Check out my latest video comparing Shimano's 12-speed MTB Cassettes: ua-cam.com/video/kME0yIAbA8k/v-deo.htmlsi=XIyq3gFtvgUOCPLf UPDATE: The eBay listings in the links ended after I posted this video. You can still find take off shifters close to the prices I discussed in this video, but the exact listings that I referenced are no longer available. A good excuse to contact your LBS to buy these even if it does cost a bit more!
I ride a Stumpjumper Comp carbon with a SLX group-set. I replaced the SLX-Shifter with a XT and would never ever go back. The instant shifting and the double shifting to a higher gear is a game-changer. And the best thing is, everyone can do this in 15-20 minutes and watching a UA-cam tutorial. Its like playing with 60 fps for a year and then go back to 30fps on the same games ;) Cheers from Switzerland
going to be pairing a deore deraileur with an xt shifter and a sunrace casette coz the sunrace is the only thing i can find in my country that uses the older HG freehub with 11-51 range , im on an older bike with quick release and i am not yet ready to replace the wheelset as they are prohibitively expencive to replace and im pretty sure i wont find the newer freehub bodies for my el cheapo joytek hubs , for reference im going from an older deore 3x9 for wich cranks are impossible to find without importing so im riding with the cheap altus stamped crank
Been loving the series, super informative and has influenced the monetary decisions I’m making but you getting excited about remembering the up and down shift paradox cracked me up bro 😂 Thanks for doing this series.
After a rock killed my XTR mech and a few teeth on a creaky XT cassette, I now have XT shifter, XT mech and SLX cassette. I feel the lighter weight mech arm on the XTR led to a little flex. SLX cassette with all steel cogs definitely feels better than alloy cogs on the XT. I do love being able to dump 2 gears on the upshift with the XT shifter. The wife having smaller hands and less thumb strength loves the SLX shifter with the softer feel.
I’m XT all the way. Still can’t get the shifting perfectly crisp after tinkering with it. But it’s a dependable setup that is cheap to replace parts when needed.
I think this content and others comparison content are very helpful to me. Comparison,hack and bang for bucks make me excited in your next episode. Good job 👏
Epic series of videos! Did the same with my 11 speed setup. M7000 slx brakes (the same stoping power and newer on the market), XT M8000 RD with an XTR M9000 shifter, just because it was the only one with 4 bearings in the mechanism vs the rest. Need to check that cable quick action 😁 LE: Yes, I have it as well. Yuhuu.. it explaines now why it's such a crisp shifting action. I thought it was just the multi-bearing setup.
Great video series! Im personally running a Deore shifter, Cassette and Chain with a Deore XT rear derailleur and entire brake setup on my Trekking Bike, and Im really happy with it.
I'm just starting out and already realizing very quickly that "the ultimate Shimano drivetrain" doesn't include the bottom bracket, and I've also opted to go with a Wolf Tooth chainring for the 1 piece design..
Thank you so much for this. I’m just replacing the awful sram nx that came on my bike and really didn’t understand the differences. Appreciate the honest information here. Will purchase using your links :)
ONE BIG PROBLEM WITH XT - They work way harder than Deore and SLX, because of that instant release. Tenision is higher and levers are harder to press. This makes a difference for many women I know. Just to let you know. I moved back from XT to SLX on my GF bike just because of that.
That’s a really good point! I didn’t notice the extra force required, but I know my wife has the grip strength of a young child so I could see that being a problem for her. That’s definitely a good thing to consider when looking into upgrading.
@@RichardWagenknecht I have not noticed that! I’m surprised the XTR wouldn’t be harder too if the Instant Release mechanism is the reason for the increased required pressure.
@@Kyosuke_Kun what I think they mean is the XT shifter takes more force to press than the SLX. I ran the SLX shifter for a year before switching over to the XT model. I personally didn’t notice a difference, but others have claimed they do. Being that the shifter is actuating the derailleur through the shifting cable, I would think the only thing that could make the lever harder to press would be the length of the lever being shorter, but I don’t think that is the case either. I would say get the XT shifter and you won’t be disappointed.
thansk for making this video. I've been on the fence about getting the XT shifter, and I think this video convinced me it's worth it. I have a Pivot that came with XT rear mech and SLX shifter.
I like your videos! I've been using the XT M8000 11 speed shifter for years, but on a new build I decided to try a ($16) Deore M5100 11 speed shifter. It definitely has a softer feel, with less pressure required than the XT, but the shifts aren't as crisp and solid as the XT shifter, despite having an all new Deore M5100 drivetrain. I'm going back to an XT shifter, although the cheapest I can find them for right now is around $50.
