Working in both the government contracting commercial & the wedding commerical video space, the media company needs to understand how to adapt and match different looks and needs. Period. If you say to a client "sorry I can't make the product look like that because that's not my style" they would NEVER work with you again and word gets around- clients in the same contracting space will not hire you either (especially in the government contracting space.) In my opinion, adapting to difference editing styles and critiques make you a better filmmaker/photographer. If the direction not your thing, then polish that turd and do it anyways because that video will land you more work.
I'm with you all the way on this when I heard that I didn't know it was such a thing. Why not do it for the client/company? The reason they picked you is because it was something they like in your previous work. They may like your style though you are on their clock til the project is done. Just put a certain amount of revisions then move on.
1 major thing some of you are forgetting. THE MOMENT MONEY IS EXCHANGED YOU ARE A BUSINESS THEN A PHOTOGRAPHER. Service will always be out rank style. Fight about style with your own money not your clients money. Sticking to your style is not more important than losing a client. Stop it with this creative artist egos
Agree to disagree - this is applies to creatives who are hired based on their signature style. This is a version of the infamous “Spielberg clause” named after the aforementioned director who has this clause in all of his movie contracts where he cannot be fired based on the “style” of moviemaking that he was hired for without a golden parachute.
I’m familiar with this channel and that particular video the people on this podcast are actually wedding photographers with the “airy” photo style that’s in style nowadays. I think that’s the main reason why they’re talking about that clause in contracts because their clients are primarily the brides with certain artistic wants and needs that might not align with the photographers original style
@@FlashFilmAcademyit’s not crazy actually saying no avoids situations like the sepia bride not all money is good money and getting clients who’s vision is on the same page as you makes for better work and better work environment. Would I tel this to a fresh photographer in the wedding industry no! But once you’re established you don’t have to take on every client it’s “your” business and you can run it as you see fit and won’t go out of business that way if the product is great plus the experience given to clients…
1:45 nahhhhh 😂 it’s the equivalent of going to McDonald’s and ordering a Big Mac, sitting down at your table, and then going back to the counter complaining that you wanted a Whopper. If the client and photographer agree to do a different style, then they’re good! This protects the photographer for when the client comes back later complaining about your style, when they hired you in the first place after looking at your photos. 🤷🏻♂️
Some people just feel really “entitled” to their wants. Not putting the client first. These people will be lit or business sooner than later if they can’t put the needs and wants of the clients before their own.
You are too correct for UA-cam... you know that, right? Right? You make common and business sense. That won't get you likes. I'm kidding of course. You are right on. Losers, wannabees, and part time "influencers" seem to rule. Like your channel.
If it's a B2C, they get clean images from my company. If they want to make it upside down green, then that's on them. We're not wasting time with the "which color is this dress?" meme from years ago. For a B2B client, we have the same type of revision system that your company has. But B2B has standards that can be communicated. I know what my editorial clients want and need, and my team can work with a creative director from an agency. At that point we're there to create and expedite. But yes, that "advice" podcast has the wrong ideas. They think they're being smart, but I doubt they've ever spoken to a lawyer in their own state before - nor know why that's important.
I think you’re misunderstanding. If a client wants me to deliver something I don’t show off in my portfolio then that can be discussed but this issue you’re bringing up is something that comes off from a service lying about what they can deliver. My portfolio shows the style I can deliver and want to deliver. If I buy a Toyota then I know I won’t get Tesla performance.
Noooo the client is asking that they tone down the color. They’re not asking for a different product or service. They’re asking for less color. I would get it if they were promised a in their requesting B they’re asking for a little less of a.
@@FlashFilmAcademythis isn’t what happened. Look up Sepia Bride, that’s what this is about. She hired the photographer and that original photographers style is extremely warm and then later on the bride wanted a more true to color look. It wasn’t “tone the colors back a bit” it was a completely different style that the bride re-edited the photos to. An artistic release clause in your contract protects you from a client coming back and saying they wanted a completely different style that doesn’t align with your portfolio (essentially causing you to re-edit a whole gallery from scratch) a judge would look at that and side with the photographer. Not having this clause in there could lead to you losing a massive amount of time (especially in wedding photography) due to having to re edit from scratch because the client changes their mind and time is money. It’s not about the photographer wanting to be prideful about their “art” it’s about clients who try to change it up later on or don’t know what they want and so much more lol. Also, photography and video is wildly different. For a photography contract that clause is pretty standard. And you ain’t losing money over that in B2C.
