The sheer amount of effort to compare all of these units is enormous. Hats off to you sir, for helping me decide which all-in-one to get. First class content, as always.
Just got my M500 mkiii over a week ago and I love it! Sounds exactly how you described and never gets hot. Such and awesome device and I’m having no problems driving my planars with it. Best purchase I’ve made all year. I’ve been looking for someone to finally review it, to see if I’m not the only one loving it. Thank you for the awesome review! Fully recommend the SMSL M500 Mkiii to everyone
Glad you liked the video and thanks for confirming my thoughts on the M500! Always nice to know I'm hearing things the same way as others. It's a brilliant unit. So glad you're enjoying it
@@PassionforSound I like the form factor of the m500 it doesn't take up as much space. I will consider it since you liked it. I've purchased items and headphones on mainly your reviews and never seem to disappoint. I might troll you sometimes but you are my favorite audio reviewer ✌️👍
I don't post sound clips, Kitarist, because they're actually misleading due to the fact that it's travelling via an ADC (as line in or via a mic), through UA-cam compression, into your source chain and out your headphones or speakers. Any characteristics of that very long signal path could positively or negatively impact the sound of any of these devices resulting in you thinking one is preferable over another when, in fact, it just happened to have the right synergy with that extended signal path.
I have been more than happy with my DX5. It has settled in as my desktop preamp for my Adam T8V speakers and serves as an amazing headphone amp for a number of cans that I use. I'm surprised by your thoughts on the DAC being possibly too high quality for this price point. Do you think this DAC holds its own with other DACs from $400-$700?
Glad you're enjoying your DX5! It's definitely a nice option at its price. As for the DAC, I don't think it's too good for the price so much as that I think the DAC is slightly better than the amp stage in the DX5 so it performs even better when driving external amps or active speakers (as you're experiencing with your Adams). I did a big all-in-one roundup a while back, but I can't remember where I placed the DX5 from a DAC-only point of view. I'd imagine that it's competing with $400-500 DACs
Love these comparos! Not that I'm gonna be able to own one of these anytime soon. Crunching all of it down without staring at a teleprompter and maintaining that tempo itself is praiseworthy. And then all the behind-the-scenes work and putting it all in context... Kudos for the efforts and finesse👍🏽
hello passion for sound, been a big fan for your detailed and relaxing reviews I have a question.. I know you tried arya stealth with mojo 2 and ef400. Which sounds better to you and may I know why? I listen mostly to rock and metal but I enjoy almost all genres. I prefer big soundstage, staging, musicality and linear sound (no vocal forwardness). I am sensitive to sibilance and shoutiness of vocals but you mentioned that you can eq the arya stealth with mojo 2 so I think it’s not gonna be a problem. I prefer portability but if sound is better with ef400 with more power, I can sacrifice for pure sound. Hope to hear from you. thanks
Hi Nia, I would go for the Mojo 2 because it does everything better and the EQ means you can make it sound pretty much like the EF400 if you want to while getting better resolution and detail
sorry just a quick follow up quesion sir, do you think mojo 2 has enough power for arya stealth to show off her full potentials iesp in sound dynamics?
Yes, the Arya isn't actually too hard to drive and the Mojo 2 does well with it. Of course, you can always get even better sound, but not for the same price I think
Great review! I am looking for a DAC AMP to drive Hifiman Susvara and DCA Stealth. Would you say the Burson Conductor 3X GT which you also reviewed is superior to all options in this video?
Absolutely! The Conductor GT (either 3 or 3X) is amazing and the best all-in-one I've heard other than the TT2. It's very hard to find a better single-box solution IMO
Great review. Thank you for doing all this work and then providing us your opinions on the units. The problem with reviews like this is the use of the word 'slight this' and 'slight that'. Again, you said "buy what you prefer" or "what sounds good to you". Since most of us do not have the money to have all those units in our house to test the sound between them we really rely on folks like you to provide us with your opinion. Again, your opinion. Not a knock at all. I say that since I had the K9 Pro and the SMSL iii and I sent the SMSL 3 back. Yes, great sound from both, and if I am being honest, the SMSL iii did sound 'slightly' better. However, for me, when I tested MY collection of headphones and IEM's the K9 Pro, TO MY EARS, sounded better across a host of IEM's I own (about 12 ranging in price from 20.00 US to around 300.00 US) and headphones (about 6 pairs ranging in price from 70.00 to $400.00). Again, across MY headphones and IEMs the K9 Pro was preferred. Slightly. The 'blackness of the sound floor" and the extra power I had in my 300 Ohm headphones when plugged into the K9 Pro was the deciding factor. I felt the higher impedance headphones I own just sounded fuller and had more 'oomph' to them vs. the SMSL iii. I do feel if either the K9 Pro or SMSL iii was on my desk, I would kick neither off. Both sounded really good. ZERO knocks on the SMSL iii. If I can get the SMSL on sale, I would buy it just so I had two great-sounding units to switch between but I would limit the SMSL iii to IEMs and under 300 Ohm headphones. Again, a great review and thank you for putting in all the work you did and sharing it with us.
This hobby is tricky for making decisions based on reviews. I always recommend that people watch a bunch of videos from multiple reviewers to get a handle on whose preferences are closest to yours or at least get a consistent sense of how you differ. Glad you're enjoying the K9 - it's a great device!
@@PassionforSound Completely agree! I like your reviews as they are off the 'hype train' and instead of just 'this is awesome use the link below so I get a cut', you simply state what you feel about the topic you are covering. Much respect. I am really enjoying the K9 Pro but, again I will be picking up the MK3 at some point. I am at a point where I just want to listen to my music again and these two units allow me to do just that.
Great, that you used the Arya stealth for testing. Would you recommend any of these all-in-ones for the Arya SE, or should I look into stacks at the same price range? (Like ifi sig HFM stack)
I'd personally go for separates in most cases, but the EF400 will be a great match for the Aryas if you don't need extra bells and whistles. Keep in mind that the Aryas are an exceptionally capable headphone and will easily scale with higher end gear so ideally a stack like the Burson Composer and Soloist or a Conductor GT would be even better
Thank you a lot for this comparison. It may sound cynical but this helped me to decide to go for a stack and shelll out more money but be happier in the long run.
Hi great video and effort mate. Would the m500 pair well with an LCD 2C? I am after a warm-ish sound or something which is not too midrange emphasizing. Thanks!
@@PassionforSound thanks!, by neutral do you mean too analytical? what would you suggest for a warmish sound with just a bit more bass with the lcd2c? I was looking at vali2 and modi stack but not sure if that will give that sound signature?
No, when I say neutral, I just mean uncoloured, but the M500 is smooth enough to be very enjoyable with any headphones. I haven't tried the Vali, but the Modi+ is a DAC I've reviewed recently and the M500 Mk3 is definitely better. (Modi+ isn't bad - it's excellent for the price)
Thank you very much for your work, it is always a great help! Which of all do you think combines better with the ZMF VC and Atrium? Thank you very much!
Glad I could help! The VC and Atrium work great with anything so I would probably go with the M500 Mk3 given that the EF400 doesn't seem to play as well with high impedance cans for some reason. That said, if you have more budget and space, a simple set of separates would do even better again.
@@PassionforSound Thank you very much for the reply! Yes, seeing your review I was also leaning towards the SMSL m500. The problem is that I have the possibility of buying a second-hand Chord Mojo 2, so between the SMSL and the Chord I don't know which one to choose 😭😭
Great comparison review of these units. I bought the K9 Pro ESS last spring based on your review and also DMS. It's a great piece of kit, especially the DAC that I use with the Ferrum stack.
So is this review for the sound quality for the headphones or will you get a similar experience using these dacs with a separate preamp with active monitors?
You'll almost always find that the performance via headphones is the same as the performance as a preamp. In a few cases (like the FiiO K9 Pro ESS) the performance is even better as a preamp. Just jump to my discussion of the DAC performance of these to get a sense of preamp performance
Thanks for the reviews, I can lose hours catching up on your output! 😊 I have the Edition XS headphones so purchased the EF400 after this shoot out, but unfortunately was seriously underwhelmed! It could be I was expecting too much from an AIO to replace my existing DAC and separate amp - which was SPL Phonitor One (now RebelAmp) and Soncoz SQ thingy (little square box £199, lovely!). Now I really don’t know which way to go DAC wise, is the SGD1 really an upgrade, it looks on appear to have lots of interesting improvements, should I try a £500 DAC from Topping/SMSL et al? I’ve bought a Bifrost 2 on the spur of the moment and compared and really it isn’t all that good for classical, loses too many details - the Soncoz is far more textured and resolving to my ears. The RebelAmp is amazing (another eBay find!) and the green monster is definitely a keeper… but where to DAC wise so I can itch the latest bout of upgradeitis! Does the antipodean maestro have any advice for this confused Brit…😊
Sorry you were disappointed in the EF400. Unfortunately, AIOs rarely stack up to an equivalently priced stack or individual device (DAC/amp only). I don't know the Soncoz you had/have, but the SGD1 is great and I've got a review coming. I don't recommend a Topping or SMSL over the SGD1 - that much I'm already clear on. I may have one other option that's a new entry in the market, but I haven't seen or heard it yet. I'll be comparing it with the SGD-1 in that review so stay tuned and hold off with the purchase if you can so I can hopefully provide more context and info for you. Also, with the Bifrost 2, is it the newer 2/64 version or the prior one? The update has really helped to pull out those extra details
@@PassionforSound thanks for the tantalising info on whats coming up, I shall hold off for a while and await details of the newcomer with eagerness! I’m finding the only way to decide these things in your own system with your own ears is to hopefully buy second hand and pass on or buy new and return if things don’t work out! Looking forward to the newcomer and hope it does well in your comparison review. The Bifrost 2 is the OG version picked up on eBay, and I’m thinking that adding the 64bit card (for it seems £300) would take it nearly into the realm of some pretty interesting DACs, I’m happy around the £500-700 price bracket for this round of upgrades I think. I’m sure it’s a great DAC as everyone seems to say so, its maybe that the Rebel has all the organic feel I need and maybe the DAC in this instance needs to be as clear and precise as possible, without being harsh, which is a neat trick to pull off! Thanks for coming back so quickly, I’ll keep an eye on your notifications… 👍😊
Same headphones, I'll let you know what I think of the m500 when it arrives. I was considering the EF400 based on Passion's review. What aspect of it don't you like with the Edition XS?
@@PavlosPapageorgiou it’s just not that revealing, pleasant enough but I would say the little Soncoz DAC @ £175-199 paired with a £350 amp like the SPL Phonitor One does a much better job at retrieving the detail and presenting it in a more dynamic way. I have since given the Bifrost 2 another week or two in my system and my initial thoughts have completely changed! After deciding to sell it on and putting the Soncoz qxd1 back in to the mix it was obvious the Schiit was doing something right the Soncoz wasn’t quite managing. The little Soncoz does extract lots of detail but after listening to the Bifrost 2 for a few weeks it was obvious it too had the detail, but presented it in a much deeper soundstage. The Soncoz was a flatter delivery, all on one plane, which can seem like more information… I suppose this is the sort of thing that improves as you go up the ladder with what are pretty much all excellent products theses days, the delivery, soundstage, height, placement of instruments etc is what improves 😊
@@timwoodward3381 The m500 mkIII just arrived and aw, it's such an improvement! It drives the Edition XS properly, the sound is punchy, expansive, and overall satisfying. It has the same cleanness and detail but also resonance! I listen in high gain and about -24dB with default filter and color. Crystal seems harsh but I could like the Tube sound colors to calm down some content. It certainly feels like I'm getting the value out of the headphones and DAC/amp with the m500. I also love the industrial design and I think it provides finer volume increments. If I'd bought the m500 in the first place I wouldn't be looking for an upgrade, but I'm still intrigued about the EF400. Now I'm wondering what to do with the EX5 and its underwhelming amp. Either return it of fit the Bluetooth antenna and use it as a DAC with my room amp to play music from my phone through speakers (which I almost never do).
If you had to pick one all in one of the dac'amps above in combination with the Hifiman He-1000V2 Stealth which one would you pick? The M500? Thanks for your time and great review
@@PassionforSound The HE 1000 Stealth has a treble that I would like to smooth out. What would you recommend? Or do I get that result with the MK 500 and some EQ maybe? Or is the Topping DX7 pro plus or the Fiijo K9 Pro Ess maybe the one to get a warmer bass and a smoother treble?
Thank you so much for this! I've been in "dac/amp research Hell" for a few days now, and I'd narrowed down to (many) Topping devices, SMSL and HifiMan. Never heard of the M500 - But now that's the easy choice for me. That quickly solved my headaches. I'm using Focal Utopia and HE1000SE. I also needed Bluetooth, so that's great. The extra sound settings are very appealing too. Cheers!
@@MarcLie90 I heard about some issues with M500 after this, ended up getting a used SMSL SU-9. It was okay but I wasn't super happy with it. Now I have a Ferrum stack and an empty wallet but I'm happy lol
This is interesting. I recently auditioned a bunch of headphones using an EF400. As you noted it drove a set of Arya Stealth beautifully. I also tried it with the Focal Clear MG and the difference was drastic - they sounded so lacking in detail, especially in the mids & trebble that I wondered if the test headphones I tried were defective. Having watched this video I'm wondering if it was rather that the EF400 simply doesn't work well with that sort of headphone. Given that Hifiman makes planars I wonder if the EF400 has been optimised for current output rather than voltage which might cause problems with higher impedance cans. Very interesting video.
