Mysticism - Hadewijch - The Theology and Writings of the Beguine Mystic of Loving the Divine Abyss
Вставка
- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- God is an Abyss of Love only ultimately discovered through Insanity, Abjection and Radical Un-Faith - This is the startling mystical theology of the 13th century Beguine Mystic Hadewijch. While her life remains mysterious, her complete works seem to come down to us virtually intact despite going virtually unstudied for nearly 800 years. In her Visons, Letters and Poetry we are witness to one of the most innovative and shocking mystical insights into esoteric Christianity to emerge from the middle ages - that reality is fundamentally Divine Love approached through a desire more intense and torturing than Hell itself. Hadewijch's writings remain some of the most daring, even alarming but also systematic and curated in the history of Christian mysticism. I hope you can join me as we divine into the mystical thought of this amazing medieval woman.
Make sure to check out Zevi's series on mysticism over @SeekersofUnity and his episode here: • The Making of Mysticis...
Make Sure to Subscribe & Consider supporting Esoterica by
becoming a monthly Patron - / esotericachannel
or a one time donation - www.paypal.me/...
Your support is profoundly appreciated!
#mysticism #hadewijch #beguines
Ay, minne, ware ic minne
Ende met minnen minne u minne!
Ay, minne, om minne ghevet dat minne
Die minne al minne volkinne.
Recommended Readings:
Hadewijch: The Complete Works - 978-0809122974
Swan - The Wisdom of the Beguines - 978-1629190082
McGinn - The Flowering of Mysticism - 978-0824517434
Mommaers - Hadewijch. Writer - Beguine - Love Mystic - 978-9042913929
McGinn - The Essential Writings of Christian Mysticism - 978-0812974218
Make Sure to Subscribe & Consider supporting Esoterica by
becoming a monthly Patron - www.patreon.com/esotericachannel
or a one time donation - www.paypal.me/esotericachannel
Your support is profoundly appreciated!
Its the age old war between the Ein-Sof and Solar Logos crowds.
You and Zevi are my favorite channels on UA-cam. Really, truly diamonds in the rough. Thank you for all of your amazing work.
Also... Mad wimpel flex 😂
Thank you Justin. It's an honor to call you a friend and a pleasure to be creating educational content alongside you on the topics we love. You set a high bar for the rest of us, both in your scholarship and your thoughtfulness. Looking forward to many more mystical, scholarly years together. With love, Zevi
I totally share this sentiment and I really honored to share this platform and project of making topics like these - high quality, intellectually rigorous, deeply sympathetic and truly accessible - with folks like you. It's a blessing, to be sure. Here's to many more years of friendship and working together!
@@TheEsotericaChannel
Is there a specific episode on the Tselem astral body?
Thanks for the high quality content and making it very approachable.
@@ron1313 not yet but I'm planning to get to it
@@TheEsotericaChannel
Thanks for the quick response. I found a old lecture
ua-cam.com/video/lkQQ9gKZNF0/v-deo.html
I'm glad you guys paired up in research. I've been keeping up with both of your channels. Good stuff
I’m a Christian and this is one of my favorite channels
I’m a Christian Mystic and this is good stuff.
⭐️Outstanding Work❤️thank you
Have you every read into the movement started by the Bàb? A prophetic claimant in 1840s persia? It eventually lead to the Bahai faith though his own movement had some marked differences
A bit but not much
@@TheEsotericaChannel I'd recommend the work of Denis MacEoin on the group
I've learned through the years to not hate the religion itself, but those that use Christianity to push their own bigotry and deceptive behaviors. Basically I go by the phrase 'hate the sin, not the sinner,' which is funny to me since I'm Pagan! You are completely right that anyone that wants to have a well-rounded view on Mysticism needs to look into all works from all branches of religions, and that includes all of the Abrahamic religions. That is where Mystics would've also been, and they would've been writing from that viewpoint! Despite my religious views being different, there's plenty that can be taken from the works by these authors, and I think more people need to understand that. Wonderful and fascinating video as always! ❤
I appreciate this sentiment.
Bigot?
I agree with you
No people are below dignity, and no ideas are above scrutiny - maajid Nawaz
This is the approach that I have had to take as will
This is absolutely fascinating. There is so much here that I feel I’d need to watch several times, and take notes, and/or look into the reading, in order to go deeper. The different forms and modes of experiencing love are quite intriguing (making me want to map/contemplate them). But I’m also struck by your (her) description of the abyss, and the betrayal of love, IN ORDER to experience it most deeply. I feel the pain and tension of duality and unity, most acutely, here. The dance of polarity, of opposites, in order to experience unity. So thought provoking. Thank you for this. 🙏🏻💛
There's so much going on in her writings, it's truly fascinating!
Begin the Beguine again.
Wow, I resonate with the idea of "unfaith" on such a visceral level. I sometimes tell people I went through an atheist detox - that in order to discover any kind of real faith I had to completely deny it. I feel so weirdly connected to this idea and I really want to read her work now!
Atheism then is a rite of passage to deep spirituality!
While I'm still very much an atheist, I respect that you've entertained more ideas! Too many religious people are not very thoughtful, and have dangerously cartoonish understandings of other people's perspectives.
I became an atheist at 17, grew up Catholic and later tried a Lutheran approach, because I felt that people SHOULD understand their faith on their own terms, but it never satisfied me.
Because of my atheist journey, I realized the knowledge I craved was no only physical and numerical, but also spiritual. My atheism, in a way, opened me up to receive a waterfall of knowledge, when the droplet of dogma wasn’t cutting it anymore.
Your justing looking for your top 😂
A Kabbalist teacher I listen to interpreted Jacob’s trajectory as an example of a type that needs to “run away from home,” as it were, before reconnecting there.
As a Pagan minister and seminarian, I do believe the disregard, and even hate for Chrisitianty among esotericists is directly a result of trauma and religious abuse at the hands of the church.
Most American Pagans (myself included) are ex-Christians who were harmed with legalism at their lowest moments.
I take it as a work within myself, and to encourage my parishioners, to heal and not paint an entire religion in broad strokes.
There are a lot of spiritually abused out there. Structures of men’s beliefs stirred in a deadly mixture of law and grace.
I've been waiting for this one! Thank you so much. I've recently been studying Hilma af Klint. A Christian Theosophist now credited with being the first abstract artist in Western painting who received the insperations for her art during séances. Truly fascinating.
I may have skipped class today, but at least I can spend my morning coffee learning something more important like this anyways. Appreciate the videos! I'm also currently reading Philosophy of Mysticism by Richard Jones because of you, half way through and is a very excellent book on all the views of mysticism.
I get really touchy when people are genuinely anti-Christian, because I grew up Christian and had very positive experiences with the church (though I know that's obviously not the case for everybody!). I have always been very comfortable watching your channel, because you've never been anti-Christian. Anti- certain practices, of course, but who isn't? You're definitely hitting the happy medium, and it makes your content both more enjoyable and less intellectually biased. I love seeing a new Esoterica video get uploaded!
Someone: "How many times can you say love before it starts to sound weird?"
Hadewijch: "Hold my beer"
Yes, this
@Level ARE3RA No thanks
@Level ARE3RA Or I could not do that? Like, take a hint buddy I'm not interested.
As a Christian, I appreciate your opening section. I see a lot of over simplification of Christianity and its history thrown around esoteric and similar corners.
I am Catholic and I love your channel. My niche within the Catholic tradition is the teaching of the Mystics and the Mystical tradition. Honestly, I appreciate all the information you provide; especially knowing, you are not going to gloss over the bad behavior (and there has been plenty of it) within Catholicism. Thanks for all your work!
I really do my best to name the good and the will, the weal and the woe - otherwise, I just don't feel like I'm being honest.
For those who would like to know more about the Catholic faith ,Fr Chris from the Divine Mercy channel, series : Explaining the faith. Bishop Barron has a great ministry as well , Word on Fire. The Franciscan Friars and The Fathers of Mercy give great homilies.
Good to see another catholic in this channel:)
Dr. Sledge, do you have any interest in The Cloud of Unknowing or in Dionysius the Pseudo-Aereopagite? Both would be good topics, I think. There are many interesting threads in Christian mysticism.
Yep, I'll get to those, but they are otherwise better known.
I first read Hadewijch last year and immediately fell in love with her writings. Very glad to see some great commentary on her!
Thank you for this excellent work! I am a (non-Christian) student of theology and philosophy in Leuven. It’s lovely to hear such a well-researched and thoughtful account of an important Flemish mystic not often remembered.
Funny how layman see things. Case in point, my wife caught me studying Hebrew the other day and asked me if I was up to something evil. Hehe... BTW “I came here for the daemons but stayed because of the archangeli.” Thanks for all your work Dr Justin! To avoid the inherent bias, I always differentiate my Christianity by saying Esoteric Christianity. Seems to deflect some of the hate.
Eh, I'm fine with both dimensions as long as they aren't toxic. Christianity is, like all religions, wonderful and terrible.
"Esoteric Christianity" is a signal for Neo-nazism in some circles.
Be aware.
I'm absolutely shocked how tightly my mystical beliefs align with hers. I'm not a Christian (they would call me an Apostate I suppose), but the idea that Love is literally "all there is" and is the prime substrate upon which everything else emanates from, is my own personal belief born of one indescribably profound spiritual experience plus years of searching. I feel like I could sit down with her over some beers and we would totally bond haha. Thank you for teaching us about her...
Thank you, this was wonderfully inspirational. I went to a Benedictine high school, so powerful women and mysticism were front and center. The rest of the world is missing out.
Sister Mary Pious (who was later known to me as “Bernice”, once told us all belief and knowledge is both wonderful and terrible, and certainty is dangerous. That memory came back today.
I can't believe that "Benedictine high school" is something that actually exists in the same world that I'm living in. This made my day! Thank you for sharing it. 🙂
Christianity is very difficult.
This is not to say the other religions are not. But it is not praying for wealth and judging others or condemning so-called Pagans or other faiths.
Great work, Dr. Sledge! One of my least favourite aspects of contemporary discussions of mysticism is the tendency for people like Alan Watts to act as if the teachings of the Christian mystics that they like (like Hildegard of Bingen, Julian of Norwich, Meister Eckhart etc.) are somehow fundamentally different and separable from Christianity as a whole. As if Eckhart or Hadewijch were just Buddhists dressed in Christian clothing. This not only misses the point of what these mystics were actually saying and what makes them unique, but ignores how deeply rooted a lot of their more seemingly radical ideas are within the broader Christian philosophical tradition.
Yeah, same with medieval occultists like Agrippa or dee - they were pious, if not unusual, Christians
@Amy Wade please don't divorce Christ from Christianity. Any New Age or Oriental reading will inevitably lead to error when it comes to reception of the Gospels.
I used to do the same until I recently rejoined the flock.
Anyways, the same could apply to any religious figure.
The New Age tendency to mix and match as one pleases is ruining people's spiritual and critical insights, chaining them to gurus who will demand money and devotion for the next piece of their puzzle.
Don't take this comment harshly, though, I'm not trying to disrespect you. Have a nice day.
What about tersa of avalia
What about tersa of avalia
You are correct. Being criticized by both extremes is a great indication that your academic nuance is sufficiently precise and accurate so as to make no ideologue happy. 😊🤗
Professor, thank you for this! I had never encountered this amazing thinker and mystic before. I agree that there is a puzzling disregard for Christianity in the world of contemporary occultism and mysticism. I also admit that I have played my own part in that and I appreciate being challenged to revise my approach.
We can all learn and grow, and glad to make her better known. She's amazing!
Thank you for trying to help us with our anti-Christian prejudice. It is something I struggle with all the time. As you say, it is a complex history, as with all older religions. One has to see it in its entirety-the heinous and evil as well as the beautiful, inspirational and even sometimes progressive. Not an easy thing to do.
A person who can deliver a truly objective and intellectual presentation on UA-cam is so rare, like a pearl of great worth. Dr. Sledge is that pearl. He is simply a great pleasure to listen to.
I feel ya on that opening point about anti-Christian (or anti-abrahamic) sentiments in occult, I see the same thing often in modern pagans and atheists, with the three groups usually having in common that they're "driven" to their new beliefs by bad experiences with Christianity (only partly - I'm not trying to devalue their interests). Considering Christianity's pervasiveness in the English speaking world, this makes a lot of sense, as unfortunate as it is.
Yeah, it's a pity really. Baby and Bathwater, as they say.
Also due to the fact that christianity largely "occulted" its own neoplatonist roots and hijacked a lot of symbolism and philosophy, and for someone to even be set on a positive personal path towards a mystical experience or understanding of themselves they have to un-learn/relearn a great deal in its proper context...
Being very much an atheist, I think a lot of people (accusers and accused) forget to separate individuals and institutions. Institutional Christianity is awful, but individual Christian people vary widely. I typically find I have the least issue with Christians who are thoughtful and educated in their faith - those who don't critically examine their faith are the ones who perpetuate the larger institutional problems.
@@monsieurdorgat6864 I know lots of people who have positive experiences with "institutional Christianity." Nuance is important in these topics, and dividing it into a binary is not exactly nuanced.
But yes, people who are thoughtful and educated about their own faith (or any/every faith) tend to be quite pleasant.
@@LoudWaffle Fair enough - there are many Christian institutions. That being said, we could name many denominations who largely espouse net explicitly harmful beliefs, especially when that denomination is a majority rather than a minority.
Part of nuance is to acknowledge systemic perspectives, as well as individual perspectives. In fact, dealing with systemic problems is usually more productive.
True about Christianity, Judaism and Islam. They seem to have deeeeeeeeeep spirituality.
Had it not been you & your channel I would have never known about so many esoteric traditions of Western Civilization. I would have lived the imagined truth that ‘Only India, the land of Yogis and Gurus had truth’ Thank you so much🙏🙏
Everywhere and all people's have deep wells, glad to showcase this amazing woman's thought and life.
I love this channel so much. Most subjects of your videos I have never heard of and sends me down rabbit holes in books and internet. I would not have it any other way. So many different belief systems and majority of the writings are not in English or impossible to get the writing to read. Thank you.
Yep, it's called esoterica for a reason ;)
I think Hadewijch's visions could be compared quite interestingly to the views of George Bataille, Pierre Klossowski, and also the American Christian Atheist, Thomas J. J. Altizer.
Go forth and do
I wonder how many people were driven to study esotericism due to negative interactions with modern Christianity. Speaking personally, I was raised Catholic and found myself pushing it away (especially as I got older and during college) while simultaneously seeking out more and more alternative esoteric prospectives. It’s kind of come full circle and now I’m not so apprehensive to specifically Christian concepts but my interest is always academic- I can’t bring myself to fully embrace Christianity.
I that number is rather substantial and am somewhat curious of beliefs born of such a reaction-formation. I've always admired a great deal of Christian philosophers even if the mythology never made the least sense to me.
@@TheEsotericaChannel Speaking personally (again) it made me take a pretty hard bent towards atheism but nowadays I find myself going back and forth. The only thing I know is that I don’t know I guess you could say, but I’m trying my best to keep an open mind and your channel has been huge in exposing me to thinkers that I wouldn’t have given much of a chance in years past.
@@nicholasmiller3195 i watch this channel for the same reason! I do not like or attend church services, although I was raised and raised my boys in private school. ( my youngest attend an all boys school in Anaheim, CA. Servite was started in 1233 (i think) by 7 holy men (frairs) in devotion to the Virgin Mary, in Italy. I've heard we can arrive anywhere in the world where servite is and we won't go hungry or without a roof over our heads....no idea if its true but by the brotherhood we experienced i would say its very true. I tell you this because I too being disillusioned have also returned to my "roots" to see what I believe and dont....I basically tell God, His Son and The Holy Spirit...I believe in You. I do not care what label people slap on you Christian catholic Baptist Muslim Mormon don't care I know they're real and I could care less where the story of Jesus came from. I love hearing all versions and I could care less what year. I do find it fascinating though that people associate the 3 wise men with astrology. I heard that I few weeks ago and am now trying to read up on that. .....forgive my ramble i just wanted you to know you aren't the Lone Ranger out there investigating the crazy paths our ancestors walked.
What a great episode. Thank you:)
It is fair to recognize the insights and great deepness of Christian Mysticism. The weight of the exoteric side of Christianity seems to have outshined the great mystics this tradition has given us, such as Ruysbroeck, , Hadewijch, Teresa de Jesús, Juan de la Cruz, Meister Eckhart, all-time giant, etc.
This whole channel is amazing and I am currently going through the entire backlog. Thank-you for the wonderfully produced videos and the book recommendations! Please, keep going.
Amen
As a Christian I agree so much. There is so much spiritual beauty in the church fathers and scripture. They say sometimes the worst part about Christianity is the Christian’s not the faith. And to me that is regardless of whether Jesus was historical, not , or immaculately conceived and was resurrected. The story beneath the scripture and the spiritual foundation has been life changing. Or put another way filled the hole in my heart only Christianity could fill. Even if many may see me as a heretical Christian. But hey maybe that’s why I’m so in love with the faith. Thanks for the video.
As an atheist witch I love learning about any kind of mysticism. I found this really interesting!
Her poetry is a great gift to both the world and the Dutch language. Thank you so much for this video. Moogt ge baden in minne!
Wonderful… thank you so much, Justin! I’ve already approached my publisher about writing a novel about Hadewijch. So inspired!
As a former student of J.Z. Smith and current Episcopal priest, I completely agree with your assessment of the riches of Christian mysticism existing within the sewer of official Christian culture. Hadewijch is new to me. Thank you for the introduction.
I am a follower of the Nazarene. I am not a fan of the business that the church’s have become.
I don't like religion in general. I was kicked out of a church that my mother was a Sunday school teacher. I was put into the older classes when I was 11 with the priest and he told me "the devil put the dinosaur bones in the ground to confuse us". As a 11 year old that was very into dinosaurs, let's just say I lost my sh*t. I appreciate the information and don't think we should ever lose it but religion of any adhered rigid nature is like wearing horse blinders. It is far core complex that anything written or said by anyone.
*I imagine higher beings find our little hats and candles hilarious.
yep, reaction-formations and dogmatism are usually two sides of the same coin.
@@TheEsotericaChannel I'm not against religion, I just think it should be a more open ended funnel to enlightenment. But this conclusion I have come to through my experience here on this flying rock.
Justin🙏 your the best 🙏 and I love how you champion women ❣️ you got me on one for The Flowing Light of the Godhead🥰❣️🙏 I'll be starting a book club soon 🙏 forever grateful 🙏 oh and I rock my esoterica t-shirt often 🙏 stay blest my friend 🙏
the wimple flex slayed me
Wow! I love this channel more and more. I especially appreciate learning about this history of women. Can you do a video of Mary Magdalene? 🌹❤️
Interesting idea!
@@TheEsotericaChannel ❤️ Thank you for your response and consideration. 😊
Love before and after the abiss, always :)
Medieval Trinity story, suspended in time by you, beautifully❣️
Thk u 🙏
"Begin the Beguine" -- Cole Porter ?
"All Is Full Of Love" -- Bjork .
Hadewijch definitely had strong wimple game - thanks so much for such an interesting and well-made video, Justin.
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@TheEsotericaChannel I definitely did, though I will probably have to re-watch to make sure I understand everything!
Another superb book on Hadewijch is “Love is everything” by Andrew Harvey. A beautiful translated book of her sublime poems. Really lovely!💜🙏🏼
🔥❤️🔥 Much love to you all at Esoterica! Thanks for the learning! 🙏
Sounds like she is describing a series of migraine events which conclude with a feeling of relief bordering on heavenly?
I don't think she ever reported such a condition - unlike Simone Weil or Hildegard.
Woohoo! Sorry I’m excited 😆
Okay THIS is ontotheology. 😁
This is fascinating though. Reminds me of empedocles
Yeah, and Hadewich doesn't give a f***** about Heidegger and his bag ;)
Though I understand the centuries of damage done by the church , I feel that to dismiss the writings of the early church fathers would be to throw out the baby with the bath water. Most of the great occult writings came from people who once held positions in the church.
I believe people don't really see how pagan the Catholic church really is , and the esoteric relationship between the church and the occult sciences that still exists till this day. The literal translation of the bible and uninitiated study of these occult sciences that go unseen by most will not make one aware of the deeper mysteries of biblical text and it's rituals.
Regardless of any connection to the occult, it's just a mistake to ignore the tremendous influence of Christianity, for good and ill. Focusing on just the ill is simply bad history.
@@TheEsotericaChannel exactly , occultist or not , it has much value . 👍
I have recently studied the Gothic Bible and the unique paganistic Christianity of the Goths. The Gothic language is heavily based on Koine Greek and shares several similarities. There is even Gothic Cabbala, as the numerical values of Gothic and Greek are the same and the esoteric connections between words of equal numerical value is intriguing, to say the least.
I've watched most of your videos. I've always loved that you are NOT biased
Oh I'm biased, I just try to keep it in check.
I believe in the light and infinite love of Christ. I do not believe in the church!! That's not all I believe...
I completely believe that love is the answer
I think they have a song about that!
It sounds like a mix of Saint John of the Cross and John lennon
Can't stand the unreasonable hatred for Christianity. As a survivor of Jehovah's witnesses people would say "ugh I hate Christianity" And I have to ask "which one?" And they just say all of it like what
Exactly. I'm sorry that they went through bad times with Christianity, but they misunderstand a lot. They pick the worst examples and use that as the rule instead of the exception. Turns out, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, Creflo Dollar etc. are not generally loved across board by Christians. They are viewed, justly so, as charlatans and con artists by a good number of Christians. Using them to argue against Christianity is ridiculous.
She speaks a lot about metaphysically embracing the other
As always 👌
The description at 30:43 of becoming the throne of God reminded me of your previous lectures on Merkabah mysticism, in which the mystic seeks to witness, or even sit on the throne of God. Only she puts a twist on that.
It’s absolutely insanely crazy how you answer my question without any previous messages I love it and I am love and light thank you once again
Evelyn Underhill should be read by any one interested in mysticism. the best that i have found . You are only as good as your search.
Yep she's an important resource
@@TheEsotericaChannel Many thanks to u kindred spirit.
“Begin the Beguines”-long before Cole Porter.
There is an Bagijnenhof in my street in The Hague (Netherlands) They are fascinating places. You only see a big gate in a big wall. You can pass by them for years without noticing it. But once the gate opens, you see this small garden paradise in the middle of city life. They are like a time capsule . Beautifully preserved.
Yep, the one in A'dam is one of my favorite places to sit and just think. It's just lovely and peaceful.
I can honestly say you're right. We all claim we believe and love him
Thank you for this. I often get tired of reading sources -- and since hitting my 50s, my patience drains much more quickly -- where any women mentioned are basically NPCs. This is what caused me to put down the Tomer Devorah that you recommended. I bought it, but after reading sixteen variations of "Dovod and Baruch were having an argument about their four sons," I just tuned out. I know there are things to be gained from it but I've spent 55 years squeezing the lemon of All-Male Wisdom, and it's time to pick up another one.
It's lovely to read things by women with that perspective built-in. I've found that while certain things are invariable, there is a recognizable difference in mysticism and theology as analyzed by women.
I wish that women had participated in the creation of the Talmud as well, but then I look at my copy of the Torah Women's Commentary and think to myself, "You idiot. Don't complain. You are living contemporary with the next millennium's Ancient Women Elders. People in a 1,000 years will give their eyeteeth to be alive at the same time as the women who wrote that!" Women's Torah commentary, siddurim with women's contributions, and music by women ... all being created as I sit here!
Wonderful comment !
Thanks!
"If Love be the disease, give me not the cure."
I enjoy all of your videos, but this one was extra special. Thank you.
Your feeling for this text really come through in your talk. The poetics and the mysticism make this topic fascinating. This is the most interesting lecture I have head yet on this channel.
I also love your (her) description of living the Trinity. Deeply moving.
I agree, I would consider myself an agnostic-atheist, but I would never turn my back on this never ending well of history, those who this will never fortify and expand their knowledge.
I have been watching several of your videos and just wanted to comment on 2:00 (roughly).
I appreciate the information you give. I am a Catholic turned agnostic and I have to admit that your video on the Thunder God episode (my introduction to your channel) explained one of the major reasons I turned from organized religion in the first place. (The two faced nature of God, largely between the old and new testament.)
The church has done some horrific things. Rather, corrupt people with power in the church. But even today, people use the church as a front for their various bigotries. Yet no one seems to blame these events on the church. You manage to point out the atrocities without blaming the church itself, and I oddly find that refreshing.
I hope to be able to contribute, in some way to the channel, once my financial situation improves. Until then, I will continue to watch the videos you have made and like them at the very least.
Ahhhh! My bestie wrote his doctoral thesis on Hadewich! He's gonna love this!
Amo amas amat amamus amatis amant 😀
now in the subjunctive :)
@@TheEsotericaChannel 😊
@@TheEsotericaChannel amem amemus amarem amaremus amaverim amaverimus amavissem 😋😎
;)
Thank you so much for this video, although I just started watching it. I'm a Dutch student in my undergraduate considering going into medieval studies. I'm currently writing a paper on the role of female embodiment in Hadewijch's visions versus the decidedly male role she takes on in her love songs. I will probably go into contemporary literature but the middle ages and mysticism are close to my heart and Hadewijch is the GOAT.
I take the approach of a literary scientist, not a religious scholar. The input from that perspective is very valuable and it's just nice to see you talking about one of my favourite writers. I have recordings of the songs, in the Middle Dutch with reconstructed melody, sung by professionals, that I listen to. I've read all of her visions in the original Middle Dutch, too. It's very beautiful and does make me wonder about all the amazing Latin (and Greek, Hebrew, etc.) medieval and ancient texts I'm missing out on, but I rejoice in the fact that being able to read Middle Dutch is probably more rare than any of those! ;)
I've got the video saved for later; very curious what perspective you have to offer us on Hadewijch and I will edit with any comments or questions I have!
Wonderful! Looking forward to your comments. I've heard that Middle-dutch isn't too difficult for modern Dutch readers - is that your experience?
@@TheEsotericaChannel It is relatively easy compared to learning say Latin, ofcourse, but there is a definite learning curve. I'd say it's a lot like reading Middle English, or probably a little harder honestly. (I've read a bunch of Chaucer and some random poems which I'm going off) The lexical changes might be smaller for Dutch but unmarked clitics, cases instead of prepositions, latinisms and so on throw you off. It took me practice but I can read it pretty comfortably since getting into it three years ago.
