Are Cessationists False Teachers?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 26 тра 2024
- Are Cessationists False Teachers?
To get more bold, practical truth from Pastor Mark Driscoll, visit realfaith.com or text “RealFaith” to 99383.
Click HERE to subscribe to our channel: ua-cam.com/users/MarkDriscollM...
To listen to Pastor Mark's podcast, follow here:
Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/4IdNLJC...
Apple: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...
Follow on social media:
Facebook: / pastormark
Instagram: / markdriscoll
TikTok: / pastormarkdriscoll
Twitter: / pastormark
Click here for more resources: linktr.ee/markdriscoll - Розваги
I’m literally listing to this sermon in the woods camping and journaling. I just stopped and am asking for prayer! For wisdom, open and closed doors, a church community! Thank you! God Bless all of you and thank you Mark! GOD has been speaking to me through you like crazy!! 🙌🏼 Healing a lot of childhood trauma right now and big life transition. 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Prayer said for you. Amen.
@@littleme3597 Amen!! Thank you so much! I had no idea I was going to come back and see this. 😭 I was in the word most of the day and so many amazing things happened! Praise GOD and I can’t thank everyone enough! 🙏🏼🙌🏼♥️
What a time you must've been having!
Same here! His sermons hit like they were meant for me. Praying for you as well!!
@@Cloak_23 Thank you so much! Any prayer requests let me know! GOD Bless! 🙏🏼
Please pray for those who lost loved ones, homes & businesses in the Rogers, Arkansas tornado this weekend. Thank you.
I’m glad you’ve changed your position on this issue Pastor Mark. I attended one of your campuses in WA and it was this specific issue that led to me seeking another church.
Have always respected your ministry.
This was timely and needed as the Spirit of anti christ and division is definitely at work within the body of Christ!! Thank you and God bless you Brother Mark!!!
We left our church of 2.5 years because of the false teaching of so called “cessationism.” It infects much more than you would think. Fellowship, prayer requests, worship, confession of sin/prayer for healing. It boils down to unbelief. It’s “hedging your bets,” so as to not look like the “charismatics.” I liken a “cessationist church to the black knight from the Monty python movie: chopping off arms and legs, and thinks that it is still battle hardened.
So if you pray for healing and don't get it that is because of unbelief?
@christoprighteous8199 it’s because it’s not the will of the Spirit. Pretty simple. As Corinthians says: the gifts are distributed as the Spirit wills, including gifts of healings.
@@christoprighteous8199There could be multiple reasons (in my life it was things I said or fear, my wife was unforgiveness) but I would ask you the question, if you pray for salvation and don't receive it is because of the lack of faith? There are two ways to receive healing, one is by the gifts of the Spirit listed in Corinthians, the other is by faith as clearly described in multiple passages when Jesus said, "As your faith is, be it unto you." Also in Acts 14 Paul perceived the man had Faith to be healed and told the man to act on that faith and he was healed. So it does take Faith to be healed unless the gift of healing by Holy Spirit is in operation.
@@subjecttochrist It is always God and Jesus's will to heal. Jesus never said no to anyone that came to him for healing and he is the express image of the Father.. The gift of healing listed in Corinthians "are as the Spirit wills" because they are miraculous gifts without the need for the person themselves to have faith. The woman that touched the hem of Jesus garment had faith and was healed without Jesus being consciously aware of who she was or what she wanted.
@osowers6755 I understand what you’re trying to say and the conclusions that you’re trying to draw, but I take issue with your statement about the Spiritual gifts not requiring faith. You must believe (have faith) to be saved. Faith (I don’t need to parse out “saving faith” from the spiritual gift of faith (which is the same Greek word)) is a gift from God: ALWAYS. So faith is a prerequisite to receive gifts of the Spirit. Those people Jesus (who had the Holy Spirit rest upon Him after baptism) were healed, believed Jesus (who is God), in His word. They were the active recipient of a gift of the Spirit. Jesus’s healing power came from the Holy Spirit. He is the God-man, who walked in the Spirit: the perfect example for His followers to walk in righteousness.
Hey prayer team,
Please pray for us who need courage, boldness, wisdom and insight to share the good news of Christ to our immediate family
On the recovery road got hit by a Mack truck in the driver's door God has been so good to me and he's healing me GOD IS SO GOOD ❤️🙌🇮🇱
Prayer request for my daughter Ashley's deliverance from the demonic forces that rule her life so she can /hopefully will choose Jesus. And my marriage, it's under severe attack.
