy would come into effect. Or even maybe how a homeowners policy responds to certain aspects around firearms. (Ie: theft of a firearm, would a liability policy on a home respond to a civil suit in the event of a justified self defense shooting in your home). Again I know all policies are different, but just curious.
Targets in Canada had an "American Security" Safe to store the cash. They were UL TL-15 rated 2400lbs 30x24x60" ! The door weighs 800lbs. TL-15 is 15 minutes tools on safe. The alarm system and response is there to close the hole.
Thank you for the video and the associated information. I'd like to see a detailed look at storage laws and what is mean't by phrases used "readily accessible" actually means. to me its wide open to interpretation.
I'm frightened they will implement central storage...... instead of a buy back which was just cancelled by tender. Then once they are all centrally stored steal and confiscate. Thank you for the time you put into making these very informative videos. I've recommended you to many. Keep up the great work for law abiding citizens.
@@davidmcgregor4691 My opinion is that the contrary is true. I believe it's a sign of the feds realizing that they have bitten off more than they can chew. They could have banned only the AR15 for similar political optics, but they've decided to go for the grand slam. I think we're all aware that a majority of these firearms will be buried, lost in a boating accident, or hidden regardless of a buyback happening or not. Do NOT do this.
I should elaborate. If you believe a buyback is expensive, you haven't imagined the cost of centralized storage and implied registration for all of the newly banned firearms. It's simply not economical. Confiscation is simply dangerous for anyone involved and would be a travesty. They can try I supposed, but would you want to be the police officer that's forced to door knock gun owners every day for months?
Central storage is outright confiscation. Once enough privately owned guns are in the building, the government will simply lock it up and say too bad. Drug dealers and organized crime will certainly get a good laugh out of it as their guns won't be impacted though... they'll still have their guns.
I *think* the issue about the air vents / holes is that now you have something (the hole / vent) you can insert a pair of metal cutters into, and now you can easily start to cut the cabinet open and steal its contents (guns). Perhaps the Crown was trying to argue that the vents made the cabinet less secure? Same with seal around the door (enter pry bars into cracks and seams).
Thank you for your professionalism and breaking the law down into layman terms and language. I appreciate your efforts on informing the public and law abiding gun owners alike. Cheers,
Excellent video / information. Very much appreciated! Keep these videos coming. Question, I have often heard this "comment" and it was mentioned by someone in their comments to this video.... Is there a legal requirement to meet the safe storage law in the Firearms Act to have the safe or vault bolted to the floor or wall? Obviously, anything a person does to enhance the durability of the safe / vault is good idea. When possible to do so it is a good idea as it would likely work in the owners best interest if he / she found themselves in court. Putting the "good idea" aside, is there really a legal requirement to have the safe bolted to the floor and / or wall? One could argue that by doing so, the safes fire and water proof capabilities maybe compromised. This has nothing to do with safety but could be a legitimate argue to be used in some way to defend why the safe wasn't bolted down or why it shouldn't be bolted down. As well, I would assume the weight of the safe would be another mitigating factor to consider in an argument on this issue. A safe weighing some 800lbs to 1000lbs is not a readily moveable object. As well, exact placement of the safe to enhance it's efficiency could be another mitigating factor such as if the safe is recessed back between three concrete walls and only the door being exposed. I only bring all these points up as I could see some if not all being used as part of a defence or prosecution if the prosecutor was determined to charge the individual. The basic question though is does the safe need to be bolted down to meet safe storage requirements in accordance with the Firearms Act?
Not everyone lives in a home with many different rooms. What would be required of someone who is licensed but lives in a bachelor apartment? How do you keep a bolt or ammunition separate from your firearms?
He was the head of a well known MC Club. I'm sure they were hoping to get more on him, but the raid on his house turned up nothing. The storage issue was weak, but that's all they had.
Dunno if you heard of it or not Ian but there was a guy who lived near me who had his entire basement set up as a " vault" with cement walls all around and a legit vault door installed. When he went away on vacation someone broke into hos house and used chainsaw to cut out big hole in main floor above vault. He was charged with careless storage.
I don't think he should have been charged with careless storage as no one really factors in someone using a chainsaw or even should have to factor that in when storing something. As that is just obsessive to even think someone would use a chainsaw to get into a vault since you would have to think about a lot of ways they would try to break in just to make it non careless storage
Love you video's! I farm in southern Alberta , caught a guy trying to steal one of my trucks on the farm . walked up to my truck in the dark and tapped the barrel of my .22 on the back of his head as he was rummaging threw the truck looking for the key and asked him to get out , to which he did ! 3/4 hour later the rcmp arrived and gave me shit for keeping him at gun point . The officer asked if i had intent to shot the guy and I pointed at my backhoe back in the yard and told him if the guy wouldn't have co=operated ,you would not have been called . the guy ended up being charged with mischief under $5000
Great video. I’d like to know what counts as proper storage for the purpose of restricting access to other members of the same household. For example, is a trigger lock sufficient for a gun sitting loose in a closet, if the spouse does not have a PAL? Or would the spouse be considered to unlawfully ‘possess’ that gun since he/she has access to take possession of it, trigger lock notwithstanding ?
It's problem if guns are not fully locked up since only you have license and those guns are registered only to you. Safe storage applies if you are not using the gun at that instant. Also, a spouse cannot know the location of the keys or lock combo. A pal got tricked by cops who wanted to know if the wife knew where the keys were "just in case". Instead, include instructions in your Will as to keys location and instructions for inheritance or disposal. You still have property rights in your Will, that is, a Prohib can be deactivated and sold as such or sold to another prohib license holder or licensed dealer, etc. So far, the gov is not entitled to seize guns at death. Grown kids cannot inherit live prohibs (dewats OK) or have other live guns without a PAL or RPAL.
