This is such a great video, thank you for such a comprehensive comparison of the books available on the market. If anyone is interested, the reason why pre-1914 books have Psalms 148, 149 and 150 as the last psalm of Lauds under one antiphon is that this was the ancient custom in the Western office for these Psalms to be said every day at Lauds (indeed, its still the practice in the traditional Benedictine office). This was however changed in the Roman Breviary in 1914 by Pope St Pius X in his apostolic constitution "Divinu Afflatu". Divinu Afflatu rearranged the distribution of the Psalms to largely strip out repetition of Psalms (other than the invitatory psalm and Psalm 50 during penitential seasons) and thereby reduce the length of the time it took to say the Roman office for clergy. Psalm 148 was now said alone as the last Psalm at Lauds on Sunday and it seems this new distribution was reflected in the Little Office.
Thanks so much Veronica, your explanations and visual examples are so helpful - just starting out learning chant and using the 1962 Little Office. Please keep posting even the most basic information, it really helps a new convert to Tradition. 💓
I have two Little Office of Our Lady. One is a Maroon hardback by A Master Of Novices Carmel Books 1997 in Latin and English. It also has prayers to Saint Joseph for Lauds and Vespers. It’s got the Nihil Obstat and Impiratur. I use this on on a regular basis. The other one I’ve got is the Angelus press which I also like very much and it c has Office of the Dead. This one is easy to slip into my zipped cover containing my bigger prayer book called Carmelite Devotions. Being a Carmelite tertiary these prayer books are invaluable to me.
I'm not sure. On page xvi, it states that the English translation follows the Douay Rhiems Bible for all psalms and scriptural texts. Unless it's because that usually means the Challoner edition, and they're using a different variation in the Douay Rhiems.
Whilst you were explaining the different versions, you came to one and said 'this is my one'. I loved the fact that its from 1800's but I dont understand which one it actually is. (sorry I'm a beginner). I am reciting Karl Kellers which i find straight forward and simple but am curious about others and in particular now the one you mentioned was yours. Thank you.
The one I called "my one" is from a scan from the Internet Archive from an Irish book from 1832. I had it printed through Lulu.com and it's available - the link should be in the description.
Thank you for making this video. I lost my previous baronius press Little Office and am wondering what new edition should I get. After watching your video I have decided on the 1832 edition.
Thanks for putting the time and effort into helping us pray the Little Office! As you've nicely explained, each of the books mentioned have advantages and drawbacks. All seem to require a considerable amount of individual study and research to pray properly. Which of the copies covered would you suggest for someone praying this great devotion, say, for the fulfillment of their Sabbatine Privilege associated with the Brown Scapular? Would there be one that would be better for someone praying as an individual vs someone praying in a lay-community?
I do like the Angelus Press one for readability. For learning to sing the Latin, you could print bits from the pdfs of the hours at littleoffice.brandt.id.au and introduce one part at a time, probably leaving the psalms last. I wonder if the Little Office of the Immaculate Conception could provide a sort of Mini Little Office for Beginners - no psalms, mostly just the hymn plus some prayers. Sounds like a recipe for another video!
Never heard of that one, but I agree. The shorter version are great for beginners to get used to the prayer schedule of the Little Office covered in the video. There's also The Little Office of the Holy Ghost (mothersforpriestsdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2020/05/jumbo-little-office-of-the-holy-ghost-2.pdf) that might be neat to compare in a potential future video.
Hello! Could you explain what are the differences in rubrics and also in content between the editions of Little Office by Benziger Brothers and Angelus Press? I know that both were updated according to the 1961 rubrics. If you can't explain, I would be satisfied with the indication of some source to consult.
The Benziger Brothers book was updated to 1915. You might be referring to the Baronius Press one, which is updated to the 1961 rubrics. The Baronius Press has an extra word in the collect for Prime which doesn't appear in the Angelus Press book, but apart from that I'm not aware of any differences. Would you like a detailed check of the two books?
@@VeronicaBrandt I had said that both editions were in line with the 1961 rubrics. Sorry, I was wrong. I don't remember why I wrote this. Here in Brazil, the editions of Little Office in Portuguese do not have many explanations about the headings. I got to know the Benziger Brothers edition and saw that it had more explanations, but I know they are out of date. So I would like to know what has changed in the 1961 Little Office rubrics in relation to the Divino Afflatu rubrics (which are the rubrics in the Benziger Brothers edition).
