Weber Mass Vs THD Hotplate - Power Attenuator Comparison - Shootout
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- Опубліковано 14 кві 2015
- '77 Marshall Super Bass full blast Vs Attenuation with Hotplate 16 and Weber Mass 100. '72 Marshall 1982A Speaker Cab and '08 Gibson Les Paul R9. Attenuators ran with all compensatory features bypassed exept for the Hotplates Bulb function on all but bedroom volume. If you wanna get an idea about SPLs check out this clip:
• Weber MASS 100 - Power...
Settinds on the Super Bass: Lead Vol: 8, Presc: 9, Bass: 3,
Mid: 9, Treble: 8
Love your experiments. You are a great reference for guitar palyers. Thank you so much for your devotion. By the way have you ever tried the Dr Z Air Brake ? Cheers !
Great review and demo.
+Metallion 1,968 Thanks! :-)
for what it's worth: this looks like an older version of the mass 100 but i don't believe much has changed over the years. i just got one and i'm blown away. and i'm not trying to do cranked tube distortion at bedroom level, i'm trying to get a naturally compressed clean tone at a reasonable stage volume, and MAN does the mass excel at that. life changing!
man thanks again for your great vids....you made me order a weber mass 200 ...pure clarity
+steeve thomas Thanks Steeve!
Johan, Awesome video as always, I've learned so much from you! Thank you, sincerely.
I'm looking for an attenuator for my JCM 800 2203, will the Weber 100 fry if I dime the 100 watt head? Thanks in advance!
great post.Cheers
+Chris Doyle Thanks Chris, Cheers!
You and your bandmates rule !!!
Hi i might be loosing my rehearsal space soon. Which attenuator would you recommend for home use of a 78 super bass
Thanks again.
I've got Weber mass 100 that I've been very happy with. I like that you can dial in any volume with it. Of course it doesn't sound as good as cranked, but I think the difference in sound has to do with the speakers not being pushed more than any kind of signal degradation within the attenuator
+MrBingping Speaker distortion has indeed an influence but actually it's mostly signal degradation in the attenuator. In this clip I use the Aracom down to bedroom volume level, with remarkably little sound degradation, but it colors the sound more than the Weber.
ua-cam.com/video/8rJzLDaCzoE/v-deo.html
Awesome video and playing as always
I realy enjoyed this one as i have the THD hotplate 4 ohm, I realy liked the Weber Mass dynamic response, When using my Hotplate on the -16db i prefer to keep the continous knob high all the way, the lower it is, the more you lose the dynamics from the amp, the best thing to do to get the best tone is not to use an attenuator but sometimes it is necessary for home environments or studio. Great job Johan
Can't wait for the mic comparison, keep rocking
Noah
JCMSLASH - NoahThawco Thanks Noah, always interesting to hear what you think. Cheers Johan
Johan Segeborn Great Review did you use the treble on either one? Also to your ears witch one sounded the best? i'm asking because i'm in the market for attenuator im in toss up between thd Weber and jetunator. the only problem with the jetunator it has no treble boost but does have di out which i don't know if thd or weber. have.
Great video!!! Thank U!!! By the way, I'm not sure if I'm using my Weber mass properly. I got a cab with just one speaker. Should I set my weber mass in 8 or 16Ohms? Thank you
Hi Johan! Very good video!!! Thanks!!!
I have a JCM800 2204 (50 watts) with S.I.R mods #34 and #36 and I'm looking for an attenuator to use with it. I'm in doubt between the THD Hot Plate and the Weber Mass 100.
Would you recommend which of the 2? I keep thinking that if I buy a 100 watt amplifier in the future, I won't be able to get room volumes with the Weber without damaging it.
The Weber (especially on 1) took out some nasty top end and let the growl come through. I like it better than 'no attenuator' as well.
Yeah, that's my goto attenuator, very transparent
Still to this day not much has changed but the super cheap Bugera now out. I tried that one for $110. It was ok if you set your amp volume to 1-2, and set it at 12 o’clock for bedroom. But anything else by turning the amp up was bad. Also the DI volume doesn’t work, and it works on the main volume. At that point better to stick a mic on the cab.
So after taking to Weber and telling them my findings with the Bugera, and asking questions. I decided I’m returning the Bugera and getting the Mass 100. It’s a bit more at $300 these days for newest model. But the feature set and transparency is much better! I found the $100 ones that are all same made in China design, are fine if you have a cheap amp, don’t want to spend a lot and play with your amp low volume then shave off some db. But cranking it and dialing enough off even to record…it doesn’t sound good to me. The Mass 100 at least has the treble controls, the DI out eq and you can use it as a load box. So you actually can use cab sims and be quiet at 3am to play or make demo tracks. The Bugera does one thing and at that it cuts it by 50% just being plugged in. So the tone is even sucked a bit fully open.
Even in 2022, best bang for buck is the Web Mass. Prices went up $50, but it’s a good kit of you have a nice amp and don’t want to risk it…plus have full on working features. Many cab IR loaders you can get free, and free IR responses as well…if that’s your thing. I couldn’t do that on the Bugera! Sometimes in DI it would hiss even! Without spending $600+ I haven’t found much better than Weber🤷🏻♂️
I'm just looking to buy used THD and based on this review, do you think I should go with a Webber?
GREAT DEMO JOHAN THANX,IM GETTING THE MASS 200W
How are liking the mass 200?
@@Platewarp i cant say how happy i am with the mass 200.its the only soak that doesn't ruin your tone in any way.i advise all to get one.the fryette is no answer as its a power amp and what use is that if you change your old fenders power amp. Defeats the purpose. Weber soaks imo with there dummy speaker motor are so transparent. Plus it handles any amp.also soaks with high power ratings to my ears always sound better
does the Weber mass 200 allow you to set different impedance on input from amp as well as to speaker cab? I see the toneking does but it’s more expensive.
@@JimmyDevere no you can basically use any ohmage you want because the weber has a speaker motor design and it doesn't matter what your amp is set to.let ,me say this besides the fryette[which isnt a soak or the ox box] the mass 200 is easily the best sounding soak out there.it retains tone way better then my jim kelly soak
Interesting comparison and very well made!
I myself have a Aracom prx150 undoubtedly the abolut most transparent of them all!
Thanks, I'm gonna look for one of those. Have heard great things about them. Cheers
Johan Segeborn Yeah the aracom is awesome even at bedroom level. The hotplate is ok at -12 dB but at -16 or lower the sound seems to be fuzzy and you loose a lot of harmonics. The weber seems to be good for the price too. Like always, you always get what you pay for.
pleximanic I heard they are very good, I'm going to put my THD on ebay and get one I think
pleximanic I've got one too and it's a gem of an attenuator. I've used it with an early '73 JMP50 that didn't like attenuators and it worked beautifully. The amp didn't heat up like it did with other attenuators and I got everything that I needed from the Aracom. However I found the Aracom really cut the highs on my '68 Plexi and '68 8x10. In the Aracom's defense the cabinet is pretty bright, though it does take away from some of the awesomeness of the plexi and I had to switch it for my Dr Z Power Brake which seems to do a pretty good job. The Aracom also works very well with my '72 Park and '72 straight cab with 75hz greenbacks which is a darker sounding combination. Now that I've heard the Hot Plate in action I'll give it a try on the 8x10 to see if it's more transparent.
A feedback effect while sounding the high note on the thinner string its not a everyday s cup .. Excellent sound. In some parts was a pretty Hendrix sounding
Very good video, Johan!!! Thanks!!!
When you say "bedroom volume", means I can play at my apartment at night?
Del Rei Thanks man, yeah with someone sleeping in the next room :-)
Johan Segeborn Wow!! Awesome!
HI, I owner of THE SILENCER attenuator of Doctor Amp. I need work with level bedroom using the attenuato with -16 db, and the problem is the tone, the incredible loss of tone. I am thinking buy the MASS III 150W but I don´t know if you will loss tone working with -16 db like The Silencer. Is possible work with a JTM 45 Marshall with crunchy tones in your bed using MASS III 150W with a well tone?. I think that in that sense all products Weber Mass will be similars. Thanks
Great review!
Would the Mass 100 work properly with a Super Lead 100 as long as the amp wasn't turned up all the way?
+crazybaldheadz Thanks! I'd go with the Mass 150 or 200 for a Super Lead. But if you don't attenuate down to bedroom volume the 100 is ok. Cheers Johan
Hello johan i have a jcm2000 and tv cab (25watt greenbacks) and recently bought 16ohm thd hotplate. I set it up how your supposed to but 2 of my tubes red plated and then the mains fuse blew. I replaced both tubes cause they where fried but now when using the hot plate the amp is getting very very hot but the hot plate stays cool and doesnt heat up all. Is there something wrong? Why wouldnt my jcm2000 like the hot plate but you seem to be using one fine with your plexys? Does anybody have any ideas?
test with a mastervolume amp as well and see how the attenuators compare to master volume being turned down. Easy enough to say "oh the thd sounds worse at -16dB" but a real comparison isnt to the non attenuated sound but to the master volume bringing it to the same volume level. Although yes a comparision vs bypass is also interesting to hear too to hear how transparent the attn is but even if we know it is not at high attenuation, would then be good to compare to master volume. Because I remember years ago having the thd but the powerbrake was no longer in production and hard to get and the weber wasnt so easy to find either or was a lot more expensive if i remember correctly.
Awesome video, thanks.
Just some feedback: I realize the need for the ads, but that info box for other videos was super distracting as it popped up over the text. (not complaining about a free youtube video, just my 2 cents)
+bigdbrew Thanks, I have thought about that too. I'm gonna consider removing them. Cheers Johan
Very nice video Johan! I really want to get an attenuator now! I love your playing by the way! I'm curious about your string gauges on your Les Paul? 9's or 10's? I love the bends you use!
+El Tigre Thanks! Glad to hear that! I use 10-46.
Thanks for the string info! I'm really enjoying your youtube channel. I just discovered you recently. Keep up the great posts!
Johan, is the additional cost of the tone stack on the Weber mass worth the additional cost if you are only attenuating a bit? I'm leaning towards a mini-mass or mass lite for a Fender 22w Deluxe Reverb head but the ability to mass with bass, mids, and treble on the Mass w/ full tone stack is tempting...
Hi, I bypass all EQs and correction features on the Mass, so if the other attenuators are identical besides the EQ, they'd do for me. I adapt the EQ on the amp instead. Cheers
Johan Segeborn Thanks much, Johan. :)
You're welcome :-)
I have a Weber Mass, I use on my Fender Deluxe Reverb, works and sounds great
Thanks for the additional feedback, John Finley. I'm definitely going to grab one when I find the right deal on Reverb.
is the MASS 200 good?
hello Johan did you by chance do a Weber Mass 3 video? seems like this unit has more tone tweaks capable
+Revelry 1969 Hi! No I have only demoed the mass 100, but I'm not using the EQ or the treble compensation, just the attenuation
Johan, Tell me please, what's the best attenuator for Marshall 1978Master Volume JMP, it is important for me to get a loop and reverb
+serge97rus Both these two would go a great job, the Webers are more transparent but the Hotplates aren't as dark at extremely low volumes
Thank you, what you think about Bad Cat Unleash 2
Great video, for a Marshall Bluesbreaker I was thinking of a Tedweber Mass 100w attenuator to play it in my house without the neighbors claiming me, you agree? Or with a 50w attenuator is enough?
+Gonzalo Arriagada Thanks Gonzalo! They recommend twice the power of the amp on the attenuator, if you wanna attenuate it down to bedroom volume levels, so I'd get the Mass 100. Cheers
Johan Segeborn thanks!!!
So which one do you like better Johan? Weber or hot plate? Or which one "kills less tone" I guess?
+Jeremy Wilburn The Weber is more transparent but the Hotplate has a treble compensation that is awesome.
You should try an Aracom and the Dr Z Air Brake attenuator
I will indeed!
Johan Segeborn Great! Thanks for posting this shoot out!!
OK you re playing a guitar with humbucker. But I wonder how can Hendrix sound like that with a single coil strat .
Great video!
Johan Segeborn, could you please help with this? I have a Weber Mass 100, but I'm afraid of using it in a 100W plexi, since the Weber website says:
"Full attenuation: up to 60w amplifiers. Slight attenuation: up to 100w amplifiers."
How come were you able to attenuate a 100w plexi fully with a Weber Mass 100?
Great as always ! Maybe one day you could also make covers ? That would be awesome to ear some old stuff with your gear..
