I used to work in the QA lab at a food processing facility. We were required to run surface chlorine tests of raw food and ingredient areas (we used Steramine). The test strips we used, before we got digital readers, only measured up to 400ppm. You are able to get a better-ranged reading than ones that test up to 1000ppm or higher. Also, the test strips someone might use for their pool may also not be adequate as they generally only read up to 10ppm. The ones I use are labeled 'restaurant quality' and are not at all expensive. About $8 for 100 strips. Oh, and measure your vinegar before adding to the salt and Pipettes are wonderful to use for adding small amounts or pulling a small amount of product out to test.
Just spent over $100 dollars loading up on tabs then thought there's got to be a diy video. Should have visited UA-cam an hour ago. Thank you so much for the video.
This machine is great. Owned it for a couple years until it broke. Missed its usefulness and stumbled onto a larger unit from Ecoloxtech and they give you the measurements needed to make the mix instead of pods. Thanks for sharing your personal recipe and experience!
I think the biggest difference is the technology the Eco One uses. I believe the FON is a membrane cell unit, which will produce some lye. As I understand it, the Eco doesn't produce the lye as a byproduct. I own a FON unit and I just bought my Eco last night. I'm really looking forward to getting/making larger amounts to clean my carpets.
amy l., so is the lye byrproduct bad? especially if i want to out this HOCL solution in a fogger and cool vaporizer/humidifier?? Can the Eco make different concentrations (ppm) of HOCL?? thanks
Like others have reported, my FON machine was producing about 500 ppm chlorine at pH 5-5.5. my solution to this was to add another 320 ml the the finished HOCL. Then checking the chlorine again it would be close to 250ppm and still around pH 5.5. when I told my Brother(a Surgeon) he told me I was no longer making HOCL because the addition water I used for dilution had not been electrolyzed. So with the help of your video, I now make my HOCL at about 250 ppm chlorine. Thanks. Keep up the good work!
i bought a china made sodium hypochlorite generator it says. The seller said it can produce hypochlorous acid because I do not want sodium hypochlorite bec that is the bleaching harmful type am i right? the generator said it can make a 500ml solution.how can i use it in order to produce hypochlorous acid and not sodium hypochlorite? I hope you can enlighten me without adding vinegar also but only water and salt.
@@donnaalfonso4357 did you find out? The devices seem to be the same but why does one say it produces hypochlirous acud and the other say sodium hypochlorite?
@@saraferre616 probably just the amount of salt. If it's super saturated, meaning too much salt, it'll probably make bleach. Less salt, hypochlorous acid.
@@donnaalfonso4357 the vinegar is what makes one chlorine species predominant in the finished product, so if you want to generate HOCl, you also need to add vinegar. Just salt and water will create hypochlorite.
Thank you for doing the heavy lifting of figuring out the balance of the right ingredients. I just can’t see myself throwing more little plastic pods away. This way makes a lot more sense. Plus the $avings!!
Thanks. I'm looking at these units, but the capsules were a deal breaker for me. The FON website tries make people scared of trying this by acting like one extra drop of vinegar is going to convert this into the strongest bleach of all time! It might be easier to eventually find a measuring spoon that coincides with the formula so you don't have to pull out the scale each time.
Thank you for your excellent video Jen. I’ve just bought a different system to produce electrolytic water and you clear explanation of correct ph. And chlorine ppm will help me made the right mix for my family. Thank you again. Ray, Sandbach, Cheshire ,England.
Madam, As you really do not need to chk the Alkaline (above 7ph), suggest go for another strip showing ph in .5 fractions from 3.5 to 6.0. that way you will reach more accurately to a Ph with in 5.0 and 5.5 range.
Hi! I just tried your process today. My PPM IS 500, and the PH is about 7.6. My water started at 7, and I added vinegar to get to 5.5. I tested some made with a FoN capsule. It was closer to 200 ppm and 6.6 PH. I do have a water softener that user salt pellets. Would you suggest adding less salt next time? Is what I made safe for use? Thank you for the valuable info!
@@qt5160 Yes, same formulation. Have purchased the Test strips by Home Brew Ohio Chlorine Test Papers (100 Strips) and Ph test strips. and concentration of chlorine and ph all is within proper range.
I have a doubt: why is it that the amount of vinegar may vary based on my tap water, but the capsules have a steady formula that is combined with any tap water? If the capsules work for everyone, why wouldn’t the same DIY formula work for everyone? I’m not questioning you, just a question bouncing around in my head. Thanks so much for the video!!
