Bigger artist now are affected but this has been a big issue with metal, hardcore and underground hip-hop for years. From not touching any money from the bar to venues taking money from the merch. The system needs a reset.
The music and movie industry need a hard reset. None of them are making real money right now. We need entertainment direct to consumer if they want their coin.
@LewdConnoisseur USA is a greedy capitalistic country. anything that makes it easier for the common or non company owning person is getting thrown out the door
@@thatonebritishidiot3037 NO. Because of lobbying in the music industry is larger. Artists might not be relabled if they focus on unions. It's basically slavery. Tickets, labels, spotify, etc, are all connected.
Artists can't make money from their music sales and they can't make money from their shows. Things have to change or artists won't have anyway to support themselves. And to answer Ken's question, the artists that "matter" are all signed to UMG, Sony and Warner Music. The Big 3 music labels all have stake in Spotify so of course they aren't going to speak out and go direct to consumer. Gotta get educated before you disrespect artists out here doing the work because you don't think they "matter"
I read the comments before watching so that definitely colored my opinion a bit. While I literally get what Rod is saying about things being "realistic," to me the artists should be getting cuts of concessions, even parking to me. We cant lose sight of the fact that these major companies make billions and screw everyone, including fans. I cant see myself defending these businesses.
@@HamAndCheeze yeah he fought the idea a bit and sort of came around. I don't think he knew going in all of the details. I think they should've played the Jon Bellion clip so everyone could speak on the same information
Live Nation should focus on what it should focus on. Not more than what it shouldn't. Their cost shouldn't be so high the artist gets nothing. The stadium should be efficient.
Year after year music has continued to be devalued on terms of perception to the consumer. Most fans dont care about any of this, they just want convenience and to pay as little money as possible to listen to music
And I understand the convenience of streaming, but I have always been anti-Spotify. Wayyy back when DEHH had their video discussion on digital vs physical media, I have always been on the pro-physical side. I appreciated Feefo saying he at the very least buys his favorite artists merch and stuff. But if you’re a FAN you should always buy the music if it’s of quality. I was hugely disappointed that Schoolboy Q has 10 million followers on instagram but he can’t even break 100,000 units first week of sales for Blue Lips which is of the highest quality of music in his discography. Like those kind of statistics don’t add up. If you’re a fan then buy the music.
I remember when Knower released their latest album, it was initially exclusive to Bandcamp for like a month, except for the handful of video clips they posted on UA-cam, because, as Louis Cole put it very bluntly, they need to get some money from this stuff.
As an artist, it's true that even smaller venues would take bar and you can keep ticket sales. The problem for Jon and bigger artists is they're deal with Live Nation means they lose money off their ticket sales, like Jon said paying for things like catering when he doesn't even want it. Realistically we just gotta cut out the middle man
Spotify only works if it's not a freemium model. Treat it like netflix for $5.99, and they may convert if advertising is not very profitable, but still can have ads and upsell for less ads but still have ads. People who go there for free will probably don't buy anything. They need a metric for that, but still must price but not be close to netflix to lose audience or have bad reputation.
Spotify: I know they are making billions whilst in partnership with music industry entities like Universal. The idea of paying percentages from a dollar is absurd. The concept of them cracking down on third-party promotion on finding means to gain ways on playlists and streams is forcing people to subscribe to their ecosystem. Note: I have created the music, recorded, mixed & mastered it. Then, I pay a DSP to upload my music before I can get my any traction. It's strong arming artists' work. #f*ckspotify #scarecrowzw
The problem with streaming isn't the revenue, it's the amount of access it gives consumers. Spotify is paying artists 70% of the revenue per stream so the artist isn't getting screwed. Keep in mind that your average person streaming a song wouldn't actually pay money for an individual track if they had to. Streaming in general is honestly just a terrible system and if you ask me, the iTunes model in the 2000s was the perfect compromise. How many people have thousands of songs saved in their streaming libraries but play the same 20-30 songs on repeat? Well over 50% of the songs in my likes are things I heard and thought "oh, this sounds nice, I guess I'll save it and probably never come back to it again". Maybe 10% of the songs in my library are tracks I actually come back to on a regular basis. The other 40% are songs that are part of albums I liked that I decided to download. Spotify works very well as a radio service but you shouldn't be able to download thousands of songs per month for $10, it just doesn't make any sense. I'd gladly pay $7-10 to own albums like Illmatic, DSOTM, The Sun's Tirade, MBDTF, etc. I'm happy I don't HAVE to, but if that was the way it was, I'd deal with it and just listen to specific radio stations and pay tastemakers for their playlists/ears. At least in those scenarios, artists could get ad revenue and get paid a flat rate. This goes for the entertainment industry period tbh. As for concert sales, Live definitely sounds like they're conducting themselves in a sociopathic ass manner and they definitely need to face consequences for that. Fact of the matter is tho, it's hard to make a buck as a creative if you're not in the 1%, and nowadays with all the exploitation, it's almost impossible without stressing yourself into an early grave.
