The alloy this part is made of, (which you do not need to mention) from my smaller experience, turning the block into swiss cheese, as per milling slots and holes, drilling holes in infinity of directions, my part would be warped or the first hole drilled would be out of spec in placement by the time the part is finished. Kinda like what cold rolled would do... how do you manage that, are you pre-calculating where things will end up, by the time the part is done... I have even had stress proof and or destressed material change on me, and my parts were so much smaller in length then the example you have in the machine in this video.... Glad to see you and yours are doing well.. be safe. Dru
I really enjoy these videos. Thank you. Just a glimpse behind the scenes at the clever people and processes that make our modern lifestyle possible. Best wishes and good luck, everyone.
First thanks for your fantastic video's very educating. Regarding cv as you mention we in Denmark are few weeks ahead. My advice is more to Center Line and how to run the business during the cv peak. 1. If workers are doing shift work make sure there is under lap hours, so when a new work has to take over they will not meet each other. 2. Ask the cantina to produce take away food pre packed and they have to abandon the cantina room. Eat at the machine. 3. Zone divides the factory; try to minimize who is walking where. 4. Close down bath facilities. 5. Ask workers not to visit Gym training center. 6. Use Alcohol to clean doors, handles, computer keyboards, screen, machine panels. 7. Careful not touch or scratch your face. 8. Abundance workers outside, painters, Plummer’s, etc. that must wait. 9. Each worker must not get near each other closer than 2 m. 10. Buy the food early in the morning and only one person in the mall; do not take families with you. ----------------------------- What could Super Market do ? 1. Put markers on floor 2 m distance, entrance, the line for payment etc. 2. Mount safety plexi glass on the counter to protect the person behind the register. 3. Avoid sales that activate many people. ------------------------------- What could you do? Offer hospitals your machine service; soon they will need spare parts. They will order in China or schweizerland (Roche) cobas® 6000 analyzer for cv test, but parts will never show up and waisting testing time. US has to produce parts them self. Some scientist (Anders Fomsgaard) in Denmark has discovered a method to reduce 1 step in isolating the virus genetic material RNA by heat treat each sample with 98 degree Celsius in 5 min. That saves pressures test chemicals for test equipment. He suggest an aluminum slant plan surfaced for cleanness and drilled holes with a diameter equal to the glass tubes and the slant is heated by electric controlled element. In Italy an soon Spain (Properly New York, Miami too) they do not have enough respirators and the nest best anesthesia equipment, so they have to use couplings for tubes so 2 person can share the same machine. These couplings require skill workers and machine shops.
Take your elderly home, the elderly home and hospitals soon become super factories for cv. Just my advice and contribution. Stay safe
Infrastructure! Whether its a bridge or facilities in a shop, it takes time to build and requires effort and resources over time to maintain. The tooling, instrumentation and machines in your shop never cease to amaze me. However, it all depends on human intelligence and skill to be meaningful. The engineers who designed the part you are working on. Then comes your expertise in actually making the part. None of that comes with the "push of a button!" Again, I thank you for sharing your work with us. I also hope that you and your family come through the health challenge we are all facing.
Great insight into the types of measuring equipment you carry in the shop. That part in the lathe is awesome. You are definitely a pro at this game. Thanks for sharing with us. Cheers
Thanks for sharing, I sure hope this customer doesnt get upset about you showing their parts. It would be a shame to have an issue like last time. Be safe and stay healthy, I look forward to the next project. Charles
I came across this video in a browse for something else and after a few mins I just had to go back inside, make me a cup of tea and take it outside to my favourite chair on the back patio...........my cat though I was going to fall asleep and drop my tea but being retired and not having to do any more of this shit ever again makes me so sleepy and the Sun is so warm I get relaxed..........at 81, the thought that some people are still slaving away for the dollars is frightening.......my CNC mill is working away making some odd toy thing I want to give to my neighbour's kid to keep him out of my garage.....what a life. BTW, nice workshop you have, better than any I've ever worked in.....If you offered me a million for an hour of my time now I wouldn't trade it for my cup of tea.....the Sun's just too warm.
🙂 Ian you sound like a man very satisfied with his life, it’s an amazing thing to see. I’m less the half your age and not even working in the metal machining/CNC trade but, it’s fascinating to me, this channel is just one of the ones I watch.
Thread Disk is awesome! Most shops around here have it. It's insanely handy. You can use it to add in plating allowances, make hard-gauges, get specs for different classifications, make custom sized threads...
I work in a machine shop that primarily builds machines for automotive suppliers. Two weeks ago was a normal March/April which normally slows down, before stuff takes off for the July Auto Plant shut down. Last Friday we were told to expect 2 more weeks of work before lay offs because the economy fell apart. My point is that this isn't like a normal bad economy it can happen over night.
Very good video. I have been thru this a few times with companies that I was hired to startup CNC manufacturing .One misconception is “all we need is a machine and a operator”. The company were I am now in the last 3yr startup we have spent $200,000 - $300,000 in just tooling and gauges. We try to add the cost to each job little by little.
I think one reason haas gets a bad rep in cutting steel is because the spindle is not integrally cooled. It just relies on the coolant to cool it. I had ran a 1" 6"lbs insert cutter in 4140(with no coolant) for 3 hours and the holder damn near stuck in the spindle. Left a huge head spot in the spindle and holder.
