The Internet Goes EXTINCT as Gen AI Takes Over | The Dark Forest Internet & Proving Your "Humanness"
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- Опубліковано 8 чер 2024
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00:00 dark forest hypothesis
01:09 dark forest internet
13:40 proof of humanness
22:42 my solution
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1:36 😂😂 ~”I had to watch an ad [..] before I could get into my own house, and this is only going to get worse”
Unti someone sues because it got them seriously hurt.
this is exactly why the digital ID will be enforced. People will ask for it to discern between AI and humans
@MrJetMango And ai will fake it in no time.
This made me laugh, thanks :) I hope it's a joke though :)
Nah, that's just marketing. Whether you buy it or not is another question 😁
As we face new challenges, it's important not to create new "solutions" that are worse than the original "problem" they claim to "solve."
but this is how Big Tech operates these days. And are we, as workers, going to get paid extra for the extra productivity supposedly afforded by these new AI assistants? Fuck no lol.
they created problem to resolve that with digital G-u-l-a-g, next stage is be glad to be alive usually, time travel back into 1930s Europe
If that you’re job you have to dance. Because if you don’t dance why are they keeping around a dancer. Thus solutions will be made often just to say -something was done. All front end. No real exploration of back end downstream disasters.
there is no we, the problems you face are too much internet. worry about your own problems.
Well the issue imo is that this flood of gentent generated content, is that the cost for hosting will be on the social media platforms
I am sure they won't mind if that content makes money, but if a flood of ignored garbage comes in, I doubt they will distinguish between human and AI
my suspiscion is free accounts will come with content limits and use a subscritption model if you want to post more
I honestly don't think they care as much about where the content is comming from rather than whether they are making money
Your retina has a unique pattern which can be stored as a large unique number in some database. If that large number (your retina-based digital ID) is stolen, you can’t prove that transactions identified with the number weren’t initiated by you and you can’t get a new retina to start over.
I agree, this is a well-known problem with biometry I wonder why we still need to discuss it...
Do you really believe new retina is that far off? :D
@@TheCianhogan I remember a scene in Blade Runner :)
@@TheCianhogan How long before our home robot pulls our eye from our eye socket to get on the web :)
@@TheCianhogan they haven't gotten balding down yet so I'd say: yes, far off, at least 25 years. But I'll be glad to be proven wrong.
Thanks for not shocking us.
SHOCK has gone EXTINCT
Need my daily dose of AI shock tbh
This "SHOCKING" stuff got old fast. Please stop.
This actually shocked me
Dating websites were fakes AI ,shocking!
Please, no.
PLEASE, NO!
PLEASE DON'T GIVE COMPANIES THE POWER TO DECIDE IF YOU'RE HUMAN OR NOT!
Support open source, distributed, decentralized projects (and no, just because its on a blockchain doesn't mean its decentralized - have a look at Buterin's 'blockchain trilemma').
Orwell would go depressed faster than you can say "enslavement".
People have elearned to truly embrace and love ❤️ their bondage, unless of course you are Mark Passio of WhatOnEarthIsHappening. He despises it. Most however adore being in chains. You try to break them free and they will pick up their chains and whip you with them. Is this the future? You betcha.
I am STUNNED by the fact that this video didn't SHOCK me. Keep up the good work Wes!
He was properly shamed into changing his titles. We'll see if this ebeggar sticks to it.
This "SHOCKING" stuff got old fast. Please stop.
but u look ai as fuck
Yeah, but stuff is now going EXTINCT
@@markmurex6559Your inability to understand and appreciate the meme got old fast.
I don't say the n-word because I'm edgy, I say it because I'm HUMAN
In what context would you ever need to say the N word
@@MeatCatCheesyBlasterDidn't you watch the video? I'll do it to prove my humanity, since LLMs are limited as to not say it. How is that concept not hilarious to you?
@@MeatCatCheesyBlaster Probably when someone asks you which word you're even referring to when you say "N word", or when you have a compulsive desire to correct someone who has it wrong.
I think its nazi. The worst of all insults.
The "smart bear" problem at 8:30 is more likely a "lazy human" problem. It's just too much trouble to have to re-lock the trash every time you use it.
Bro I was literally LOL’ing with the bear thing. What a great way to start the day.
"Smarter than a depressingly large portion of the human population" ~Yogi Bear gritty realism reboot, in cinemas early 2025 😅
I had the same situation with my dog. It was an arms race, which I consistently lost. You see, the dog's only job was to escape. He had 24x7 hours a week of mental resources to solve the issue. I, on the other hand, had to goto work to put food on the table. I spent no more than 1 hour a week upgrading and implementing the next iteration. Therefore
Dogs intelligence X 24x7 hours > My intelligence X 1 hour per week
So for me to just keep pace with my dogs escapee skills. I had to have an intelligence of 168 times that of my dog's. Sadly I was not up to the task.
I also loled at that. It's kinda depressing but hilarious at the same time. 😂
Wes, you don't need the shocking titles to attract me! Your content does, not the thumbnails nor the titles. Your reflective thoughts and smooth reporting makes me come back. No matter what digital marketing bro's say! Quality spreads!
Wes, not gonna lie I swore your content was AI generated as of a few weeks ago. I just couldn’t understand how you were putting quality content out so quickly!! Keep up the hard work, your content is fire! 24:28
It's almost like adding "SHOCKING" to everything makes the internet more cluttered with junk, even to the point where you can't even open your garage door without watching bot commercials.
where "shocking"?
@@milztempelrowski9281 it's a running joke
SHOCKING, isn't it?
@@wayfa13 it's gonna lose it's meaning, like "literally" a few years ago
Neurobiological failures of humans are more to blame. The algorithm just surfaces our weaknesses.
About the retina scanning thing: in my country there are already groups of shady people who are paying people in the streets to harvest their biometric data (They use Worldcoin imagery as a facade to look authentic). And people are willingly letting themselves be scanned because they have no clue of what's going on, they just care for the quick cash.
Your last point about “slurs = real person” would be true if the only LLMs used in the future are the ones governed by large companies or governments. But what about homebrew open source AI? It is advancing parallel to closed source AI. And it would be incredibly easy to not censor your own homebrew AI.
Found your channel yesterday and love the way you present these things. You're very easy to listen to and don't fluff your videos to the point i either get bored or i'm just unable to retain information. Great voice as well
If you delve into liquid neural networks, a breakthrough architecture, you’ll find they can already endow classical neural networks with the ‘adaptability’ trait we possess(a main component of evolution). Thus, no new jargon will save the internet anyway. The internet is already evolving into a global social platform rather than a combined knowledge and social platform, but there’s a catch which is social platforms might survive as long as human-to-human interactions are valued by humans.
Can't wait for you to start making content. I challenge you to using that nice name and pfp kudos brudda
But ai is now smarter than most humans so who’s counting?
@@Cassp0nk tamagotchi smarter than most humans
"as long as human-to-human interactions are valued by humans" Boy have I got some bad news for you
@@HorseyWorsey Yep, I'm aware. That is why I hinted that in the first place.
As someone totally against the Worldcoin solution, especially if it could form the basis for an economy, I appreciate you getting the awareness of it out there. Stuff like this needs to be aired out and discussed.
I enjoy your great content, but what makes it even better is your smooth voice that makes the content flow perfectly in my ears during my morning walk 😉
Very entertaining, Wes. World coin is interesting, though I think the idea of solar coin is better. Damn, that is bad about the garage door app, fire that product! The bright side of a "dead internet" is people may actually value meeting in person again, as before all the shiny electronic objects were made.
You got a good channel going on here Wes. I have been watching a few of your very well made videos and i totally like how you draw all over the place to explain 'stuffs'! Also most important for me is you speak in a calm yet expressive and much likeable voice. Keep it up! I am a fan and I am also not a bot so @$#?!& you too. 😉
Good shiz wez dawg as always. Do you you take incentives from any of the for mentioned?
You’re nailing it!
Minority Report here we go!!
Yes, leftists own you now. You are their property and on your knees in submission is where you'll remain..
We have thought police now too and all the rage in law enforcement is precrime.
Great stuff. One of the best AI content channels.
Love your content man...❤
Always the good stuff. Thanks Wes.
Wes, I really like your Ai content. You’re my favorite Ai content creator thus far.
Great content! love your videos, Wes!
I am human but dunno how to prove it lol
My favorite Wes Roth vid yet!
There is one solution to the ID problem on the Internet and new digital economy. Its called non-participation.
It's been in use for several centuries in certain parts of the world.
It embodies some of what has been said on this video.
The Amish are a famous example of this in regards to modern technology.
You don't need to verify your personhood because you've an active, real world participant, you get out physically and are seen in the community, you work in the physical community and your labor is publicly seen and verifiable. You live and function in the real world and shun the digital world.
As the hippies used to say in the 1960s, "Turn on, tune in, drop out", instead the reverse of this what you'll need to do "Turn off(social media), tune out(the digital world), drop in(to reality)."
what software do you use to highlight text
Cixin Liu's science fiction trilogy The Three-Body Problem, The Dark Forest, and Death's End - deals with the dark forest concept.
That last take was hilarious!
And tbh, that's my preferred solution!!! 😂😂😂
The problem with the quote "there are no solutions, only trade offs", is that the entrepreneur is left with a limited set of choices: "Yes my new product may create tonnes of waste plastic that will pollute the environment, that is the trade off I accept as I'll be able to buy a Lambo and make my angel investors rich in the process". People can't make value judgements when the only real measure of value is fiat currency. It's why we are where we are. Its why so many new companies are now trying to monetise the clean up of other company's mess - which serves further to socialise the losses and privatise the gains.
Also, what is really the difference between OpenAI making a human eye secured "world coin" vs a government doing it? Both are primarily motivated by either money and/or power. Both motivations are the source of 99% of all corruption. Even altruism has been corrupted by capital. It's down to a failure to make the *higher* moral choice: ie: the environment is more important than debatable improvements to human lives.
“People can’t make value judgements when the only measure of value judgements is fiat currency”
Well what dictates the value of fiat currency? Supply and demand. And what dictates demand? Whatever it is humans desire more. In this sense, fiat currency is the truest, most sincere measure of what humanity values most-if it isn’t “valuable” then no one will be willing to pay for it, much less at a higher price tag.
@@Jay-ge1hoI'll put it another way. The environment is considered as plots of land bought and sold. Its value is determined purely by whether it can be used to make money from what occurs on it. For example, deforestation in the Amazon. This completely misses the true value of the land which is beyond the simplification of human commodification. Therefore, the systems of valuation humans use are, currently, completely inadequate. Supply and demand are irrelevant. Human desire: irrelevant. The wider picture and value of things that sustain the environment we live in are beyond commodification and value.
@@Jay-ge1hohere’s the thing.
Money is really meant to be, psychologically, Societal Favor. You having money is proof that you have offered enough value to society to have the money in the first place.
In small communities or in your home, this money is basically the feeling of gratitude. You feel like your bother is very kind to you so when he asks for something, you trust him to return the value you give him, so you do it. Money is a physical embodiment of that trust.
So now, think about this. If people can make money by stealing it, did he do you a favor to get it? No. You don’t feel like you’ve been done a favor. But because he has the money, technically society says “hey he did the favors.”
If someone sells you hyper addictive drugs, is he doing you a favor? I guess so, I mean you asked for it right? But each of these are riddle with questionable interpretations of “favor”.
To me, money is a force that allows for what would have had to be manually built trust between human beings, to be infiltrated by psychopathic intents that still count as “favors”.
And then because of this problem, we need laws and government and force to match the psychopathy that people are willing to do in such behaviors.
The incentive to make money is really the incentive to be highly favored by society. But society isn’t a human being who feels gratitude and reflects it back, it’s a machine that “eats” favor. That is a very different dynamic.
So the two poles: the economic pole which is the society eating human favors and distributions it out to those who can “get it” and the government pole that stops the acquisition of human favors by means unwanted by the Society.
Makes for a super effective, yet completely unnatural incentive funnel that will always seem noble but basically always leave room for some class of “exception to the rule” people and abuse. And allows for a class of people who feel deeply uncared for by the society, but are inexplicably dependent on contributing to it to function. You trust it in the same way you trust an person who isolated you from being treated any better.
And no one is none the wise
9pm 0
We killed this planet, we just don't know it yet is what I say
Another true mind expanding post Wes! The diagram was helpful to understand the structure/problem. Glad some people are looking at this because the internet is clearly, rapidly going in the wrong direction.
thank'you so much for all videos.
Funny you should mention your garage door! Mine got adverts late last year, then more adverts so it takes a couple of seconds to click through - and finally this month it suddenly became a subscription service! I couldn't open the door without subscribing.
I took a hammer to the controller and fitted a good ol' radio remote instead. Might be worth considering before it happens to you?
An advertisement on a product you already paid for is insane! Let alone a security product you need to get in (or out) of your house.
@@mennovanlavieren3885 As much as I enjoy the latest greatest new tech, it’s hard to beat a good old button or light switch in this case.
They still sell regular old “real” candles at the grocery store. There are some things in life where I say if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it with something that requires batteries or a subscription when the vintage option is cheaper and much less of a pain in the ass.
24:30 I don't get the AI generated content can't have slurs thing? Surely you could fine-tune a model to swear more than a horny pirate.
.There are already open source models without filters that say foul things
so that "solution" is almost humorously naive
heck you don't even need a sophisticated LLM to do that, you just randomly spam offensive langauge with a classic chatbot to pass that test as a mixture of experts system ontop of corp sponsored models
smh
really disapointed someone could think that this "test" was any kind of robust solution to the issue
A possible counter argument would be that creating such a script would be doable, having realtime video/audio generation of a photorealistic human being saying the things in the script would be significantly more difficult if you assume that the resources for this video generation is outside the reach of everyone except large corporations
@@annodomini2012
I mean I feel like people don't get the issue of deep fakes and parasocial relationships
people are getting catfished and scamed and most of the time without current level of deepfake/AI generation
so idk...just seems like you underestamate vulnerability of lonely people imo
i think he ment that as a joke (from his general videos i had the impression he is pretty smart and i just cant imagine he is naive enough to mean that seriously)
There’s that dude that trained a chatbot with 4chan posts, then released *multiple* of them at a time, and in the end they were all calling slurs and accusing each other of being bots. Fucking hilarious
Commenting as I listen, an AI watermark should be mandatory and included on all AI content to avoid steep legal penalty. Government should use social security numbers as ID to avoid duplicate payouts, votes, etc.
Great video Kyle Hill!
What I thought at first but it was probably an article 1st.
Well done video.
Enjoyed the Yogi Bear analogy. 😊
Im liking this circle corner thing.
Very interesting. Great analysis
I prefer the marker effect on text rather than the select style. With the marker you can reinforce some important parts or words.
Ur the Realest Virtual Person on UA-cam!
And one of the realest on Reddit , ur sub is great 😸
That ending though!
and I took that personally 😂😂
This is actually an excellent use for blockchain. Before you get upset, notice how I said "blockchain", not "cryptocurrency".
There's a smart contract called a "zero knowledge proof" - basically without a person disclosing their identity to anyone, they can prove they have certain characteristics (such as "I am human" or "I am of legal drinking age") with no potential for dispute and without revealing their identity.
The internet _needs_ this.
Hey now, the AI Breakdown is solid
Thank you for the knowledge- Covenant is a movie that illustrates the concept quite well
Thanks Wes
In the most shockable environment. Thanks for keeping it light on us.
Your solution has a problem: non-corporate entities. Sure LLMs and alike are now only at the hands of the top-G's, thus will not talk in a certain way, but like with any tech, it will become publicly more available and will be modified.
Your “payment = less bots” argument falls apart the moment you look at MMOs that are infested with bots. Why do bots exist? To make money for the bot creator. If they can make enough money before they get detected and shut down, they pay for their own cost and then generate surplus revenue. It’s EXTREMELY hard to detect a bot before it becomes profitable without making your website so expensive, no one will use it.
And it’s worse than that. The bots that run the simple scripts to do grinds or whatever are nothing compared to multiple AGI agents. that said, I definitely don’t like the retinal scanning to prove I’m human thing and I actually don’t see why the hardware couldn’t be hacked I mean ultimately it’s going to be a bit stream Traveling through a cable and if you can simulate the metrics that the hardware generates I’m not sure why you can’t just tap that signal and fake it?
@@shane5003 That’s my issue as well. Look at Sora. Now imagine that technology improved in 5-10 years. There’s nothing stopping an AI from generating an extremely realistic, unique video of a retina scan that is indistinguishable from a real person scanning their own. I don’t think that’s a valid identifier very, very soon. It might work TODAY, but I’m doubtful it could even work a year from now at the pace this technology is improving.
I like listening to this channel to fall sleep, bc his accent sounds like my European cousins I grew up with & miss. Please tell us more stories of dark forest, uncle Wes ❤😂
😂😂 I hope he pins this .that's cute.
As you were explaining about World Coin I was thinking of other solutions and came up with what you proposed in the end. Great minds think alike.
You have a great mind, of which I am deeply appreciative of. Thank you 😊 for having a wonderful soul and spirit too. ❤️
Would enjoy Part 2: Wes' guide to thriving in the probable dystopia.
Well, slurs is apparently Claude’s default mode in french canadian, I suspect it won’t be the secret handshake for long in any language
The lack of shocking ness has me shook.
Ha I just wrote this yesterday, BEFORE seeing your video "The plague of Sybil is unleashing upon humanity." 🙏
So much meaning in one final piep, i wonder if/when Claude will pick this up 😂
This channel is gonna blow up
4:40 I *love* that guy! Lol I actually never even considered that he was using AI to animate himself and it never, ever bothered me at all! You've just actually proven the opposite of your concern... For new users, even those who 'know' about AI will not blink if the content is authentic and engaging. I'll have to remind myself of the channel name... It's one of my channels that I regularly check, but nice and low profile but occasionally very easy watch and informative!
Answer : The AI Breakdown... *thoroughly recommend*
I'm not convinced that it was AI simply because of the microphone shake and blurriness.
The much simpler and more likely explanation to me is that his camera and mic are attached to a crappy flimsy desk and he keeps shaking it as he's talking.
Maybe it's because I was already an adult when the Internet became mainstream and that kind of quality would have been considered normal, if not actually pretty good comparatively speaking 😄
@@tracy419 I agree. I don't see that as evidence that he is using AI. Besides why go through all the trouble of using AI for that anyway? What's the advantage versus the cost? I don't get it but hey I also have problems with captcha's sometimes. Maybe I just have a problem with determining the difference between 1/8 of a bicycle tire and the road or maybe i'm just an idiot.
The biggest problem with a World ID system will be the incentive to commit crime...kidnapping someone will not only give you leverage in the real world in the form of an additional UBI, but also the digital world, where you could clone that persons digital persona into an illegal AI capable of violating any governances an AI is expected to follow.
Human Trafficking 2.0. Your employees (victims) will make you rich guaranteed!
Hey Wes, interestingly you ended up at this World-ID-thing, as me as well. I didn't check the important thing about it, if it is opensource and really leaving your full identity in decentralized individual hands. Many people in crypto were very negative against Wordcoin... but the important thing to evaluate this, is to ensure that privacy-control remains to the individual... if so, it could be really contribute in a positive way. I read something like that they even do not ask for your personal data when scanning your eye-ball, only email... I am not sure that this is enough, as data could be connected to a personal profile afterwards... I would like to know, if this could be excluded by cryptography? or maybe is already solved by this World-ID? Very intersting!
Thanks Wes. Another major issue is we don’t really establish balanced practices for personhood even outside of the digital realm. For example, in the USA there are more restrictions in establishing personhood to buy a beer or cigarettes compared with voting or even owning a home. All depending on your origin. That is an issue that should be resolved first. Otherwise the verification becomes a garbage in garbage out scenario.
4:29 I have an opensource text to speech app with 82 English language voices that uses Microsoft AI Voices. Some of the voices are really good. Some times you have to spell a word differently to get the pronunciation you want.
btw, is this posy's cursor?
Decentralisation is a must..
Hi Wes could you please do another video on what’s the latest with World Coin? Thank you.❤
Im not shocked. What a relief 😅
I don't get it. What if I get Sam Altman's iris from all the videos he appears in? (If one video isn't enough, maybe multiple videos could enhance resolution somehow?)
..or train a model to generate unique human-like iris's to break his little scam project.
Yeah, it seems that this whole half baked project suxs...
I used an ai video maker and gave it 30 seconds of voice. It’s spooky how accurate it is. Voice inflection pauses, will even ad uhs.
Already, I saw the locked out problem the other day. Got a captcha where you had to do addition that went into the teens. No way every single person can actually do that, or at least not easily. Some people don't have any math skills at all.
The solution for proving you're human is not needed... You just need to be able to vouch for others like a decentralized block chain, you initially exchange public keys in person with your physical social network... Whenever trash is flagged those who vouched for it will have their weights readjusted related to your own tastes...
We don't need to filter out Ai we just need to punish the use for spamming
This is already needed since the early 00s
imagine humans needing "the mark of the human" to identify between ai and human
23:36 well that's also trivial for LLM, just use the uncensored one
Seems to me that a UBI will be the only way our society doesn't consume itself in our lifetimes... Considering that 90% of jobs are likely to become obsolete. I really hope the political, religious, and nationalist minded people can find some sort of common ground soon.
No matter what you use, once it's data it can be hacked. Scanning my eye creates an image that is indexed for unique properties. That is then stored as an exception key. Each time I would need to validate that I'm a human I would have to scan my eye. What is stopping the data from being accessed while in transit and then being used to fake that it's human?
We’re not quite here yet?? We’ve been here for a minute lol! I don’t Google anything anymore. Straight to AI to avoid all the ads
Advertisers and others already uniquely identify individuals using digital finger printing against their will which is general considered bad. Why would people volunteer giving optical identification?
Had a guy who couldn't get in his apt at all because his iPhone was dead . He couldn't open the security gate or open his door or even identify himself to security without his phone.
Dang it Wes! PLS drop the link when you highlight another YTer. The AI dude with pink hat, I just want to check him out. I know I will never find him but my OCD won't let up.
Great ending.
Btw, I call the theory here "Above the canopy" e.g. we get out of the dark forest by going up, not down. Like when Bilbo climbed up the tree to get his bearings out of Mirkwood. (That's where I got the idea). Get away from the noxious fumes and the spiders by getting above the noise and nonsense.
Hey 👋 Dave !
In Spain, the government has forbidden gathering retina scans, Worldcoin had to stop doing that. The company will appeal the ban, let´s see what happens.
I think a simple solution to this would be a privacy focused ID. Something like this is has been used for years for more sketchy activity. You have a verification phase where an ID or whatever is required for creating the "human" identification then the data is deleted and a you have just a human id you can use and is backed by some sort of authority. It could also have other security features like 2 factor or TTL built in on request. Its kinda funny to me how people don't remember you can delete data after a verification process instead of storing it to use later.
That solution proposed by the OpenAI CEO is the ultimate techbro retardation. You can just have goverments made you to login with your id document and have same result. But why do that when you can make another cryptoscam bullshit that also harvests your data. Plus theoretically you can influence your goverment, but what can you do against international corporation?
Swedish Banks have created BankID which is used by most Swedes as identification. I assume each country could have their own verification. Also, Tegmark have a TED talk how to make AI safe.
Last time I was in Kenya 🇰🇪, people were being paid 50$ to sign up for World Coin
dude... any time you come up with a parameter for verification, someone else can come up with an AI model trained to defeat that parameter. by trying to understand ourselves, we are unwittingly developing the undoing of our sense of self.
No Shock?! What happened? 😱 I'am shocked of not being shocked.
To be serious again keep up your great work Captain Picard!
I think it could be a solution with proff of personhood, I'm just very sceptical to the that the guy that created the problem is the guy with the solution and that the solution is so "global". I think I'm gonna take trip outside now.
The moment I’m asked to pull my credit card out, they’ve lost me.
“Meat space “ works assuming you leave all electronics away from the meating .
I had my worries until the last 10 seconds. Im happy this was made by a human
Actually we already have sometime similar in India 🇮🇳 for a decade ,
It's called "Aadhaar card ID's" and UPI IDs for payments.
It's NUTS how everything in this video from the content to the images used to the thumbnail look almost identical to the one Kyle Hill just dropped.
Having this "proof of personhood" would lead to a dystopian online world (no privacy, no free speech)
What is this guys first language? I can’t place the accent