I won’t answer this as our expert is much more capable. But if it’s Restricted or if you have children, definitely consider better security even if it’s only better concealment such as a small shelf on the door side for the gun to rest on.
@@john-paulsilke893 Physical safe storage applies all the time anything less the a secure container, etc is risky. 'Concealment' is not the same, it's playing with fire, why do it? Legal problems spoils your year for sure and costs big! In my case, I have a total of 5 layers of locks and a monitored alarm. I did this in the 1990s when some cops that live too close were known for stealing from owners!
I tend to agree with you as to overdoing the storage regs for firearms. Although I do not have any prohibited guns I do have restricted and non-restricted guns. They are locked in a Canadian tire style safe that is bolted to a walled and the floor and every gun has a trigger lock on it. I have a central station alarm system monitored 24/7. The gun safe door is alarmed. In the same room the ammunition cabinet is steel and bolted to the wall, and padlocked. The room the safe is in is dead-bolted and kept locked and is also alarmed. The garage where this room enters from is alarmed and locked. The exterior door to the garage is steel and deadbolted and is monitored by an exterior cctv system that connects to my cell phone as does the main building alarm. As you can see I am not the most trusting of individuals when it comes to ensuring complete compliance with authorities. I should point out that I do own a security company and have worked extensively within the legal system and, as a result take nothing for granted.
Your comment that Evan if you're home you could be charged with unsafe storage, on the rcmp website it states you can "display " firearms while your home. So how could a court convict if you're home? If the police say guns not in use how can they claim they're not being displayed?
Interesting video. Since so few jurisdictions have set standards for a “safe” for residential firearms storage I have seen occasional reference to the firearms storage standard as set out by California. When I look at them they seem to be a more robust version of a locker with built-in locking devices as opposed to padlocks and with locking pins/bolts on three sides. Comments?
Hello there. I asked a question somewhat related to this over at the CCFR (I'm a member), and they sent me to your channel here...subscribed! I have just gotten my first restricted and I've watched several of your videos, some of which came very close to answering or answering in part my question: as I understand it, there is no law against a person having loaded magazines for a handgun (the handgun is unloaded) stored in the safe WITH said handgun, the handgun NOT being protected by a trigger locking device. This is assuming the safe qualifies as a safe under the legal definition. Is that correct? Thanks so much for all the work you're doing!
I just bought a Beretta M9A3. I don't currently have a safe. So I trigger locked and locked the container it came in for the time being. It's not being stored with ammunition. Is this sufficient? And ... If I were to store loaded magazines with it and in my current arrangement ... Would I be compliant ? Also, I can transport this with loaded magazines as well ...? I'm somewhat clear I just want to make absolute certain ... Thanks in advance for your response.
@Runkle Of The Bailey so by this ruling, a school type locker would be sufficient. I would still pull bolts and ammo into another locker in this case. is that valid? Lots of school lockers available out there for gun owners to take advantage of.
Can you do a video on what defines a room specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of firearms. I'm considering building such a room and am curious to see what would qualify. I was thinking steel locking door and having the room lined with 3/4 plywood. Do rooms need to be inspected by a chief firearms officer or any other qualifying agent?
Ian...I've come to dig your channel. I'm from Texas. But I am in a relationship with a Canadian who lives in Ontario. If the relationship continues on its trajectory I will probably (hopefully) be living in Canada one day. I'm not sure if you'd be up to making a video explaining to us americans who travel to or might one day live in Canada about the basic Canadian rights when dealing with the police. Such as: - do you have a first, second, fourth and fifth amendment equivalent. - do I or when do I have to identify to the police - what are my rights as a passenger in a car that has been stopped by the police. Reason I am asking is because my first trip up there prior to the ongoing global viral issue we've been experiencing...on the way from the airport my girlfriend got stopped for speeding. I was asked for my ID and I asked if it was required since I was the passenger. They took me out of the car after my gf informed them I was american searched me, which is to say patted me down and entered all of my pockets and searched my luggage after my gf gave permission to search her car. Nothing was found and we were free to go without and citation or anything. After asking if I was required to show ID as the passenger I just went with the flow because I didn't know the laws or want to risk future entry into the country. But I would like to know the basic rights in dealing with Canadian law enforcement from an attorney although I understand it would not be legal advice. I know I'm not the only one as well. Thank you keep.up the good videos.
@@RunkleOfTheBailey also, if you decide to do this type of video (which I genuinely would appreciate it if you did) when, how and with what is one allowed to defend ones self or someone else. Reason for this question is during one of my visits to Canada my gf and I were in a bar/pub after going out for dinner; as we were l sitting at our table an obviously drunk guy that we had no interaction with during our visit walked by and grabbed one of my gf breasts. She of course was offended and grabbed his wrist and I grabbed his arm as I stood up...I just pushed him back and said something to the effect of "that's not cool...you need to get the f**k away from us..." And called him a few choice words. He continued to stand there trying to talk to my gf as we both continued to tell him to leave us alone. He left within several minutes. Neither my gf or I were intoxicated as we only had two beers each. As I said in my first post I am from Texas. If this were to have happened here i would have been legally comfortable in not showing as much restraint. I vividly remember mentally questioning "what am I allowed to do here?" I understand this video would not be personal legal advice but I would like to get a lawyers opinion... Thank you.
Great content my friend. I notice you mention the cost of a trial quite a bit. And I appreciate that. But it raises an interesting point in my mind. Canadians have fairly equal access to social services like healthcare. Which can be extremely expensive. I kinda consider criminal convictions to be right up there with health issues, as they can totally change your life. Why is it, there's no socialized legal defence to give more people, more access to affordable legal defence. Everyone has the right to a trail, but not the right to defence from that trial. I feel like this is unfair, especially to anyone middle class or lower. Just a thought.
At a guess, Mr. Runkle, the issue of the air vents might have been considered a structural weakness or point of attack for somebody trying to break into the safe.