I listened to FiiO K7, FiiO K9, FiiO K9 PRO, EarMen ST-Am, HiFiMAN EF400, of all of them I liked FiiO K9 PRO and EarMen ST-Am the most. Before I bought the FiiO K9 PRO, I listened through a portable THX Onyx amplifier for two years, and with the advent of the Beyerdynamic DT 770 PRO 250 Ohm, the power of the THX Onyx was not enough, although the sound in the headphones was good at full volume. So I went to listen to amplifiers and make difficult choices. FiiO K7 - the sound was not impressive. Worse than THX Onyx. There is no wide stage, no powerful and beautiful sound is felt, no analytical sound, weak bass, no velvety bass. The sound does not evoke emotion at all. FiiO K9 - the sound is noticeably different from THX Onyx and FiiO K7, but also did not impress me. The sound is detailed, but cold (I don’t like it, listening to music is boring), there is no melody, the sound stage is wide, the bass is a little weaker than that of the FiiO K9 PRO ESS. Sound does not evoke emotion. FiiO K9 PRO ESS - great sound, I really liked it, I was so impressed that tears came and goosebumps appeared. It sounds much better than FiiO K9 for the reason that the sound is neutral, very detailed and at the same time melodic, the bass is strong and velvety. It sounds emotional, the sound has a pleasant effect on the auditory nerves, which is why you experience emotions over the edge. HiFiMAN EF400 - did not understand the charm of the sound, the sound is dry, neutral, does not sound as good as FiiO K9 PRO ESS and EarMen ST-Amp. I was told that I need to warm it up for at least 100 hours, then this sound amplifier will open - nonsense. The THX Onyx, FiiO K9 PRO ESS and EarMen ST-Amp sounded great right out of the box. EarMen ST-Amp - great sound, I really liked it too. It sounds better than FiiO K9 and HiFiMAN EF400, the sound is warmer than FiiO K9 PRO, but it is inferior to FiiO K9 PRO in detail. It also evokes emotions and I liked it. But the EarMen ST-Amp had a problem when I listened to it in an audio store. After 30-40 minutes, the EarMen ST-Amp began to click when rewinding or scrolling through a track in the player. The clicks are such that they seem to be knocking on the microphone, but in foobar the clicks have disappeared. We took the second one out of the box and it also clicked. I bought FiiO K9 PRO ESS and two headphones. Headphones can't sound good everywhere, so I took a pair of headphones. Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm for music and cinema, and Beyerdynamic MMX150 only for games. I listened to headphones: Logitech G Pro X, Razer BlackShark V2, Sony INZONE H3, HyperX Cloud Alpha S, Microsoft Xbox TLL-00010, Sony MDR-7506, Audio-Technica ATH-M30x, Shure SRH440A-EFS, Sennheiser HD 569/599 /HD660S, Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32/80/250 Ohm, Beyerdynamic DT 880/990/1770 PRO 250 Ohm, Focal Clear MG, Beyerdynamic MMX150/MMX300. I didn’t take the Beyerdynamic MMX300, because it’s the same Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32 Ohm, but with a microphone, and games also lack mid and high frequencies, like the Beyerdynamic DT 880/990/1770 PRO 250 Ohm, and the Beyerdynamic MMX150 is fine with this. The Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm sounds great in music and movies, but in games the mids and highs are lacking, resulting in muffled sound and poor positioning in games. The Beyerdynamic MMX150 don't sound very good in music, okay in movies, but great in games. Logitech G Pro X, Razer BlackShark V2, Sony INZONE H3, HyperX Cloud Alpha S, Microsoft Xbox TLL-00010 are the worst gaming headphones. The Beyerdynamic DT 1770 PRO 250 Ohm doesn't make any sense because it has weaker bass and doesn't sound as nice as the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm. Focal Clear MG sound good, but their bass and treble are rather weak, while the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm has very good bass, they are velvety and comfortable high frequencies, the sound is more interesting with the FiiO K9 PRO ESS, as if in a concert hall. The Shure SRH440A-EFS sounds more interesting than the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32/80 Ohm, but not as great as the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm. Sennheiser HD 569/599/HD660S didn't make it, they don't reach Beyerdynamic. FiiO K9 PRO ESS sounds great. Playing games, listening to music and watching movies with such sound is a pleasure. In games I experience new sound experiences. There is no need for enhancers, HeSuVi, Dolby Atmos for headphones, THX Spatial Audio, DTS:X, equalizers, all this greatly spoils the sound in games, music, and movies. In the game Avatar: Frontiers of Pandora, FiiO K9 PRO ESS gave such emotions that I shed tears from the magnificence of the sounds. When I listen to beautiful music, I get goosebumps. FiiO K7, FiiO K9, HiFiMAN EF400 and my two-year-old THX Onyx cannot give me such emotions in sound as the FiiO K9 PRO ESS gives me.
@@DarkFire515 With the FiiO K9 PRO, any headphones sound good, and with the right headphones, the sound will be great. Such acoustics will give you strong emotions. By the right headphones, I mean those headphones that were chosen by your ears when you listened to different headphones and it was these headphones that your ears liked the most and delight your hearing.
Awesome review. Im eyeing on the m500 mk3 as my headphones (kennerton gh50) are a bit warm. Are there any other amps or dacs (can be a separate unit) you recommend at a lower price point?
There's nothing that really stands out as a better option for less. The Topping E50 & L50 come close, but the amp in the L50 isn't my favourite. Similarly, the SMSL SU-8 & SH-8 or DO200 and HO200 don't get there for me either. I'd personally go with the M500 Mk3 and add an external amp later if you feel the need.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the reply. Does the m500 mkiii play well with external amps? Will the overall sound quality increase? Im going to get the m500 first, then maybe a couple of months later i might get another amp to pair with it at round the $500-600 range. Or should i just get the chord mojo2?
Yes, it works very well as a DAC feeding external amps. The Mojo 2 does produce better overall sound so it will depend on your feelings about the ergonomics of the Mojo 2 vs M500 for desktop use as to which is the better choice, but sonically, the Mojo 2 wins
@@PassionforSound Right when I was about to pull the trigger on the m500, i stumbled upon one of your comments in this video saying that the chord mojo sounds better. Thank you for providing such an expansive review and your effort in replying to every comment. SUBSCRIBED!
First of all thank you for your videos, I really appreciate the reviews as they are very helpful! What do you think is the best match for Hifiman HE1000 V2 Stealth? I am torn between EF400 and Fiio K9 Pro. I am also planning on getting a pair of monitor speakers so I am leaning more towards the Fiio K9 Pro since it has a pre-amp and I can control the speakers' volume. On the other hand other reviewers such as Joshua Valour, prefers the EF400 for HE1000 V2 Stealth but EF400's analogue output is always on so I need a preamp for it(looking at Topping Pre90 right now) which would mean more money to spend on. Do you have other recommendations? I might also consider a DAC/Amp stack solution but the problem is I am not sure if it will be a good match for HE1000 V2 Stealth.
Of the two you mentioned, I would choose the K9 Pro because its DAC is excellent and it's better suited to your speaker usage. However, its amp is only average so you might want to add a separate headphone amp later (similar to needing a preamp with the EF400). The EF400 is nice, but it's still a fairly budget unit and performs accordingly when compared to higher end gear. I think, for the money you're spending, I'd recommend a nice stack like the SMSL HO200/DO200 or similar. The SMSL M500 Mk3 is another good option as an all-in-one that has almost as good of a DAC as the FiiO and almost as good an amp as the EF400 (speaking about their subjective sound quality)
@@PassionforSound Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and suggestions, I really appreciate it! I am now reading through forums for other options as well and now I have my eyes on HE1000 V2(non-stealth). Like everyone is saying - this is a rabbit hole xD Again, thank you for taking the time to read through and reply to my query. Your interaction with your viewers is something to applaud to though I know it will be hard for you to keep that up as you gain more viewers and subscribers. Sending my support from Perth WA. Cheers! 🍻
Thanks a lot for the review. I am still hesitating between the M500 and the Ifi Gryphon...(quite different I know). Can some of you share the way you stream your DAC/headphone amp please? I am tempted by a dedicated android phone with micro sd + UAPP app for cca 250 bucks. Better option than this is the same type of price range? cheers.
Hi Streps, I don't have any direct recommendations, but keep in mind that you will need to charge the phone to keep it running and the USB socket will be busy outputting the signal to your DAC. You might need to consider other options like a Raspberry Pi or similar.
Hi, thanks a lot/ Your feedback is very much appreciated. I guess I'll need to use a phone as a remote for the raspberry pi anyway for volumio or whatever else. I was considering a dedicated phone to stream therefore I do not really mind to have my usb socket busy or directly use BTooth. Search for the best option still ongoing...Cheers
Great Review, I already own the EF400 right now and had the DX7 Pro and agree with all your points. Interesting to know about High Impedance Headphone compatibility, I don't have any High Impedance Headphones to test but I remember seeing a post on Head-Fi that mentioned EF400 having different output impedance on each of it's outputs, maybe that's effecting the final sound quality? On a separate topic, Is Mojo 2 sound quality on a similar level to EF400? I'm planning to upgrade my portable setup (using LG V60 now) and currently going back and forth between Mojo 2 & RS2.
The output impedance should have less impact on high impedance headphones so not sure what's causing the issue. As for the Mojo 2, it's on a similar performance level with the Bifrost 2 (from a DAC perspective) so I'd expect it will be even better than the EF400, but I haven't directly compared them. It's definitely my recommended portable all-in-one option though
So will the k9 pro perform better with a separate preamp just using the k9 pro for the dac the using a example gustard p26 to adjust volume is the k9 pro worth getting if you plan on getting a separate preamp?
Thank you for all your informative reviews. I am getting an open box Focal Clear mg at a good price and need to get a DAC/AMP. Will the SMSL 500 MKIII be a good match or will it undercut the performance that the Clear mg is capable of? Thanks to any/all for help.
Nice one! The M500 Mk3 will be nice, but you would get better performance from higher end gear if you have the budget. There's nothing wrong with starting with the M500 and upgrading down the track though. You could add an amp later and use the M500 as a DAC where it's quite strong
@@PassionforSound Okay...taking your advice and going for better performance. Schiit BiFrost 2/64 and Jotunheim 2. Thought about a Singzer SA-1 and also an aio Burson Conductor xp. Went with Schiit as I'm in the US so if problems easy to send in repairs and 5 year warranty plus I like lots of slam:) TY for having such a great channel.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the answer! Would you recommend k9pro or topping dh7pro+? considering that I didn't like the presentation of EF 400 - I listened k9pro and I liked it, but I will have to order the topping blindly...
I have my MKIII coming in the mail post watching this video- this will be my first DAC/Amp. Was happy to find it on sale for $450. I’ll give an update when I get it. I originally wanted the RME ADI 2 (for mixing & mastering music because of the high resolution) but am trying to get as close to that as a general 500$ price range can get. I read some of the comments and realized you mentioned a DAC and AMP separate will usually be a better bargain. If I returned my Mk3, what DAC/AMP combo would you say would get as sonically close to the RME as possible (without all the features). Not necessarily in that 500$ price range but the lowest price possible whilst getting a close/damn near equivalent sound?
The ADI-2 isn't the best thing around as some people make it that it is. You can match or beat it's sound quality (not it's powerful features) with something like a Soncoz SGD-1 and a Singxer SA-1 or even a Geshelli E2 or Archel 2.5. The amp stage isn't great in the ADI-2 - fine, but not great, so it depends on whether you want to match it (Geshellis) or better it (Singxer).
@@PassionforSound so my M500 came today and it sounds really nice in comparison to my previous Dac (Blackface Apollo twin) it’s a lot more quiet, I didn’t know the Apollo Twin was noisy till comparing but there is a constant noise that makes low volume elements lost. With the M500 I could hear delay effects in vocals that I didn’t notice were there. Reverb also was more intelligible. The sound also sounded considerably more tame so I could hear compression much better-- it almost sounded like the Apollo was just kinda distorted sounding. I tested this with a mix and I noticed a lot of the issues I had with mixes I turned out previously were automatically solved by me just listening with the M500. Is it safe to assume the RME is a significant sonic upgrade to the Mk500? Looking at the prices of your suggestions it may make more sense to just get the RME used or marked down because it would look cleaner, less items, and it has those features. And sense you mentioned it's not a 'great' AIO-- is there some that you consider a tier(s) better than the RME? I’ve heard some say the RME is like an audio equivalent of 1080p resolution… so I’m wondering what would be the 4K or 6k (to keep the analogy). To extend the analogy, maybe the M500 is 720p resolution.
I'm glad you're enjoying your M500. With the ADI-2, it will likely be an upgrade on the M500, but it's also quite a different sound with more edge to the sound so it's a bit more forceful and could be less enjoyable depending on your tastes and headphones/earphones. It's definitely not a bad device, but I think, if you're staying with the idea of an all-in-one, I'd look at the Burson Conductor 3XP instead.
Well now what do you think that there's a version of the dx5 that's $100 less with no mqa? And even better yet $100 less than that coming on a mass drop in 3 months? A $250 versus 450 it seems like it would be the best bang for buck of all time.
I'm not a massive fan of the Ares II, but I'm pretty confident that it's better than the EF400 DAC because the Ares II is at the Bifrost 2 kind of performance level and the EF400 doesn't get there
I'm going to have to pick one up to do a side by side compare but I'm a little concerned moving from a balanced amp to a non-balanced amp. I'm not sure if it's the amp or the cable that I bought but the biggest Improvement in sound that I heard in my setup even between testing different amplifiers was to change in sound that I heard from switching cables to balanced. It opened everything up bigger more spacious more clear. I was always one of those people that thought it was snake oil until I heard it what are your thoughts about the difference between balanced and unbalanced?
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the quick response! Will definitely check out your review on those again! Also considering the Jotunheim 2. Which would you recommend if I am looking to tame the treble a bit on the HD800s or Arya? I am a bit treble sensitive.
@@PassionforSound Hi! What does the built-in DAC to 9 Pro look like in comparison with the DAC in FE-400 and SMSL Do 200? I have the opportunity to buy a used K9 for 600usd. And I want to build a stack from the best DAC + external amplifier topping A90D. THX amplifier K 9 did not impress me at all, but I heard that the dac in K9 is one of the best deltasigms up to 1000 usd.