Can you do a Shimano brakes comparison? Would it be GREAT! 1)brake lever and caliper (would it be great if you consider the 4 pistons ones) they say you could buy an SLX and have the freestroke adjust by replacing a screw and basically have the XT 2)then rotors comparison 3)maybe pads comparison, material, fins exc *)extra, the hose that is different between the lineup Thank you
This is super helpful, i just started to look into building a bike and the diff series shimano offers consumes me. anyway, other thatn the difference you mentioned in the video, are there any difference in terms of durability, material, easy to fix (i guess no one will fix given the low price?) etc among the differ shifter? thank you
I have tested multi release XT and earlier 443's and didn't like the sensation . A big no for me . Just conventional XT similar to the 740 3 x 8 ones in use on my TREK custom build mtb . They are old but work well and are in good condition . They are servo wave feel in a way.
I am constantly mixing up-shift and downshift up, but I think they’re right on the Google sheet. 4/3 Downshifts and 2/1 Up-Shifts is correct as long as downshifts means easier gear and upshifts means harder. Which when looking at a cassette seems wrong, but when thinking about it like a manual transmission with 1 being the easiest gear and 6 being the hardest then I believe it is right.
Ah ha! That explains the problems I had with an SLX shifter. I had two of them fail from sweat getting inside and corroding the mechanism. That didn’t happen with XT. Worth the extra money, for sure.
i just purchased the XT 11-speed Linkglide shifter for my new 11-speed Cues derailleur, unfortunately all i could find was the bar clamp version but I found an I-Spec EV replacement cover on ebay. I contacted Shimano to see if it would fit and they said yes, so I literally just ordered it 5-mins ago.
I had the exact same issue trying to replace my current Deore 11 speed. I don't think they even sell an EV version of the XT 11 speed. Did you end up okay using the EV cover?
@@MarioGoatse yep, it worked great. Which deore shifter do you have, what's the model number? Because there is also a I-Spec EV cover that i saw for a Deore shifter. I'll have to see which it was for.
@@NonLegitNation2 My current one is an 11 Speed Deore SL-M5100, with a clamp. But I wanted to upgrade it to the 11 Speed XT shifter because I upgraded my brakes to XT 8100 levers and they’re I Spec EV as well.
I used to mountain biking in the early 90's and I got itching again for it. So I'm in the very confusing endevour of trying to understand what model to buy. Since the early 90's these bitches have become so sophisticated, that I found it very challenging to decide what features I really need/wish for, also given the too high price for my wallet. It due my financial means what I'll get i will be stuck with for a long time, so I plan to get a bike (it will an ebike as I'm old and far from fit) I will upgrade some features in time. It given the "Auto Shift", or at least electronic shifting, would be something I really wish for (I know I don't need it) from this video I'm getting hope I may identify a bike which will be a good match for my evil plan. Currently I'm oriented on Giant it seems to me a reliable brand and there are good bargains on a couple years old models, which have Shimano ep8 drive and XT components (Giant Trance X E+ 1 at ~30% discount seems to fit the role). Do you have other suggestion?
That's great that you're getting back into it! As for recomendations, I don't know e-bikes well at all, but I do think Giant is a reputable brand overall and offer some good value as well. My wife rides a Liv brand (Giant's womens counterpart) and loves it!
Sadly, while I expected XT to be the obvious best-value option, mine didn’t hold up more than about 20 hours. A small internal spring broke, and I had to buy what I could get locally, and XTR. Now I have well over 100hrs on the shifter with zero detectable degradation. Turns out other folks I know had XT failures too, so hopefully it was just a production issue that affected material durability or something…. I can’t see myself doing XT again unless I know for sure they solved the issue.
That pawl spring on the XT is a known design flaw. Shimano will tell you it has been fixed but it hasn't. The Deore shifter is fine, but it has 50% less i-spec rotation angle adjustment than SLX and XT. For my money, SLX is the best value in Shimano MTB shifters.
@@Bikes-with-Ben I just had the pawl spring fail on my 2 yr old very limited use SLX. I replaced it with XT I had around. No noticeable difference in actuation pressure though I run clutch off. Nice beakdown of the differences between models. Clearly all around nicer shift execution with the XT IMHO.
The pull for upshifts doesn't work when going downhill. You can't let go of the brake. I do find it more convenient when riding uphill and not covering the brake.
You’re not on the brakes your whole descent are you?! I almost exclusively use the trigger pull for upshifts and haven’t run into an issue having my fingers off the brake levers to do it.
@@Bikes-with-Ben that's not good. Finger on the brakes when going with any significant speed. But the pull is nice when just resting my hands climbing. Miss that feature on my other bike.
@vlbz hey, to each their own. For me I’ve got little reason to be upshifting while I’m climbing and not having my finger resting on the brake lever 100% of the time has not been an issue.