Runkle Of The Bailey a prybar in a vent hole does nothing. If there are enough of them it could aid in cutting the circumference but that would take quit a long time. Better to use a drill and a tungsten screw and a dent puller or probably a jiggler or wave lockpick set since these locks are typically very weak. Very little skill required.
I wonder, what precisely defines a specifically constructed room? If it is a modified closet with steel exterior grade door and safe inside, can it be considered as a special room?
I know several people who built rooms like this. Apparently the CFO will provide more details if you call. But you are right it has to be a steel outdoor grade door.
The thing that irks me is that it is in the public interest for firearms owners to choose the higher standard of storage in a safe, than in a less secure location. And that in this case, there had been no theft or exposure to the public. If he had selected the lower standard of storage with bolts and carriers removed, it isn't likely that would have been as deterrent to thieves as if he had stored the articles in a safe at any level at or above the minimal reasonable interpretation of a "safe". The guy lived in an apartment, any thief who entered the apartment could assemble something out of parts more easily if parts had been removed, but stored under lock in some kind of minimal container, other than in a safe.
So not sure if it's been chained but my understanding to law I can hang a non restricted rifle on the wall. It doesn't even need a trigger lock by law but it's a good thing to do. Am I correct on this and if not can u explain it? Thnx. Ps I live in a rual aria.
Question for you sir Now that many AR15 are prohibited and that we are still keeping it in Canadian tire metal containers with bolt caries and trigger lock should we be worried should we be removing bolt carrier and locking it up in separate container or just put it in container with ammo?
This channel rules. A 'must subscribe' for any gun owner in Canada.
It's great to have a Canadian perspective of the law. Your videos are really informative.
Thank you--and yeah, there's a lot of American commentary out there, but not much Canadian.
Add as many layers of security to your firearms storage as you can.
That's a nice comment. Hope you have a lovely weekend!
@@tactical_pat6449 the biggest security , do not tell any liberal you have firearms
@@RunkleOfTheBailey As a new canadian rPAL owner, I'm devouring your videos and wanted to say thanks for all the incredibly informative videos you've made throughout the years.
The crown should never be allowed to benefit from the ambiguity of it's own laws.
Aha the crown RELIES on the ambiguity of its own laws
We still live in Medieval Times. How do you think the monarchy got so rich? Due to taxing you to death and pillaging.
Another video from Mr. Runkle?
YES PLEASE!
It shouldn't be a surprise that your channel is growing, you are doing good work. Canadian gun laws are very vague and hard to get a legal perspective on for the average folk. You can get many conflicting opinions on Canadian firearm related forums on wide range of firearm related topics. Your channel proves to be very informative by brining previous cases and how you derived to your conclusions from the context in an easy to understand format. When a life changing criminal charge is pending for the average folk just trying to abide laws set by policy makers intentionally left unclear. it is no surprise many would listen to your opinion.
Thank you for your great work.
Thank you, appreciate it.
Would there be a different interpretation for non-restricted gun storage.
First time commenting.
Canadian tire and or Cabela’s has a gun safe sale, I’m presuming they’re all legal.
Everything sold to the public should have been reviewed fully by law, NO EXCEPTIONS.
The consumer should be able to trust those safes without giving it a thought.
Laws themselves, create criminals, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND!
Great show as always my friend
Thank you for taking the time to inform.
I seem to recall a case, in Toronto I believe, where a safe ( A really well built safe, I recall) was worked on for an entire weekend, and they eventually breached it, and stole the guns. He was charged with unsafe storage. Crazy stuff. Like you said, given time, skill, and tools, you can breach a bank vault, and there is plenty of instances where this has happened. Burglary rated safes have time rating, tool ratings, etc, and an expensive box can have a TL-15 rating, and thats just rated for 15 minutes of work. Not very long. The better the rating, the more expensive it gets.
Your videos are really appreciated. I’ve had many questions answered since you started these
I recall a person - bid on a real BANK safe - and he had to pour a concrete pad - for a 2 ton safe. We as owners of firearms - have tried to follow the law. We use the commercial safe's as we can only TRUST - that those SAFE's - Vault's or other special rooms we build to protect our property and firearms. Thank YOU Sir for Your work and the explanations of our laws. Cheers!
Finally a proper informative channel on canadian law! Thank you sir
I'm a former soldier (90's). I'm not new to firearms but only got my civilian PAL last year. I had some cheap choices but thought fk it, I'll buy a legit gun safe. For $450 on sale at Bass Pro in December 2019 I bought a manual combo lock safe. 238lbs good for my apartment, fire rated etc. There is no question that it is a safe. I wasn't going to screw around with that. I have my non-restricted stuff in there and I can also store some of my hunting ammo on it's shelf.
Glad this video cleared some things up but make easier and buy something sold as a "safe". When police come to inspect, I have no doubt they come with the intent to charge.
Harry Barnes aka 'Johnny Sombrero' was a pretty cool guy and always gave great advice! I keep the Nov 2016 news clipping of his death at 81 due to heart disease on my bulletin board, right over my reloading bench! RIP Johnny!
Sadly never met the guy--he sounds like quite a character, and I bet he would have been great to talk to.
If the law is vague, any uncertainty should be construed to the defendants’ favor.
If you ask a military man the difference between a “tank” and a “tank destroyer,” he will explain the difference is NOT in the construction but in the doctrine. Apply that here: A cabinet is a safe when used as such, and a locker when used as such.
The other container sounds like the tool chests found on construction sites. As one manufacturer calls his brand “SiteSafe,” I’d say that makes the box a safe.
If the intent was to mandate certain features, installation, or certification, then it is for the law to specify. After all, every building code has no problem bwing so specific.
Important information for every firearms owner in Canada
Poor Canadians, I feel badly for how you are treated. Wow! The rules you suffer under are mental
Indeed dude. Absolute tyranny. We love firearms enough that we put up with the bother and legal scrutiny. We need more liberty here, that's for sure.