From what I've been told, EF400's 3.5 mm and 4.4 mm output have different output impedance than the 6.35 mm and XLR output. And I think Hifiman recommend use low impedance headphone on the 3.5 mm and 4.4 mm output and high impedance headphone on the 6.35 mm and XLR output. Not sure which port you ran the high impedance headphones on but that's my guess. That or maybe this amp has more current rather than voltage. Though my headphone is Denon D5200 (24 ohm) so I do plan to pick up EF400 eventually. :)
I didn't know that about the different output impedances, but I was using XLR for all tests I think as that's my standard termination on aftermarket cables (I then adapt to 4.4mm if needed) I think you'll be very happy with the EF400 for your Denons!
Have you tried the mkii version of the m500? If so, i'd like to know if there is much difference in terms of sound quality vs the mkiii one. And if, in your opinion, the difference in price is justified (around 100$) I'm looking to buy one of them, for the dac alone and sound quality and value are my main focus. Thank you
I haven't tried the Mk II - sorry! There are some significant improvements that they've implemented so I'd expect notable improvements, but I can't say from experience.
@@PassionforSound yes i've seen the spec comparison between both but was wondering if the price difference would be worth it when comparing sound quality only(dac). from what i've red sound signature seems very similar.
I don't know the Hedd monitors and there are many different Beyerdynamic headphones, but I'd choose the SMSL M500 Mk3 for use with headphones and monitors because it allows you to switch them which the EF400 doesn't
How does this compare to directly plugging into the desktop PC with a modern mid to high end mainboard? Are they all so much better? (Assume desktop output is more than loud enough)
The sound quality is vastly better from these devices compared to even high quality mainboards. I'd definitely recommend checking one of these out to experience the difference
thanks for your dedication. i am a proud owner of the old version, S.M.S.L m500 mkII. glad to see the mkIII doing well here too. i switch the output often between the headphone and the XLR for my active speakers. i find the little help from the remote control does the job perfectly.
Cheers, another super thorough review! I was excited to see you review the M500 but pitting it against competition just made it all the more interesting. I guess the M500 would still be my choice if I do buy a unit soon, which may be the case, but I am considering the limited power output limiting my potential headphone choices later. The slightly more cumbersome line out management for desktop speakers also has me thinking. Hmmm... Thanks Lachlan! ⭐️
So glad I could help. I would personally still choose the M500 out of this lot. There really are only 2-3 headphones it won't suit from a power perspective
@@PassionforSound Thank you, that advice helps. I might just take the plunge on the M500 and I am sure I will be happy with it then 😊 As always, appreciate your passion, approach and dialogue with commenters. 👍
I am not a headphone listener but am Interested in the M500 MkIII to use as a DAC. So switching won't be a hassle for me. I am wondering if there are sonic improvements/changes in comparison to the MKII
I haven't compared with the Mk2, but the changes listed in the marketing materials should all make noticeable sonic differences. It's an excellent device IMO
Wow this is awesome. Am sure you must have long sessions with coffee and listening. I have got (thanks to you) bifrost 2 with soloist and ef400. B2 with soloist definitely better sounds to my ears. I really love the laid back nature of ef400 with hifiman headphones. You are 💯 right about running out of volume when i am using the focal clear balanced(again thanks to you) i find the maximum at 9 o clock. That is why am using 6.35 connection.
Glad you enjoyed it and glad I've been able to help with your setup! This one was definitely a long time in preparation and listening sessions, but it was a fascinating journey that didn't go as I expected on multiple occasions
@@PassionforSound I never lost interest while listening to it even the video was long (it's supposed to be long) relevant points. I think a lot of people will get help in deciding from this. I read in one of the forms, a post from official hifiman. They said that if you get a good power supply with this will enhance the quality of the sound. What i love about bifrost is their unison usb that really is silent. I am looking at jitterbug which potentially can bring clear signal to ef400. Not sure if that is going to make any difference. Also i think many of us(viewers) forget that each device might sound good on it's on but when you start comparing than it is a different game. plus people can get touchy especially if they have bought a unit. They want all praise.
Hello Lachlan, thank you for an excellent review! I appreciate this format very much. Direct comparison of multiple devices is much more informative and useful than reviews of individual products. I understand it is logistically difficult but it puts things in actual perspective, which is priceless. In fact, I would rather wait for, say, a month to get a review like this than to watch individual reviews weekly. You covered everything relevant, were to a point and presented your findings and evaluations logically, illustratively and clearly. Remarkable job. One question: what would be your recommendation for a “pure“ DAC (without the amp section) under 500 USD and why? Thanks
So glad you found it helpful, Lukas. It's very hard to co-ordinate this type of format and it's often just luck (like this one) when the timings all align. As for the DAC under $500, I'd probably look at the Soncoz SGD-1. I haven't reviewed it yet, but it's a lovely DAC
how is the EF400 with the Susvara ? (i’m now thinking to buy two d’accord/amps, one transportable DAC/PRE/Amp and a great DAC for home, would the EF be good enough to convince my family im not totally nuts to buy those headphones ? ;-)
I think the EF400 is a great device, but I don't think it makes sense to pair the Susvaras with it - you won't be getting the best out of your Susvaras.
what else would work as a transportable system ? those susvara are complicated, did u hear the ZMF caldera yet ? im going to amsterdam soon to test them, there is a shop there that only sells headphones, they even have the orpheus and are getting the he6. a bit far from your home :) anyway, see u on patreon :)
The Calderas will be on their way to me any day now according to Zach (along with my personal pair of Atriums 🎉) I can't think of too many transportable systems (other than the Hugo 2) that will beat the Mojo 2. iFi make products like the Gryphon and Diablo, but I don't know that they'll match the Mojo 2 for SQ (they're just more powerful) Thanks for joining the community on Patreon! Chat to you more there 🙂🙂
I haven't directly compared, but the Mojo 2 is at the level (DAC-wise) as the Bifrost 2 so it will best the EF400 and it has sufficient power to drive the Aryas just fine
That's a really tough one. I'm not sure and don't currently have time to check. I think the EF400 would be better on pure sound quality because the L50 isn't the best amp around (the E50 is a brilliant DAC). The EF400's lesser performance with higher impedance headphones could be a factor though
The Mojo performs on a different level because it's on par with the Bifrost 2 as a DAC. The amp is significantly less powerful than these all-in-ones and it's less ergonomic as a desktop solution, but I think it sounds better than any of these (assuming you're not trying to drive a crazy difficult headphone like a Susvara or maybe Stealth/Expanse)
Lachlan, I sold my Topping D90SE, still have the A90 amp which I can either sell (and buy the SA-1) or keep since it’s very powerful. Would you recommend the EF400 or should I get a Musician Pegasus or Denafrips Ares II?
I've actually got the Pegasus here for review soon, Billy, and I think it's maybe better than the Ares II. I haven't done thorough listening, but will get to it soonish. They both perform beyond the EF400 by a fair margin though. It's worth remembering that the A90 is part of your overall sound though and the SA-1 is a better amp IMO, but also might not need the extra smoothness of an R2R DAC. Have you considered the updated Bifrost 2 and a Singxer SA-1?
@@PassionforSound, 😱 did I read your mind or a coincidence? It’s great I’m your Patron so I get to see it first. Online shops here have a sale every month (9.9, 10.10 next) and we’re having the Great Singapore Sale to coincide with F1 in Singapore so I may just get the Pegasus and use it with my A90 until I sell it which I will then consider the SA-1 ($819) or iFi iCAN Signature ($2,945). Your recommendations are always excellent and you probably knew I like warmer sounds hence I sold the D90SE. I’d read that the Pegasus ($1,499) is more musical than Ares II ($1,149). There are some concerns about the QC of Musician Pegasus (but I’ve also read that they do running-in at the factory, not sure true or just marketing), voiced by 2 reviewers and some buyers’ experiences online about their units going horribly wrong, I hope those problems are fixed. Denafrips distributor is in Singapore and the owner Alvin is a nice guy who can service Denafrips but I’m not sure about Musician Audio’s support and service here though. Just want to be able to get help if I face a problem. As for the Singxer SA-1, I’d probably get it after I sell the A90 or get the iFi iCAN Signature, to pair with the Pegasus. I’m not sure if Bifrost has a distributor here though as I mostly purchase from the online shops of actual stereo shops. I know you don’t do iFi products but the iFi iDSD Pro ($4,200) and iCAN Pro signature ($2,945) series are circling in my mind but this combo will cost me my headphone budget for an Atrium and Elite or Empyrean. The hybrid and tube options with its legendary X-Bass and X-Space are very tempting on the iCAN Signature but it’s more than double the price of the SA-1. Perhaps, pairing the Pegasus with the SA-1 would be good enough that I don’t need to spend so much for the iFI stack and still get an Atrium lol this hobby can be stressful…
I'd forgotten you were in Singapore. That might make getting Schiit a little trickier, but you might be able to order direct. I would definitely be concerned about the longevity and service with the Pegasus as my unit had an issue and it's being repaired by a friend because Musician were very slow to reply to my emails and then have gone completely silent ☹️ How much is Pontus 2 compared to the Pegasus? I'm hoping to try a Pontus 2 soon and that might be a better option
Lachlan, I searched and there’s no authorized distributor for Schitt here. Also, different voltage in US (120V) and Singapore (230V). I’d prefer not to buy direct because if I have a problem, I’ll have to send to manufacturer when service is needed, the freight may be costly too and then, it’s not viable anymore. We do have individuals who imports and sell some products not represented here but they are giving their own personal warranty and I do not trust that unless it’s from a reputable company who’s products are “safe” ie. excellent QC, a product not known to be problematic such as the Focal headphones I bought. Ooh, your unit has issue too? I know nobody who can fix problems for me and hell, I may not know if my unit has a problem and would appreciate a service Centre that I can at least have it checked, even if it means paying a service fee. Now, adding your unit to the others that I had mentioned, it sounds like fault rates are high for Musician Audio. If it’s only the Pegasus model, then perhaps I can consider another model but the increase in price may just drive me to pay more to get other brands or compromised the musicality and get Denafrips or Ladder instead. The others whom had problems with their Pegasus didn’t get replies too and 2 cases where the unit was sent to China went missing mysteriously. 1 case was more exasperating because the owner was told to declare the product value at US$20 or something along this line so even with insurance, he was screwed. As a business consultant and C-level executives’ coach, it is very frustrating for me to see companies with good products and demand not taking their businesses seriously and only wants the short term gains. They lack meaningful missions, integrity and ethics, poor QC, cut corners, services and supports, customer care, false/misleading marketing messages, not caring for or training employees, etc… are all just very sad. If I get to sit down with these businessmen as a consultant, I’ll tell them off. Anyway, I read that “some” brands “stole ideas” and enticed manufacturers who made goos products for a brand to make for them by copying with minimal differences and then call it their own. I believe you know what I mean.
@@PassionforSound, Denafrips Pontus 2 is $2,449. Listing prices of the others in case anyone reading is interested to know.Prices in Singapore dollars since it’s about the sa,e as AUD$. Denafrips Ares II $1,149, Venus 2 $4,149. Musician Audio Draco $1,039, Pegasus $1,499, Aquarius $4,299. Maybe Gustard R26 at $2,349 is worth considering? Price wise, it’s closed to Pontus 2. Meanwhile, maybe I’ll get the iFi xDXD Gryphon first since the Hifiman EF400 is not that impressive. I had wanted to send you the iFi Zen DAC V2 but the postage and all may not make it worthwhile.
Thank you for this. My headphones are HiFiMan Edition XS (18Ω). I bought a Topping EX5 to drive them and it's OK. Beautifully clear and precise for quiet passages but kind of underwhelming when the music does something punchy. I've got an m500 mkIII arriving tomorrow to try out, as many reviewers said it sounds more dynamic or powerful. I also like the design of both of these models. But now I'm intrigued about the EF400. If it's designed for low impedance headphones, and possibly HiFiMan's own then it may be the best combo. The classic no features, no remote attitude is a plus for me.
Glad it was a helpful review! See how you go with the M500 and some of its feature - it's a great device. If you still want more, the EF400 is a touch better again, particularly if you like the simple, classic design.
@@PassionforSound It arrived and it's great! It produces the satisfying, punchy sound that the EX5 did not. To be fair reviewers already said don't buy the EX5 to use with the Edition XS. The m500 drives them beautifully. I found what I was looking for at the price range, don't see myself going for Arya and high end sources any time soon, but I'll see if I can get a listen of the EF400. It even has a passive transformer and you have to buy the right voltage :)
Sadly, the issue with the EX5 isn't the Edition XS - it's just how the EX5 sounds. The M500 though? A wonderfully different story. Glad you're enjoying it
Thanks for the review. After watching the review, I plan to buy the SMSL M500 MK3. I went to local store (Singapore) to ask a few questions but the sales staff were not able to answer. Here are the questions, please help: - Is the 4.4mm headphone plug of SMSL M500 MK3 balanced? - I am owning the Sony WM1AM2 DAP, I would like to know whether I can connect it to the M500 as my music sources. (FYI, The WM1AM2 is working when connected to Chord Mojo II. But it is not working when connected to Fiio K9 Pro ESS). Thanks in advance 🙏🏼
I can't answer the question about the DAP because they're all different. As for the 4.4mm output, it's not a truly balanced output, but it's not really relevant. As long as you have sufficient power and the sound quality is good (which it is), balanced vs SE really makes no difference for headphone outputs
What is best for mix mastering also on Sennheiser 560s headphones I decided to get them headphones as I heard they were very neutral and detailed. Also can you record into the topping dx7 pro plus
None of these will take inputs for recording as an ADC - you'd need a digital interface like a Scarlett 2i2 or similar for that. As for the best option for the HD560s, I'd happily take any of these for that use and would therefore base the decision on the features you want and the sound quality that seems most appealing based on what I've described (and others too if you check out more reviews). Personally, I think the SMSL M500 Mk3 is hard to go past for your needs.
Yep, that's not my take at all. One possible theory is that those people saw the relatively modest power output and decided based on a number rather than by using their ears.
@@PassionforSound thanks! I do have a nice integrated amp with gobs of power I use to drive the HE6sev2. Do you think the sound from the RU6 competes well with the EF400, or is the EF400 a big enough step up to warrant buying both?
For the k9 pro I want to pair it with a gustard p26 preamp and run 2 focal alpha twin evo active monitors will the k9 pro be a good option for a 2 ch setup
It should do a really nice job. You could probably do the same for less by getting a dedicated DAC without all the extra features and amp, but it depends on your needs
I ordered an EF400 because I liked the look and simplistic nature of it, I'll be mainly using my Clear MGs with it. I'm afraid I might regret it, but still excited to see how it sounds when it comes. I have a BTR7 for bluetooth and features/portability, so just looking for pure desktop sound quality. Thanks for the amazing comparison.
@@CrackaSlapYa Very nicely! I can definitely tell a difference in clarity and punch from the BTR7, which I still use a good amount of the time with the Clear MGs but it's definitely a luxury to get time to sit down and listen with the EF400. Happy with the purchase.
You mentioned there was a spectrum of sound from more lush/musical to more analytical - and that the EF400, DX7 Pro+ and M500 all sat quite close together but with EF400 being more lush, the DX7 Pro+ being more analytical, and the M500 being in the middle (and closer to the DX7 Pro+). Well, where would a Schiit Jotunheim sit on this continuum? Would it be more towards the lush side than even the EF400 is?
Quite an undertaking there, Lachlan, well done for completing it so efficiently. Before watching this I had the expectation that the M500 would be a strong candidate for winning overall and so I agree with your conclusion. Interestingly, neither its DAC unit nor its amp are solely/mostly responsible for M500's performance which is what such a unit should be designed to do. My only question woule be what are all those versions of M500 (MK 1 - 3) signify: debugging or marketing strategy?
Glad you liked the video. I have no idea why we get so many new releases from Topping and SMSL. My assumption is that it's because people keep buying the latest and greatest so I guess that makes it a marketing strategy (or response)
All the versions have hardware improvements like they upgraded the HPA and power the first time, now there are additional improvements such as sound processing.
I think the question here though is whether or not the "improvements" are always actually improvements. Certainly, the M500 Mk3 brought some significant upgrades by using the 8 channels of the DAC chips instead of only 2, but many times it's such a minor change that a lot of these Topping and SMSL devices are interchangeable and redundant
@@PassionforSound I guess I will patiently have to wait awhile and watch for the true white whale to emerge, along with your reviews hightlighting things along the way like the Supra Exchaliber cable.
I added the Singxer SA1 to the EF400 as an amp and it really gives my Ayras a fuller sound in the low end and smooths out the treble peaks really well. I really like the EF400 as an dac paired with the SA1
Thanks so much for this review, I've been hoping to see a nice breakdown of the M500 Mk3 as I've been drooling over it for a couple weeks now. Up till now, my only experience with a dedicated DAC or amp is my Earmen Sparrow (and I got a second one of those for my wife). I've been looking for a nice versatile desktop upgrade, and the M500 really does look like it fits the bill.
It would be good enough to be enjoyable, for sure. The Clears can sound even better with higher level gear, but that's no reason to avoid the M500 which will still sound great with the Clears
I haven't compared them directly, but knowing that the Mojo 2 is on the same level as the Schiit Bifrost 2 and none of these devices reached that level, I'd say the Mojo 2 will be comfortably better
Awesome. Thanks. I was myself considering one of these all-in-one, but in the end I bought a Topping D30 Pro/A30 Pro combo + XLR cable. Very happy with the performance.
I wanted a desktop dac/headphone amp for my iems, og clairvoyance, og monarch, og oracle to name a few. Have a few daps including m6 pro, two r3 Sabre pro, and q1. Used jriver and foobar in asio and waspi from full .wav quality songs. Had k9pro ess, used via coaxial and optical and my main issue was its sound. It runs lean which is what I prefer for iem usage but is it does not have a full note quality. It cuts short the note and does not have a fullness to its notes. Also i did not get any of that deep "ghetto" bass that it should be able to produce. For instance on Warren g regulate it has that deep ghetto bass rumble. The k9 pro is unable to produce it. It should be there when called upon but just completely missing. K9 pro is for "audiophile" Bluetooth lovers looking to step up to their next level.
I agree 100% about the lack of note weight and the muted nature of the sound of the K9 Pro. It's amazing when used as a DAC so this is a case of the FiiO amp design restricting its performance which is a shame. ☹️
While I would prefer there to be a simple switch on the front to switch between line out and headphone out on the M500, you *can* setup the remote to switch between outputs with one press of the FN button. That seems to be the easiest way to do it.
@@PassionforSound It seems to be the quickest and easiest approach. If it wasn't for that, I would probably not even use the remote at all, as I'm using it as a desktop DAC. It's a minor annoyance with an otherwise stellar piece of hardware.
At 35:09 he mentions something that sounds like "i squared s" which sounds like a 'thing' that you plug into the DX7 Pro+ to make it sound 'more refined'...? What is "i squared s"?
That's actually exactly what I said 😁 IIS or I2S or I²S is a transmission protocol (like, USB, optical, coax, etc.) that often uses an HDMI connector (but it's not HDMI transmission protocols). It's benefit is that it separates the timing information from the audio signal data (many protocols merge these together) and it tends to produce a cleaner, more refined sound in my experience
Does the single ended output of the EF400 have enough juice for low impedance, but insensitive headphones like the Hifiman Arya (non-stealth) or the AKG K702? And can it drive the HD800s with authority?
The SE output can drive pretty much any headphone (I didn't test with Susvara). As for the HD800, as I discussed in the video, it CAN drive them but doesn't sound it's best with some high impedance headphones and I'm not sure why.
I'm so pleased to hear that! I always try to keep the content as relevant and well-paced as I can so it's wonderful to hear that this extra long video didn't drag 🙂
I didn't find any local sellers when I did a brief search, but there's a global link in the description which will take you to HiFiGo. Great choice by the way! 🙂
Nice round up. It didn't came as that big of a suprise to me. iiwi reviews has similar taste with you and he loves m500 mkii. to the point that he sold his denafrips ares ii. not because m500 was better but he thought it was close enough. It would be great if you could get your hands on a Yulong Da-art Aurora all in one. It has it's quirks like no gain settings but it has a very powerful class A amp and nice features like rca line in which you can use with turn tables and other dacs. I'm using my unit for a few months now and absolutely loving it. Zeos also reviewed it today but probably couldn't find the dac/pre switch :D
The Soloist is a pure amp so not really a fair comparison. The Conductor is their all-in-one and would likely be the strongest of the bunch, but also the most expensive too.
I am looking to get a new DAC/amp combo unit and i have no clue what to get i use sennheiser HD599 headphones and i dont want a DAC that sounds too cold clinical or flat but i dont want something that sounds like its under water either i am looking for a middle ground just like the HD599 are
Thanks for the great video👍 Have the EF400. Beautiful in OS mode 4 pin XLR low gain with the Ananda SE. In NOS a bit muddy to my ears. Have the feeling that it does not drive the HE6seV2 to his potential. Waiting for my Burson Conductor 3X GT😀
@@PassionforSoundvery detailed comparison video ! Btw , I got the D9200 with the EF400 , it sound pretty well together , but if I wanted to upgrade for more , Do you think I can reuse the dac of the EF400 and buy a pure Amplifier like Violectric V222 or ifi pro ican Or do you think I should consider a dac amp combo all in one like ifi pro iDSD signature or Burson Conductor , since I also got some DSD files , but the EF400 only provides PCM … But it surprisingly doesn’t sound too much different at all which I transfer DSD to PCM instead of DoP in AK240 .
The EF400 is fine, but I do think you can do better so perhaps start with an amp upgrade knowing that you might then upgrade the DAC in the future too. You can always get another all-in-one, but they are somewhat limiting in terms of upgrade paths so just consider your future possible steps before deciding.
Will all of these work with iOS, ie an iPhone through the Camera Kit apple dongle method? It’s my preferred way to stream high rez tidal but I have struck out sending a signal to some devices, e.g. JDS Labs element.
I can't test that for you because I'm not an Apple user, but I would expect them to all work well because they're all driverless with Windows which would suggest a fairly easy USB interface
The sheer amount of effort to compare all of these units is enormous. Hats off to you sir, for helping me decide which all-in-one to get. First class content, as always.
So glad it was helpful! 🙂🙂
@@PassionforSound What do you think about Jds Labs element 3?
I haven't heard it. I've been unable to get review units from JDS
@@PassionforSound wait you did a review for the Jds Labs element 2😑
Yes, a channel patron sent it over for me to try. I reached out to JDS after that but they weren't interested ☹️
Just got my M500 mkiii over a week ago and I love it! Sounds exactly how you described and never gets hot. Such and awesome device and I’m having no problems driving my planars with it. Best purchase I’ve made all year. I’ve been looking for someone to finally review it, to see if I’m not the only one loving it. Thank you for the awesome review! Fully recommend the SMSL M500 Mkiii to everyone
Glad you liked the video and thanks for confirming my thoughts on the M500! Always nice to know I'm hearing things the same way as others. It's a brilliant unit. So glad you're enjoying it
Hey man can you post a video clip how it sounds? Just for reference. Thanks :)
@@PassionforSound I like the form factor of the m500 it doesn't take up as much space. I will consider it since you liked it. I've purchased items and headphones on mainly your reviews and never seem to disappoint. I might troll you sometimes but you are my favorite audio reviewer ✌️👍
I don't post sound clips, Kitarist, because they're actually misleading due to the fact that it's travelling via an ADC (as line in or via a mic), through UA-cam compression, into your source chain and out your headphones or speakers. Any characteristics of that very long signal path could positively or negatively impact the sound of any of these devices resulting in you thinking one is preferable over another when, in fact, it just happened to have the right synergy with that extended signal path.
Glad I can help, J Cap. The trolling mustn't be too bad because it hasn't stood out to me as particularly "trolly" 😁
I have been more than happy with my DX5. It has settled in as my desktop preamp for my Adam T8V speakers and serves as an amazing headphone amp for a number of cans that I use. I'm surprised by your thoughts on the DAC being possibly too high quality for this price point. Do you think this DAC holds its own with other DACs from $400-$700?
Glad you're enjoying your DX5! It's definitely a nice option at its price.
As for the DAC, I don't think it's too good for the price so much as that I think the DAC is slightly better than the amp stage in the DX5 so it performs even better when driving external amps or active speakers (as you're experiencing with your Adams).
I did a big all-in-one roundup a while back, but I can't remember where I placed the DX5 from a DAC-only point of view. I'd imagine that it's competing with $400-500 DACs
Love these comparos! Not that I'm gonna be able to own one of these anytime soon. Crunching all of it down without staring at a teleprompter and maintaining that tempo itself is praiseworthy. And then all the behind-the-scenes work and putting it all in context... Kudos for the efforts and finesse👍🏽
So glad you liked it! 🙂🙂
Definitely was a challenging one to pull together, film and edit - that's for sure!
Thanks Lachlan - this is legendary mate. With the Fiio - could you recommend a good amp to improve the sound like you mentioned?
Glad you liked it! I'd go with something like the Singxer SA-1 for a great setup with lots of versatility.
hello passion for sound, been a big fan for your detailed and relaxing reviews
I have a question.. I know you tried arya stealth with mojo 2 and ef400. Which sounds better to you and may I know why? I listen mostly to rock and metal but I enjoy almost all genres. I prefer big soundstage, staging, musicality and linear sound (no vocal forwardness). I am sensitive to sibilance and shoutiness of vocals but you mentioned that you can eq the arya stealth with mojo 2 so I think it’s not gonna be a problem. I prefer portability but if sound is better with ef400 with more power, I can sacrifice for pure sound. Hope to hear from you. thanks
Hi Nia, I would go for the Mojo 2 because it does everything better and the EQ means you can make it sound pretty much like the EF400 if you want to while getting better resolution and detail
really appreciate your response. this helps a lot in my decision making between the 2 dac/amps 😊 hope you a nice day 😊
sorry just a quick follow up quesion sir, do you think mojo 2 has enough power for arya stealth to show off her full potentials iesp in sound dynamics?
Yes, the Arya isn't actually too hard to drive and the Mojo 2 does well with it. Of course, you can always get even better sound, but not for the same price I think
Thanks you so much. happy weekend! 😊🤘🏽
Great review! I am looking for a DAC AMP to drive Hifiman Susvara and DCA Stealth. Would you say the Burson Conductor 3X GT which you also reviewed is superior to all options in this video?
Absolutely! The Conductor GT (either 3 or 3X) is amazing and the best all-in-one I've heard other than the TT2. It's very hard to find a better single-box solution IMO
Great review. Thank you for doing all this work and then providing us your opinions on the units. The problem with reviews like this is the use of the word 'slight this' and 'slight that'. Again, you said "buy what you prefer" or "what sounds good to you". Since most of us do not have the money to have all those units in our house to test the sound between them we really rely on folks like you to provide us with your opinion. Again, your opinion. Not a knock at all. I say that since I had the K9 Pro and the SMSL iii and I sent the SMSL 3 back. Yes, great sound from both, and if I am being honest, the SMSL iii did sound 'slightly' better. However, for me, when I tested MY collection of headphones and IEM's the K9 Pro, TO MY EARS, sounded better across a host of IEM's I own (about 12 ranging in price from 20.00 US to around 300.00 US) and headphones (about 6 pairs ranging in price from 70.00 to $400.00). Again, across MY headphones and IEMs the K9 Pro was preferred. Slightly. The 'blackness of the sound floor" and the extra power I had in my 300 Ohm headphones when plugged into the K9 Pro was the deciding factor. I felt the higher impedance headphones I own just sounded fuller and had more 'oomph' to them vs. the SMSL iii. I do feel if either the K9 Pro or SMSL iii was on my desk, I would kick neither off. Both sounded really good. ZERO knocks on the SMSL iii. If I can get the SMSL on sale, I would buy it just so I had two great-sounding units to switch between but I would limit the SMSL iii to IEMs and under 300 Ohm headphones. Again, a great review and thank you for putting in all the work you did and sharing it with us.
