Remember when jimin was spotted in a club just hanging out having fun as he should...but what happened next? People got mad because he went to a fucking club...what was he supposed to do tea party smh
your speaking facts even me as a kpop stan (well mainly a bts stan) dont like most kpop stans that ive come across on twitter. TRUST if your a baby stan dont go on twitter its a dangerous place.
I'm pretty sure EVERYONE famous in the music industry is manufactured, not their faces, not their personalities, just their image. It's not only kpop, it's anywhere near a camera and a famous person.
BTS LITERALLY SPOKE OUT ABOUT THIS. They have multiple songs discussing this fake facade that they're forced to show. They even have songs about this FAKE LOVE is literally a fucking diss to the industry, and about how theyre viewed as dolls and not humans, how they're being photographed,stalked, touched without their consents and they have to fake being okay with it because as idols they're dehumanized. Jimin's songs are fucking cries for help. Lie discusses the struggles of his depression and being trapped as an idol. "Get away away away from me. Me who is trapped, caught in a lie, I couldn't run away, save me same from this lie, me who is being punished,give me back my smile" LIKE BITCH???? even FILTER talks about changing his personality to suit everyone's taste. Even IDOL talks about the shit. BTS even made BURN THE STAGE to show people some of the struggles they're going through. Injured Jungkook still needs to dance. Taehyung and Jin fought and had to act normal and lovey dovey on stage. Jimin had a fucking breakdown because his voice kept breaking from exhaustion,that boy cried and had a meltdown and was still forced to go out and sing. On their recent Festa, Jin talked about their first years where he was PROHIBITED FROM LAUGHING. Fucking laughing. He wasn't allowed to laugh out loud because he was forced to be a " Cool,Quiet type" and was forced to eat only boiled chicken breast for a YEAR because they had to keep him slim as fuck to push the " Shoujo Manga" look. They are manufactured. It's not their fault. They're forced to do that to survive in the industry that tolerates nothing but perfection from its elites. BTS has been trying to break away from that shit but they're still bound to that norm. Saying that they're manufactured is not an attack on them,but a criticism to the industry itself.
I don’t listen to BTS or any kpop for that matter but I knew of this stuff and it makes me feel so bad for them. All celebrities have to go through this in one way or another, but I feel in the kpop industry they do it 10x worse than like in American pop industry. Once I saw this one group dancing on stage and one of the girls passed out in the middle of it and THEY KEPT DANCING. It’s like they were forced to ignore their member literally passing out from being overworked. It’s terrible and because of that and the toxic kpop community, it just makes me not even want to give the music a try. It’ll feel bittersweet
Estela Lopez Not true at all. It’s the exact same in America just cultural differences exist between Korea and America that have nothing to do with the entertainment industry
When you really get down to it we all are. We don't let the people who are not close friends or family see every part of our lives. We present an image when we go to the store out to eat anywhere we put on our public mask. We just don't get paid to do it.
You know when you finish the main storyline an open world RPG and just roaming around aimlessly and exploring and you come across a million bugs and areas where the game begins to break like respawned invincible enemies, graphic glitches etc. That has what life has felt like since 2012.
@@Kitty-mb4hy The latest controversy was at the beginning of the COVID outbreak in the US. Dr. Phil went on FOX News, which is a well known far right-wing propaganda outlet. He said that Americans shouldn't worry about COVID claiming that 360,000 people died from drowning in a swimming pool yearly, which was more deaths than we had at time. However, the real number was actually 3,600. I think our death toll at the time was still smaller than 3,600, but he contributed to the blatant disinformation being spread about COVID that has sadly been a major factor in why our death toll is so high today.
as a kpop stan, everyone with a brain knows celebrities are all “manufactured” they all have a fake image to look perfect. some may be more open about their real self but no idol or no celebrity is the same off camera. and this is all very obvious you just need common knowledge
exactly, only a few kpop stans like myself actually have brains and know this is true. others either don't believe it or continue to deny it cuz they're just that dense
@@kstar1489Nope. it's not just about makeup or clothes, we're talking about their personality & character as a whole. they are expected to not only appear but also ACT a certain way on camera; one wrong move and it's all over.
I think that fans forget that BTS is a part of an industry that sells ideals. RM himself says (in Burn The Stage) that he struggles with having two identities: RM and Kim Namjoon. RM is an image and personality created by BigHit and his own creativity and talent, while Kim Namjoon is just a person that probably behaves differently when not in front of a camera.
@@heeseungpilled2003 I don't think it's DID just putting on a persona to perform. A lot of entertainers do this, especially if they're shy - in example, Beyoncé and her persona Sasha Fierce. But I don't know him personally so who knows.
Idk why people acting like Dr. Phil said Jimin is a whole robot that was birthed from a machine. He literally just said his image his manufactured, which is true. It’s true for like, all celebrities/brands.
many stans just get defensive because they always think people are saying their idol is fake Obviously many idols are not 100% fake and staged, but there is ethics and a way to portray yourself as an artist Also people think that others attack idols for plastic surgery or something, and they listen to these generalized opinions and raaaaage. It's something common and nothing deadly to rage about, many koreans do want to do a little change on their eyelids or nose, it's just the way it is, it's just another face of earth society :p
Well all stars have a manufactured image, but not all have to work until they collapse for basically no money without any form of selfexpression in public and private (do what others want you to do, don't have any relationships or anything that could uncover the actual you, don't do anything that could risk the image the company wants you to have or get fired) Sorry... Just that theres a massive difference between kpop n everything else. Even ballerinas get paid more and treated better than kpop stars it seems
Little Loner Well it depends on the company, but yeah. Trust me, kpop fans know. They’ve been fighting with the companies since the end of time. If we’re specifically talking about Jimin though, he does get paid. And while he has worked himself till he collapse it was not forced by the company, he did it on his on volition, but he’s recovered from that mindset. The dating ban is stupid, and it’s starting to deteriorate slowly, so let’s hope for the best on that one. But yeah, kpop entertainment companies are crazy corrupt, practically sadistic.
army:once:elf:exol multi I totally agree! I stg all these people who were like “JiMiN iS nOt MaNuFaCtuReD” like they need to chill, dr Phil was not “attacking” anyone, in the business of a celebrity their image is manufactured to go according to the public, it does not mean they’re fake. I’m a big BTS fan but some army need to chill😶
I mean, Jimin doesn’t even look like “Jimin” without makeup on.. and he’s pretty open about that. To paraphrase Jungkook, “Jimin is cute normally, and suddenly sexy with makeup on”
as a korean, it concerns me that k-pop “stans” are so defensive. k-pop idols are forced into diets, exercise, etc. dr phil isn’t lying. also, oli london doesn’t look CLOSE to asian.
@@pennybleta2300 your claim actually furthers the notion that bts is manufactured. They formed as a group due to a manufactured audition process, got put into positions in the group that would increase their popularity based off of their talents, got promoted on multiple media platforms to increase awareness about them, ext. Their company agreeing to letting them be active on social media was a strategic move to promote them, something that most kpop companies don't allow to their artists. Bighit knew that and used it to their advantage. As they got more popular, revenue started coming in that contributed to the economy, which got noticed by the actual government of korea. The promoting department in the Korean government (@ sleep is IrrelevAnT correct me what it's called) asked bts to make a song for them that would promote travel to south korea, which in turn also promoted bts. It's all manufactured, which isn't a problem at all. As long as the artists and their fans can distinguish their *persona* from their *true* selves, then there shouldn't be a problem. Unfortunately, there are some fans that can't disnguish the two. Fortunately, most fans and bts themselves can, as shown in literally bts' albums love yourself and map of the soul (specifically *persona*)
@@quidditch1991 What a load of bullshit. This whole paragraph you wrote shows you know nothing about BTS. Watch this video to educate yourself on the matter because not only what you said is bullcrap but uninformed as heck. ua-cam.com/video/rBsZhHPA7t8/v-deo.html Don't bother to come back unless you make an actual effort to educate yourself on who BTS are and why they are called a once in a lifetime phenomenon which led to their contribution to SK economy. I will only respond back to you if you show signs that you actually watched the video of a journalist that has done his research unlike you. And just to give you two hints about your ignorance. First BTS didn't begun as an idol group but a hip hop one they later changed in an attempt to become more known. They weren't trained like other idols to acquire skills but to hone in their own. Each BTS member was already skilled and accomplished each in their field before they joined BTS. They adopted the training system but not as the idol industry dictated. In fact they fought this shitty industry and it's rules since day one. And that is why they succeeded when this shitty industry dictated they never would according to its rules which despite their success it doesn't show signs of changing any time soon. And the second one is no BTS weren't promoted in any media due to their company being a small bankrupt one. Their broadcasts were being cut and they were replaced by Big3 and more famous ones and were told as such in their face. Which is the reason BTS used other internet platforms to communicate with their fans and which made them more accessible and showed their personality and daily lives to us fans. Suga himself has said that they should not filter anything for the fans. And of course on stage they use a persona but not when they communicate with us.
Penny Bleta He comments under every comment. Imagine how sad his life must be in order to keep writing all of these comments so he feels better about himself.
no they haven't taehyung has literrally said he doesn't need to act different on camera and off camera because he has nothing to hide. so have ppl who have worked for them
no they literally haven’t... bts have been proven to act the same irl and on camera and they don’t feel the need to act any different. please stop putting words in their mouths to try to get them to fit into the narrative you want :( it’s really not good.
The word “idol” itself *literally means* that this image is superhuman. Same thing with fashion models - the word “model” means it is a certain type of look/body. This is why those of us who are not working as idols or models so easily put our own fantasies and ideologies onto those who are. It’s the concept of “eidolon” - the “ideal image.” It’s............problematic in a lot of ways, but yes I still listen to predominantly South Korean music. Yikes I’m a part of the problem.
I think it's fine to partake as long as you're critical and acknowledge the faults; that's leagues better than the fanbase being solely made up of rabidly loyal people that wouldn't stop supporting a member if they committed murder. Everything in moderation!
I do understand what you mean, but idol is a Korean term (in this context) and doesn’t necessarily mean the same thing in English. I do know what you mean though
@I love Angelique are they? Is it? Idk... Maybe just the image that they have to put out is. Are ALL of them like that? in my opinion, their image has to be manufactured, but it doesn't make it a fact. so I guess we'll never know, will we?
@@abdia5044 bro, idfk 😭 They are attacking me cuz I'm a 1D Stan, stupid innit? If you're an army you'll know that our fandoms don't get along. 😭😭 Idek why bro lmao
Dude, one time a Kpop Stan asked me why I don’t listen to Kpop. I said “It doesn’t appeal to me. It all ends up kinda sounding the same” and 5 different Stans called me racist
@@ME6ATURTLE I feel you on that, when people know I listen to metal they're like: "It all sounds the same, it's just anger and noise" and I know I have no way of convincing them otherwise if they're not willing to listen to some, which they are not. So I just brush it off and change the subject.
one time i said i didnt like kpop just because I dont like the music and it doesnt appeal to me and some girl called me racist because i guess that means i hate korean people? idek it was so dumb
@Perla Lopez Gomez did they tho? I mean...how would they know that, really? Cause I see it this way: when they debuted they were out to be "sold" like any other product. But sales depend on the buyers, so if the product isn't interesting for the buyers, they wont buy it and it wont be popular. People got interested in BTS and they got popular buy they weren't so...yeah
@Perla Lopez Gomez they didn't really tho… especially Namjoon has been vocal about the fact that after debut they literally thought people would hate them and they were scared of not appealing to the public
just wanna say right off the bat allkpop is a miserable excuse for journalism, they've done a lot of stuff from a bit shady to outright leaking someone's nudes. but i agree with the video overall, even though i like kpop myself
I used to go on there all the time when I was younger and it’s just full of trolls. The ones who commented on the articles were worse than the ones who were in the forums. The user generated content is full of bias and starts many fan wars.
I've always said that Asian Junkie and Kpopalypse are the _peak_ of kpop journalism. I know people don't like them because of the satire doesn't translate well to everyone but the posts are not biased and there all kinds of people in the comments but most are level headed.
K pop stars are literally groomed from childhood, they pluck the cutest, most charismatic kids with perfect voices and bone structures from their private schools and then their put through the machine.
Not all.. Atleast I know bts... Rm and Sugar were underground rappers before they joined bts.. They were criticized for not fitting beauty standard, jungkook auditioned in 7 music companies and they scouted him but he decided to enter big hit because he saw Rm rap, jin was scouted while getting off a bus with no music background, V and jhope auditioned and was picked, jimin was a dancer, the top male contemporary dancer in his class, class president for 9years, school valecditorian, maths wizard, very good in martial arts, good in hip hop dancing not that good in vocals but can still hold a note but he was almost cut 8times before debut... He was the last member and trained for only 3months before debut..
@Mia Pedriana I'm 26 and I'm Jimin biased and I don't hide it but maybe you should get to know about them to know that he didn't train for a year... He was not a vocalist before joining the group, he studied contemporary dance but when he entered bighit he had to learn a different type of dance,bighit almost cut him 8 times, V said they accepted Jimin because when V was asked he said he needs a friend like Jimin in the group. Jimin said himself he's an examplary student on jimmy fallon show, he said he was school president for 9 years, he is so good in maths and physics that he even comes up with his own formula, he became a local celebrate when he came out on top his class as a contemporary dancer which is rare for boys, he already trained in kendo, has a blackbelt in taekwando, was offered a Chinese scholarship for martial arts, he also knows hapkido... Did I say the other members are not good? I just answered the person who said they are trained by their label.. Jimin was already good in so many things before entering bighit yet he was cut almost 8 times prior to their debut.. So what is wrong in what I said.. I just stated facts.
@Jane girl I'm 26 and I stated facts... Though they pass through training most of them already have so many skills and talents before being scouted... It may seem like fan fiction but its real.. He was almost removed 8 times if not for one of the members V.. They have talked about it openly so I didn't make it up.
@@sophiaumeh9553 Alot of them are still not treated all that well while their trainees and they are probably scared to talk about their real selves online or even their love lives or anything and the truth is you will never know the true them.
@@madisonblair9423 I know what you mean and that's why I'm not defending celebrities I don't know... I defended bts because I have been listening to them since 2013... Just recently Suga came out and said that he feels empty inside, Jin also made a solo song abyss saying how he's depressed, jimin also released a solo song Christmas love and wrote on Twitter that it reminded him of his childhood.. They normally go on Clive and talk about their issues.. If they are manufactured they would not do that but I get what you mean.. Many celebrities don't show us everything but you can't blame them.. Society is tough on them.. They show you everything and you still bash them.. But the people bashing them are just like them... I mean as an individual there are things you don't do when you are not in the mist of friends or under scrutiny... It's just easy to see it in them because they are celebs but we live the same life everyday.. Now will you now call it manufactured.. It's not.. Manufactured means they are like dolls and don't have the mind of their own.. That's wrong.
As an Army I really don't know about this issue. But damn, twitter stans are scary. This is one of the reason why I don't like using twitter and tiktok. There's always an issue and a war.
Yuki James exactly couldn’t have said it any better. In the song Jimin literally states that he had lost a part of himself in this phase of being an idol. He had so many struggles with body image he put himself and prob the company as well on a heavy diet. That’s why you could see him fainting on stage in one of his performances. Even Namjoon has come out and stated that being in the group has made him lose a part of himself because they’re always putting this facade in order to avoid making the fans unhappy but he always says that making music has always reminded him of who he truly is so that’s what’s keeping him on the ground and his family and friends. It’s really sad because idols have so many limits in order to avoid making fans upset. They obviously get tired of putting up these fake personas and that’s what the album Persona is all about cuz at the end of the day the members lost a part of themselves once they decided to join BTS.
Facts. Ive had people who follow me on social media simply b/c they think im pretty, have never met a day in life, they dont even kno what my voice sounds like think they kno me & tell me about myself im just like wtf? My social media is what i choose to show you about me, its all the *REAL ME!* just certain aspects about myself i chose not to put out there. Everyone doesn't deserve to really know u. Thats vip status & few have reached that level.
@Estela Lopez fake and manufactured are two different things. They're obviously not fake because um duh... but yes they are manufactured. And I don't think you know what I said, try reading it again and then we'll talk xx
I have to remember that a lot of these people on the internet are children so ideas as simple as "celebrities and influencers have manufactured images to increase profit" is very hard for them to grasp. It's frustrating lol. We are getting old
@@thedarkderp2520 uh yikes no. I have a therapist that is actually qualified and doesn’t televise our sessions I don’t need to talk to a gross quack doctor.
KPOP is manufactured and that's just facts. It doesn't mean the idols are totally not themselves on camera periodically, but that image we get is created by marketing and publicity teams.