YHVH is not a genie. HE is sovereign! Whatever the LORD does HE pleases, in heaven and in earth, in the seas and in all the deep places.. Psalm 135:6
Now read that in the contacts of the gospels and see the authority that the believer is sovereignly, given along with a lot of responsibility to use it properly. Start with John 14, don’t miss the part where your life is supposed to have more miracle Jesus. I’m seeing miracles, because I’m praying the will of God over peoples lives, I’m not anyone special, it’s not me, it’s God being allowed to work through me. Are you allowing God to truly work through you by truly doing as scripture says. I’m not saying this is you, but I know so many people that the devil ensnares with the logical words that hold them in low understanding due to all the outside of scripture study has brought them, taking them away from what scripture actually says. Read also 2 Timothy 3 and we must ask God is their any theology we’ve allowed into our homes that foolishly deny the normal supernatural way God does things. I used to limit God thinking it was God who set the limits, no, that was a lie I believed from the Devil while I lacked faith that God wanted me truly do even more by that same spirit that rose Jesus from the dead dwelled inside and was not limited by God’s sovereign nature, but my refusal to humble and believe what scripture actually promises. Now, the most important caveat is you need to first ask to hear the voice of the Lord clearly, because, when we pray, we pray the will of God, we don’t pray our will. Jesus said my sheep hear my voice, and they do not listen to another. If you know scripture you can test the voice as it doesn’t contradict scripture, but he will contradict many things a person is taught about scripture and the fruit is beautiful! Don’t miss out. Start humbly by doing what scripture says an asking the Lord to search your heart and remove anything that is standing in the way. And as you read, scripture, ask the Holy Spirit to be the interpretation you need to here and then ask your Father to help you to do what it actually says to do.
@@SRose-vp6ew I'm praying for the Holy Spirit to to give you the gift of spelling, punctuation, grammar, and paragraph breaks.
@@mitchellcumsteen9220that’s rude
Ur momma@@mitchellcumsteen9220
I could use prayers to restore my marriage. Pastor Mark, i was a husband like one in your older sermon on terrible husbands. I have repented many many times in the past year, and will continue to. God has changed my mind, heart, and actions. I thank him every day that my wife has nit asked for a divorce. If he doesnt send her home, i completely get it. But I have not felt whole since she left (I was unknowingly neglectful for almost our entire 25 years married). I trust the Lord and ask for his strengh all day ecwry day. Any and all prayers are GREATLY appreciated. Thanks in advance and God bless everyone who reads this🙏🏼
All Glory To GOD ALMIGHTY! Praised Be YOU KING JESUS... HALLELUJAH!!!
I was once under a word of faith church and I was spiritually abused and didn't know for a while. I kept thinking I'm weak in my faith and something was always wrong with me. So grateful God got me away from that.
Faith always has humility and obedience in it. I'm thankful for the word of faith teaching as multiple people in my family were healed from seizures, deafness, strangulated hernia, hip conditions, etc.. My dad was healed of cross eyes in his late 20s from understanding Faith from the word of faith movement. Jesus healed him. I have experienced many dynamic and true healings as well. I am very thankful for the "word of faith" teaching but some people take it to a prideful level. Faith doesn't operate by pride, it operates by love. There are many other things that can short-circuit your faith, ask the Lord, He will answer you. I also have some very dear friends that don't get healed and don't experience moves of God but get upset when we as a family talk about faith or believing God for His promises. They act like we think we are better than them but we don't. Yet these same people (dear friends) will spend hours and hours going bowling, found hiking, having all sorts of fun, going camping, etc. but don't take time to open their Bibles to read what God really says. Faith comes by hearing the word of God.
I asking for prayer, coming thru cancer. My finances have been affected severely as a result. I still, per the regiment, have to go through intense therapy. The idea of early medical retirement is on the table because I currently am not able to work in the environment of my trade. I’ve been looking for YHVH to intercede in this am truly believing this is a Lazarus moment
This is such a tough question when posed thoughtfully. Teachers can be solid but teach something that isn't true. I don't believe this alone makes them false. They could just be wrong. A false teacher is someone who deals in falsehood with the intention to promote themself at the expense of God. Imo.
I feel like the argument is rarely, if ever, presented fairly. Sometimes people drift into straw-man arguments where they present cessationism in a way that goes beyond what it actually means.
can you please pray for my brother who is battling stage 4 pancreatic cancer???
and his salvation too??
Prayed 🙏 🤲
Praying for salvation and God's perfect will for your brother. May the LORD comfort you and your brother .
Prayed for salvation and healing in Jesus' mighty name! 🙏
Praying for your family 🙏🏻
Cessationists wouldn't argue against the example he gave at the end and Mark knows this. They believe the gift of healings giving to individuals has ceased, not that God has ceased healing people through prayer or His sovereign choice. At least present their position correctly.
Exactly! This is what people like him always do, they always misrepresent our position, I'll be making a video on this
You're speaking out of both sides of your mouth. The gift of healing hasn't ceased, so the cessationist view is still absolutely false, no matter how they try to present their argument.
@@theeternalsbeliever1779 I said Mark misrepresented the cessationist position by the example he gave. How am I “speaking out of both sides of my mouth”?
The book of Samuel shows that there are times when God is quiet. God sometimes will not answer prayers or do anything miraculous for a reason, but that doesn't mean He can't. So this video is very true.
Why would I need to believe in anything not written in the Bible? It says we can deliver people and many things but why would I do it by my hand if I can use God's word. In building simply on the Word I found my house built on the rock.
