@@WH250398 yea amt talking about pc. in fact if you enter tungle the cracked version of reainbow six siege and aliens colonial marines full players online. the main problem about rainbows six siege there is no map design for single player and ai enemys all same guys mostly. weapons also feels so big since the rainbow six vegas they fucked the size. ı mean the gun cosmetic attachment looks bigger than ammo clip wtf. the defalut game 28 gb ı think and cureetn game 55 someting wtf too.
@@MrStrangermoon you call 28 to 55 GB bloating the install size? Those are rookie numbers lol. Just look at the original Starcraft from Blizzard. The game was like 100 MB in 1998 and now after patches it is 15 GB while looking exactly the same (not talking about the remastered version).
This looks pretty cool, I just wish TVs would start integrating REAL 120 Hz more often instead of the lame motion interpolation and crap that they currently market as "120 Hz"
@@GruntKF LG C9 OLEDs have true 120hz output as well as Gsync compatibility with RTX 2XXX and GTX 16XX video cards. They also have HDMI 2.1 hdmi inputs, but there are no HDMI 2.1 devices yet.
Yeah, I noticed the impact 120/144hz had even on 30-60fps games when I upgraded my panel before I upgraded my PC ;p It was a small, but pleasant surprise. And if you turn off vsync, tearing will still look different depending on your refresh rate versus in-game framerate.
Great video. One other advantage of 120Hz is that HDMI transmission rate is tied to refresh, so a 120Hz signal will actually transmit twice as fast as 60Hz. That results in an 8.33ms improvement in display lag.
@@flyinhawaiiangc7310 playing any game at above 1080p is just stupid. it always hurts the framerate and response times. which is why the 4k arguement this generation is gone
I have a simple dream. I only want John, Tom and Alex to make a complete slow-motion technical analysis of Richard's hands movement and comment on the resolution, blur, ray-tracing, frame drops, tearing, latency, transparency and other effects his gestures create!
I had a 1080i capable CRT for my OG Xbox. It's actually the system that made me buy it. Honestly though, I bought it primarily for progressive scan 480p, but 720p and 1080i were a nice plus.
What Microsoft and Sony means when they are talking about 120Hz and 8K support is that the consoles will use HDMI 2.1 which theoretically supports framerates up to 120Hz at 4K and up to 60Hz at 8K. But there's no f.cking way that these consoles will run games like this - only 2D side scrollers at best. We've seen a jump from 480p to 576/720p from PS2 to PS3 (a 3x increase in overall resolution) and a 2x increase between PS3 and PS4 (from 720p to 1080p). There's no f*cking way that we'll see a 16x times increase under a span of one console generation (so from PS4's 1080p to PS5's 4320p, which is 8K). We will be lucky if we'll get native 4K. Also, 120Hz is very unlikely, most consoles games even have a problem achieving a solid 30FPS and those that run at 60 in reality run between 40-60.
I think we'll see shooters scale up to 120fps for sure. Halo Infinite, I'd bet money, will shoot for 120 fps on Series X but probably at 1080p. I think expecting 120fps at a lower resolution is very possible, but would never expect this for 1440p-4K.
4k 120 wont happen, 8k 60 wont happen. 1080p 120hz i hope would still be miles better than 4k60, i personally dont know a single person who games in 4k. Personally i think its rather dumb, once youve gamed at a high refresh rate you understand there is no going back lol and there isnt a way to make a console for 500$ than can achieve alk these things. Ya big navi is gonna be awesome and zen 2 cores are great but you cant stuff 1500$ in a hardware in a 500$ box. They will make some sacrifices and im excited to see what they can pull off
Yeah true. Even if these consoles could fully support I doubt game devs would start building games for 8K. One because of the huge budget increase they would need and two because really no one has a 8k tv or monitor to plays the content on
Great video. One of the minor details I've appreciated in the Xbox platform since day dot. Shame developers haven't taken more advantage of this in their titles, but looking forward to seeing them do so in the next wave of consoles.
Wow! Since Digital Foundry has the new setup, they are not only pumping out one video after another. But also showcasing multiple games at that, no problem!
Warm Soft Kitty appreciate your genuine concern. Sounds like I should have consulted you before buying my tv. Do you have any other advise you feel Is important you need to share in the UA-cam comment section? 700 hours of use and zero burn in, I don’t see it being an issue and if by chance it is..... Ill just go buy a new TV because, well I can. I’ll keep you posted at the one year mark because you seem so concerned with what I spend my money on.
Who Knows I hope not. But time will tell I guess. The intention I had when I picked the C9 was it supported the full HDMI 2.1 spec. I will find out Christmas 2020 when I pick up the new gen of consoles. Wish me luck!
Very interesting video, I got a little confused with the explanation however, using 1440p/120hz on the xbox reduces input lag but you also loose HDR, hopefully Microsoft would give us an update and add HDR support to other resolutions than just 4k.
JoelsterG4K ahhh so this explains why I cannot active HDR. My mon supports HDR10 but is a 1080p monitor. But would it not be the developers, and not MS that needs to enable hdr content on lower resolutions?
JoelsterG4K irs not like it’s true HDR anyways. You cannot experience true HDR on anything but reference monitors or Apple XDR display. TV HDR is just a fake gimmick
@@joshuamartinez970 Every TV is different, most of them do produce true HDR, they have the brightness, local dimming, the color space required for HDR and you can clearly see the improvement.
Yeah..we just didn't care. I guess because I started gaming on a NES and Sega Master System all the way to current gen, with a couple of janky PCs on the middle, I don't really mind low fps or low res, dont care about stutters or tears
@@astrocslopes863 No we've always cared. MS's Greenberg marketing machine just told you to think otherwise at the start of this gen to make a weakness into a positive with the Xbone's lower res games. For us nerds working in devops and sw deployment, seeing how creatively devs push boundaries with both sw and hw is one of the most incredible aspects about this amazing technical art form. Resolution isn't everything of course, but that does not at all mean it's nothing, doesn't matter, nor pointless. It's just as important as everything else in a game and chasing clean code and creative optimizations to deliver great resolutions (as well as other graphical elements for their time) have revolutionized gaming - and this BEST practice continues to do so. We've cared back then just like we do today.
@@ionseven speak for yourself. I sold my Vega 56, Ryzen 2600 PC and am happy playing Open Transport Tycoon and Dota 2 on my laptop's integrated graphics
Astroc Slopes yikes . I can agree gameplay is key and always fundamentally most important. I would say maintaining the ability to at least play newer titles in an industry that caters to high graphic standards is a desire I attempt to experience regularly
I’m using a c9, if you’ve got one try it for yourself with the game in performance mode. It’s likely the same reason he explains in the video with Wolfenstein, it’s an uncapped frame rate and it reduces stutter.
Adam Henningsen if you’re tv supports it go the settings on your Xbox then go to the icon that says “TV AND DISPLAY” click that and you should have a option to switch over from there
@@BadaBing420 I see it makes you go from 4k to 1080p.. is that only for gaming? Does that affect 4k movies being played thru the Xbox one x? Or Netflix 4k?
Adam Henningsen it effects everything so if you want to game at 120 then your gonna have to switch that mode. If you wanna watch movies at 4K your gonna have to switch it back in the settings
Wait until you hear from people saying the human eye cannot detect the difference of anything over 30hz! I tell them there is a lot of VR vomit to suggest otherwise.
Refresh rate is king. After spending years and years at 1080p I recently picked up a 27" 4k IPS display, and needless to say my expectations of what 4k would look like vs. reality was a major disappointment. 144hz 1440p is the way to go imo. There is nice improvement in sharpness between 1080 and 1440, but to be honest I'd rather game at 100+ hz at 1080 as long as the AA is good rather than 4k or 1440/60.
I play on 1440p/144Hz G-Sync/27"/ips for years and don't see a big reason to upgrade to 4k. Even when I upgrade my graphics card, I would still play on this monitor for a while, especially with Supersampling available. I agree on playing higher refrehsrate vs resolution, but it also depends highly on the games. A single player, maybe not that fast paced gameplay but high details just screams for 4k. Then around 60 fps/Hz are okay, I think of Batman games. On the other side, games like Counter Strike or Overwatch want higher refreshrates, in cost of resolution and image quality settings.
With a screen as small as 27'' sure even 720p is enough for the size. I own a 55'' tv and xbox one x and i can tell you that 4k its a must for the size.
The quality of the 4K panel matters a lot. I have a 1440p/144hz LG-GL850 next to a 4K/60 LG-UK650 and can tell the difference from the 1440p to the 4K easily, but the difference in frame rate leads to a much better experience on the GL850. But, compare either of these to my LG OLED and it's night and day. My 4K UK650 monitor looks like 1080p compared to the quality of that OLED. I think had you of bought a better 4K panel you would see the difference. But, framerate is king.
Even with a gtx 1080 I play at 60 FPS locked on most games. Only old, indie, or games on lower settings can run at a steady 120+ FPS. If you like competitive games than 144 makes sense. 4K 60 FPS is best for Narrative games. 1080/1440 120+FPS is best for Competitive games.
I thunk the 8K on the Series X is more for Media stuff like Netflix and Blue Ray movies 8K could get more of a standart during the nex gen lifecicle just like 4k is almost now a standart in this gen even tho 4k was just found when this gen started
Well what ever happens with 8k in the new consoles And media in the future I’m ready for it. I’ll be curious to see if I’ll get any use out of my 8k tv besides upscale in the years ahead
Or for low powered games that have lots of resources to spare. I wouldn't be surprised if some of those newly acquired studios have an option for higher res (8k) or higher frame rate.