@@alyiv_ of course lol. That's widely and commonly known. I referenced kpop specifically cause his video focused on it mainly but every music industy everywhere has similar issues.
@@user-yb7ph7un1o I think that while the US industry founded this manufactured system, South Korea is going above and beyond with group members eating ice to lose weight and being prohibited from openly dating or being gay. Obviously there was a time when things were like this in the US music industry but, with the "woke" movement, things have developed to the point where artists like Lizzo are sweeping Grammy noms when they would have been barred from the industry only a few decades prior. Before people get pressed, I'm not American and, while I don't listen to much K-pop, I'm a K-drama fan (as the dramas are actually a lot more progressive).
@@alyiv_ Not to this extent. Sure, American industry plant performers have it really bad, but it's nowhere near as bad as Korean ones. They're not allowed to date, to have phones, to even see their families unless they're scheduled to. They have to go on dangerous, life-threatening diets and do intense workouts, and they're the ones who pay for it. They're constantly in debt to their company, and barely get paid 25% of their actual profit. That's nothing compared to the American industry, which mostly deals with creating a false image of the artist and writing their songs for them, but still giving them the freedom to, you know, see their parents.
lillie olette Although bts have came out with documentaries giving us a glimpse of what goes on behind the scene , that doesn’t make it any less manufactured, in fact it actually proves how much it is. I remember watching a clip on one of their documentaries on UA-cam and one of the members said something like “it’s not always what we portray it to be” or something like that
Palash Jain yes true , but the kpop industry is extremely manufactured and you can’t compare that to everyday life. Look at how groups are performing on award shows. You see how perfect their performing . So perfect to the point where you can put the exact same song their performing side by side and there’d be no difference between the two videos except the clothes. Kpop is creating this perfect image portraying idols as perfect angles that can do no wrong . That’s manufactured
@@sourheadacheplayz2335 being perfect and manufactured are two different things. Manufactured means everything about them is decided by higher authorities. For the case of bts its different because their relationship with bighit is not so much like thus but more so of the kind of polishing their already existing strengths.
It's especially obvious when you look at performances in their own country and showcases vs when they're on tour and have more fun with it. Blackpink being the biggest example rn.
when you like Kpop but the stans are kinda crazy when you like Kpop but 'normal people who listen to normal music' look down on me until it becomes trendy on tiktok for 15secs idk what now?
As a BTS stan myself, ( who stays far away from twitter ) this situation really disappoints me because our reputation is going further down due to the twitter stans taking what Dr. Phil said wrong. I apologize on behalf of the SANE fans and hope that in the future less and less toxic fans will emerge. Thank you for spreading light on this.
i too am a 'fan' of kpop, but it's when some stans as people call them get too intricate about their idols 'everything', what they do, how they do, when they do, and, i apologize if this comes off as rude or offensive to any kpop fans, start attacking like rabid dogs on the street if their idols are given constructive criticisms of any sort. that kind of kills the appeal of people maybe dipping their toes into the kpop community. although ive had really good friends and even people close to me who like kpop and would never shun anyone for their likes. but i get it, though. they just want themselves to feel like they're shielding their role models. the bottomline is, doctor phil never condemned or shunned jimin's qualities or himself as a person in any way, and said the truth. most notably, before the days of kpop there was one direction, people were absolutely crazy after that band so i digress lol
@@AbdullahB17 exactly thats what I said in my comment, fans took what he said wrong and got pissed at him for nothing and the point was to say that as a bts fan that isnt toxic, im glad that the toxic fans are being called out but at the same time people need to understand that not every fan is toxic. Its mostly the twitter stans that are, and the majority are normal fans.
There are different definitions tho if i'm correct the original meaning came from eminem's song stan and has the meaning of an obsessed stalker like fan but in in kpop it's used in a different way. We say we are stans when we not only listen to the groups songs but actively are in the fandom of the said group and practically know their names and watch a lot of their content. So saying i stan this group in kpop has not the same meaning of a stan in the west
And the definition stalker fan is called Sasaeng in the kpop industry so basically a saesang is an overly obsessed stalking fan who invades idols personal spaces and do crazy stuff like go into an idols house and shit on their ground and send them letter written with period blood (Both of these happened not just once...) That's called a saesang which is a stan in the western meaning but stan in kpop is a fan who is actively in the fandom and likes the group/artist a lot
It’s really annoying because when kpop twitter does shit like this is completely invalidates any actually criticism fans may have. Like if a kpop fan and or stan says anything valid or not it immediately taken as we’re stupid and overreacting. And thanks for throwing it out there that not all fans are like this.
And it's sad, i mean, we all know most of Twitter stans are toxic and kpop twitter is toxic to the point where it invalidates someone elses' opinion whether is the person who the stans are attacking or kpop fans themselves.
I’m a big BTS fan and I love Jimin, but I literally don’t understand. OF COURSE kpop is manufactured, they are marketed to us as boyfriends and girlfriends, that’s how the business works. They were seven people who did not know each other and they were put together by their company. This means they were manufactured. This doesn’t detract from their message or their talent. The reason I’m a fan is because of what they stand for and their music/performances make me happy.
Same . I feel like some kpop fans are too sensitive and protective of their idols while most of the idols are grown adults and can handle criticism it reached to the point where you can’t criticize and share your honest opinion
@@cameliaales67 that is true. but fans just feel the need to protect their idols because it DOES get upsetting to them. if you've seen this one RM interview where he said that he was scared to open social media bcs he was scared that he would get hate, you would know how much fans want to protect idols. bcs fans know how much they go through and don't want to let their idols have to deal with everything on their own
Aren't we all manufactured at times? I mean manufactured is a little dehumanizing, but I think Dr. Phil just meant we don't know Jimin like a close friend. We can't see more than he'll give us, although Jimin is pretty open with us.
The reason why a lot of people were upset is that Dr Phil's statement encourages, or at least aligns itself with a very harmful stereotype of not only K-pop idols but East Asian people in general. I don't think this is what was meant in the original conversation, but if you're into Kpop you've probably noticed how people tend to think of it as a very robotic industry + that Kpop idols are somehow less authentic than Western celebrities. This also goes hand in hand with common East Asian stereotypes of unnaturally talented and honed people, like math geniuses, working like computers, and generally being perfect copies of each other. This is a stereotype that Kpop idols are subject to a LOT, and BTS suffers the brunt of it because they're more exposed to people who don't know anything about Kpop. And Jimin specifically is the member who gets by far the most unwarranted hate. He's always specifically targeted for being too feminine, for looking "more Asian" than the rest, or even for having an auto-tuned sounding voice that's too high pitched for a guy, for "looking gay" or "like a girl." He's the most well-known member, so he's the most common target for completely unwarranted criticism (honestly criticism is a really soft way of putting it, the amount of death threats he's gotten at this point), and the thing with Oli London is also a form of harassment that he's unquestionably the victim of, but people still blame him and make fun of him for it all the time (even D'Angelo made a joke about it in the video before this). The stereotype that people got really mad at Dr Phil for encouraging isn't plastic surgery or even just the basic manufactured image that celebrities all have, but that Kpop idols, and BTS specifically, and *Jimin* in particular, are somehow *more* manufactured and *less* human than other celebrities. It also goes along with this weird idea that people who don't know Kpop have that the appeal of Kpop is that everyone is perfect -- I'd say that's the complete opposite of what draws most people to K-pop. Yeah that's the initial shine to it, yes, everyone is very talented, but most people stay for the behind-the-scenes, knowing of course that it's not completely authentic, but the contact you have with Kpop artists through specifically the off-stage, imperfect moments is a huge draw for most K-pop fans. And Jimin is pretty well known for being extremely open about his work-related insecurities; he’s definitely the most personal and vulnerable Ive seen any artist get; he worked through some big body image issues while being pretty open about it with his audience, he’s talked so many times about not being happy with his vocal abilities or his dancing, and so many other things. He’s definitely not closed off or robotic; of course there’s a significant division between his public and private images, but if you want to call any celebrity plastic or closed off, Jimin should be one of the last people on the list. Not to mention that the "robotic," "clean," and "manufactured" nature of K-pop that a lot of people criticise, like certain mannerisms or customs, are just a part of Korean culture, which is also something racial stereotypes have normalised to us as foreign and inhuman. In the comments D'Angelo showed in the video of the "reasonable" K-pop fans saying that ALL K-pop idols are manufactured -- which is true -- notice how they were only talking about Kpop idols and not all celebrities. I don't think it makes sense to dismiss criticism from people who know a lot more about the subject of the conversation than you do just because their profile picture is a BTS member. There were some "unreasonable" comments that actually might be making some good points if people tried to understand them and listen to them instead of just dismissing them as crazy because they disagree with them. Yeah a lot of the people talking about this are completely off the mark, but a lot of BTS fans actually (surprise) know a lot about BTS and might be able to contribute more to the conversation than someone who's not into K-pop at all. *Edit:* I mentioned this in a reply but I think it's an important point I didn't mention before. First, I'm not in any way excusing or justifying any violence or aggression that came from this situation. The only thing I tried to do was give people a different perspective on the issue, which I think is more complex and more important than "look at all these delusional kpop girls." Besides that, and I think the most important part, is that I find it really strange that neither Dr Phil nor D'Angelo talked about how racist and genuinely disturbing this whole issue is. Not Dr Phil's comment, but Oli London's entire schtick which is based around stalking, harassing, and to a disturbing extent taking on the identity of a whole other human being by emulating and appropriating his East Asian features -- which are something that Jimin has been harassed and violated for many times in his life, but Oli London is able to take on as an aesthetic and profit off of. Not to mention that Jimin in particular has struggled since he was a kid with his own public body image and has serious mental health issues related to this, and it's widely known that this is in part due to the extensive harassment he's received online since a very young age for the shape of his face, eyes, etc. Oli often refers to himself as Jimin, he's had extensive surgery to look more "Korean," and he regularly refers to Jimin and other East Asian people's facial features as "cute" and "Kpop," and only hires East Asian people to be in his music videos, while openly fetishising East Asian features, cultures and languages. It's blatantly racist, but there's rarely any conversation around this aspect of the topic. Instead most people, including D'Angelo, have taken this whole thing as an opportunity to talk about Kpop fans. I think it says a lot about the people talking about this when their takeaway from the conversation is overwhelmingly "Kpop fans are crazy" rather than "this man is being racist, invasive, inappropriate; this is a form of harassment and discrimination that Jimin, a real East Asian person with feelings and self-agency, is unquestionably the victim of and it's not acceptable." Maybe we should be talking about where this type of behavior comes from, how it should be stopped, and why it's so easily normalized and rephrased into a joke at Jimin's expense.
Thank you so much for putting this together...this should be the pinned comment so that everyone can actually understand the thing...purple you and thnxx for giving so much time to do this.
You did a great job expressing your thoughts here and I personally really admire that 🙂 I’m also just always glad when we’ll spoken Army’s show up to deliver their thoughts it always helps me feel less embarrassed to be a part of this fandom. (💜)
Kpop idols literally train for *years* to become "perfect". They dont just do dancing and singing training, they literally train *how to go on TV shows*, what kind of personalities they're going to have, and what they are and aren't allowed to say. They're prohibited from doing so much regular stuff in public (like dating, smoking, cursing) in order to serve their image. And they're literally forced to diet, sometimes starve, once again for their image. All kpop idols are MANUFACTURED. Everything they do is for their image. That doesn't mean they're not good people, but the idol you see and how they actually are is different.
I think this is part of the reason why so many people view k-pop as toxic. I'm not a k-pop fan really at all, and from what I have seen, all the toxic people are the people who actually think they are like this in real life, and get so offended by literally any criticism whatsoever. These are the same people who think celebrities are not manufactured in any way. Honestly, part of the reason I don't like k-pop is because it is so manufactured, and again, because of toxic stans.
@iyanna best you do realize that BTS members were trainees before debut.. They were also recruited at a young age and molded into idols. They are of course allowed to do all those things but they wouldn't dare do them publicly and if they did they would face harsh criticisms from Knetz. They also have to cover their tattoos while performing. Kpop idols are literally formed to be seen as PERFECT individuals. Hate to break it to you but BTS is no exception.
@iyanna best yeah I know bts has more freedom than many other kpop idols due to their popularity and their fan base being more international, but that didn't change the process they went thru to get there.
@@annejackielee i think what contributes to it a lot is media itself. the major broadcasting stations are very strict and do all they can to avoid "offending" the public. take tattoos as an example. tattoos are widely seen to be gang related by the general public in korea. it's just how it is. and so, to avoid offending these people, when kpop idols are onstage, they are forced to tape up their tattoos. if idols want to gain popularity and earn money and just be successful, they have to do the best they can to be seen as perfect by the public. it's toxic and so horrible but its been this way for so long. this is why i treasure shows like bts' run bts, and bon voyage. they openly swear and drink, and do all these things that are usually censored. it is thanks to their international fanbase that they can be so open and real with us. i cannot deny that bts were manufactured, as this is how all kpop groups are formed, but they have certainly deviated from that image. i think this is why they are so successful.
@@neveratinygoldilocks I agree with you but lets not act like it's only the kpop industry that's manufactured. The entire entertainment industry itself is toxic and manufactured. So many western artists like Ariana Grande have had so many different personas throughout their careers and they're very clearly manufactured too.
The thing is, this idea of having a manufactured and marketed image was actually a huge theme in BTS's last album, Map of the Soul: Persona. The intro to the album is literally about separating the idol image from the real person, and having to adopt a PERSONA when they get on stage or in front of a camera. BTS are aware of their manufactured image. And they use it in their music. And it's not a bad thing. It's a reality for every celebrity, and in many ways every single person. We create different personas for ourselves depending on where we are, and who we talk to. I have a certain image that i adopt for my job, or when i go out, or when I'm around friends, etc. Its a normal part of society.
The problem is the fetishisation of that image by the people who make these idols and the K-pop fans themselves, it is a bad thing when an obsession warps your view of reality so much that you begin to believe the lie and feel personally invested in a falsehood. That isn't normal or healthy, let's not pretend that putting on a face in your normal life is in any way comparable to the act idols have to put on everytime they are outside.
There are so many stans who refuse to see that so many idol's personalities are manufactured. So many idols even say it themselves and even in song lyrics. They constantly point out how they have to change themselves to appease a toxic fan's needs. Yoongi from BTS even said, "People think we show our lives without filtering anything, but we hide a lot of things". There have only been a very few times when groups like BTS filter nothing. It's really rare to come by and I can only imagine how stressed out those idols feel for not being able to express that side of themselves.
Actually that’s mainly only the big or mainstream ones. There are many small niche artists who are completely original. Unfortunately the ones that do get big eventually tend to burn out due to the pressure to conform or consistently produce more of their original work.
because the kpop industry makes idols look "available" to fans and some of them take it way too far and become really obsessive about them and are delusional (they think they have a chance to date them lol). the industry is really fucked up. most of us just admire them and their music but quite a big part of kpop fandoms is toxic
@@atlasatlantic it's worse when they make fun of idols for being cringey and seeming dumb too cutesy. Can't help but feel like defending them not because they insulted my fave but because being an idol seems like one of the hardest jobs in the world. Years of emotional abuse in your developing years and pushing your body till it breaks only to be criticised for putting on a few pounds or wearing a skimpy dress you didn't even choose and just being objectified for your physical apperance and eventually to be replaced by someone younger when you've reached a certain age.
I am a closeted LOONA and BTS fan . One of my friends once found out , and asked me if liked them . So I said yes , she kept bashing me for it and calling them names and saying that they all look the same and stuff . I don’t mind if you hate BTS that’s up to you , but why do you have to attack me and them when I did nothing to you? Also am talking about her not you YOU
Estela Lopez if you live with someone for 7 YEARS do you think that you aren’t going to fight at least a little bit? Also, they might have been joking with each other, c’mon.
Im a kpop stan, not necessarily bts, but yeah I really hate the toxic fans. I for sure like the way they band together to fill racist hashtags, but I don’t like how crazy they can get on useless topics
I just think that Jimin, to an extent, chooses what he can about his image. Of course a lot of his image is marketed, but he also chooses to have some feminine aspects of himself, and literally has shopped at women’s clothing shops. He chose at least that piece of himself. Yes, Jimin is manufactured, probably the majority of him is manufactured, but not all of him. That’s why I feel Dr. Phil was a little harsh, but not in the wrong.
I agree with this completely they r making it seem like Jimin is forced into this feminine clothes and makeup he literally has a say to so Idk yes hes Lil manufactured but like he isn't forced to have the aesthetic he has
@Estela Lopez lots of their songs are about break ups. >.> and you assuming that they hate eachother, and act different off camera is also an assumption.