I just bought Deore and XT 12 speed shifters. Also rode friends XTR 12. The xtr feels super precise and solid. The xt and deore work fine but dont feel nearly as refined. Still plasticy compared to xtr. The dual release is the only bonus of xt and for me its not that big a deal.
I didn’t talk about it much because there wasn’t much to say. It has the same weight and features as the XT, but on the sealed bearing housing has 4 instead of 2. Quantities there being ball bearings I think. I think it also adds a rubberized grip to the trigger part of the upshift lever (i think). All in all, it doesn’t justify the large price jump.
Thanks sir. Im building my bike from scratch. And planning to build with 1x12 deore and XT family. One more, there is GRX 1x12, can we mix and match with deore, slx, xt, xtr family? Can I use GRX shifter and mix with 1x12 deore, slx, xt, xtr drivetrain?
I don’t believe you can. The GRX line of 12-speed stuff is compatible with the 105 line of 12-speed road components I think, but it’s not compatible with any of the MTB stuff.
Did you make a mistake with the column headings on that google doc you shared? The first page has column headings Deore, SLX, XT, XTR - The body of the table looks to be the other way round with XTR features on the left, and Deore on the right.
So I don’t think the data in each column is mismatched, but page 1 goes Deore to XTR from left to right because that’s how it makes sense in my head and that is my summary page that I’ve created from page 2. Page 2 is Shimano comparison table that I’ve just copy-pasted and formatted. They go XTR to Deore on theirs. I really should keep the formatting consistent on both tabs though. Deore to XTR makes the most sense to me, what about to you?
I'd be too scared to buy those shifters off of eBay. Not sure how they can sell and ship them for less than wholesale. The Amazon prices are still darn cheap, but it's a bit easier to know if the seller is reputable there. How do you feel about the stiffness of the 12-speed XT shifter? I only tried it once in a test ride, but it seems to require a lot more force to actuate than any other shifter I've used. Good video! Thanks!
My guess for eBay is that they’re takeoffs from pre-builds that got swapped out for a different model. But, yeah it’s a risk at the cheaper price and luckily it’s only a $30 risk. I’ve heard other people mention the stiffness of the XT, I haven’t noticed anything out of the ordinary. Maybe if I did a side by side again while actively thinking about the stiffness I might notice, but I’m quite happy with how it feels.
I just bought from Aliexpress for the first time. All Shimano stuff has been fine except possibly a chain I havent tried yet. Bought xt groupset, brakes, and Deore shifter and derailleur.
Clamp band will work with any setup and clamps directly to your handlebars . The I-Spec requires that your brakes have I-Spec mounts on them (most Shimano brakes do and I’m sure some others too). The I-Spec type shifter mounts directly to your break lever mount and still gives you side to side and rotation adjustment of the shifter position. It is nice and makes your cockpit look cleaner, with the drawback being that it’s not compatible with every setup. I’ve run clamp style for years and just recently got I-Spec on my new bike. The shifters themselves are no different, just the mount.
Does anyone know why Shimano went from 6/4 Titanium to 7075 aluminum for the XTR 9100 chainring? If i were to pay about 💰450-500.00🍁, I would want the Best material possible. And speaking of Titanium, 5Dev's very cool 6/4 Titanium cranks are 💰💰3,000🍁😳🤨
Yeah I’d go Deore or SLX derailleur with an XT shifter. The jockey wheels are optional, I’d wait til the stock ones got worn down and then just upgrade with the XT jockey wheels at that point.
I actually don’t know. The question comes down to whether or not the road cassettes/derailleurs have the same indexing values as the MTB ones. Instincts tell me no, but I’m not positive.
Shimano's comparison chart shows only a few differences and some of them I don't fully understand either. 1. Multibearing Construction: 4 (XTR) vs 2 (XT). I assume this is inside around the pivot point of the levers, but I'm not sure physically how that looks. 2. Shifter Lever Bracket Material Finish: Anodized Aluminum (XTR) vs Painted Aluminum (XT) 3. Relase Lever Body Material: Carbon Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XTR) vs Steel+Glass Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XT) 4. Base Cover Material: Carbon Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XTR) vs Glass Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XT) 5. Shifter Level Cable: Polymer-Coated Cable (XTR) vs OPTISLICK Cable (XT) 6. Rubber Grooved Grip: Main & Release Levers (XTR) vs Main Lever only (XT) Definitely a few differences, but the weights stay the same and none of the differences seem that special especially when you consider the price difference.
Thanks for the reply, I had a look at Shimano's exploded drawings but it is not clear/shown where the huge jump in cost went in the engineering of the XTR shifting mechanism (as you state). I have not read of any definitive robustness or longevity that the XTR has over the XT. I actually have the XTR as it came with the bike but have not had an opportunity to directly compare with the XT.@@Bikes-with-Ben
Do you have a 12-spd shifter and rear derailleur? There are times where you can use 12-spd parts with 11-spd ones, but I’d have to look into specifics.