To the response of Jennifer Lopez and Lil Baby comments on not being able to sell out arenas, my question is are they really considered “high caliber” artists to begin with trying to do arena tours in the first place?? Because in my opinion no, and I don’t feel bad at all when such artists complain about such things because I would just say “know your place and where you stand” In the past couple of years I’ve seen The Weeknd, J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar live and a Kpop group named TWICE and they had NO issue selling out tickets. And of course titans like Taylor Swift and Beyonce could sell out in less than 24 hours. So all of these artists wanting MORE of the profit should probably rethink their business strategies a little. I feel bad for more of the smaller artists of course because their tour profits are their literal livelihoods, but all of these multi-millionaire artists need to check their popularity more before going on such ambitious tours
Rod is one million percent wrong. It doesn't matter if they "provided the venue" or not. No talent, no show, no show, no packed house. A venue with no talent is just a bar. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I doubt every artist inks this type of bogus ass deal. I promise you more independent artist knew better because the understand the logistics.
I agree. I think at the very least people should directly support the artists they REALLY really like. I get that if you have large tastes it's hard to buy every single hat, vinyl, CD, cassette etc., but if you go around saying someone is your fav, I think it's worth giving them your $10-$30ish bucks at least once in a while, especially if they're not some major label act.
Don’t feel bad Feefo, it’s not your fault you’re a fan of music. These artist take crappy deals for a bag & now they’re complaining about the bag when they already signed off for the bag lol. For most of us it’s either Spotify or Pirate Bay & these artist better be glad we’re choosing Spotify. They can go the direct to consumer way if they want.
@@Newportnews98 True, but if you truly love making music & performing you’d do it no matter what. These underground artist are only underground because they seriously care about their art.
I feel like Feefo is the voice of reason in this convo, love to see it
A lot of venues take merch cuts too, if the venue can take a merch cut the artist should be able to get a bar cut too
Ken talking about JLO and The Black Keys thinking they can sell out arenas had me dead😂 This dude Ken hilarious without trying to be hilarious
Bigger artist now are affected but this has been a big issue with metal, hardcore and underground hip-hop for years. From not touching any money from the bar to venues taking money from the merch. The system needs a reset.
The music and movie industry need a hard reset. None of them are making real money right now. We need entertainment direct to consumer if they want their coin.
rod gotta be the devil for halloween next time for how much he play's devil's advocate.
been like that for years😂 i noticed it when they started ITMSO
@@kxngmuzikig2417 Jason Rod strikes again
Music artist need a union...like actors and writers....
Pimp C used to say this!!
I know musicians in the UK are union, but for some reason musicians in US aren't or it isn't as proactive.
@@LewdConnoisseur because unions sound like a socialist idea is my guess
@LewdConnoisseur USA is a greedy capitalistic country. anything that makes it easier for the common or non company owning person is getting thrown out the door
@@thatonebritishidiot3037 NO. Because of lobbying in the music industry is larger. Artists might not be relabled if they focus on unions. It's basically slavery. Tickets, labels, spotify, etc, are all connected.
Artists can't make money from their music sales and they can't make money from their shows. Things have to change or artists won't have anyway to support themselves.