@@kawanardoqueiroz Ah, that makes more sense now! I was wondering about finding copies of the Little Office in other languages. The Rubrics section in the front of the book is still much the same. The 1961 books don't mention any Ave Maria before each hour. The Kyrie Eleison, Christe Eleison, Kyrie Eleison towards the end of each hour is also left out. The Commemoration of Saints at the end of Lauds and Vespers is deleted too.
I have the St Bonaventure book, the one with red cover. It's as clear as mud, I regret getting it. There is no table of contents and I have no idea which day is which.
It depends what you want. The Baronius Press book has some chant in the back, but you could print the chant you're interested in from my webpage, littleoffice.brandt.id.au.
Hi, is the Bonaventure Press version laid out like the Baronius Press with three Offices? Office 1 beginning with Matins on Febuary 3rd. Office 2 beginning with First Vespers on the Saturday before the First Sunday of Advent. and Office 3 beginning with First Vespers on Christmas Eve. Thank you.
The Baronius Press one is the only one I have which has separate sections for Office 1, Office 2 and Office 3. The others list each antiphon with the rubrics: "From Candlemas until Advent", "During Advent" and "From Christmas until Candlemas" - there isn't really enough room for them to be more specific in the hours section. Today I can't find the Bonaventure Press one - we tidied up the house yesterday for our homeschool registration appointment and there are lots of things we can't find. I'm going from a similar reprint which says: "(I) The ordinary form of the Office begins at Matins the day after the Purification. (II) The Advent Office begins with the Vespers of the Saturday before the first Sunday of Advent. (III) The Christmas Office begins with the first Vespers of Christmas and continues until after Compline of the Purification." This is yet another book which I obtained after I made the video - so now I'll need to do another video :) The Angelus Press one gives the same, except the way it's worded is a bit ambiguous on the first Vespers of Christmas, but that's splitting hairs :) I'll write another reply once the red book turns up.
@@lisafurlong1712 I've found the Bonaventure Press book this morning and I cannot find the details of exactly when the changeovers happen. As it's an extract from a larger book, maybe these are assumed knowledge. It just gives the headings "from Candlemas to Advent", "during Advent", "from Christmas to Candlemas".
@@lisafurlong1712 it's only the Baronius Press version which has the flipping back and forth for the little hours in Advent and Christmas. Bonaventure and Angelus both include all the Antiphons inline, so you just need to know which Antiphons to skip. There's a trade off between flipping and skipping.
And also could you do in your kindness do a review on psalms of the little office by Karl Keller( just to know the which version it is)….I have only the Dominican office …am a bit hesitant to buy the others due to changes…I really want to buy the fr lasance little office…but shipping costs to india is high..just now saw your reviews on little office I am planning to buy your 1832 Irish version and your recant 1910 version release(this one was the first little office I prayed before buying the Dominican little office..I love the Dominican too…it is easy to pray than 1910 and has beautiful explanation on psalm a pearl!! but since It’s affordable I will buy these two versions too… thank you for your efforts …)
I know the webpage kellerbook, which has the lists of the different Psalm schemas. Also, there's a great booklet about singing the Dominican little office from the internet archive. I'll have to do a video on that too.
@@VeronicaBrandt yes ..you have shared it to me…(there are no psalm changes during the week …and the compline psalms are different when compared to the Roman one) I sing the little office now without any difficulty with your udemy videos …thank you for your efforts!!
The Blue Baronius Press book is temporarily out of stock at baronius.com. I don't have any inside information on when they'll be reprinted, but you could contact them. In the meantime, there are PDFs at littleoffice.brandt.id.au
They do include the Pater Noster, Ave Maria and Gloria Patri in Latin and English, so I guess you could count that as the majority of the prayers of the Rosary.
Question, since the psalms for terce, sext, and none are usually the same in both the Roman Breviary and Little BVM Office on most days, do orders or laypersons who recite both only do one for those hours, or do they combine both like they would for the larger hours? If so, that’s pretty dedicated. Hope that question makes sense. It’s nice always learning from your videos.