@@Bikes-with-Ben yes i used m7100 slx 12speed, slx m7100 12shifter and deore m5100 11 speed cassette. I am Planning to upgrade my shifter to deore xt 12speed
Not in my experience. The main thing to be wary of is chains, they seemed to be faked a lot more but it’s pretty easy to tell. A lot of the eBay parts tend to be take offs from brand new bikes that got upgraded before ever being ridden.
Do the XTR stil jvse A firmer "bump" feel when down shifting? M9000 has a firmer kit was weird. Is this the case with m9100? Or do both xt8100 and m9100 have no bump, just light shift? Like m615 had?
@@mtbboy1993 the XTR and XT have the firmer shift that’s a bit more responsive while the SLX and Deore have a smoother action that is very slightly delayed
@@mtbboy1993 ua-cam.com/video/moq13PBrMMU/v-deo.htmlsi=MTqG-NO64bW2A-qz I haven’t used the previous version, but here is a video I made comparing the SLX and XT so you can see how firm the XT is.
The only difference is in the sealed bearing setup. I think it’s two bearings in the XT vs 4 in the XTR. I assume this is a ball bearing count, but I’m not positive.
Geez, hostile dude. That list was up for over two months as I was making this video. There are multiple other listings on eBay right now that get you very close that $16 price tag. I’m not trying to misinform people here, I don’t gain anything by saying those were $16. That’s what they were for the entirety of the time that I filmed and edited this video.
@@muthatrucker6485 It’s $23 on Amazon and Backcountry. There are other take offs and used ones on eBay starting at $10, I just looked. The Deore eBay link was up for over two months as I was making this video. I don’t gain anything by telling you the Deore is cheaper than it currently is. Idk what you want me to do, I don’t control when things go on sale.
Check out my latest video comparing Shimano's 12-speed MTB Cassettes: ua-cam.com/video/kME0yIAbA8k/v-deo.htmlsi=XIyq3gFtvgUOCPLf
UPDATE: The eBay listings in the links ended after I posted this video. You can still find take off shifters close to the prices I discussed in this video, but the exact listings that I referenced are no longer available. A good excuse to contact your LBS to buy these even if it does cost a bit more!
I ride a Stumpjumper Comp carbon with a SLX group-set. I replaced the SLX-Shifter with a XT and would never ever go back. The instant shifting and the double shifting to a higher gear is a game-changer. And the best thing is, everyone can do this in 15-20 minutes and watching a UA-cam tutorial.
Its like playing with 60 fps for a year and then go back to 30fps on the same games ;)
Cheers from Switzerland
I know a lot about shifters but didn’t realize the difference in cable release. I love learning new info so thanks for that!
I thank the algorithm for showing me your channel, loving it so far
Finally a video about shimano shifters that's not 4 years old!
Great info, great comparison. Love how you're not a bike snob, like so many others here on the Tube.
going to be pairing a deore deraileur with an xt shifter and a sunrace casette coz the sunrace is the only thing i can find in my country that uses the older HG freehub with 11-51 range , im on an older bike with quick release and i am not yet ready to replace the wheelset as they are prohibitively expencive to replace and im pretty sure i wont find the newer freehub bodies for my el cheapo joytek hubs ,
for reference im going from an older deore 3x9 for wich cranks are impossible to find without importing so im riding with the cheap altus stamped crank
Been loving the series, super informative and has influenced the monetary decisions I’m making but you getting excited about remembering the up and down shift paradox cracked me up bro 😂
Thanks for doing this series.
After a rock killed my XTR mech and a few teeth on a creaky XT cassette, I now have XT shifter, XT mech and SLX cassette. I feel the lighter weight mech arm on the XTR led to a little flex. SLX cassette with all steel cogs definitely feels better than alloy cogs on the XT.
I do love being able to dump 2 gears on the upshift with the XT shifter.
The wife having smaller hands and less thumb strength loves the SLX shifter with the softer feel.
I’m XT all the way. Still can’t get the shifting perfectly crisp after tinkering with it. But it’s a dependable setup that is cheap to replace parts when needed.
I think this content and others comparison content are very helpful to me. Comparison,hack and bang for bucks make me excited in your next episode. Good job 👏
Epic series of videos! Did the same with my 11 speed setup.
M7000 slx brakes (the same stoping power and newer on the market), XT M8000 RD with an XTR M9000 shifter, just because it was the only one with 4 bearings in the mechanism vs the rest. Need to check that cable quick action 😁
LE: Yes, I have it as well. Yuhuu.. it explaines now why it's such a crisp shifting action. I thought it was just the multi-bearing setup.
Great video series! Im personally running a Deore shifter, Cassette and Chain with a Deore XT rear derailleur and entire brake setup on my Trekking Bike, and Im really happy with it.
