We used this method a lot in my old unit, and one day at IIT a recon guy gave his opinion on how a one man should choose direction and it stuck with me; became how I taught and approached the concept from then on. Granted we would typically be stacked on one side of a doorway. Paraphrasing; You're the one man, you're the first dude to put eyes in the room. You've been gathering data since the doorway was open; you take the unknown. To the two man all of it is unknown. You've cleared as much as you can from that starting direction all the way to center, take the rest. That way you give the two man the best chance you can. Granted that's a specific answer to a specific problem, but I liked it. Good or bad it seemed to give guys an easy reference, and a moral compass to the training.
@@oriontraininggroupllc2782 could you elaborate on managing forward momentum for (i suppose) this method and "catch it, clean it"? or do you already have a video covering it?
I’m glad you brought this technique up. I’ve always taught my squad the snapshot method rather than pie’ing or flowing in a room. I have my guys be deliberate but also violent with control. Gives the one man a quick image of what is inside the room and if he has to engage he will follow through with his shot
I love these videos! Really great information and training considerations. I never really thought about center checks breaking up the flow of the team momentum before.
If everyone’s on the same page I think this solves some over-penetration/over-exposure issues clearing fast pace. If there’s time to pie out I think it’s still safer but also slower. Some trade off everyone has to be on board with. I like it gents 🤙🏼
Love the content you guys are producing. You guys are gonna take off quick. I have a video request! Single man CQB/Room clearing. Specifically a center fed room. This scenario has always befuddled me and it seems i can never get a straight answer to a half decent solution.
There’s no good answer. We aren’t going to do solo right now because it’s such a cluster f*ck. We teach it, but it’s too nuanced to do a video on UA-cam for now. Maybe one day.
@@oriontraininggroupllc2782 100% agree with you, especially if entry is being made without any flash or similar. I’d definitely be cool to see some different options and ideas to get the gears if the mind turning in a prop direction.
Single man is a desperation move that's borderline suicide. It's going to be your typical home defense situation, which is something I've advocated for years should be fort up, hold a strong point with your loved ones behind you... and call the cops. Let someone else do the dying if you have a choice.
u should reevaluate the footwear u use in cqb. using something light and flexible to feel the micro terrain while moving in the dark.wearing shoe boots as we use to call them are awesome for outside in the fields but they arent very good inside or very quiet especially if u pick up a rock or other object in the tread,now the noise gave u away. just my 2 cents. awesome video
Gurwitch introduced me to the idea, hearing it talked about hear I can see why it might mess with the flow though. I still think it makes sense though.
If the number one get stuck with a threat near the threshold, he will push into the room just deep enough for the number two and three come in and dig the corners. There are pros and cons to everything. Just like the saying goes. "There is always a never and never and always". The cons you brought up are valid but can be overcome with correct training.
Good info. I wanted to know the manufacture of the laser system/training aid yinz are using. I am a novice shooter at best. My expertise is in Medical (20 years in EMS - various systems, mainly a hood medic). Any who, I am looking for a tool to ease the burden of cost in going to the range. Something that will let me get reps in without breaking the budget on fuel and ammo. Finally, over the years I have trained with some pretty knowledgeable instructors. I have had the privilege to teach some "street" medicine whilst learning a little bit from some top tier personnel. That being said, I still feel like a baby in the world of weaponcraft as it pertains to shooting. I have found that the styles of CQB and gunfighting are similar, but unique depending on the instructors background and what their mission set was/is. The knowledge is ever evolving and changes as more information is gathered from real world experiences. Much like medicine, Weaponscraft is becoming, and is an evidence base practicum. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, I appreciate your time and effort to put this together.
When doing the center check, to mitigate getting sucked in could you stack dudes in the center and each engage said threat as they enter before hitting their corner?
@@Chingon6969 if you have ever worked at night you'll realize that suppressor shadow is a thing. but hey, if you don't want to address it, it's cool. to each his own. it's a simple fix - extend the light a bit. but digging in heels because you think i'm insulting these dudes is silly. i'm not. i dont' know them. have never worked with or heard of them in the community.
@@dad2022 Oh no doubt suppressor shadow is a thing. I'm just saying it's not a problem. I don't know these dudes either but they are putting out great content for free. I disagree with some of the things they do; I don't like pressure pads which is one reason why my lights aren't so far forward. I've done a lot of work at night and prefer to not have a white light "nd", as well as tactile control over my laser device. Cheers bro
@@Chingon6969 Totally agree on pressure pads. I worked for 32 yrs in special operations and that is something we rooted out early on. Ditch the option to burn white light! Mine was a dedicated button for a white light - no chance to accidentally fire it. Tell you a good bunch of dudes to check out is AMERICAN KINETIX - they're on youtube. Bunch of fmr CIA Ground Branch guys and DEVGRU and they have great content and they know their $h1t.
We used this method a lot in my old unit, and one day at IIT a recon guy gave his opinion on how a one man should choose direction and it stuck with me; became how I taught and approached the concept from then on. Granted we would typically be stacked on one side of a doorway. Paraphrasing; You're the one man, you're the first dude to put eyes in the room. You've been gathering data since the doorway was open; you take the unknown. To the two man all of it is unknown. You've cleared as much as you can from that starting direction all the way to center, take the rest. That way you give the two man the best chance you can.
Granted that's a specific answer to a specific problem, but I liked it. Good or bad it seemed to give guys an easy reference, and a moral compass to the training.
We cover that concept as well in class 🤝
@@oriontraininggroupllc2782 could you elaborate on managing forward momentum for (i suppose) this method and "catch it, clean it"? or do you already have a video covering it?
I’m glad you brought this technique up. I’ve always taught my squad the snapshot method rather than pie’ing or flowing in a room. I have my guys be deliberate but also violent with control. Gives the one man a quick image of what is inside the room and if he has to engage he will follow through with his shot
Indeed. Lot of high level units use this rather than panning. With a bang it’s a great solution.
I love these videos! Really great information and training considerations. I never really thought about center checks breaking up the flow of the team momentum before.
You guys are spot on and I love what you guys are teaching. Greetings from Sweden 🇸🇪
If everyone’s on the same page I think this solves some over-penetration/over-exposure issues clearing fast pace. If there’s time to pie out I think it’s still safer but also slower. Some trade off everyone has to be on board with. I like it gents 🤙🏼
Where’s the far side of the door?
Love the content you guys are producing. You guys are gonna take off quick. I have a video request! Single man CQB/Room clearing. Specifically a center fed room. This scenario has always befuddled me and it seems i can never get a straight answer to a half decent solution.
There’s no good answer. We aren’t going to do solo right now because it’s such a cluster f*ck. We teach it, but it’s too nuanced to do a video on UA-cam for now. Maybe one day.
@@oriontraininggroupllc2782 100% agree with you, especially if entry is being made without any flash or similar. I’d definitely be cool to see some different options and ideas to get the gears if the mind turning in a prop direction.
Single man is a desperation move that's borderline suicide.
It's going to be your typical home defense situation, which is something I've advocated for years should be fort up, hold a strong point with your loved ones behind you... and call the cops.
Let someone else do the dying if you have a choice.
u should reevaluate the footwear u use in cqb. using something light and flexible to feel the micro terrain while moving in the dark.wearing shoe boots as we use to call them are awesome for outside in the fields but they arent very good inside or very quiet especially if u pick up a rock or other object in the tread,now the noise gave u away. just my 2 cents. awesome video
What is that laser training system you're using? I assume it's the red mag that's producing that laser whenever you're firing.
Mantis Blackbeard
Gurwitch introduced me to the idea, hearing it talked about hear I can see why it might mess with the flow though. I still think it makes sense though.
If the number one get stuck with a threat near the threshold, he will push into the room just deep enough for the number two and three come in and dig the corners. There are pros and cons to everything. Just like the saying goes. "There is always a never and never and always". The cons you brought up are valid but can be overcome with correct training.
Good info. I wanted to know the manufacture of the laser system/training aid yinz are using. I am a novice shooter at best. My expertise is in Medical (20 years in EMS - various systems, mainly a hood medic). Any who, I am looking for a tool to ease the burden of cost in going to the range. Something that will let me get reps in without breaking the budget on fuel and ammo. Finally, over the years I have trained with some pretty knowledgeable instructors. I have had the privilege to teach some "street" medicine whilst learning a little bit from some top tier personnel. That being said, I still feel like a baby in the world of weaponcraft as it pertains to shooting. I have found that the styles of CQB and gunfighting are similar, but unique depending on the instructors background and what their mission set was/is. The knowledge is ever evolving and changes as more information is gathered from real world experiences. Much like medicine, Weaponscraft is becoming, and is an evidence base practicum. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, I appreciate your time and effort to put this together.
It looks like they're running the mantis blackbeard system. I have one and it's a great investment
When doing the center check, to mitigate getting sucked in could you stack dudes in the center and each engage said threat as they enter before hitting their corner?
Stack dudes in the center? Like in a line in front of the door? Lol
@@oriontraininggroupllc2782 What? You don't want to put everybody in front of the funnel!?
Where did you get that daggar?
What laser training aid is that you have in your rifle?
That looks to be the Mantis blackbeard system. I have one for my rifle and it's a awesome training tool
We've been teaching low compressed for shorter people in teams with taller peeps. That short guy is close to lasing... Just my obs...
at 7 sec...guys...your white light is illuminating your suppressor (and throwing suppressor shadow)...get an cantilevered light mount...
Lol
Solve a problem that doesn’t exist.
@@Chingon6969 if you have ever worked at night you'll realize that suppressor shadow is a thing. but hey, if you don't want to address it, it's cool. to each his own. it's a simple fix - extend the light a bit. but digging in heels because you think i'm insulting these dudes is silly. i'm not. i dont' know them. have never worked with or heard of them in the community.
@@dad2022 Oh no doubt suppressor shadow is a thing. I'm just saying it's not a problem. I don't know these dudes either but they are putting out great content for free. I disagree with some of the things they do; I don't like pressure pads which is one reason why my lights aren't so far forward. I've done a lot of work at night and prefer to not have a white light "nd", as well as tactile control over my laser device. Cheers bro
@@Chingon6969 Totally agree on pressure pads. I worked for 32 yrs in special operations and that is something we rooted out early on. Ditch the option to burn white light! Mine was a dedicated button for a white light - no chance to accidentally fire it. Tell you a good bunch of dudes to check out is AMERICAN KINETIX - they're on youtube. Bunch of fmr CIA Ground Branch guys and DEVGRU and they have great content and they know their $h1t.