Cheers from France
BlackOrpheus Thanks man, What do you wanna hear? :-)
Johan Segeborn Maybe some old Ace Frehley's licks (a Kiss midley ?) since you seem to like it :) But whatever you like would be great, and if you have any original material I would love to hear it too !
Weber site says "Many amps can reach full power at 3 or 4 on the volume dial, so it is a good suggestion to get an attenuator with 4x the power handling. For example, if you have a 50w high gain amp, you should opt for the MASS 200. If you have a 100w amp, you should still go wtih the MASS 200 but you should not crank the amp."
Should not crank the amp? ... kinda defeats the purpose then.
What do you think about the "Ultimate Attenuator"? Never tried it? I've heard it's the best.
+JMP Jack I have never tried it, but I've heard that it modifies the tone - to the better many say, but I need something transparent. That's just what I've heard, may not be accurate. Cheers
Thanks for your reply, Johan. I really trust of your opinion, since we have the same tastes about the guitar sounds. Keep it up!
Full blast sounds the best... cheers!
***** Indeed, but I think they both sound pretty good. And the Weber is ok even at bedroom volumes. Cheers!
Hello Johan,
Been watching your video for quite a bit, I decided to buy a 1987x and a 1960ax cab. I couldn't find these to try them myself, hopefully I won't be deceived. What do you think about the combination ?
On the other hand Which attenuator you think I should get ? For a bedroom level without loosing the tone. Should I consider a master knob mod ?
Thank you so much for what you're doing it's very helpful.
Thanks Elghoul! Glad you like my clips. It's a great and classic combination. You will like it. The speakers of the cab may need some breaking in though, say 60 hours of playing before they're perfect but they're quite ok out of the Box too.
I think you should get a hotplate, to me they're the best at really low volumes.
Cheers Johan
Thanks Johan, I appreciate your answer
Hi Johan, have you ever tried the SPL Reducer? It's made in Germany and about the same size as the Hotplate and all hand-wired. I don't have any experience with it but I've heard from others that it's even better than the Rivera RockCrusher, which I own. Frankly I wasn't impressed with the RockCrusher at all at bedroom levels, it seems to suck the life out of my tone. Recently I picked up a Hotplate and thought it sounded much better at lower levels, but I'm interested to look into the SPL Reducer as others have said it's far more transparent at lower levels than the RockCrusher..
+Dagger 323 Hi! No, I'm afraid I haven't tried that one. The best attenuator for bedroom volume levels that I've tried is the Aracom, check this clip ut
ua-cam.com/video/8rJzLDaCzoE/v-deo.html
Johan Segeborn wow, the Aracom sounds great. Definitely going to have to check out more about that one before I make another purchase on an attenuator...
Johan how do you like the Marshall power brake?
+Billy Ards I have only used it a couple of times, so my experience is limited. People who use it tell me it's very transparent at slight attenuation levels but not as effective at heavy attenuation compared to the Hotplate. Cheers
I once had one - it kind of looked cool, but I didnt think it sounded good at all. The older Marshall which have active circuits in it, sounds much better.
Thank you boomer. I needed this comparison.
Is the THD passive??
Yeah it is
I like my THD with my 64 SR but after 12dbs you are paying a price. The Badcat Unleash seems to work well but I needed a Z Matcher to make it work with 2 ohms from the amp. I did a demo of both but really for just attenuation the THD especially for what they go for used.
Do you have a link to the demo, couldn't find it on your YT channel. Cheers
Johan Segeborn What differences did you notice between the two in person?
The Weber was a bit darker but more transparent. The Hotplate coloured the sound, brightened it up but in a natural sounding way. On bedroom volume levels only the Weber was good enough. Cheers
Johan Segeborn You inspired me so I tried the Weber with a 64 Super Reverb. Ill compare it with Unleash later. I also did a demo of the optional headphone tap.