I don't think I know any laypeople who say both. It's a good question. I think the Carthusians say both. Looking at my diurnale, it looks like the psalms for terce, sext and none are usually different. I did read somewhere that for those obliged to say both, it sufficed to sing the Marian antiphon after each of the Roman hours, but I can't remember where I read that.
@@VeronicaBrandt Thank you. I guess I’m curious what the purpose is for having the Divine Office and then another Office of the BVM. We’re they meant to be said together, is one for the clergy and another for laity or certain orders, was one for private devotion and another for group, do they both fulfill the same purpose when recited?
@@CaliCarpetbagger The origins of the Little Office are a bit obscure, but looks like the Divine Office developed first, for all clergy and religious to say, then more intense monasteries also enjoined the Little Office. Some places just added it in on Saturdays. There were three Little Offices popular, one for All Saints, one for Holy Souls (or Office of the Dead) and the Office of Our Lady. It would be hard to say the Divine Office plus all 3 Little Offices, so orders chose between them. The Office of All Saints shrank down to the commemorations we see in old copies of the Little Office of Our Lady. I should just find the source of the little chapter on the history that I'm going from here and read it out in a new video! Basically, in medieval times when orders could be peaceful and dedicate heaps of time to prayer, they could pray heaps and new offices sprang up. Then it got busy and the orders pared things back and the laity learned to read and picked up the Little Office as more accessible than the full Divine Office.
@@VeronicaBrandt thank you. That would be a great video. So if one prays the little offices are they also participating in the divine office the clergy and religious say daily, or do they serve an entirely different purpose? I really appreciate your responses. It’s been a topic of interest the past couple of years.
@@CaliCarpetbagger I'm a bit out of my depth here, but as I understand it, as it's a liturgical prayer it joins in the prayer of the Church in a more special way than just private prayer. You could pray any prayer for clergy and religious, but I think praying the Little Office has a special place in making up for any lack.
Qué hermosos libros. Es una verdadera lástima que sea tan difícil encontrarlos en español. Estoy muy convencido de que editarlos es el primer paso para la restauración de la cultura cristiana. Saludos, desde Argentina. AMDG
Gracias. It would be great to have more books in different languages. I did a Roman Compline booklet in Latin and Portuguese - gitlab.com/veromary/portuguese/-/raw/master/compline.pdf It should be possible to do the same with the Little Office and divinumofficium.com's Espanol translation.
Here is the one I have www.lulu.com/shop/-catholic-church-and-david-siefker/the-day-hours-of-the-1962-roman-breviary-breviarium-romanum-diurnale/paperback/product-145jmp5v.html?page=1&pageSize=4
All of them :) The Baronius and Angelus Press ones are based on the way things stood at the opening of Vatican 2. The others are from before that. This would be a good spot for a timeline - I'll see what I can come up with for the next video.
Hi! I want your reprint but am in Canada and only have Paypal. Can I contact you and get a PayPal account to transfer you the money? I can't find another way to contact you on your site.
If you choose the direct debit option then I can manually put through the order. My paypal address is veronica@brandt.id.au - I'd better get a contact page on shop.jubilus going!
This is such a great video, thank you for such a comprehensive comparison of the books available on the market. If anyone is interested, the reason why pre-1914 books have Psalms 148, 149 and 150 as the last psalm of Lauds under one antiphon is that this was the ancient custom in the Western office for these Psalms to be said every day at Lauds (indeed, its still the practice in the traditional Benedictine office). This was however changed in the Roman Breviary in 1914 by Pope St Pius X in his apostolic constitution "Divinu Afflatu". Divinu Afflatu rearranged the distribution of the Psalms to largely strip out repetition of Psalms (other than the invitatory psalm and Psalm 50 during penitential seasons) and thereby reduce the length of the time it took to say the Roman office for clergy. Psalm 148 was now said alone as the last Psalm at Lauds on Sunday and it seems this new distribution was reflected in the Little Office.
One of these days I'll go through the old books and take notes on which books included what.
Thanks so much Veronica, your explanations and visual examples are so helpful - just starting out learning chant and using the 1962 Little Office. Please keep posting even the most basic information, it really helps a new convert to Tradition. 💓
I can do basic. I'll keep that in mind.