I think I know what you mean but there are a lot of things that we believe that are true yet they are not written in the Bible. The Bible is a ruler by which we judge our experiences with God. That is what the word cannon of scripture actually means, "ruler" or measuring stick. You believe in electricity, it's not written in the Bible, you believe in welding, it's not written in the Bible, you believe in cars and computers, yet nothing is said about them in the Bible, , etc.. I think I know what you mean but I don't like it when super religious people act like we can receive nothing from God unless it's written in the Bible. God has spoken for me to do many things that have always "lined up with his word" but they're not specifically written in the word of God.
The word bible is not in the Bible and neither is the trinity, the English language changes but he doesn’t. His word is eternal. It’s always important to understand the context of everything you read
Man's unbelief limits God. Just as faith allows God to move. Many who are afflicted do not have the faith to be healed. They remain sick because of their unbelief. For healing someone who God anoints must be sent to minister. They need faith to hear from God and obey. But no mighty deeds will occur unless the sick have sufficient faith to receive. Because of secular education in the west. All the western world is like Nazareth was to Jesus. No faith in the name of Jesus. People believe in the false God of medicine. It's time for the western church to repent.
Please pray for my friend Victor Schmidt who has just learned he has Stage 2 prostate cancer to be healed by KING JESUS!!!
I'm committing to more prayer daily and being closer to God....if anyone has a prayer request, I'd be happy to pray for you. Just let me know ❤
The Holy Spirit is.
Misreprentation of Cessationism...Holy Spirit does act. Even miracles do happen...
I'm in the second group. I readily acknowledge that God can do whatever He wants to, that no one can stop him from doing what He wants, and no one can make Him do what they want, but in over 20 years of faith, I have NEVER seen a miracle take place nor heard of any verifiable reports. It's always hearsay and unsubstantiated rumors. If I ever saw a miracle take place personally or even heard a report of a miracle happening which could be independently verified, that would change my perspective.
You haven't read enough.
@@user-pl7si5pn5k I've read a great deal. Reading is not the issue here.
Every day you wake up, you have a miracle.
@@traceyreid8233 That's not what he's talking about, and you know it.
@@selohcinIt is what he's talking about, but all of you want blockbuster movie type miracles and so you can't see any, at all.
Thank you Lord Jesus for healing Sammy.
I lost my four-year-old daughter in a car accident. Several communities of faith came together and prayed to God to save her. He chose not to. We buried her in a pink casket. She'd be turning 9 years old this year.
I'd call myself a soft-cessationist before watching this, but given Driscoll's definition, I suppose I'm still a continuist. Just a limping one, I guess.
This is an answer to "how" I should pray. I have been grappling with, "thy will be done, on earth...." Why should I pray if the world is headed towards the ultimate judgment (e.g.govt corruption; invasion; war; for how we have allowed evil to grow; children are being harmed; sin is ridiculous). I see all of this as the culmination and lead-in to the Tribulation or prophetic fulfillment. Nothing is going to stop it. It has to happen to stop the evil. So, I will continue to pray that these children being sacrificed, SA'd, and trafficked will get deliverance FROM evil. Souls continue to be enlightened.
Sundays coming sister.. love ya
Abused sufferers by many charismatic IS sadly true!
BUT, it does NOT negate His gifts moving in us.
Yes they are. False as a $6 bill.
Just a question to my brothers and sisters who believe the spiritual gifts have not ceased;
Have you or anyone you know seen a person who is disabled, paraplegic etc completely healed like we see in the gospels and book of acts?
Have you or anyone you know seen persons who were blind completely healed and can see?
Have you seen someone rise from the dead through someone's gift of healing?
Finally, have you seen or known of anyone who supernaturally began to speak fluently in another language like we see in book of acts?
This is not to belittle anyone nor to scoff.
This is why im cessationist.
Praying for reconciliation and guidance in my divorce.
So pastor Mark- I have two issues with your message- 1) Cessationists dont believe the Spirit has stopped working. They believe in the cessation of the sign gifts. But the Spirit is still healing, convicting of sin, etc.
2) Continuationism is NOT the same as a charismatic. A charismatic is a continuationist, but a continuationist is not necessarily a charismatic. Im a continuationist- I believe there is still miracles happening. But charismatics wrongly define the gift of tongues. The gift of prophecy. These are frontline gifts granted to evangelists and missionaries in frontline areas that have never heard the Word of God...and gifts are not necessarily permanent, nor are they under the control of the giftee....these are manifestations of the Spirit given by God, according to His will. The gift of tongues is the supernaturally given utterance of human languages for the purpose of "extolling the wonderful works of God." Not a prayer language.
Praise God
I believe that as it pertains to healing by the Holy Spirit, many people don't receive because they put their faith and trust in doctors too much, and don't take care of their own bodies. USA has a 63% population of overweight people and around thirty or so percent are actually obese. We are a nation obsessed with food. So here's what I think. Believe that GOD wants us healthy. Take care of our own bodies. Pray fervently before trusting a doctor, except in case of an accident or serious wound or broken bone or the like. We limit The Holy Spirit' ability to heal us. He lives in us , not just an outside force.
I had this same conversation the other day, completely agree!
If someone can read Craig Keener's 2 volume book set on miracles and come away a skeptic there is absolutely no hope for them. They ought not to call themselves Christians any longer and just be atheists because that is what they really are.