I'm just starting out and already realizing very quickly that "the ultimate Shimano drivetrain" doesn't include the bottom bracket, and I've also opted to go with a Wolf Tooth chainring for the 1 piece design..
Thank you so much for this. I’m just replacing the awful sram nx that came on my bike and really didn’t understand the differences. Appreciate the honest information here. Will purchase using your links :)
Ben - completely agree that XT shifters are the best. I run these on my 10 speed setups on 3 bikes.
Love your comparison videos dude! Great job!
ONE BIG PROBLEM WITH XT - They work way harder than Deore and SLX, because of that instant release. Tenision is higher and levers are harder to press. This makes a difference for many women I know. Just to let you know. I moved back from XT to SLX on my GF bike just because of that.
That’s a really good point! I didn’t notice the extra force required, but I know my wife has the grip strength of a young child so I could see that being a problem for her. That’s definitely a good thing to consider when looking into upgrading.
Yep, can’t stand it. XTR and SLX have much better action. XT feels like something off a farm tractor.
@@RichardWagenknecht I have not noticed that! I’m surprised the XTR wouldn’t be harder too if the Instant Release mechanism is the reason for the increased required pressure.
Can u actually repeat it what do you mean work way harder than deore and slx? I don't actually get it because I'm gonna buy xt soon
@@Kyosuke_Kun what I think they mean is the XT shifter takes more force to press than the SLX. I ran the SLX shifter for a year before switching over to the XT model. I personally didn’t notice a difference, but others have claimed they do. Being that the shifter is actuating the derailleur through the shifting cable, I would think the only thing that could make the lever harder to press would be the length of the lever being shorter, but I don’t think that is the case either. I would say get the XT shifter and you won’t be disappointed.
thansk for making this video. I've been on the fence about getting the XT shifter, and I think this video convinced me it's worth it. I have a Pivot that came with XT rear mech and SLX shifter.
I really do like the XT. I think if you’ve got a bit of cash to spend it’s a worthwhile upgrade.
This a great comparison video! You're others are equally informative.
I like your videos! I've been using the XT M8000 11 speed shifter for years, but on a new build I decided to try a ($16) Deore M5100 11 speed shifter. It definitely has a softer feel, with less pressure required than the XT, but the shifts aren't as crisp and solid as the XT shifter, despite having an all new Deore M5100 drivetrain. I'm going back to an XT shifter, although the cheapest I can find them for right now is around $50.
Yeah, the Instant Release feature on the XT just makes it so crisp.
Could you do a video on Shimano Brakes from Deore to XTR as well as a video on rotors front and rear
Awesome Vid! Would love to see a vid comparing shifter cables
XTR is lighter feel as well as more smooth feel. It is that way since 9spd XTR. For me it is the only XTR component that is worth to pay for.
It definitely feels better than xt. And xt isnt bad.
I absolutely agree, The shifting is so much better as XT. But if you are not shifting so much.. slx is maybe enough.
You are so damn right about not getting burn out doing this, almost nobody in UA-cam get it.
Can you do a Shimano brakes comparison? Would it be GREAT!
1)brake lever and caliper (would it be great if you consider the 4 pistons ones)
they say you could buy an SLX and have the freestroke adjust by replacing a screw and basically have the XT
2)then rotors comparison
3)maybe pads comparison, material, fins exc
*)extra, the hose that is different between the lineup
Thank you
Yo I appreciate this and the derailleur videos, very well done and saved me some cash!
This is super helpful, i just started to look into building a bike and the diff series shimano offers consumes me. anyway, other thatn the difference you mentioned in the video, are there any difference in terms of durability, material, easy to fix (i guess no one will fix given the low price?) etc among the differ shifter? thank you
I always upshift using my trigger finger. Never noticed that you can multiple if you use your thumb😅
I do the same. I still mainly use the trigger, but every once in a while I jump to the thumb if I need a quick up shift of multiple gears.
You are my new hero!!! Subscribed and liked!
I have tested multi release XT and earlier 443's and didn't like the sensation . A big no for me . Just conventional XT similar to the 740 3 x 8 ones in use on my TREK custom build mtb . They are old but work well and are in good condition . They are servo wave feel in a way.
Great video. I think that your up-shift and downshift numbers on your google sheet are backwards.
I am constantly mixing up-shift and downshift up, but I think they’re right on the Google sheet. 4/3 Downshifts and 2/1 Up-Shifts is correct as long as downshifts means easier gear and upshifts means harder. Which when looking at a cassette seems wrong, but when thinking about it like a manual transmission with 1 being the easiest gear and 6 being the hardest then I believe it is right.
good tech info...thanks
I paid just over 💰200.00🍁 for a pair of XT M772 Rapid Fire plus shifters back in 2011; they're still going🤘🤘
Ah ha! That explains the problems I had with an SLX shifter. I had two of them fail from sweat getting inside and corroding the mechanism. That didn’t happen with XT.
Worth the extra money, for sure.
Oof, how much are you sweating out of your thumb? I would’ve thought creek crossings or rain to be the culprit.
@@Bikes-with-Ben Enough sweat, I suppose. One’s hand is right there. It also gets really hot and humid here.
Fair point, could be dripping from your helmet too over the bars. I’m glad the XT fixed your issues!
Is it possible to clean the inside without disassembling it? Using an air compressor, for example?
@imilic8 you’d be better off taking it apart because there is grease in there so an air compressor won’t really do much.
On our local store, XT shifter is 20 usd, RD is 45 usd. XT groupset is entry level.
i just purchased the XT 11-speed Linkglide shifter for my new 11-speed Cues derailleur, unfortunately all i could find was the bar clamp version but I found an I-Spec EV replacement cover on ebay. I contacted Shimano to see if it would fit and they said yes, so I literally just ordered it 5-mins ago.
I had the exact same issue trying to replace my current Deore 11 speed. I don't think they even sell an EV version of the XT 11 speed. Did you end up okay using the EV cover?
@@MarioGoatse yep, it worked great. Which deore shifter do you have, what's the model number? Because there is also a I-Spec EV cover that i saw for a Deore shifter. I'll have to see which it was for.
@@NonLegitNation2 My current one is an 11 Speed Deore SL-M5100, with a clamp. But I wanted to upgrade it to the 11 Speed XT shifter because I upgraded my brakes to XT 8100 levers and they’re I Spec EV as well.
Please do a video comparisson between Shimano deore/slx/xt/xtr disc brakes
It’s coming up in a few videos!
Had archer electronic shifting with xtr rd 12 speed the archer motor burned after a year no warrenty so going back mechanical xt shifter...
Wow thank you for this
Nice video. You know you called these “derailleurs” for the whole video? 😂
😂 I did notice that in editing, eh they’re all bike parts.
@@Bikes-with-Ben totally! Ha ha. I did enjoy the video!
I used to mountain biking in the early 90's and I got itching again for it. So I'm in the very confusing endevour of trying to understand what model to buy. Since the early 90's these bitches have become so sophisticated, that I found it very challenging to decide what features I really need/wish for, also given the too high price for my wallet. It due my financial means what I'll get i will be stuck with for a long time, so I plan to get a bike (it will an ebike as I'm old and far from fit) I will upgrade some features in time. It given the "Auto Shift", or at least electronic shifting, would be something I really wish for (I know I don't need it) from this video I'm getting hope I may identify a bike which will be a good match for my evil plan. Currently I'm oriented on Giant it seems to me a reliable brand and there are good bargains on a couple years old models, which have Shimano ep8 drive and XT components (Giant Trance X E+ 1 at ~30% discount seems to fit the role). Do you have other suggestion?
That's great that you're getting back into it! As for recomendations, I don't know e-bikes well at all, but I do think Giant is a reputable brand overall and offer some good value as well. My wife rides a Liv brand (Giant's womens counterpart) and loves it!
My SLX can shift down 4 times with one sweep to bigger cogs, but only when starting from the position of the smallest cog . Otherwise it's 3.
Sadly, while I expected XT to be the obvious best-value option, mine didn’t hold up more than about 20 hours. A small internal spring broke, and I had to buy what I could get locally, and XTR. Now I have well over 100hrs on the shifter with zero detectable degradation. Turns out other folks I know had XT failures too, so hopefully it was just a production issue that affected material durability or something…. I can’t see myself doing XT again unless I know for sure they solved the issue.
That’s interesting, I put my XT middle of last season and haven’t had any issues yet. Hopefully it has been fixed!
That pawl spring on the XT is a known design flaw. Shimano will tell you it has been fixed but it hasn't. The Deore shifter is fine, but it has 50% less i-spec rotation angle adjustment than SLX and XT. For my money, SLX is the best value in Shimano MTB shifters.
That sucks, so far I’ve got a couple hundred hours between my two XTs and so far so good!
@@Bikes-with-Ben I just had the pawl spring fail on my 2 yr old very limited use SLX. I replaced it with XT I had around. No noticeable difference in actuation pressure though I run clutch off. Nice beakdown of the differences between models. Clearly all around nicer shift execution with the XT IMHO.
The pull for upshifts doesn't work when going downhill. You can't let go of the brake. I do find it more convenient when riding uphill and not covering the brake.
You’re not on the brakes your whole descent are you?! I almost exclusively use the trigger pull for upshifts and haven’t run into an issue having my fingers off the brake levers to do it.