We continue to elect aholes. We are too nice, and they take advantage of us.
Only a small percentage of Canadians own firearms. The majority live in their urban bubbles and are the ones who vote people into power who don’t care that they have to abuse the most good-natured and well-behaved group of citizens in the country in order to satisfy the people who have no idea what they’re talking about.
@@ratherbefishing4225 drunk on promises of free things.
@@walperstyle Sad thing is it seems to work.
Really enjoying your videos ... As a fellow Edmontonian and new gun owner, I find them very educational..
Glad you find them helpful.
I live in Edmonton as well 🤟🏼
Mr. Runkle,
I have recently discovered your channel and was very impressed with both the quality of your videos and the topics you cover (absolutely fascinating!!!). I immediately subscribed and will recommend your channel to everyone I know. The legalities surrounding firearms and other weapons as it relates to Canadian laws are rarely covered in such a comprehensive manner elsewhere, and I appreciate your insight on this.
Good luck with your channel, and keep up the good work!
P.S. Very impressed with the lockpickinglawyer reference, I also follow him :)
I appreciate what you are doing .
And just wanted to thank you
Much appreciated!
Thank you for another great video. I keep a copy of R. v. Barnes sitting on top of my "safe."
I keep a copy of the RCMP guidelines for storage and the Barnes case taped to the inside door of all my safes...
Savage. Nothing says I know the law and have a lawyer like that to any nosy inspector looking at your property.
This is a FANTASTIC idea. And keep copies of the law in your transport storage also! Huge deterrent for illegal/unlawful search/seizures and charges.
You appreciate our support, and we appreciate your content! I'm a first time viewer with this video, and a new subscriber
Awesome! Thank you!
Your videos are the best. You do a great job. And your logic is sound even in your scepticism. Keep up the great videos!
It's amazing how you make this stuff so easy to consume and understand
I like the way you explain in a simple language and comprehensive way the case of safe and locker for fire arms. Thanks so much.
I know for the US Army they want metal cabinets with 16 gauge steel, seams welded every few inches not just with bolts and chain able to the floor or affixed to the floor. Then having the lock hardware for the pad lock also welded. That was also inside the armsroom, everything was to to be locked inside the room.
Liked and subscribed. Very helpful info to be found in your videos in a time of uncertainty for firearms owners.
I have only recently come across your videos. I am extremely impressed with the educational value I glean from them and I anticipate your channel will be very successful. There are very few methods to find Canadian firearms case law and an easy to understand explanation that is omnipresent in your presentations. BZ!
Great channel and very informative, support from Canada!!!
Safes can range from a steel locker to a 20 ton built in vault. Conforming to firearms storage laws a safe can be a steel locker. Firearms owners can’t be expected to pay $5k to get a quality safe. Locking up a firearm is not intended to prevent theft, only quick access that may result in a discharge. The $1500 gun safe is not a quality safe that can prevent forced entry. Safes can only extend the time required to gain entry. Expensive safes only prevent attacks by tools for a short time. This is where an alarm 🚨 paired to a good safe is the best defence. A safe is something that requires dedicated attacks to defeat. Not something that just pulling on the door hard opens it. The person who breaks into a safe is the problem not the person who uses the safe to retain firearms. You can’t say that the owner is at fault and the thief is not, absurd. Do they lay charges against banks when they are robbed?
It would be interesting to see some analysis on what constitutes a secure container for purposes of transporting restricted firearms to and from a range. Fro example, there are cloth cases that are lockable (lockable zippers).
In NZ, the definition used to be 'A Lockable container of Stout and Sturdy construction', which apparently harkens back to Victorian style wooden Gun Cabinets, but also allows for things like an old Steel Work Locker.
Future current subscriber - thanks for this video Ian.
I am inheriting some non-restricted rifles and shotguns, and am going through the old videos for anything that pertains to the transportation and storage of said firearms. Even though this video doesn't completely apply, it did help me find the correct regulation and confirm that I am dotting my I's correctly. Albertan by the way, but not anticipating needing your services ;)
The old man always says "a lock only stops an honest man" if someone wants in bad enough, they'll get in
Regarding ventilation of the safe • All ammunition should be stored in a cool, dry place, preferably in a vented container. This will reduce the chance of corrosion or breakdown of the ammunition components that could cause the firearm to jam or misfire. Page 93 - RCMP Canadian Firearms Safety Course Manual
Good catch!
Thank you for the great videos.
Amazing video! May you get millions of subscribers, one for every firearm owner in Canada! I wish my lawyer would have used this case in my trial, I had a handgun with no trigger lock in a Canadian Tire gun "cabinet" and the RCMP said that "because it wasn't bolted to the wall/floor that makes it a portable travel container" and I was convicted of unsafe storage :( Woot, thanks for the shout out at 25:46! yay
That's a damb awkward "travel container"!
@@wilfdarr Plus with the 20 guns in it and tons and tons of ammo it would take 3 people to carry it! RCMP couldn't get it out of my house until they asked me for the key for it so they could remove all the contents! Travel container? yeah... lol :(
@@toysareforboys1 No where in the law does it say the safe must be bolted: the law says they must be locked in the safe, but there is no guidance suggesting the safe must be secured to anything: the law does not require it. It's not even suggested in the RCMP guidance. A safe doesn't become a "travel container" just because it's not bolted to a building: it remains a safe by definition. I take a "travel container" to be a lockable container with carry handles (no this is not a legal definition but as long as they are pulling definitions out of their but you can too!) You should have appealed that ruling (with a new lawyer of course!). Who was your lawyer? Does this affect your ability to have a PAL?