I do believe a measure of faith is required in our prayers. That our prayers should align with His will for Kingdom things and not our own will for worldly things. I believe all blessings flow from and to Him and we pause and Thank God for all He has done for us and others in remembrance and continues to do. I believe God is super natural. I believe most of our prayers should be for others. What I don’t know about (something that conflicts within me), is this movement tied to this charismatic believe that leads us down a road towards NAR. Something deep down in my spirit and love of truth believes this ‘movement’ is a bit of a Tower of Babel approach. Treading carefully with charismatic Pastors.
pastor mark with the certified bangers as usual
Praise God!
Pastor Mark, yes, people may be vulnerable if they have state 4 cancer and they are praying for healing, yet don’t get healed. However, in some cases that cancer was brought on because of unforgivness or possibly another sin that is unaddressed that opened up a door to a spiritual attack. Many times, in repentance and belief, such a person can be healed.
Or God may be calling them. Our lives are temporary.
Theres a lot of soft-atheism i see nowdays in people seeing the word of God as a historic, academic work. Not the living word of a present God.
Yes, God has put heavy on my heart.
2 Timothy 3
Godlessness and manipulative denial of God’s Power in the Last Days
3 But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. 2 For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, 4 treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having the appearance of godliness, but denying his power. Avoid such people. 6 For among them are those who creep into households and capture weak women, burdened with sins and led astray by various passions, 7 always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth. 8 Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men corrupted in mind and disqualified regarding the faith. 9 But they will not get very far, for their folly will be plain to all, as was that of those two men.
There are many times when the prophets actually just spoke things and they happened. In the New Testament we can see this in the example of Peter speaking the death of Ananias and Saphira. He didn't stop and pray. He just prophesied. We are to 'walk in the spirit ' -not stop, get down and pray every time we have a need. The spirit lives in us. And Jesus spent time alone with the father and fasted so that he could know what to do in each situation.
I’ll look more into it but this was the most uncharitable definition of cessationism I’ve heard from a respectable preacher. But then again, the charismatic movement has been taking a lot of hits lately due to all of its false teachers.
Will you explain this a bit more? Baby Christian here and I’ve been studying and listening to a lot of different pastors! Would appreciate it! GOD Bless!
@@TMH792 Cessationism versus continuationism seems to be an odd thing for Christians to fight over but it’s even more odd to me that Mark thinks cessationists don’t believe the Holy Spirit is still working. The distinction for me is whether the spirit works through the body of believers sporadically (ie the example Mark gave w the praying mother) or do some in the modern era have abundant access to the fruits with consistency (ie the apostles, or self proclaimed prophets and healers like Benny Hinn and Todd White).
@@found.ernest Yes! Thank you for explaining this. I completely understand what you’re saying. I think I agree with you?! lol I’m going study it more and usually I agree with Marks teachings. Love his preaching! Thanks again! 🙏🏼
Preach IT Pastor Mark; Truth!
In old testament power did come down but new testament the power doesnt come down He lives in us
I think the Holy Spirit works today still, but we chalk it up to science or natural processes or luck.
YAHWEH does nothing by luck or chase. He is still the Miracle worker of all times.
Yep, people are quick to forget or rationalize.
It's a big debate in the western church. Go to a third world country, they definitely Believe in the gifts and every Christian over there has like 3 gifts at least. 😆💯
we believe that God is sovereign! we believe that when in Acts disciples went out and spoke in tongues they were actual languages. it wasnt angelic babble and nonsense. we dont need to pray to God in tongues because Our God understands our native tongue. that being said we also believe that when in says First Corinthians 13:8-10: “Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears.” In the KJV, the tongues “will cease.” In other words, at some point after Paul wrote 1 Corinthians, the gift of tongues would no longer be in use. But in Gods Sovereignty he can give you an ability to speak a different language while you are sharing the Gospel. THats his choice. you cannot summon God to give you these gifts and this "angelic babble" that sounds Like BOUGHTAHONDASHOULDABOUGHTAYAMAHA is exactly that. Nonsense. Or you could be summoning demons for all we know, its not like there are 2 translators to keep you in check, like Paul instructs.
Whats nonsense is claiming the gift of tongues has ceased! There is nowhere in the Bible that says tongues have ceased and the scripture you brought up says “will” not “has” ceased and it was literally Paul comparing the preeminence of love to other examples of things that when compared to love are irrelevant. however to the contrary there are countless portions scripture that explain how important this gift of tongues is to all Christians.
Cpr's purpose is to keep blood pumping to supply oxygen to the brain while hoping to Kickstart the heartbeat. 2 hrs of cpr did that. But, that's not to take away from the miracle that God still brought the boy back in response to his mother's prayer. That whole miracle is a picture of God's sovereignty and the fact that despite our best efforts, it's always still in God's hands
CPR's purpose is to stimulate the heart and push oxygen into the blood stream. If the heart is not pumping it will not supply oxygen to anything.
Thanks great video
i have a prayer request for anyone that has an extra moment or feels called to pray for me.....ive been called back to God and was saved a year and a half ago and ive been growing my relationship with God alone and without a church because ive had a hard time finding one that feels like its not giving in to worldly agendas and ive been afraid of being lead the wrong direction before i have a better knowledge of the bible and while im still learning and more easily tricked by false teaching. ive felt called to be baptized and so my prayer request is that God may help lead me to a good church thats of His word and not manipulating the word and i pray for discernment that the lord will let me know when im in the right place with the right people and also that i can be baptized as soon as he'll have me because i just cant wait to be washed clean and be renewed and reborn as a fully committed christian! im just really excited and cant wait to run into his word with join others and so because of my eagerness im just a little weary of joinging the wrong church and missing any signs if theyre not delivering Gods word as hed have it delivered and interpreted. anyways, thanks brothers and sisters! God bless and thanks in advance!
Praying for you. Keep studying the scriptures and you will be able to have discernment.
The greatest sign and wonder presently known to man is the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in all of the born again. If you're saved the Holy Spirit indwells and seals you unto the day of redemption. The only reason that anyone can pray is by that same Holy Spirit. Don't always look for the outward working of the Spirit but rather, be aware of His inward working within you. That is where He performs most of His greatest miracles. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Cessationists do NOT believe that the Holy Spirit doesn't act anymore. They believe that He acts differently than He did.
He has misrepresented the position here.
Differently how?
@@turbotheamericanstaffy They believe that sign gifts have passed. So people having a gift of legitimate tongues or healing, and prophecy, for the sake of being a sign. Signs are for the Jews. N.T. gift of tongues, in that you can communicate to others in their native languages, or that you can heal anyone, or would be receiving new revelations from God that are 100% accuarte and should be added to Scripture.
God is the same yesterday today and forever. To say he is not is false teachings
@Repent2Christ you are correct. Cessathionists do not believe God changes, but God isn't always doing the same thing. For example, right now Armageddon is not happening.
If you're looking for miracles, forget it. If you're asking in faith, expect God to fulfill his plans. We should not expect signs. God works by grace.
Satan is planning to deceive many by having his false prophet do amazing miracles in the last days.
Many of the Charismatic churches I’ve been to, the pattern I have seen, is God heals or delivers on His discretion. Yes, people are hoping for an outcome that they think is what they desire. The reality is God reveals an area of the heart that a person needs to work on. Most miracles aren’t a healing of the body, but an outcome of healing to one’s soul.
That’s really the beauty of a true miracle.
Satans miracles are vain and impure and return void.
Amen
I NEED PRAYERS . IM DEALING WITH A WIFE WITH A JEZEBEL SPIRIT. I DON'T KNOW HOW TO DEAL WITH HER . I NEED YOUR HELP
Brother, you are better off leaving her. Jezebel spirit is likely to NEVER repent, and will always be a victim. Read John Paul Jackson's book on the subject. Do not give in to her temper tantrums to get her way, don't give in to the Ahab spirit.
Ah yes, I totally agree with blam9360, that darn Jezebel is too powerful for God, best you move on!
Tsk, tsk, tsk! This is the danger of this perverse movement, not keeping people accountable and blaming satan and is demons for all their bad choices.
If your wife is a saved person she has no such thing as a Jezebel spirit, if your wife is not saved she has far bigger issues than a Jezebel spirit. My suggestion for you would be to pray without seizing for the truth of God to set her free. Keep giving her truth not some 'you are possessed' nonsense. That is like throwing oil on the fire.
@@AnniEast you are completely ignorant about the jezebel spirit. God will never go against a person's own will. For a person to repent they have to see that they are wrong. A person with a jezebel spirit only sees themselves as the victim. They are never wrong in their own mind and therefore have no need to repent. And they can be completely convinced that they are saved, that God is on their side and every decision is always right.
As you know, saying your saved and actually being saved can be 2 different things. Jezebel is a covert demon that obviously hides in churches, which we can read about in Revelation. Like Satan, they can know Scripture, too, but they tear down their spouse and destroy the church they go to from the inside. Their spouses often die from health issues because of the extreme stress caused by living with a jezebel.
Did Queen jezebel repent in the Bible? No, she didn't and her children didn't do well spiritually either, and you can read about that in the Bible.
Also no one said she was POSSESSED. The demoniac was possessed. Queen jezebel, definitely OPPRESSED, but you probably don't understand the difference. If you've ever seen a person go from perfectly normal to being in a rage? Possession can look like that too. Do you have any experience with deliverance? I doubt it.
Unless you are knowledgeable on the subject, it's best not to give "advice". You'll do more harm than good, even if you have his intentions. Of which the path to hell is paved with.
That's quite the caricature of a cessationist's beliefs. Haha!
Amen definitely 🙏
Amen HalleluJAH
secondly could someone please define sign gifts as apposed to Holy Spirit move. The Apostles healed people at will, sign gift. their shadows healed people, they sent their cloth they wiped their sweat with and it healed people, sign gift. God still heals today, but do men have the gift to will it themselves. I am not saying they healed by their own power it was the Holy Spirit.