Unrelated side note, but I have found that Middle English is very accesible to me as someone who speaks Dutch and English fluently, even before I got into Middle Dutch and even though English is a second language. There is a lot of words with Germanic roots that were replaced by words of Latin origin, so that they are completely foreign to English speakers but are instantly recognizable cognates of Dutch or German.
Hadewijch is considered the most difficult Middle Dutch material we have. 95% of what I've read on her is extracurricular. We get translations of everything with a few exceptions of fragments, for Hadewijch everything was translated. So it is considered too difficult or labour intensive to ask of undergraduates.
Some of the original is still very obscure to me, and the Dutch translations don't do it complete justice so I don't imagine the English ones could. Translation is interpretation and Hadewijch is not easy to interpret. She was a very gifted stylist though, as you said, and I'm glad that comes through in translation! The original is absolutely stunning and completely otherworldly. Reading the Visions for the first time is one of my favourite literary experiences ever.
@@GijsInc Thanks for this very thoughtful and thorough answer!
@@TheEsotericaChannel oh hey and my close friend is doing his Masters in Western Esotericism in Amsterdam, shout-out!
@@GijsInc Hope they enjoy it - I did!
What I find most amusing about the beginning topic of this video is that people assumed all of Medieval Europe was the same, not realizing that Medieval Europe was as complex and diverse as Modern Europe today. The church is by all means not always the central of everyones' lives and their doctrines wasn't always reality. Case in point, the church condemns women of being sinful due to the sin of Eve (though Adam ate that same fruit too and he didn't became targeted as sinful) thus creating biblical laws suppressing women at a societal level. What we find in artifacts and writings is that women still held property rights and even had the right to divorce just on the bases her husband can't get it up. Also, Medieval women were expected to take over her fathers' or husbands' trading and work, especially if either of them died. Women were limited if they were a noble woman and/or royalty (this is true in all time periods and not limited to just medieval times), but if a woman were from the merchant and artisan classes she was more mobile and allowed to take up trade and have her own business (many were beer, ale and other fermented drink makers). After the black plague, we can see a rise of women involved in trading and owning businesses since there was a demand for labor due to the shortage of people. Again, by all means, the church and its doctrines wasn't always the reality of daily lives of most medieval individuals, especially those of merchant and lower classes (even peasants govern their own communities, since lords and land owners tend to let the peasants deal with the superficial things like court cases and distributes over governing land). We can only speculate based on the documents and artifacts of the time period and unfortunately the majority of those said documents and artifacts were from the church, since the clergy men were very meticulous about their archives of books and documents. Much of the average medieval person were either minimally found or not at all and we just based it on the documents found in church. 🤷I think that adds more hatred towards the church rather than being grateful that at least one group of medieval folk wanted to archive and save their history, knowing the power of knowledge, regardless what type it is or was. As always thank you for such an informative video.
I really started to understand advanced Esoteric world after watching Sat Yoga institute on UA-cam.
Could you pls give your valuable insights
On in next episode
💚💚
Yep! Wholeheartedly agree..shame there is (understandable) alienation from this truth, beauty, purpose, soul-salve.
Wonderful presentation. Very balanced between problems and potentials of mysticism at the time of 13the century. Good recommendations for further reading. Excellent summary and intriguing prospects for today, some 700 years late. Thank you.
6 you so much for an introduction to some amazing and powerful works, but also the fascinating history of this Medieval women's movement!
I followed your buddy! I can't wait to start watching his videos. TY for spreading the knowledge. 💕
Dr Justin... Let's make a craft beer, and name it 'Hadewijch - The Abyss.' Waddya think? Waddya think? (...Signs graffiti on the wall of high literacy). : )
Would be cool to have a line of beers named after mystics!
@@TheEsotericaChannel Some guy with more money than us, is gonna do this. LOL Not to worry - let them have the hassle; we shall drink the beer and listen to your lectures. And that's as good as it gets right there.
Thank you for yet another fascinating video! I have always appreciated your respect for women and their sizable contributions to esoteric and occult subjects as they are often overlooked or dismissed. Hadewijch's daring view on a divine abyss of love is haunting and you've inspired me to learn more about this innovative, visionary woman. 🖤
Of course, I really enjoy making episodes like this. Of course, I'm also happy to amplify marginalized voices in esoterica as I can. I means esoterica itself is marginalized and if we're going to do the history, we should do it fully, especially focusing on the voices least heard historically but deeply deserving of a platform. Hadewijch fits that bill exactly. Thanks for the kind comment!
