As far as I understand, the repetitions are in Feldman's manuscript, but for some reason I ignore they don't appear in this edition. There exists a newer UE edition where this has been fixed.
Yes, Takahashi's relatively flowing tempo works wonders. Makes some slower readings sound ponderous. The question with Feldman always is: At what speed?
Thank you SO much for uploading this!! Btw., one of my favorite passages: 37:06 of course, there are many more ... :p EDIT 2021-01-09: plus the short reprise @ 56:15
Yes, absolutely. I see what you mean. That's when the line gets longer, more sensuous and, after a long time on the upper registers, we descend into the sonority of the bass clef.
It took a lot of guts for Morton to compose music like this that lasts an hour. His work is best appreciated if you are laying down and very comfortable. If you doze off that's OK because you didn't miss much.
Feldman often deliberately notated passages in ways that would make them harder to play. One can speculate as to the reasons why but I've always chosen to believe it's because he wanted to invite indeterminacy. He wanted passages even when literally the same to be played ever so slightly differently outside of the performer's control or choice, to create just that extra bit of microvariance. And indeed, you do see that in the opening here. The pianist makes a few mistakes with the rhythm as notated and the overall tempo wobbles. I believe this is exactly what Feldman wanted and it adds to the hypnotic feeling.
@@prepcoin_nl4362 Stravinsky did much the same thing in "Agon". Some rhythms are notated an eighth note displaced from their natural accents, lending the music an intended nervous quality. A lot of that is likely due to it being genuinely terrifying for the performers.
Few parts remind me Messiaen but with much less development. And I understand why Phillip Glass prefered this music instead of European Avant Garde of 50's and 60's. It has his beloved repetition!.
This is just a guess, but apparently Feldman is giving you a choice of four ways of playing this tremolo, reading each hand on either treble or bass, and she is switching back and forth between them.
I am always amused at how Morton went out of his way to make the rhythms more complicated than need be. I guess it was part of his desire to be modern like all the rest of us back in those days.
If he was just trying to be rhythmically complicated to be trendy, he probably wouldn't have written rhythms like the top system of 22:06, or the music around 34:40. Rather, I think he is using rhythm to create different subtle feelings of time throughout the piece. For example the repeats at 22:06 have a certain feeling of intensity to me because of the surrounding music and concentration required to perform it, even though it's just about the simplest thing you could possibly write down in music notation. If you look even for a moment beyond the surface level it's clear this music is doing more than just trying to be modern.
@@christophedevos3760 Yes! His own book "Give my Regards to Eighth Street" is a collection of essays mostly on aesthetics but sometimes they give a little bit of insight into his process. He seemed to not want to be so obvious on his exact procedures, for good reason.
@@mm-dn6oe thanks for the tip. Yes he was secretive about his methods. As are most contemporary composers I have the impression actually. But I understand indeed why.
This time signature is LaMeNtAbLe 4/4 with a slow triplet on the long notes would be so much playable I know he knew, still he choose the HARD way cause it's more tricky He hates us all, not good
Agree. I have Sabine Liebner's recording, which seems to be about twice as long. Having said that, there's no metronome mark at the beginning of the score, so I guess any speed you like is fair game, and Takahashi is a highly respected interpreter of Feldman. However, I find this version frenetic rather than relaxing, and the speed makes it harder to hear the subtle variations in timing between the repetitions... but I guess that's my problem.
It was one of the goals of 20th century modernism to write endless pages of mind-numbingly boring music and dress it up in the program notes with all sorts of intellectual pretensions. As such, Feldman was a brilliant success.
Behind this is the desire to avoid the intention and aggression behind both traditional classical and popular music. The passion of the mob. You have to feel negatively towards that, basically society in general, to see the point of this rambling music. Once you do it's like balm.
@Richie Beirach - one of my greatest friends is a composer, pianist and Royal Academy graduate and he’s introduced me to this sort of ‘experimental’ “music” and I’ve taken the time to discuss it with him in some detail over a number of years, which, of course, doesn’t make me any sort of authority or knowledgeable critic, but it does mean I have tried hard to see the “music” inside the cacophony. I applaud the attempt to explore new avenues of creativity, this is absolutely necessary to advance the art. However, those that are observing the experimental art must have the balls to call out nonsense when it appears. I simply contend that a jumbled cacophony of notes does not necessarily constitute music. I’ve been assaulted by a great deal of this type of sound and cannot, in all conscience, agree that the composition represents real music. Sound experiments, yes, music no.
@@portlyoldman I don't think it is really a "jumbled cacophony of notes." There's a great deal of structure in it. A lot of people object to this music because of its austerity. It's music that you really have to sit and completely tune into it. That makes it hard to listen to, but at a certain point you get into it (if you like this kind of music, which I do).
Nope, not what I said. My points were first that this music is truly challenging to listen to (for me too!). I don't think you have put forth a good case that this music is a jumbled cacophony. The fact that you don't like it or don't respond to it is justification enough for not listening to it. You don't need to malign it.
![Tōru Takemitsu - 12 Songs for Guitar [Audio + Score] (1974-1977)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/8f72wNZdLYY/mqdefault.jpg)
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I wonder why she repeats the patterns sometimes more than once although there is no such indication in the score. does anyone know?
As far as I understand, the repetitions are in Feldman's manuscript, but for some reason I ignore they don't appear in this edition. There exists a newer UE edition where this has been fixed.
@@unpetitabreuvoir okay,thank's. I also have a score sample where they don't appear.
Very beautiful interpretation. One could see why Takahashi was one of Feldman´s favourites.
Yes, Takahashi's relatively flowing tempo works wonders. Makes some slower readings sound ponderous. The question with Feldman always is: At what speed?
This is the sonic equivalent of watching icebergs melt..at night.
I'm eternally grateful to Mattin for introducing this wonderful music to me in 2001 at Eddie Prevost's workshop. I own ten versions now.
You need to get another one to add to the collection!
mattin as in the Spanish noise artist?
@@OtherSideOfTheVoid yes Mattin the Basque artist
@@TimGoldieAbjectBloc very nice it's cool he likes morton feldman too! all the best
Thank you SO much for uploading this!!
Btw., one of my favorite passages: 37:06
of course, there are many more ... :p
EDIT 2021-01-09: plus the short reprise @ 56:15
Yes, absolutely. I see what you mean. That's when the line gets longer, more sensuous and, after a long time on the upper registers, we descend into the sonority of the bass clef.
I do hope you love the ending to Why Patterns too?
@@Uikamamansnsnsnsj yes, I do indeed :)
31:44 too
Superbe performance ! Merci beaucoup (Christian-Yves, France)
So great
There are never any cheap tricks with Morton Feldman.
Expensive tricks, yes…
Massive
すげー、、アキさん、人間シーケンサー
might get a shitstorm here but this sounds like me being stoned behind keys
eh usually my "concerts" last about 2-3 hours
If someone would read poetry to you in a language you dont speak it would not be beautiful to you, maybe this is a similar situation
Hypnotic!
This is the sonic equivalent of watching icebergs melt..at night.
Nice
This is the real Interstellar.
3bodyproblem more suitable for it, i suppose
nice work
The amount of times a section is repeated is up to the pianist?
If I understood well, a manuscript version exists which indicates the number of repetitions
The score here indicates the number of repetitions.
5:48
It took a lot of guts for Morton to compose music like this that lasts an hour. His work is best appreciated if you are laying down and very comfortable. If you doze off that's OK because you didn't miss much.
my favorite composer
@@Cleekschrey Do you nap during his longer pieces?
@@stephenjablonsky1941 I can nap through anything
@@Cleekschrey That is a talent that should guarantee you a long life. May it be so!
My favorite sleep music, my wife doesn't get it
There is absolutely no need for the notation using quadruplets. It probably shouldn't bother me as much as it does but... Anyway, beautiful piece.
Feldman often deliberately notated passages in ways that would make them harder to play. One can speculate as to the reasons why but I've always chosen to believe it's because he wanted to invite indeterminacy. He wanted passages even when literally the same to be played ever so slightly differently outside of the performer's control or choice, to create just that extra bit of microvariance.
And indeed, you do see that in the opening here. The pianist makes a few mistakes with the rhythm as notated and the overall tempo wobbles. I believe this is exactly what Feldman wanted and it adds to the hypnotic feeling.
@@prepcoin_nl4362 Stravinsky did much the same thing in "Agon". Some rhythms are notated an eighth note displaced from their natural accents, lending the music an intended nervous quality. A lot of that is likely due to it being genuinely terrifying for the performers.
Few parts remind me Messiaen but with much less development. And I understand why Phillip Glass prefered this music instead of European Avant Garde of 50's and 60's. It has his beloved repetition!.
12:23
d a n k n e s s
honestly, youtube, when you mutilate long pieces like this to tell me to buy nails at home depot, i hate you AND home depot…
how is this mutilated?
Minute 14 why docent he play the brakes. On my opinion its to much pedal
It’s marked ‘1/2 pedal’ which i think the pianist is actually doing. I don’t think the intentions are for the pianist to actually play the breaks here
How can the pianist not fall asleep during the performance remains a mystery to me
Listen to Dennis Johnson's 'November' and then ask this question 😂
On ne peut pas s'endormir à écouter la pulsation du monde
wtf ca. 45"
yes, everytime I listen to 44:56, I'm dumbfounded, too :)
This is just a guess, but apparently Feldman is giving you a choice of four ways of playing this tremolo, reading each hand on either treble or bass, and she is switching back and forth between them.
I am always amused at how Morton went out of his way to make the rhythms more complicated than need be. I guess it was part of his desire to be modern like all the rest of us back in those days.
If he was just trying to be rhythmically complicated to be trendy, he probably wouldn't have written rhythms like the top system of 22:06, or the music around 34:40. Rather, I think he is using rhythm to create different subtle feelings of time throughout the piece. For example the repeats at 22:06 have a certain feeling of intensity to me because of the surrounding music and concentration required to perform it, even though it's just about the simplest thing you could possibly write down in music notation. If you look even for a moment beyond the surface level it's clear this music is doing more than just trying to be modern.
@@mm-dn6oe Is there anything written how he composed this works? I have read the book on his early graphic scores, but I have not gotten much wiser.
@@christophedevos3760 Yes! His own book "Give my Regards to Eighth Street" is a collection of essays mostly on aesthetics but sometimes they give a little bit of insight into his process. He seemed to not want to be so obvious on his exact procedures, for good reason.
@@mm-dn6oe thanks for the tip. Yes he was secretive about his methods. As are most contemporary composers I have the impression actually. But I understand indeed why.
@@mm-dn6oe Just ordered it. Can't wait.
This time signature is LaMeNtAbLe
4/4 with a slow triplet on the long notes would be so much playable
I know he knew, still he choose the HARD way cause it's more tricky
He hates us all, not good
Feldman rarely gave concession to the performer
SO FAST.
Agree. I have Sabine Liebner's recording, which seems to be about twice as long. Having said that, there's no metronome mark at the beginning of the score, so I guess any speed you like is fair game, and Takahashi is a highly respected interpreter of Feldman. However, I find this version frenetic rather than relaxing, and the speed makes it harder to hear the subtle variations in timing between the repetitions... but I guess that's my problem.
It was one of the goals of 20th century modernism to write endless pages of mind-numbingly boring music and dress it up in the program notes with all sorts of intellectual pretensions. As such, Feldman was a brilliant success.
You have no arguments
Behind this is the desire to avoid the intention and aggression behind both traditional classical and popular music. The passion of the mob. You have to feel negatively towards that, basically society in general, to see the point of this rambling music. Once you do it's like balm.
Man do you know nothing.
people love to talk confidently about things they know nothing about
Some Feldman I like very much (Rothko Chapel, Structures, for example). This piece (and so many others): mind-numbingly boring.
...Emperor's new clothes......
@Richie Beirach - one of my greatest friends is a composer, pianist and Royal Academy graduate and he’s introduced me to this sort of ‘experimental’ “music” and I’ve taken the time to discuss it with him in some detail over a number of years, which, of course, doesn’t make me any sort of authority or knowledgeable critic, but it does mean I have tried hard to see the “music” inside the cacophony. I applaud the attempt to explore new avenues of creativity, this is absolutely necessary to advance the art. However, those that are observing the experimental art must have the balls to call out nonsense when it appears. I simply contend that a jumbled cacophony of notes does not necessarily constitute music. I’ve been assaulted by a great deal of this type of sound and cannot, in all conscience, agree that the composition represents real music. Sound experiments, yes, music no.
@@portlyoldman I don't think it is really a "jumbled cacophony of notes." There's a great deal of structure in it. A lot of people object to this music because of its austerity. It's music that you really have to sit and completely tune into it. That makes it hard to listen to, but at a certain point you get into it (if you like this kind of music, which I do).
@@douglynch8954 - ok, but this does sound very much like the “you’re not clever enough to understand “ defense.
Nope, not what I said. My points were first that this music is truly challenging to listen to (for me too!). I don't think you have put forth a good case that this music is a jumbled cacophony. The fact that you don't like it or don't respond to it is justification enough for not listening to it. You don't need to malign it.
@@portlyoldman cringe