I've used for Modern Warfare on my Sony xe930, it halves the input lag and gets rid of tearing while also stabilizing the fps. It's great for certain games but only at 1080 120.
One interesting thing about frame rate and input lag is that it also speeds up how quickly the input is read, not just how quickly it pushes out the result. So frame rate actually affects input lag at the front and tail end of the loop/cycle.
@Why Me As developer who's actually worked on entire graphics pipelines... I've known it for over a decade. It's the fact of how little others know about it... Hence "One interesting thing", not "What I just learned".
That only applies to games where the input processing is tied to the frame rate. If the input is polled at a different fixed rate, you only get a benefit from increased frame rates on the tail end of the cycle.
@@halofreak1990 that's very true, but those games tend to be designed so that moderate levels of input lag are not significantly impactful. Even Rockstar's games like RDR2, where it is tied to frame rate, the priority placed on smooth animation translation instead of instant response will show little practical improvement for the front end response time.
16:55 LG has added G-Sync Compatibility support over HDMI (because TVs don't use DisplayPort) which isn't the same as full-fledged G-Sync Ultimate support like in PC gaming monitors that use actual G-Sync modules inside.
@@AeonMW2 thank you. For me it is hard to see such differences, where only the newest Pioneers amps can easily support eARC, but direct hdmi connection is better, I see it in colours. Amp seems to be ready for it, but there will be always some losing in image quality. I'm just getting tired having two hdmi cables for atmos and not atmos games, where like to have both. I hope that for series X, they will place hdmi for video and sound separately like in new Sony BD players.
I use 120hz mode on my oneX exclusively when I play PubG. I have a Samsung TV with FreeSync Ultimate. I can't play PubG any other way now. It seems "slow" to put it plainly, to play the "old" way now.
@@BLINDCABBY ultimate allows for lower refreshes. normal Freesync screens work at 90fps to 120+fps, and Freesync ultimate supports framerates all the way down to 45fps. if the framerate falls below these (depending on what kind of display you use so either below 90 or below 45) the freesync feature will disable and run the screen at the maximum set refresh.
I'd love the option to run old OG Xbox games at native 8k, just for the sake of it. It will be interesting to see how much that closes the gap between Xbox and Xbox 360 on native hardware. Maybe some older games will look even better than others from 7th gen! The same goes for 360 games pushing 5k 60fps, that would definitely make them more enjoyable. Less likely, but still possible, would be to run Xbox One games @4k 120fps, which would require about 2X the power of an X1X and also a powerful cpu... we will see.
2:21 what are you talking about? I still own the original model 360 and not only does it output 1080p 60hz via component, it also outputs that resolution via VGA for all games. I have been using a VGA to HDMI converter with it for 14 years without any issues or lag. The only exception would be HD DVDs via component. I believe the highest res possible was 1080i, but via VGA you got full 1080p.
The VRR can be baked into HDMI 2.0b. You dont need 2.1 for VRR. The only real issue is 4K 120hz. Which if you are gamer like me, none of the games on Series X or PS5 will deliver that. Maybe a re-release of Pac Man. But i wouldnt expect to play Call of Duty 4K 120. So if your buying a TV just for gaming. 2.1 isnt really neccessary
I have an LG C7 and have been using the 120hz mode on it with OneX games that don't run at 4k. I think there's less input latency on games that can get a bit choppy like GTA, Bioshock, Dishonored and some back compat games like Crysis. There are some games that I hate to downgrade to1080p though, like Forza Horizon 4
You see a very very small decrease. Remember that High Refresh rates only have the full impact if the content itself is running at maximum + Refresh. So if you run a game that’s locked to 30 FPS on a 120/144/240 screen you won’t really see much change. Granted Xbox could have something up its sleeve but I’d be skeptical. So this is all based on PC experience.
Probably alot to ask, but does DF have a list of games that perform well on 120hz vs the games that perform better at lower Hz ? Myself running xbox one x, and 144hz 2560x1440p screen (Asus MG278Q). Should be well enough for series x right? 4k gaming isnt my Nr 1 priority.. FPS is more important and respons ofc
144hz 1440p screen and you aren’t using a pc? .... are you just using a xbox occasionally on same screen ? I think the 120hz mode if you are using a 144hz monitor will always be a better experience on the console but what it was showing it’s not enough difference to probably visually notice it .
@@joewayne9951 I had a high end gamin pc before. But I bought this screen to get the most out of xbox series x tbh. Might be getting a new high end gaming pc later on though... Either way, most gaming is atm on console (xbox one x), and when I play on console with this screen, the info on the screen reads, and console setup/settings: Monitor info reads: HDMI (OFC), 2560X1440 @ 120Hz Console is setup for: 1440p 120hz in settings
@@joewayne9951 not sure wich monitor "game visuals" are best to use for xbox on the other hand.. Can choose from: Scenery mode Racing mode Cinema mode RTS/RPG mode FPS mode sRGB Mode And to be honest I have no clue wich of these modes is best on the monitor. Or what each of the do.. I have tried searching as well :p Anyways, running the setup I am currently running, you think I'll come across the issues he talked about in the video ? If you think I might come across stuff like that with my settings, do you know if any of these "modes" would make any difference at all ? Thanks for your answer earlier btw ;)
Rule of thumb is you want games that are fast-paced, like Sekiro, to have higher frame rates so use higher Hertz rates on games like that. It helps with accuracy. Shooters, fast paced actions games, etc. Games that are slower and more narratively driven should be used with resolutions of 4k60 fps. Nothing can output more than 4k60 fps at the moment so something like 4k 120 fps does not exist because of bandwidth limitations. I play Devil May Cry 5 and Resident Evil 2 remake at 1440p 120 fps, while I play something like Ni No Kuni at 4k 60 fps.
@@beezusHrist I'm a far cry type of guy, CoD WW2, cod aw, rainbow six siege, wildlands, gta 5, dying light, and similar games. Only game I'm seemingly having weird moments with is far cry 5 (while looking around). Not sure what it's called, but when I look fast to the right, and back to the left (let's say I am looking at mountain tops), and I keep switching from left to right. It's almost as if I see x2-x3 mountain tops... does that make any sense at all. Not sure how to explain it. I need to be turning around kinda quick for it to happen. If I do it slowly, nothing happens. One of the reasons I bought the screen as well... just one of the reasons ;p hoped it would remove the "looking around issue" in far cry 5. Haven't really seen it in other games, on this monitor
Great video Rich. Something that should be noted though is Xbox One X's compatibility with monitors. More specifically, the ability to run 1440p @ 120hz. I myself have an LG 32GK850F and despite the fact it can do 1440p @120h the One X will only allow it to run at 60hz with 1440p. I can only enable 120hz if I run at 1080p. After doing a google search it would seem it's a common thing with many different monitors.
Last thing I want to see is the next gen console chasing higher pixels, I would rather they went for higher quality pixels then more of them like this gen did as it pushed me more towards PC gaming as at least there you can choose what resolution and visual settings. This gen of console has been too obsessed with higher resolution which is fine but only when the hardware is there and for 4k, it's not really, not natively anyway and I feel other areas in the games are suffering because of it.
Actually they have been pushing quality over quantity of pixels rather than resolution. For proof, look at the resolution most launch titles were running at on the original Xbox One. Some games were running as low as 900 and 720p. I wish they would finally get to 60fps instead of staying at 30, and I think it's reasonable to top out at 4K, but you'd probably see a mix between 2K and 4K. I think 8K gaming in anything more than basic graphical fidelity is unlikely though.
@@robertt9342 The Jaguar CPU Processors stopped them from hitting 60fps in alot of situations. Along with developers favoring better graphics than framerate on top of that.
Correct, 1080 'p' with 60Hz as well - not just 1080i via the VGA cable. I have the vanilla Xbox 360 and I bought that very cable at launch. It is just an upscale to 1080p for most games ofc, although Daytona USA renders at native 1080p and 60 fps via that cable on the vanilla 360.
I actually use this function. Bought the LG Oled B9 for that. I play everything in 120 Hz, the X sadly doesn't support 4k in combination but 1440p is more than satisfying to me. Games just look smoother overall. The B9 of course also is future proof with HDMI 2.1
I'm reminded of Dreamcast with its nearly universal VGA/480p support. The vast majority of titles are easily patched to make use of it, and most support out of the box. There was an 800x600 mode foreseen too, but not used. Although PS2 is hardly a system known for output quality, with green-tinted DVDs and excessive interlace flicker due to an error in flicker fixer circuit design, some games do support 480p, and Gran Turismo 4 is an outlier which even supports 1080i via component.
I'm curious about Black Frame Insertion now. Apparently, the CX OLED can do it at 120hz, whereas the C9 can only do it at 60hz. Just wondering what the difference in motion clarity is.
It's great, but requires a steady framerate to be useful, so nothing current gen consoles can output (since you also need a framerate of at least 60 fps to not have very visible annoying flickering), not sure if next gen will be able to push out such framerates either (if developers opt for eye candy over framerate yet again), let alone do any kind of low motion blur in conjunction with variable refresh rate.