Yeah. Just love it when a mate says, nearly got the money saved, to buy a lathe/Mill. I chuckle, thinking of how much in Tooling the business actually costs. Same as a bloke with a Million Dollar Boat. Sure, the boat is beaut, but putting in fuel and running the bugger, that is the bit that impresses me.
I am utterly in awe at the size of the Mazak! I wondered why you couldn't access the tool magazine from the front, but when I looked back (7:57) I noticed that some part of the spindle extends all the way across the front. Thanks for sharing!
There is a special system that brings the tools up to the tool changer near the spindle. I have shown it in some of my videos. I believe the video of the parts I made for Hacksmith shows it.
Thanks for another very interesting video of the type of work you do. Again, looks like Tier 1 (SLB / HAL / BKR) oil and gas formation pressure testing hardware.
working is the best thing one can do currently. either go on sundays to get stuff done which is difficult during normal days. or planing and preparing long overdue overhauls.
Hi Peter great to see videos as always, I'm wondering if you have a philosophy where it's OK to use ER collets and where you would use shrink fit or a milling chuck. Like ER is OK for twist drills but not for end mills? Also wondering if there's a difference in holding force and runout if you have a ER20 and an ER32 say both at 1/4". Thanks and stay safe
For milling tools ER collets are not my first choice. The ER collet system doesn't have a lot of holding power. A endmill will tend to pull out of one. There are different precision levels of ER collets. If you buy cheep collets don't expect low run out. Also it pays if run out is important to buy a collet that is the size of your tool. Not one that covers a large range of sizes. It is possible to buy ER collets of specific sizes and precision ones. Kiser Big Daishowa makes them in specific sizes and precision. Of all the ER collet chucks I have checked they run pretty true. It is the collets that cause the runout. I would say the larger ER collet the more holding power, If the shank extends for the whole length of the collet. Just the fact the a larger collet has more gripping area and has a larger wrench to tighten it with more force. Makes it stronger.
Thanks for the video Peter , nice collection . One thing i wanted to tell. Since i'm on a horizontal mill, tool changer capacity can become an issue , or a tool that is too large or too delicate.... . So anyway the machine i use has an active tool list of up to 150 tools, with nice names , not just numbers. When a tool is not in the magazine, but in active tool list , the milling head comes to the operator and asks for the tool . After op is done it gives it back . This way i don't have to mess with tool edge numbers and different offsets (of course i can still load the wrong tool). I say this because in a post or somewhere you mentioned you play with tool edges and different offsets , to get around the magazine limitations. So i wondered if your active tools equal magazine capacity , in my case i have a 60 tool magazine , but up to 150 active tools (i can load manually 90 tools if i have to)
On the Mazatrol control you have offsets like this. For tool 1 you could have 1A, 1B, 1C, 1D, all the way to Z. The Only letters you cant use are I and J if I and some others I cant remember. There are something like 22 offsets on each tool number possible. There are no active offsets you call up what you want to use, the machine doesn't know any better. In G code That would be T1.01 For 1A, T1.02 For 1B and so on. Each offset does have complete information on its window and is saved for only that tool. So once it is set it doesn't have to be reset. Its just a matter of swapping the tool in the spindle or magazine. So if you set all the offsets that could give a total of 1760. I have only gone up to about G on any offset before.
hey peter - awesome video - awesome to see someone else loving dual bore gages.. i prefer them also and i also always set them with gage blocks in the nominal measurement aswell.. i hope everything is ok over there and be safe you and the family.
Thank you for doing another video. Keeping some of us sane... Trying times indeed. Hope you and yours can keep well. Nice tool kit, love the met stuff.
Keep up the great videos, wow I thought my 320 tool paths was a big one well the biggest one I have done yet. I can't imagine over 700 that unreal!!! Hey also would you be able to send me the name and maybe a model number for that tool to check a shallow bore I tryed looking it up and couldn't find it. There has been so many times that would have saved me so much time sizing in a shallow bore within half thou.
Nice collection of measuring equipment! Nice to see how well looked after they are , some of them being 20 plus years old. Just wondering if you have to get them calibrated to meet iso standards? Here in Australia if a company want to be iso certified all measurement equipment has to be calibrated by an outside company. We found that it is cheaper to buy new gauge blocks than to get a set checked and certified.
It depends on how you word your quality manual on the calibration. ISO calibration doesn’t guarantee anything. If you manual says you only calibrate certain things and everything is referenced to them. That’s all you have to calibrate. If you write you manual without much thought. It could cost you a lot because once certified under that manual you have to follow its procedures. Or loose you certification.
@@EdgePrecision Would be great to see you do a video on ISO certification, I think there would be a few machinist that would like to know more about it.
WRT accuracy of gauge blocks: not just a price difference, once you get to A & AA grades you start having to care more about temperature to stay within tolerance. So your work area has to be temperature controlled, you can't directly handle them without letting them soak back to temperature, etc. More of a concern for end standards than gauge blocks, and a huge concern for interferometric distance measuring tools.