@@theseusvsminotaurus lmao just to let yk being a "stan" is an inherently bad thing. the implication is basically a crazy/obsessive fan, who worships their idol or whatnot. most ppl call themselves stans cause it seems pretty harmless without rlly knowing how deep it is
Scarlett Lee The term stan comes from a eminem’s song of the same name. In the song a young fan named Stan writes three letters to Eminem over a period of time, each letter getting more desperate and hateful to him each time. It unravels into Stan k*lling both him and his pregnant wife, and Eminem writing a response letter before realizing he was too late. Em wrote this bc around this time many of his fans dealt with mental illness and issues Eminem spoke about. He didn’t want stans. He didn’t want to be worshipped. He just wanted to make music and provide for his daughter. He talks about this in The Way I Am. So yeah being a stan was never meant to be a good thing
i’ve been an army for like 4 years and yeah i know that kpop idols are manufactured and have to keep a public image that could be completely different from their true self, i love jimin but some toxic stans gotta realize this
TLDR: UA-camrs have "images" too and I often worry about Markiplier or Jack having such a heavy reliance on their images. RT is also up there too but mostly cus his Twitch chat is annoying lmao. I've been struggling with this idea for years. Especially experiencing first hand through UA-camrs in recent years. Everything in every industry is "manufactured". You learn that in marketing class. It's like Marketing 101 to create an IMAGE to market. People BECOME images. Not the other way around. I remember worrying about people like Markiplier for a while. Cus holy shit Mark's fanbase is SOOO YOUNG. I feel bad for him sometimes because I'm sure it's probably hard(and only getting harder) to connect with people less than half his age. It can feel very lonely and inauthentic I'm sure for him. Mark has always been amazing with kids though. People I worry about more often are people like Jacksepticeye. He clearly gets sick of his fans sometimes, and it makes sense seeing as only like less than a decade ago he was shot into a child fanbase by Pewds. I'm sure he probably had a close-knit fanbase of reliable people he could have discussions with before, being a smaller UA-camr. I can only imagine what it was like to lose all that but gaining a lot too. It must have been so isolating to be surrounded by a conversation you can't really join. Even if you did, half your fanbase would find your comment and just say something unrelated like "You should play [insert game]." Or "You're awesome Jacksepticeye." I've seen once a thread where people are just laughing. Like you don't have to type that out and post it 😂😂 Maybe last year/two years ago I started to notice Jack's videos decline a bit in energy. It was very clear to me that is is running out of steam to do all the crazy screaming and loudness. He's naturally energetic so it still works for him, but I can't help but feel sorry for the way he has to keep up that persona no matter what. I noticed as well he started to copy other videos. Like he started a Scary Games playlist or started up a Minecraft playthrough, often without even MENTIONING one of his close friends that did it first. Not that he shouldn't do that, it just felt odd being used to people being like "I saw this person's video so I made this." 😂 I just noticed a lack in his own idea/take on something. He really seems to enjoy games with others though (like the Boner Cast). Those videos Jack seems back to his old self, energetic and fun. It's hard to be sure obviously cus that IS his image 😂 I'm happy for his current girlfriend too being a gamer, cus then they can have fun together and I think that reinvigorates him. He's definitely extroverted LOL. I think he's slowly finding his place again, and I really hope the best for him. I worry about RT sometimes too because his twitch just is legit like 6 years old and he is CONSTANTLY getting annoyed by them cus they just say stupid fucking shit in hopes of being noticed 😂 I just love these UA-camrs (images and all) and hope their mental health is first priority to them.
I really appreciated it because I know a little bit of Korean and pronouncing it can be really hard, still is hard for me, and it's really quite nice to see people trying their best to say the names correctly. It can be a bit awkward listening to people saying it wrong even when they probably know it's wrong- but I do understand, though, since I personally pronounce the names in anime rather incorrectly just because I think they sound better the way I say it.. but mostly that's because they're fictional characters and I don't feel like trying to put on a poor Japanese accent in front of my family just to say it half-correct
I’m a kpop Stan and have so for nearly 5 years now. Idk why some kpop stans are so sensitive or protective of kpop. But anyway I do think kpop in general is manufactured and so is the rest of the music industry, I do think BTS also are manufactured. It does sound negative but for BTS and the rest of kpop there are ALOT of people behind the people in the group. There are people writing their songs, creating music videos, taking their pictures, doing their hair, styling them. So yeah it’s kinda like a manufacturing line with all these steps for an album to be released. It’s down to the Indiavidual on how they interpret this but I don’t necessarily think it’s negative it’s just how things are and that’s why kpop and the music is the way that it is.
Ok, I’m a big minority in being a straight white 18 year old male THAT LOVES bts. I see the talent, I bop to the music, I love the dancing, I LOVE bts. That being said, I hate kpop twitter, I hate Stan culture, I 100% agree with dr Phil, it’s true for every celebrity. I hate the music I love being associated with such a disgusting misguided fan base.
honestly thank you. We know like bits of their personality that they put forward, but they've said that it isn't /really/ them. Yknow why? cause we aren't with them 24/7, and we don't see all sides of them, including the ones that they have to hide to preserve their image. I agreed with this video before I became a BTS stan and I still agree with it. It's kind of something for everyone online or in an entertainment industry. You legit don't know everything about them and you never will and it's kinda something you have to deal with and its absolutely fine like damn. Jimin isn't "fake", which seems to be the misconception here. It's more like he has to present himself a certain way and do certain things to live up to peoples perception of him, which is what Dr. Phil was trying to say.
Hell yeah someone who recognizes the superiority of "She Is", one of the most underrated Kpop singles of all time! Jonghyun really knocked it outta the park with that one.
As a jimin stan I agree that jimin's image is pure marketing ... and I mean to become an idol takes a looot of training so it is true that the idea of jimin is manufactured, but he is a real person, we can see this when he goes out to drink or when he is just being himself ... but you are not gonna tell me he isn't and asset
As much as jimin has came out and talked about his life and personal struggles through his art or even just vlives, seeing him in countless episodes of run bts and just seeing him literally grow up, you really wanna sit here and say that the entire persona that he presents to army/the world is completely fake... I feel like thats kind of insulting. Jimin himself even talked about how in early bts days he was trying to be something that he isnt but now he's learned to love himeself for who he really is and is happy that he is now able to show us himself without a mask. Jin also has a video talking about the same thing. Personally I just feel like if you're gonna agree that jimin + bts's identity are completely manufactured then you must think the same for their music as well... because I dont see how you can see their music and message as authentic but their personas as fake. I know you wrote this months ago but seriously give me some specific examples of jimins identity thats unauthentic (and I'm not saying that bts/jimin is completely authentic in every way either just btw). And to be honest me, you nor D'Angelo know N O T H I N G about Jimin outside of the content and art that he produces because you dont know him personally. Generalizing every single person bc of the group they are apart of is never good bc it creates false narratives and is generally not productive. Saying that every single celebrity or person that have a large following is fake and is only the way they present to be because they are trying to capitalize of of people, I believe is just unfair when the topic is about one specific celebrity. I could say that D'Angelo is fake and is only saying this stuff for clicks but doesnt actually believe it since he has a large following. But that unfair for me to say bc I literally dont know the guy, he could be honest in his controversial opinions. You know what I mean. idk I just think you should give jimin a little more credit... and sorry if im not making complete sense in certain sentences it's the summer and its late
as an army myself, the boys themselves have said it through their songs that they put a mask on and that no matter everything we still don't know the real, raw bts. yes they are manufactured and a part of why some fans are upset is because from all the videos we watch it feels like u know them personally even if it's just a tiny amount. yoongi rapped about it in shadow how his personas clash , HELL EVEN IN OUTRO HER yoongi literally says : "I can never take off the mask Because the me behind this mask Is not the one you know" "Make up to wake up today too And dress up to mask on In order to become the me that you love" so yeah. they themselves have said they're manufactured. and idk why people are so upset when in fact that image also lifts people up and helps people love themselves a bit more. at the end of the day all the answers r in their music :'))
YES! literally his image is marketed but jimin and the others try so hard to break from that and it just seemed ignorant for dr phil to completely ignore it
@@haggisa if only you had the sense to realize that theyre in korean and this is a translation so of course it aint gonna sound exactly smooth Please do elaborate your stance on why they're bad by basing your opinion off mere 2 lines, i would certainly like to know
I can tell you, as a person who's pretty active on kpop twitter, that everyone is aware. Stans tend to have this weird competition about whether the group they like or the group another person likes had it worse so they can be like "yeah but your faves had a silver spoon" It's wild over there lmao
Jimin has a manufactured image. bts has a manufactured image. every single person who is someone in this world has a manufactured image. as an ARMY whose bias is Jimin, I'm so embarrassed right now. these people really need to realize that even if BTS is more transparent than some other artist they are never gonna be 100% unfiltered. they are never gonna be 100% themselves. they are never gonna show you every side of themselves cause that's just not how it works. that doesn't mean that they are fake or bad people that simply means that you are not gonna know them like their mom or their best friends you are gonna know them as a fan. Jimin is manufactured because even if he loves making music and wants to give back to his fans he is selling a product. he and BTS NEED to sell their product because that is what they live off of. and to sell that product they create a marketed image. these fans really need to grow and realize that they are fans. they will always be fans and they will never see a completely unfiltered BTS or Jimin cause that's just not how the music industry works. and when I say Jimin is manufactured I don't mean that he's gotten plastic surgery or that his whole personality is just entirely fake and that he's a horrible and entirely different person in reality. no, what I mean is that his every move is planned. every time he dyes his hair, every time he posts something, everything appearance he makes on talk shows are carefully calculated business moves to create hype around BTS. to sell their product. of course, some things he does are not entirely manufactured but he has to watch what he does and what he says to not tarnish his image and that is exactly what I mean when I say that Jimin and BTS are manufactured. I love BTS and I love their music. BTS makes me genuinely happy but I KNOW that they aren't completely honest with us all the time. I know that they make mistakes and they are not some sort of gods. I'm only 14 and even I can see this. we need to stop pretending that they are some sort of gods who do no wrong, who are always completely selfless and honest with us cause they are not. please stop. you are the reason that ARMY's get ridiculed for being "crazy teenage fans"
dr phil didnt say that jimin is manufactured. he said that his image is manufactured, which is a fact. they're international celebrities, they're gonna have a celebrity persona in order to still have a private life. some fans especially it seems in kpop where sharing a lot of clips and info is normal don't realize that they don't Know their idols. one of the bts members seokjin has literally said (and probably others) that the jin he shows to the world and to the camera is not the jin he is, only an aspect and only what he wants people to see. this is true in pretty much all media. no one said that they're not genuine people or artists
I remember him saying and I think it was burn the stage that he gets depressed a lot but he tries to keep up with good face for the others in the group.
Some bts fans don't even bother to listen to their music it seems. They literally have a whole album talking exactly about this, in which they explore about the differences and similarities between their artistic selfs and themselves as persons. The first track is even called "intro: persona" lol. Jimin himself has a solo track there called "Filter" in which he speaks on how he's able to create different images of himself, catering to people's preferences. I think the "real person/persona" is an existencial dichotomy every performer has to deal with, and it must be really hard to come to terms with that. I mean, every person itself isn't a monolith, we present ourselves differently depending on who we are with to an extent, even unconsciously. But when you're put on the spotlight, it maximizes.
me, an ARMY watching this and actually agreeing that Jimin's *image* is manufactured, not his personality, wondering why kpop twt had to embarrass us like this : 👁️👄👁️
Even his personality is. No one can be in that competitive of an environment that if they step a toe out of line they're out, and not put on an act for their audience and a camera. They have an image to uphold, a way they have to act. It's just the K-Pop industry, not saying he's bad or anything, but to continue to be in the spotlight, he has to be that perfect, manufactured person. This isn't a new concept, it's been around since boybands were popular in the US back in the 1990's.
I'm not a BTS fan and don't listen to their music. But some k-pop stans r just way too protective about k-pop idols. Like u don't have the right to control how they live. I also don't respect Dr. Phil but Dr. Phil wasn't "attacking" jimin, all he was saying is that he's manufactured and marketed.
So when Jimin faced backlash for drinking at a bar and having a chat with a fan while on his vacation that wasn’t because of his manufactured image? Or when he hides the fact that he has a tattoo even though we can all tell he does because of preserving his image! Who are we all kidding! I am a fan of BTS for years now, I enjoy their music and the content they put out there and the more you see and learn about them the more you realize that they can never truly live their authentic life due to always having to preserve a specific image of good and pure boys. It is ridiculous assuming that the image we see of any of the boys is their true self, we might see snippets of their personalities but never the whole thing!
It's frustrating because I feel like all those image rules are all imposed on them specifically by Korean idol culture, but BTS is international and the majority of their fanbase isn't Korean. While I can't speak for everyone, i-armys mostly agree that whenever stupid drama comes up it really shouldn't be a big deal. Like when JK was caught having lunch with the tattoo artist, did anyone actually care? It seemed the only thing everyone was angry about was the fact that the picture was leaked in the first place! The restrictions are totally unnecessary imo. Their fans would still love them even if they went on dates or broke the mold in terms of looks because it wasn't them being pretty, pure boys that made them #1 on Billboard. I hate feeling like that by being a fan I am also being a jailer.
Honestly I had to leave BTS and kpop behind. I stanned BTS for about 3 or 4 years and spent tons on albums, merch, BT21, all kinds of stuff, and it made me super happy. I even saw them in concert. But I used Twitter to keep connected and up to date with everything that they did, and the stans there were so toxic that it took a legitimate toll on my mental health. May sound dumb, but whenever I saw army on this dumb shit, I felt like I had to hop in and try to get them to stop being ridiculous, but I just got attacked. And seeing the fandom be so toxic and dumb made me really upset even when it wasn't directed at me. So I deleted my Twitter and bc of the negative association I had with them and the fact I couldn't keep up on Twitter, I just moved on to different things (but their songs still all bop when I hear them)
@@frog-sp6yc they're also quite literally manufactured. like K-pop idols literally are required to change their appearance. I remember this K-pop idol dude who had beautiful brown curly-ish hair and they forced this guy to straighten it bleach it and get a minor tan to fit the image of an idol better
@@frog-sp6yc I'm aware. I simply added on to what you said because you're replying to a stan and "they don't own their life" is far too simple an explanation
'theres no way i can be my most authentic self whilst having in the back of my mind that many people are watching me' felt that. made a video just now and it took me 30 mins to say something that's around 10 mins. the editing was rough but i kept pausing and saying the same thing over and over again until i said it in a way that... just doesn't seem like me. loved the video btw, it's a little old but your 'camera persona' is engaging enough to make older news seems fun and new again. thank you!!!
I’m a BTS fan and I agree with everything you said in this video. I can’t speak for all fans, but at least in the part of the fandom I’m in, I constantly see tweets calling out delusional fans who think they “own” an idol and reminding everyone that we don’t truly know them and we will never truly know them because everyone is different on camera and off. Also, I cracked up when you said whenever you see BTS trending you assume one of them died
I'm a BTS fan and have been a fan of kpop since I was around 11. I'm 23 now if that puts anything into perspective. All performers from every aspect are marketed and manufactured. I'm a performer, with an agency and there are certain things that your agency will do to pitch you to the correct market in order to make money. That's completely normal. You may not be marketed according to how you are in reality. Who you are as a performer is not 100% you, it is only a fraction of that and sometimes depending on how much control an agency has on a persons image, that image is entirely different that the real you. Over the years I have watched artists mold and change according to the market, and it's normal. It isn't an insult to point out that this is how the entertainment industry works. It's like this ALL OVER THE WORLD. I can see how someone might misinterpret was was said by Dr. Phil, but that's all he meant. He was talking about Jimin as an idea and a concept pitched by his agency for marketing purposes, versus Jimin off camera on his down time. Also, I'm pretty sure Ollie London got free promotion for his music through that Dr. Phil episode...so...there's that.
True, when someone finds out I listen to kpop they roll their eyes INSTANTLY and ofc I’ll be upset, cause the rudest and meanest fans are the loudest and that’s the majority if not the only thing those other people who don’t listen to kpop see online.... it’s really exhausting cause I want to tell those people that we aren’t all like that but I don’t want to look like I’m attacking them and defending any certain group with my dear life, but unfortunately that’s how they portray it cause that’s all they see....😔
Honestly with this mob mentality of toxic fans it gets hard to share genuine interests in certain communities because we get generalized and judged. I avoid telling people I'm into anime/K-pop until I know that they're also into it.