Hey there. Quick thought on word of faith. I keep hearing people who are confused as to what word of faith movement really means. I agree some sections of word of faith sounds demanding of the holy spirit but actually it's biblical based belief. Let me explain I believe the Bible says by his stripes I am healed. So I then pray and say lord I come into alignment with your word where it says I am healed thank you for my healing. I am not demanding the holy spirit heal me. I am believing he has already done the work on the cross.
If you are pentecostal then why don't you go to your local hospital and lay hands on the sick and dead there (heal them). The Holy Spirit worked differently with the Apostles during Pentecost (starting of the church on Earth) than today. If we believers in Christ can do the same as the Apostles, why are the gifts/miraculous signs gone today.??? And don't say because of "lack of faith" either.
Amen 🙏🏻
What does Scripture say about those who have a form of godliness but deny the power there of? 8:27
9:27 typo
Mark is NOT a mainstream charismatic.
If the sign gifts happen today as they did in the apostolic age, point me to the healer and the seer. Please, send me to them.
How do you know you are not misrepresenting? How do you know your interpretation is truth? Gods totality?
Read the word and believe what new testament says
@@billyshavers7806 the word? Which word? Which Bible? Which language and translation? Which out of the 45,000 different Christian denominations is the right one? Whats the measure? Ones mind and heart? Ok, listen to what is being preached. Is fear of God? Doubt? Uncertainty? Should we seek in the world as we would have it be in our own weakness seen apart from God? This particular preaching sows fear and division. To see others not like yourself. To not love them as you love yourself. Is that of Christ? When people and preachers champion trump I question it. I question investing in the opposite of Christ to get something of this fleeting perishable world. Is that of Christ or the opposite?Need I go on? The word indeed. I recognize he is not his false beliefs nor are you nor am I. And for that matter Nor is trump. But shouldn’t we be seeking unity in Christ name rather than sowing fear and division? I think his audience is those who share his limited vision, his particular branding. Is that milk or meat? The word? Or his interpretation of the word? Maybe he is meeting people where they are. Maybe he is what he judges. Maybe we all are.
Cessationism is the excuse, that is crafted so that people can boast in the power of the flesh to prosper them, instead of the power of God. I'm hearing word of faith belief, it's really just about getting back to original intent. But, a lot of people go about it in ignorance or error. This is where you get the "not enough faith", etc. I don't primarily go off of here say about word of faith, etc. I go to the people themselves and hear them.
Sign gifts are NO longer needed.....! We have a complete Bible. I do not believe in "tongues" and all the other "funnies" but I do believe God works as He wills and not by human command....!💞
Misinterpretation of 1 Corinthians
Worldly Word of Faith is bad as well.
Do we have a Holy Spirit from the first century? 😮
We have a Holy Spirit that has never changed from before day 1 and throughout eternity
Read Malachi 3:6.
different
The Apostles laid hands on Christians, and the Gifts were passed on to believers in the first century. What happened when John died? I leave it for you to figure it out. Oh, and yes, GOD CAN DO ANYTHING HE DESIRES. Including ending the Gifts, because we have the New Covenant with us! Praise Jesus!!!
The burden of proof is on YOU to prove that God ended the gifts after John's death, because i read in Paul's epistles that God's gifts will continue to exist in His Church for as long as it exists, and His Church didn't end with John's death. Your claims and assumptions aren't matching up with biblical teaching.
G'day Would love to talk and pray with you me ole mate,,, Need to tell you 🙏 about what God did for me , was brain 🧠 dead coma 6 weeks,, Fair dinkum long story,,, Love Michelle and Myself Ross'co xx I'm a Aussie now in Texas USA 🇺🇸
Amen 🙏 🙏 🙏
Mark, you’re a smart guy. It’s because you’re a smart guy that you and I know you just made a gross misinterpretation of what Cessationism actually is. I don’t know a single cessationist that would say “The Holy Spirit won’t act”.
Isn't it 2024?
Odd. If people had the same gifts as the disciples had, why are they they at the children's hospitals healing all the sick kids? People don't know how to rightly divide these days. Thinking speaking gibberish without a translator and flopping around is of the Holy Spirit is absolute nonsense.
A cessiationist is just a sleepy christian who hasn't been touched by the power of the Holy Spirit.
I know there are some word of faith that are abusive, but I think that is a huge generalization when you say they are trying to force God. I don't believe you can ever force God, but you can put you faith in God doing what he already said his will is.
At the least, cessationalism is the “error” Jesus pointed out in Mark 12:24. God never violates His Word, our entire faith is predicated on that reality. That is the underpinning of the so-called ‘word of faith’ belief. See Romans 10:8 and Deuteronomy 30:14.
The Holy Spirit should be able to be evident to people without someone convincing you to believe in one way or the other. Who cares that someone else had a “god” experience. Without your own personal experience of truth, you have to take someone’s word for it. That’s not good enough for me.
Strawman.
🕊️❤️😇🙏
Wow…wrong definition of cessationism.
Hello genius. Since you are so intellectual and knowledgeable, can you please give YOUR PERSONAL DEFINITION of cessationism? That way, we can pick apart all your errors. Thanks.