I have 3 sets of the Diatest split ball bore gates. They span from about .04 to about .875. I am real fussy about accuracy and precision and have found that the Diatest split ball gages are indeed linear and can be trusted. Nevertheless, because I dislike having an indicator needle make several rotations I often will set up gage blocks at the desired dimension rather than use a ring gage that is not so close. Because of my nature I test all the gages that come into my shop with master gages of k own accuracy. If a new gage doesn't measure up, so to speak, it goes back. If a used gage is not accurate I repair it straightaway or mark it as bad and store it for later repair. Eric
I really wanted this video for a loong time, please dont hesitate to do a one take video like this agin. its really interesting just to see what other shops and diffrent machines are like. Thanks allot
Peter, very interesting video. I think measuring tools are something I struggle with most as far as finding information on the internet. Not tool many people show their process on metrology. I was wondering where you got that set of gauge blocks with the holes in them that you can screw together. I have a 6.251"(+0.001"/-0.000") bearing bore I need to measure and most bore gauge sets skip this size for some reason they go from 0" to 6" and then 6.5" to 10". I found a SPI bore gauge on MSC that goes from 6" to 10". I saw the error you showed when measuring with a micrometer on a stand and that would probably put me out of spec. Do you have any suggestions for how you would measure this? I was thinking of stacking gauge blocks like you showed. Thanks!
You can make any bore gauge to any size you need depending on the spacers you put between the anvil point and the gauge. A 1.4-6” set has a 2” spacer. The thing that is knurled on the OD and has a female thread on one end and male thread on the other. It is used to extend the length of the measuring points/anvils. All you have to do to get to a 8” range is screw two of those on the bore gage. Than use the anvils and shims to get it to the size you want in the travel of the dial indicator. Or you could just make a special one in your case .500” longer. Now you have a 6.50” gauge. Simple as that.
How is your workflow? Do one feature at a time in cam, then onto the machine, and then back to cam again to do next? or do you bang out the entire cam first, then let the machine do its work for X hours?
I usually do a large percentage of the program and run that than more and run that. In this case the programs combined were to large to fit in the memory capacity of this machines control. So that dedicated the size of each percentage.
Makes you wonder why they don’t design parts to be simpler? I love the way he uses the CNC more like a computer-aided manual machine, a lot of UA-cam channels just show them running a long program non-stop.
I try to look at a job before I agree to do it. If it needs a lot of special tooling like this one the price has to cover it. I will tell you this. In this jobs case I got some up front money in advance for tooling.
Edge Precision are you pretty on the money with your estimates then ,? Or have you been caught out an lost out money wise ? I’m guessing that sort of thing comes with experience... and abit of “you win some you lose some”
If been hoping you make a video on all of your tooling. This is great information. What do you think the total cost of the tooling in the carousel is 80,000-100,000 ?
I fall under the umbrella of Center-lines quality program. So all my instruments are for reference only they control the final quality. There are many things people don't understand about ISO certification and calibration. This all depends on how your quality manual is written. If you say you will only calibrate your standard (A set of gauge blocks for instance) and than you will self calibrate everything to that standard. That's all you need to do. But if you write in your manual to send everything out to be calibrated and the interval of time. Than that is what you have to do. You can see it is very important how you word your manual. After you are certified to that quality program you have to follow it. And yes most all larger customers want ISO compliance.
that capto stuff is very expensive due to dual contact nature of the mating surfaces I guess, I won few 40 taper holders with the capto c6-c4 on the business end and just don't know what to do with them, I think they were made by BIG (Daishova) and look new/unused, but whenever I look for some capto holders for them that would fit my needs and see the pricing, I push those 40 taper holders deeper and deeper into the shelf and out of sight...
Thanks for the tool box tour. That gagemaker software looks really useful. I use the theoretical machinist website it does not do as nearly as much but has the basics for metric and imperial threads. I'm assuming your customer is still working and has not shut down? Take care Peter.
Thanks Bill. Everything for now is OK. They passed out papers here that will exempt us from any quarantine measures. They say if that happens and we get stopped by anyone this will let us go to work. We will see. I hope it doesn't come to that.
@@EdgePrecision Yeah Peter I hear you. I work for a college so we are still working. The students are using remote learning and many of the staff are working from home. I'm going to film some video on my lunch and hopefully upload soon to my channel.
That's a crazy amount of tools for one job. Did you quote this before accepting or are they paying you by the hour and amount of tools you have to buy?
Except for the actual cutting tools. I already had all but three tool holders I needed. The cutting tools themselves are figured into doing the machine work. I also had to purchase a few measuring tools.
A little off topic since we're just wandering around, have you ever used a grinding wheel on a cnc mill? I've been tossing the idea in my head for a few days, and the only thing I could think of that could stop you would maybe be dust collection?
Yes I reground the top of the base of my 8" Kirt vise in my horizontal mill. Using a CBN cup wheel. It worked fine. Use super abrasive wheels with coolant. There will be very little dust or abrasive.
So you rent the space in this shop for your machines? I don't believe I've seen that concept in manufacturing before. It's like barbers renting a chair in a salon. Neat.
@@EdgePrecision Ok. I've watched your videos before and didn't catch that. This video was confusing at first, until I assumed that was the situation lol. Thanks for the reply.
Hpw much are you going tk be charging for those parts?????? I imagime they gotta be really expensive.... What king of material are the parts you're machining???? Nice job
That is an amazing process you have put together for that part. Would you consider addressing how you prepare for producing such a part. For instance, how much time does it take to get from receiving contract/production specifications to cutting metal, what are the steps you go through to determine the program subroutines, when do you program the dimension verification pauses in the code, etc. I am not a machinist so maybe this is a nonsense question to experienced machinists. If so, please disregard. I ask this because it seems to me you don't just sit down and produce 700+ lines of code, start cutting and wing the rest. This is obviously a tongue in cheek comment; Haha and such.
that's not 700 lines of code. that's 700 individual operations which each operation would use way, way, way more than 700 lines! Just to put it into perspective - I've made relatively simple parts compared to this and it took 14,000 Plus lines of code.
Most jobs it can be the same day you start the job your machining material. Not really a job like this. It takes running setup parts to test processes and tooling. Also finding that tooling and the way to hold it (Tool Holders) has taken a lot of time with this job. There are also process you don't see here (I did mention welding in the video) drilling, welding, checking those welds for flaws, pressure testing and Inspection to mention a few. All I'm doing is the actual machine work but many of these processes happen in between what I do. For instance I have to prep the stock for the welding than it goes for weld and die penetrant test than pressure check. Than back to me for more machining and so on. This is why it seems like it takes so long.
Coatings and type depend on what you are machining. A coating can improve the life of a tool. But its not required. I run many tool I grind myself without coating. Most of the tools I have are coated with TIALN. That coating can look anywhere from black to a blackish bronze color. The TIN coating you are referring to is gold in color.
I am always surprised by the size of the C8/CAT50 tool magazines. Our 72 tool C6 (i100 Integrex) magazine would fit completely inside yours twice or three times easily.
Peter, thanks for the update. I always look forward to seeing your new videos. I love the "show and tell" of your new Kennedy box! I'm kind of a tool junky so that was eye candy to me! I agree with your C.V. hypothesis, more than likely just a matter of time. But like you said hopefully it won't be too bad! Anyhow, best wishes! Dan @6-4 Fab
I choose to believe you're building a 1:100 scale ballistic missile submarine. Kidding aside I'm glad you're well and I'm having a whale of a time following your process with these parts.
Actually there’s seven programs for the whole part. One for each end and five to do the middle. The machine can’t hold the whole thing in it’s working memory. There is only about 2 megabytes of working memory.
when I was doing install and training for mitsubishi cnc machine tools, 75 % of customers could machine a more complex part than they could inspect and measure, customers required a cmm in the inspection room but it had 1/2 inch dust because no one could run it, they depended on the cnc to produce a good part
@@EdgePrecision shops go bankrupt bidding parts they cant make or didnt check on tooling prices, had my own shop for 5 years hated small business now I have a mill and lathe in garage and machine for fun, its amazing how many shops cant fixture the part right
Saw his tools. Then saw my collection. Closed the cigar box lid and went to bed crying.
You've got a cigar box full?! Wow! I have an Altoid tin.
Peter's tooling costs more than my house :-O
I know this Feeling ist so frustraiting
AJAJA absolutely
Lol
Enjoyed Peter amazing work as always!
ATB, Robin
Impressive stuff! I just bought a 3 axis Anilam 3300Mk vertical knee mill a few weeks ago. First CNC machine. Absolutely love it.
The alloy this part is made of, (which you do not need to mention) from my smaller experience, turning the block into swiss cheese, as per milling slots and holes, drilling holes in infinity of directions, my part would be warped or the first hole drilled would be out of spec in placement by the time the part is finished. Kinda like what cold rolled would do... how do you manage that, are you pre-calculating where things will end up, by the time the part is done... I have even had stress proof and or destressed material change on me, and my parts were so much smaller in length then the example you have in the machine in this video.... Glad to see you and yours are doing well.. be safe. Dru
I believe someone may have had it stress relieved. It is remaining remarkably straight. But there is a little distortion.
I really enjoy these videos. Thank you.
Just a glimpse behind the scenes at the clever people and processes that make our modern lifestyle possible.
Best wishes and good luck, everyone.
First thanks for your fantastic video's very educating. Regarding cv as you mention we in Denmark are few weeks ahead. My advice is more to Center Line and how to run the business during the cv peak.
1. If workers are doing shift work make sure there is under lap hours, so when a new work has to take over they will not meet each other.
2. Ask the cantina to produce take away food pre packed and they have to abandon the cantina room. Eat at the machine.
3. Zone divides the factory; try to minimize who is walking where.
4. Close down bath facilities.
5. Ask workers not to visit Gym training center.
6. Use Alcohol to clean doors, handles, computer keyboards, screen, machine panels.
7. Careful not touch or scratch your face.
8. Abundance workers outside, painters, Plummer’s, etc. that must wait.
9. Each worker must not get near each other closer than 2 m.
10. Buy the food early in the morning and only one person in the mall; do not take families with you.
-----------------------------
What could Super Market do ?
1. Put markers on floor 2 m distance, entrance, the line for payment etc.
2. Mount safety plexi glass on the counter to protect the person behind the register.
3. Avoid sales that activate many people.
-------------------------------
What could you do?
Offer hospitals your machine service; soon they will need spare parts. They will order in China or schweizerland (Roche) cobas® 6000 analyzer for cv test, but parts will never show up and waisting testing time. US has to produce parts them self.
Some scientist (Anders Fomsgaard) in Denmark has discovered a method to reduce 1 step in isolating the virus genetic material RNA by heat treat each sample with 98 degree Celsius in 5 min. That saves pressures test chemicals for test equipment. He suggest an aluminum slant plan surfaced for cleanness and drilled holes with a diameter equal to the glass tubes and the slant is heated by electric controlled element.
In Italy an soon Spain (Properly New York, Miami too) they do not have enough respirators and the nest best anesthesia equipment, so they have to use couplings for tubes so 2 person can share the same machine. These couplings require skill workers and machine shops.
Take your elderly home, the elderly home and hospitals soon become super factories for cv.
Just my advice and contribution.
Stay safe
Peter, do you keep track of roughly how many hours put into just programming?
Infrastructure! Whether its a bridge or facilities in a shop, it takes time to build and requires effort and resources over time to maintain. The tooling, instrumentation and machines in your shop never cease to amaze me. However, it all depends on human intelligence and skill to be meaningful. The engineers who designed the part you are working on. Then comes your expertise in actually making the part. None of that comes with the "push of a button!" Again, I thank you for sharing your work with us. I also hope that you and your family come through the health challenge we are all facing.
Hey Peter thanks for the tour, and gotta love those tools.
Hi Peter. Thank you for sharing. I always enjoy your videos.
Great insight into the types of measuring equipment you carry in the shop. That part in the lathe is awesome. You are definitely a pro at this game. Thanks for sharing with us. Cheers
Awesome Peter - stay safe there in Houston.
I second that.
Thanks for sharing, I sure hope this customer doesnt get upset about you showing their parts. It would be a shame to have an issue like last time. Be safe and stay healthy, I look forward to the next project. Charles
I'm still watching , your custom tooling that you make is my favorite.
that bar that fits into grooved boring head that was made just for this job?
Yes.
I know pain of not having enough tool, I only have a 10 tool changer so have to design setup to use different tool setups.
I came across this video in a browse for something else and after a few mins I just had to go back inside, make me a cup of tea and take it outside to my favourite chair on the back patio...........my cat though I was going to fall asleep and drop my tea but being retired and not having to do any more of this shit ever again makes me so sleepy and the Sun is so warm I get relaxed..........at 81, the thought that some people are still slaving away for the dollars is frightening.......my CNC mill is working away making some odd toy thing I want to give to my neighbour's kid to keep him out of my garage.....what a life.
BTW, nice workshop you have, better than any I've ever worked in.....If you offered me a million for an hour of my time now I wouldn't trade it for my cup of tea.....the Sun's just too warm.
🙂 Ian you sound like a man very satisfied with his life, it’s an amazing thing to see. I’m less the half your age and not even working in the metal machining/CNC trade but, it’s fascinating to me, this channel is just one of the ones I watch.
Thanks for sharing, stay safe Peter & family. Greetings from the Netherlands.
Thread Disk is awesome! Most shops around here have it. It's insanely handy. You can use it to add in plating allowances, make hard-gauges, get specs for different classifications, make custom sized threads...
What a project! Required so many tools and set ups. Much props to you Peter.
Was wondering what you've been up to.enjoy these videos,keeping our factory open during this,and I'm ok with that. Great video of the shop.
I work in a machine shop that primarily builds machines for automotive suppliers. Two weeks ago was a normal March/April which normally slows down, before stuff takes off for the July Auto Plant shut down. Last Friday we were told to expect 2 more weeks of work before lay offs because the economy fell apart. My point is that this isn't like a normal bad economy it can happen over night.
Thank you for sharing. Awesome stuff.
When you think your getting someplace in life and you come across this guy , DAM i suck , i gotta get these wheels of the ground man ...
Very good video. I have been thru this a few times with companies that I was hired to startup CNC manufacturing .One misconception is “all we need is a machine and a operator”. The company were I am now in the last 3yr startup we have spent $200,000 - $300,000 in just tooling and gauges. We try to add the cost to each job little by little.
Yeah 200-300k in measuring alone wouldn't be too hard
Peter, tyvm for taking time away from making parts to make this update video! We viewers appreciate it! Be safe, go wash your hands...
I think one reason haas gets a bad rep in cutting steel is because the spindle is not integrally cooled. It just relies on the coolant to cool it. I had ran a 1" 6"lbs insert cutter in 4140(with no coolant) for 3 hours and the holder damn near stuck in the spindle. Left a huge head spot in the spindle and holder.
We are getting 2 VF6's first week of april and both have 5 axis trunions. These updates are always welcomed from you peter.
Why not a umc?
@@spazzywhitebelt not my call. And for the work we do a mill is better than a umc.
Yeah. Just love it when a mate says, nearly got the money saved, to buy a lathe/Mill.
I chuckle, thinking of how much in Tooling the business actually costs.
Same as a bloke with a Million Dollar Boat. Sure, the boat is beaut, but putting in fuel and running the bugger, that is the bit that impresses me.
I once owned a expensive Porsche. A guy told me once. I could give him the car and he couldn't afford it.
I am utterly in awe at the size of the Mazak! I wondered why you couldn't access the tool magazine from the front, but when I looked back (7:57) I noticed that some part of the spindle extends all the way across the front. Thanks for sharing!
There is a special system that brings the tools up to the tool changer near the spindle. I have shown it in some of my videos. I believe the video of the parts I made for Hacksmith shows it.
Thanks for another very interesting video of the type of work you do. Again, looks like Tier 1 (SLB / HAL / BKR) oil and gas formation pressure testing hardware.
Could be I don’t know what the part does.
Wow impressive array of serious tooling. Thanks for the update.
working is the best thing one can do currently. either go on sundays to get stuff done which is difficult during normal days. or planing and preparing long overdue overhauls.
The truth is no matter how big of a tool magazine you have, they're never big enough
Yes that is true. As well as the bigger machine is never big enough.
Edge Precision
a man needs to build a shed over his tool
Very interesting seeing your inspection gear ~ and I enjoyed the tour of the shop, many thanks.
Hi Peter great to see videos as always, I'm wondering if you have a philosophy where it's OK to use ER collets and where you would use shrink fit or a milling chuck. Like ER is OK for twist drills but not for end mills? Also wondering if there's a difference in holding force and runout if you have a ER20 and an ER32 say both at 1/4". Thanks and stay safe
For milling tools ER collets are not my first choice. The ER collet system doesn't have a lot of holding power. A endmill will tend to pull out of one. There are different precision levels of ER collets. If you buy cheep collets don't expect low run out. Also it pays if run out is important to buy a collet that is the size of your tool. Not one that covers a large range of sizes. It is possible to buy ER collets of specific sizes and precision ones. Kiser Big Daishowa makes them in specific sizes and precision. Of all the ER collet chucks I have checked they run pretty true. It is the collets that cause the runout. I would say the larger ER collet the more holding power, If the shank extends for the whole length of the collet. Just the fact the a larger collet has more gripping area and has a larger wrench to tighten it with more force. Makes it stronger.
Thank You for posting this content. It is Very helpful and Inspiring. I am glad I found your channel via your comment to Chris (AvE)
Thanks for the video Peter , nice collection .
One thing i wanted to tell. Since i'm on a horizontal mill, tool changer capacity can become an issue , or a tool that is too large or too delicate.... . So anyway the machine i use has an active tool list of up to 150 tools, with nice names , not just numbers. When a tool is not in the magazine, but in active tool list , the milling head comes to the operator and asks for the tool . After op is done it gives it back . This way i don't have to mess with tool edge numbers and different offsets (of course i can still load the wrong tool).
I say this because in a post or somewhere you mentioned you play with tool edges and different offsets , to get around the magazine limitations. So i wondered if your active tools equal magazine capacity , in my case i have a 60 tool magazine , but up to 150 active tools (i can load manually 90 tools if i have to)
On the Mazatrol control you have offsets like this. For tool 1 you could have 1A, 1B, 1C, 1D, all the way to Z. The Only letters you cant use are I and J if I and some others I cant remember. There are something like 22 offsets on each tool number possible. There are no active offsets you call up what you want to use, the machine doesn't know any better. In G code That would be T1.01 For 1A, T1.02 For 1B and so on. Each offset does have complete information on its window and is saved for only that tool. So once it is set it doesn't have to be reset. Its just a matter of swapping the tool in the spindle or magazine. So if you set all the offsets that could give a total of 1760. I have only gone up to about G on any offset before.
@@EdgePrecision I see, different from Sinumerik of course , but seems just as easy to use.
hey peter - awesome video - awesome to see someone else loving dual bore gages.. i prefer them also and i also always set them with gage blocks in the nominal measurement aswell.. i hope everything is ok over there and be safe you and the family.
We swear by the Gagemaker thread software. You can buy it separate, the name of it is TDWin and it's about $200.
they need to update the software, it will not work correctly on newer computers with WIN10
Thank you for doing another video.
Keeping some of us sane...
Trying times indeed.
Hope you and yours can keep well.
Nice tool kit, love the met stuff.
Thanks for the update. Dave
Keep up the great videos, wow I thought my 320 tool paths was a big one well the biggest one I have done yet. I can't imagine over 700 that unreal!!! Hey also would you be able to send me the name and maybe a model number for that tool to check a shallow bore I tryed looking it up and couldn't find it. There has been so many times that would have saved me so much time sizing in a shallow bore within half thou.
Search This SPI 30-639-9
Nice collection of measuring equipment! Nice to see how well looked after they are , some of them being 20 plus years old.
Just wondering if you have to get them calibrated to meet iso standards?
Here in Australia if a company want to be iso certified all measurement equipment has to be calibrated by an outside company. We found that it is cheaper to buy new gauge blocks than to get a set checked and certified.
It depends on how you word your quality manual on the calibration. ISO calibration doesn’t guarantee anything. If you manual says you only calibrate certain things and everything is referenced to them. That’s all you have to calibrate. If you write you manual without much thought. It could cost you a lot because once certified under that manual you have to follow its procedures. Or loose you certification.
@@EdgePrecision Would be great to see you do a video on ISO certification, I think there would be a few machinist that would like to know more about it.
Thanks for the video stay safe.
You sure make some complex parts and the sizes are huge. Mistakes must be truly expensive. Your custom tools look every bit as nice as store bought.
what cad/camm package do You use? Your work is amazing. I would love to come and be a floor sweeper in You shop and just learn from You.
I use Esprit TNG cam software and SpaceClaim for cad.
Love those Bowers 3 point micrometers.
Great video - thanks for the tour!
WRT accuracy of gauge blocks: not just a price difference, once you get to A & AA grades you start having to care more about temperature to stay within tolerance. So your work area has to be temperature controlled, you can't directly handle them without letting them soak back to temperature, etc. More of a concern for end standards than gauge blocks, and a huge concern for interferometric distance measuring tools.
782 discrete processes...my word! That's a record - as far as my machining capabilities go...Awesome! Love your work!
lo primero cuidate mucho y procura evitar asuntos con el coronavirus...por otro lado buen video y gracias por tu tiempo
It is great to hear an expert talk about their work.
Peter, great video. Keep on making those unbelievable parts. Stay safe.
I have 3 sets of the Diatest split ball bore gates. They span from about .04 to about .875. I am real fussy about accuracy and precision and have found that the Diatest split ball gages are indeed linear and can be trusted. Nevertheless, because I dislike having an indicator needle make several rotations I often will set up gage blocks at the desired dimension rather than use a ring gage that is not so close. Because of my nature I test all the gages that come into my shop with master gages of k own accuracy. If a new gage doesn't measure up, so to speak, it goes back. If a used gage is not accurate I repair it straightaway or mark it as bad and store it for later repair.
Eric
this part is bananas
Yea I’m guessing if peter did a deep dive into application he could modify a lot of the hard to do elements of this part to be more machining friendly
I see engineers over complicate designs all the time. One guy always goes bonkers with the radius tool in his cad for looks lol
That's a next lvl part
Thanks for the video.
Great video, Peter. I find this kind of stuff incredibly interesting. Thanks.
Another great video! I really enjoyed seeing all the little measurement equipment creations!
I really wanted this video for a loong time, please dont hesitate to do a one take video like this agin. its really interesting just to see what other shops and diffrent machines are like. Thanks allot
Peter, very interesting video. I think measuring tools are something I struggle with most as far as finding information on the internet. Not tool many people show their process on metrology. I was wondering where you got that set of gauge blocks with the holes in them that you can screw together. I have a 6.251"(+0.001"/-0.000") bearing bore I need to measure and most bore gauge sets skip this size for some reason they go from 0" to 6" and then 6.5" to 10". I found a SPI bore gauge on MSC that goes from 6" to 10". I saw the error you showed when measuring with a micrometer on a stand and that would probably put me out of spec. Do you have any suggestions for how you would measure this? I was thinking of stacking gauge blocks like you showed. Thanks!
You can make any bore gauge to any size you need depending on the spacers you put between the anvil point and the gauge. A 1.4-6” set has a 2” spacer. The thing that is knurled on the OD and has a female thread on one end and male thread on the other. It is used to extend the length of the measuring points/anvils. All you have to do to get to a 8” range is screw two of those on the bore gage. Than use the anvils and shims to get it to the size you want in the travel of the dial indicator. Or you could just make a special one in your case .500” longer. Now you have a 6.50” gauge. Simple as that.
I used to do some welding for you in the late '90s and early 2000s. Spring Engineers as well. Say hi to Allan Peterson for me. Terry.
Really enjoyed the toolbox tour! Stay safe and keep making good parts. :-)
How is your workflow? Do one feature at a time in cam, then onto the machine, and then back to cam again to do next? or do you bang out the entire cam first, then let the machine do its work for X hours?
I usually do a large percentage of the program and run that than more and run that. In this case the programs combined were to large to fit in the memory capacity of this machines control. So that dedicated the size of each percentage.
Makes you wonder why they don’t design parts to be simpler?
I love the way he uses the CNC more like a computer-aided manual machine, a lot of UA-cam channels just show them running a long program non-stop.
That might happen if one of the design engineers had more experience with actual machining or had to pay for it out of his salary.
So very cool!!! What's up with the Gatorade in the magazine?
I’m not sure. Someone must have thrown it in there.
Thanks Peter, take care.
Fascinating stuff as usual, Peter! Thanks for posting. Stay safe over there.
just finished this video - that part you are making is simply amazing!
I see Stix and Lionel in your feed. I figured you were in the know on more than just machining ; ) Thanks Peter, good to hear from you.
Yes the conspiratoriam. We are not conspiracists we are conspiracy analysts.
What do you do with all your custom tools ? You cost those into the job before you take it on ? Or do you set a value of money for “just incase” ?
I try to look at a job before I agree to do it. If it needs a lot of special tooling like this one the price has to cover it. I will tell you this. In this jobs case I got some up front money in advance for tooling.
Edge Precision are you pretty on the money with your estimates then ,? Or have you been caught out an lost out money wise ? I’m guessing that sort of thing comes with experience... and abit of “you win some you lose some”
Man, you've got some time and money tied up in all of that custom tooling! Thanks for sharing.
My guess it is a: "We want this thing, cost doesn't matter" deal.
,,, ahhhhhh, some Gerstner wood, in a sea of plastic and stamped steel .
If been hoping you make a video on all of your tooling. This is great information. What do you think the total cost of the tooling in the carousel is 80,000-100,000 ?
More
Wow those instruments!
One time I filed the pointy end off a nail.
Who does your calibration? Does the shop have a cal lab or do you have to send it out? Do most customers want ISO compliance?
I fall under the umbrella of Center-lines quality program. So all my instruments are for reference only they control the final quality. There are many things people don't understand about ISO certification and calibration. This all depends on how your quality manual is written. If you say you will only calibrate your standard (A set of gauge blocks for instance) and than you will self calibrate everything to that standard. That's all you need to do. But if you write in your manual to send everything out to be calibrated and the interval of time. Than that is what you have to do. You can see it is very important how you word your manual. After you are certified to that quality program you have to follow it. And yes most all larger customers want ISO compliance.
that capto stuff is very expensive due to dual contact nature of the mating surfaces I guess, I won few 40 taper holders with the capto c6-c4 on the business end and just don't know what to do with them, I think they were made by BIG (Daishova) and look new/unused, but whenever I look for some capto holders for them that would fit my needs and see the pricing, I push those 40 taper holders deeper and deeper into the shelf and out of sight...
Thanks for the tool box tour. That gagemaker software looks really useful. I use the theoretical machinist website it does not do as nearly as much but has the basics for metric and imperial threads. I'm assuming your customer is still working and has not shut down? Take care Peter.
Thanks Bill. Everything for now is OK. They passed out papers here that will exempt us from any quarantine measures. They say if that happens and we get stopped by anyone this will let us go to work. We will see. I hope it doesn't come to that.