Im a Kpop fan and specifically a fan of BTS. That being said i completely agree with the fact that all kpop idols are manufactured! and not only in kpop, every single famous person has at least a team of people behind them, working on their image and appearances. That doesnt mean those people are bad, this is just how celebrities are portrayed nowawdays.
OK, OK ,OK I think you mixing up a persona as being inauthentic(since when are these terms interchangeable), like just because you literally don't always come on camera and spill your guts don't mean your in inauthentic ,you saying BTS are manufactured kind of feels like you're discrediting their their artistry and the stance's they take as fake. Also that part about the hair trending literally makes no sense about them being manufactured like if your in the fandom the dumbest shit be trending, like #closethegyms. Thats how twitter works my dude ,when you have such a big fandom shit trends.
it's quite literally fact that they're marketed and manufactured. they're groomed and trained from a very young age to act and portray themselves in a specific way. the way they look act, conduct themselves, speak, and the 'personalities' they have are not real. nothing that D'Angelo said was false in any way. They are inauthentic. They're not real.
@@khalfani414 they are also humans wtf saying that they arent real and are inauthentic takes away the fact that they have freedom and are not corporate puppets like western media portrays asian artists. it’s literally the same with ANY celebrity in the west, they would act different in front of the camera but that doesnt mean that they have a whole different personality off cam, maybe stop believeing anything that dangelo says lmao
@@naur9880 what you just said just contradicted yourself yk.. "they would act different in front of the camera" - "that doesnt mean that they have a whole different personality off cam" 💀💀💀
@@whoiissofi it's literally psychology, you will behave differently subconsciously knowing you're on the cam, dvmb mf keyword is behave, that's different from assuming a whole different personality like a whole 180 degree of your character, literally what's so hard to get????
I've lost respect for K Twitter a long time ago. Like when they did the whole "[insert someone who has passed way] wouldn't have died if you stanned [insert any kpop group]." That stuff was messed up on a whole new level
there are alot of shitty sides to kpop Twitter. alot of that type of thing was actually part of the intricate strategy of some fanwars. haters of different groups would make fake "stan accounts" for a hated group, and post comments like this on tragic events to get the general public to join in on hating the group they disliked. the people who did/do this tend to be shunned by the community as a whole, but that doesn't stop them from barging into public spaces to try and generate hate for their "enemies."
those are mostly trolls though, i've yet to see more than maybe two people who were actual fans of said artists who did that. it's really a fucked up thing to do regardless though, don't get me wrong
i'm confused as to why this is such a thing. literally every artist in the public eye is, to some extent, manufactured. this is simply a fact. why are kpop stans trying to act as if it's just an opinion of the few?
literally every celebrity or company has a manufactured marketing image that is how they make money, it's just business. Better Reputation = Higher Profit, roles marketing.
I think BTS fans got upset bc manufactured seems like Jimin isn't a real person with feelings. He hasn't had plastic surgery, and experts (plastic surgeons) have said it's unlikely he did. BTS are one of the few kpop bands that are really real with their fans. They show their flaws and troubles. So yeah, Jimin could be a different person than we think, but manufactured sounded too dehumanizing. I mean isn't there some point in our life where we're faked things to seem perfect, or fit an image? We all have flaws we feel we should hide. We're human, and so is Jimin. Dr. Phil could have worded it better. Also the reason Kpop twiiter is getting protective of Jimin is because Oli is very creepy to Jimin. Some kpop idols are fake, but not BTS. Well it's not likely they are fake. Former people who have worked with them have said how humble and nice they are. One member(Jungkook) thanked a cleaner in the bathroom just for doing their job. BTS have donated to India during covid 19, two million dollars. One million to BLM, was donated by them. Their lives weren't always perfect, and still aren't so that's why people are protective. Also I'm not hating on anyone just giving some background info. Oli can only seen Jimin though as a singer, who has many fans. He's too blind to see the real Jimin who is creeped (it keeps on giving me a red line anyway so I'm just spelling it like this) out by him.
Wait I just realized something? Even yoongi from bts talked about how Suga (his stage name) is a manufactured image he said in his solo music stuff like “behind every idol rapper who succeeds there’s a true self standing behind that name” and stuff like that as well as stuff like “reality separation” and you get the idea
I have been a part of BTS army since 2014, and I´m so embarrassed by these types of fans who need to make drama out of everything. Dr. Phil spoke facts when saying this
Same! I was only around 9/10 at the time so I really didn't care too much about what other people were saying, but as kpop grew more and more popular over the years it was saddening to see it grow into such a hateful (yet loving) place. A lot of people are so cruel and it really sucks because no one is perfect and people trying to "own" kpop idols and trying to tell them what to do is dehumanizing (sorry I went on a rant lol)
2:10 extra information regarding oli london: CW: racism, Islamophobia. 1) He has attacked a youtuber called "Sherliza Moé" and tried to destroy her business by saying false and defamatory things about her because she criticized him. 2) He called a muslim girl "oppressed and brainwashed" for wearing a burqa because she called him a tool. 3) He made a song called "Lockdown City" in the middle of a pandemic. 4) He once went to someone that JUST hit 18, and was like "you're pretty and gorgeous", it's pretty suspicious considering this person JUST hit 18. 5) He once said "I want a cute kpop nose". 6) He once wore cornrows, then said it makes him feel more "gangster" for his new hip-hop song. When people called him out, he said (and I quote) "It's just hair! Get a grip".
Side note: Allkpop is not the place to go for reasonable, adult kpop conversations. In 2013, Allkpop leaked the nude photos of the singer Ailee. Their CEO was her ex and some of the photos were also likely taken when she was a minor. So after that, most people wouldn't touch that site. The people that are there now are mostly newer kpop fans that weren't around for that and just don't know. But newer kpop fans are also more likely to be younger and more..aggressive in the defence of their idols.
I think it's hard for ppl to hear their faves are manufactured bc they've felt a connection to these people and dont want that invalidated. I think some ppl see "manufactured" as "completely fake," which is wrong and what might set ppl off. It's a refined and perfectly packaged product, sure, but that doesn't have to mean there's no truth or sincerity behind it. Maybe that's where some of the outrage comes from when kpop is called manufactured.
Sarah Beara completely agree. I have to admit before I got into kpop i would use the term manufactured as meaning completely fake and while I’m sure dr Phil wasn’t doing that I think that’s how most people do use it when talking about kpop.
Sarah Beara all idols show their true personality more or less on camera, but people really have a hard time seperating the idol from the person. F.x. i like Nico D’angelo and i believe he’s always talking about his opinions and showing a lot of his personality... doesnt mean i know him or that it isn’t manifactured tho. But yeah, Kpop fans are prickly beings that instead of trying to understand always jump straight to either defense of offense.
I wonder if people will even consider what I am going to write next. People who watched the whole episode knows that Oli London wants to look like Jimin really bad, "his nose, lips and eyes" (I am quoting)... but never once has he mentioned he wants to have his personality, dance like him or sing like him. Basically he is not interested in his idol persona. So when Dr Phil said that Jimin is manufactured, they assumed he was talking about his facial features as Oli doesn't want anything else from him, he explained that to Dr Phil. So, here is where the indignation jumps, Jimin does not have any surgery but people have been insulting him and the other BTS members about being plastic dolls for years. People got mad that Dr Phil will encourage those comments when a simple search on his childhood pictures will tell you he is natural. Jimin, out of all BTS members, underwent serious body image issues years before BTS blowed up. Got massive online criticism ( by non-fans) because he was a bit chubby which almost lead to eating disorders. He confessed his fragile state of mind and got mocked for being weak and not suck it up like a man. It is a sore topic for the fandom that him, out of all members, has his appearance being questioned once again. Dr Phil could have better said "the whole kpop industry is manufactured" but instead he said: "Jimin is manufactured" when all the episode they talked strictly about his facial features. Hence, it was taken as a bad generalisation instead of a well researched fact
@@BellroseJewel I see! I didn't see the Dr. Phil episode beyond what was included here, but I can see why fans would have an issue with that wording. Did Dr. Phil tell Oli that he can't ever look like Jimin bc he isn't even Asian? I feel like that's really all that needs to be said but Oli is... really something else, so I don't think anything anyone tells him means anything. :///
what K-pop groups/artists should I give a chance? (not bts)
nct !!! their concept is cool u might like it
Idk
dangelowallace
you should Totally listen to Sudan Archives album Athena. It’s a very good album
dangelowallace not specifically pop but oohyo has really nice chill music with a touch of pop
exo or monstax !!
Remember when jimin was spotted in a club just hanging out having fun as he should...but what happened next? People got mad because he went to a fucking club...what was he supposed to do tea party smh
Ifkr. He is a grown ass man and he has his own life like- *sigh*
And when jungkook went to the night club with his friends
I agree with you!
@@joliearanda6481 Yeah, but that was like during covid, sooooooooooooo
@@diyagore1784 It wasn't even during covid though, it was posted during the pandemic but the picture was taken way before the outbreak
I swear, nobody hates kpop stans more than kpop stans
This is so accurate oh my goodness 🤣
your speaking facts even me as a kpop stan (well mainly a bts stan) dont like most kpop stans that ive come across on twitter. TRUST if your a baby stan dont go on twitter its a dangerous place.
Honestly, I’m a kpop stan but I HATE kpop stans with a passion.
@@faeyee me too
Honestly😂
I'm pretty sure EVERYONE famous in the music industry is manufactured, not their faces, not their personalities, just their image. It's not only kpop, it's anywhere near a camera and a famous person.
Not even just music tv personas too. So dr. Phil is also manufactured.
Say it louder for the ones in the back saying it’s only the kpop industry
@@camillefejgh
Its more wroser and obvious in kpop
@@abirmohamed8343 I am a k pop Stan and I must agree the images in the k pop industry is more extremely manufactured
@@riahlexington exactly, he contradicts himself
BTS LITERALLY SPOKE OUT ABOUT THIS. They have multiple songs discussing this fake facade that they're forced to show. They even have songs about this FAKE LOVE is literally a fucking diss to the industry, and about how theyre viewed as dolls and not humans, how they're being photographed,stalked, touched without their consents and they have to fake being okay with it because as idols they're dehumanized. Jimin's songs are fucking cries for help. Lie discusses the struggles of his depression and being trapped as an idol. "Get away away away from me. Me who is trapped, caught in a lie, I couldn't run away, save me same from this lie, me who is being punished,give me back my smile" LIKE BITCH???? even FILTER talks about changing his personality to suit everyone's taste. Even IDOL talks about the shit.
BTS even made BURN THE STAGE to show people some of the struggles they're going through. Injured Jungkook still needs to dance. Taehyung and Jin fought and had to act normal and lovey dovey on stage. Jimin had a fucking breakdown because his voice kept breaking from exhaustion,that boy cried and had a meltdown and was still forced to go out and sing.
On their recent Festa, Jin talked about their first years where he was PROHIBITED FROM LAUGHING. Fucking laughing. He wasn't allowed to laugh out loud because he was forced to be a " Cool,Quiet type" and was forced to eat only boiled chicken breast for a YEAR because they had to keep him slim as fuck to push the " Shoujo Manga" look.
They are manufactured. It's not their fault. They're forced to do that to survive in the industry that tolerates nothing but perfection from its elites. BTS has been trying to break away from that shit but they're still bound to that norm. Saying that they're manufactured is not an attack on them,but a criticism to the industry itself.
Your comment is making me cry😢😭😭😭😭😭
@Milky Audios but the comment is agreeing with that statement. Why would they need a "chill pill"?
I don’t listen to BTS or any kpop for that matter but I knew of this stuff and it makes me feel so bad for them. All celebrities have to go through this in one way or another, but I feel in the kpop industry they do it 10x worse than like in American pop industry. Once I saw this one group dancing on stage and one of the girls passed out in the middle of it and THEY KEPT DANCING. It’s like they were forced to ignore their member literally passing out from being overworked. It’s terrible and because of that and the toxic kpop community, it just makes me not even want to give the music a try. It’ll feel bittersweet
Write that on Twitter. People need to hear this
For all this typing and for spilling all of how you feel also behalf on what we also feel thank you, you deserve more likes
i don’t think these people even understand what a “manufactured marketing image” means, because literally every single celebrity is one.
abyss exactllyyy
Estela Lopez Not true at all. It’s the exact same in America just cultural differences exist between Korea and America that have nothing to do with the entertainment industry
Exactly
When you really get down to it we all are. We don't let the people who are not close friends or family see every part of our lives. We present an image when we go to the store out to eat anywhere we put on our public mask. We just don't get paid to do it.
“Kpop Twitter tries to cancel dr Phil” sounds like a really bad fever dream
*buwahahaha*
You know when you finish the main storyline an open world RPG and just roaming around aimlessly and exploring and you come across a million bugs and areas where the game begins to break like respawned invincible enemies, graphic glitches etc.
That has what life has felt like since 2012.
You should listen to stray kids, they have more of an edm sound so if you don't really like that i recommend Day6
Lmao
Sir this is a McDonalds drivethru please stop laughing
out of all of the stupid, terrible shit that "dr." phil has actually said and done, imagine getting upset about THIS. like.... priorities???
Would you please mind sharing what he has said and done? I am a foreigner and do not know much about him.
@@Kitty-mb4hy The latest controversy was at the beginning of the COVID outbreak in the US. Dr. Phil went on FOX News, which is a well known far right-wing propaganda outlet. He said that Americans shouldn't worry about COVID claiming that 360,000 people died from drowning in a swimming pool yearly, which was more deaths than we had at time. However, the real number was actually 3,600. I think our death toll at the time was still smaller than 3,600, but he contributed to the blatant disinformation being spread about COVID that has sadly been a major factor in why our death toll is so high today.
@@jaidabody3874 wow. tthank you for sharing
Dr. Phil don’t give a shit about anyone 😭 You should watch Danielle Bregollis (idk how to spell her last name) video about him and how he don’t gaf
@@jaidabody3874 like how cnn, msnbc, trevor noah, snl, every late night show is a far left wing propoganda. The hypocrisy.
as a kpop stan, everyone with a brain knows celebrities are all “manufactured” they all have a fake image to look perfect. some may be more open about their real self but no idol or no celebrity is the same off camera. and this is all very obvious you just need common knowledge
exactly, only a few kpop stans like myself actually have brains and know this is true. others either don't believe it or continue to deny it cuz they're just that dense
This goes for you as well then. If wearing make up or clothes makes you manufactured it’s not just celebrities
@@kstar1489Nope. it's not just about makeup or clothes, we're talking about their personality & character as a whole. they are expected to not only appear but also ACT a certain way on camera; one wrong move and it's all over.
Yea everyone knows but not everyone wants to acknowledge it for some reason
Sure. Even normal people have different images of themselves in different environments as well.
I think that fans forget that BTS is a part of an industry that sells ideals. RM himself says (in Burn The Stage) that he struggles with having two identities: RM and Kim Namjoon. RM is an image and personality created by BigHit and his own creativity and talent, while Kim Namjoon is just a person that probably behaves differently when not in front of a camera.
This comment is underrated thank you
does he have did or smth aw twins
@@heeseungpilled2003 I don't think it's DID just putting on a persona to perform. A lot of entertainers do this, especially if they're shy - in example, Beyoncé and her persona Sasha Fierce. But I don't know him personally so who knows.
That’s literally what almost all Kpop artists go through
Jess Kim That doesn’t make it okay? If anything that makes it much, much worse
Idk why people acting like Dr. Phil said Jimin is a whole robot that was birthed from a machine.
He literally just said his image his manufactured, which is true. It’s true for like, all celebrities/brands.
many stans just get defensive because they always think people are saying their idol is fake
Obviously many idols are not 100% fake and staged, but there is ethics and a way to portray yourself as an artist
Also people think that others attack idols for plastic surgery or something, and they listen to these generalized opinions and raaaaage.
It's something common and nothing deadly to rage about, many koreans do want to do a little change on their eyelids or nose, it's just the way it is, it's just another face of earth society :p
I like kpop but its true .
Well all stars have a manufactured image, but not all have to work until they collapse for basically no money without any form of selfexpression in public and private
(do what others want you to do, don't have any relationships or anything that could uncover the actual you, don't do anything that could risk the image the company wants you to have or get fired)
Sorry... Just that theres a massive difference between kpop n everything else.