No, I dont agree. You can't tell Rolex the kind of dail you want beyond the options they offer for watches, they'll happily refuse your money if your desires do not align with their style of watchmaking. Your advice is signing anyone up to become a yesman pretty much, which is a nightmare of a situation to be in with any client. I see what you're saying but I cannot agree. You also can't make 100% of your client base happy, and that's ok. I believe you're coming from the POV of a cameraman or a DP, those are very functional roles, if your client tells you to jump, you're gonna ask them "ok how high do you want me to jump?" Which again, is completely fine. But to say that their advice is bad when it comes on to offering a tailored or niche product is insane. I also do not agree that people don't just hire you for art. People in this field based on the creator 100% can and will hire you for art, not all of them ofcoarse. Yes everyone has a camera, the same way we all have access to pro grade tools of many industries as a result of consumerism, but that doesn't make everyone with a camera proficient at creating. We all have the potential to create based on the tools at hand, not everyone can. Owning a camera does not make you an artist. You're the one giving terrible advice in response to theirs. If they want to stipuilate that in their contracts that's fine, they may lose some clients but it is not an indicator of sabatoge to their business. Before anyone calls me crazy for my POV, Annie Leibovitz has disclaimers for clients on her agreements, by your argument is she sabotaging her career? Absolutly not, because her clients find her. She's richer than the entire comment section combined I'm sure lol. I would not listen to this man. Additionally by your logic we can then conclude that all photographers are made equal, everyone has their own style, and every client has differing taste. Think about it.
Personally, I can't tell the difference between Annie Leibovitz or another photographer that shot for VOGUE. As of matter of fact, VOGUE hires her because she fulfills a "LOOK" or a "STYLE" that they want, which helps them...wait for it... SELL MORE MAGAZINES! Any half way decent photographer can copy a style of Annie Leibovitz to fulfill the clients need. Besides , do you think Annie Leibovitz knows more about VOGUE's target audience than VOGUE does?? NO. If VOGUE asks Annie Leibovitz to photograph a woman in a red dress with a snowy background, and she comes back with a woman in a yellow dress standing in a rain forest, is VOGUE going to be happy with her saying, "this is my style" non sense. NO. They're gonna fire her and find an AI image generator that can follow directions and produce the photo in 10 seconds. And believe me, Annie Leibovitz, knows this fact. You're speaking from your ego. Ego doesn't pay the bills!
Also the only people who put this in their contract are the ones that use presets and can't actually edit photos lol
Hahahahha facts
Working in both the government contracting commercial & the wedding commerical video space, the media company needs to understand how to adapt and match different looks and needs. Period. If you say to a client "sorry I can't make the product look like that because that's not my style" they would NEVER work with you again and word gets around- clients in the same contracting space will not hire you either (especially in the government contracting space.)
In my opinion, adapting to difference editing styles and critiques make you a better filmmaker/photographer. If the direction not your thing, then polish that turd and do it anyways because that video will land you more work.
That’s all I’ve been saying bro
I'm with you all the way on this when I heard that I didn't know it was such a thing. Why not do it for the client/company? The reason they picked you is because it was something they like in your previous work. They may like your style though you are on their clock til the project is done. Just put a certain amount of revisions then move on.
1 major thing some of you are forgetting. THE MOMENT MONEY IS EXCHANGED YOU ARE A BUSINESS THEN A PHOTOGRAPHER. Service will always be out rank style. Fight about style with your own money not your clients money. Sticking to your style is not more important than losing a client. Stop it with this creative artist egos
Agree to disagree - this is applies to creatives who are hired based on their signature style. This is a version of the infamous “Spielberg clause” named after the aforementioned director who has this clause in all of his movie contracts where he cannot be fired based on the “style” of moviemaking that he was hired for without a golden parachute.
I have my own style and I know it does not work with my target audience in my niche. I use my style for my own personal creative satisfaction…
Yeah this is terrible advice. I can't tell you how much work I've done for businesses that you wouldn't know I did it.
I’m familiar with this channel and that particular video the people on this podcast are actually wedding photographers with the “airy” photo style that’s in style nowadays.
I think that’s the main reason why they’re talking about that clause in contracts because their clients are primarily the brides with certain artistic wants and needs that might not align with the photographers original style
Thats cool but even brides hire you for a purpose. to tell them no is CRAZY to me lol
@@FlashFilmAcademyit’s not crazy actually saying no avoids situations like the sepia bride not all money is good money and getting clients who’s vision is on the same page as you makes for better work and better work environment. Would I tel this to a fresh photographer in the wedding industry no! But once you’re established you don’t have to take on every client it’s “your” business and you can run it as you see fit and won’t go out of business that way if the product is great plus the experience given to clients…
I get it but they already took the money. At that point you have to deliver
@@FlashFilmAcademypreach that!!
BRO, WTF is that? I've never heard of that ever but if I had that for my work I'd be pushing burgers at Don's.
1:45 nahhhhh 😂 it’s the equivalent of going to McDonald’s and ordering a Big Mac, sitting down at your table, and then going back to the counter complaining that you wanted a Whopper.
If the client and photographer agree to do a different style, then they’re good! This protects the photographer for when the client comes back later complaining about your style, when they hired you in the first place after looking at your photos. 🤷🏻♂️
Some people just feel really “entitled” to their wants. Not putting the client first. These people will be lit or business sooner than later if they can’t put the needs and wants of the clients before their own.