@@EdgePrecision Yeah Peter I hear you. I work for a college so we are still working. The students are using remote learning and many of the staff are working from home. I'm going to film some video on my lunch and hopefully upload soon to my channel.
That's a crazy amount of tools for one job. Did you quote this before accepting or are they paying you by the hour and amount of tools you have to buy?
Except for the actual cutting tools. I already had all but three tool holders I needed. The cutting tools themselves are figured into doing the machine work. I also had to purchase a few measuring tools.
A little off topic since we're just wandering around, have you ever used a grinding wheel on a cnc mill? I've been tossing the idea in my head for a few days, and the only thing I could think of that could stop you would maybe be dust collection?
Yes I reground the top of the base of my 8" Kirt vise in my horizontal mill. Using a CBN cup wheel. It worked fine. Use super abrasive wheels with coolant. There will be very little dust or abrasive.
@@EdgePrecision is the CBN just to have less abrasive, or are there other benefits?
So you rent the space in this shop for your machines? I don't believe I've seen that concept in manufacturing before. It's like barbers renting a chair in a salon. Neat.
Yes the shop was mine until 2005 when I sold it. Now I rent space from the present owners.
@@EdgePrecision Ok. I've watched your videos before and didn't catch that. This video was confusing at first, until I assumed that was the situation lol. Thanks for the reply.
Wow what is this part for anyway very complex and elaborate and expensive piece. Thats why I like your channel. You do lots of weird stuff.
Thanks man, stay safe!
That part in the CNC looks like the stem out of my wristwatch. - Signed, Jolly Green Giant. (:
Hpw much are you going tk be charging for those parts??????
I imagime they gotta be really expensive....
What king of material are the parts you're machining????
Nice job
These parts are titanium.
Just boggles the mind. 750 operations on that one part must put it over 100,000.00. And I just filled up this morning for 1.76 a gallon.
And we pay the same prise for a litre as you do for a gallon
@@Thefreakyfreek And that too boggles the mind, but from another direction...
Great job Pete.
Interesting Holly Shaft 👍🙌 .
Very impressive.
That is an amazing process you have put together for that part. Would you consider addressing how you prepare for producing such a part. For instance, how much time does it take to get from receiving contract/production specifications to cutting metal, what are the steps you go through to determine the program subroutines, when do you program the dimension verification pauses in the code, etc. I am not a machinist so maybe this is a nonsense question to experienced machinists. If so, please disregard.
I ask this because it seems to me you don't just sit down and produce 700+ lines of code, start cutting and wing the rest. This is obviously a tongue in cheek comment; Haha and such.
that's not 700 lines of code. that's 700 individual operations which each operation would use way, way, way more than 700 lines! Just to put it into perspective - I've made relatively simple parts compared to this and it took 14,000 Plus lines of code.
Most jobs it can be the same day you start the job your machining material. Not really a job like this. It takes running setup parts to test processes and tooling. Also finding that tooling and the way to hold it (Tool Holders) has taken a lot of time with this job. There are also process you don't see here (I did mention welding in the video) drilling, welding, checking those welds for flaws, pressure testing and Inspection to mention a few. All I'm doing is the actual machine work but many of these processes happen in between what I do. For instance I have to prep the stock for the welding than it goes for weld and die penetrant test than pressure check. Than back to me for more machining and so on. This is why it seems like it takes so long.
Wow. Thank you for your response.
I have been looking at getting a used VF2 Haas for hobby projects and some small job work. Is this a route you recommend to get started with CNC?
Yes if you can afford it.
Pete keep on chugging. Are titanium nitride coatings a must for tooling
Coatings and type depend on what you are machining. A coating can improve the life of a tool. But its not required. I run many tool I grind myself without coating. Most of the tools I have are coated with TIALN. That coating can look anywhere from black to a blackish bronze color. The TIN coating you are referring to is gold in color.
I love metrology stuff, something satisfying about quality measuring gear
I am always surprised by the size of the C8/CAT50 tool magazines. Our 72 tool C6 (i100 Integrex) magazine would fit completely inside yours twice or three times easily.
Peter, thanks for the update. I always look forward to seeing your new videos. I love the "show and tell" of your new Kennedy box! I'm kind of a tool junky so that was eye candy to me! I agree with your C.V. hypothesis, more than likely just a matter of time. But like you said hopefully it won't be too bad! Anyhow, best wishes! Dan @6-4 Fab
So, there's this designer, designing parts that can't be machined, and Peter's machining parts that can't be designed...
I choose to believe you're building a 1:100 scale ballistic missile submarine. Kidding aside I'm glad you're well and I'm having a whale of a time following your process with these parts.
Just wondering how you keep it all together with that many machining steps in one program... :o
Actually there’s seven programs for the whole part. One for each end and five to do the middle. The machine can’t hold the whole thing in it’s working memory. There is only about 2 megabytes of working memory.
when I was doing install and training for mitsubishi cnc machine tools, 75 % of customers could machine a more complex part than they could inspect and measure, customers required a cmm in the inspection room but it had 1/2 inch dust because no one could run it, they depended on the cnc to produce a good part
This is a subject I have been thinking of doing a video on. This is a very common mistake shops make.
@@EdgePrecision shops go bankrupt bidding parts they cant make or didnt check on tooling prices, had my own shop for 5 years hated small business now I have a mill and lathe in garage and machine for fun, its amazing how many shops cant fixture the part right
I used to have a set of those NuLine blocks, very nice blocks
Your getting up there in subs soon maybe mazak will give you a new Intergrets that be kool.. you own that shop or just work there?