This hobby is tricky for making decisions based on reviews. I always recommend that people watch a bunch of videos from multiple reviewers to get a handle on whose preferences are closest to yours or at least get a consistent sense of how you differ. Glad you're enjoying the K9 - it's a great device!
@@PassionforSound Completely agree! I like your reviews as they are off the 'hype train' and instead of just 'this is awesome use the link below so I get a cut', you simply state what you feel about the topic you are covering. Much respect. I am really enjoying the K9 Pro but, again I will be picking up the MK3 at some point. I am at a point where I just want to listen to my music again and these two units allow me to do just that.
Great, that you used the Arya stealth for testing. Would you recommend any of these all-in-ones for the Arya SE, or should I look into stacks at the same price range? (Like ifi sig HFM stack)
I'd personally go for separates in most cases, but the EF400 will be a great match for the Aryas if you don't need extra bells and whistles. Keep in mind that the Aryas are an exceptionally capable headphone and will easily scale with higher end gear so ideally a stack like the Burson Composer and Soloist or a Conductor GT would be even better
Thank you a lot for this comparison. It may sound cynical but this helped me to decide to go for a stack and shelll out more money but be happier in the long run.
Glad I could help and I think you've made exactly the right choice!
Hi great video and effort mate. Would the m500 pair well with an LCD 2C? I am after a warm-ish sound or something which is not too midrange emphasizing. Thanks!
That should work great! The M500 is essentially neutral - just smooth
@@PassionforSound thanks!, by neutral do you mean too analytical? what would you suggest for a warmish sound with just a bit more bass with the lcd2c? I was looking at vali2 and modi stack but not sure if that will give that sound signature?
No, when I say neutral, I just mean uncoloured, but the M500 is smooth enough to be very enjoyable with any headphones.
I haven't tried the Vali, but the Modi+ is a DAC I've reviewed recently and the M500 Mk3 is definitely better. (Modi+ isn't bad - it's excellent for the price)
@@PassionforSound thanks appriciate the response!
Thank you very much for your work, it is always a great help!
Which of all do you think combines better with the ZMF VC and Atrium? Thank you very much!
Glad I could help! The VC and Atrium work great with anything so I would probably go with the M500 Mk3 given that the EF400 doesn't seem to play as well with high impedance cans for some reason. That said, if you have more budget and space, a simple set of separates would do even better again.
@@PassionforSound Thank you very much for the reply! Yes, seeing your review I was also leaning towards the SMSL m500. The problem is that I have the possibility of buying a second-hand Chord Mojo 2, so between the SMSL and the Chord I don't know which one to choose 😭😭
Mojo 2 will sound better if you're ok with the less "desktop" form factor
Great comparison review of these units. I bought the K9 Pro ESS last spring based on your review and also DMS. It's a great piece of kit, especially the DAC that I use with the Ferrum stack.
That would be a great setup with the Ferrums!
So is this review for the sound quality for the headphones or will you get a similar experience using these dacs with a separate preamp with active monitors?
You'll almost always find that the performance via headphones is the same as the performance as a preamp. In a few cases (like the FiiO K9 Pro ESS) the performance is even better as a preamp. Just jump to my discussion of the DAC performance of these to get a sense of preamp performance
Thanks for the reviews, I can lose hours catching up on your output! 😊 I have the Edition XS headphones so purchased the EF400 after this shoot out, but unfortunately was seriously underwhelmed! It could be I was expecting too much from an AIO to replace my existing DAC and separate amp - which was SPL Phonitor One (now RebelAmp) and Soncoz SQ thingy (little square box £199, lovely!). Now I really don’t know which way to go DAC wise, is the SGD1 really an upgrade, it looks on appear to have lots of interesting improvements, should I try a £500 DAC from Topping/SMSL et al?
I’ve bought a Bifrost 2 on the spur of the moment and compared and really it isn’t all that good for classical, loses too many details - the Soncoz is far more textured and resolving to my ears. The RebelAmp is amazing (another eBay find!) and the green monster is definitely a keeper… but where to DAC wise so I can itch the latest bout of upgradeitis! Does the antipodean maestro have any advice for this confused Brit…😊
Sorry you were disappointed in the EF400. Unfortunately, AIOs rarely stack up to an equivalently priced stack or individual device (DAC/amp only).
I don't know the Soncoz you had/have, but the SGD1 is great and I've got a review coming. I don't recommend a Topping or SMSL over the SGD1 - that much I'm already clear on.
I may have one other option that's a new entry in the market, but I haven't seen or heard it yet. I'll be comparing it with the SGD-1 in that review so stay tuned and hold off with the purchase if you can so I can hopefully provide more context and info for you.
Also, with the Bifrost 2, is it the newer 2/64 version or the prior one? The update has really helped to pull out those extra details
@@PassionforSound thanks for the tantalising info on whats coming up, I shall hold off for a while and await details of the newcomer with eagerness! I’m finding the only way to decide these things in your own system with your own ears is to hopefully buy second hand and pass on or buy new and return if things don’t work out! Looking forward to the newcomer and hope it does well in your comparison review.
The Bifrost 2 is the OG version picked up on eBay, and I’m thinking that adding the 64bit card (for it seems £300) would take it nearly into the realm of some pretty interesting DACs, I’m happy around the £500-700 price bracket for this round of upgrades I think. I’m sure it’s a great DAC as everyone seems to say so, its maybe that the Rebel has all the organic feel I need and maybe the DAC in this instance needs to be as clear and precise as possible, without being harsh, which is a neat trick to pull off! Thanks for coming back so quickly, I’ll keep an eye on your notifications… 👍😊
Same headphones, I'll let you know what I think of the m500 when it arrives. I was considering the EF400 based on Passion's review. What aspect of it don't you like with the Edition XS?
@@PavlosPapageorgiou it’s just not that revealing, pleasant enough but I would say the little Soncoz DAC @ £175-199 paired with a £350 amp like the SPL Phonitor One does a much better job at retrieving the detail and presenting it in a more dynamic way. I have since given the Bifrost 2 another week or two in my system and my initial thoughts have completely changed! After deciding to sell it on and putting the Soncoz qxd1 back in to the mix it was obvious the Schiit was doing something right the Soncoz wasn’t quite managing. The little Soncoz does extract lots of detail but after listening to the Bifrost 2 for a few weeks it was obvious it too had the detail, but presented it in a much deeper soundstage. The Soncoz was a flatter delivery, all on one plane, which can seem like more information… I suppose this is the sort of thing that improves as you go up the ladder with what are pretty much all excellent products theses days, the delivery, soundstage, height, placement of instruments etc is what improves 😊
@@timwoodward3381 The m500 mkIII just arrived and aw, it's such an improvement! It drives the Edition XS properly, the sound is punchy, expansive, and overall satisfying. It has the same cleanness and detail but also resonance! I listen in high gain and about -24dB with default filter and color. Crystal seems harsh but I could like the Tube sound colors to calm down some content. It certainly feels like I'm getting the value out of the headphones and DAC/amp with the m500. I also love the industrial design and I think it provides finer volume increments. If I'd bought the m500 in the first place I wouldn't be looking for an upgrade, but I'm still intrigued about the EF400. Now I'm wondering what to do with the EX5 and its underwhelming amp. Either return it of fit the Bluetooth antenna and use it as a DAC with my room amp to play music from my phone through speakers (which I almost never do).
If you had to pick one all in one of the dac'amps above in combination with the Hifiman He-1000V2 Stealth which one would you pick? The M500? Thanks for your time and great review
EF400 for pure sound quality. M500 for a more versatile device.
@@PassionforSound The HE 1000 Stealth has a treble that I would like to smooth out. What would you recommend? Or do I get that result with the MK 500 and some EQ maybe? Or is the Topping DX7 pro plus or the Fiijo K9 Pro Ess maybe the one to get a warmer bass and a smoother treble?
There's no all-in-one that will make a significant difference without EQ so I'd still go for the EF400 or M500.
Great review! I am looking for a DAC/AMP to drive Denon D7200. Burson Playmate 2 or Topping Dx5 which of it do you recommend?
I haven't tried the Playmate 2, but it's the one I'd choose because it's got a discrete output stage using the excellent Burson op-amps
Thank you so much for this! I've been in "dac/amp research Hell" for a few days now, and I'd narrowed down to (many) Topping devices, SMSL and HifiMan. Never heard of the M500 - But now that's the easy choice for me. That quickly solved my headaches. I'm using Focal Utopia and HE1000SE.
I also needed Bluetooth, so that's great. The extra sound settings are very appealing too. Cheers!
Happy with it?
@@MarcLie90 I heard about some issues with M500 after this, ended up getting a used SMSL SU-9. It was okay but I wasn't super happy with it. Now I have a Ferrum stack and an empty wallet but I'm happy lol
Haha. It's like that
This is interesting. I recently auditioned a bunch of headphones using an EF400. As you noted it drove a set of Arya Stealth beautifully. I also tried it with the Focal Clear MG and the difference was drastic - they sounded so lacking in detail, especially in the mids & trebble that I wondered if the test headphones I tried were defective. Having watched this video I'm wondering if it was rather that the EF400 simply doesn't work well with that sort of headphone. Given that Hifiman makes planars I wonder if the EF400 has been optimised for current output rather than voltage which might cause problems with higher impedance cans. Very interesting video.
I never got to the bottom of that issue, but it's nice to hear that it's not just me who's heard it. I thought I might have been a bit mad. 🙂
I listened to FiiO K7, FiiO K9, FiiO K9 PRO, EarMen ST-Am, HiFiMAN EF400, of all of them I liked FiiO K9 PRO and EarMen ST-Am the most. Before I bought the FiiO K9 PRO, I listened through a portable THX Onyx amplifier for two years, and with the advent of the Beyerdynamic DT 770 PRO 250 Ohm, the power of the THX Onyx was not enough, although the sound in the headphones was good at full volume. So I went to listen to amplifiers and make difficult choices.
FiiO K7 - the sound was not impressive. Worse than THX Onyx. There is no wide stage, no powerful and beautiful sound is felt, no analytical sound, weak bass, no velvety bass. The sound does not evoke emotion at all.
FiiO K9 - the sound is noticeably different from THX Onyx and FiiO K7, but also did not impress me. The sound is detailed, but cold (I don’t like it, listening to music is boring), there is no melody, the sound stage is wide, the bass is a little weaker than that of the FiiO K9 PRO ESS. Sound does not evoke emotion.
FiiO K9 PRO ESS - great sound, I really liked it, I was so impressed that tears came and goosebumps appeared. It sounds much better than FiiO K9 for the reason that the sound is neutral, very detailed and at the same time melodic, the bass is strong and velvety. It sounds emotional, the sound has a pleasant effect on the auditory nerves, which is why you experience emotions over the edge.
HiFiMAN EF400 - did not understand the charm of the sound, the sound is dry, neutral, does not sound as good as FiiO K9 PRO ESS and EarMen ST-Amp. I was told that I need to warm it up for at least 100 hours, then this sound amplifier will open - nonsense. The THX Onyx, FiiO K9 PRO ESS and EarMen ST-Amp sounded great right out of the box.
EarMen ST-Amp - great sound, I really liked it too. It sounds better than FiiO K9 and HiFiMAN EF400, the sound is warmer than FiiO K9 PRO, but it is inferior to FiiO K9 PRO in detail. It also evokes emotions and I liked it. But the EarMen ST-Amp had a problem when I listened to it in an audio store. After 30-40 minutes, the EarMen ST-Amp began to click when rewinding or scrolling through a track in the player. The clicks are such that they seem to be knocking on the microphone, but in foobar the clicks have disappeared. We took the second one out of the box and it also clicked.
I bought FiiO K9 PRO ESS and two headphones. Headphones can't sound good everywhere, so I took a pair of headphones. Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm for music and cinema, and Beyerdynamic MMX150 only for games. I listened to headphones: Logitech G Pro X, Razer BlackShark V2, Sony INZONE H3, HyperX Cloud Alpha S, Microsoft Xbox TLL-00010, Sony MDR-7506, Audio-Technica ATH-M30x, Shure SRH440A-EFS, Sennheiser HD 569/599 /HD660S, Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32/80/250 Ohm, Beyerdynamic DT 880/990/1770 PRO 250 Ohm, Focal Clear MG, Beyerdynamic MMX150/MMX300. I didn’t take the Beyerdynamic MMX300, because it’s the same Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32 Ohm, but with a microphone, and games also lack mid and high frequencies, like the Beyerdynamic DT 880/990/1770 PRO 250 Ohm, and the Beyerdynamic MMX150 is fine with this. The Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm sounds great in music and movies, but in games the mids and highs are lacking, resulting in muffled sound and poor positioning in games. The Beyerdynamic MMX150 don't sound very good in music, okay in movies, but great in games. Logitech G Pro X, Razer BlackShark V2, Sony INZONE H3, HyperX Cloud Alpha S, Microsoft Xbox TLL-00010 are the worst gaming headphones. The Beyerdynamic DT 1770 PRO 250 Ohm doesn't make any sense because it has weaker bass and doesn't sound as nice as the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm. Focal Clear MG sound good, but their bass and treble are rather weak, while the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm has very good bass, they are velvety and comfortable high frequencies, the sound is more interesting with the FiiO K9 PRO ESS, as if in a concert hall. The Shure SRH440A-EFS sounds more interesting than the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 32/80 Ohm, but not as great as the Beyerdynamic DT770 PRO 250 Ohm. Sennheiser HD 569/599/HD660S didn't make it, they don't reach Beyerdynamic.