@@wilfdarr I was being held reverse onus with bail denied due to being a "threat to the public", even after I had raised the $1M they were originally asking for. When you're being held reverse onus you have no priority for your court case so I had to plead out if I didn't want to sit in jail for 3 years or more waiting for my court date. They had me on 86 charges with 33 witnesses so they wanted a continuous 3 week block of court time, not easy to obtain and would constantly be pushed back. They came up with a plea deal for four of the 86 charges but when the judge asked me "so you're pleading guilty to unsafe storage, possession of prohibited device, import without authority, over import explosives limit" I said no, I don't agree with any of them, gun was in a safe and safely stored. Prohibited device? The 50rd magazines were disassembled and could hold ZERO rounds so no, not prohibited. Import without authority? I had import certs that the RCMP revoked (the day I went to pickup the firearms at the border) because the RCMP employee I called to verify the firearms wasn't allowed to verify restricted, only non-restricted, how can that be my fault?! Shouldn't I just be able to call the RCMP again and re-verify the firearms with the proper verifier? "ummm, no, that's not how it works, they must be destroyed"... and the explosives import limit, you're measuring the entire weight of the AMMUNITION including the case and bullet, not just the powder and primers for explosive TEQ limit!?! "the manufacturer doesn't list weights for the explosive compound weight in the primer nor the weight of the powder in the case" well just because they don't, doesn't make it illegal! Weigh it yourself if you have to... The charges were an absolute joke but when I said that to the judge she said "ok, so you can sit back in jail and come back in 2 weeks for another bail review then". They would drag me to court every 2 weeks for a bail review and if I didn't plead guilty would just say "reverse onus, threat to the public, bail denied", so was useless for me to even go. The other problem was bail review was always on pancake tuesdays and f me if I was missing breakfast on that day so eventually I had to plead guilty (so NO APPEAL) :( I won't name my lawyer but he is supposedly #1 or #2 firearms layer in Ontario, at least he billed like he was $$$! I was sentenced to 1 year in jail (the minimum sentence on conviction of prohibited device, the rest of the charges could have just got off with fine and/or community service) and was released after 6 months on provincial parole (which I'm told hardly anybody gets). They melted down my $30k worth of guns (which they originally said I would be able to have an agent sell them to pay for my lawyer) and I received a 10 year firearms and explosives prohibition which recently expired. I have my PAL again and my Pyro and Display Fireworks licenses so other then not being able to touch guns or fireworks for 10 years it hasn't specifically affected me. My PAL application sat on the CFO's desk for many months until after calling his extension 188 times (actual number, I recorded every call) I finally got through to him, he did a phone interview "so you didn't rape or murder anyone? ok, looks good, stamp stamp" had my PAL# an hour later. My explosives license was approved almost instantly, I assume because your PAL allows you to manufacture some binary explosives (tannerite, etc.) so if you have that they must just clear you for the pyro stuff. I hope that answered all your questions. ecuflashking.com/rcmp/
@@toysareforboys1 Well, you took it rather well I'd say by the way you refer to 30k in guns, 6 months in prison, and a 10 year prohibition as "other than that"! Also, the one "40mm Military Grenade Launcher" wasn't even prohibited at that time (it really bothers me the way they add stuff to all their press releases that are obviously only there to scare an uneducated public (when a press release should in my mind be FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF EDUCATING THE PUBLIC!): the 'nades are the weapons, the launcher is a modified sewage pipe): if they had found the WEAPONS it is designed to launch that would have been a much different story...
Of course there was no "Go fund me" back then so it would have been difficult to get the word out to the gun community to help you out. I am sincerely sorry about your troubles. Anyways, I'm glad you're back and active in the community. Take care.
PS thanks for supporting Mr Runkle: I'm not in a financial position to do so at this time so I'm very grateful to those who chose to support him so he can continue to make this content which is so important for the public to have at this time.
Hey man, your videos are great. I've seen them all. Very informative! Thanks for all your hard work!
LPL has opened two of my three safes on his channel. One of them took him about 1:40 to enter and the other took him almost 4:00 to get into. I rely on multiple layers of security including obfuscation being the best. If you can’t find it you can’t break it. (Obviously I won’t reveal their contents or my other security but I’m certain that information in the wrong hands would allow entry in less then 10 minutes for my toughest safe all without raising an alarm. Worst part is I have spent well over $1,000 to prevent this but some Princess Auto tools and a quick $50-$100 Amazon purchase could allow this.
This is gold! Thanks for this very elucidating information.
Have you made a video concerning ammunition storage in Canada? Thanks for all your work sir. It’s very helpful
Thanks for your work Ian , big 👍
So in the eyes of this judgement, am I correct in thinking the metal containers sold as gun cabinets by the likes of Canadian Tire and Cabelas would be considered as safes?
Per this judgment, it appears so.
My personal rule is that if it isn't advertised and sold as a safe by the manufacturer then it isn't a safe. Regardless of what this ruling says , if it is advertised as a cabinet then it is not a safe and the last thing I want to do is have to defend myself in court so I spent the extra money and bought an actual safe.
Bassdeff follow the spirit as well as the letter and you can hold your head high. Further it is our obligation not to turn petty criminals in to murderers by supplying them with our legal guns. (It is a moral obligation as well as a legal one, my morals rank much higher then the law in my eyes because of its uneven handedness).
That's what the judgment says but I would air on the side of caution as stated earlier in the video, this was a provincial ruling so there is a reasonable chance that another court may disagree. Why put yourself through the legal battle, trigger locks aren't THAT expensive. Might be the kind of thing that, in a pinch your lawyer could use to fight on your behalf but your already up shits creek at that point.
Just my 0.02 and I'm not a lawyer so you can just basically ignore me if you want :)
@@john-paulsilke893 You MUST MUST do MORE than the reg's say. Unless you've got money to burn and time to sit in jail it's not worth just trying to get by on the minimums. I was convicted of unsafe storage because my stuff was in a Canadian Tire gun "cabinet" (that wasn't bolted to the floor/wall, that seemed to be the big issue with the RCMP). Follow @Bassdeff 's avice, if the manufacturer doesn't call it a safe, don't use it as such.
