I had the earlier HILLMAN Avenger, on an 'L' reg (1973). The last model fitted with a 1500 cc engine. It was a 3 speed Auto, and it NEVER let me down(until the "tin worm" took hold). IMHO a very underrated car. Mine was the basic "no frills" model, but for reliable cheap motoring it was brilliant !
Yes, the Avengers are very good cars, probably better than the Marina, Escort or Viva. The gearbox being sprung around first and second as opposed to the more usual third and fourth took a bit of getting used to, but very nice to drive nevertheless. Thank you ever so much indeed for watching and commenting!
Very interesting video sir, ( just found you) as I had a 1250 cc Avenger, a 1971 model that I bought in 1973 on old fashioned 'HP' when my dear old Sunbeam Rapier bit the dust.As someone has commented, it was a very underated car with a delightful gearbox and was so easy to drive. The only embarrassment I had was when the membrane on the Stromberg carburettor ( I think) developed a split causing rapid loss of power one morning whilst driving to work in Redhill,Surrey with the resultant tailback of traffic behind me until I went down hill! Ah, the pleasures of motoring. I later had a 1978 Chrysler Alpine which I loved, with the most comfortable seats ever - why don't they make soft seats any more?? I will continue to watch.
Thank you very much indeed for watching, Barrie! If you look in the video description, you will find links to a lot of other reviews of cars of this era, and then we also have a Sensible Secondhand Reviews/Classics playlist on the channel too. Having driven a Marina and a Viva the same day, I have to say that this was a lot better than both, although this was the highest specification model of the three. I still managed to mess up the gearchange, but overall it was very good. I would also like to try an Alpine.
Great vid, parents had few Avengers, 2 remember most are L reg 1.5gls had from about 73 to 77 great tow car. Dad got one as company car in about 80/81 was 1.6 estate in maroon very roomy car, had a chrysler badge but think had changed name to talbot by then. Really are rare cars now that one looks brilliant.
Yes, the very late cars (August 1979 onwards) had Talbot badges but the Chrysler logo. This one is in lovely condition. It seems a lot of people are very nostalgic for these. Thank you for watching!
Glad you enjoyed it, sir! I just wish I hadn't had so much trouble with the gearbox, which should theoretically have been a lot better than most of the cars I drove that day.
Loved the review, loved driving the Avenger in the summer Does appear to be a bit of an issue finding this video (and the viva one) the only way I came across it was in links from the marina video
Always good to see an Avenger, though I much prefer the styling of the Hillman version. The oversized (slightly goofy) headlights and the downright awful changes to the rear light clusters don't do the Chrysler/Talbot version any favours. An enjoyable video, sir!
The rear lights look fine on their own, but if you then discover those terrible metal caps on the rear wings, it really lets the side down quite considerably...
I was never keen on this cars front end. Kind of reminds me of the Morris Ital with the blobby indicators. I always prefer the Hillman Avenger. Nice colour though Joseph.
There was a trend from the mid 1970s to 1980s to fit bigger lights to cars. This is certainly evident with this Avenger and Marina/Ital. Probably a safety issue as I doubt that the head and tail lights on the original Avenger were up to the job in poor weather conditions and in the dark. A shame that it lost those 'hockey stick' tail lights though.
Yes, general design trends in the mid to late 1970s led this facelifted Avenger and the Morris Ital looking the way that they did. They are both a bit of an acquired taste from that point of view, but I quite like them, and as Matt says, these larger headlamps are safer, but the rear end is probably a bit of an embarrassment if you know what the Hillman looked like.
Very good, happy memories my late father had the original a 1275 dl I think a 1972 model; seemed a little underpowered a heavy car. but a lovely car to drive I used to drive when i passed my test back in 1981.
Yes, the 1250/1300 models probably did seem a bit underpowered, although this 1600 was absolutely great. They are nice to drive if you don't mess up the gearchanges as I (predictably) did. Thank you for watching, sir!
Yes, although many people prefer the look of the original Hillman Avenger, I think that the front at least was a very successful facelift considering the time and budget. The metal caps on the rear wings, though...
Avengers are brilliant - so so underated and are great drivers cars. We had a number of them in our family back in period - and I owned a 1600 automatic early Chrysler facelift example back in the mid 90s. Far nicer cars to drive in standard form than any Escort. The rear wing pressings bizarrely were completely new - and the fuel filler was relocated from the rear panel to the offside rear. Those rear wing blank off sections were purely due to the cost and complication of pressing that shape out in one piece - there is also a very slight difference in the bootlid lower edge shape to the earlier cars. The Brazilian versions of the car had an 1800cc variant of the engine - and were available through Chrysler competitions in the UK as a performance upgrade for road race and rally - and in tuned form could outperform 2.0 pinto' powered Escorts. Such a shame that the Rootes linage has been lost through successive company ownerships - the Avenger deserves much more positive recognition.
Yes, this drove really nicely, although I kept messing up the gearchanges for some reason. The rear wing situation is absolutely bizarre, it looks awful! Funny how the Brazilian engine was actually available over here, this 1.6 was fast enough, though, maybe I should have tried the automatic so I couldn't mess the gearchanges up. Thank you for watching, sir!
This Avenger is the same shade of blue as my parents' old 1980 Talbot Horizon 1.3 LS (owned between 1986 and 1990). That also had the Chrysler Pentastar badge on the bonnet.
Yes, the early Talbot Horizons still had the Pentastar on the grille, the later ones had a proper Talbot badge. Would love to try a Horizon, Sunbeam, Samba, Alpine and Solara.
I worked on the earlier Avengers and they were all good cars with strong engines. I seem to remember a power increase on the earlier models engines when Chrysler fitted a twin downpipe on them. There were changes on the Tiger engines too, the later ones (twin headlights models) had a quieter induction sound. This particular model has a similar dash and steering wheel to the Alpine which I guess was influenced by Simca. The column switches and door window winders look like they have been carried over from the Simca models.
Thank you, sir! That explains why I found two different power outputs for the Tiger during my research. Yes, probably a lot of Simca parts in this facelifted model from the Alpine. The engine seemed to pull very well indeed.
Hey …. no the high load bay that gets slated on cars was ideal to trap carrier bag handles on the weekly shop to stop the random roll occurring all the way home… 😉
@@TomAlter1000 , just done a quick search, and I don't think there are contemporary UK based reviews of a Sunbeam (at least a standard one rather than a Lotus version) out there at all. I would love to test one, though.
Thanks for this video! My Uncle had an earlier one (Not sure what type - I was only four but it had quad headlights.). Avengers were actually very popular in New Zealand. I like the styling of the last ones - the grill made them look very French, not unlike a Renault or a Simca 180 - the latter actually being the next step up from the Avenger in the French Chrysler lineup, hence similar styling. Would you like to test a Talbot Sunbeam Lotus or an Avenger Tiger/BRM one of these days? Fun fact: Andrew Cowan won the 1976 New Zealand Rally in a two-door Avenger.
Trying to get hold of any type of Sunbeam is really hard. I cannot even remember seeing a normal one (as opposed to a Sunbeam Lotus) at any show recently. The Lotus versions are actually quite well preserved on the whole, but the standard ones had no classic status for years, hence their rarity these days.
A very Sporty looking Hillman compared to the Hunter in 1970. The interior looked great and the dash had sunken dials that looked very Italian. The hockey stick Taillamps are missing on the 1976 facelift but it did bring the design up to date quite well. I can't remember the caps on the rear wintips looking so terrible. The new dash was a transformation. The little spindly stalks were just a trademark of Chrysler UK. The interior upgrade looked better than the Mk2 Escort and the HC Viva. Also I did prefer to Viva dash to the Escort in the 1970s. A vinyl roof is always very acceptable.
Yes, the dashboard is rather good, actually. The original Avenger, in retrospect, was maybe not ground-breaking, but was very well engineered by normal car standards when it was released in 1970. The Hunter is also a car I would like to try for myself. Thank you again, sir!
Strange that some people ignore the Avenger but focus on the Escort for classic rallying. It seems just as nimble and tunable as an Escort, let alone an old Datsun.
Very nice car. Never seen one in my life, but a guy from our street had sth similar almost 30 years ago...he said it was a "sunbeam", that's all I know and I do believe it had those "hockey stick" lights at the back. I'm from Slovenia and have to mention that I own two rovers r8 which are extremely rare here. There were a few horizons, solaras an sambas here though...but i believe badged as Simca and Talbot later on...huge confusion arround these cars anyway 😀 Please do that red maestro seen in the clip? Is it a MG?
Yes, they were sold as a Sunbeam in some parts of the world (the maker's name), but there was also a whole different model known as the Chrysler or Talbot Sunbeam from around 1976 to 1981, which was essentially a three door hatchback Avenger with updated styling. If it had the hockey stick lights, it would have been the earlier Sunbeam with no Chrysler badge. The Horizon and Solara were sold with Simca, Chrysler and Talbot badges, the Samba was just sold as a Talbot. Thank you for watching from Slovenia!
It was supposed to rival the Cortina when it was designed, but that grew in size with the Mark III of 1970, and so it really rivalled the Escort and the Marina from 1971 onwards.
I had the earlier HILLMAN Avenger, on an 'L' reg (1973). The last model fitted with a 1500 cc engine. It was a 3 speed Auto, and it NEVER let me down(until the "tin worm" took hold). IMHO a very underrated car. Mine was the basic "no frills" model, but for reliable cheap motoring it was brilliant !
Yes, the Avengers are very good cars, probably better than the Marina, Escort or Viva. The gearbox being sprung around first and second as opposed to the more usual third and fourth took a bit of getting used to, but very nice to drive nevertheless. Thank you ever so much indeed for watching and commenting!
Very interesting video sir, ( just found you) as I had a 1250 cc Avenger, a 1971 model that I bought in 1973 on old fashioned 'HP' when my dear old Sunbeam Rapier bit the dust.As someone has commented, it was a very underated car with a delightful gearbox and was so easy to drive. The only embarrassment I had was when the membrane on the Stromberg carburettor ( I think) developed a split causing rapid loss of power one morning whilst driving to work in Redhill,Surrey with the resultant tailback of traffic behind me until I went down hill! Ah, the pleasures of motoring. I later had a 1978 Chrysler Alpine which I loved, with the most comfortable seats ever - why don't they make soft seats any more?? I will continue to watch.
Thank you very much indeed for watching, Barrie! If you look in the video description, you will find links to a lot of other reviews of cars of this era, and then we also have a Sensible Secondhand Reviews/Classics playlist on the channel too. Having driven a Marina and a Viva the same day, I have to say that this was a lot better than both, although this was the highest specification model of the three. I still managed to mess up the gearchange, but overall it was very good. I would also like to try an Alpine.
Great vid, parents had few Avengers, 2 remember most are L reg 1.5gls had from about 73 to 77 great tow car. Dad got one as company car in about 80/81 was 1.6 estate in maroon very roomy car, had a chrysler badge but think had changed name to talbot by then. Really are rare cars now that one looks brilliant.
Yes, the very late cars (August 1979 onwards) had Talbot badges but the Chrysler logo. This one is in lovely condition. It seems a lot of people are very nostalgic for these. Thank you for watching!
Good Morning Sir, Joy, Oh Joy, Oh Joy. My favorite classic of them all. Thanks for the memories👌
Glad you enjoyed it, sir! I just wish I hadn't had so much trouble with the gearbox, which should theoretically have been a lot better than most of the cars I drove that day.
Had two of these second was a 79 gls loved that car wish i still had it
These are brilliant cars. Shame that there are so few left! Would have been even better if I hadn't kept messing up the gearchanges...
Loved the review, loved driving the Avenger in the summer
Does appear to be a bit of an issue finding this video (and the viva one) the only way I came across it was in links from the marina video
That's because it hasn't been released on the channel yet.
@@lloydvehicleconsulting I see
Always good to see an Avenger, though I much prefer the styling of the Hillman version. The oversized (slightly goofy) headlights and the downright awful changes to the rear light clusters don't do the Chrysler/Talbot version any favours. An enjoyable video, sir!
The rear lights look fine on their own, but if you then discover those terrible metal caps on the rear wings, it really lets the side down quite considerably...
I was never keen on this cars front end. Kind of reminds me of the Morris Ital with the blobby indicators. I always prefer the Hillman Avenger. Nice colour though Joseph.