This is crazy.
Yeah, this is crazy, lol.
You are too correct for UA-cam... you know that, right?
Right?
You make common and business sense.
That won't get you likes.
I'm kidding of course.
You are right on.
Losers, wannabees, and part time "influencers" seem to rule.
Like your channel.
Bro that’s the story of my life
If it's a B2C, they get clean images from my company. If they want to make it upside down green, then that's on them. We're not wasting time with the "which color is this dress?" meme from years ago.
For a B2B client, we have the same type of revision system that your company has. But B2B has standards that can be communicated. I know what my editorial clients want and need, and my team can work with a creative director from an agency. At that point we're there to create and expedite.
But yes, that "advice" podcast has the wrong ideas. They think they're being smart, but I doubt they've ever spoken to a lawyer in their own state before - nor know why that's important.
The difference here is B2B vs B2C. These people sound like B2C
Even if it’s B2c it’s still crazy
I think you’re misunderstanding. If a client wants me to deliver something I don’t show off in my portfolio then that can be discussed but this issue you’re bringing up is something that comes off from a service lying about what they can deliver. My portfolio shows the style I can deliver and want to deliver. If I buy a Toyota then I know I won’t get Tesla performance.
Noooo the client is asking that they tone down the color. They’re not asking for a different product or service. They’re asking for less color. I would get it if they were promised a in their requesting B they’re asking for a little less of a.
@@FlashFilmAcademythis isn’t what happened. Look up Sepia Bride, that’s what this is about. She hired the photographer and that original photographers style is extremely warm and then later on the bride wanted a more true to color look. It wasn’t “tone the colors back a bit” it was a completely different style that the bride re-edited the photos to.
An artistic release clause in your contract protects you from a client coming back and saying they wanted a completely different style that doesn’t align with your portfolio (essentially causing you to re-edit a whole gallery from scratch) a judge would look at that and side with the photographer. Not having this clause in there could lead to you losing a massive amount of time (especially in wedding photography) due to having to re edit from scratch because the client changes their mind and time is money.
It’s not about the photographer wanting to be prideful about their “art” it’s about clients who try to change it up later on or don’t know what they want and so much more lol.
Also, photography and video is wildly different. For a photography contract that clause is pretty standard. And you ain’t losing money over that in B2C.
No, I dont agree. You can't tell Rolex the kind of dail you want beyond the options they offer for watches, they'll happily refuse your money if your desires do not align with their style of watchmaking. Your advice is signing anyone up to become a yesman pretty much, which is a nightmare of a situation to be in with any client. I see what you're saying but I cannot agree. You also can't make 100% of your client base happy, and that's ok. I believe you're coming from the POV of a cameraman or a DP, those are very functional roles, if your client tells you to jump, you're gonna ask them "ok how high do you want me to jump?" Which again, is completely fine. But to say that their advice is bad when it comes on to offering a tailored or niche product is insane. I also do not agree that people don't just hire you for art. People in this field based on the creator 100% can and will hire you for art, not all of them ofcoarse. Yes everyone has a camera, the same way we all have access to pro grade tools of many industries as a result of consumerism, but that doesn't make everyone with a camera proficient at creating. We all have the potential to create based on the tools at hand, not everyone can. Owning a camera does not make you an artist. You're the one giving terrible advice in response to theirs. If they want to stipuilate that in their contracts that's fine, they may lose some clients but it is not an indicator of sabatoge to their business.
Before anyone calls me crazy for my POV, Annie Leibovitz has disclaimers for clients on her agreements, by your argument is she sabotaging her career? Absolutly not, because her clients find her. She's richer than the entire comment section combined I'm sure lol. I would not listen to this man. Additionally by your logic we can then conclude that all photographers are made equal, everyone has their own style, and every client has differing taste. Think about it.
I respect that bro. It the client was not asking for something different they were asking to tone down the style not something different
Personally, I can't tell the difference between Annie Leibovitz or another photographer that shot for VOGUE. As of matter of fact, VOGUE hires her because she fulfills a "LOOK" or a "STYLE" that they want, which helps them...wait for it... SELL MORE MAGAZINES! Any half way decent photographer can copy a style of Annie Leibovitz to fulfill the clients need. Besides , do you think Annie Leibovitz knows more about VOGUE's target audience than VOGUE does?? NO. If VOGUE asks Annie Leibovitz to photograph a woman in a red dress with a snowy background, and she comes back with a woman in a yellow dress standing in a rain forest, is VOGUE going to be happy with her saying, "this is my style" non sense. NO. They're gonna fire her and find an AI image generator that can follow directions and produce the photo in 10 seconds. And believe me, Annie Leibovitz, knows this fact. You're speaking from your ego. Ego doesn't pay the bills!