What was the surrounding story to this? Seems to me this was a massive fishing expedition, one that while ended well certainly cost the victim a LOT of money.
Harry Barnes aka " Johnny Sombrero" was the leader and founder of the Black Diamond Riders Motorcycle Club. Here's a nice little write up of what happened ... yourwardnews.wordpress.com/2013/07/18/the-black-diamond-riders-m-c/
@@Eastford Thanks for sharing that. Obviously not a Saint, not really someone I want representing the firearms community, but also, they spent 5 hours in his home and that's what they got him on, so maybe they should have done their homework better.
Thinking on this - I suspect it's the Air Vents that are the difference between a Safe and Not-a-safe.
In the event of a Fire, a proper Safe (with seals) provides a degree of protection to the contents, protection that is nullified by the Air Vents.
Thanks for the info and explanation on this particular case- great video
I was relieved to hear the ending and I often wondered how picky the courts would be about the ambiguous "not easily broken into " (just like most of the firearms act) :)
Great information thanks for your efforts to make this murky issue a little more clear for the Canadian public!
Hey Runkle, wonder if you could make a video on Firearm insurance in Canada. I'm still waiting to get my PAL/RPAL but I'm curious as to how the insurance policies work (that are offered thru the CCFR etc). I know that every policy is different, but i'm just curious as to what the general exclusions of the policies are for the most part and when the policy would come into effect. Or even maybe how a homeowners policy responds to certain aspects around firearms. (Ie: theft of a firearm, would a liability policy on a home respond to a civil suit in the event of a justified self defense shooting in your home).
Again I know all policies are different, but just curious.
Thanks keep us informed some of this stuff is hard to find.
Targets in Canada had an "American Security" Safe to store the cash. They were UL TL-15 rated 2400lbs 30x24x60" ! The door weighs 800lbs. TL-15 is 15 minutes tools on safe. The alarm system and response is there to close the hole.
Thank you for the video and the associated information. I'd like to see a detailed look at storage laws and what is mean't by phrases used "readily accessible" actually means. to me its wide open to interpretation.
Ian, thank you very much for the excellent content! Subscribed.
Please please do a video on the legal standards of gun rooms, vault rooms and rooms specifically modified to store firearms.
Me too. I’m very interested in the Gun Room solution. I would like to build one and know that I’m within the law.
Ian thank you , love the channel.
I'm frightened they will implement central storage...... instead of a buy back which was just cancelled by tender. Then once they are all centrally stored steal and confiscate.
Thank you for the time you put into making these very informative videos. I've recommended you to many. Keep up the great work for law abiding citizens.
Central storage is just a large honeypot. Centralization of anything leads to large problems.
@Long Nards That is exactly what the feds *want* you to do.
@@davidmcgregor4691 My opinion is that the contrary is true. I believe it's a sign of the feds realizing that they have bitten off more than they can chew.
They could have banned only the AR15 for similar political optics, but they've decided to go for the grand slam.
I think we're all aware that a majority of these firearms will be buried, lost in a boating accident, or hidden regardless of a buyback happening or not. Do NOT do this.
I should elaborate. If you believe a buyback is expensive, you haven't imagined the cost of centralized storage and implied registration for all of the newly banned firearms. It's simply not economical.
Confiscation is simply dangerous for anyone involved and would be a travesty. They can try I supposed, but would you want to be the police officer that's forced to door knock gun owners every day for months?
Central storage is outright confiscation. Once enough privately owned guns are in the building, the government will simply lock it up and say too bad. Drug dealers and organized crime will certainly get a good laugh out of it as their guns won't be impacted though... they'll still have their guns.
I *think* the issue about the air vents / holes is that now you have something (the hole / vent) you can insert a pair of metal cutters into, and now you can easily start to cut the cabinet open and steal its contents (guns). Perhaps the Crown was trying to argue that the vents made the cabinet less secure? Same with seal around the door (enter pry bars into cracks and seams).
Thank you for your professionalism and breaking the law down into layman terms and language. I appreciate your efforts on informing the public and law abiding gun owners alike. Cheers,
Thank you again for clarifying alot once again. A +++
I wonder if the police were trying to say the vents are a weak point for entry?
Have you done a video on what constitutes a room constructed so that it cannot readily be broken into?
Thank-you Sir! I do appreciate your videos.
Excellent video and information. Thanks Ian!!
Excellent video / information. Very much appreciated! Keep these videos coming.
Question, I have often heard this "comment" and it was mentioned by someone in their comments to this video.... Is there a legal requirement to meet the safe storage law in the Firearms Act to have the safe or vault bolted to the floor or wall? Obviously, anything a person does to enhance the durability of the safe / vault is good idea. When possible to do so it is a good idea as it would likely work in the owners best interest if he / she found themselves in court. Putting the "good idea" aside, is there really a legal requirement to have the safe bolted to the floor and / or wall? One could argue that by doing so, the safes fire and water proof capabilities maybe compromised. This has nothing to do with safety but could be a legitimate argue to be used in some way to defend why the safe wasn't bolted down or why it shouldn't be bolted down. As well, I would assume the weight of the safe would be another mitigating factor to consider in an argument on this issue. A safe weighing some 800lbs to 1000lbs is not a readily moveable object. As well, exact placement of the safe to enhance it's efficiency could be another mitigating factor such as if the safe is recessed back between three concrete walls and only the door being exposed. I only bring all these points up as I could see some if not all being used as part of a defence or prosecution if the prosecutor was determined to charge the individual.
The basic question though is does the safe need to be bolted down to meet safe storage requirements in accordance with the Firearms Act?
Hi, Lockpicking Lawyer here, today we are breaking Canadian law
Thanks for that valuable information.