There was a trend from the mid 1970s to 1980s to fit bigger lights to cars. This is certainly evident with this Avenger and Marina/Ital. Probably a safety issue as I doubt that the head and tail lights on the original Avenger were up to the job in poor weather conditions and in the dark. A shame that it lost those 'hockey stick' tail lights though.
Yes, general design trends in the mid to late 1970s led this facelifted Avenger and the Morris Ital looking the way that they did. They are both a bit of an acquired taste from that point of view, but I quite like them, and as Matt says, these larger headlamps are safer, but the rear end is probably a bit of an embarrassment if you know what the Hillman looked like.
Very good, happy memories my late father had the original a 1275 dl I think a 1972 model; seemed a little underpowered a heavy car. but a lovely car to drive I used to drive when i passed my test back in 1981.
Yes, the 1250/1300 models probably did seem a bit underpowered, although this 1600 was absolutely great. They are nice to drive if you don't mess up the gearchanges as I (predictably) did. Thank you for watching, sir!
Excellent MR Lloyd, I like how it looks more modern and has a much nicer interior, than the newer Morris Ital, and a rev counter.
Yes, although many people prefer the look of the original Hillman Avenger, I think that the front at least was a very successful facelift considering the time and budget. The metal caps on the rear wings, though...
Thank you Sir! You can't beat a good bit of Rootes Group content!
Sir, we very much enjoyed this lovely Chrysler Avenger!
Excellent review Sir, glad you enjoyed driving this lovely looking Avenger.
I did, sir, although I did have some difficulties with gear changing (as usual).
Avengers are brilliant - so so underated and are great drivers cars. We had a number of them in our family back in period - and I owned a 1600 automatic early Chrysler facelift example back in the mid 90s. Far nicer cars to drive in standard form than any Escort. The rear wing pressings bizarrely were completely new - and the fuel filler was relocated from the rear panel to the offside rear. Those rear wing blank off sections were purely due to the cost and complication of pressing that shape out in one piece - there is also a very slight difference in the bootlid lower edge shape to the earlier cars. The Brazilian versions of the car had an 1800cc variant of the engine - and were available through Chrysler competitions in the UK as a performance upgrade for road race and rally - and in tuned form could outperform 2.0 pinto' powered Escorts. Such a shame that the Rootes linage has been lost through successive company ownerships - the Avenger deserves much more positive recognition.
Yes, this drove really nicely, although I kept messing up the gearchanges for some reason. The rear wing situation is absolutely bizarre, it looks awful! Funny how the Brazilian engine was actually available over here, this 1.6 was fast enough, though, maybe I should have tried the automatic so I couldn't mess the gearchanges up. Thank you for watching, sir!
I had one as a taxi in the old days and it was fun to drive but with 4 passenger it was down on the spring hammers
Not the most capacious with four passengers, I wouldn't have thought...
This Avenger is the same shade of blue as my parents' old 1980 Talbot Horizon 1.3 LS (owned between 1986 and 1990). That also had the Chrysler Pentastar badge on the bonnet.
Yes, the early Talbot Horizons still had the Pentastar on the grille, the later ones had a proper Talbot badge. Would love to try a Horizon, Sunbeam, Samba, Alpine and Solara.
I worked on the earlier Avengers and they were all good cars with strong engines. I seem to remember a power increase on the earlier models engines when Chrysler fitted a twin downpipe on them. There were changes on the Tiger engines too, the later ones (twin headlights models) had a quieter induction sound. This particular model has a similar dash and steering wheel to the Alpine which I guess was influenced by Simca. The column switches and door window winders look like they have been carried over from the Simca models.
Thank you, sir! That explains why I found two different power outputs for the Tiger during my research. Yes, probably a lot of Simca parts in this facelifted model from the Alpine. The engine seemed to pull very well indeed.
Hey …. no the high load bay that gets slated on cars was ideal to trap carrier bag handles on the weekly shop to stop the random roll occurring all the way home… 😉
I mean, that's one way of looking at it, I suppose.
Those stalks and the instrument binnacle have a very Gallic look and feel to them.
I think that they may be out of the Alpine, but I am not exactly sure. Thank you for watching!
@@TomAlter1000 , I would absolutely love to review a Chrysler or Talbot Sunbeam!
@@TomAlter1000 , just done a quick search, and I don't think there are contemporary UK based reviews of a Sunbeam (at least a standard one rather than a Lotus version) out there at all. I would love to test one, though.
Thanks for this video! My Uncle had an earlier one (Not sure what type - I was only four but it had quad headlights.). Avengers were actually very popular in New Zealand. I like the styling of the last ones - the grill made them look very French, not unlike a Renault or a Simca 180 - the latter actually being the next step up from the Avenger in the French Chrysler lineup, hence similar styling. Would you like to test a Talbot Sunbeam Lotus or an Avenger Tiger/BRM one of these days? Fun fact: Andrew Cowan won the 1976 New Zealand Rally in a two-door Avenger.
Trying to get hold of any type of Sunbeam is really hard. I cannot even remember seeing a normal one (as opposed to a Sunbeam Lotus) at any show recently. The Lotus versions are actually quite well preserved on the whole, but the standard ones had no classic status for years, hence their rarity these days.
You will break the front door trim with the fire extinguisher in the door pocket
Seems to be OK so far...
I had one of these in gold as lhd.
Such good cars for their time, weren't they?
@@lloydvehicleconsulting a shame as I sold it. 😞
A very Sporty looking Hillman compared to the Hunter in 1970. The interior looked great and the dash had sunken dials that looked very Italian.
The hockey stick Taillamps are missing on the 1976 facelift but it did bring the design up to date quite well. I can't remember the caps on the rear wintips looking so terrible.
The new dash was a transformation. The little spindly stalks were just a trademark of Chrysler UK.
The interior upgrade looked better than the Mk2 Escort and the HC Viva. Also I did prefer to Viva dash to the Escort in the 1970s.
A vinyl roof is always very acceptable.
Yes, the dashboard is rather good, actually. The original Avenger, in retrospect, was maybe not ground-breaking, but was very well engineered by normal car standards when it was released in 1970. The Hunter is also a car I would like to try for myself. Thank you again, sir!
Strange that some people ignore the Avenger but focus on the Escort for classic rallying. It seems just as nimble and tunable as an Escort, let alone an old Datsun.
Yes, very capable on the rally stage, very tunable and definitely got the pedigree too, especially with the Tiger version.
The avenger was a better rally car than the escort,you never saw many avengers going off
Very nice car. Never seen one in my life, but a guy from our street had sth similar almost 30 years ago...he said it was a "sunbeam", that's all I know and I do believe it had those "hockey stick" lights at the back. I'm from Slovenia and have to mention that I own two rovers r8 which are extremely rare here. There were a few horizons, solaras an sambas here though...but i believe badged as Simca and Talbot later on...huge confusion arround these cars anyway 😀
Please do that red maestro seen in the clip? Is it a MG?
Yes, they were sold as a Sunbeam in some parts of the world (the maker's name), but there was also a whole different model known as the Chrysler or Talbot Sunbeam from around 1976 to 1981, which was essentially a three door hatchback Avenger with updated styling. If it had the hockey stick lights, it would have been the earlier Sunbeam with no Chrysler badge.
The Horizon and Solara were sold with Simca, Chrysler and Talbot badges, the Samba was just sold as a Talbot. Thank you for watching from Slovenia!
Play 'My Sharona!' 😀
No sir, I am afraid that isn't going to happen....
Another fine review Sir.
Size-wise, would you consider the Avenger a rival to the Escort rather than the Cortina?
It was supposed to rival the Cortina when it was designed, but that grew in size with the Mark III of 1970, and so it really rivalled the Escort and the Marina from 1971 onwards.
But why did Chrysler remove those fabulous “boomerang” rear light clusters 😮
We don't really know, it may have been cost-cutting from Chrysler.
@@lloydvehicleconsulting that’s a bit like a council thing… spend money on an established setup to cost cut 🤣
@@patrickh7368 , I suppose so!
4th
Very good, sir!
They ruined the avenger looks when chrysler up dated it
I suppose it depends what you prefer...
Why you dont show the car, instead watching you driving? We want car, not you!
Why don't you just watch the whole video? We want intelligent comments, not stupid ones!
@@lloydvehicleconsultingIgnore that curmudgeon.