@@user-pl7si5pn5k 3 gifts of 1) healing, 2) “tongues” and 3) prophecy ended with the apostles. That’s it. Simple. No need for the sarcasm. This is not my personal definition.
It also does not mean God is not present in our world. Of course he is, miracles happen! But not by someone who claims they are “anointed”. we are all anointed!
God Bless you
okay bring your Cameras Mark... then go to the children's cancer ward in any large city, declare the Gospel, and Heal the children of Cancer in Jesus' Name, then go to the Morgue and Raise the Dead in Jesus's name. Then I'll believe your signs and wonders charismania, but not until.
It will never happen.
Cessationists demonstrate their utter lack of understanding when they make bad faith arguments like this one. Healing isn't some kind of party trick that a Christian can perform on demand. _God_ does the healing, and He does so _through_ the human instrument when _He_ wants it to happen. Furthermore, the person who wants to be healed has to believe that God can and will do it, but very few ppl in this world have real, living faith in God these days.
We’ve spent several months hosting thoughtful discussions from respectable teachers on both sides of this issue. Unfortunately this clip is a strawman festival and does not represent what cessationists believe. Would love to have you on anytime to discuss.
These clips are from full sermons, did you listen to the full sermon?
According to the definition, as a Baptist, im supposedly a cessationilist!
My personal take on it is that even tho I don't think any spiritual Gift is dead so to speak that things like speaking in tongues the way most think it means is bunk or extremely rare. You only see it among certain groups and I have never seen an interpreter.
I personally feel that God can do anything he wants and miracles happen daily, I've personally seen laying of hands and healing (not from a charismatic preacher, lol) but with prophets, im on the fence. Everything pointed to Jesus and Jesus fulfilled the prophecies, we got John's revelation for the end so I'm at the conclusion that even tho God can and it's possible, I feel we have everything already with his word. Now keep in mind, I'm not talking about on a personal level but rather on a worldly one. Maybe I am a cessationilist lol but the funny thing is tho, I want raised in a church and most of my thoughts were derived from reading scripture and it's just now that I'm hearing titles like cessationilist,sola scriptura ect. I would love to read your thoughts on the matter seeing that your original comment was the 1st one I seen.
You can't flirt with heresy and not end up in bed with it.
What ? Jesus is blessing his enemies ? Are you out of your mind ?
Cessationists false teachers, no I reserve that for someone who knows what they are saying are false. I think most of these are honestly wrong, which is a thing in every other aspect of life. False teacher usually has malevolent intent and I don’t see that in Cessationists
Does these videos use a laugh track?
I respect alot of what Mark says from what i've seen of him, but I think its quite a shallow and prejudice view of the cessationist. For example, no serious cessationist believes that the Holy Spirit doesn't do anything. Its actually very misleading to say that and divisive. (I can already see in the comments below people attacking cessationists as if they are all hell bound heretics). The Holy Spirit's ministry is the only way anything happens spiritually and the main act of the Holy Spirit is the application of the gospel upon hardened hearts and the regeneration of the new birth. Secondly, even the most seasoned cessationists believe and alot of them have seen miraculous healings. Like bonefide miracles confirmed by medical reports (not fake miracles that often get reported in word-faith circles). They just believe that the gospel has been revealed and that no further "sign" is needed to show people the gospel. The Holy Spirit reveals to hardened sinners the light of the gospel through the preaching of the word... and that is enough. God however through his Holy Spirit does sovreignly perform miracles when he wishes and can be from a direct answer to a prayer. The point is we should all trust God regardless and trust in Christ's atoning sacrifice for our sins, and continue to pray for the sick in reverence and awe, which many cessationists do! So please in the name of peace and understanding, do not be so quick to condemn a bunch of cessationists... just as I am not here condemning this message.
I think Mark has a lack of understanding of the cessationist and is offended by them and believes they are somehow damaging the body of Christ (through a lack of understanding) and therefore attacks them, but the cessationist then doesn't understand his position so they retaliate and you get this back and forth. ... Mark honestly believes cessationists are very wrong and bad... to what I say is a lack of understanding. If he is saying cessationists believe the Holy Spirit does nothing I just don't understand how he has done much research or has listened to the main points from prominent cessationist teachers. Mark needs to do more research before attacking this doctrine and the many Godly Christians who believe in it, and the cessationist being attacked needs to have patience and understanding of where these attacks are coming from - a genuine belief that cessationists are wrong, and a genuine care for the body of Christ, and should therefore seek to patiently dialoge and explain different points that would hopefully fall on listening and teachable ears.
to add to this, I had only watched till half way through. I then heard the testimony of this miracle. Man, I do not know a single cessationist who would not praise God for that miracle or believe that a grieving mother and father's prayers cannot stir the sovreign hand of God to do something miraculous. The point is this is a grieving and belieiving mother and father... its not normative, it doesn't happen daily, we cannot force God's hand (as Mark so eloquently stated), and these two people probably don't claim they have a healing gift, they just praise God for the miracle he performed! and so do I.... but that is just speculation. We could get out all the books and do a thorough investigation of the matter, but for now... the view that God can bring a young kid back to life from the prayers of a grieving mother and father is no stumbling block for the cessationist. Its a cause of joy.. so I again Mark if you read this I encourage you to have a further look into the claims of cessationists...