FiiO K9 PRO ESS sounds great. Playing games, listening to music and watching movies with such sound is a pleasure. In games I experience new sound experiences. There is no need for enhancers, HeSuVi, Dolby Atmos for headphones, THX Spatial Audio, DTS:X, equalizers, all this greatly spoils the sound in games, music, and movies. In the game Avatar: Frontiers of Pandora, FiiO K9 PRO ESS gave such emotions that I shed tears from the magnificence of the sounds. When I listen to beautiful music, I get goosebumps. FiiO K7, FiiO K9, HiFiMAN EF400 and my two-year-old THX Onyx cannot give me such emotions in sound as the FiiO K9 PRO ESS gives me.
@@dragonsbreath8653 I also ended up buying a K9 Pro ESS to power my Arya Organics. Fantastic sounding amp and headphone combination.
@@DarkFire515 With the FiiO K9 PRO, any headphones sound good, and with the right headphones, the sound will be great. Such acoustics will give you strong emotions. By the right headphones, I mean those headphones that were chosen by your ears when you listened to different headphones and it was these headphones that your ears liked the most and delight your hearing.
Thanks for sharing such a detailed write up!
Awesome review. Im eyeing on the m500 mk3 as my headphones (kennerton gh50) are a bit warm. Are there any other amps or dacs (can be a separate unit) you recommend at a lower price point?
There's nothing that really stands out as a better option for less. The Topping E50 & L50 come close, but the amp in the L50 isn't my favourite. Similarly, the SMSL SU-8 & SH-8 or DO200 and HO200 don't get there for me either.
I'd personally go with the M500 Mk3 and add an external amp later if you feel the need.
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the reply. Does the m500 mkiii play well with external amps? Will the overall sound quality increase? Im going to get the m500 first, then maybe a couple of months later i might get another amp to pair with it at round the $500-600 range.
Or should i just get the chord mojo2?
Yes, it works very well as a DAC feeding external amps. The Mojo 2 does produce better overall sound so it will depend on your feelings about the ergonomics of the Mojo 2 vs M500 for desktop use as to which is the better choice, but sonically, the Mojo 2 wins
@@PassionforSound Right when I was about to pull the trigger on the m500, i stumbled upon one of your comments in this video saying that the chord mojo sounds better. Thank you for providing such an expansive review and your effort in replying to every comment. SUBSCRIBED!
My pleasure! Glad I could help and thanks for the sub 🙂🙂
I went with the Fiio K9 Pro ESS, thanks great content.
It's a great device, especially as a DAC and pre-amp. Enjoy!
First of all thank you for your videos, I really appreciate the reviews as they are very helpful!
What do you think is the best match for Hifiman HE1000 V2 Stealth? I am torn between EF400 and Fiio K9 Pro. I am also planning on getting a pair of monitor speakers so I am leaning more towards the Fiio K9 Pro since it has a pre-amp and I can control the speakers' volume. On the other hand other reviewers such as Joshua Valour, prefers the EF400 for HE1000 V2 Stealth but EF400's analogue output is always on so I need a preamp for it(looking at Topping Pre90 right now) which would mean more money to spend on.
Do you have other recommendations? I might also consider a DAC/Amp stack solution but the problem is I am not sure if it will be a good match for HE1000 V2 Stealth.
Of the two you mentioned, I would choose the K9 Pro because its DAC is excellent and it's better suited to your speaker usage. However, its amp is only average so you might want to add a separate headphone amp later (similar to needing a preamp with the EF400). The EF400 is nice, but it's still a fairly budget unit and performs accordingly when compared to higher end gear.
I think, for the money you're spending, I'd recommend a nice stack like the SMSL HO200/DO200 or similar. The SMSL M500 Mk3 is another good option as an all-in-one that has almost as good of a DAC as the FiiO and almost as good an amp as the EF400 (speaking about their subjective sound quality)
@@PassionforSound Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and suggestions, I really appreciate it!
I am now reading through forums for other options as well and now I have my eyes on HE1000 V2(non-stealth). Like everyone is saying - this is a rabbit hole xD
Again, thank you for taking the time to read through and reply to my query. Your interaction with your viewers is something to applaud to though I know it will be hard for you to keep that up as you gain more viewers and subscribers.
Sending my support from Perth WA. Cheers! 🍻
Thanks faitoq! Glad to help
Thanks a lot for the review. I am still hesitating between the M500 and the Ifi Gryphon...(quite different I know). Can some of you share the way you stream your DAC/headphone amp please? I am tempted by a dedicated android phone with micro sd + UAPP app for cca 250 bucks. Better option than this is the same type of price range? cheers.
Hi Streps, I don't have any direct recommendations, but keep in mind that you will need to charge the phone to keep it running and the USB socket will be busy outputting the signal to your DAC. You might need to consider other options like a Raspberry Pi or similar.
Hi, thanks a lot/ Your feedback is very much appreciated. I guess I'll need to use a phone as a remote for the raspberry pi anyway for volumio or whatever else. I was considering a dedicated phone to stream therefore I do not really mind to have my usb socket busy or directly use BTooth. Search for the best option still ongoing...Cheers
Great Review, I already own the EF400 right now and had the DX7 Pro and agree with all your points. Interesting to know about High Impedance Headphone compatibility, I don't have any High Impedance Headphones to test but I remember seeing a post on Head-Fi that mentioned EF400 having different output impedance on each of it's outputs, maybe that's effecting the final sound quality?
On a separate topic, Is Mojo 2 sound quality on a similar level to EF400? I'm planning to upgrade my portable setup (using LG V60 now) and currently going back and forth between Mojo 2 & RS2.
The output impedance should have less impact on high impedance headphones so not sure what's causing the issue.
As for the Mojo 2, it's on a similar performance level with the Bifrost 2 (from a DAC perspective) so I'd expect it will be even better than the EF400, but I haven't directly compared them. It's definitely my recommended portable all-in-one option though
So will the k9 pro perform better with a separate preamp just using the k9 pro for the dac the using a example gustard p26 to adjust volume is the k9 pro worth getting if you plan on getting a separate preamp?
Yep. The K9 is one of the rare products where it's DAC and preouts are noticeably better than the HP output
Thank you for all your informative reviews.
I am getting an open box Focal Clear mg at a good price and need to get a DAC/AMP. Will the SMSL 500 MKIII be a good match or will it undercut the performance that the Clear mg is capable of?
Thanks to any/all for help.
Nice one! The M500 Mk3 will be nice, but you would get better performance from higher end gear if you have the budget. There's nothing wrong with starting with the M500 and upgrading down the track though. You could add an amp later and use the M500 as a DAC where it's quite strong
@@PassionforSound Okay...taking your advice and going for better performance. Schiit BiFrost 2/64 and Jotunheim 2. Thought about a Singzer SA-1 and also an aio Burson Conductor xp. Went with Schiit as I'm in the US so if problems easy to send in repairs and 5 year warranty plus I like lots of slam:) TY for having such a great channel.
My pleasure! Enjoy your great new stack!
Hi there! have you heard Gustard ah90? How is it? compared with mk500 or k9pro?
I haven't heard it. Sorry!
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the answer! Would you recommend k9pro or topping dh7pro+? considering that I didn't like the presentation of EF 400 - I listened k9pro and I liked it, but I will have to order the topping blindly...
I haven't heard the Topping either - sorry
I have my MKIII coming in the mail post watching this video- this will be my first DAC/Amp. Was happy to find it on sale for $450. I’ll give an update when I get it. I originally wanted the RME ADI 2 (for mixing & mastering music because of the high resolution) but am trying to get as close to that as a general 500$ price range can get.
I read some of the comments and realized you mentioned a DAC and AMP separate will usually be a better bargain. If I returned my Mk3, what DAC/AMP combo would you say would get as sonically close to the RME as possible (without all the features). Not necessarily in that 500$ price range but the lowest price possible whilst getting a close/damn near equivalent sound?
The ADI-2 isn't the best thing around as some people make it that it is. You can match or beat it's sound quality (not it's powerful features) with something like a Soncoz SGD-1 and a Singxer SA-1 or even a Geshelli E2 or Archel 2.5. The amp stage isn't great in the ADI-2 - fine, but not great, so it depends on whether you want to match it (Geshellis) or better it (Singxer).
@@PassionforSound so my M500 came today and it sounds really nice in comparison to my previous Dac (Blackface Apollo twin) it’s a lot more quiet, I didn’t know the Apollo Twin was noisy till comparing but there is a constant noise that makes low volume elements lost. With the M500 I could hear delay effects in vocals that I didn’t notice were there. Reverb also was more intelligible. The sound also sounded considerably more tame so I could hear compression much better-- it almost sounded like the Apollo was just kinda distorted sounding. I tested this with a mix and I noticed a lot of the issues I had with mixes I turned out previously were automatically solved by me just listening with the M500.
Is it safe to assume the RME is a significant sonic upgrade to the Mk500?
Looking at the prices of your suggestions it may make more sense to just get the RME used or marked down because it would look cleaner, less items, and it has those features.
And sense you mentioned it's not a 'great' AIO-- is there some that you consider a tier(s) better than the RME? I’ve heard some say the RME is like an audio equivalent of 1080p resolution… so I’m wondering what would be the 4K or 6k (to keep the analogy). To extend the analogy, maybe the M500 is 720p resolution.
I'm glad you're enjoying your M500. With the ADI-2, it will likely be an upgrade on the M500, but it's also quite a different sound with more edge to the sound so it's a bit more forceful and could be less enjoyable depending on your tastes and headphones/earphones. It's definitely not a bad device, but I think, if you're staying with the idea of an all-in-one, I'd look at the Burson Conductor 3XP instead.
Well now what do you think that there's a version of the dx5 that's $100 less with no mqa? And even better yet $100 less than that coming on a mass drop in 3 months? A $250 versus 450 it seems like it would be the best bang for buck of all time.
Great stuff! Would the ares 2 be better matched with an headphone amp then the ef400 on its own? For arya v3, quad era 1, dt 1990 plus iems?
From what I understand, the EF400 only has digital inputs so you can’t use it with a different DAC
@@EricRosenfield i ment will the ares 2 combined with an amp better then then ef400 in and outputs aside
I'm not a massive fan of the Ares II, but I'm pretty confident that it's better than the EF400 DAC because the Ares II is at the Bifrost 2 kind of performance level and the EF400 doesn't get there
Hifiman ef 400 or mojo 2 which one be the best option for hifiman xs?
I'd go with Mojo 2
I'm going to have to pick one up to do a side by side compare but I'm a little concerned moving from a balanced amp to a non-balanced amp. I'm not sure if it's the amp or the cable that I bought but the biggest Improvement in sound that I heard in my setup even between testing different amplifiers was to change in sound that I heard from switching cables to balanced. It opened everything up bigger more spacious more clear. I was always one of those people that thought it was snake oil until I heard it what are your thoughts about the difference between balanced and unbalanced?
I have been anxiously waiting for this since you teased it two weeks ago even though I already own the EF400. Let’s gooooooo!
Hope you enjoyed it!
Nice Comparison. Any amp upgrade recommendation for the K9 Pro?
It depends on budget, but options like the Singxer SA-1 and Burson Soloist 3XP would be great
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the quick response! Will definitely check out your review on those again! Also considering the Jotunheim 2. Which would you recommend if I am looking to tame the treble a bit on the HD800s or Arya? I am a bit treble sensitive.
I'd go for Jotunheim 2 or Singxer SA-1 for those two cans. The SA-1 is a bit stronger technically than Jot 2, but Jot 2 is a bunch of fun
@@PassionforSound Hi! What does the built-in DAC to 9 Pro look like in comparison with the DAC in FE-400 and SMSL Do 200? I have the opportunity to buy a used K9 for 600usd. And I want to build a stack from the best DAC + external amplifier topping A90D. THX amplifier K 9 did not impress me at all, but I heard that the dac in K9 is one of the best deltasigms up to 1000 usd.
The K9 Pro DAC is excellent and I'd choose it over either of the others you mentioned for sure.
Thanks for your detailed review - I was looking at the EF400 - wasn't aware of the shortcomings
Yeah, me either. It's still a great device, but not quite as great as I first thought
From what I've been told, EF400's 3.5 mm and 4.4 mm output have different output impedance than the 6.35 mm and XLR output. And I think Hifiman recommend use low impedance headphone on the 3.5 mm and 4.4 mm output and high impedance headphone on the 6.35 mm and XLR output.
Not sure which port you ran the high impedance headphones on but that's my guess. That or maybe this amp has more current rather than voltage.
Though my headphone is Denon D5200 (24 ohm) so I do plan to pick up EF400 eventually. :)
I didn't know that about the different output impedances, but I was using XLR for all tests I think as that's my standard termination on aftermarket cables (I then adapt to 4.4mm if needed)
I think you'll be very happy with the EF400 for your Denons!
@@PassionforSound That's very good to hear! And thank you again for all your amazing and detailed content, it really helps a lot! 🙂
So glad I can help 🙂🙂
Waiting for something like that for ages. Thanks.
My pleasure. I hope it was helpful 🙂🙂
Have you tried the mkii version of the m500? If so, i'd like to know if there is much difference in terms of sound quality vs the mkiii one. And if, in your opinion, the difference in price is justified (around 100$) I'm looking to buy one of them, for the dac alone and sound quality and value are my main focus. Thank you
I haven't tried the Mk II - sorry! There are some significant improvements that they've implemented so I'd expect notable improvements, but I can't say from experience.
@@PassionforSound yes i've seen the spec comparison between both but was wondering if the price difference would be worth it when comparing sound quality only(dac). from what i've red sound signature seems very similar.
Yes. Sorry I can't help more
@@PassionforSound don't have to be sorry. thanks for the reply.
Thank for this...
I using Monitor speakers(hedd) and headphones(beyerdynamic), which is best for me??