@@Bikes-with-Ben that's not good. Finger on the brakes when going with any significant speed. But the pull is nice when just resting my hands climbing. Miss that feature on my other bike.
@vlbz hey, to each their own. For me I’ve got little reason to be upshifting while I’m climbing and not having my finger resting on the brake lever 100% of the time has not been an issue.
I just bought Deore and XT 12 speed shifters. Also rode friends XTR 12. The xtr feels super precise and solid. The xt and deore work fine but dont feel nearly as refined. Still plasticy compared to xtr. The dual release is the only bonus of xt and for me its not that big a deal.
Dual release AND instant release. The instant release is what makes it worth while for me.
Did I miss the bit where you talked about the XTR and why it is so expensive?
I didn’t talk about it much because there wasn’t much to say. It has the same weight and features as the XT, but on the sealed bearing housing has 4 instead of 2. Quantities there being ball bearings I think. I think it also adds a rubberized grip to the trigger part of the upshift lever (i think). All in all, it doesn’t justify the large price jump.
Thanks sir. Im building my bike from scratch. And planning to build with 1x12 deore and XT family. One more, there is GRX 1x12, can we mix and match with deore, slx, xt, xtr family? Can I use GRX shifter and mix with 1x12 deore, slx, xt, xtr drivetrain?
I don’t believe you can. The GRX line of 12-speed stuff is compatible with the 105 line of 12-speed road components I think, but it’s not compatible with any of the MTB stuff.
Just go all XT 8100 with the 9100 XTR cassette 😁
Did you make a mistake with the column headings on that google doc you shared? The first page has column headings Deore, SLX, XT, XTR - The body of the table looks to be the other way round with XTR features on the left, and Deore on the right.
Also THANKS for the spreadsheet. It is super useful. Please keep it up.
So I don’t think the data in each column is mismatched, but page 1 goes Deore to XTR from left to right because that’s how it makes sense in my head and that is my summary page that I’ve created from page 2. Page 2 is Shimano comparison table that I’ve just copy-pasted and formatted. They go XTR to Deore on theirs. I really should keep the formatting consistent on both tabs though. Deore to XTR makes the most sense to me, what about to you?
I'd be too scared to buy those shifters off of eBay. Not sure how they can sell and ship them for less than wholesale. The Amazon prices are still darn cheap, but it's a bit easier to know if the seller is reputable there.
How do you feel about the stiffness of the 12-speed XT shifter? I only tried it once in a test ride, but it seems to require a lot more force to actuate than any other shifter I've used.
Good video! Thanks!
My guess for eBay is that they’re takeoffs from pre-builds that got swapped out for a different model. But, yeah it’s a risk at the cheaper price and luckily it’s only a $30 risk.
I’ve heard other people mention the stiffness of the XT, I haven’t noticed anything out of the ordinary. Maybe if I did a side by side again while actively thinking about the stiffness I might notice, but I’m quite happy with how it feels.
I just bought from Aliexpress for the first time. All Shimano stuff has been fine except possibly a chain I havent tried yet.
Bought xt groupset, brakes, and Deore shifter and derailleur.
@@johndef5075 I haven’t bought from AliExpress yet, but the chains are the main thing I’ve seen counterfeited for sure.
@Bikes-with-Ben Im going to buy chains from my lbs from now on. Too critical to take a chance on.
Some of the increased shifting force is coming from the clutch on the derailleur.
basically the Deore XT T8000 shifters are made for 3x10. Can it be turned in a 2x10 ?
@@Pepin-LB I’m not sure I understand. These shifters are for 1x12 setups
I just want to ask bro.. my rd is 10-11s deore i have thought maybe it is possible i use 12s shifter and 12s cassette? It is possible to work it?
which XT shifter do you recommend? I-spec or clamp band and what is the difference between the two.
Clamp band will work with any setup and clamps directly to your handlebars . The I-Spec requires that your brakes have I-Spec mounts on them (most Shimano brakes do and I’m sure some others too). The I-Spec type shifter mounts directly to your break lever mount and still gives you side to side and rotation adjustment of the shifter position. It is nice and makes your cockpit look cleaner, with the drawback being that it’s not compatible with every setup. I’ve run clamp style for years and just recently got I-Spec on my new bike. The shifters themselves are no different, just the mount.
Thanks. By the way, great videos!
There is a hack that removes the bit of plastic that stops the multiple shifts
Oh interesting, so you can convert an Deore/SLX shifter to work like an XT/XTR? That’d be sweet!