And to answer Ken's question, the artists that "matter" are all signed to UMG, Sony and Warner Music. The Big 3 music labels all have stake in Spotify so of course they aren't going to speak out and go direct to consumer. Gotta get educated before you disrespect artists out here doing the work because you don't think they "matter"
I read the comments before watching so that definitely colored my opinion a bit. While I literally get what Rod is saying about things being "realistic," to me the artists should be getting cuts of concessions, even parking to me. We cant lose sight of the fact that these major companies make billions and screw everyone, including fans. I cant see myself defending these businesses.
Rod said he thinks artists deserve a percentage though
@@HamAndCheeze yeah he fought the idea a bit and sort of came around. I don't think he knew going in all of the details. I think they should've played the Jon Bellion clip so everyone could speak on the same information
@@JulianWyllieEverything discussed was shared prior to filming
@feefo247 okay dope good to know. Glad yall talked about this and good job leading the discussion
Venues are like movie theaters. They get a lil cut of the ticket price but get all profits from food
Live Nation should focus on what it should focus on. Not more than what it shouldn't. Their cost shouldn't be so high the artist gets nothing. The stadium should be efficient.
Year after year music has continued to be devalued on terms of perception to the consumer. Most fans dont care about any of this, they just want convenience and to pay as little money as possible to listen to music
This is why the actors went on strike. Streaming is a huge issue
Live Nation/Ticketmaster will lower the price of the ticket because they don't care they get the "service" fees anyway
Part of the reason why these concert tickets arent selling is because the prices of the tickets are insanely high. 300 for nosebleed seats
And I understand the convenience of streaming, but I have always been anti-Spotify. Wayyy back when DEHH had their video discussion on digital vs physical media, I have always been on the pro-physical side. I appreciated Feefo saying he at the very least buys his favorite artists merch and stuff. But if you’re a FAN you should always buy the music if it’s of quality.
I was hugely disappointed that Schoolboy Q has 10 million followers on instagram but he can’t even break 100,000 units first week of sales for Blue Lips which is of the highest quality of music in his discography. Like those kind of statistics don’t add up. If you’re a fan then buy the music.
UA-cam is just as much of a problem cuz alot of signed artists dont get any of the youtube revenue either
I remember when Knower released their latest album, it was initially exclusive to Bandcamp for like a month, except for the handful of video clips they posted on UA-cam, because, as Louis Cole put it very bluntly, they need to get some money from this stuff.
Rod be playing the Devil's advocate for the most obvious bullshit. Not every situation needs one.
As an artist, it's true that even smaller venues would take bar and you can keep ticket sales. The problem for Jon and bigger artists is they're deal with Live Nation means they lose money off their ticket sales, like Jon said paying for things like catering when he doesn't even want it. Realistically we just gotta cut out the middle man
This has always been an issue since Pearl Jam in the nineties. Ticketmaster has been screwing with artists and fans for decades now.
The venue can't get people in it to sell the food and alcohol if not for the artist.
Spotify only works if it's not a freemium model. Treat it like netflix for $5.99, and they may convert if advertising is not very profitable, but still can have ads and upsell for less ads but still have ads. People who go there for free will probably don't buy anything. They need a metric for that, but still must price but not be close to netflix to lose audience or have bad reputation.
Spotify: I know they are making billions whilst in partnership with music industry entities like Universal. The idea of paying percentages from a dollar is absurd. The concept of them cracking down on third-party promotion on finding means to gain ways on playlists and streams is forcing people to subscribe to their ecosystem. Note: I have created the music, recorded, mixed & mastered it. Then, I pay a DSP to upload my music before I can get my any traction. It's strong arming artists' work. #f*ckspotify #scarecrowzw
Good Convo
I knew I was always right about Rod lol bring Myke bike
Man is a pinata of bad takes.
@@gregorybertrand645 I rewatch his part multiple times like what do you even agree with Rod?
Rod is the only person I’ve ever seen that should probably rehearse his opinions before offering them.
But they get paid through ads if someone is using the app for free. