Stans of any celebrity can be toxic and unwilling to accept wrongdoings and nuance, Taylor Swift stans included. That's why I like the UA-cam channel Swiftologist, which is one of the only places on the internet where you can find a fair balance of love for Taylor and criticism. Nobody is perfect, even our faves, and sometimes that needs acknowledgement.
I saw him in a video saying he was bored of the Ethan, Ariana, Dalton etc. saga. He said his position had softened and why does "everyone" care so much? Seemed to me this indicated Swiftie involvment in this quite nasty smear campaign. If he thinks everyone cares so much and he is around a lot of swifties it must mean there is a connection. Looking at his earlier video he was definitely involved himself calling Ethan "trash" and saying Ariana should "seek help". Atleast he has seen some sense now to soften his position. Maybe he got caught up with much harsher people around and thought he was being more nuanced then he actually was. We all probably said things we shouldn't have but it really is bad to be regurgitating stuff from page 6 that is clearly a smear campaign designed to harm. It is really quite nasty with wider targets.
You see this is the problem. Y'all know that this love is unhealthy and unsettling, but Y'all still double down on it instead of being introspective. What makes her more special than others?
@@IWantToMature85 I don't think there is necessarily anything "unhealthy" or "unsettling" about being a swiftie. Nor does being a swiftie imply a lack of introspection. I am a 65 yo male philosopher who loves a wide range of music from virtually every genera and decade and I also happen to be a swiftie in the sense that I love (or at least enjoy to some extent) virtually all of Taylor's music and I believe that she is, at core, a good person (not perfect, but essentially a well-intentioned person who shares my values). I am somewhat of an expert on the lore surrounding her life, and I have to admit that I tend to root for her like I might root for my favorite football team (I grew up as a Vikings fan), or Team USA in Olympic events. I get a thrill from knowing that she is breaking records on a historic/global scale. In a casual way I can see how I might seem "cultish" but I don't see any of this as being unhealthy. I simply enjoy her music, love her public persona, and I enjoy rooting for her. None of this disrupts my life or does any harm to anyone. What makes her "more special"? Probably nothing in particular, but I do see her as being a "perfect storm" of qualities that appeal to me - and, apparently, I'm not the only one. By virtually every objectively measurable sign of someone being a person of tremendous cultural and potentially historical significance, Taylor is on a trajectory to becoming a household name that will remain a household name for centuries. If she keeps writing songs, making movies, donating vast sums of wealth, and transforming industries at anything close to her current pace, it's hard to even imagine how far she could go over the next 40 to 50 years. As a philosopher who has deep interests in sociology, psychology, and anthropology, I find Taylor and her fans to be a fascinating phenomenon. I fully understand that some people will never like her music, and that's fine. There's no accounting for subjective tastes. But I often see people claiming (without ever offering any empirical evidence or logical arguments) that she "has no talent" and/or "only writes bubblegum pop songs", etc. and here I can say that, by every reasonable measure, these people are simply ignorant and/or blinded by their own personal issues.
@@gaylenwoofThank you so much for appreciating Taylor Swift for who she really is and thank you for appreciating her music. I love her so much and love all her songs. I came to this podcast by the suggestion of another massive Swifte and pocaster Anna - she and her best friend Jessi have that beautiful podcast TSPN which I watch every Friday. And it’s my favorite podcast.
As a Swiftie, I am here for this!! Taylor has built this relationship with her fans by being active online and interacting for most of her career up to her self chosen disappearance in 2016/2017. Add in the secret sessions, before/after concert meet up (OMG an invite to the T party would be AHHHH!), and how often she is seen making time to meet & greet. She has built this world for Swifties to live in and it is so easy to let yourself get lost in it. I also have to agree that some people take it too far, but I feel like the majority of us are rational humans, maybe prone to over reactions of excitement now and then. but overall pretty balanced and grounded in reality.
Also, I think the Beyhive (Beyoncé) would make for a great episode as well. I feel like even the most die-hard Swiftie can't compete with the Beyhive devotion.
hehehhehehe LOVED YOUR GUYS' EPISODE!!! Honestly I love that us swifties can roast ourselves when we get a lil too crazy because we DEFINITELY do 🤪 thanks for the shoutout girls!! I got a lot of texts today about my mention on your pod so I had to check it out🥰 Love what you're doing, keep it up! ❤
wait wait wait...I just discovered this podcast today and yesterday I finished "cultish, the language of fanaticism" I didn't know the author had a podcast! I gasped when I heard it was her!
Omg wish I could listen to a fresh take on this after witnessing the fans that stood for four hours straight, in Nashville, in storms, waiting to *possibly* still see her. And the way they’ve trauma bonded over it on Tiktok.
I tweeted this the other day. She has created a deep bond with her fans and is a marketing genius. She works with an amazing team. It's definitely not done by herself. Also, I agree people who are her stans can't separate the fact that she's a celebrity with the fact that she's also human and can be wrong. In fact, she probably has totally different views than what she portrays online. I stopped calling myself any stan name (directioner, lovatic, swifty, whatever) because I have matured and now understand that I am a human being who simply likes music, not a robot with a sticker on my forehead telling me how I should indefinitely support someone I've never met in my entire life. Love this episode. Lots of love
I’m a swiftie and yes I will defend her to the death when it’s needed (for example the Kanye feud where he was clearly so in the wrong and painting her in a totally unfair light n got the whole world to hate her) but I am also the first to call her out on her bullshit when it’s justified and feel disappointment when she does do wrong. I also don’t care if people don’t like her music or her. But for every swiftie there is a hardcore Taylor swift hater who has genuine, heated hate for her for NO reason/bc she’s a woman who lots of girls love/based on media lies which is even weirder to me. Putting energy into loving someone makes sense, but hating them?? I think those people are far more concerning than die hard swifties 😂😭
Got an unalive threat once for my Carcass shirt (which shows the beginnings of brain surgery with two scalpels in two surgeon hands, gender left ambiguous on the artist part) saying it was Taylor Erm, no it is not
i think the rating should be somewhere between live your life and watch your back bc real damage has been done to others bc of the fandom...and future damage could happen...don't underestimate fandoms 😅
I would suggest you to give folklore and evermore a chance (if you'd like to obviously). They are very different albums from any other project of hers. Most of it is fictional, and the producers really did some magic
The personality cult around Taylor Swift is becoming more and more disturbing every day. When she figures out how much *power* she has - and that's not only a possibility; it's *likely* - things could get very ugly very quickly. Especially considering being a victim is her whole schtick. "This guy was unfair to me and we broke up. Poor me." "This guy interrupted me at the VMAs, poor me." "People online are being mean to me. Poor me." "This friend is a backstabber. Poor me." And people *eat this shit up.*
So I have to go back thought your two's whole previous work to find out with "Live you Life" means relative to cults? COULDN'T YOU DO A FAQ? It sound to me like it means cult-like but does not occupy your whole life if you are a member. But how about that FAQ. You two are smart, clever, and sorry cute. So, all the best. Thanks for expanding my vocabulary with Cheugy .
@@claire.chiste actually the point is when most people talk about taylor the simple mindset all of them has is she writes about her ex, she picks on fight with others and write about it, her music is white trash, she writes for 14 year old girls, she sings for white blonde girls, she is a white supremist, all of her song sounds same, some even goes to make a point that her parents served her a career in a holden plate, she doesn't write her own stuffs etc. They often listens to just to the singles off her album (such as me, shake it off, yntcd) and judge her entire artistry. Though some of the people are gradually changing their mindset after the release of folklore and evermore. But still most people don't admire her because of her music and how it affects the listener and how we relate to her.
Nobody actually wants to see Detroit. Yes, it has gotten a bit better but actual Detroit is still mostly a nightmare. All the rotting and abadonded buldings and murder lucking throughout. I only go sometimes and for things I really want to see or do. I have been robbed twice so maybe that has something to do with my feelings on Detroit proper and even some areas Detroit adjacent.
@marniekilbourne608 I live in Detroit, not in the central business district and in what could be considered a "rough neighborhood". As for the buildings, the city's Blight Patrol has done insane things already. Just this week I drove down what was previously an abandoned street and saw multiple urban tree farms, homes being renovated, and a new elementary school being built. The city has also identified 11 districts in need to focus on first. We just got brand new LED street lights in our district. People want to be here, even if you don't 🤷♀️
Y’all can do a whole miniseries on music fandoms and I would be fully tuned in. That rabbit hole runs deep.
#neurodivergentswifties!
Just found you through Morgans podcast, such fun themes ❤❤❤
Stans of any celebrity can be toxic and unwilling to accept wrongdoings and nuance, Taylor Swift stans included. That's why I like the UA-cam channel Swiftologist, which is one of the only places on the internet where you can find a fair balance of love for Taylor and criticism. Nobody is perfect, even our faves, and sometimes that needs acknowledgement.
ahhh. I love him too!
yes the Swiftologist is such a slay! his podcast is really good too
swift ologist was the first thing I thought about I started this video, lol
glad to see all the swiftologist fans have gathered in this comment thread !
I saw him in a video saying he was bored of the Ethan, Ariana, Dalton etc. saga. He said his position had softened and why does "everyone" care so much? Seemed to me this indicated Swiftie involvment in this quite nasty smear campaign. If he thinks everyone cares so much and he is around a lot of swifties it must mean there is a connection. Looking at his earlier video he was definitely involved himself calling Ethan "trash" and saying Ariana should "seek help". Atleast he has seen some sense now to soften his position. Maybe he got caught up with much harsher people around and thought he was being more nuanced then he actually was. We all probably said things we shouldn't have but it really is bad to be regurgitating stuff from page 6 that is clearly a smear campaign designed to harm. It is really quite nasty with wider targets.
Is she culty? Of course! Am I still her biggest fan? Also of course!
You see this is the problem. Y'all know that this love is unhealthy and unsettling, but Y'all still double down on it instead of being introspective. What makes her more special than others?
@@IWantToMature85 I don't think there is necessarily anything "unhealthy" or "unsettling" about being a swiftie. Nor does being a swiftie imply a lack of introspection. I am a 65 yo male philosopher who loves a wide range of music from virtually every genera and decade and I also happen to be a swiftie in the sense that I love (or at least enjoy to some extent) virtually all of Taylor's music and I believe that she is, at core, a good person (not perfect, but essentially a well-intentioned person who shares my values). I am somewhat of an expert on the lore surrounding her life, and I have to admit that I tend to root for her like I might root for my favorite football team (I grew up as a Vikings fan), or Team USA in Olympic events. I get a thrill from knowing that she is breaking records on a historic/global scale.
In a casual way I can see how I might seem "cultish" but I don't see any of this as being unhealthy. I simply enjoy her music, love her public persona, and I enjoy rooting for her. None of this disrupts my life or does any harm to anyone.
What makes her "more special"? Probably nothing in particular, but I do see her as being a "perfect storm" of qualities that appeal to me - and, apparently, I'm not the only one. By virtually every objectively measurable sign of someone being a person of tremendous cultural and potentially historical significance, Taylor is on a trajectory to becoming a household name that will remain a household name for centuries. If she keeps writing songs, making movies, donating vast sums of wealth, and transforming industries at anything close to her current pace, it's hard to even imagine how far she could go over the next 40 to 50 years. As a philosopher who has deep interests in sociology, psychology, and anthropology, I find Taylor and her fans to be a fascinating phenomenon.
I fully understand that some people will never like her music, and that's fine. There's no accounting for subjective tastes. But I often see people claiming (without ever offering any empirical evidence or logical arguments) that she "has no talent" and/or "only writes bubblegum pop songs", etc. and here I can say that, by every reasonable measure, these people are simply ignorant and/or blinded by their own personal issues.
Is it true if i say something negative about Taylor you'll find me and murder me at my house???? Just curious.
@@gaylenwoofThank you so much for appreciating Taylor Swift for who she really is and thank you for appreciating her music. I love her so much and love all her songs. I came to this podcast by the suggestion of another massive Swifte and pocaster Anna - she and her best friend Jessi have that beautiful podcast TSPN which I watch every Friday. And it’s my favorite podcast.
As a Swiftie, I am here for this!! Taylor has built this relationship with her fans by being active online and interacting for most of her career up to her self chosen disappearance in 2016/2017. Add in the secret sessions, before/after concert meet up (OMG an invite to the T party would be AHHHH!), and how often she is seen making time to meet & greet. She has built this world for Swifties to live in and it is so easy to let yourself get lost in it. I also have to agree that some people take it too far, but I feel like the majority of us are rational humans, maybe prone to over reactions of excitement now and then. but overall pretty balanced and grounded in reality.
#neurodivergentswifties!
Also, I think the Beyhive (Beyoncé) would make for a great episode as well. I feel like even the most die-hard Swiftie can't compete with the Beyhive devotion.
@JustanotherEmmaInSwedenSWIFTIN I also thought about K-pop fans (BTS specifically)!! Harry Styles was on my list as well :)
hehehhehehe LOVED YOUR GUYS' EPISODE!!! Honestly I love that us swifties can roast ourselves when we get a lil too crazy because we DEFINITELY do 🤪 thanks for the shoutout girls!! I got a lot of texts today about my mention on your pod so I had to check it out🥰 Love what you're doing, keep it up! ❤
Love how the comments just prove your points.. 😂
wait wait wait...I just discovered this podcast today and yesterday I finished "cultish, the language of fanaticism" I didn't know the author had a podcast! I gasped when I heard it was her!
I am listening to this while scrolling on twitter. Swifties losing it after Taylor x Joe break up rumor.
Omg wish I could listen to a fresh take on this after witnessing the fans that stood for four hours straight, in Nashville, in storms, waiting to *possibly* still see her. And the way they’ve trauma bonded over it on Tiktok.
I tweeted this the other day. She has created a deep bond with her fans and is a marketing genius. She works with an amazing team. It's definitely not done by herself. Also, I agree people who are her stans can't separate the fact that she's a celebrity with the fact that she's also human and can be wrong. In fact, she probably has totally different views than what she portrays online. I stopped calling myself any stan name (directioner, lovatic, swifty, whatever) because I have matured and now understand that I am a human being who simply likes music, not a robot with a sticker on my forehead telling me how I should indefinitely support someone I've never met in my entire life. Love this episode. Lots of love
I’m a swiftie and yes I will defend her to the death when it’s needed (for example the Kanye feud where he was clearly so in the wrong and painting her in a totally unfair light n got the whole world to hate her) but I am also the first to call her out on her bullshit when it’s justified and feel disappointment when she does do wrong.
I also don’t care if people don’t like her music or her. But for every swiftie there is a hardcore Taylor swift hater who has genuine, heated hate for her for NO reason/bc she’s a woman who lots of girls love/based on media lies which is even weirder to me. Putting energy into loving someone makes sense, but hating them?? I think those people are far more concerning than die hard swifties 😂😭
Got an unalive threat once for my Carcass shirt (which shows the beginnings of brain surgery with two scalpels in two surgeon hands, gender left ambiguous on the artist part) saying it was Taylor
Erm, no it is not
i think the rating should be somewhere between live your life and watch your back bc real damage has been done to others bc of the fandom...and future damage could happen...don't underestimate fandoms 😅
Never listened to a TS song, prob never will. I do see her mentioned all over the web. Carly Simon, Alanis M., Carole King, etc more my speed.
I would suggest you to give folklore and evermore a chance (if you'd like to obviously). They are very different albums from any other project of hers. Most of it is fictional, and the producers really did some magic
As a swiftie I can wholeheartedly say that NO we wouldn´t . No matter what. Period. We love her but we are not insane.
Read your own words. They sound insane.
Nope, you definitely *are* insane.
The personality cult around Taylor Swift is becoming more and more disturbing every day. When she figures out how much *power* she has - and that's not only a possibility; it's *likely* - things could get very ugly very quickly. Especially considering being a victim is her whole schtick. "This guy was unfair to me and we broke up. Poor me." "This guy interrupted me at the VMAs, poor me." "People online are being mean to me. Poor me." "This friend is a backstabber. Poor me."
And people *eat this shit up.*
So I have to go back thought your two's whole previous work to find out with "Live you Life" means relative to cults? COULDN'T YOU DO A FAQ? It sound to me like it means cult-like but does not occupy your whole life if you are a member. But how about that FAQ. You two are smart, clever, and sorry cute. So, all the best. Thanks for expanding my vocabulary with Cheugy .
I LOVE HER SM MIDNIGHTS IS OUT IN 2 DAYS I CANT DIWHWINSJA
Taylor is our little overachiever! It's why we love her
She is neurodivergent. All of this is incredibly obvious to all of us, all ot it is classic neuroatypicality
BTS LIKEEEE BTSSS YES BUT CAREFULLL JUST BE CAREFULL 💜😂💜💜💜💜💜💜
Are we saying Swiftie fans are willing to kill someone for her? 😮
Controversial opinion, Taylor Swift is overrated. Her music isn't really all that different from her peers/contemporaries.
She is an overrated celebrity but an underrated artist. And her peers are no where near her.
@@cats13shorts47 she’s not at all an underrated musician
@@cats13shorts47 speak on it, queen!!!
@@claire.chiste actually the point is when most people talk about taylor the simple mindset all of them has is she writes about her ex, she picks on fight with others and write about it, her music is white trash, she writes for 14 year old girls, she sings for white blonde girls, she is a white supremist, all of her song sounds same, some even goes to make a point that her parents served her a career in a holden plate, she doesn't write her own stuffs etc. They often listens to just to the singles off her album (such as me, shake it off, yntcd) and judge her entire artistry. Though some of the people are gradually changing their mindset after the release of folklore and evermore. But still most people don't admire her because of her music and how it affects the listener and how we relate to her.
You just lack brain cells hun x
Okay but if you DO want to come out and see Detroit, my husband and I will house you and I will probably provide baked goods 🧁😎
Nobody actually wants to see Detroit. Yes, it has gotten a bit better but actual Detroit is still mostly a nightmare. All the rotting and abadonded buldings and murder lucking throughout. I only go sometimes and for things I really want to see or do. I have been robbed twice so maybe that has something to do with my feelings on Detroit proper and even some areas Detroit adjacent.
@marniekilbourne608 I live in Detroit, not in the central business district and in what could be considered a "rough neighborhood". As for the buildings, the city's Blight Patrol has done insane things already. Just this week I drove down what was previously an abandoned street and saw multiple urban tree farms, homes being renovated, and a new elementary school being built. The city has also identified 11 districts in need to focus on first. We just got brand new LED street lights in our district. People want to be here, even if you don't 🤷♀️