This is a very good observation and one of the reasons we test both the pH and FAC of our finished product. The fact is FON can't offer a standardized vinegar content in their capsules and expect standardized results with the various water sources people use across the country and around the world. Many users, upon using test strips, find their FON capsule-based finished product lands in the 500-800ppm range, which is a far cry from the advertised 200-220ppm range. Fine if used as directed, but less than optimal for textiles, and maybe not ideal for spraying a pacifier before popping back into baby's mouth... nevermind if you ever want to venture into the skincare applications.
Great Video! I recently got interested in HOCL for skin purposes for treating eczema and acne prevention. Can you recommend a range of ppm and a ph that’s best for skin?
Thanks! I'm not sure what ppm is best for skin. The ph should probably be 5.5 ph because that seems to be the highest percentage of HOCl. Are you on Facebook? There is a facebook group that I link to in the description of this video and there have been several discussions about using it on skin. You may be able to find some guidance there.
Most of the retail HOCl products land in the 100-120ppm range, and like Jen said, aiming for 5.5pH will yield the highest percentage of HOCl. It is very soothing to skin, moreso than plain water, in my experience. We keep spray bottles of HOCl in every bathroom, for wound care, spraying our toothbrushes, toilets, and reducing viral load in ears, eyes, and nasal passages after venturing out in public.
This should be started with a PPM under 100 (most reverse osmosis systems down to near 0) which is actually listed on the FON EPA registration application. Concentrations of the 3.74 gm refill droppers contain 20.1% sodium chloride to 79.9% vinegar, but the epa registration doesn’t list the vinegar strength unfortunately. I would assume they’re using something higher than typical household strength and perhaps more like Acetic Acid. The Ecolux recipe people keep on referring to mixes a different concentration of hypochlorous acid which from what I’ve read appears to range in concentration strength. In all transparency, I don’t see how FON can safely state that it makes 200 PPM solution when the starting water PPM can range greatly if not using 0 PPM distilled water. This can only occur if they start off at 0 ppm distilled water. Again the EPA registration for FON states to use water preferably under 100 PPM as a starting point so unless you have an RO system, use distilled water, or happen to be lucky and have PPM
If I'll be in a hard water area, and don't have access to filtered water, would bottled water work? And at what point would it be considered dangerous?
@@ThymefortheTable I'll be in Vietnam, not sure if distilled water is readily available there. But bottled water they'll have. So the final spray product, what would be considered dangerous? How would I know if I've made bleach instead of HOCL?
@@sherikream You want to stay close to 5.5 ph and 200 pm. Are you in the HOCl facebook group? There are some graphs and documents that people have posted that give an idea of how the it changes as you get further from 5.5 ph. There is a link to the group in the description of this video.
@@ThymefortheTable Thanks, I'll take a look at the FB group. I've tested the ph and ppm of both final products the with the diy salt/vinegar and with the FON capsules. The diy and FON capsule are both approx 5.5 ph. The diy ppm is just above 200 while the FON one came out as dark as 500 on the test strip!?!
@sherikream Many of us in the group that have tested our FON capsule ppm have gotten 500 ppm even though they said it should be about 200 ppm after running the device.
"The vinegar just brings the pH down." The reason that's important is that HOCl is most effective at around pH 5. NaOH is pH 13 and acetic acid is pH 7. Also, that "pool smell" is probably is probably chloramine gas. Best not to breathe too much of that as that's somewhat corrosive to the lungs.
Also you may go for 50 to 200 PPM strips they are a lot cheaper. Targeting a Ph of 4.5 to 5.5 your PPM of FAC any way is going to stay at around 250 or so. No need to waste money on up to 1000 PPM strips. PPM of 750 to 1000 will be at Ph 2.5 or below.
The issue with 200ppm strips is that when the solution is higher than 200ppm, you'll never know because the strips don't readily higher. FON finished product often reads at 500ppm, and for some, up to 800ppm, so having the higher 1000ppm strips empowers us to know exactly what we're making.
Thanks for making this video! Very helpful and you saved me a lot of money :) One tip: UV light degrades the hypochlorous acid and chlorine so you might want to use amber colored bottles, or put some blinker light tape on the bottles.
@@ThymefortheTable for someone who is domesticity challenged like me who can go long times before cleaning , it would be nice to know if you can add something cheap to preserve the cleaner to it fullest potential.
@@adamx6000 The benefit of owning a HOCl generator is being able to make it fresh as needed. That said, what FON will never recommend is running the expired solution in the device again to freshen it back up to full potency. Every other brand of generator encourages this, but since FON's actual product is the capsule, they want you to believe you must toss expired cleanser. Not so. To answer the question, other retail HOCl brands use far more complicated methods to create a purer HOCl end product, which has a longer shelf-life, and fewer by-products. It is too much to ask of a residential counter-top unit that sells under $50... =/
@@wixbetty I noticed that with my FON device if I make it with there capsules before it turns to HOCL during the process it smells like bleach. Is it bleach during the process before tuning to HOCL?
I bought a different electrolyte device that use salt and water and produce hypochlorite acid and with your instruction, I should able to produce hypochlorous acid. Just to confirm to compare the chlorine level should I look at the Total Chlorine ppm or Free Chlorine ppm?
I found this explanation in the eco one website Titanium Electrolysis Cell - The cell must be manufactured in high grade titanium. Systems using electrolysis cells that are manufactured from lower quality alloys will deteriorate quickly and may not be generating hypochlorous acid. If the electrolysis cell is made from steel or other lower grade metals, the electrolysis cell will deteriorate very quickly and will generate harmful chromium compounds that can be carcinogenic. Size of the Electrolysis Cell - Our electrolysis cell is relatively large for a 1 Liter pitcher and only requires 2 grams of salt to generate 200 ppm of hypochlorous acid. Even higher concentrations can be generated if the system is run for extra cycles. Many low quality systems manufactured in China are requiring very large quantities of salt. If you see that the directions on a system require 5 to 20 grams of salt per Liter, you can be sure that the electrolysis cell is very small and your solution salinity will be extremely high. Most likely the system is generating sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl) and not hypochlorous acid (HOCl).
Can anyone explain the chemistry of this? I’ve seen a few attempts, but nothing convincing. If vinegar is in the mixture, is the gas given off carbon dioxide? Or is it still hydrogen, as it would be without the vinegar?
Have you tested the efficacy of the diy solution compared to when using the FON capsules... Maybe with a petri dish control/sample swatch test? Is the DIY just as effective in disinfecting?
@@ThymefortheTable I've done it with the FON solution made with their capsules, compared to a few EO water devices, and none had come close to the FON "disinfecting" power. So since this is a diy version of the FON capsule, I'll definitely do a petri dish test to make sure. I'll let you know how it goes when I find some time to do the test.
Hi! Thank you for this video. I just purchased this and was wondering if you can use the solution that came with the machine as a hand sanitizer. If so do you use a specific container(glass or plastic?) Also, is it preferably wipe down after spray or air dry? Thank you again!
I know hypochlorous acid is very unstable, it can easily go back to salt water, my question is about the shelf life how long can it sit in a container?
@@israelrabiedmd1904 According to a Japanese study on storage of HOCL, they suggest keeping it in the refrigerator away from direct sunlight and using foil paper to cover the bottle to block "UV" light.
Sorry, one other thing...maybe you can help clear this up. In this journal article -- www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1853323/ -- it says "To maintain HOCl solution in a stable form, maximize its antimicrobial activities, and minimize undesirable side products, the pH must be maintained at 3.5 to 5." This seems to contradict the 5.5 goal and what others on the FoN forum are saying. What do you think?
@@ThymefortheTable Thanks! Here is the reply from FoN: "Our solution has a concentration of 220 ppm HOCI at a PH of between 5.5 and 6.0 depending on your local water. You'll know the solution has reached that concentration and ph level when the indicator light on your electrolyzer changes from pulsating blue to solid green all the way around. That's the only thing you need to see happen to know the solution has reached full accuracy. Test strips are notoriously inaccurate which is why the EPA requires chemical titration for all testing because the level of precision and accuracy needed is extremely high. Even testing the same solution across different strip brands can show widely different results. An example for you - according to Hach, probably the largest most sophisticated test strip manufacturer, the accuracy of a color strip is one half the color bar, which means that a reading of 400 PPM is +/- 200, meaning it could actually be from 200-600 ppm. Chemical titration is much more expensive to do, but it's the only method we count on when a high level of accuracy is critical. Force of Nature makes 220 PPMs (the concentration required to kill 99.9% of germs)."
For anyone about to try this, I suggest starting with distilled water. Correct the PH of the entire volume of distilled water with the vinegar. Add an amount of salt to match the ratio of liquid you have (less to be on the safe side). Make some solution, and adjust your salt as necessary for new batches if needed. If you record your measurements as you go, you should have a repeatable solution without having to do as much of the mixing or measuring.
Isn’t this pretty much what she did? She mixed her salt and vinegar together (her own repeatable formula) and then checked the pH of her ENTIRE solution before running it. Can you please clarify what the ratio of salt to total liquid volume should be? I’m having a hard time getting my final solution to the desirable pH of 5.5-6. Thanks Eric!
Why not just do the ppm at the end? I dont see how pH would be off if the right amount of Na,Cl,HOCL and Vinegar..? These 2 steps might be repetitive...
The steps are not repetitive. The "right" amount of salt and vinegar is relative to the pH of the water you're adding it to. Because,..you're adding those ingredients to 12oz of water. The pH of the water at a house in New York is different from the pH of the water at a house in California, and different from the pH of the water at a house in Michigan and Paris and Beijing and Rio de Janiero. Even bottled water, even distilled water, can have varying pH levels. SO if someone starts with water at 8.5 pH, and someone else starts with water at 6.5 pH, thats how the pH could vary from whats ideal in this solution.
We’ve tried it as it’s similar to a fogger affect for spreading disinfectant and cleaning. It fogs up the room, and we generally leave the room...haven’t noticed any problems breathing it but we usually turn the fans on to clear it out and circulate air.
I not 100% sure of this, but I heard if you just add salt without vinegar you get bleach ??? for safety I wouldn’t do that. Maybe do that with a separate water ionizer. I am seeing devices like this on Amazon that say to add salt to make Sodium hypochlorite (bleach).
@@ThymefortheTable o cool what is the Facebook group about? Just force of nature or different cleaning solutions? Also distilled water has a ppm of 0-1 giving a more accurate representation of the ppm of the diy solutions.
@@ThymefortheTable While you are a really nice person it's against youtube terms to lie that you don't get a commission. I don't mean to offend you and I'm just trying to warn you for future videos. The product itself is excellent and I thank you for sharing it. It's only common sense that you have approached the company for sponsorship.
@@ThymefortheTable on a completely different note the baby sound near the end was so adorable and cute ❤. Keep them safe. My favorite pet would be a human baby, love playing with them 😅
Seems like a lot extra work when you can just buy the capsules. Besides, isn’t buying all of those extra strips and stuff as expensive or more than just buying the capsules from the company?
The capsules certainly offer convenience for those of us with more money than time, but at about a $1 each, it can add up quickly, and in perpetuity... For those of us with more time than money, using our own salt and vinegar costs somewhere in the range of 1/4 of a penny to make a single 12oz batch of FON. Yes, test strips cost money, but that can be mitigated somewhat by cutting the strips down into smaller swatches, and durable goods, like the scale, only need to be purchased once.
That is a light Bleach machine. better buy bleach and dilute add vinegar. There has some hypochlorous acid (HOCL) most ingredients are NAOCL(Bleach). Please check other machines that sell Hypochlorite(Bleach) Generator. If you test in some way dilute bleach add vinegar then you can get the same ph and PPM. Electrolyzing saltwater is a way to make bleach. It looks like it is not bleach by adding vinegar (acid) to it to lower the pH.
Not hype. My housekeepers have used this for years. This is on the list of approved disinfectants for Corona virus. Read the articles that are linked to this video.
I used to work in the QA lab at a food processing facility. We were required to run surface chlorine tests of raw food and ingredient areas (we used Steramine). The test strips we used, before we got digital readers, only measured up to 400ppm. You are able to get a better-ranged reading than ones that test up to 1000ppm or higher. Also, the test strips someone might use for their pool may also not be adequate as they generally only read up to 10ppm. The ones I use are labeled 'restaurant quality' and are not at all expensive. About $8 for 100 strips. Oh, and measure your vinegar before adding to the salt and Pipettes are wonderful to use for adding small amounts or pulling a small amount of product out to test.
Just spent over $100 dollars loading up on tabs then thought there's got to be a diy video. Should have visited UA-cam an hour ago. Thank you so much for the video.
This machine is great. Owned it for a couple years until it broke. Missed its usefulness and stumbled onto a larger unit from Ecoloxtech and they give you the measurements needed to make the mix instead of pods.
Thanks for sharing your personal recipe and experience!
Please do! You’re gonna love it’s features. Sad how the price just a week ago was $60 less. It’s now at $199 😢.
I think the biggest difference is the technology the Eco One uses. I believe the FON is a membrane cell unit, which will produce some lye. As I understand it, the Eco doesn't produce the lye as a byproduct. I own a FON unit and I just bought my Eco last night. I'm really looking forward to getting/making larger amounts to clean my carpets.
amy l., so is the lye byrproduct bad? especially if i want to out this HOCL solution in a
fogger and cool vaporizer/humidifier?? Can the Eco make different concentrations (ppm) of HOCL??
thanks
@amythinks
Which unit do you like better and do you still use it?
Like others have reported, my FON machine was producing about 500 ppm chlorine at pH 5-5.5. my solution to this was to add another 320 ml the the finished HOCL. Then checking the chlorine again it would be close to 250ppm and still around pH 5.5. when I told my Brother(a Surgeon) he told me I was no longer making HOCL because the addition water I used for dilution had not been electrolyzed. So with the help of your video, I now make my HOCL at about 250 ppm chlorine. Thanks. Keep up the good work!
i bought a china made sodium hypochlorite generator it says. The seller said it can produce hypochlorous acid because I do not want sodium hypochlorite bec that is the bleaching harmful type am i right? the generator said it can make a 500ml solution.how can i use it in order to produce hypochlorous acid and not sodium hypochlorite? I hope you can enlighten me without adding vinegar also but only water and salt.
@@donnaalfonso4357 did you find out? The devices seem to be the same but why does one say it produces hypochlirous acud and the other say sodium hypochlorite?
@@saraferre616 probably just the amount of salt. If it's super saturated, meaning too much salt, it'll probably make bleach. Less salt, hypochlorous acid.
@@donnaalfonso4357 the vinegar is what makes one chlorine species predominant in the finished product, so if you want to generate HOCl, you also need to add vinegar.
Just salt and water will create hypochlorite.
Thank you for doing the heavy lifting of figuring out the balance of the right ingredients. I just can’t see myself throwing more little plastic pods away. This way makes a lot more sense. Plus the $avings!!
Thanks. I'm looking at these units, but the capsules were a deal breaker for me. The FON website tries make people scared of trying this by acting like one extra drop of vinegar is going to convert this into the strongest bleach of all time! It might be easier to eventually find a measuring spoon that coincides with the formula so you don't have to pull out the scale each time.
@@ThymefortheTable Yeah, that's the one I'm leaning towards, but it's more than twice the price with some of the discounts you can get on this one.
Thank you so much for making this! I was able to replicate this exactly per your steps. Super helpful and saves money!
OMG!! I LOVE YOUR VIDEO. You are the best. I am so going to do this. I love your kitchen!!
Have you tried making a larger quantity of the salt a vinegar solution so that you don't have to weigh out everything each time?
Jen, a study which discusses HOCL storage and virus kills suggests 5.5-6.0 as ideal PH.
Thank you for your excellent video Jen. I’ve just bought a different system to produce electrolytic water and you clear explanation of correct ph. And chlorine ppm will help me made the right mix for my family.
Thank you again. Ray, Sandbach, Cheshire ,England.
Madam, As you really do not need to chk the Alkaline (above 7ph), suggest go for another strip showing ph in .5 fractions from 3.5 to 6.0. that way you will reach more accurately to a Ph with in 5.0 and 5.5 range.
Hi! I just tried your process today. My PPM IS 500, and the PH is about 7.6. My water started at 7, and I added vinegar to get to 5.5. I tested some made with a FoN capsule. It was closer to 200 ppm and 6.6 PH. I do have a water softener that user salt pellets. Would you suggest adding less salt next time? Is what I made safe for use? Thank you for the valuable info!
Hi jenn, can i just use plain tap hard water? Thanks
1 liter water 2g salt, 1tsp white vinegar recipe from Ecolox Tech User Manual
Makes almost 3 batches
hi taur0, can this solution then be used in the FON machine? if so, how much (ml) should i add in?? thanks
@@qt5160 Yes, same formulation. Have purchased the Test strips
by Home Brew Ohio
Chlorine Test Papers (100 Strips) and Ph test strips. and concentration of chlorine and ph all is within proper range.
i make a batch in a three liter pitcher and then fill up the FON machine as needed.
I have a doubt: why is it that the amount of vinegar may vary based on my tap water, but the capsules have a steady formula that is combined with any tap water? If the capsules work for everyone, why wouldn’t the same DIY formula work for everyone?
I’m not questioning you, just a question bouncing around in my head. Thanks so much for the video!!
Well spotted. It might clean carpets etc., but for worktops etc just use a bleach based cleaner and don't put it on your hands. Use alcohol gel.
This is a very good observation and one of the reasons we test both the pH and FAC of our finished product.
The fact is FON can't offer a standardized vinegar content in their capsules and expect standardized results with the various water sources people use across the country and around the world.
Many users, upon using test strips, find their FON capsule-based finished product lands in the 500-800ppm range, which is a far cry from the advertised 200-220ppm range.
Fine if used as directed, but less than optimal for textiles, and maybe not ideal for spraying a pacifier before popping back into baby's mouth... nevermind if you ever want to venture into the skincare applications.
Would this be safe to use in a small kids pool to help keep clean?
Great Video! I recently got interested in HOCL for skin purposes for treating eczema and acne prevention. Can you recommend a range of ppm and a ph that’s best for skin?
Thanks! I'm not sure what ppm is best for skin. The ph should probably be 5.5 ph because that seems to be the highest percentage of HOCl. Are you on Facebook? There is a facebook group that I link to in the description of this video and there have been several discussions about using it on skin. You may be able to find some guidance there.
Most of the retail HOCl products land in the 100-120ppm range, and like Jen said, aiming for 5.5pH will yield the highest percentage of HOCl.
It is very soothing to skin, moreso than plain water, in my experience.
We keep spray bottles of HOCl in every bathroom, for wound care, spraying our toothbrushes, toilets, and reducing viral load in ears, eyes, and nasal passages after venturing out in public.
This should be started with a PPM under 100 (most reverse osmosis systems down to near 0) which is actually listed on the FON EPA registration application. Concentrations of the 3.74 gm refill droppers contain 20.1% sodium chloride to 79.9% vinegar, but the epa registration doesn’t list the vinegar strength unfortunately. I would assume they’re using something higher than typical household strength and perhaps more like Acetic Acid.
The Ecolux recipe people keep on referring to mixes a different concentration of hypochlorous acid which from what I’ve read appears to range in concentration strength. In all transparency, I don’t see how FON can safely state that it makes 200 PPM solution when the starting water PPM can range greatly if not using 0 PPM distilled water. This can only occur if they start off at 0 ppm distilled water.
Again the EPA registration for FON states to use water preferably under 100 PPM as a starting point so unless you have an RO system, use distilled water, or happen to be lucky and have PPM
Can u please make a video of u using it and the results please
If I'll be in a hard water area, and don't have access to filtered water, would bottled water work? And at what point would it be considered dangerous?
Distilled water works great! I think some bottled water has added minerals, and that would be fine. Distilled is the best though.
@@ThymefortheTable I'll be in Vietnam, not sure if distilled water is readily available there. But bottled water they'll have. So the final spray product, what would be considered dangerous? How would I know if I've made bleach instead of HOCL?
@@sherikream You want to stay close to 5.5 ph and 200 pm. Are you in the HOCl facebook group? There are some graphs and documents that people have posted that give an idea of how the it changes as you get further from 5.5 ph. There is a link to the group in the description of this video.
@@ThymefortheTable Thanks, I'll take a look at the FB group. I've tested the ph and ppm of both final products the with the diy salt/vinegar and with the FON capsules. The diy and FON capsule are both approx 5.5 ph. The diy ppm is just above 200 while the FON one came out as dark as 500 on the test strip!?!
@sherikream Many of us in the group that have tested our FON capsule ppm have gotten 500 ppm even though they said it should be about 200 ppm after running the device.
Never rest the strip against the bottle. Keep it about an inch away from the color chart to get an accurate read.
Can the concentrated solution be stored for any period of time before putting it in the machine?
I asked the manufacturer today and they suggest 3 years, although salt and vinegar don’t have a shelf life.
"The vinegar just brings the pH down."
The reason that's important is that HOCl is most effective at around pH 5. NaOH is pH 13 and acetic acid is pH 7. Also, that "pool smell" is probably is probably chloramine gas. Best not to breathe too much of that as that's somewhat corrosive to the lungs.
No. It’s not chloramine gas. There’s no ammonia on this.
Isn't acetic acid in vinegar? Mine tests in the 3pH range. What kind of acetic acid tests pH neutral at 7?
Can I add the vinegar afterwards like after the solution has been made?
No, you want the ph to be low before electrolyzing.
Also you may go for 50 to 200 PPM strips they are a lot cheaper. Targeting a Ph of 4.5 to 5.5 your PPM of FAC any way is going to stay at around 250 or so. No need to waste money on up to 1000 PPM strips. PPM of 750 to 1000 will be at Ph 2.5 or below.
The issue with 200ppm strips is that when the solution is higher than 200ppm, you'll never know because the strips don't readily higher.
FON finished product often reads at 500ppm, and for some, up to 800ppm, so having the higher 1000ppm strips empowers us to know exactly what we're making.
Thanks for making this video! Very helpful and you saved me a lot of money :) One tip: UV light degrades the hypochlorous acid and chlorine so you might want to use amber colored bottles, or put some blinker light tape on the bottles.
Great idea! Also, seems like it is not a budget buster.
I wonder what the ready made hypochlorous acid cleaners has in them to preserve their potency?
@@ThymefortheTable for someone who is domesticity challenged like me who can go long times before cleaning , it would be nice to know if you can add something cheap to preserve the cleaner to it fullest potential.
@@adamx6000 The benefit of owning a HOCl generator is being able to make it fresh as needed.
That said, what FON will never recommend is running the expired solution in the device again to freshen it back up to full potency.
Every other brand of generator encourages this, but since FON's actual product is the capsule, they want you to believe you must toss expired cleanser. Not so.
To answer the question, other retail HOCl brands use far more complicated methods to create a purer HOCl end product, which has a longer shelf-life, and fewer by-products. It is too much to ask of a residential counter-top unit that sells under $50... =/
@@wixbetty I noticed that with my FON device if I make it with there capsules before it turns to HOCL during the process it smells like bleach. Is it bleach during the process before tuning to HOCL?
@@wixbetty can running it again turn it back to HOCL or is that dangerous?
I bought a different electrolyte device that use salt and water and produce hypochlorite acid and with your instruction, I should able to produce hypochlorous acid. Just to confirm to compare the chlorine level should I look at the Total Chlorine ppm or Free Chlorine ppm?
I found this explanation in the eco one website
Titanium Electrolysis Cell - The cell must be manufactured in high grade titanium. Systems using electrolysis cells that are manufactured from lower quality alloys will deteriorate quickly and may not be generating hypochlorous acid. If the electrolysis cell is made from steel or other lower grade metals, the electrolysis cell will deteriorate very quickly and will generate harmful chromium compounds that can be carcinogenic.
Size of the Electrolysis Cell - Our electrolysis cell is relatively large for a 1 Liter pitcher and only requires 2 grams of salt to generate 200 ppm of hypochlorous acid. Even higher concentrations can be generated if the system is run for extra cycles. Many low quality systems manufactured in China are requiring very large quantities of salt. If you see that the directions on a system require 5 to 20 grams of salt per Liter, you can be sure that the electrolysis cell is very small and your solution salinity will be extremely high. Most likely the system is generating sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl) and not hypochlorous acid (HOCl).
Can anyone explain the chemistry of this? I’ve seen a few attempts, but nothing convincing. If vinegar is in the mixture, is the gas given off carbon dioxide? Or is it still hydrogen, as it would be without the vinegar?
Have you tested the efficacy of the diy solution compared to when using the FON capsules... Maybe with a petri dish control/sample swatch test? Is the DIY just as effective in disinfecting?
@@ThymefortheTable I've done it with the FON solution made with their capsules, compared to a few EO water devices, and none had come close to the FON "disinfecting" power. So since this is a diy version of the FON capsule, I'll definitely do a petri dish test to make sure. I'll let you know how it goes when I find some time to do the test.
@@ThymefortheTable yes, I'll definitely note down the pH and ppm of the solutions.
Hi! Thank you for this video. I just purchased this and was wondering if you can use the solution that came with the machine as a hand sanitizer. If so do you use a specific container(glass or plastic?) Also, is it preferably wipe down after spray or air dry? Thank you again!
I know hypochlorous acid is very unstable, it can easily go back to salt water, my question is about the shelf life how long can it sit in a container?
I dont want to just spray salt water thinking it can sanitize or disinfect but all i get is just salt water with no disinfecting effect.
@@israelrabiedmd1904 According to a Japanese study on storage of HOCL, they suggest keeping it in the refrigerator away from direct sunlight and using foil paper to cover the bottle to block "UV" light.
Sorry, one other thing...maybe you can help clear this up. In this journal article -- www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1853323/ -- it says "To maintain HOCl solution in a stable form, maximize its antimicrobial activities, and minimize undesirable side products, the pH must be maintained at 3.5 to 5." This seems to contradict the 5.5 goal and what others on the FoN forum are saying. What do you think?
@@ThymefortheTable Thanks! Here is the reply from FoN: "Our solution has a concentration of 220 ppm HOCI at a PH of between 5.5 and 6.0 depending on your local water. You'll know the solution has reached that concentration and ph level when the indicator light on your electrolyzer changes from pulsating blue to solid green all the way around. That's the only thing you need to see happen to know the solution has reached full accuracy.
Test strips are notoriously inaccurate which is why the EPA requires chemical titration for all testing because the level of precision and accuracy needed is extremely high. Even testing the same solution across different strip brands can show widely different results. An example for you - according to Hach, probably the largest most sophisticated test strip manufacturer, the accuracy of a color strip is one half the color bar, which means that a reading of 400 PPM is +/- 200, meaning it could actually be from 200-600 ppm. Chemical titration is much more expensive to do, but it's the only method we count on when a high level of accuracy is critical. Force of Nature makes 220 PPMs (the concentration required to kill 99.9% of germs)."
For anyone about to try this, I suggest starting with distilled water. Correct the PH of the entire volume of distilled water with the vinegar. Add an amount of salt to match the ratio of liquid you have (less to be on the safe side). Make some solution, and adjust your salt as necessary for new batches if needed. If you record your measurements as you go, you should have a repeatable solution without having to do as much of the mixing or measuring.