I have two Little Office of Our Lady. One is a Maroon hardback by A Master Of Novices Carmel Books 1997 in Latin and English. It also has prayers to Saint Joseph for Lauds and Vespers. It’s got the Nihil Obstat and Impiratur. I use this on on a regular basis. The other one I’ve got is the Angelus press which I also like very much and it c has Office of the Dead. This one is easy to slip into my zipped cover containing my bigger prayer book called Carmelite Devotions. Being a Carmelite tertiary these prayer books are invaluable to me.
Sounds lovely. Your daily tools for the work of God.
Thank you for putting this together. It was very helpful. I thought the Baronius Press did use the Rheims English. What translation does it use?
I'm not sure. On page xvi, it states that the English translation follows the Douay Rhiems Bible for all psalms and scriptural texts. Unless it's because that usually means the Challoner edition, and they're using a different variation in the Douay Rhiems.
Whilst you were explaining the different versions, you came to one and said 'this is my one'. I loved the fact that its from 1800's but I dont understand which one it actually is. (sorry I'm a beginner). I am reciting Karl Kellers which i find straight forward and simple but am curious about others and in particular now the one you mentioned was yours. Thank you.
The one I called "my one" is from a scan from the Internet Archive from an Irish book from 1832. I had it printed through Lulu.com and it's available - the link should be in the description.
Thank you for making this video. I lost my previous baronius press Little Office and am wondering what new edition should I get.
After watching your video I have decided on the 1832 edition.
More psalms and more typos. It's one I often use as it's small.
@@VeronicaBrandt I also like how it is an exact reprint of an original.
Great video! The Marian Friars Minor just published their own version of the Little Office under Roman Seraphic Books. Pax et bonum! 😊
That is exciting news! I'll keep an eye out for the book.
Thanks for putting the time and effort into helping us pray the Little Office!
As you've nicely explained, each of the books mentioned have advantages and drawbacks. All seem to require a considerable amount of individual study and research to pray properly.
Which of the copies covered would you suggest for someone praying this great devotion, say, for the fulfillment of their Sabbatine Privilege associated with the Brown Scapular? Would there be one that would be better for someone praying as an individual vs someone praying in a lay-community?
They're all good for personal reading. For praying in a group, would you be singing in Latin? Or just reading out the English?
@@VeronicaBrandt The group I'm with is still learning the Latin, so we'd likely begin praying it in English and work towards singing it in Latin.
I do like the Angelus Press one for readability. For learning to sing the Latin, you could print bits from the pdfs of the hours at littleoffice.brandt.id.au and introduce one part at a time, probably leaving the psalms last. I wonder if the Little Office of the Immaculate Conception could provide a sort of Mini Little Office for Beginners - no psalms, mostly just the hymn plus some prayers. Sounds like a recipe for another video!
Never heard of that one, but I agree. The shorter version are great for beginners to get used to the prayer schedule of the Little Office covered in the video. There's also The Little Office of the Holy Ghost (mothersforpriestsdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2020/05/jumbo-little-office-of-the-holy-ghost-2.pdf) that might be neat to compare in a potential future video.
Hello! Could you explain what are the differences in rubrics and also in content between the editions of Little Office by Benziger Brothers and Angelus Press? I know that both were updated according to the 1961 rubrics. If you can't explain, I would be satisfied with the indication of some source to consult.
The Benziger Brothers book was updated to 1915. You might be referring to the Baronius Press one, which is updated to the 1961 rubrics. The Baronius Press has an extra word in the collect for Prime which doesn't appear in the Angelus Press book, but apart from that I'm not aware of any differences. Would you like a detailed check of the two books?
@@VeronicaBrandt I had said that both editions were in line with the 1961 rubrics. Sorry, I was wrong. I don't remember why I wrote this. Here in Brazil, the editions of Little Office in Portuguese do not have many explanations about the headings. I got to know the Benziger Brothers edition and saw that it had more explanations, but I know they are out of date. So I would like to know what has changed in the 1961 Little Office rubrics in relation to the Divino Afflatu rubrics (which are the rubrics in the Benziger Brothers edition).
@@kawanardoqueiroz Ah, that makes more sense now!
I was wondering about finding copies of the Little Office in other languages.
The Rubrics section in the front of the book is still much the same. The 1961 books don't mention any Ave Maria before each hour. The Kyrie Eleison, Christe Eleison, Kyrie Eleison towards the end of each hour is also left out. The Commemoration of Saints at the end of Lauds and Vespers is deleted too.