Bro doesn’t even understand what cessationists actually believe.
Mr. Driscoll, cessationism is the view that the “miracle gifts” of tongues and healing have ceased-that the end of the apostolic age brought about a cessation of the miracles associated with that age. Most cessationists believe that, while God can and still does perform miracles today, the Holy Spirit no longer uses INDIVIDUALS to perform miraculous signs. God still performs miracles and is always working. He does what He pleases for His will is perfect. If you think Greg Locke is an apostle then I would say you are tap dancing on false teaching as well
Mark has misrepresented the Cessationist position here. The Holy Spirit does still work. The position is that "sign gifts" are given by the Holy Spirit at the moment. They believe that the Holy Spirit still gives gifts of ministry. But as Scripture says, signs are for the Jews. When you go through Scripture, signs very often came at the times that Scripture was being written, to confirm to the Jews that God was indeed working. God still answers prayer, and can and will do so miraculously if He chooses to do so. This is certainly a misrepresentation of a genuine position. Some hold the position to different degrees.
While it is overly simplistic, Mark is not wrong in representing this position as teaching that the Holy Spirit “ceased” acting in a specific way- by giving certain “sign gifts” to His body. The NT does not teach such a position, which should exhort any believer to question it and remain open, prayerful, and expectant.
@@Iwasneverhere7 He has misrepresented the position, because he made out that the position is that the Holy Spirit has ceased operating completely. That means there are no current gifts of the Spirit. He did not represent that the position is talking about sign gifts only. And the position is backed up by 1Corinthians 13:8-13. So you are misrepresenting the position too. They point to the fact, that tongues ceased to be mentioned after the earliest epistle 1Corinthians. It isn't mentioned in any further epistle. It is only mentioned a handful of significant times in Acts, and not again. Acts 2:43 states that many wonders and signs were done by the APOSTLES, but it doesn't mention anyone else doing these gifts. The early church fathers reported that these gifts were gone. Likewise with healings and prophecy, it seems that after the original apostles passed, that these few "wonders and signs" ceased to exist. As I said, some take positions on this more or less extreme, but this is the position, and to suggest that it has no Biblical basis is a false accusation too.
Check out the scientifically verified miracle on the most recent episode of jimmy akin’s mysterious world. A severed leg healed! Amazing story
The wildest thing about God to me is this; He's the very creator speech, let alone everything else, and so by and through His word, but can't and won't speak to us unless there's a bunch of things we do and don't do. No sin, no Savior.
You’ve got it all wrong
@@diegoalbor106 that's your perspective versus mine. Prove to me I'm wrong.
@@vandamnn3564John 10:27-28
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Every man has been given the measure of faith. God reaches out to us many different ways, people, nature, calamity etc. Keep slapping His hand away your whole life and you miss the boat. It's that simple. He emancipates from reprobate children. But He is just as forgiving to repentant prodigals as He is those who don't stray from the path. You're accountable to Him. One way or another. The choice is yours.
When I decided to follow instead of going my own way I found the path, a blessed life and a blessed wife. He is still repairing me from my damaged childhood and adolescence but my life changed so much for the better and I have salvation. Jesus is truly Lord.
Mark Driscoll is disqualified
I firmly reject the secessionist view, there have been way too many verifiable reports of events that do not follow the natural order of things. Certain individuals call these experiences false or imagined because it doesn’t fit the man made dogma that they have adopted.
Cessationism eliminate al those fakes miracles and fake claims by wolves in sheep clothes. Boasting is key for these devils during their "sermons". Unfortunately I am picking up such tones.
How conveniently charismatic of you
I don’t feel like you’re a charismatic. Maybe I don’t understand it entirely but I have seen some of those charismatic preachers and they seem to be charlatans and liars for the most part. You seem to just preach the gospel of Jesus from his holy word. Which is, from what I have read and come to think, that is how the Lord wants it. And I think you see the Bible is in fact to be taken literally. I have an impossible story of how Jesus saved my physical body once that proves without a doubt to me that he still works to this day the same as he did yesterday and before that. Jesus is Lord of us all. And he loves all of us. It’s such a shame that some people won’t admit it while they are here alive.
So what you are saying is that you don't read books but you go to fake churches and you have zero knowledge of the existence of miracles of healing happening. Makes zero sense to most other people.
This is a completely straw manned and uninformed presentation of cessationism.
I believe in the power of prayer, but there is no man today who can do what the apostles did, if so, I invite you to go to St Jude's and heal all the sick little babies. Please tell me are the miracles performed by the Mormon Church from God? The Oneness Pentecostal who do not believe in the Trinity? The Catholic Church and the miracles done by Mary? And the HS must be all mixed up, teaching you guys soooooo many different and false teachings....
Tongues, prophecies have ceased, 1Cor 13 and we have ALL TRUTH, John 16:13 says that the apostles were led into ALL TRUTH, ........so please go to St. Jude's........