Well done, I enjoyed this video, and thanks for putting in the time.
How do you say "uneccessary use of Latin" in Latin? I'm glad you spoke of this, since I am an owner of a Canadian Tire cabinet "safe."
@@misuseofyou Yeah,. I just edited that comment. I should have guessed it would be open to that interpretation.
Well at least it's built for gun storage and not like a 'school locker'.
Not everyone lives in a home with many different rooms. What would be required of someone who is licensed but lives in a bachelor apartment?
How do you keep a bolt or ammunition separate from your firearms?
Awesome video from Mr. Runkle. Could you please talk about modified storage room method as well? Really appreciated.
I'm curious what lead up to them getting a warrant in the first place?
Someone wanted those guns for personal reasons.
He was the head of a well known MC Club.
I'm sure they were hoping to get more on him, but the raid on his house turned up nothing. The storage issue was weak, but that's all they had.
I really appreciate all of your videos Ian and hope I NEVER need your services!
Dunno if you heard of it or not Ian but there was a guy who lived near me who had his entire basement set up as a " vault" with cement walls all around and a legit vault door installed.
When he went away on vacation someone broke into hos house and used chainsaw to cut out big hole in main floor above vault.
He was charged with careless storage.
I don't think he should have been charged with careless storage as no one really factors in someone using a chainsaw or even should have to factor that in when storing something. As that is just obsessive to even think someone would use a chainsaw to get into a vault since you would have to think about a lot of ways they would try to break in just to make it non careless storage
Thank you for these videos , your helping a lot of people
Thank you! These are great videos.
Love you video's! I farm in southern Alberta , caught a guy trying to steal one of my trucks on the farm . walked up to my truck in the dark and tapped the barrel of my .22 on the back of his head as he was rummaging threw the truck looking for the key and asked him to get out , to which he did ! 3/4 hour later the rcmp arrived and gave me shit for keeping him at gun point . The officer asked if i had intent to shot the guy and I pointed at my backhoe back in the yard and told him if the guy wouldn't have co=operated ,you would not have been called . the guy ended up being charged with mischief under $5000
Great video.
I’d like to know what counts as proper storage for the purpose of restricting access to other members of the same household. For example, is a trigger lock sufficient for a gun sitting loose in a closet, if the spouse does not have a PAL? Or would the spouse be considered to unlawfully ‘possess’ that gun since he/she has access to take possession of it, trigger lock notwithstanding ?
Heh, this one is on my list to do. I recorded one for it ages ago, but I am going to re-record it for a few reasons. But it's coming, for sure.
It's problem if guns are not fully locked up since only you have license and those guns are registered only to you. Safe storage applies if you are not using the gun at that instant. Also, a spouse cannot know the location of the keys or lock combo. A pal got tricked by cops who wanted to know if the wife knew where the keys were "just in case". Instead, include instructions in your Will as to keys location and instructions for inheritance or disposal. You still have property rights in your Will, that is, a Prohib can be deactivated and sold as such or sold to another prohib license holder or licensed dealer, etc. So far, the gov is not entitled to seize guns at death. Grown kids cannot inherit live prohibs (dewats OK) or have other live guns without a PAL or RPAL.
I won’t answer this as our expert is much more capable. But if it’s Restricted or if you have children, definitely consider better security even if it’s only better concealment such as a small shelf on the door side for the gun to rest on.
@@john-paulsilke893 Physical safe storage applies all the time anything less the a secure container, etc is risky. 'Concealment' is not the same, it's playing with fire, why do it? Legal problems spoils your year for sure and costs big! In my case, I have a total of 5 layers of locks and a monitored alarm. I did this in the 1990s when some cops that live too close were known for stealing from owners!
@@RunkleOfTheBailey Can't wait for the video on that!!!
Crown: If we win the case, we want all his guns.
Also Crown: If we lose the case, we want all his guns.
Good judge.
Absolutely. They cut right to the issues in a very clear, succinct judgment.
C’est excellent et très clair! Thank!
YOUR WORTH HAS ALWAYS BEEN HIGH BUT LATELY CAUSEA TURD, your updates are invaluable, tks
Very helpful. Thank you sir.
I tend to agree with you as to overdoing the storage regs for firearms. Although I do not have any prohibited guns I do have restricted and non-restricted guns. They are locked in a Canadian tire style safe that is bolted to a walled and the floor and every gun has a trigger lock on it. I have a central station alarm system monitored 24/7. The gun safe door is alarmed. In the same room the ammunition cabinet is steel and bolted to the wall, and padlocked. The room the safe is in is dead-bolted and kept locked and is also alarmed. The garage where this room enters from is alarmed and locked. The exterior door to the garage is steel and deadbolted and is monitored by an exterior cctv system that connects to my cell phone as does the main building alarm. As you can see I am not the most trusting of individuals when it comes to ensuring complete compliance with authorities. I should point out that I do own a security company and have worked extensively within the legal system and, as a result take nothing for granted.
Excellent video, eye opener
Your comment that Evan if you're home you could be charged with unsafe storage, on the rcmp website it states you can "display " firearms while your home. So how could a court convict if you're home? If the police say guns not in use how can they claim they're not being displayed?
Interesting video. Since so few jurisdictions have set standards for a “safe” for residential firearms storage I have seen occasional reference to the firearms storage standard as set out by California. When I look at them they seem to be a more robust version of a locker with built-in locking devices as opposed to padlocks and with locking pins/bolts on three sides. Comments?
Hello there. I asked a question somewhat related to this over at the CCFR (I'm a member), and they sent me to your channel here...subscribed! I have just gotten my first restricted and I've watched several of your videos, some of which came very close to answering or answering in part my question: as I understand it, there is no law against a person having loaded magazines for a handgun (the handgun is unloaded) stored in the safe WITH said handgun, the handgun NOT being protected by a trigger locking device. This is assuming the safe qualifies as a safe under the legal definition. Is that correct?