Even ballerinas get paid more and treated better than kpop stars it seems
Little Loner
Well it depends on the company, but yeah. Trust me, kpop fans know. They’ve been fighting with the companies since the end of time. If we’re specifically talking about Jimin though, he does get paid. And while he has worked himself till he collapse it was not forced by the company, he did it on his on volition, but he’s recovered from that mindset. The dating ban is stupid, and it’s starting to deteriorate slowly, so let’s hope for the best on that one. But yeah, kpop entertainment companies are crazy corrupt, practically sadistic.
army:once:elf:exol multi I totally agree! I stg all these people who were like “JiMiN iS nOt MaNuFaCtuReD” like they need to chill, dr Phil was not “attacking” anyone, in the business of a celebrity their image is manufactured to go according to the public, it does not mean they’re fake. I’m a big BTS fan but some army need to chill😶
I mean, Jimin doesn’t even look like “Jimin” without makeup on.. and he’s pretty open about that.
To paraphrase Jungkook, “Jimin is cute normally, and suddenly sexy with makeup on”
yes lol
@Halies yes lmao
Yeah i agree lol
To paraphrase jungkook?
What
every celebrity is a manufacturered image. Kpop stans need to chill.
if we are real the whole world is actually manufactured
Yeah, no shit. There are cameras.
@@meimei-dj9gp lol. Same here.
@@meimei-dj9gp me too lol its just that these "stans" are the louder one's but not all of us are like that lmao
as a kpop Stan, I agree. A lot of BTS “stans” need to calm tf down..
Kpop Twitter is typing…
*nervous sweating*
as a korean, it concerns me that k-pop “stans” are so defensive. k-pop idols are forced into diets, exercise, etc. dr phil isn’t lying. also, oli london doesn’t look CLOSE to asian.
period.
K-pop yes. BTS no and that is why they contribute 4.6 billion to your economy ten times the whole shitty pop industry combined.
@@pennybleta2300 your claim actually furthers the notion that bts is manufactured. They formed as a group due to a manufactured audition process, got put into positions in the group that would increase their popularity based off of their talents, got promoted on multiple media platforms to increase awareness about them, ext. Their company agreeing to letting them be active on social media was a strategic move to promote them, something that most kpop companies don't allow to their artists. Bighit knew that and used it to their advantage. As they got more popular, revenue started coming in that contributed to the economy, which got noticed by the actual government of korea. The promoting department in the Korean government (@ sleep is IrrelevAnT correct me what it's called) asked bts to make a song for them that would promote travel to south korea, which in turn also promoted bts. It's all manufactured, which isn't a problem at all. As long as the artists and their fans can distinguish their *persona* from their *true* selves, then there shouldn't be a problem. Unfortunately, there are some fans that can't disnguish the two. Fortunately, most fans and bts themselves can, as shown in literally bts' albums love yourself and map of the soul (specifically *persona*)
@@quidditch1991 What a load of bullshit. This whole paragraph you wrote shows you know nothing about BTS. Watch this video to educate yourself on the matter because not only what you said is bullcrap but uninformed as heck.
ua-cam.com/video/rBsZhHPA7t8/v-deo.html
Don't bother to come back unless you make an actual effort to educate yourself on who BTS are and why they are called a once in a lifetime phenomenon which led to their contribution to SK economy. I will only respond back to you if you show signs that you actually watched the video of a journalist that has done his research unlike you. And just to give you two hints about your ignorance. First BTS didn't begun as an idol group but a hip hop one they later changed in an attempt to become more known. They weren't trained like other idols to acquire skills but to hone in their own. Each BTS member was already skilled and accomplished each in their field before they joined BTS. They adopted the training system but not as the idol industry dictated. In fact they fought this shitty industry and it's rules since day one. And that is why they succeeded when this shitty industry dictated they never would according to its rules which despite their success it doesn't show signs of changing any time soon. And the second one is no BTS weren't promoted in any media due to their company being a small bankrupt one. Their broadcasts were being cut and they were replaced by Big3 and more famous ones and were told as such in their face. Which is the reason BTS used other internet platforms to communicate with their fans and which made them more accessible and showed their personality and daily lives to us fans. Suga himself has said that they should not filter anything for the fans. And of course on stage they use a persona but not when they communicate with us.
Penny Bleta He comments under every comment. Imagine how sad his life must be in order to keep writing all of these comments so he feels better about himself.
bts themselves literally said that they're way different off camera compared to on camera
no they haven't taehyung has literrally said he doesn't need to act different on camera and off camera because he has nothing to hide. so have ppl who have worked for them
no they haven't?
no they literally haven’t... bts have been proven to act the same irl and on camera and they don’t feel the need to act any different. please stop putting words in their mouths to try to get them to fit into the narrative you want :( it’s really not good.
Lol your replies are funny asf. Crying over lil boys byee 😂😂
Many ppl can prove u wrong, and bighit staff can prove that lol
The word “idol” itself *literally means* that this image is superhuman. Same thing with fashion models - the word “model” means it is a certain type of look/body. This is why those of us who are not working as idols or models so easily put our own fantasies and ideologies onto those who are. It’s the concept of “eidolon” - the “ideal image.” It’s............problematic in a lot of ways, but yes I still listen to predominantly South Korean music. Yikes I’m a part of the problem.
Thank you for pointing that out. It's in the name. I don't know why people don't realize that.
ANPANMAAAANNNNN
I think it's fine to partake as long as you're critical and acknowledge the faults; that's leagues better than the fanbase being solely made up of rabidly loyal people that wouldn't stop supporting a member if they committed murder. Everything in moderation!
I do understand what you mean, but idol is a Korean term (in this context) and doesn’t necessarily mean the same thing in English. I do know what you mean though
Hangyereul neomeo Superhuman
I sungan jinjjareul bwa Babe
Gamchwowasseossdeon naui mameul kkaewobwa
You saved my heart
It really isn't inaccurate. All huge celebrities are a manufactured image. it wasn't even a personal attack..
@I love Angelique are they? Is it? Idk... Maybe just the image that they have to put out is. Are ALL of them like that?
in my opinion, their image has to be manufactured, but it doesn't make it a fact. so I guess we'll never know, will we?
@Perla Lopez Gomez okay
Exactly and it isn't even a bad thing! People are so offended by it but it's not meant to be mean towards him.
@@sanasana_5625 thank you! this is what I've been thinking.
I still don't get why Armies are criticizing Dr. Phil. Dr. Phil is just trying to help Oli London, not attack BTS or Jimin.
Don’t take stan twitter serious. They’ll get pressed over a pen.
Edit: thanks for the likes losers
😂
IM SCCREAMINGKSKSJSJSJSJDBSHHDS
literally all you have to do is breathe in the direction of their favs and all hell breaks loose
fact
wtf? a pen? do you KNOW HOW OFFENSIVE THAT IS? YOURE SO IGNORANT
I am an army and I agree with you ... I wish these toxic stans would magically vanish but sadly that's just my imagination 😭
You just need the infinity stones
@@alainachanel08 reality can be whatever you want
Lol, you sound like a nice/non-toxic kpop stan. That's refreshing, cuz all of armys keep attacking me lol 😭
@@unknown-ke4ro bruh why are they attacking you 💀
@@abdia5044 bro, idfk 😭
They are attacking me cuz I'm a 1D Stan, stupid innit? If you're an army you'll know that our fandoms don't get along. 😭😭 Idek why bro lmao
Dude, one time a Kpop Stan asked me why I don’t listen to Kpop. I said “It doesn’t appeal to me. It all ends up kinda sounding the same” and 5 different Stans called me racist
Honestly, that's a much more respectful take than the ones that just assume they all look the same or that they're too feminine.
@@queenqong5381 exactly. I wasn’t even against Kpop. I don’t even dislike it, I just don’t listen to it 🤷🏻♂️
@@ME6ATURTLE I feel you on that, when people know I listen to metal they're like: "It all sounds the same, it's just anger and noise" and I know I have no way of convincing them otherwise if they're not willing to listen to some, which they are not. So I just brush it off and change the subject.
Some people don't know how to respect others'opinions. As long as you're respectful, I don't really mind if you like or dislike kpop.
one time i said i didnt like kpop just because I dont like the music and it doesnt appeal to me and some girl called me racist because i guess that means i hate korean people? idek it was so dumb
Dude, even kpop stars know they're manufactured.
@Perla Lopez Gomez did they tho? I mean...how would they know that, really? Cause I see it this way: when they debuted they were out to be "sold" like any other product. But sales depend on the buyers, so if the product isn't interesting for the buyers, they wont buy it and it wont be popular. People got interested in BTS and they got popular buy they weren't so...yeah
@Perla Lopez Gomez ok
@Perla Lopez Gomez they didn't really tho… especially Namjoon has been vocal about the fact that after debut they literally thought people would hate them and they were scared of not appealing to the public
Perla Lopez Gomez they literally almost disband when they first started out because they were broke and not very popular...
zimsalabean exactly...
just wanna say right off the bat allkpop is a miserable excuse for journalism, they've done a lot of stuff from a bit shady to outright leaking someone's nudes. but i agree with the video overall, even though i like kpop myself
I used to go on there all the time when I was younger and it’s just full of trolls. The ones who commented on the articles were worse than the ones who were in the forums. The user generated content is full of bias and starts many fan wars.
Also, they've always been cringey
I've always said that Asian Junkie and Kpopalypse are the _peak_ of kpop journalism. I know people don't like them because of the satire doesn't translate well to everyone but the posts are not biased and there all kinds of people in the comments but most are level headed.
@SwimmerGirl95 how about no
Also I just want to add that d angelo totally roasted me but I’m here for it 😂
K pop stars are literally groomed from childhood, they pluck the cutest, most charismatic kids with perfect voices and bone structures from their private schools and then their put through the machine.
Not all.. Atleast I know bts... Rm and Sugar were underground rappers before they joined bts.. They were criticized for not fitting beauty standard, jungkook auditioned in 7 music companies and they scouted him but he decided to enter big hit because he saw Rm rap, jin was scouted while getting off a bus with no music background, V and jhope auditioned and was picked, jimin was a dancer, the top male contemporary dancer in his class, class president for 9years, school valecditorian, maths wizard, very good in martial arts, good in hip hop dancing not that good in vocals but can still hold a note but he was almost cut 8times before debut... He was the last member and trained for only 3months before debut..
@Mia Pedriana I'm 26 and I'm Jimin biased and I don't hide it but maybe you should get to know about them to know that he didn't train for a year... He was not a vocalist before joining the group, he studied contemporary dance but when he entered bighit he had to learn a different type of dance,bighit almost cut him 8 times, V said they accepted Jimin because when V was asked he said he needs a friend like Jimin in the group. Jimin said himself he's an examplary student on jimmy fallon show, he said he was school president for 9 years, he is so good in maths and physics that he even comes up with his own formula, he became a local celebrate when he came out on top his class as a contemporary dancer which is rare for boys, he already trained in kendo, has a blackbelt in taekwando, was offered a Chinese scholarship for martial arts, he also knows hapkido... Did I say the other members are not good? I just answered the person who said they are trained by their label.. Jimin was already good in so many things before entering bighit yet he was cut almost 8 times prior to their debut.. So what is wrong in what I said.. I just stated facts.
@Jane girl I'm 26 and I stated facts... Though they pass through training most of them already have so many skills and talents before being scouted... It may seem like fan fiction but its real.. He was almost removed 8 times if not for one of the members V.. They have talked about it openly so I didn't make it up.
@@sophiaumeh9553 Alot of them are still not treated all that well while their trainees and they are probably scared to talk about their real selves online or even their love lives or anything and the truth is you will never know the true them.
@@madisonblair9423 I know what you mean and that's why I'm not defending celebrities I don't know... I defended bts because I have been listening to them since 2013... Just recently Suga came out and said that he feels empty inside, Jin also made a solo song abyss saying how he's depressed, jimin also released a solo song Christmas love and wrote on Twitter that it reminded him of his childhood.. They normally go on Clive and talk about their issues.. If they are manufactured they would not do that but I get what you mean.. Many celebrities don't show us everything but you can't blame them.. Society is tough on them.. They show you everything and you still bash them.. But the people bashing them are just like them... I mean as an individual there are things you don't do when you are not in the mist of friends or under scrutiny... It's just easy to see it in them because they are celebs but we live the same life everyday.. Now will you now call it manufactured.. It's not.. Manufactured means they are like dolls and don't have the mind of their own.. That's wrong.
As an Army I really don't know about this issue. But damn, twitter stans are scary. This is one of the reason why I don't like using twitter and tiktok. There's always an issue and a war.
"if you never heard of oli london" every kpop stan knows that scary name.
😂ikr
I know right, I still have nightmares of that guy.
😂😂😂 so scary
I bet jimin gets nightmares 🚮
Lol yeah
I feel like half of the twitter comments are from 12 year olds that don't know what "manufactured marketed image" means
Alon that’s why there’s age restrictions on apps 😭😂 but nobody ever follows those who am i kidding
I feel like all you spit are facts
multi fandom trASH yeah, true..
Not every 12 year old...
@@criistal_frappex253 right... 13 YEAR OLDS.
**me being 14 and sitting in the corner confused as to why everyone’s making this a big deal**
I basically stan ur username 😂
Your username though!!!!
And yeah, I feel you on this
Your user is the truth.
But where did he leave you?
A namjoon stan 😌 love your name
Same
Some kpop stans need to ✨calm down✨ (yes I’m a kpop Stan but I’m not crazy lmao)
Same
ew sparkle emojis
@@readmyabout8806 why don’t you like sparkle emojis?- 😃
Yasssss same
@@readmyabout8806 ✨✨✨✨✨
Jimin literally made a song called lie that talks about his struggles with self image
Yuki James exactly couldn’t have said it any better. In the song Jimin literally states that he had lost a part of himself in this phase of being an idol. He had so many struggles with body image he put himself and prob the company as well on a heavy diet. That’s why you could see him fainting on stage in one of his performances. Even Namjoon has come out and stated that being in the group has made him lose a part of himself because they’re always putting this facade in order to avoid making the fans unhappy but he always says that making music has always reminded him of who he truly is so that’s what’s keeping him on the ground and his family and friends. It’s really sad because idols have so many limits in order to avoid making fans upset. They obviously get tired of putting up these fake personas and that’s what the album Persona is all about cuz at the end of the day the members lost a part of themselves once they decided to join BTS.
Thats also why map of the soul persona was created
i’m pretty sure it was about his eating disorder and a voice in his head telling him to go back to his old ways, filter is about that tho
JUNGKOOOK lol ye that’s the same thing as a struggles with self image
n o s t a l g i c t h i n g z yeah but filter is more about the “manufactured” side of him
moral of the story: don't act like you know someone you've only ever seen on camera
florille PREACH TO THE CHURCH
Little Leah my good sis, it’s not all of us. there are crackheads in every family 😂🤷🏾♀️
Facts. Ive had people who follow me on social media simply b/c they think im pretty, have never met a day in life, they dont even kno what my voice sounds like think they kno me & tell me about myself im just like wtf? My social media is what i choose to show you about me, its all the *REAL ME!* just certain aspects about myself i chose not to put out there. Everyone doesn't deserve to really know u. Thats vip status & few have reached that level.
*TRIGGEREDDDDDDDDDDDDD*
@Estela Lopez fake and manufactured are two different things. They're obviously not fake because um duh... but yes they are manufactured.
And I don't think you know what I said, try reading it again and then we'll talk xx
I have to remember that a lot of these people on the internet are children so ideas as simple as "celebrities and influencers have manufactured images to increase profit" is very hard for them to grasp. It's frustrating lol. We are getting old
@@tteee7241 Where the hell did I say that?
@@llerretjazelle omg I’m so sorry i commented on the wrong thing 🤦🏻♀️
@@tteee7241 lmao ah okay I was so confused
Dr. Phil: "Why are you booing me? I'm right."
He’s an awful person tho and a hypocrite. I love ur pfp tho.
@@ollieno971 how come?
@@ollieno971 you should go on his show and talk about it
@@thedarkderp2520 uh yikes no. I have a therapist that is actually qualified and doesn’t televise our sessions I don’t need to talk to a gross quack doctor.
@@ollieno971 i wasn't being serious
KPOP is manufactured and that's just facts. It doesn't mean the idols are totally not themselves on camera periodically, but that image we get is created by marketing and publicity teams.
@@alyiv_ Thank you! I feel like some times people forget how sh*ty the american music industry really is. We need to talk more about it~
@@alyiv_ of course lol. That's widely and commonly known. I referenced kpop specifically cause his video focused on it mainly but every music industy everywhere has similar issues.
🙌🏿
@@user-yb7ph7un1o I think that while the US industry founded this manufactured system, South Korea is going above and beyond with group members eating ice to lose weight and being prohibited from openly dating or being gay. Obviously there was a time when things were like this in the US music industry but, with the "woke" movement, things have developed to the point where artists like Lizzo are sweeping Grammy noms when they would have been barred from the industry only a few decades prior. Before people get pressed, I'm not American and, while I don't listen to much K-pop, I'm a K-drama fan (as the dramas are actually a lot more progressive).
@@alyiv_ Not to this extent. Sure, American industry plant performers have it really bad, but it's nowhere near as bad as Korean ones. They're not allowed to date, to have phones, to even see their families unless they're scheduled to. They have to go on dangerous, life-threatening diets and do intense workouts, and they're the ones who pay for it. They're constantly in debt to their company, and barely get paid 25% of their actual profit. That's nothing compared to the American industry, which mostly deals with creating a false image of the artist and writing their songs for them, but still giving them the freedom to, you know, see their parents.
As a kpop fan it’s pretty obvious how manufactured kpop is like cmon they literal take in a group of teens and train them until their adults
lillie olette Although bts have came out with documentaries giving us a glimpse of what goes on behind the scene , that doesn’t make it any less manufactured, in fact it actually proves how much it is. I remember watching a clip on one of their documentaries on UA-cam and one of the members said something like “it’s not always what we portray it to be” or something like that
By this logic every person is "manufactured" in the job they have because they literally spend years in school and college for it.
Palash Jain yes true , but the kpop industry is extremely manufactured and you can’t compare that to everyday life. Look at how groups are performing on award shows. You see how perfect their performing . So perfect to the point where you can put the exact same song their performing side by side and there’d be no difference between the two videos except the clothes. Kpop is creating this perfect image portraying idols as perfect angles that can do no wrong . That’s manufactured
@@sourheadacheplayz2335 being perfect and manufactured are two different things. Manufactured means everything about them is decided by higher authorities. For the case of bts its different because their relationship with bighit is not so much like thus but more so of the kind of polishing their already existing strengths.
It's especially obvious when you look at performances in their own country and showcases vs when they're on tour and have more fun with it. Blackpink being the biggest example rn.
when you like Kpop but the stans are kinda crazy
when you like Kpop but 'normal people who listen to normal music' look down on me until it becomes trendy on tiktok for 15secs
idk what now?
As a BTS stan myself, ( who stays far away from twitter ) this situation really disappoints me because our reputation is going further down due to the twitter stans taking what Dr. Phil said wrong. I apologize on behalf of the SANE fans and hope that in the future less and less toxic fans will emerge. Thank you for spreading light on this.
i too am a 'fan' of kpop, but it's when some stans as people call them get too intricate about their idols 'everything', what they do, how they do, when they do, and, i apologize if this comes off as rude or offensive to any kpop fans, start attacking like rabid dogs on the street if their idols are given constructive criticisms of any sort. that kind of kills the appeal of people maybe dipping their toes into the kpop community. although ive had really good friends and even people close to me who like kpop and would never shun anyone for their likes. but i get it, though. they just want themselves to feel like they're shielding their role models. the bottomline is, doctor phil never condemned or shunned jimin's qualities or himself as a person in any way, and said the truth. most notably, before the days of kpop there was one direction, people were absolutely crazy after that band so i digress lol
@@AbdullahB17 exactly thats what I said in my comment, fans took what he said wrong and got pissed at him for nothing and the point was to say that as a bts fan that isnt toxic, im glad that the toxic fans are being called out but at the same time people need to understand that not every fan is toxic. Its mostly the twitter stans that are, and the majority are normal fans.
same
I think people sometimes forget that "Stan" comes from a story about a psycho superfan who kills himself.
OvO
There are different definitions tho if i'm correct the original meaning came from eminem's song stan and has the meaning of an obsessed stalker like fan but in in kpop it's used in a different way. We say we are stans when we not only listen to the groups songs but actively are in the fandom of the said group and practically know their names and watch a lot of their content. So saying i stan this group in kpop has not the same meaning of a stan in the west
And the definition stalker fan is called Sasaeng in the kpop industry so basically a saesang is an overly obsessed stalking fan who invades idols personal spaces and do crazy stuff like go into an idols house and shit on their ground and send them letter written with period blood (Both of these happened not just once...) That's called a saesang which is a stan in the western meaning but stan in kpop is a fan who is actively in the fandom and likes the group/artist a lot
@@Maze.-. That's really interesting, I didn't know that. Thanks!
@@AlyxDG Oh You are welcome
It’s really annoying because when kpop twitter does shit like this is completely invalidates any actually criticism fans may have. Like if a kpop fan and or stan says anything valid or not it immediately taken as we’re stupid and overreacting. And thanks for throwing it out there that not all fans are like this.
Exactly. So many people equate being a kpop fan with being like insane
And it's sad, i mean, we all know most of Twitter stans are toxic and kpop twitter is toxic to the point where it invalidates someone elses' opinion whether is the person who the stans are attacking or kpop fans themselves.
Alright, I've been saying the same thing and I've seen no one else say this. Not all kpop fans are rude and insane. I legit love you now-
@@ShaynaFlowers d'angelo said so in his video lolol
and don't forget the fancams that they spam everywhere
BTS themselves have talked about the struggle of having a persona to keep up lol
"JoJo's Blizzard Adventure." 😂😂😂 I just fucking died!!
I’m a big BTS fan and I love Jimin, but I literally don’t understand. OF COURSE kpop is manufactured, they are marketed to us as boyfriends and girlfriends, that’s how the business works. They were seven people who did not know each other and they were put together by their company. This means they were manufactured. This doesn’t detract from their message or their talent. The reason I’m a fan is because of what they stand for and their music/performances make me happy.
Same . I feel like some kpop fans are too sensitive and protective of their idols while most of the idols are grown adults and can handle criticism it reached to the point where you can’t criticize and share your honest opinion
This comment
Camelia Ales that just sounds like your calling out younger audiences, which is very wrong.
exactly, but now their bond is stronger and they have grown together to become "hyungs"
@@cameliaales67 that is true. but fans just feel the need to protect their idols because it DOES get upsetting to them. if you've seen this one RM interview where he said that he was scared to open social media bcs he was scared that he would get hate, you would know how much fans want to protect idols. bcs fans know how much they go through and don't want to let their idols have to deal with everything on their own
His IMAGE is manufactured and marketed. It’s literally not that deep. All idols have manufactured marketed images. Sit down Karen.
지훈 wouldn’t you rather wanna listen to an artist that isn’t fake as shit? christ.
지훈 the dude in the video also said his image is manufactured and marketed as well- there was no genuine need for you to type what u did lol.
@@whispersinvenice bro they were just agreeing with him
@@whispersinvenice wow, you feel so attacked
Rodney Taylor Bruh, can you read? Like... at all?
Aren't we all manufactured at times? I mean manufactured is a little dehumanizing, but I think Dr. Phil just meant we don't know Jimin like a close friend. We can't see more than he'll give us, although Jimin is pretty open with us.
The reason why a lot of people were upset is that Dr Phil's statement encourages, or at least aligns itself with a very harmful stereotype of not only K-pop idols but East Asian people in general. I don't think this is what was meant in the original conversation, but if you're into Kpop you've probably noticed how people tend to think of it as a very robotic industry + that Kpop idols are somehow less authentic than Western celebrities. This also goes hand in hand with common East Asian stereotypes of unnaturally talented and honed people, like math geniuses, working like computers, and generally being perfect copies of each other. This is a stereotype that Kpop idols are subject to a LOT, and BTS suffers the brunt of it because they're more exposed to people who don't know anything about Kpop. And Jimin specifically is the member who gets by far the most unwarranted hate. He's always specifically targeted for being too feminine, for looking "more Asian" than the rest, or even for having an auto-tuned sounding voice that's too high pitched for a guy, for "looking gay" or "like a girl." He's the most well-known member, so he's the most common target for completely unwarranted criticism (honestly criticism is a really soft way of putting it, the amount of death threats he's gotten at this point), and the thing with Oli London is also a form of harassment that he's unquestionably the victim of, but people still blame him and make fun of him for it all the time (even D'Angelo made a joke about it in the video before this).
The stereotype that people got really mad at Dr Phil for encouraging isn't plastic surgery or even just the basic manufactured image that celebrities all have, but that Kpop idols, and BTS specifically, and *Jimin* in particular, are somehow *more* manufactured and *less* human than other celebrities. It also goes along with this weird idea that people who don't know Kpop have that the appeal of Kpop is that everyone is perfect -- I'd say that's the complete opposite of what draws most people to K-pop. Yeah that's the initial shine to it, yes, everyone is very talented, but most people stay for the behind-the-scenes, knowing of course that it's not completely authentic, but the contact you have with Kpop artists through specifically the off-stage, imperfect moments is a huge draw for most K-pop fans. And Jimin is pretty well known for being extremely open about his work-related insecurities; he’s definitely the most personal and vulnerable Ive seen any artist get; he worked through some big body image issues while being pretty open about it with his audience, he’s talked so many times about not being happy with his vocal abilities or his dancing, and so many other things. He’s definitely not closed off or robotic; of course there’s a significant division between his public and private images, but if you want to call any celebrity plastic or closed off, Jimin should be one of the last people on the list. Not to mention that the "robotic," "clean," and "manufactured" nature of K-pop that a lot of people criticise, like certain mannerisms or customs, are just a part of Korean culture, which is also something racial stereotypes have normalised to us as foreign and inhuman. In the comments D'Angelo showed in the video of the "reasonable" K-pop fans saying that ALL K-pop idols are manufactured -- which is true -- notice how they were only talking about Kpop idols and not all celebrities.
I don't think it makes sense to dismiss criticism from people who know a lot more about the subject of the conversation than you do just because their profile picture is a BTS member. There were some "unreasonable" comments that actually might be making some good points if people tried to understand them and listen to them instead of just dismissing them as crazy because they disagree with them. Yeah a lot of the people talking about this are completely off the mark, but a lot of BTS fans actually (surprise) know a lot about BTS and might be able to contribute more to the conversation than someone who's not into K-pop at all.
*Edit:* I mentioned this in a reply but I think it's an important point I didn't mention before. First, I'm not in any way excusing or justifying any violence or aggression that came from this situation. The only thing I tried to do was give people a different perspective on the issue, which I think is more complex and more important than "look at all these delusional kpop girls." Besides that, and I think the most important part, is that I find it really strange that neither Dr Phil nor D'Angelo talked about how racist and genuinely disturbing this whole issue is. Not Dr Phil's comment, but Oli London's entire schtick which is based around stalking, harassing, and to a disturbing extent taking on the identity of a whole other human being by emulating and appropriating his East Asian features -- which are something that Jimin has been harassed and violated for many times in his life, but Oli London is able to take on as an aesthetic and profit off of. Not to mention that Jimin in particular has struggled since he was a kid with his own public body image and has serious mental health issues related to this, and it's widely known that this is in part due to the extensive harassment he's received online since a very young age for the shape of his face, eyes, etc. Oli often refers to himself as Jimin, he's had extensive surgery to look more "Korean," and he regularly refers to Jimin and other East Asian people's facial features as "cute" and "Kpop," and only hires East Asian people to be in his music videos, while openly fetishising East Asian features, cultures and languages. It's blatantly racist, but there's rarely any conversation around this aspect of the topic. Instead most people, including D'Angelo, have taken this whole thing as an opportunity to talk about Kpop fans. I think it says a lot about the people talking about this when their takeaway from the conversation is overwhelmingly "Kpop fans are crazy" rather than "this man is being racist, invasive, inappropriate; this is a form of harassment and discrimination that Jimin, a real East Asian person with feelings and self-agency, is unquestionably the victim of and it's not acceptable." Maybe we should be talking about where this type of behavior comes from, how it should be stopped, and why it's so easily normalized and rephrased into a joke at Jimin's expense.
Couldn't have said it better myself
Thank you so much for putting this together...this should be the pinned comment so that everyone can actually understand the thing...purple you and thnxx for giving so much time to do this.
Those are exactly my thoughts, thank you ❤
Hey, I appreciate and respect you for writing this out
You did a great job expressing your thoughts here and I personally really admire that 🙂 I’m also just always glad when we’ll spoken Army’s show up to deliver their thoughts it always helps me feel less embarrassed to be a part of this fandom.
(💜)
Kpop idols literally train for *years* to become "perfect". They dont just do dancing and singing training, they literally train *how to go on TV shows*, what kind of personalities they're going to have, and what they are and aren't allowed to say. They're prohibited from doing so much regular stuff in public (like dating, smoking, cursing) in order to serve their image. And they're literally forced to diet, sometimes starve, once again for their image. All kpop idols are MANUFACTURED. Everything they do is for their image. That doesn't mean they're not good people, but the idol you see and how they actually are is different.
I think this is part of the reason why so many people view k-pop as toxic. I'm not a k-pop fan really at all, and from what I have seen, all the toxic people are the people who actually think they are like this in real life, and get so offended by literally any criticism whatsoever. These are the same people who think celebrities are not manufactured in any way. Honestly, part of the reason I don't like k-pop is because it is so manufactured, and again, because of toxic stans.
@iyanna best you do realize that BTS members were trainees before debut.. They were also recruited at a young age and molded into idols. They are of course allowed to do all those things but they wouldn't dare do them publicly and if they did they would face harsh criticisms from Knetz. They also have to cover their tattoos while performing. Kpop idols are literally formed to be seen as PERFECT individuals. Hate to break it to you but BTS is no exception.
@iyanna best yeah I know bts has more freedom than many other kpop idols due to their popularity and their fan base being more international, but that didn't change the process they went thru to get there.
@@annejackielee i think what contributes to it a lot is media itself. the major broadcasting stations are very strict and do all they can to avoid "offending" the public.
take tattoos as an example. tattoos are widely seen to be gang related by the general public in korea. it's just how it is. and so, to avoid offending these people, when kpop idols are onstage, they are forced to tape up their tattoos. if idols want to gain popularity and earn money and just be successful, they have to do the best they can to be seen as perfect by the public. it's toxic and so horrible but its been this way for so long.
this is why i treasure shows like bts' run bts, and bon voyage. they openly swear and drink, and do all these things that are usually censored. it is thanks to their international fanbase that they can be so open and real with us. i cannot deny that bts were manufactured, as this is how all kpop groups are formed, but they have certainly deviated from that image. i think this is why they are so successful.
@@neveratinygoldilocks I agree with you but lets not act like it's only the kpop industry that's manufactured. The entire entertainment industry itself is toxic and manufactured. So many western artists like Ariana Grande have had so many different personas throughout their careers and they're very clearly manufactured too.
The thing is, this idea of having a manufactured and marketed image was actually a huge theme in BTS's last album, Map of the Soul: Persona. The intro to the album is literally about separating the idol image from the real person, and having to adopt a PERSONA when they get on stage or in front of a camera. BTS are aware of their manufactured image. And they use it in their music.
And it's not a bad thing. It's a reality for every celebrity, and in many ways every single person. We create different personas for ourselves depending on where we are, and who we talk to. I have a certain image that i adopt for my job, or when i go out, or when I'm around friends, etc. Its a normal part of society.
Thank you.
wow I love this comment 💜
LITERALLY.
Amen
The problem is the fetishisation of that image by the people who make these idols and the K-pop fans themselves, it is a bad thing when an obsession warps your view of reality so much that you begin to believe the lie and feel personally invested in a falsehood. That isn't normal or healthy, let's not pretend that putting on a face in your normal life is in any way comparable to the act idols have to put on everytime they are outside.
There are so many stans who refuse to see that so many idol's personalities are manufactured. So many idols even say it themselves and even in song lyrics. They constantly point out how they have to change themselves to appease a toxic fan's needs. Yoongi from BTS even said, "People think we show our lives without filtering anything, but we hide a lot of things". There have only been a very few times when groups like BTS filter nothing. It's really rare to come by and I can only imagine how stressed out those idols feel for not being able to express that side of themselves.
D’angelo likes Jonghyun’s music? Truly a king worth being supported
All artists are manufactured
Exactly
Define “Manufactured” yes, all artists that are popular tend to be on major labels but I imagine that plenty of artists can act themselves
Actually that’s mainly only the big or mainstream ones. There are many small niche artists who are completely original. Unfortunately the ones that do get big eventually tend to burn out due to the pressure to conform or consistently produce more of their original work.
Everyone's manufactured
Especially any kind of idol
Jojo’s Blizzard Adventure sounds like a Slice of Life fan fiction about JJBA characters going skiing.
or going to Dairy Queen
I'd read that unless it's the dipper parody someone mentioned. [fear]
xD Someone make this!
cartoonhours Why would you remind me of this???
thanks boutta go make this
Why are people soo obsessed with idols anyway? 😂
because the kpop industry makes idols look "available" to fans and some of them take it way too far and become really obsessive about them and are delusional (they think they have a chance to date them lol). the industry is really fucked up. most of us just admire them and their music but quite a big part of kpop fandoms is toxic
If u ever want to get interested in kpop I wouldn't suggest going to twitter lmao.