@@Alexandra-ek7kh its not a gimmick if you have the performance to pull it off. It turns your flat screen into a CRT. I played an arcade game and seeing a sprite like pacman move on it I had forgotten just how smooth games used to look. Even at 144hz which was smooth but made lines shimmer just slightly he suddenly lost all motion blur. When they moved they were solid. Popped on Yoshis island and I hadn't seen an image move like that since Afterburner II in the cabinet.
@@Krystalmyth I wouldn't say it turns it into a CRT, sadly a whole bunch of processing is going on on a TV to make the image "better", causing ginormous input latency, "game mode" usually lowers this to ~20ms (only guaranteed at native resolution, again post processing will likely occur at lower resolution to resolve a "better" image from a lower resolution source) which is still pretty bad compared to a CRT (~0.1ms).
It would be amazing if the new gen console also supported DisplayPort. Because my mon only supports HDMI2.0 up to 120Hz, while DP support up to 144Hz. Feel like my mon can do so much more. Also, what would the recommended settings be for r6 siege on the Xbox one x? Do I enable vsync on my monitor during multiplayer games? And turn it off for terrorist hunt?
Thanks for the analysis. My feelings on this subject are somewhat mixed - I am happy that manufacturers are future-proofing their products, but at the same time I feel the developers are not doing enough to actually make use of the supported technologies. Even worse, developers seem to not care for optimizing their games before release - a trend that has gotten steadily worse over time, to the point where I am genuinely puzzled by some recent releases. I guess that's what you get when the day-one patch and the live-service models are now standardized, but even so, many such games NEVER get optimized. I would be very pleased if, in parallel with supporting new technologies, console manufacturers would set some kind of standard, such as Nintendo who I believe have VSync on as a requirement; I'd love it if 1080p 60fps would be the minimum requirements for next-gen consoles.
There is also the fact that many screens on the market have a lower input lag at higher frequency, independently of the lower input lag provider by higher frame-rates, due to image processing by the monitor. Samsung g7 for example with 9ms at 60Hz and 2,7ms at 240Hz. Not measured at 120Hz by i guess somewhere in between.
Richard, Richard, Richard... You're wrong about no 1080p on the 360 before the HDMI option was released. Using the DSUB-15 VGA cable you could 100% output in 1080p. This is the setup I used as my 61" Samsung HLS-6187W had a d-sub15 VGA input and I used this (along with the 360 VGA cable) with the 360 to output 1080p. As long as you were using that cable to output video, the menu on the 360 (the OG Blades variant no-less...) then gave you the option for 1080p output. I live in Canada so I can't attest for the European model of 360's (if there's even a difference) but the Original "fat" 60GB NA model (with the silver disc tray) absolutely, 100% without ANY doubt allowed for 1080p output. Please Richard... fix this error in your piece. Edit: As a matter of fact, the 360 using the Component cables could also output 1080p as long as your TV or receiver allowed for 1080p over Component. I also used this setup but stopped as soon as a got the VGA cable. The VGA picture was just much clearer... But still 1080p was available over component AND VGA... Look it up or better yet, try it for yourself. If you have a OG 360 there must be a way to clear the HDD so you can run the original OS... With a VGA cable or a decent set of Monster Component cables and a compliant TV or receiver you can prove this functionality for yourself.
Holy cow never knew original Xbox could do 720p with SOULCALIBUR II before 720p became a standard! I always knew it was powerful but holy cow that's impressive. Loved my original Xbox.
Hello Richard, do you guys receive suggestions for videos? Right now there's a big issue with the Destiny 2 community on consoles and PC and it would be nice a revisit on the topic, with the game being free to play and with a cross save feature since October 1st of last year, there's a lot of new players everyday having performance issues everywhere, and it would be nice to get a professional view on what's going on as Bungie doesn't talk about performance. On PC, no one knows what is going on with the engine, sometimes the game runs fine but has sunden massive drops to single digit fps, some configurations are hit with constant 100% CPU usage, sometimes the CPU is fine but then GPU usage never hits 100%, FPS is never constant. And also there's something going on with effects and lightning, they seem to being rendered at half the resolution like on consoles, causing shimmering even when playing on 4k resolution with FXAA or SMAA enabled. On consoles, it's general bad perfomance even on PS4 Pro and Xbox One X, on some big battles like final raid bosses the Xbox One X becomes unplayable.
I haven't seen any unplayable scenes I was just playing it last night. I've played anthem to and yes I just started playing it and haven't seen issues other than loading screen which is terrible. But these games have been playing greatly for me. I just started playing these cuz I heard the fuse and waited til all the patches were released. Haven't played my game Control yet or the star wars, but eventually I will...
Outputting 1440p120 is also advantageous for PC gamers with high refresh 1440p monitors. PS4 Pro cannot be set to 1440p so you're always dealing with upscaling from 1080p.
The smaller frametime fluctuations might explain why I don't find stutters and tearing as much of an annoyance on the 144Hz monitor I got last year, even though it doesn't have Gsync/Async. On my old 60Hz monitor I'd do whatever it took to keep performance stable, whether it was V-sync or using a game's frame limiter. But now I'll just leave everything unlocked, with maybe a 144fps cap if a game offers it. I just don't feel bothered by any of the tearing or stuttering at 144Hz. If I pay attention I can see them, but when I'm focused on the game they are just too minor to bother me.
As someone who only cares about PC gaming these days, I do love the direction being taken with Xbox. Ever so slowly they have been ironing out the discrepancies between console and PC gaming. It's still got a long way to go but if I'm correct in assuming that the Series X is indeed a 'series' of consoles of varying power/price targets, then they may very well have accelerated the process significantly. At the very least it should promote more foresight from developers when it comes to future-proofing their games. Gone should be the days where precise framerate caps are intrinsic to the behaviour of gameplay physics. Like even if they make a game that is too demanding for any console to run at 4K @ 120hz RIGHT NOW, their soon will be. Come to think of it, maybe say goodbye to low-effort rereleases too.
@@deadlyydude5522 Remember... the new Xbox releases late this year. New PC GPUs are supposed to be released this Summer, which is going to be more powerful than what these consoles can do. A 2080ti will see a big price drop before the new consoles come, and I'm willing to bet that the 3080 will easily beat it in value due to new added features and power. My advice to any gamer is to wait and see what happens because things might surprise you.
@@deadlyydude5522 Well Game Pass and a ton of Xbox games are already on PC and all Xbox games moving forward are going to be on PC. Plus, the plethora of PC exclusives and now PlayStation is putting their games on PC too. PC is literally going to have like 90% of all games lol. You can actually use your Xbox profile on your PC and all your stats and stuff carries over to PC. Plus mods, VR, better graphics, better fps, more games, free online, etc etc.
Are you sure that Xbox 360 was not able to output 1080p at launch? I frequently use 1080p output on my PS2 (enforced with GSM) to get progressive scan and nice integer scaling, so 1080p is not out of spec for component cables.
I am wondering about any potential FPS boost using the One X 120hz/1440p setting and matching it with PUBG 's 1440p mode? Anyone got any thoughts on that?
@@nighttimestalker I played around with it a bit, I noticed it was a more seamless experience. Especially looting, seemed to pick things up quicker and the inventory screen doesnt seem to "hang" like it does in the resolution priority mode. I am also running the game off an external SSD which helps things a good bit.
My LG C9 OLED supports 4K 120hz and VRR, so it’s for high end HDMI 2.1 TV’s, few exist now, but it’s awesome. Pure gaming TV. G Sync and 4K120, epic! If you don’t mind spending $2k for a 65 inch, the 55s aren’t bad though. Closer to $1k
@@Dr.WhetFarts it's what I can afford. Sorry, I don't have the money like you to throw into a brand new top end monitor like an AOC Agon AG352UCG6. 75hz is also well smooth when using AMD freesync. Plus the price was under £120 UK. I use it daily, i am delighted! I need people like you to pay 400 plus. It lowers the cost of other decent items!
Maybe we already do this, but to me is seems that, despite the fact that we're in the world of ubiquitous LCD's now, we're still working with old scanline-based technology. It seems we should be capable of determining and rendering only sub-pixel data which changes with a new frame, updating only the specific pixels that have changed, tracking movement and simply changing old render data to new sub-pixel elements based on direction of movement, needing to only render new edge data or altering the previously rendered sub-pixels based on a delta because of, e.g., a new lighting effect.
120hz 6 Teraflops 4k Games and Blu Ray playback with backwards compatibility makes Xbox One X the most powerful console there is! PS4 Pro at only 2k has left the chat
@@nickbrennan3925, 10 millions players are playing Sea Of Thieves today... And God of War?! How many players still playing this today?! 😏😏😏 You can left from the universe now... 👍😂✌
@@christiandyers6309 Still more titles than the PS4P. RDR2 is native 4k30, I believe Witcher 3 is 4k30 or 1080p~60. R6 Siege is 1800p60, Halo 5 is dynamic 4k60, Master Chief Collection is 4k60 with some games having dynamic res and others not. Still far more titles with higher resolutions than the PS4 Pro. If you're too ignorant to admit that more GPU power isn't gonna equal higher res and better visuals, then you just need to be quiet.
Refresh rate has been a big part of what holds a lot of games back in terms of visual presentation, if you haven't already you should get a 144Hz display and try it out yourself. I'm glad to see xbox aiming for a better refresh rate and allowing games to potentially display at 120FPS the way they should but I do worry that the console's hardware and the devs working on the games might not achieve this.
Yea because we totally have seen what Sony has to offer. I'll wait for both to be revealed, released and reviewed thoroughly before spending half a grand on a box that can only do one thing. I am interested in PS5 though mainly because of Sony IPs. But I will wait until it's out to see if there is a compelling reason to buy it.
The VRR range on most displays are 48 to 60/120 hz. Ideally a 20 to 60 hz range would be ideal for current gen consoles. Hopefully most games run a 60fps minimum or the VRR range improves.
As a PC enthusiast with an i9 9900KS and 2 RTX 2080 Ti ROG Strix in NVLINK, I’m excited for consoles! I plan on buying both Series X and PS5 for the exclusives and stick to my PC for the premium experience! But I don’t understand why gamers are sooo excited on console for the specs they have. I mean cmon guys! You can’t access them via BIOS so what’s the point in getting hyped for specs. That’s why I admire PC for full control of your system. Other than that I find console boring when it comes to customization due to the hardware being locked down soo tightly and no room to upgrade or OC or water cool in the future. I buy consoles for exclusives and that’s pretty much it! Also how are players going to get even close to that 120 FPS target at 1080p on XBSX and PS5 when TVs are only 60 Hz and you need to buy a monitor that can support it and most people just want to use there TVs and go from there.
Her exact words were "we're seeing framerates up to 120 frames per second." Not talking just about a 120Hz mode, but more so getting 120fps on that mode? That was my take on what she said. Also... hate to beat a dead horse but it's been a thing for a long time on one of the platforms... and higher... I love how they try to make everything sound so amazing and done first on consoles.
"Resolution and frame rates that we've never seen before, were looking at fram rates of up to 120fps" yeah we'll never see them cause we can only see up to 30fps, wow just trying to rip us off. (sarcasm btw)
Yep slot people rather take what they believe as the truth rather then what is actually scientifically true. The age of alternative facts and science denial is apon us. SAD!
16:36 - it's why everyone is going nuts and getting the LG C9 / X models this year. Having said that, I'm moving from my C8 to C9 this week. Might as well get a bigger size at 65" while I was at it.
@@AlexJasso100 The guy in the Microsoft footage talked about how 120hz is something "we've never seen before, like never seen before." 120 is ok, but that is as old as CRT monitors which can go further. ASUS just recently announced a 360hz G-Sync monitor.
@@tobydion3009 yes, but show me a gaming device that costs less than 1000 that can run games at medium/high graphics at 1080p 120fps? Maybe you could use a lower end gpu but you'd have to take down all your settings to barely reach 100. 120fps has never been seen before at this price range is what they should have said.
@@rickygforce4217 Maybe any of the Unreal Tournament games. I play games at 1080p 144hz normally, games that don't even take 30% of my GPU like Sundered (recently played game that came to mind). You can play simple games at crazy fps with a GTX 760. I'm sure they meant console, but the way he said it made it seem like it was some mind boggling thing that is only possible now.
I did that kind of test on my original Xbox. A lot of games supported 720p and few supported 1080p. Like crash nitro racing, which looked like a early Xbox 360 game. Wished I kept that HDMI adapter for the Xbox. It's becoming more expensive and harder to find nowadays.
Kind of mind-boggling when internal GPU buffers are taken into account for screen space reflections, shadows, dynamic lights, stencils, depth, HDRI, etc. The computer is literally processing way more than 120 fps.
0:15 OMFG thank you for putting that in, so tired of console people pretending PC doesnt win in everything they ever talk about. and LOL, i still love the 8k talk....ya Tetris will play at 8k at 20 fps
I had VGA cables for my 360 monitor support looked awesome (for the time) through them. Would be great to see a 'best TV's for next gen consoles' article. Is there any difference to them? What should I be looking out for when buying a new one? etc
9:45 .."It looks smoother, and it feels smoother because it IS smoother!"
16 times the detaillllllll
It it ain't smooth than it gets ruff ya dig?
@@MrStrangermoon best comment I've read today hahajahha
I knew it!
@@jordangenge6417 it just works
He's the David Attenborough of tech.
Rich’s hand motions are actually a complex code signaling the coordinates of our planet to extraterrestrials.
The Wichard Waggle
I would argue that his eyebrow movements are the most underrated thing of this generation.
It's just sign language for "Enough of that levity."
@@Frellyouall Yall crack me up with the memes. Love Digital Foundry
Extraterrestrials with ridiculuous beards!
You can actually test the unpatched version of Rainbow Six Siege on the X, Just install the disc while offline.
am still using cracked first version for lan party. the current game is like fortnite characters and uncessery maps and zomibes.
Are there offline modes that ran at 60 fps though?
@@WH250398 yea amt talking about pc. in fact if you enter tungle the cracked version of reainbow six siege and aliens colonial marines full players online. the main problem about rainbows six siege there is no map design for single player and ai enemys all same guys mostly. weapons also feels so big since the rainbow six vegas they fucked the size. ı mean the gun cosmetic attachment looks bigger than ammo clip wtf. the defalut game 28 gb ı think and cureetn game 55 someting wtf too.
Thank you god.
@@MrStrangermoon you call 28 to 55 GB bloating the install size? Those are rookie numbers lol. Just look at the original Starcraft from Blizzard. The game was like 100 MB in 1998 and now after patches it is 15 GB while looking exactly the same (not talking about the remastered version).
Digital Foundry and Rich are some of finest things you can experience in life.
DF IS Rich.
Wich*
Wichard IS DF
Yes
This looks pretty cool, I just wish TVs would start integrating REAL 120 Hz more often instead of the lame motion interpolation and crap that they currently market as "120 Hz"
Some do some don't, it's a mess 🙄
LG C9
The only manufacturer I can find with true 120 in Mexico is Vizio
My 2018 samsung qled is native 120hz at 1440p. Samsungs and lgs are really the best gaming tvs.
@@GruntKF LG C9 OLEDs have true 120hz output as well as Gsync compatibility with RTX 2XXX and GTX 16XX video cards. They also have HDMI 2.1 hdmi inputs, but there are no HDMI 2.1 devices yet.
Love the deep dive work you guys do!
Its what keeps us coming back
“Fans of the Crysis trilogy- AND AREN’T WE ALL”
You’re goddamn right
You are the first people who can explains me this setting.
You must be special. Not in a good way.
MadFinnTech Daaamn, chill neckbeard.
@@madfinntech
Compelling argument. You sure you're not the special one? In a bad way that is?
Yeah, I noticed the impact 120/144hz had even on 30-60fps games when I upgraded my panel before I upgraded my PC ;p It was a small, but pleasant surprise. And if you turn off vsync, tearing will still look different depending on your refresh rate versus in-game framerate.
Did you know Richard's hands run at 120fps when the rest of his body is at 60 fps ?
That's f*cking hilarious, you guys crack me up!
You should watch him on a vsync monitor, it's breathtaking.
Pretty sure that's just tearing
His eyes are 480 fps
Thank you so much! I posted a comment months back to see this revisited and see how it is now with newer titles! Thank you for the work.
Great video. One other advantage of 120Hz is that HDMI transmission rate is tied to refresh, so a 120Hz signal will actually transmit twice as fast as 60Hz. That results in an 8.33ms improvement in display lag.
Lifespan1000 so I’d benefit with 1080p 120hz on my one x playing modern warfare, over 1440p at 60hz? As far as multiplayer goes?
@@flyinhawaiiangc7310 yes
@@flyinhawaiiangc7310 ive recently gotten a 144hz monitor for games and its godlike compared to 60hz
@@turtleb7170 good
@@flyinhawaiiangc7310 playing any game at above 1080p is just stupid. it always hurts the framerate and response times. which is why the 4k arguement this generation is gone
I have a simple dream. I only want John, Tom and Alex to make a complete slow-motion technical analysis of Richard's hands movement and comment on the resolution, blur, ray-tracing, frame drops, tearing, latency, transparency and other effects his gestures create!
A 1 million subs celebration! Make it happen DF.
I had a 1080i capable CRT for my OG Xbox. It's actually the system that made me buy it. Honestly though, I bought it primarily for progressive scan 480p, but 720p and 1080i were a nice plus.
What Microsoft and Sony means when they are talking about 120Hz and 8K support is that the consoles will use HDMI 2.1 which theoretically supports framerates up to 120Hz at 4K and up to 60Hz at 8K. But there's no f.cking way that these consoles will run games like this - only 2D side scrollers at best. We've seen a jump from 480p to 576/720p from PS2 to PS3 (a 3x increase in overall resolution) and a 2x increase between PS3 and PS4 (from 720p to 1080p). There's no f*cking way that we'll see a 16x times increase under a span of one console generation (so from PS4's 1080p to PS5's 4320p, which is 8K). We will be lucky if we'll get native 4K. Also, 120Hz is very unlikely, most consoles games even have a problem achieving a solid 30FPS and those that run at 60 in reality run between 40-60.
I think we'll see shooters scale up to 120fps for sure. Halo Infinite, I'd bet money, will shoot for 120 fps on Series X but probably at 1080p. I think expecting 120fps at a lower resolution is very possible, but would never expect this for 1440p-4K.
4k 120 wont happen, 8k 60 wont happen. 1080p 120hz i hope would still be miles better than 4k60, i personally dont know a single person who games in 4k. Personally i think its rather dumb, once youve gamed at a high refresh rate you understand there is no going back lol and there isnt a way to make a console for 500$ than can achieve alk these things. Ya big navi is gonna be awesome and zen 2 cores are great but you cant stuff 1500$ in a hardware in a 500$ box. They will make some sacrifices and im excited to see what they can pull off
Yeah true. Even if these consoles could fully support I doubt game devs would start building games for 8K. One because of the huge budget increase they would need and two because really no one has a 8k tv or monitor to plays the content on
Koncz Dávid they don’t mean games will be playable in 8k just media stuff like UA-cam
Lol you delusional to think consoles next gen will do anywhere near 8k 60 lol
Great video. One of the minor details I've appreciated in the Xbox platform since day dot. Shame developers haven't taken more advantage of this in their titles, but looking forward to seeing them do so in the next wave of consoles.
Wow! Since Digital Foundry has the new setup, they are not only pumping out one video after another. But also showcasing multiple games at that, no problem!
It’s almost like you knew I spent most of my weekend googling, trying to figure out the benefits of 120hz and VRR for my 77” C9... spot on timing.
Does it work well?
Warm Soft Kitty. Ya I can’t wait. I only bought it for the burn in and games. 🙄
Warm Soft Kitty appreciate your genuine concern. Sounds like I should have consulted you before buying my tv. Do you have any other advise you feel Is important you need to share in the UA-cam comment section? 700 hours of use and zero burn in, I don’t see it being an issue and if by chance it is..... Ill just go buy a new TV because, well I can. I’ll keep you posted at the one year mark because you seem so concerned with what I spend my money on.
C9 great tv but could have problems with AMD stuff regarding vrr.
Who Knows I hope not. But time will tell I guess. The intention I had when I picked the C9 was it supported the full HDMI 2.1 spec. I will find out Christmas 2020 when I pick up the new gen of consoles. Wish me luck!
I’ve got an LG C9 with 120hz / hdmi 2.1 and I got excited thinking you were going to highlight some X1X games that supported it even if over hdmi 2.0
Same tho...
Same here
not a single game will be 120fps
@@bonjovi7399 Let me dream :,(
Very interesting video, I got a little confused with the explanation however, using 1440p/120hz on the xbox reduces input lag but you also loose HDR, hopefully Microsoft would give us an update and add HDR support to other resolutions than just 4k.
JoelsterG4K ahhh so this explains why I cannot active HDR. My mon supports HDR10 but is a 1080p monitor. But would it not be the developers, and not MS that needs to enable hdr content on lower resolutions?
@@granwillestrauss2963 Yes it is up to MS to enable the 1X to allow HDR on lower resolutions, the PS4 does support it.
JoelsterG4K irs not like it’s true HDR anyways. You cannot experience true HDR on anything but reference monitors or Apple XDR display. TV HDR is just a fake gimmick
@@joshuamartinez970 Every TV is different, most of them do produce true HDR, they have the brightness, local dimming, the color space required for HDR and you can clearly see the improvement.
@@joshuamartinez970 whatever dude :) nobody cares
I remember when i was playing Soul Calibur 2 and Tony Hawk 3. I didnt give a shit about resolution back then and just enjoyed the games...
Yeah..we just didn't care. I guess because I started gaming on a NES and Sega Master System all the way to current gen, with a couple of janky PCs on the middle, I don't really mind low fps or low res, dont care about stutters or tears
Astroc Slopes sounds pathetic .
@@astrocslopes863 No we've always cared. MS's Greenberg marketing machine just told you to think otherwise at the start of this gen to make a weakness into a positive with the Xbone's lower res games. For us nerds working in devops and sw deployment, seeing how creatively devs push boundaries with both sw and hw is one of the most incredible aspects about this amazing technical art form. Resolution isn't everything of course, but that does not at all mean it's nothing, doesn't matter, nor pointless. It's just as important as everything else in a game and chasing clean code and creative optimizations to deliver great resolutions (as well as other graphical elements for their time) have revolutionized gaming - and this BEST practice continues to do so. We've cared back then just like we do today.
@@ionseven speak for yourself. I sold my Vega 56, Ryzen 2600 PC and am happy playing Open Transport Tycoon and Dota 2 on my laptop's integrated graphics
Astroc Slopes yikes . I can agree gameplay is key and always fundamentally most important. I would say maintaining the ability to at least play newer titles in an industry that caters to high graphic standards is a desire I attempt to experience regularly
A patch for geometry wars to run at a sustained 120Hz? Surely the Xbox One S or VCR could handle that? That would be amaze-balls.
I found borderlands 3 in 1440p 120hz felt a lot smoother, like night and day smoother. Be interesting to see that analysis.
jaffaman99 I think you were high
@Awakened Virtue please delete your comment
I’m using a c9, if you’ve got one try it for yourself with the game in performance mode. It’s likely the same reason he explains in the video with Wolfenstein, it’s an uncapped frame rate and it reduces stutter.
It's nice on pubg
@@monarchu Someone doesnt know what a joke is...
I switch over to 120 when ever I play rock band 4 drums
How do u switch to 120??
Adam Henningsen if you’re tv supports it go the settings on your Xbox then go to the icon that says “TV AND DISPLAY” click that and you should have a option to switch over from there
@@BadaBing420 I see it makes you go from 4k to 1080p.. is that only for gaming? Does that affect 4k movies being played thru the Xbox one x? Or Netflix 4k?
Adam Henningsen it effects everything so if you want to game at 120 then your gonna have to switch that mode. If you wanna watch movies at 4K your gonna have to switch it back in the settings
@@BadaBing420 balls. That sucks. Thanks for the help!
I feel like i just talked to the architect in the matrix
Well, technically...
*🤯*
I was arguing with someone that said 120hz does absolutely nothing so I’m actually happy this video came out conveniently lol
One thing is for sure, you can't bullshit the Rich.
Wait until you hear from people saying the human eye cannot detect the difference of anything over 30hz! I tell them there is a lot of VR vomit to suggest otherwise.
@RS1 You need to use high fps glasses. ; )
hi it me can i buy some weed mayne
@WOGBOY How stupid do you actually feel?? Lmao
Refresh rate is king. After spending years and years at 1080p I recently picked up a 27" 4k IPS display, and needless to say my expectations of what 4k would look like vs. reality was a major disappointment. 144hz 1440p is the way to go imo. There is nice improvement in sharpness between 1080 and 1440, but to be honest I'd rather game at 100+ hz at 1080 as long as the AA is good rather than 4k or 1440/60.
I play on 1440p/144Hz G-Sync/27"/ips for years and don't see a big reason to upgrade to 4k. Even when I upgrade my graphics card, I would still play on this monitor for a while, especially with Supersampling available. I agree on playing higher refrehsrate vs resolution, but it also depends highly on the games. A single player, maybe not that fast paced gameplay but high details just screams for 4k. Then around 60 fps/Hz are okay, I think of Batman games. On the other side, games like Counter Strike or Overwatch want higher refreshrates, in cost of resolution and image quality settings.
With a screen as small as 27'' sure even 720p is enough for the size. I own a 55'' tv and xbox one x and i can tell you that 4k its a must for the size.
The quality of the 4K panel matters a lot. I have a 1440p/144hz LG-GL850 next to a 4K/60 LG-UK650 and can tell the difference from the 1440p to the 4K easily, but the difference in frame rate leads to a much better experience on the GL850. But, compare either of these to my LG OLED and it's night and day. My 4K UK650 monitor looks like 1080p compared to the quality of that OLED. I think had you of bought a better 4K panel you would see the difference. But, framerate is king.
Even with a gtx 1080 I play at 60 FPS locked on most games. Only old, indie, or games on lower settings can run at a steady 120+ FPS. If you like competitive games than 144 makes sense. 4K 60 FPS is best for Narrative games. 1080/1440 120+FPS is best for Competitive games.
Theres no reason to upgrade to 4k unless you have like dual 2080tis lol. 1440p 144-165hz is the gaming sweet spot
I thunk the 8K on the Series X is more for Media stuff like Netflix and Blue Ray movies 8K could get more of a standart during the nex gen lifecicle just like 4k is almost now a standart in this gen even tho 4k was just found when this gen started
Standard. Life cycle. Your welcome!
Well english ain't my naitive language so yeah thanks
Well what ever happens with 8k in the new consoles And media in the future I’m ready for it. I’ll be curious to see if I’ll get any use out of my 8k tv besides upscale in the years ahead
Or for low powered games that have lots of resources to spare. I wouldn't be surprised if some of those newly acquired studios have an option for higher res (8k) or higher frame rate.
Actually, you can currently game in 8K, but in terms of other forms of 8K media, virtually nothing.
My gaming laptop has a 120Hz display. Right now it's mostly older games that hit that mark, but I do find that input lag is reduced noticeably.
I think that 120fps besides multiplayer shooters is overkill.
Wow I didn't know you could do 120 hz on Xbox one I should try it.
BTW great work as always 😉
I take it you don't follow much gaming news at all?
120Hz support is old news.
120 Hz kinda useless runing games in 30 fps or 60
@@PSYCHOV3N0M on pc maybe but on Xbox I didn't know you could use a 120hz monitor.
@@dusty_reaper96 I agree.
I've used for Modern Warfare on my Sony xe930, it halves the input lag and gets rid of tearing while also stabilizing the fps. It's great for certain games but only at 1080 120.
One interesting thing about frame rate and input lag is that it also speeds up how quickly the input is read, not just how quickly it pushes out the result. So frame rate actually affects input lag at the front and tail end of the loop/cycle.
@Why Me As developer who's actually worked on entire graphics pipelines... I've known it for over a decade. It's the fact of how little others know about it... Hence "One interesting thing", not "What I just learned".
That only applies to games where the input processing is tied to the frame rate. If the input is polled at a different fixed rate, you only get a benefit from increased frame rates on the tail end of the cycle.
@@halofreak1990 that's very true, but those games tend to be designed so that moderate levels of input lag are not significantly impactful. Even Rockstar's games like RDR2, where it is tied to frame rate, the priority placed on smooth animation translation instead of instant response will show little practical improvement for the front end response time.
@@Akrymir Rockstar games FEEL SO DATED 💩💩💩💩
There is a benefit to 120hz, reduced input lag.. Especially in fighting games..
yup
Give it a couple years high refresh rate will be a real thing on console
@@anthonyfong8098 *decades
ResonatingRaptorid65 except that it’s been confirmed that next gen consoles will have 120hz support
@@ultimatebugman8846 Emphasis on support. Implementation will be highly unlikely
16:55 LG has added G-Sync Compatibility support over HDMI (because TVs don't use DisplayPort) which isn't the same as full-fledged G-Sync Ultimate support like in PC gaming monitors that use actual G-Sync modules inside.
Well, it works for Samsung Qled series, worth wonderful game mode, but still not available using amplituner hdmi, even if has 2.2 access
it's still fine tho, you just get less VRR range. just do not drop below 40 fps and you're good :)
@@AeonMW2 thank you. For me it is hard to see such differences, where only the newest Pioneers amps can easily support eARC, but direct hdmi connection is better, I see it in colours. Amp seems to be ready for it, but there will be always some losing in image quality. I'm just getting tired having two hdmi cables for atmos and not atmos games, where like to have both. I hope that for series X, they will place hdmi for video and sound separately like in new Sony BD players.
Are you sure it's hdmi. Because I don't think any nvidia gpu can output gsync over hdmi. Wouldn't LG oleds have a display port fitted instead?
@@corsairsloop3234 yes it is hdmi
17:52 "We have a bell there..." lol
I use 120hz mode on my oneX exclusively when I play PubG. I have a Samsung TV with FreeSync Ultimate. I can't play PubG any other way now. It seems "slow" to put it plainly, to play the "old" way now.
What monitor do you have ?
Me to pubg 1440p 120hz on the q70r turned off 4k and hdr and it looks Awesome And responsive
Sean R freesync ultimate sounds like marketing bs, what’s beyond freesync ?
@@BLINDCABBY ultimate allows for lower refreshes. normal Freesync screens work at 90fps to 120+fps, and Freesync ultimate supports framerates all the way down to 45fps.
if the framerate falls below these (depending on what kind of display you use so either below 90 or below 45) the freesync feature will disable and run the screen at the maximum set refresh.
I have a Samsung and ultimate freesync makes a big difference
Been waiting so long for a video that explains this. Always wondered why the Xbox had an option for 120Hz.
I'd love the option to run old OG Xbox games at native 8k, just for the sake of it. It will be interesting to see how much that closes the gap between Xbox and Xbox 360 on native hardware. Maybe some older games will look even better than others from 7th gen! The same goes for 360 games pushing 5k 60fps, that would definitely make them more enjoyable.
Less likely, but still possible, would be to run Xbox One games @4k 120fps, which would require about 2X the power of an X1X and also a powerful cpu... we will see.
Wichard is the man! ❤️
2:21 what are you talking about? I still own the original model 360 and not only does it output 1080p 60hz via component, it also outputs that resolution via VGA for all games. I have been using a VGA to HDMI converter with it for 14 years without any issues or lag.
The only exception would be HD DVDs via component. I believe the highest res possible was 1080i, but via VGA you got full 1080p.
The original, non-HDMI Xbox 360 could do 1080p60 over component cables (YPbPr) and VGA (RGB). I was able to use both on my plasma TV at the time.
The VRR can be baked into HDMI 2.0b. You dont need 2.1 for VRR. The only real issue is 4K 120hz. Which if you are gamer like me, none of the games on Series X or PS5 will deliver that. Maybe a re-release of Pac Man. But i wouldnt expect to play Call of Duty 4K 120. So if your buying a TV just for gaming. 2.1 isnt really neccessary
One of the best DF videos. Rich at the top of his game as always.
I have an LG C7 and have been using the 120hz mode on it with OneX games that don't run at 4k. I think there's less input latency on games that can get a bit choppy like GTA, Bioshock, Dishonored and some back compat games like Crysis. There are some games that I hate to downgrade to1080p though, like Forza Horizon 4
I wonder if this will reduce input lag in classic games.
It should
Too bad most people with a console don’t have a vrr or 120hz display
You see a very very small decrease. Remember that High Refresh rates only have the full impact if the content itself is running at maximum + Refresh. So if you run a game that’s locked to 30 FPS on a 120/144/240 screen you won’t really see much change. Granted Xbox could have something up its sleeve but I’d be skeptical. So this is all based on PC experience.
@@willy541000 144hz monitors are more affordable nowadays
@@Rohgamu monitors. People are playing on their big 4k TV, still not supporting 120hz
We've NEVER SEEN THESE RESOLUTIONS AND FRAME RATES BEFORE!!!
@Rich Scales "4k"
@Rich Scales btw if you think you've seen real 4k on a console you might wanna read up about how that is a lie lol
Probably alot to ask, but does DF have a list of games that perform well on 120hz vs the games that perform better at lower Hz ?
Myself running xbox one x, and 144hz 2560x1440p screen (Asus MG278Q). Should be well enough for series x right? 4k gaming isnt my Nr 1 priority.. FPS is more important and respons ofc
144hz 1440p screen and you aren’t using a pc? .... are you just using a xbox occasionally on same screen ? I think the 120hz mode if you are using a 144hz monitor will always be a better experience on the console but what it was showing it’s not enough difference to probably visually notice it .
@@joewayne9951 I had a high end gamin pc before. But I bought this screen to get the most out of xbox series x tbh. Might be getting a new high end gaming pc later on though...
Either way, most gaming is atm on console (xbox one x), and when I play on console with this screen, the info on the screen reads, and console setup/settings:
Monitor info reads:
HDMI (OFC), 2560X1440 @ 120Hz
Console is setup for:
1440p 120hz in settings
@@joewayne9951 not sure wich monitor "game visuals" are best to use for xbox on the other hand..
Can choose from:
Scenery mode
Racing mode
Cinema mode
RTS/RPG mode
FPS mode
sRGB Mode
And to be honest I have no clue wich of these modes is best on the monitor. Or what each of the do.. I have tried searching as well :p
Anyways, running the setup I am currently running, you think I'll come across the issues he talked about in the video ? If you think I might come across stuff like that with my settings, do you know if any of these "modes" would make any difference at all ? Thanks for your answer earlier btw ;)
Rule of thumb is you want games that are fast-paced, like Sekiro, to have higher frame rates so use higher Hertz rates on games like that. It helps with accuracy. Shooters, fast paced actions games, etc.
Games that are slower and more narratively driven should be used with resolutions of 4k60 fps. Nothing can output more than 4k60 fps at the moment so something like 4k 120 fps does not exist because of bandwidth limitations.
I play Devil May Cry 5 and Resident Evil 2 remake at 1440p 120 fps, while I play something like Ni No Kuni at 4k 60 fps.
@@beezusHrist I'm a far cry type of guy, CoD WW2, cod aw, rainbow six siege, wildlands, gta 5, dying light, and similar games.
Only game I'm seemingly having weird moments with is far cry 5 (while looking around). Not sure what it's called, but when I look fast to the right, and back to the left (let's say I am looking at mountain tops), and I keep switching from left to right.
It's almost as if I see x2-x3 mountain tops... does that make any sense at all. Not sure how to explain it.
I need to be turning around kinda quick for it to happen. If I do it slowly, nothing happens.
One of the reasons I bought the screen as well... just one of the reasons ;p hoped it would remove the "looking around issue" in far cry 5. Haven't really seen it in other games, on this monitor
Background music:
Bjørn Lynne - Over Distant Shores
The best quality pixels anyone has ever seen.
Great video Rich. Something that should be noted though is Xbox One X's compatibility with monitors. More specifically, the ability to run 1440p @ 120hz. I myself have an LG 32GK850F and despite the fact it can do 1440p @120h the One X will only allow it to run at 60hz with 1440p. I can only enable 120hz if I run at 1080p. After doing a google search it would seem it's a common thing with many different monitors.
Last thing I want to see is the next gen console chasing higher pixels, I would rather they went for higher quality pixels then more of them like this gen did as it pushed me more towards PC gaming as at least there you can choose what resolution and visual settings.
This gen of console has been too obsessed with higher resolution which is fine but only when the hardware is there and for 4k, it's not really, not natively anyway and I feel other areas in the games are suffering because of it.
Nerd
Actually they have been pushing quality over quantity of pixels rather than resolution. For proof, look at the resolution most launch titles were running at on the original Xbox One. Some games were running as low as 900 and 720p.
I wish they would finally get to 60fps instead of staying at 30, and I think it's reasonable to top out at 4K, but you'd probably see a mix between 2K and 4K. I think 8K gaming in anything more than basic graphical fidelity is unlikely though.
@@robertt9342 The Jaguar CPU Processors stopped them from hitting 60fps in alot of situations. Along with developers favoring better graphics than framerate on top of that.
There is no such thing as "higher quality pixels". Stop quoting that cringeworthy Xbox One X reveal trailer.
I just want 120 FPS to be in a 1080p game. Turn off the other stuff i needed to get me there. Fr.
2:20 The Xbox 360 launch system could output 1920x1080 via the VGA cable.
Correct, 1080 'p' with 60Hz as well - not just 1080i via the VGA cable.
I have the vanilla Xbox 360 and I bought that very cable at launch.
It is just an upscale to 1080p for most games ofc, although Daytona USA renders at native 1080p and 60 fps via that cable on the vanilla 360.
I actually use this function. Bought the LG Oled B9 for that. I play everything in 120 Hz, the X sadly doesn't support 4k in combination but 1440p is more than satisfying to me. Games just look smoother overall. The B9 of course also is future proof with HDMI 2.1
Almost every 4k tv supports HDMI 2.1
I'm reminded of Dreamcast with its nearly universal VGA/480p support. The vast majority of titles are easily patched to make use of it, and most support out of the box. There was an 800x600 mode foreseen too, but not used.
Although PS2 is hardly a system known for output quality, with green-tinted DVDs and excessive interlace flicker due to an error in flicker fixer circuit design, some games do support 480p, and Gran Turismo 4 is an outlier which even supports 1080i via component.
"It varies from title to title" welcome to the PC gaming world and -sync.
Can you guys please include 120/1440p mode in your next game performance analysis video?
I'm curious about Black Frame Insertion now. Apparently, the CX OLED can do it at 120hz, whereas the C9 can only do it at 60hz. Just wondering what the difference in motion clarity is.
It's great, but requires a steady framerate to be useful, so nothing current gen consoles can output (since you also need a framerate of at least 60 fps to not have very visible annoying flickering), not sure if next gen will be able to push out such framerates either (if developers opt for eye candy over framerate yet again), let alone do any kind of low motion blur in conjunction with variable refresh rate.
What's the point in having black frame insertion under 120fps? It would look terrible.
@@Alexandra-ek7kh its not a gimmick if you have the performance to pull it off. It turns your flat screen into a CRT. I played an arcade game and seeing a sprite like pacman move on it I had forgotten just how smooth games used to look. Even at 144hz which was smooth but made lines shimmer just slightly he suddenly lost all motion blur. When they moved they were solid. Popped on Yoshis island and I hadn't seen an image move like that since Afterburner II in the cabinet.
@@Krystalmyth I wouldn't say it turns it into a CRT, sadly a whole bunch of processing is going on on a TV to make the image "better", causing ginormous input latency, "game mode" usually lowers this to ~20ms (only guaranteed at native resolution, again post processing will likely occur at lower resolution to resolve a "better" image from a lower resolution source) which is still pretty bad compared to a CRT (~0.1ms).
I had a friend who hooked his 360 to a 720p TV and set his console to output 1080i. After 15 minutes I gave up trying to explain it to him.
It would be amazing if the new gen console also supported DisplayPort. Because my mon only supports HDMI2.0 up to 120Hz, while DP support up to 144Hz. Feel like my mon can do so much more.
Also, what would the recommended settings be for r6 siege on the Xbox one x? Do I enable vsync on my monitor during multiplayer games? And turn it off for terrorist hunt?
Warm Soft Kitty what do you mean? The Xbox one X supports vsync
Thanks for the analysis. My feelings on this subject are somewhat mixed - I am happy that manufacturers are future-proofing their products, but at the same time I feel the developers are not doing enough to actually make use of the supported technologies. Even worse, developers seem to not care for optimizing their games before release - a trend that has gotten steadily worse over time, to the point where I am genuinely puzzled by some recent releases. I guess that's what you get when the day-one patch and the live-service models are now standardized, but even so, many such games NEVER get optimized.
I would be very pleased if, in parallel with supporting new technologies, console manufacturers would set some kind of standard, such as Nintendo who I believe have VSync on as a requirement; I'd love it if 1080p 60fps would be the minimum requirements for next-gen consoles.
Psycho seems impressed by your hand-eye coordinations.
There is also the fact that many screens on the market have a lower input lag at higher frequency, independently of the lower input lag provider by higher frame-rates, due to image processing by the monitor. Samsung g7 for example with 9ms at 60Hz and 2,7ms at 240Hz. Not measured at 120Hz by i guess somewhere in between.
Richard, Richard, Richard... You're wrong about no 1080p on the 360 before the HDMI option was released. Using the DSUB-15 VGA cable you could 100% output in 1080p. This is the setup I used as my 61" Samsung HLS-6187W had a d-sub15 VGA input and I used this (along with the 360 VGA cable) with the 360 to output 1080p. As long as you were using that cable to output video, the menu on the 360 (the OG Blades variant no-less...) then gave you the option for 1080p output. I live in Canada so I can't attest for the European model of 360's (if there's even a difference) but the Original "fat" 60GB NA model (with the silver disc tray) absolutely, 100% without ANY doubt allowed for 1080p output. Please Richard... fix this error in your piece.
Edit: As a matter of fact, the 360 using the Component cables could also output 1080p as long as your TV or receiver allowed for 1080p over Component. I also used this setup but stopped as soon as a got the VGA cable. The VGA picture was just much clearer... But still 1080p was available over component AND VGA... Look it up or better yet, try it for yourself. If you have a OG 360 there must be a way to clear the HDD so you can run the original OS... With a VGA cable or a decent set of Monster Component cables and a compliant TV or receiver you can prove this functionality for yourself.
Holy cow never knew original Xbox could do 720p with SOULCALIBUR II before 720p became a standard! I always knew it was powerful but holy cow that's impressive. Loved my original Xbox.
Hopefully the new Xbox would be backwards compatible. So far enjoying my one S.
Xbox Series X will be compatible with Xbox one, 360 and the original xbox.
Its all forward and backward compatible all ur hardware now will work on the new one and the new hardware like controllers will work both ways.
I noticed this improvement at kingdom come deliverance, it is so much smoother
Hello Richard, do you guys receive suggestions for videos?
Right now there's a big issue with the Destiny 2 community on consoles and PC and it would be nice a revisit on the topic, with the game being free to play and with a cross save feature since October 1st of last year, there's a lot of new players everyday having performance issues everywhere, and it would be nice to get a professional view on what's going on as Bungie doesn't talk about performance.
On PC, no one knows what is going on with the engine, sometimes the game runs fine but has sunden massive drops to single digit fps, some configurations are hit with constant 100% CPU usage, sometimes the CPU is fine but then GPU usage never hits 100%, FPS is never constant. And also there's something going on with effects and lightning, they seem to being rendered at half the resolution like on consoles, causing shimmering even when playing on 4k resolution with FXAA or SMAA enabled.
On consoles, it's general bad perfomance even on PS4 Pro and Xbox One X, on some big battles like final raid bosses the Xbox One X becomes unplayable.
I haven't seen any unplayable scenes I was just playing it last night.
I've played anthem to and yes I just started playing it and haven't seen issues other than loading screen which is terrible. But these games have been playing greatly for me. I just started playing these cuz I heard the fuse and waited til all the patches were released. Haven't played my game Control yet or the star wars, but eventually I will...
I never thought I needed higher frame rates until watching this video
Thank you for this video!! I was wondering if the 120hz mode did anything
Me to! I was thinking the games don't run anyway in 120FPS so why set to 120Hz?
Sascha Habanero I have a 1080p 120hz freesync monitor that I play with my one X on all the time and always wondered if I was getting anything lol
I think developers fully utilized past systems better than they do in today's systems!
Give me native 4k 60fps + 1440 120fps option for $500 and count me in.
Definitely possible if they will use a mix of medium and high settings. Not even a 2080 Ti can do 4k60 1440/120 at ultra on all modern games
@@00kayem consoles always use something between low-medium. That will be fine for me if cost $500.
@@DiegoCobain makes sense indeed. I'm good with that too but I'll still keep my gaming pc
@@DiegoCobain X uses med high on red dead 2 at 4k
You're setting your expectations to high. It possible, but wouldn't allow for games to have better graphics, only better resolution.
Outputting 1440p120 is also advantageous for PC gamers with high refresh 1440p monitors. PS4 Pro cannot be set to 1440p so you're always dealing with upscaling from 1080p.
9:45 after applying lube
The smaller frametime fluctuations might explain why I don't find stutters and tearing as much of an annoyance on the 144Hz monitor I got last year, even though it doesn't have Gsync/Async. On my old 60Hz monitor I'd do whatever it took to keep performance stable, whether it was V-sync or using a game's frame limiter. But now I'll just leave everything unlocked, with maybe a 144fps cap if a game offers it. I just don't feel bothered by any of the tearing or stuttering at 144Hz. If I pay attention I can see them, but when I'm focused on the game they are just too minor to bother me.
As someone who only cares about PC gaming these days, I do love the direction being taken with Xbox. Ever so slowly they have been ironing out the discrepancies between console and PC gaming. It's still got a long way to go but if I'm correct in assuming that the Series X is indeed a 'series' of consoles of varying power/price targets, then they may very well have accelerated the process significantly.
At the very least it should promote more foresight from developers when it comes to future-proofing their games. Gone should be the days where precise framerate caps are intrinsic to the behaviour of gameplay physics. Like even if they make a game that is too demanding for any console to run at 4K @ 120hz RIGHT NOW, their soon will be. Come to think of it, maybe say goodbye to low-effort rereleases too.