Thanks so much for all the work you're doing!
I just bought a Beretta M9A3. I don't currently have a safe. So I trigger locked and locked the container it came in for the time being. It's not being stored with ammunition. Is this sufficient? And ... If I were to store loaded magazines with it and in my current arrangement ... Would I be compliant ? Also, I can transport this with loaded magazines as well ...? I'm somewhat clear I just want to make absolute certain ... Thanks in advance for your response.
I love your videos. Thank you
Thank you! I really appreciate it.
@Runkle Of The Bailey so by this ruling, a school type locker would be sufficient. I would still pull bolts and ammo into another locker in this case. is that valid? Lots of school lockers available out there for gun owners to take advantage of.
Can you do a video on what defines a room specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of firearms. I'm considering building such a room and am curious to see what would qualify. I was thinking steel locking door and having the room lined with 3/4 plywood. Do rooms need to be inspected by a chief firearms officer or any other qualifying agent?
Great vid . Thank you.
Ian...I've come to dig your channel. I'm from Texas. But I am in a relationship with a Canadian who lives in Ontario. If the relationship continues on its trajectory I will probably (hopefully) be living in Canada one day.
I'm not sure if you'd be up to making a video explaining to us americans who travel to or might one day live in Canada about the basic Canadian rights when dealing with the police. Such as:
- do you have a first, second, fourth and fifth amendment equivalent.
- do I or when do I have to identify to the police
- what are my rights as a passenger in a car that has been stopped by the police.
Reason I am asking is because my first trip up there prior to the ongoing global viral issue we've been experiencing...on the way from the airport my girlfriend got stopped for speeding. I was asked for my ID and I asked if it was required since I was the passenger. They took me out of the car after my gf informed them I was american searched me, which is to say patted me down and entered all of my pockets and searched my luggage after my gf gave permission to search her car. Nothing was found and we were free to go without and citation or anything. After asking if I was required to show ID as the passenger I just went with the flow because I didn't know the laws or want to risk future entry into the country. But I would like to know the basic rights in dealing with Canadian law enforcement from an attorney although I understand it would not be legal advice. I know I'm not the only one as well.
Thank you keep.up the good videos.
Hmm, Canadian law primer for Americans might be a good video, for sure.
@@RunkleOfTheBailey also, if you decide to do this type of video (which I genuinely would appreciate it if you did) when, how and with what is one allowed to defend ones self or someone else.
Reason for this question is during one of my visits to Canada my gf and I were in a bar/pub after going out for dinner; as we were l sitting at our table an obviously drunk guy that we had no interaction with during our visit walked by and grabbed one of my gf breasts. She of course was offended and grabbed his wrist and I grabbed his arm as I stood up...I just pushed him back and said something to the effect of "that's not cool...you need to get the f**k away from us..." And called him a few choice words. He continued to stand there trying to talk to my gf as we both continued to tell him to leave us alone. He left within several minutes. Neither my gf or I were intoxicated as we only had two beers each.
As I said in my first post I am from Texas. If this were to have happened here i would have been legally comfortable in not showing as much restraint. I vividly remember mentally questioning "what am I allowed to do here?"
I understand this video would not be personal legal advice but I would like to get a lawyers opinion... Thank you.
Great content my friend.
I notice you mention the cost of a trial quite a bit. And I appreciate that. But it raises an interesting point in my mind.
Canadians have fairly equal access to social services like healthcare. Which can be extremely expensive.
I kinda consider criminal convictions to be right up there with health issues, as they can totally change your life.
Why is it, there's no socialized legal defence to give more people, more access to affordable legal defence.
Everyone has the right to a trail, but not the right to defence from that trial.
I feel like this is unfair, especially to anyone middle class or lower.
Just a thought.
because it isnt in the interest of the federal government to subsidize cases where they lose
At a guess, Mr. Runkle, the issue of the air vents might have been considered a structural weakness or point of attack for somebody trying to break into the safe.
Seems to me that an air vent is way less of a vulnerability than just the door itself.
Runkle Of The Bailey a prybar in a vent hole does nothing. If there are enough of them it could aid in cutting the circumference but that would take quit a long time. Better to use a drill and a tungsten screw and a dent puller or probably a jiggler or wave lockpick set since these locks are typically very weak. Very little skill required.
Thank You for another great video.
10:27 - the air vents are a big deal, there, Ian! Gaseous state firearms are not to be trifled with!
I wonder, what precisely defines a specifically constructed room? If it is a modified closet with steel exterior grade door and safe inside, can it be considered as a special room?
I know several people who built rooms like this. Apparently the CFO will provide more details if you call. But you are right it has to be a steel outdoor grade door.
The thing that irks me is that it is in the public interest for firearms owners to choose the higher standard of storage in a safe, than in a less secure location. And that in this case, there had been no theft or exposure to the public. If he had selected the lower standard of storage with bolts and carriers removed, it isn't likely that would have been as deterrent to thieves as if he had stored the articles in a safe at any level at or above the minimal reasonable interpretation of a "safe". The guy lived in an apartment, any thief who entered the apartment could assemble something out of parts more easily if parts had been removed, but stored under lock in some kind of minimal container, other than in a safe.
So not sure if it's been chained but my understanding to law I can hang a non restricted rifle on the wall. It doesn't even need a trigger lock by law but it's a good thing to do. Am I correct on this and if not can u explain it? Thnx. Ps I live in a rual aria.
Question for you sir
Now that many AR15 are prohibited and that we are still keeping it in Canadian tire metal containers with bolt caries and trigger lock should we be worried should we be removing bolt carrier and locking it up in separate container or just put it in container with ammo?
Its also considered a safe on the california legislation ( DOJ ) . Maybe that could help in future court cases
Very valuable information! Thank you!