Dang, i feel bad for the normal kpop stans who just wanna listen to cool music without being grouped with crazy people.. ;/
@@atlasatlantic it's worse when they make fun of idols for being cringey and seeming dumb too cutesy. Can't help but feel like defending them not because they insulted my fave but because being an idol seems like one of the hardest jobs in the world. Years of emotional abuse in your developing years and pushing your body till it breaks only to be criticised for putting on a few pounds or wearing a skimpy dress you didn't even choose and just being objectified for your physical apperance and eventually to be replaced by someone younger when you've reached a certain age.
Oh it happens all the time. I get death threats on Twitter for liking BTS.
It’s an aggravating fate
I am a closeted LOONA and BTS fan . One of my friends once found out , and asked me if liked them . So I said yes , she kept bashing me for it and calling them names and saying that they all look the same and stuff . I don’t mind if you hate BTS that’s up to you , but why do you have to attack me and them when I did nothing to you? Also am talking about her not you YOU
@@pancreaticcum2122 tell your friend to back off
BTS have said themselves in multiple songs that they feel manufactured and controlled by their fame. Are these people even really fans? Doubt it.
@Estela Lopez what??? When? 😂
@@ooin_otaku4282 don't mind them, they are constantly writing that through all the comments here
@Estela Lopez This is why eveyone hate kpoopies. Your comments says it all.
@Estela Lopez He never said that so stop spamming and grow up
Estela Lopez if you live with someone for 7 YEARS do you think that you aren’t going to fight at least a little bit? Also, they might have been joking with each other, c’mon.
Im a kpop stan, not necessarily bts, but yeah I really hate the toxic fans. I for sure like the way they band together to fill racist hashtags, but I don’t like how crazy they can get on useless topics
I just think that Jimin, to an extent, chooses what he can about his image. Of course a lot of his image is marketed, but he also chooses to have some feminine aspects of himself, and literally has shopped at women’s clothing shops. He chose at least that piece of himself. Yes, Jimin is manufactured, probably the majority of him is manufactured, but not all of him.
That’s why I feel Dr. Phil was a little harsh, but not in the wrong.
I agree with this completely they r making it seem like Jimin is forced into this feminine clothes and makeup he literally has a say to so Idk yes hes Lil manufactured but like he isn't forced to have the aesthetic he has
I hate when they take it the wrong way. It’s not even about surgery.
I want Jhope to step on my throat me too bud
I want Jhope to step on my throat I love your name 💕
A lot of things tend to fly over their heads, not 𝘢𝘭𝘭 Kpop stans though.
who the fuck is jhope and what?
@@Isabel-ge1ou Jhope is from BTS just like Jimin.
"Manufactured marketed image" so you mean a celebrity? His brand? why are people even mad about this
Because Dr Phil wouldn’t say that about a Western artist
Estela Lopez
No shit
@Estela Lopez lol what
Amina A Did anybody come on the show trying to look like a western artist by getting millions of surgery and changing their race for it?
@Estela Lopez lots of their songs are about break ups. >.> and you assuming that they hate eachother, and act different off camera is also an assumption.
"jojo's blizzard adventure" I'M SCREAMING-
I swear, I always get embarrassed when shit like this goes viral
Why can’t people just be fans, and stop being stans? Stop stanning people and putting them on this godlike pedestal, because they are human.
thank youuuuuuu
wait is "stan" negative I always say I'm a BTS stan but I never knew stan is negative 👁👄👁
@@theseusvsminotaurus lmao just to let yk being a "stan" is an inherently bad thing. the implication is basically a crazy/obsessive fan, who worships their idol or whatnot. most ppl call themselves stans cause it seems pretty harmless without rlly knowing how deep it is
Scarlett Lee The term stan comes from a eminem’s song of the same name. In the song a young fan named Stan writes three letters to Eminem over a period of time, each letter getting more desperate and hateful to him each time. It unravels into Stan k*lling both him and his pregnant wife, and Eminem writing a response letter before realizing he was too late. Em wrote this bc around this time many of his fans dealt with mental illness and issues Eminem spoke about. He didn’t want stans. He didn’t want to be worshipped. He just wanted to make music and provide for his daughter. He talks about this in The Way I Am. So yeah being a stan was never meant to be a good thing
I mean, hyperfixations- but yeah.
im literally a kpop stan, and i still admit that ofc its manufactured.. i thought we all knew that... its an industry
right? it's pretty obvious, and if you don't know that then... idk what to say to you
Randall Paquet that word’s meaning has changed luv
Randall Paquet lmao what should i say then. we use that word all the time.
Randall Paquet i say this with respect because clearly you dont know, but nobody says fan on stan twitter
Estela Lopez in what way do you mean that
i’ve been an army for like 4 years and yeah i know that kpop idols are manufactured and have to keep a public image that could be completely different from their true self, i love jimin but some toxic stans gotta realize this
TLDR: UA-camrs have "images" too and I often worry about Markiplier or Jack having such a heavy reliance on their images. RT is also up there too but mostly cus his Twitch chat is annoying lmao.
I've been struggling with this idea for years. Especially experiencing first hand through UA-camrs in recent years. Everything in every industry is "manufactured". You learn that in marketing class. It's like Marketing 101 to create an IMAGE to market. People BECOME images. Not the other way around.
I remember worrying about people like Markiplier for a while. Cus holy shit Mark's fanbase is SOOO YOUNG. I feel bad for him sometimes because I'm sure it's probably hard(and only getting harder) to connect with people less than half his age. It can feel very lonely and inauthentic I'm sure for him. Mark has always been amazing with kids though.
People I worry about more often are people like Jacksepticeye. He clearly gets sick of his fans sometimes, and it makes sense seeing as only like less than a decade ago he was shot into a child fanbase by Pewds. I'm sure he probably had a close-knit fanbase of reliable people he could have discussions with before, being a smaller UA-camr. I can only imagine what it was like to lose all that but gaining a lot too. It must have been so isolating to be surrounded by a conversation you can't really join. Even if you did, half your fanbase would find your comment and just say something unrelated like "You should play [insert game]." Or "You're awesome Jacksepticeye." I've seen once a thread where people are just laughing. Like you don't have to type that out and post it 😂😂
Maybe last year/two years ago I started to notice Jack's videos decline a bit in energy. It was very clear to me that is is running out of steam to do all the crazy screaming and loudness. He's naturally energetic so it still works for him, but I can't help but feel sorry for the way he has to keep up that persona no matter what.
I noticed as well he started to copy other videos. Like he started a Scary Games playlist or started up a Minecraft playthrough, often without even MENTIONING one of his close friends that did it first. Not that he shouldn't do that, it just felt odd being used to people being like "I saw this person's video so I made this." 😂 I just noticed a lack in his own idea/take on something.
He really seems to enjoy games with others though (like the Boner Cast). Those videos Jack seems back to his old self, energetic and fun. It's hard to be sure obviously cus that IS his image 😂 I'm happy for his current girlfriend too being a gamer, cus then they can have fun together and I think that reinvigorates him. He's definitely extroverted LOL. I think he's slowly finding his place again, and I really hope the best for him.
I worry about RT sometimes too because his twitch just is legit like 6 years old and he is CONSTANTLY getting annoyed by them cus they just say stupid fucking shit in hopes of being noticed 😂 I just love these UA-camrs (images and all) and hope their mental health is first priority to them.
All artists are manufactured. Stop being mad y’all.
Except the smaller ones without labels (eg Seezyn, solo artist with under 2k fans)
Just because other people do it, it doesn’t make it okay.
Society itsepf is manufactured if you think about it.
Unless its just some bedroom artist
Or fricken cavetown
Us: Jimin
D’angelo: *Jee-Meen*
Man of culture I see.
Lol I also appreciated his correct pronunciation
how do you all pronounce jimin ??
Nur Farisha they probably pronounce it like the “i” in “tin”. Just a guess though.
Nur Farisha “gym in” is how they say it
I really appreciated it because I know a little bit of Korean and pronouncing it can be really hard, still is hard for me, and it's really quite nice to see people trying their best to say the names correctly. It can be a bit awkward listening to people saying it wrong even when they probably know it's wrong- but I do understand, though, since I personally pronounce the names in anime rather incorrectly just because I think they sound better the way I say it.. but mostly that's because they're fictional characters and I don't feel like trying to put on a poor Japanese accent in front of my family just to say it half-correct
Honestly, because of some kpop stans, every kpop stan gets a bad image- like I promise not all of us are like this
😔✊
I’m a kpop Stan and have so for nearly 5 years now. Idk why some kpop stans are so sensitive or protective of kpop.
But anyway I do think kpop in general is manufactured and so is the rest of the music industry, I do think BTS also are manufactured.
It does sound negative but for BTS and the rest of kpop there are ALOT of people behind the people in the group. There are people writing their songs, creating music videos, taking their pictures, doing their hair, styling them. So yeah it’s kinda like a manufacturing line with all these steps for an album to be released.
It’s down to the Indiavidual on how they interpret this but I don’t necessarily think it’s negative it’s just how things are and that’s why kpop and the music is the way that it is.
It's the btass stans who are the most sensitive. Criticizing their faves is like starting ww3
Ok, I’m a big minority in being a straight white 18 year old male THAT LOVES bts. I see the talent, I bop to the music, I love the dancing, I LOVE bts. That being said, I hate kpop twitter, I hate Stan culture, I 100% agree with dr Phil, it’s true for every celebrity. I hate the music I love being associated with such a disgusting misguided fan base.
You are valid
Give it a few years lol
honestly thank you. We know like bits of their personality that they put forward, but they've said that it isn't /really/ them. Yknow why? cause we aren't with them 24/7, and we don't see all sides of them, including the ones that they have to hide to preserve their image. I agreed with this video before I became a BTS stan and I still agree with it. It's kind of something for everyone online or in an entertainment industry. You legit don't know everything about them and you never will and it's kinda something you have to deal with and its absolutely fine like damn. Jimin isn't "fake", which seems to be the misconception here. It's more like he has to present himself a certain way and do certain things to live up to peoples perception of him, which is what Dr. Phil was trying to say.
One of the reasons I stopped listening to kpop...
rosa purzelbaum was because you’re a straight white male or because of bts? 💀
It’s almost like they never watched that gravity falls episode with the boy band.
Insomniac I actually love you for bringing this up😂
Oh yeah that episode **shiver**
Dang it 😂🤣
i watched that when i was young and my scaredy ass would think in the middle of the night thats how one direction was formed
Yes omg
Hell yeah someone who recognizes the superiority of "She Is", one of the most underrated Kpop singles of all time! Jonghyun really knocked it outta the park with that one.
^^ yes it’s a great song 😭🎶 I love it !!!
‘Twas the shit 😌
As a jimin stan I agree that jimin's image is pure marketing ... and I mean to become an idol takes a looot of training so it is true that the idea of jimin is manufactured, but he is a real person, we can see this when he goes out to drink or when he is just being himself ... but you are not gonna tell me he isn't and asset
As much as jimin has came out and talked about his life and personal struggles through his art or even just vlives, seeing him in countless episodes of run bts and just seeing him literally grow up, you really wanna sit here and say that the entire persona that he presents to army/the world is completely fake... I feel like thats kind of insulting. Jimin himself even talked about how in early bts days he was trying to be something that he isnt but now he's learned to love himeself for who he really is and is happy that he is now able to show us himself without a mask. Jin also has a video talking about the same thing. Personally I just feel like if you're gonna agree that jimin + bts's identity are completely manufactured then you must think the same for their music as well... because I dont see how you can see their music and message as authentic but their personas as fake. I know you wrote this months ago but seriously give me some specific examples of jimins identity thats unauthentic (and I'm not saying that bts/jimin is completely authentic in every way either just btw).
And to be honest me, you nor D'Angelo know N O T H I N G about Jimin outside of the content and art that he produces because you dont know him personally. Generalizing every single person bc of the group they are apart of is never good bc it creates false narratives and is generally not productive. Saying that every single celebrity or person that have a large following is fake and is only the way they present to be because they are trying to capitalize of of people, I believe is just unfair when the topic is about one specific celebrity. I could say that D'Angelo is fake and is only saying this stuff for clicks but doesnt actually believe it since he has a large following. But that unfair for me to say bc I literally dont know the guy, he could be honest in his controversial opinions. You know what I mean.
idk I just think you should give jimin a little more credit... and sorry if im not making complete sense in certain sentences it's the summer and its late
A looooot
Lol
you are not a jimin stan fck off
You are a jm anti, said fu
as an army myself, the boys themselves have said it through their songs that they put a mask on and that no matter everything we still don't know the real, raw bts. yes they are manufactured and a part of why some fans are upset is because from all the videos we watch it feels like u know them personally even if it's just a tiny amount. yoongi rapped about it in shadow how his personas clash , HELL EVEN IN OUTRO HER yoongi literally says :
"I can never take off the mask
Because the me behind this mask
Is not the one you know"
"Make up to wake up today too
And dress up to mask on
In order to become the me that you love"
so yeah. they themselves have said they're manufactured. and idk why people are so upset when in fact that image also lifts people up and helps people love themselves a bit more. at the end of the day all the answers r in their music :'))
exactly
YES! literally his image is marketed but jimin and the others try so hard to break from that and it just seemed ignorant for dr phil to completely ignore it
semra acar shut your dumb ass up
hope c
Damn, those are some badly written lyrics.
@@haggisa if only you had the sense to realize that theyre in korean and this is a translation so of course it aint gonna sound exactly smooth
Please do elaborate your stance on why they're bad by basing your opinion off mere 2 lines, i would certainly like to know
Do these kpop "fans" actually know the terrible shit that kpop idols go through to even become an idol
I can tell you, as a person who's pretty active on kpop twitter, that everyone is aware. Stans tend to have this weird competition about whether the group they like or the group another person likes had it worse so they can be like "yeah but your faves had a silver spoon" It's wild over there lmao
Everyone knows that's why they support them so much.
Aculeatus we do
Yeah they have to go through a whole anime training arc
@Perla Lopez Gomez from another comment you obviously don't know anything about them so stop claiming things
Jimin has a manufactured image. bts has a manufactured image. every single person who is someone in this world has a manufactured image.
as an ARMY whose bias is Jimin, I'm so embarrassed right now. these people really need to realize that even if BTS is more transparent than some other artist they are never gonna be 100% unfiltered. they are never gonna be 100% themselves. they are never gonna show you every side of themselves cause that's just not how it works. that doesn't mean that they are fake or bad people that simply means that you are not gonna know them like their mom or their best friends you are gonna know them as a fan. Jimin is manufactured because even if he loves making music and wants to give back to his fans he is selling a product. he and BTS NEED to sell their product because that is what they live off of.
and to sell that product they create a marketed image. these fans really need to grow and realize that they are fans. they will always be fans and they will never see a completely unfiltered BTS or Jimin cause that's just not how the music industry works.
and when I say Jimin is manufactured I don't mean that he's gotten plastic surgery or that his whole personality is just entirely fake and that he's a horrible and entirely different person in reality. no, what I mean is that his every move is planned. every time he dyes his hair, every time he posts something, everything appearance he makes on talk shows are carefully calculated business moves to create hype around BTS. to sell their product. of course, some things he does are not entirely manufactured but he has to watch what he does and what he says to not tarnish his image and that is exactly what I mean when I say that Jimin and BTS are manufactured.
I love BTS and I love their music. BTS makes me genuinely happy but I KNOW that they aren't completely honest with us all the time. I know that they make mistakes and they are not some sort of gods. I'm only 14 and even I can see this. we need to stop pretending that they are some sort of gods who do no wrong, who are always completely selfless and honest with us cause they are not.
please stop. you are the reason that ARMY's get ridiculed for being "crazy teenage fans"
Thank you. I am a k-pop stan and I really thank you for being so understanding and great. We aren't all bad I swear.
dr phil didnt say that jimin is manufactured. he said that his image is manufactured, which is a fact. they're international celebrities, they're gonna have a celebrity persona in order to still have a private life. some fans especially it seems in kpop where sharing a lot of clips and info is normal don't realize that they don't Know their idols. one of the bts members seokjin has literally said (and probably others) that the jin he shows to the world and to the camera is not the jin he is, only an aspect and only what he wants people to see. this is true in pretty much all media. no one said that they're not genuine people or artists
I remember him saying and I think it was burn the stage that he gets depressed a lot but he tries to keep up with good face for the others in the group.