I have the St Bonaventure book, the one with red cover. It's as clear as mud, I regret getting it. There is no table of contents and I have no idea which day is which.
I wrote in the margins of my Bonaventure press book so I could tell which hour was which - sort of making tabs. I'll have to show you.
Here you go: ua-cam.com/video/BtIjR58Qpp8/v-deo.html
What about your new book on the little office?? It’s missing here …please do make a video on it too when you have time …thank you!!
I have another book now too. Yes I hope to make another video soon.
I have the Angelus Press version. I can get Baronius for £20 at my church, is it worth getting?
It depends what you want. The Baronius Press book has some chant in the back, but you could print the chant you're interested in from my webpage, littleoffice.brandt.id.au.
Hi, is the Bonaventure Press version laid out like the Baronius Press with three Offices? Office 1 beginning with Matins on Febuary 3rd.
Office 2 beginning with First Vespers on the Saturday before the First Sunday of Advent. and
Office 3 beginning with First Vespers on Christmas Eve. Thank you.
The Baronius Press one is the only one I have which has separate sections for Office 1, Office 2 and Office 3. The others list each antiphon with the rubrics: "From Candlemas until Advent", "During Advent" and "From Christmas until Candlemas" - there isn't really enough room for them to be more specific in the hours section.
Today I can't find the Bonaventure Press one - we tidied up the house yesterday for our homeschool registration appointment and there are lots of things we can't find. I'm going from a similar reprint which says:
"(I) The ordinary form of the Office begins at Matins the day after the Purification.
(II) The Advent Office begins with the Vespers of the Saturday before the first Sunday of Advent.
(III) The Christmas Office begins with the first Vespers of Christmas and continues until after Compline of the Purification."
This is yet another book which I obtained after I made the video - so now I'll need to do another video :)
The Angelus Press one gives the same, except the way it's worded is a bit ambiguous on the first Vespers of Christmas, but that's splitting hairs :)
I'll write another reply once the red book turns up.
@@VeronicaBrandt Thank you!
@@lisafurlong1712 I've found the Bonaventure Press book this morning and I cannot find the details of exactly when the changeovers happen. As it's an extract from a larger book, maybe these are assumed knowledge. It just gives the headings "from Candlemas to Advent", "during Advent", "from Christmas to Candlemas".
@@VeronicaBrandt so the Bonaventure Press version would be the most straight forward, simple to use, less flipping back and forth version?
@@lisafurlong1712 it's only the Baronius Press version which has the flipping back and forth for the little hours in Advent and Christmas. Bonaventure and Angelus both include all the Antiphons inline, so you just need to know which Antiphons to skip. There's a trade off between flipping and skipping.
And also could you do in your kindness do a review on psalms of the little office by Karl Keller( just to know the which version it is)….I have only the Dominican office …am a bit hesitant to buy the others due to changes…I really want to buy the fr lasance little office…but shipping costs to india is high..just now saw your reviews on little office
I am planning to buy your 1832 Irish version and your recant 1910 version release(this one was the first little office I prayed before buying the Dominican little office..I love the Dominican too…it is easy to pray than 1910 and has beautiful explanation on psalm a pearl!! but since It’s affordable I will buy these two versions too… thank you for your efforts …)
I know the webpage kellerbook, which has the lists of the different Psalm schemas.
Also, there's a great booklet about singing the Dominican little office from the internet archive. I'll have to do a video on that too.
@@VeronicaBrandt yes ..you have shared it to me…(there are no psalm changes during the week …and the compline psalms are different when compared to the Roman one)
I sing the little office now without any difficulty with your udemy videos …thank you for your efforts!!
Where can I get the book with the Gregorian chants included?
The Blue Baronius Press book is temporarily out of stock at baronius.com. I don't have any inside information on when they'll be reprinted, but you could contact them.
In the meantime, there are PDFs at littleoffice.brandt.id.au
Do they have the rosary I bought it thinking it also has the rosary
No, I haven't seen any parts about the Rosary inside any of the books. The Baronius Press one has the Angelus and the Litany.
They do include the Pater Noster, Ave Maria and Gloria Patri in Latin and English, so I guess you could count that as the majority of the prayers of the Rosary.