I don't know the Hedd monitors and there are many different Beyerdynamic headphones, but I'd choose the SMSL M500 Mk3 for use with headphones and monitors because it allows you to switch them which the EF400 doesn't
@@PassionforSound thank you, i got beyer-T1
They'll go great with the M500 🙂
In terms of sound quality, which would be better if SMSL M500 MKiii is compared to Mojo 2?😇
Mojo 2 will win that one. It performs at the same level as the Bifrost 2. Keep in mind that you get less features with the Mojo 2
🥰I'm waiting for your review of something better than Mojo 2(around 700USD)!
How does this compare to directly plugging into the desktop PC with a modern mid to high end mainboard?
Are they all so much better? (Assume desktop output is more than loud enough)
The sound quality is vastly better from these devices compared to even high quality mainboards. I'd definitely recommend checking one of these out to experience the difference
Thanks for the great review! I wonder if you tried the SABAJ A20d 2022 Version? It seems like the M500 Mk3 with different form, thanks
I haven't tried it - sorry
thanks for your dedication. i am a proud owner of the old version, S.M.S.L m500 mkII. glad to see the mkIII doing well here too. i switch the output often between the headphone and the XLR for my active speakers. i find the little help from the remote control does the job perfectly.
I think I'd probably keep the remote handy for those switches too. Glad you're enjoying the Mk2!
Cheers, another super thorough review! I was excited to see you review the M500 but pitting it against competition just made it all the more interesting.
I guess the M500 would still be my choice if I do buy a unit soon, which may be the case, but I am considering the limited power output limiting my potential headphone choices later. The slightly more cumbersome line out management for desktop speakers also has me thinking. Hmmm...
Thanks Lachlan! ⭐️
So glad I could help. I would personally still choose the M500 out of this lot. There really are only 2-3 headphones it won't suit from a power perspective
@@PassionforSound Thank you, that advice helps. I might just take the plunge on the M500 and I am sure I will be happy with it then 😊 As always, appreciate your passion, approach and dialogue with commenters. 👍
My pleasure. Glad I can help 🙂🙂
I am not a headphone listener but am Interested in the M500 MkIII to use as a DAC. So switching won't be a hassle for me. I am wondering if there are sonic improvements/changes in comparison to the MKII
I haven't compared with the Mk2, but the changes listed in the marketing materials should all make noticeable sonic differences. It's an excellent device IMO
Wow this is awesome. Am sure you must have long sessions with coffee and listening. I have got (thanks to you) bifrost 2 with soloist and ef400. B2 with soloist definitely better sounds to my ears. I really love the laid back nature of ef400 with hifiman headphones. You are 💯 right about running out of volume when i am using the focal clear balanced(again thanks to you) i find the maximum at 9 o clock. That is why am using 6.35 connection.
Glad you enjoyed it and glad I've been able to help with your setup! This one was definitely a long time in preparation and listening sessions, but it was a fascinating journey that didn't go as I expected on multiple occasions
@@PassionforSound I never lost interest while listening to it even the video was long (it's supposed to be long) relevant points. I think a lot of people will get help in deciding from this. I read in one of the forms, a post from official hifiman. They said that if you get a good power supply with this will enhance the quality of the sound. What i love about bifrost is their unison usb that really is silent. I am looking at jitterbug which potentially can bring clear signal to ef400. Not sure if that is going to make any difference.
Also i think many of us(viewers) forget that each device might sound good on it's on but when you start comparing than it is a different game. plus people can get touchy especially if they have bought a unit. They want all praise.
Absolutely! None of these are disappointing on their own, but each has its clear strengths and weaknesses when compared.
Sound wise , bitfrost 2/64 or hifiman EF400 ?
Bifrost 2/64 for sure 🙂
What an incredible comparison mate.! Thank you so much for your efforts.
My pleasure. I'm glad it was helpful 🙂🙂
Hello Lachlan, thank you for an excellent review!
I appreciate this format very much. Direct comparison of multiple devices is much more informative and useful than reviews of individual products. I understand it is logistically difficult but it puts things in actual perspective, which is priceless.
In fact, I would rather wait for, say, a month to get a review like this than to watch individual reviews weekly.
You covered everything relevant, were to a point and presented your findings and evaluations logically, illustratively and clearly. Remarkable job.
One question: what would be your recommendation for a “pure“ DAC (without the amp section) under 500 USD and why?
Thanks
So glad you found it helpful, Lukas. It's very hard to co-ordinate this type of format and it's often just luck (like this one) when the timings all align.
As for the DAC under $500, I'd probably look at the Soncoz SGD-1. I haven't reviewed it yet, but it's a lovely DAC
@@PassionforSound Thanks Lachlan. I will definitely check that one
how is the EF400 with the Susvara ? (i’m now thinking to buy two d’accord/amps, one transportable DAC/PRE/Amp and a great DAC for home, would the EF be good enough to convince my family im not totally nuts to buy those headphones ? ;-)
I think the EF400 is a great device, but I don't think it makes sense to pair the Susvaras with it - you won't be getting the best out of your Susvaras.
what else would work as a transportable system ? those susvara are complicated, did u hear the ZMF caldera yet ? im going to amsterdam soon to test them, there is a shop there that only sells headphones, they even have the orpheus and are getting the he6. a bit far from your home :) anyway, see u on patreon :)
The Calderas will be on their way to me any day now according to Zach (along with my personal pair of Atriums 🎉)
I can't think of too many transportable systems (other than the Hugo 2) that will beat the Mojo 2. iFi make products like the Gryphon and Diablo, but I don't know that they'll match the Mojo 2 for SQ (they're just more powerful)
Thanks for joining the community on Patreon! Chat to you more there 🙂🙂
sir how does ef400 compare with mojo 2? esp running the arya stealth
I haven't directly compared, but the Mojo 2 is at the level (DAC-wise) as the Bifrost 2 so it will best the EF400 and it has sufficient power to drive the Aryas just fine
thanks you so much for your reply. really appreciate your review. it’s very well said. your voice is so relaxing! 😊
My pleasure. Glad you like the reviews!
Where does the Chord Mojo 2 stand between all of this as an DAC/Amp both?
It's better than any of these in terms of sound quality. Power output and form factor are obviously potential deal breakers for some people though.
Thanks for the extensive reviews man, Topping L50 and E50 stack vs ef400, what would be better you think?
That's a really tough one. I'm not sure and don't currently have time to check. I think the EF400 would be better on pure sound quality because the L50 isn't the best amp around (the E50 is a brilliant DAC). The EF400's lesser performance with higher impedance headphones could be a factor though
@@PassionforSound Thanks for the input!
Does the EF400 come with USB cables to connect to phone computer or tablet?
I can't recall. I think it comes with only USB-A to USB-B, but a USB-C to USB-B cable is all you'd need to buy to solve that. 🙂
Really great video,thanks !
My pleasure!
Would these options perform well with a Meze Elite? Thanks!
Any of these would do fine with the Elites, but they can do even better as I mentioned in a different reply to you. 🙂
@@PassionforSound Yes sir, thank you once again! 🙏
Where does something like the mojo fit into this. Does it get 50-80% of any of these in sq and what shares the most similarity with it
The Mojo performs on a different level because it's on par with the Bifrost 2 as a DAC. The amp is significantly less powerful than these all-in-ones and it's less ergonomic as a desktop solution, but I think it sounds better than any of these (assuming you're not trying to drive a crazy difficult headphone like a Susvara or maybe Stealth/Expanse)
Lachlan, I sold my Topping D90SE, still have the A90 amp which I can either sell (and buy the SA-1) or keep since it’s very powerful. Would you recommend the EF400 or should I get a Musician Pegasus or Denafrips Ares II?
I've actually got the Pegasus here for review soon, Billy, and I think it's maybe better than the Ares II. I haven't done thorough listening, but will get to it soonish. They both perform beyond the EF400 by a fair margin though.
It's worth remembering that the A90 is part of your overall sound though and the SA-1 is a better amp IMO, but also might not need the extra smoothness of an R2R DAC. Have you considered the updated Bifrost 2 and a Singxer SA-1?
@@PassionforSound, 😱 did I read your mind or a coincidence? It’s great I’m your Patron so I get to see it first. Online shops here have a sale every month (9.9, 10.10 next) and we’re having the Great Singapore Sale to coincide with F1 in Singapore so I may just get the Pegasus and use it with my A90 until I sell it which I will then consider the SA-1 ($819) or iFi iCAN Signature ($2,945). Your recommendations are always excellent and you probably knew I like warmer sounds hence I sold the D90SE. I’d read that the Pegasus ($1,499) is more musical than Ares II ($1,149).
There are some concerns about the QC of Musician Pegasus (but I’ve also read that they do running-in at the factory, not sure true or just marketing), voiced by 2 reviewers and some buyers’ experiences online about their units going horribly wrong, I hope those problems are fixed. Denafrips distributor is in Singapore and the owner Alvin is a nice guy who can service Denafrips but I’m not sure about Musician Audio’s support and service here though. Just want to be able to get help if I face a problem.
As for the Singxer SA-1, I’d probably get it after I sell the A90 or get the iFi iCAN Signature, to pair with the Pegasus. I’m not sure if Bifrost has a distributor here though as I mostly purchase from the online shops of actual stereo shops. I know you don’t do iFi products but the iFi iDSD Pro ($4,200) and iCAN Pro signature ($2,945) series are circling in my mind but this combo will cost me my headphone budget for an Atrium and Elite or Empyrean. The hybrid and tube options with its legendary X-Bass and X-Space are very tempting on the iCAN Signature but it’s more than double the price of the SA-1. Perhaps, pairing the Pegasus with the SA-1 would be good enough that I don’t need to spend so much for the iFI stack and still get an Atrium lol this hobby can be stressful…
I'd forgotten you were in Singapore. That might make getting Schiit a little trickier, but you might be able to order direct.
I would definitely be concerned about the longevity and service with the Pegasus as my unit had an issue and it's being repaired by a friend because Musician were very slow to reply to my emails and then have gone completely silent ☹️
How much is Pontus 2 compared to the Pegasus? I'm hoping to try a Pontus 2 soon and that might be a better option
Lachlan, I searched and there’s no authorized distributor for Schitt here. Also, different voltage in US (120V) and Singapore (230V). I’d prefer not to buy direct because if I have a problem, I’ll have to send to manufacturer when service is needed, the freight may be costly too and then, it’s not viable anymore. We do have individuals who imports and sell some products not represented here but they are giving their own personal warranty and I do not trust that unless it’s from a reputable company who’s products are “safe” ie. excellent QC, a product not known to be problematic such as the Focal headphones I bought.
Ooh, your unit has issue too? I know nobody who can fix problems for me and hell, I may not know if my unit has a problem and would appreciate a service Centre that I can at least have it checked, even if it means paying a service fee. Now, adding your unit to the others that I had mentioned, it sounds like fault rates are high for Musician Audio. If it’s only the Pegasus model, then perhaps I can consider another model but the increase in price may just drive me to pay more to get other brands or compromised the musicality and get Denafrips or Ladder instead.
The others whom had problems with their Pegasus didn’t get replies too and 2 cases where the unit was sent to China went missing mysteriously. 1 case was more exasperating because the owner was told to declare the product value at US$20 or something along this line so even with insurance, he was screwed.
As a business consultant and C-level executives’ coach, it is very frustrating for me to see companies with good products and demand not taking their businesses seriously and only wants the short term gains. They lack meaningful missions, integrity and ethics, poor QC, cut corners, services and supports, customer care, false/misleading marketing messages, not caring for or training employees, etc… are all just very sad. If I get to sit down with these businessmen as a consultant, I’ll tell them off. Anyway, I read that “some” brands “stole ideas” and enticed manufacturers who made goos products for a brand to make for them by copying with minimal differences and then call it their own. I believe you know what I mean.
@@PassionforSound, Denafrips Pontus 2 is $2,449. Listing prices of the others in case anyone reading is interested to know.Prices in Singapore dollars since it’s about the sa,e as AUD$. Denafrips Ares II $1,149, Venus 2 $4,149.
Musician Audio Draco $1,039, Pegasus $1,499, Aquarius $4,299. Maybe Gustard R26 at $2,349 is worth considering? Price wise, it’s closed to Pontus 2.
Meanwhile, maybe I’ll get the iFi xDXD Gryphon first since the Hifiman EF400 is not that impressive. I had wanted to send you the iFi Zen DAC V2 but the postage and all may not make it worthwhile.
Thank you for this. My headphones are HiFiMan Edition XS (18Ω). I bought a Topping EX5 to drive them and it's OK. Beautifully clear and precise for quiet passages but kind of underwhelming when the music does something punchy. I've got an m500 mkIII arriving tomorrow to try out, as many reviewers said it sounds more dynamic or powerful. I also like the design of both of these models. But now I'm intrigued about the EF400. If it's designed for low impedance headphones, and possibly HiFiMan's own then it may be the best combo. The classic no features, no remote attitude is a plus for me.
Glad it was a helpful review! See how you go with the M500 and some of its feature - it's a great device. If you still want more, the EF400 is a touch better again, particularly if you like the simple, classic design.
@@PassionforSound It arrived and it's great! It produces the satisfying, punchy sound that the EX5 did not. To be fair reviewers already said don't buy the EX5 to use with the Edition XS. The m500 drives them beautifully. I found what I was looking for at the price range, don't see myself going for Arya and high end sources any time soon, but I'll see if I can get a listen of the EF400. It even has a passive transformer and you have to buy the right voltage :)
Sadly, the issue with the EX5 isn't the Edition XS - it's just how the EX5 sounds. The M500 though? A wonderfully different story. Glad you're enjoying it
Thanks for the review. After watching the review, I plan to buy the SMSL M500 MK3. I went to local store (Singapore) to ask a few questions but the sales staff were not able to answer.
Here are the questions, please help:
- Is the 4.4mm headphone plug of SMSL M500 MK3 balanced?