Some bts fans don't even bother to listen to their music it seems. They literally have a whole album talking exactly about this, in which they explore about the differences and similarities between their artistic selfs and themselves as persons. The first track is even called "intro: persona" lol. Jimin himself has a solo track there called "Filter" in which he speaks on how he's able to create different images of himself, catering to people's preferences. I think the "real person/persona" is an existencial dichotomy every performer has to deal with, and it must be really hard to come to terms with that. I mean, every person itself isn't a monolith, we present ourselves differently depending on who we are with to an extent, even unconsciously. But when you're put on the spotlight, it maximizes.
how to twit words 101 lmaooo. yes, his "image" is filtered. he made a song about it. but he himself isn't manufactured. he is jimin.
me, an ARMY watching this and actually agreeing that Jimin's *image* is manufactured, not his personality, wondering why kpop twt had to embarrass us like this : 👁️👄👁️
Ikr. Like can y’all pls behave for ONE MINUTE. Damn I don’t wanna pretend I can’t see every day.
lmao same istg can yall be quiet and not further ruin kpop stans reputation for 2 seconds😭😭
It's like they forgot they are manufactured for us to love them
Even his personality is. No one can be in that competitive of an environment that if they step a toe out of line they're out, and not put on an act for their audience and a camera. They have an image to uphold, a way they have to act. It's just the K-Pop industry, not saying he's bad or anything, but to continue to be in the spotlight, he has to be that perfect, manufactured person. This isn't a new concept, it's been around since boybands were popular in the US back in the 1990's.
Is he saying Jimin's name wrong? Or is that just me thinking he is?
I'm not a BTS fan and don't listen to their music. But some k-pop stans r just way too protective about k-pop idols. Like u don't have the right to control how they live. I also don't respect Dr. Phil but Dr. Phil wasn't "attacking" jimin, all he was saying is that he's manufactured and marketed.
The opening of your videos are literally the best I think I have ever heard! Lol
So when Jimin faced backlash for drinking at a bar and having a chat with a fan while on his vacation that wasn’t because of his manufactured image? Or when he hides the fact that he has a tattoo even though we can all tell he does because of preserving his image! Who are we all kidding!
I am a fan of BTS for years now, I enjoy their music and the content they put out there and the more you see and learn about them the more you realize that they can never truly live their authentic life due to always having to preserve a specific image of good and pure boys. It is ridiculous assuming that the image we see of any of the boys is their true self, we might see snippets of their personalities but never the whole thing!
It's frustrating because I feel like all those image rules are all imposed on them specifically by Korean idol culture, but BTS is international and the majority of their fanbase isn't Korean. While I can't speak for everyone, i-armys mostly agree that whenever stupid drama comes up it really shouldn't be a big deal. Like when JK was caught having lunch with the tattoo artist, did anyone actually care? It seemed the only thing everyone was angry about was the fact that the picture was leaked in the first place! The restrictions are totally unnecessary imo. Their fans would still love them even if they went on dates or broke the mold in terms of looks because it wasn't them being pretty, pure boys that made them #1 on Billboard. I hate feeling like that by being a fan I am also being a jailer.
@@shinjite06 I agree with you.
AMEN DUDE
On god
Honestly I had to leave BTS and kpop behind. I stanned BTS for about 3 or 4 years and spent tons on albums, merch, BT21, all kinds of stuff, and it made me super happy. I even saw them in concert. But I used Twitter to keep connected and up to date with everything that they did, and the stans there were so toxic that it took a legitimate toll on my mental health. May sound dumb, but whenever I saw army on this dumb shit, I felt like I had to hop in and try to get them to stop being ridiculous, but I just got attacked. And seeing the fandom be so toxic and dumb made me really upset even when it wasn't directed at me. So I deleted my Twitter and bc of the negative association I had with them and the fact I couldn't keep up on Twitter, I just moved on to different things (but their songs still all bop when I hear them)
Everyone with a public image is manufactured in one way or another. Not only kpop idols.
yes but kpop stars have it very terrible, the don’t own their life.
@@frog-sp6yc they're also quite literally manufactured. like K-pop idols literally are required to change their appearance. I remember this K-pop idol dude who had beautiful brown curly-ish hair and they forced this guy to straighten it bleach it and get a minor tan to fit the image of an idol better
@@shhs1227 yeah i already get that
@@frog-sp6yc I'm aware. I simply added on to what you said because you're replying to a stan and "they don't own their life" is far too simple an explanation
Exactly he said UA-cam’s too
'theres no way i can be my most authentic self whilst having in the back of my mind that many people are watching me' felt that. made a video just now and it took me 30 mins to say something that's around 10 mins. the editing was rough but i kept pausing and saying the same thing over and over again until i said it in a way that... just doesn't seem like me. loved the video btw, it's a little old but your 'camera persona' is engaging enough to make older news seems fun and new again. thank you!!!
I love how i just got an ad from bangtantv jimin life goes on video call version 😁.... Can't skip it!!
I’m a BTS fan and I agree with everything you said in this video. I can’t speak for all fans, but at least in the part of the fandom I’m in, I constantly see tweets calling out delusional fans who think they “own” an idol and reminding everyone that we don’t truly know them and we will never truly know them because everyone is different on camera and off.
Also, I cracked up when you said whenever you see BTS trending you assume one of them died
Prince Seokjin same to all of that lolol
I'm a BTS fan and have been a fan of kpop since I was around 11. I'm 23 now if that puts anything into perspective.
All performers from every aspect are marketed and manufactured. I'm a performer, with an agency and there are certain things that your agency will do to pitch you to the correct market in order to make money. That's completely normal.
You may not be marketed according to how you are in reality. Who you are as a performer is not 100% you, it is only a fraction of that and sometimes depending on how much control an agency has on a persons image, that image is entirely different that the real you.
Over the years I have watched artists mold and change according to the market, and it's normal. It isn't an insult to point out that this is how the entertainment industry works. It's like this ALL OVER THE WORLD.
I can see how someone might misinterpret was was said by Dr. Phil, but that's all he meant. He was talking about Jimin as an idea and a concept pitched by his agency for marketing purposes, versus Jimin off camera on his down time.
Also, I'm pretty sure Ollie London got free promotion for his music through that Dr. Phil episode...so...there's that.
Im so happy to see there are people that are not insane in this fandom cause they really give you a bad name...
I’m too a bts fan and yet I couldn’t agree more and there was literally nothing wrong with what Dr. Phil said and there’s real truth to it
bts hate jews n black people king
tbh it's sad that I can't even enjoy music without being associated with stan culture and aggressive k-pop stans
Indeed
True, when someone finds out I listen to kpop they roll their eyes INSTANTLY and ofc I’ll be upset, cause the rudest and meanest fans are the loudest and that’s the majority if not the only thing those other people who don’t listen to kpop see online.... it’s really exhausting cause I want to tell those people that we aren’t all like that but I don’t want to look like I’m attacking them and defending any certain group with my dear life, but unfortunately that’s how they portray it cause that’s all they see....😔
Honestly with this mob mentality of toxic fans it gets hard to share genuine interests in certain communities because we get generalized and judged. I avoid telling people I'm into anime/K-pop until I know that they're also into it.
I want Jhope to step on my throat your username is veryyyyy relatable
@I want Jhope to step on my throat with that username? i wonder why.
Im a Kpop fan and specifically a fan of BTS. That being said i completely agree with the fact that all kpop idols are manufactured! and not only in kpop, every single famous person has at least a team of people behind them, working on their image and appearances. That doesnt mean those people are bad, this is just how celebrities are portrayed nowawdays.
OK, OK ,OK I think you mixing up a persona as being inauthentic(since when are these terms interchangeable), like just because you literally don't always come on camera and spill your guts don't mean your in inauthentic ,you saying BTS are manufactured kind of feels like you're discrediting their their artistry and the stance's they take as fake. Also that part about the hair trending literally makes no sense about them being manufactured like if your in the fandom the dumbest shit be trending, like #closethegyms. Thats how twitter works my dude ,when you have such a big fandom shit trends.
it's quite literally fact that they're marketed and manufactured. they're groomed and trained from a very young age to act and portray themselves in a specific way. the way they look act, conduct themselves, speak, and the 'personalities' they have are not real. nothing that D'Angelo said was false in any way. They are inauthentic. They're not real.
@@khalfani414 they are also humans wtf saying that they arent real and are inauthentic takes away the fact that they have freedom and are not corporate puppets like western media portrays asian artists. it’s literally the same with ANY celebrity in the west, they would act different in front of the camera but that doesnt mean that they have a whole different personality off cam, maybe stop believeing anything that dangelo says lmao
@@naur9880 what you just said just contradicted yourself yk.. "they would act different in front of the camera" - "that doesnt mean that they have a whole different personality off cam" 💀💀💀
@@whoiissofi it's literally psychology, you will behave differently subconsciously knowing you're on the cam, dvmb mf keyword is behave, that's different from assuming a whole different personality like a whole 180 degree of your character, literally what's so hard to get????
@@khalfani414what about sportspersons?
I've lost respect for K Twitter a long time ago. Like when they did the whole "[insert someone who has passed way] wouldn't have died if you stanned [insert any kpop group]." That stuff was messed up on a whole new level
Paprika Beauty Same here
there are alot of shitty sides to kpop Twitter. alot of that type of thing was actually part of the intricate strategy of some fanwars. haters of different groups would make fake "stan accounts" for a hated group, and post comments like this on tragic events to get the general public to join in on hating the group they disliked. the people who did/do this tend to be shunned by the community as a whole, but that doesn't stop them from barging into public spaces to try and generate hate for their "enemies."
Shit that happened!! Good thing I left a long time ago.
those are mostly trolls though, i've yet to see more than maybe two people who were actual fans of said artists who did that. it's really a fucked up thing to do regardless though, don't get me wrong
I wish kstans didn’t do that because now western fans say the same thing when a korean artist passes away and it’s starting so much drama
i'm confused as to why this is such a thing. literally every artist in the public eye is, to some extent, manufactured. this is simply a fact. why are kpop stans trying to act as if it's just an opinion of the few?
dijel idk I apologise on behalf of our fandom lol
kpop stans dont think like this. Some ppl do (because some are toxic but most dont) .
ignore stan twitter those people are freaking scary
Little Leah don’t be rude she literally apologized to you
Little Leah ??? You don’t have to be a dick wad.
literally every celebrity or company has a manufactured marketing image that is how they make money, it's just business. Better Reputation = Higher Profit, roles marketing.
I think BTS fans got upset bc manufactured seems like Jimin isn't a real person with feelings. He hasn't had plastic surgery, and experts (plastic surgeons) have said it's unlikely he did. BTS are one of the few kpop bands that are really real with their fans. They show their flaws and troubles. So yeah, Jimin could be a different person than we think, but manufactured sounded too dehumanizing. I mean isn't there some point in our life where we're faked things to seem perfect, or fit an image? We all have flaws we feel we should hide. We're human, and so is Jimin. Dr. Phil could have worded it better. Also the reason Kpop twiiter is getting protective of Jimin is because Oli is very creepy to Jimin. Some kpop idols are fake, but not BTS. Well it's not likely they are fake. Former people who have worked with them have said how humble and nice they are. One member(Jungkook) thanked a cleaner in the bathroom just for doing their job. BTS have donated to India during covid 19, two million dollars. One million to BLM, was donated by them. Their lives weren't always perfect, and still aren't so that's why people are protective. Also I'm not hating on anyone just giving some background info. Oli can only seen Jimin though as a singer, who has many fans. He's too blind to see the real Jimin who is creeped (it keeps on giving me a red line anyway so I'm just spelling it like this) out by him.
When he said ‘She is’ by jonghyun I was like this man has some taste
YES
we have to stan
Taste!
When was that 👁👄👁
Yess that's such a good song.
Wait I just realized something? Even yoongi from bts talked about how Suga (his stage name) is a manufactured image he said in his solo music stuff like “behind every idol rapper who succeeds there’s a true self standing behind that name” and stuff like that as well as stuff like “reality separation” and you get the idea
Very good point. The fact that Shadow is the ultimate counter to these short-sided kids who are attacking Dr.Phil is so ironic.
StarShade I know ahh!!!!! These people really need to actually listen to what their idols are saying
Jojo’s Blizzard Adventure has me in tears lolll😂
I didnt mean to reply to you my bad. That was just a normal comment oops
hello, where is the line "behind every idol rapper...." from? im curious
I have been a part of BTS army since 2014, and I´m so embarrassed by these types of fans who need to make drama out of everything. Dr. Phil spoke facts when saying this
Same! I was only around 9/10 at the time so I really didn't care too much about what other people were saying, but as kpop grew more and more popular over the years it was saddening to see it grow into such a hateful (yet loving) place. A lot of people are so cruel and it really sucks because no one is perfect and people trying to "own" kpop idols and trying to tell them what to do is dehumanizing (sorry I went on a rant lol)
2:10 extra information regarding oli london:
CW: racism, Islamophobia.
1) He has attacked a youtuber called "Sherliza Moé" and tried to destroy her business by saying false and defamatory things about her because she criticized him.
2) He called a muslim girl "oppressed and brainwashed" for wearing a burqa because she called him a tool.
3) He made a song called "Lockdown City" in the middle of a pandemic.
4) He once went to someone that JUST hit 18, and was like "you're pretty and gorgeous", it's pretty suspicious considering this person JUST hit 18.
5) He once said "I want a cute kpop nose".
6) He once wore cornrows, then said it makes him feel more "gangster" for his new hip-hop song. When people called him out, he said (and I quote) "It's just hair! Get a grip".
Side note: Allkpop is not the place to go for reasonable, adult kpop conversations. In 2013, Allkpop leaked the nude photos of the singer Ailee. Their CEO was her ex and some of the photos were also likely taken when she was a minor. So after that, most people wouldn't touch that site. The people that are there now are mostly newer kpop fans that weren't around for that and just don't know. But newer kpop fans are also more likely to be younger and more..aggressive in the defence of their idols.
yo what?! i didnt even know that 0.0
HOLY SHIT
What's allkpop?
@@bharathhegde2095 it's a popular kpop news channel
SAY IT LOUDER PLEASE
Allkpop is not a reliable source for kpop news andddddd its mostly just arguing in the comments anyways
I think it's hard for ppl to hear their faves are manufactured bc they've felt a connection to these people and dont want that invalidated. I think some ppl see "manufactured" as "completely fake," which is wrong and what might set ppl off. It's a refined and perfectly packaged product, sure, but that doesn't have to mean there's no truth or sincerity behind it. Maybe that's where some of the outrage comes from when kpop is called manufactured.
Sarah Beara completely agree. I have to admit before I got into kpop i would use the term manufactured as meaning completely fake and while I’m sure dr Phil wasn’t doing that I think that’s how most people do use it when talking about kpop.
Sarah Beara all idols show their true personality more or less on camera, but people really have a hard time seperating the idol from the person.
F.x. i like Nico D’angelo and i believe he’s always talking about his opinions and showing a lot of his personality... doesnt mean i know him or that it isn’t manifactured tho.
But yeah, Kpop fans are prickly beings that instead of trying to understand always jump straight to either defense of offense.
Estela Lopez I dunno, all music is music. Even if it’s stolen or plagiarized it’s still music.
Unless you mean lyrics?
I wonder if people will even consider what I am going to write next.
People who watched the whole episode knows that Oli London wants to look like Jimin really bad, "his nose, lips and eyes" (I am quoting)... but never once has he mentioned he wants to have his personality, dance like him or sing like him. Basically he is not interested in his idol persona.
So when Dr Phil said that Jimin is manufactured, they assumed he was talking about his facial features as Oli doesn't want anything else from him, he explained that to Dr Phil.
So, here is where the indignation jumps, Jimin does not have any surgery but people have been insulting him and the other BTS members about being plastic dolls for years.
People got mad that Dr Phil will encourage those comments when a simple search on his childhood pictures will tell you he is natural.
Jimin, out of all BTS members, underwent serious body image issues years before BTS blowed up. Got massive online criticism ( by non-fans) because he was a bit chubby which almost lead to eating disorders. He confessed his fragile state of mind and got mocked for being weak and not suck it up like a man.
It is a sore topic for the fandom that him, out of all members, has his appearance being questioned once again.
Dr Phil could have better said "the whole kpop industry is manufactured" but instead he said: "Jimin is manufactured" when all the episode they talked strictly about his facial features. Hence, it was taken as a bad generalisation instead of a well researched fact
@@BellroseJewel I see! I didn't see the Dr. Phil episode beyond what was included here, but I can see why fans would have an issue with that wording.
Did Dr. Phil tell Oli that he can't ever look like Jimin bc he isn't even Asian? I feel like that's really all that needs to be said but Oli is... really something else, so I don't think anything anyone tells him means anything. :///
The facepalm moments throughout the whole video is hilarious. Thanks for the awesome videos. Love how in-depth you always are.