www.mylespaul.com/forums/squawk-box/337325-weber-mass-100-new-version-headphone-tab-demo.html
fizzy thats how I remember my thd with an old or100
+Bebe Na Vole They're not fizzy down to -12dB in my experience
Hi. Im having trouble trying to find a proper attenuator. I tried the rivera rockcrusher but it didnt suit me as i intend to use it for rehearse and gigging, and the first level of attenuation (-3db) drops too much volume as i play with a very loud drummer. Im now trying to find and attenuator with more options between bypass and -3db as im interested im pllaying my marshall 100w loud (but not bypass loud!) Any help will be really apreciated. Great videos there! cheers and sorry for my sloppy english
+Ariel Ruiz Picot Thanks Ariel! The Hotplate starts at -4dB but maybe the Weber are continuous. Otherwise you could get less efficient speakers. For instance a G12M is 3dB quieter than a V30. Cheers Johan
Ok, i forgot the attenutors ^^. Thanks Johan !
dafxtone So which one did you like best?
Johan Segeborn Any. i didn't support any modification of the original sound ! It's each time make the sound duller, less agressiv, less authentic.
dafxtone Yeah unattenuated is certainly to prefer when circumstances allow it.
Johan Segeborn In most correct amp nowaday, you (should) could find a volume switch which will do correctly the job. But not on Plexi, not on 5150... Sometimes it's really hard to setup the volume from 0,1 to 0,2 without going to 1 ou 2 and blowing your house and you hears (i remember my Fender Hot Rod, 40 Watts was terrible for that). Even the Mesa recto 25 watts isn't really playable at low volume in modern mode... Obviously, if i had to make a choice in both of them, the best would be the -16 db, closest to the original.
Johan Segeborn And the only interest for an attenuator in ly opinion would be to make the amp tubes sing. It's not require so much higher volume, but definitively too much for bedroom. So loosing the hear of the sound in treeble with attenuators while trying to push the amp to get more life, it's not really a convincing deal for me ;)
3:23 Sonic Heaven
Which do you like better? Weber or thd.
+Joshua Phelps I really like both but the Weber is the most transparent
Great comparison!
You should try Rivera RockCrusher - it's the best attenuator.
AppetiteforDestruct1 Thanks, Yeah The Rivera, the Aracom and the Air brake gets a lot of praise. Gonna look them up for sure. Cheers Johan
Hi there, I'm looking for an attenuator under 600€, and I am so fucking lost. i've been looking reviews for months and haven't been able to decide. i'm currently playing a peavey classic 30 combo... Please HELP
-18db = way too fizzy
why does it sound better WITH the hot plate
Very close, they both sound fine in patial attenuation. When using extreme settings (-16db) they both sound bad and I guess the amp's presence control has no effect anymore.
There are many attenuators out there, Koch, Rivera, Bad Cat, from all of the attenuators i have seen i realy liked the Aracom the most, it is realy the most transparent attenuator today. you can see Solodallas's channel
ua-cam.com/video/X-9igZhS6QE/v-deo.html
JCMSLASH - NoahThawco Now, I'm really gonna get one of those. have heard so many good things about 'em.
Johan Segeborn Yeah it would be great to compare the aracom with the hotplate and the babcat or even a tone king ironman with a 50w amp and even a 100w. Johan, don't try this on the 68 jmp 50w plz ok :)
Which one is your favourite, Sylvain?
Johan Segeborn Aracom and then it's the badcat. I hear some really nice comments about the Tone King Ironman too. I only tested the builtin attenuator with the Royalist and it was awesome too. But for the sound quality with a Marshall is really the aracom prx150-dag that wins IMOO.
Really curious about the Aracom now!
aracom is the best atenuator i ve ever heard...pricey though:S
silver stone I'll look it up, cheers
To me is a waste of money, get a built in attenuator and save $1,000???
Weber and hot plate is a good deal and for each its own.
To me is a waste of money, get a built in attenuator and save $1,000???
Weber and hot plate is a good deal and for each its own.
can't hear. crank it up
I would go with the Weber ,.......don't like the THD at Bedroom volume,
it sounds like a fly trapped in a car radiator grill
+Lou Sekoya haha, yeah the Weber is the most transparent attenuator I've tried.
Johan Segeborn what do you mean when you say transparent?
Thomas Jefferson Oh, thanks man!
Weber wins
Thanks!
Johan Segeborn cheers from Brazil!!
Wtf ?
The THD at -8 dB sounds lower and sucks more tone than at -12 dB...That s weird......Your experinment is not calibrated at all dude
They both kind of compress the sound,dont like it