@@deadlyydude5522 That would be cool. But owning an Xbox when all of the games and more are on PC makes it a worthless purchase imo
@@deadlyydude5522 Oh did Microsoft already announce the price of the new Xbox? Must be pretty cheap then
@@deadlyydude5522 Remember... the new Xbox releases late this year. New PC GPUs are supposed to be released this Summer, which is going to be more powerful than what these consoles can do. A 2080ti will see a big price drop before the new consoles come, and I'm willing to bet that the 3080 will easily beat it in value due to new added features and power. My advice to any gamer is to wait and see what happens because things might surprise you.
@@deadlyydude5522 Well Game Pass and a ton of Xbox games are already on PC and all Xbox games moving forward are going to be on PC. Plus, the plethora of PC exclusives and now PlayStation is putting their games on PC too. PC is literally going to have like 90% of all games lol.
You can actually use your Xbox profile on your PC and all your stats and stuff carries over to PC. Plus mods, VR, better graphics, better fps, more games, free online, etc etc.
Are you sure that Xbox 360 was not able to output 1080p at launch?
I frequently use 1080p output on my PS2 (enforced with GSM) to get progressive scan and nice integer scaling, so 1080p is not out of spec for component cables.
I am wondering about any potential FPS boost using the One X 120hz/1440p setting and matching it with PUBG 's 1440p mode? Anyone got any thoughts on that?
The game is locked to 30. So won't really get much boost. But it should at least be more stable 30 and better latency
@@nighttimestalker I played around with it a bit, I noticed it was a more seamless experience. Especially looting, seemed to pick things up quicker and the inventory screen doesnt seem to "hang" like it does in the resolution priority mode. I am also running the game off an external SSD which helps things a good bit.
My LG C9 OLED supports 4K 120hz and VRR, so it’s for high end HDMI 2.1 TV’s, few exist now, but it’s awesome. Pure gaming TV. G Sync and 4K120, epic! If you don’t mind spending $2k for a 65 inch, the 55s aren’t bad though. Closer to $1k
1440p is sweet enough for me at 75 Hz. It's also affordable :-)
75 hz is just as bad as 60, no difference whatsoever.
@@Dr.WhetFarts it's what I can afford. Sorry, I don't have the money like you to throw into a brand new top end monitor like an AOC Agon AG352UCG6. 75hz is also well smooth when using AMD freesync. Plus the price was under £120 UK. I use it daily, i am delighted! I need people like you to pay 400 plus. It lowers the cost of other decent items!
There is a noticeable difference in smoothness between playing Sekiro on my 4K TV vs. on my Freesync 2 monitor.
Ive been enjoying my monitor Omen 240hz low lag, 1440p. You get too enjoy your hardware too it's full potential 👍🏿
Look at me digging through my settings 😑😑😑
Maybe we already do this, but to me is seems that, despite the fact that we're in the world of ubiquitous LCD's now, we're still working with old scanline-based technology. It seems we should be capable of determining and rendering only sub-pixel data which changes with a new frame, updating only the specific pixels that have changed, tracking movement and simply changing old render data to new sub-pixel elements based on direction of movement, needing to only render new edge data or altering the previously rendered sub-pixels based on a delta because of, e.g., a new lighting effect.
120hz 6 Teraflops 4k Games and Blu Ray playback with backwards compatibility makes Xbox One X the most powerful console there is!
PS4 Pro at only 2k has left the chat
And epic TerribleFlops from MS first party studios!
Xbox left the planet....
@@nickbrennan3925, 10 millions players are playing Sea Of Thieves today... And God of War?! How many players still playing this today?! 😏😏😏
You can left from the universe now... 👍😂✌
@Phil Mike Hunt is that a race joke?
Last I checked all that Xbox "POWAH" can't even produce a native 4k resolution on most titles.
@@christiandyers6309 Still more titles than the PS4P. RDR2 is native 4k30, I believe Witcher 3 is 4k30 or 1080p~60. R6 Siege is 1800p60, Halo 5 is dynamic 4k60, Master Chief Collection is 4k60 with some games having dynamic res and others not. Still far more titles with higher resolutions than the PS4 Pro. If you're too ignorant to admit that more GPU power isn't gonna equal higher res and better visuals, then you just need to be quiet.
Refresh rate has been a big part of what holds a lot of games back in terms of visual presentation, if you haven't already you should get a 144Hz display and try it out yourself.
I'm glad to see xbox aiming for a better refresh rate and allowing games to potentially display at 120FPS the way they should but I do worry that the console's hardware and the devs working on the games might not achieve this.
This is why I’m getting the series x
ScrubTzero LOL
did you want to explain what "this" is or did you just really want to tell someone that you're buying the new xbox?
Yea because we totally have seen what Sony has to offer. I'll wait for both to be revealed, released and reviewed thoroughly before spending half a grand on a box that can only do one thing. I am interested in PS5 though mainly because of Sony IPs. But I will wait until it's out to see if there is a compelling reason to buy it.
The VRR range on most displays are 48 to 60/120 hz. Ideally a 20 to 60 hz range would be ideal for current gen consoles. Hopefully most games run a 60fps minimum or the VRR range improves.
They don't do lfc at all? That's kinda sad, reminds me of the freesync 1 days where only high end monitors had useable freesync ranges & lfc.
As a PC enthusiast with an i9 9900KS and 2 RTX 2080 Ti ROG Strix in NVLINK, I’m excited for consoles! I plan on buying both Series X and PS5 for the exclusives and stick to my PC for the premium experience! But I don’t understand why gamers are sooo excited on console for the specs they have. I mean cmon guys! You can’t access them via BIOS so what’s the point in getting hyped for specs. That’s why I admire PC for full control of your system. Other than that I find console boring when it comes to customization due to the hardware being locked down soo tightly and no room to upgrade or OC or water cool in the future. I buy consoles for exclusives and that’s pretty much it! Also how are players going to get even close to that 120 FPS target at 1080p on XBSX and PS5 when TVs are only 60 Hz and you need to buy a monitor that can support it and most people just want to use there TVs and go from there.
I can understand buying the PS5, but all the Xbox "exclusives" come to PC now. Why would you bother getting an Xbox Series X?
Her exact words were "we're seeing framerates up to 120 frames per second." Not talking just about a 120Hz mode, but more so getting 120fps on that mode? That was my take on what she said. Also... hate to beat a dead horse but it's been a thing for a long time on one of the platforms... and higher... I love how they try to make everything sound so amazing and done first on consoles.
"Resolution and frame rates that we've never seen before, were looking at fram rates of up to 120fps" yeah we'll never see them cause we can only see up to 30fps, wow just trying to rip us off. (sarcasm btw)
Yep slot people rather take what they believe as the truth rather then what is actually scientifically true. The age of alternative facts and science denial is apon us. SAD!
Oh god I really hope there's no one left that actually believes this nonsense 😁
I once almost killed a man (and ruined my sisters wedding) in an argument about this.🙄
I just saw 144 fps on my computer monitor just yesterday ,woww!
16:36 - it's why everyone is going nuts and getting the LG C9 / X models this year. Having said that, I'm moving from my C8 to C9 this week. Might as well get a bigger size at 65" while I was at it.
Cant wait for this beast.
That Car Guy lol
@@balaam_7087 ?
Don't forget, DF does not stand for Didn't Finish, but did finish.
Thanks Digital Foundry for a great video once again. 👍
DF videos is like crack. I just want more of it
Vsync: Your frame will be ready in 16.8 milliseconds.
Gamer: 16.8 milliseconds? But I'm want it now!
I just enable Nvidia's fast sync now. It removes screen tearing with no discernable difference in latency.
I've seen 120hz, and I even went fur-ther, beyond 120hz...
alright goku
121hz?
@@AlexJasso100 The guy in the Microsoft footage talked about how 120hz is something "we've never seen before, like never seen before." 120 is ok, but that is as old as CRT monitors which can go further. ASUS just recently announced a 360hz G-Sync monitor.
@@tobydion3009 yes, but show me a gaming device that costs less than 1000 that can run games at medium/high graphics at 1080p 120fps? Maybe you could use a lower end gpu but you'd have to take down all your settings to barely reach 100.
120fps has never been seen before at this price range is what they should have said.
@@rickygforce4217 Maybe any of the Unreal Tournament games. I play games at 1080p 144hz normally, games that don't even take 30% of my GPU like Sundered (recently played game that came to mind). You can play simple games at crazy fps with a GTX 760. I'm sure they meant console, but the way he said it made it seem like it was some mind boggling thing that is only possible now.
I did that kind of test on my original Xbox. A lot of games supported 720p and few supported 1080p. Like crash nitro racing, which looked like a early Xbox 360 game. Wished I kept that HDMI adapter for the Xbox. It's becoming more expensive and harder to find nowadays.
I watched this at 2X speed for 120fps.
Kind of mind-boggling when internal GPU buffers are taken into account for screen space reflections, shadows, dynamic lights, stencils, depth, HDRI, etc. The computer is literally processing way more than 120 fps.
0:15 OMFG thank you for putting that in, so tired of console people pretending PC doesnt win in everything they ever talk about. and LOL, i still love the 8k talk....ya Tetris will play at 8k at 20 fps
I had VGA cables for my 360 monitor support looked awesome (for the time) through them. Would be great to see a 'best TV's for next gen consoles' article. Is there any difference to them? What should I be looking out for when buying a new one? etc