Does anyone know why Shimano went from 6/4 Titanium to 7075 aluminum for the XTR 9100 chainring? If i were to pay about
💰450-500.00🍁, I would want the Best material possible. And speaking of Titanium, 5Dev's very cool 6/4 Titanium cranks are
💰💰3,000🍁😳🤨
Would it be a good idea to have deore derailleur with xt pulleys and xt shifter? I gess thats what can be done based on your videos
Yeah I’d go Deore or SLX derailleur with an XT shifter. The jockey wheels are optional, I’d wait til the stock ones got worn down and then just upgrade with the XT jockey wheels at that point.
Take home message number two, companies are incapable of coherent naming schemes
Can i use xt derailleur 10 speed on a road bike or hybrid bike?
I actually don’t know. The question comes down to whether or not the road cassettes/derailleurs have the same indexing values as the MTB ones. Instincts tell me no, but I’m not positive.
So what is th edifference between the XT and XTR (apart from price)?
Shimano's comparison chart shows only a few differences and some of them I don't fully understand either.
1. Multibearing Construction: 4 (XTR) vs 2 (XT). I assume this is inside around the pivot point of the levers, but I'm not sure physically how that looks.
2. Shifter Lever Bracket Material Finish: Anodized Aluminum (XTR) vs Painted Aluminum (XT)
3. Relase Lever Body Material: Carbon Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XTR) vs Steel+Glass Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XT)
4. Base Cover Material: Carbon Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XTR) vs Glass Fiber Reinforced Polymer (XT)
5. Shifter Level Cable: Polymer-Coated Cable (XTR) vs OPTISLICK Cable (XT)
6. Rubber Grooved Grip: Main & Release Levers (XTR) vs Main Lever only (XT)
Definitely a few differences, but the weights stay the same and none of the differences seem that special especially when you consider the price difference.
Thanks for the reply, I had a look at Shimano's exploded drawings but it is not clear/shown where the huge jump in cost went in the engineering of the XTR shifting mechanism (as you state). I have not read of any definitive robustness or longevity that the XTR has over the XT. I actually have the XTR as it came with the bike but have not had an opportunity to directly compare with the XT.@@Bikes-with-Ben
Hello ben will it work properly if i have a slx rd and XT shifter and deore 11speed cassette?
Do you have a 12-spd shifter and rear derailleur?
There are times where you can use 12-spd parts with 11-spd ones, but I’d have to look into specifics.
@@Bikes-with-Ben yes i used m7100 slx 12speed, slx m7100 12shifter and deore m5100 11 speed cassette. I am Planning to upgrade my shifter to deore xt 12speed
@@McBoysBrothers oh perfect, if you’re already using an SLX 12-spd shifter then the XT will work just the same.
The XT shifter effort is so much higher than SLX or XTR. Not sure why Shimano did this.
Mine seems to shift okay with same effort as my Deore shifters. Is your derailleur clutch super stiff?
I just made swith from SLX to XT = no detectible difference
Aren't those eBay Shimano parts fake?
Not in my experience. The main thing to be wary of is chains, they seemed to be faked a lot more but it’s pretty easy to tell. A lot of the eBay parts tend to be take offs from brand new bikes that got upgraded before ever being ridden.
Do the XTR stil jvse A firmer "bump" feel when down shifting? M9000 has a firmer kit was weird. Is this the case with m9100? Or do both xt8100 and m9100 have no bump, just light shift? Like m615 had?
@@mtbboy1993 the XTR and XT have the firmer shift that’s a bit more responsive while the SLX and Deore have a smoother action that is very slightly delayed
@@Bikes-with-Ben is it as firm as previous xt?
@@mtbboy1993 ua-cam.com/video/moq13PBrMMU/v-deo.htmlsi=MTqG-NO64bW2A-qz
I haven’t used the previous version, but here is a video I made comparing the SLX and XT so you can see how firm the XT is.
@@Bikes-with-Ben Thx, will watch it.
These low prices for shifters🤨😳
there must be some Kind of a difference between XT and XTR
The only difference is in the sealed bearing setup. I think it’s two bearings in the XT vs 4 in the XTR. I assume this is a ball bearing count, but I’m not positive.
XT, YEAH❗️😁🤘🤘
Show me these $16 deore rear shifters....total bs, they're no where near that
"This listing was ended by the seller on Fri, Feb 2 at 4:05 AM because there was an error in the listing."
Geez, hostile dude. That list was up for over two months as I was making this video. There are multiple other listings on eBay right now that get you very close that $16 price tag. I’m not trying to misinform people here, I don’t gain anything by saying those were $16. That’s what they were for the entirety of the time that I filmed and edited this video.
@@Bikes-with-Ben I looked, minimum shipped was $40usd delivered. Almost 3x the cost
@@muthatrucker6485 It’s $23 on Amazon and Backcountry. There are other take offs and used ones on eBay starting at $10, I just looked. The Deore eBay link was up for over two months as I was making this video. I don’t gain anything by telling you the Deore is cheaper than it currently is. Idk what you want me to do, I don’t control when things go on sale.