Question, since the psalms for terce, sext, and none are usually the same in both the Roman Breviary and Little BVM Office on most days, do orders or laypersons who recite both only do one for those hours, or do they combine both like they would for the larger hours? If so, that’s pretty dedicated. Hope that question makes sense. It’s nice always learning from your videos.
I don't think I know any laypeople who say both. It's a good question. I think the Carthusians say both. Looking at my diurnale, it looks like the psalms for terce, sext and none are usually different.
I did read somewhere that for those obliged to say both, it sufficed to sing the Marian antiphon after each of the Roman hours, but I can't remember where I read that.
@@VeronicaBrandt Thank you. I guess I’m curious what the purpose is for having the Divine Office and then another Office of the BVM. We’re they meant to be said together, is one for the clergy and another for laity or certain orders, was one for private devotion and another for group, do they both fulfill the same purpose when recited?
@@CaliCarpetbagger The origins of the Little Office are a bit obscure, but looks like the Divine Office developed first, for all clergy and religious to say, then more intense monasteries also enjoined the Little Office. Some places just added it in on Saturdays. There were three Little Offices popular, one for All Saints, one for Holy Souls (or Office of the Dead) and the Office of Our Lady. It would be hard to say the Divine Office plus all 3 Little Offices, so orders chose between them. The Office of All Saints shrank down to the commemorations we see in old copies of the Little Office of Our Lady.
I should just find the source of the little chapter on the history that I'm going from here and read it out in a new video!
Basically, in medieval times when orders could be peaceful and dedicate heaps of time to prayer, they could pray heaps and new offices sprang up. Then it got busy and the orders pared things back and the laity learned to read and picked up the Little Office as more accessible than the full Divine Office.
@@VeronicaBrandt thank you. That would be a great video. So if one prays the little offices are they also participating in the divine office the clergy and religious say daily, or do they serve an entirely different purpose? I really appreciate your responses. It’s been a topic of interest the past couple of years.
@@CaliCarpetbagger I'm a bit out of my depth here, but as I understand it, as it's a liturgical prayer it joins in the prayer of the Church in a more special way than just private prayer. You could pray any prayer for clergy and religious, but I think praying the Little Office has a special place in making up for any lack.
Qué hermosos libros. Es una verdadera lástima que sea tan difícil encontrarlos en español. Estoy muy convencido de que editarlos es el primer paso para la restauración de la cultura cristiana. Saludos, desde Argentina. AMDG
Gracias. It would be great to have more books in different languages. I did a Roman Compline booklet in Latin and Portuguese - gitlab.com/veromary/portuguese/-/raw/master/compline.pdf
It should be possible to do the same with the Little Office and divinumofficium.com's Espanol translation.
Where to buy the 5books?
Here's a new article just for you.
open.substack.com/pub/littleoffice/p/buy-the-little-office-of-our-lady
There's a link in the description to the article I wrote at the time. There are usually links in the description.
Where to buy the breviarum romanum diurnale?
Here is the one I have www.lulu.com/shop/-catholic-church-and-david-siefker/the-day-hours-of-the-1962-roman-breviary-breviarium-romanum-diurnale/paperback/product-145jmp5v.html?page=1&pageSize=4
How much?
You might need to ask your local bookshop how much. My shop is shop.jubil.us if that helps.
God bless you!
Thanks! God bless you too
YAAAAY
Thank you for the video. What copies are pre-Vatican 2?
All of them :)
The Baronius and Angelus Press ones are based on the way things stood at the opening of Vatican 2. The others are from before that. This would be a good spot for a timeline - I'll see what I can come up with for the next video.
Hi! I want your reprint but am in Canada and only have Paypal. Can I contact you and get a PayPal account to transfer you the money? I can't find another way to contact you on your site.
If you choose the direct debit option then I can manually put through the order. My paypal address is veronica@brandt.id.au - I'd better get a contact page on shop.jubilus going!
@@VeronicaBrandt Right on. How much to Canada? Can I contact you from the debit order?
@@clarekuehn4372 the reprints are print on demand with a company which has printers all over the place, so I'd guess that $5 should cover the postage.
Also, if you order through Lulu.com, they have a 20% off coupon at the moment till 4th November SNEAKPEEK20 www.lulu.com/spotlight/brandt/