I found a podcast/video of McGinn today and it was amazing!
*The Crisis of Mysticism: Quietism in 17th Century Spain, Italy, and France*
I think the problem with Christian mysticism is that it was re-invented many times with some struggle. Syrian monks, Beguines, Böhme, they all are different starting points. There's no some common term, common stream. For Jusaism that would be Kabbalah, for Islam - Sufism. Yes, I know both are highly diverse within themselves, but still the common umbrella category is beneficial for recognition and a comfortable starting point. Let alone that everything else is perceived by a western viewer as generally a mysticism from the start (instead of seeing a full spectre of religious approaches as well). While all these Christian mysticism look like "Well, some weird monks doing the usual weird Christianity even in a weirder way than usual".
Augustine wrote City of God largely to address that dichotomy in the Church and Broderick human experience: each individual has a war between the City of Man (gender neutral in Latin) and the City of God going on within, and the Medievals called this dichotomy the Church of Cain and the Church of Abel. Augustine and his Medieval followers saw this line within echo individual, within the Churxh, and across the whole human race.
Augustin said of the Church "How many sheep there are without, how many wolves within!"
Yes, you are doing most everything right!! I can't imagine why anyone who seriously listens to your content would think that you are either anti-Christian or that you inappropriately defend Christianity. You obviously see the good and great as well as the bad and horrific of every form of spirituality that you discuss. And that, next to your comprehensive grasp of esotericism and your uncanny ability to explain it so clearly to us, is what makes your presentations so compelling. Profound Gratitude!! Prester Bob
I’ll take one Christianity, hold the Christians.
She sounds a lot like a Sufi. Her writing and philosophy seems very similar to Rumi and other Sufi mystics.
How weird. Never heard of such innovative approach on Christian mysticism since the cathars And it's dualistic abraxas like god
Wherever I go in my searching for God,I always find her, Hadewich, waving a hand towards me. That's so funny!
"mad wimple flex" 😂 u rule. thank u for this video, it's helping me figure out my own deal as a non-christian who wants to dedicate her life to community and spirituality.
Huh. I'd never heard of her or the Beguines before, not that surprising since I hadn't delved much into Christian mysticism and in recent years left behind my studies of religion in general, partly b/c I was doing my postgrad degrees in ancient music history and partly b/c of an ever-creeping sense of jadedness with life, including bouts with heartbreak and depression. But hearing her vision as you describe it I feel a lot of resonance with my own personal experiences with love, or what I think/thought was love--as Joni Mitchell sang, I've looked at love from both sides now, from good and bad, and still somehow it's love's illusions I recall, I really don't know love, at all.
The quest for love really can seem like hell, or worse than hell, and at points does indeed flirt with 'madness' (thinking of that girl I was almost literally mad over who used to appear in my dreams with alarming frequency and it seemed like we had some bizarre psychic dream-time link, including prophetic conversations that she would later confirm in real life, though of course she had no idea that this was happening to me. Really bizarre). Hedejwich's insights into the modes of love and her innovation of unfaith might just make me rethink my experiences in what might hopefully be a more positive light. Although I don't know...
Anyways, thank you for this fascinating and illuminating video!
You rule!! I wonder if you’ve ever read Stephen Braude’s book Immortal Remains or Telka by Patience Worth?
Nope, neither
@@TheEsotericaChannel obviously you don’t know me from a hole in the ground but I urge you to read Immortal Remains. Braude is Prof. Emeritus at the University of Maryland. The perspective it offers might fortify aspects of your studies that will be quite unexpected, as it has for me. I love your work and what you do, and have been tempted to recommend some contemporary authors who cover psi, but today a little voice told me that you might benefit from reading said book. Cheers and thanks for all of your tremendous Great Work!!!
Sir, I view you as a true teacher. There are ideas and beliefs that I disagree with, but the message is true gold. Unfortunately today the places that were once cherished institutes of learning and enlightenment, are now nothing more than echo chambers for thought lemmings.
Or perhaps income sources for the Master of Puppets.
When you piss off both sides you know you are telling the truth. I often wonder how much negative criticism you get for your work. I'm sure some of it is well meaning even If ignorant. But I know there are people out their who must absolutely despise your work without even considering it.
I had to watch 3 times to really absorb this haha (I was a bit distracted but still) wow! You are one of the best channels ever