- I am owning the Sony WM1AM2 DAP, I would like to know whether I can connect it to the M500 as my music sources. (FYI, The WM1AM2 is working when connected to Chord Mojo II. But it is not working when connected to Fiio K9 Pro ESS).
Thanks in advance 🙏🏼
I can't answer the question about the DAP because they're all different. As for the 4.4mm output, it's not a truly balanced output, but it's not really relevant. As long as you have sufficient power and the sound quality is good (which it is), balanced vs SE really makes no difference for headphone outputs
@@PassionforSound Thank you 🙏🏼
What is best for mix mastering also on Sennheiser 560s headphones I decided to get them headphones as I heard they were very neutral and detailed. Also can you record into the topping dx7 pro plus
None of these will take inputs for recording as an ADC - you'd need a digital interface like a Scarlett 2i2 or similar for that. As for the best option for the HD560s, I'd happily take any of these for that use and would therefore base the decision on the features you want and the sound quality that seems most appealing based on what I've described (and others too if you check out more reviews).
Personally, I think the SMSL M500 Mk3 is hard to go past for your needs.
I heard of othercreviews that M500 has a great dac but an weak amp that makes it sound thin. Seems that you don't agree with this .
Yep, that's not my take at all. One possible theory is that those people saw the relatively modest power output and decided based on a number rather than by using their ears.
@@PassionforSound Thankyou.
For R2R DACs, Cayin RU6 or EF400 or BiFrost 2? IEMs 70% of time on the go, and HE6se v2 30% of time at home. Thanks!
If you're mostly on the go then the RU6 is kind of the only choice. I'd get that and then a nice amp to connect it to when you're at home.
@@PassionforSound thanks! I do have a nice integrated amp with gobs of power I use to drive the HE6sev2. Do you think the sound from the RU6 competes well with the EF400, or is the EF400 a big enough step up to warrant buying both?
I haven't heard them side-by-side because the RU6 was on loan and went back ages ago. Sorry I can't help on that one.
This reivew is awesome .
Wouldo be nice a review of Xduoo TA-22.
I do like me some xDuoo. I'll see what opportunities arise...
For the k9 pro I want to pair it with a gustard p26 preamp and run 2 focal alpha twin evo active monitors will the k9 pro be a good option for a 2 ch setup
It should do a really nice job. You could probably do the same for less by getting a dedicated DAC without all the extra features and amp, but it depends on your needs
Been waiting for this one!
Me toooooo! 🍿😄
Hope it proves to be worth the wait 🙂🙂
I ordered an EF400 because I liked the look and simplistic nature of it, I'll be mainly using my Clear MGs with it. I'm afraid I might regret it, but still excited to see how it sounds when it comes. I have a BTR7 for bluetooth and features/portability, so just looking for pure desktop sound quality. Thanks for the amazing comparison.
You're in for a treat if you're using it as an upgrade from the BTR7 (which is good for a portable device). Enjoy!
how's it fairing?
@@CrackaSlapYa Very nicely! I can definitely tell a difference in clarity and punch from the BTR7, which I still use a good amount of the time with the Clear MGs but it's definitely a luxury to get time to sit down and listen with the EF400. Happy with the purchase.
@@abratskeller awesome.
That's great news! Happy listening 🙂
Excellent comparison review. Well done.
So glad you liked it!
You mentioned there was a spectrum of sound from more lush/musical to more analytical - and that the EF400, DX7 Pro+ and M500 all sat quite close together but with EF400 being more lush, the DX7 Pro+ being more analytical, and the M500 being in the middle (and closer to the DX7 Pro+).
Well, where would a Schiit Jotunheim sit on this continuum? Would it be more towards the lush side than even the EF400 is?
The original Jotunheim is fairly neutral I think, but the Jot 2 would go more towards the EF400 end.
Quite an undertaking there, Lachlan, well done for completing it so efficiently. Before watching this I had the expectation that the M500 would be a strong candidate for winning overall and so I agree with your conclusion. Interestingly, neither its DAC unit nor its amp are solely/mostly responsible for M500's performance which is what such a unit should be designed to do. My only question woule be what are all those versions of M500 (MK 1 - 3) signify: debugging or marketing strategy?
Glad you liked the video. I have no idea why we get so many new releases from Topping and SMSL. My assumption is that it's because people keep buying the latest and greatest so I guess that makes it a marketing strategy (or response)
All the versions have hardware improvements like they upgraded the HPA and power the first time, now there are additional improvements such as sound processing.
I think the question here though is whether or not the "improvements" are always actually improvements. Certainly, the M500 Mk3 brought some significant upgrades by using the 8 channels of the DAC chips instead of only 2, but many times it's such a minor change that a lot of these Topping and SMSL devices are interchangeable and redundant
@@PassionforSound I guess I will patiently have to wait awhile and watch for the true white whale to emerge, along with your reviews hightlighting things along the way like the Supra Exchaliber cable.
You should be a hypnotherapist. I need 3 coffees to keep myself awake.
Not sure if that's good or bad so I'll just say thanks for watching 🙂
Was wondering what the Fiio sounds like via balanced XLR to a pair of studio monitors like the Dynaudio BM15A's ??
The DAC in the K9 Pro ESS is excellent so you'll get fantastic performance with powered monitors
@@PassionforSound thanks 🙂
Very good review man!🤘🏽
Thank you! So glad you liked it 🙂🙂
Pulled the trigger and bought the EF400 to pair with my Aryas, thanks for your insight.
My pleasure. Enjoy the great combination!
@@PassionforSound I believe for the price and the pairing with the Ayra. its probably the best pairing In going to find at the price.
It would definitely be very hard to beat for the same money. Indeed, nothing springs to mind for me.
I added the Singxer SA1 to the EF400 as an amp and it really gives my Ayras a fuller sound in the low end and smooths out the treble peaks really well. I really like the EF400 as an dac paired with the SA1
That would be a lovely combo!
MAN passion! me use m500 mk3 + SMSL H300 + hifiman Ananda =sound combination is very good, bass and quality😉😉
Thanks so much for this review, I've been hoping to see a nice breakdown of the M500 Mk3 as I've been drooling over it for a couple weeks now. Up till now, my only experience with a dedicated DAC or amp is my Earmen Sparrow (and I got a second one of those for my wife). I've been looking for a nice versatile desktop upgrade, and the M500 really does look like it fits the bill.
EarMen Sparrow is great! If you enjoy its sound, I think you'll like the M500 Mk3 too
would M500 mk3 be good enough for Focal Creal original?
It would be good enough to be enjoyable, for sure. The Clears can sound even better with higher level gear, but that's no reason to avoid the M500 which will still sound great with the Clears
if I use Mojo 2 as a dac, how it is compare to MX500, in term sound quality alone
I haven't compared them directly, but knowing that the Mojo 2 is on the same level as the Schiit Bifrost 2 and none of these devices reached that level, I'd say the Mojo 2 will be comfortably better
@@PassionforSound Thank you friend appreciate it
Awesome. Thanks. I was myself considering one of these all-in-one, but in the end I bought a Topping D30 Pro/A30 Pro combo + XLR cable. Very happy with the performance.
Separates are always a slightly better choice IMO. Glad you're enjoying them
How is it compared with m500 mk2?
I don't own the Mk2 to test this - sorry
I wanted a desktop dac/headphone amp for my iems, og clairvoyance, og monarch, og oracle to name a few. Have a few daps including m6 pro, two r3 Sabre pro, and q1. Used jriver and foobar in asio and waspi from full .wav quality songs. Had k9pro ess, used via coaxial and optical and my main issue was its sound. It runs lean which is what I prefer for iem usage but is it does not have a full note quality. It cuts short the note and does not have a fullness to its notes. Also i did not get any of that deep "ghetto" bass that it should be able to produce. For instance on Warren g regulate it has that deep ghetto bass rumble. The k9 pro is unable to produce it. It should be there when called upon but just completely missing. K9 pro is for "audiophile" Bluetooth lovers looking to step up to their next level.
I agree 100% about the lack of note weight and the muted nature of the sound of the K9 Pro. It's amazing when used as a DAC so this is a case of the FiiO amp design restricting its performance which is a shame. ☹️
The EF400 R2R Himalaya DAC is awesome. It's actually even better sounding going to another amp like the LYR3
Yes, a separate amp can give the DAC a bit of a boost 🙂
While I would prefer there to be a simple switch on the front to switch between line out and headphone out on the M500, you *can* setup the remote to switch between outputs with one press of the FN button. That seems to be the easiest way to do it.
Good point! That would be an easy way to do it if you're happy using the remote
@@PassionforSound It seems to be the quickest and easiest approach. If it wasn't for that, I would probably not even use the remote at all, as I'm using it as a desktop DAC. It's a minor annoyance with an otherwise stellar piece of hardware.
At 35:09 he mentions something that sounds like "i squared s" which sounds like a 'thing' that you plug into the DX7 Pro+ to make it sound 'more refined'...? What is "i squared s"?
That's actually exactly what I said 😁
IIS or I2S or I²S is a transmission protocol (like, USB, optical, coax, etc.) that often uses an HDMI connector (but it's not HDMI transmission protocols).
It's benefit is that it separates the timing information from the audio signal data (many protocols merge these together) and it tends to produce a cleaner, more refined sound in my experience
Nice, you dropped this as I set down with my dinner
I imagine an SNL skit w Will Ferrell telling his family to shutup at the dinner table while watching this review
🥗🥘🥙
Does the single ended output of the EF400 have enough juice for low impedance, but insensitive headphones like the Hifiman Arya (non-stealth) or the AKG K702?
And can it drive the HD800s with authority?
The SE output can drive pretty much any headphone (I didn't test with Susvara). As for the HD800, as I discussed in the video, it CAN drive them but doesn't sound it's best with some high impedance headphones and I'm not sure why.
That was a super quick 53 minutes. I feel like I just sat down to watch. Nice review.
I'm so pleased to hear that! I always try to keep the content as relevant and well-paced as I can so it's wonderful to hear that this extra long video didn't drag 🙂
I'm sold on the M500 MKIII! Where to buy in Australia?
I didn't find any local sellers when I did a brief search, but there's a global link in the description which will take you to HiFiGo.
Great choice by the way! 🙂
Nice round up. It didn't came as that big of a suprise to me. iiwi reviews has similar taste with you and he loves m500 mkii. to the point that he sold his denafrips ares ii. not because m500 was better but he thought it was close enough. It would be great if you could get your hands on a Yulong Da-art Aurora all in one. It has it's quirks like no gain settings but it has a very powerful class A amp and nice features like rca line in which you can use with turn tables and other dacs. I'm using my unit for a few months now and absolutely loving it. Zeos also reviewed it today but probably couldn't find the dac/pre switch :D
The Aurora certainly sounds interesting. I've not yet got a contact to access Yulong gear, but I'll see what might pop up.
Curious how a Burson Soloist would fare. Clear winner or no?
The Soloist is a pure amp so not really a fair comparison. The Conductor is their all-in-one and would likely be the strongest of the bunch, but also the most expensive too.
@@PassionforSound ah. Thanks for the clarification. Im rocking the K9 Pro and it does quite well for me.
Can you review Sabaj A20 D ?
I'll see if it gets offered to me for review - all depends on if I can get one 🙂
How would you compare these amp/dacs to the IFI IDSD Signature amp/dac
I can't unfortunately because I haven't heard the iFi gear due to some local distributor issues :(
I am looking to get a new DAC/amp combo unit and i have no clue what to get i use sennheiser HD599 headphones and i dont want a DAC that sounds too cold clinical or flat but i dont want something that sounds like its under water either i am looking for a middle ground just like the HD599 are
LOL. I just linked this video in your last comment. I'd be going for the M500 or EF400 depending on what features you need.
Thanks for the great video👍 Have the EF400. Beautiful in OS mode 4 pin XLR low gain with the Ananda SE. In NOS a bit muddy to my ears. Have the feeling that it does not drive the HE6seV2 to his potential. Waiting for my Burson Conductor 3X GT😀
You'll love the 3XGT! Big upgrade even though the EF400 is lovely
I haven't compared the SE properly with the OG yet, but maybe linknet can answer...
Sorry i never had the OG...
@@PassionforSoundvery detailed comparison video !
Btw , I got the D9200 with the EF400 , it sound pretty well together , but if I wanted to upgrade for more ,
Do you think I can reuse the dac of the EF400 and buy a pure Amplifier like Violectric V222 or ifi pro ican
Or do you think I should consider a dac amp combo all in one like ifi pro iDSD signature or Burson Conductor ,
since I also got some DSD files , but the EF400 only provides PCM …
But it surprisingly doesn’t sound too much different at all which I transfer DSD to PCM instead of DoP in AK240 .
The EF400 is fine, but I do think you can do better so perhaps start with an amp upgrade knowing that you might then upgrade the DAC in the future too. You can always get another all-in-one, but they are somewhat limiting in terms of upgrade paths so just consider your future possible steps before deciding.
Can the M500 MK3 adequately drive the ananda stealth?
Absolutely! It's a great option.
Tremendous video. Thank you!!!
So glad you liked it! 🙂🙂
Thanks!
Lol😅
@Gilreynard I missed your super thanks when you gifted it. Thank you and sorry that it didn't come up in my feed to reply to!
Will all of these work with iOS, ie an iPhone through the Camera Kit apple dongle method?
It’s my preferred way to stream high rez tidal but I have struck out sending a signal to some devices, e.g. JDS Labs element.
I can't test that for you because I'm not an Apple user, but I would expect them to all work well because they're all driverless with Windows which would suggest a fairly easy USB interface
What amp pairing would you recommend for the EF400? Sub $500? Sub $1000?
I'd probably look at something like a Jotunheim 2, Singxer SA-1, or Geshelli E2 to give you a few options
Would you recommend Sennheiser Hdv820 amplifier or Fiio K9 pro ESS for Sennheiser Hd800s ?? Thanks
I haven't tried the HDV820 yet, but will be reviewing it soon as part of my review of the HD820 so stay tuned on that one...