Isn’t this pretty much what she did? She mixed her salt and vinegar together (her own repeatable formula) and then checked the pH of her ENTIRE solution before running it.
Can you please clarify what the ratio of salt to total liquid volume should be? I’m having a hard time getting my final solution to the desirable pH of 5.5-6. Thanks Eric!
You should mention that hypochlorous acid data sheets mention ‘there is NO carcinogenic properties ‘
Why not just do the ppm at the end? I dont see how pH would be off if the right amount of Na,Cl,HOCL and Vinegar..? These 2 steps might be repetitive...
The steps are not repetitive. The "right" amount of salt and vinegar is relative to the pH of the water you're adding it to. Because,..you're adding those ingredients to 12oz of water. The pH of the water at a house in New York is different from the pH of the water at a house in California, and different from the pH of the water at a house in Michigan and Paris and Beijing and Rio de Janiero. Even bottled water, even distilled water, can have varying pH levels. SO if someone starts with water at 8.5 pH, and someone else starts with water at 6.5 pH, thats how the pH could vary from whats ideal in this solution.
I’ve been using this ! So so glad I bought it 2 mths ago but still pissed at myself I didn’t but it like 4 yrs ago when I wanted
Jen Talley yea at 40 yrs old I have only 3 regrets in life and not buying this when I first knew about is one of those 3 regrets
@@Yaboringme lol 😂
Hi! can i add essential oil in the spray bottle?
can you use this water in a cool mist humidifier or fogger to disinfect the air/room??
We’ve tried it as it’s similar to a fogger affect for spreading disinfectant and cleaning. It fogs up the room, and we generally leave the room...haven’t noticed any problems breathing it but we usually turn the fans on to clear it out and circulate air.
How long does Hypochlorous Acid Water take to kill covid 19?
Very nice and informative:-) Thanks
I not 100% sure of this, but I heard if you just add salt without vinegar you get bleach ??? for safety I wouldn’t do that. Maybe do that with a separate water ionizer. I am seeing devices like this on Amazon that say to add salt to make Sodium hypochlorite (bleach).
Can I use this produced acid in a fogger and will that fog kill the virus?
What is the Shelf life of the solution?
The reason some people are most likely getting high ppm is because they are not using distilled water.
@@ThymefortheTable o cool what is the Facebook group about? Just force of nature or different cleaning solutions? Also distilled water has a ppm of 0-1 giving a more accurate representation of the ppm of the diy solutions.
@@ThymefortheTable I have no idea why but I totally misread what you wrote and good to know the water doesn't really make a difference
@@ThymefortheTable awesome I'll have to join.
thank you
Thank you!
Where is the link for the machine?!?
@@ThymefortheTable While you are a really nice person it's against youtube terms to lie that you don't get a commission. I don't mean to offend you and I'm just trying to warn you for future videos. The product itself is excellent and I thank you for sharing it. It's only common sense that you have approached the company for sponsorship.
@@ThymefortheTable on a completely different note the baby sound near the end was so adorable and cute ❤. Keep them safe. My favorite pet would be a human baby, love playing with them 😅
b888 there’s no way she’s getting a commission, FON is adamant against making your own pods.
Missed a lot, because it outside the viewing screen.
Seems like a lot extra work when you can just buy the capsules. Besides, isn’t buying all of those extra strips and stuff as expensive or more than just buying the capsules from the company?
It’s also less waste to make it yourself. No plastic capsules... :)
The capsules certainly offer convenience for those of us with more money than time, but at about a $1 each, it can add up quickly, and in perpetuity...
For those of us with more time than money, using our own salt and vinegar costs somewhere in the range of 1/4 of a penny to make a single 12oz batch of FON.
Yes, test strips cost money, but that can be mitigated somewhat by cutting the strips down into smaller swatches, and durable goods, like the scale, only need to be purchased once.
That is a light Bleach machine. better buy bleach and dilute add vinegar. There has some hypochlorous acid (HOCL) most ingredients are NAOCL(Bleach). Please check other machines that sell Hypochlorite(Bleach) Generator. If you test in some way dilute bleach add vinegar then you can get the same ph and PPM. Electrolyzing saltwater is a way to make bleach. It looks like it is not bleach by adding vinegar (acid) to it to lower the pH.
This is acidified chlorine bleach. It releases toxic chlorine gas. These recommendations are hazardous to your health.
This is a real PoS product. Way overpriced, potentially dangerous, just pure hype in the age of corona virus.
Tell us how you really feel
Not hype. My housekeepers have used this for years. This is on the list of approved disinfectants for Corona virus. Read the articles that are linked to this video.
Do you even science bro?
Thank you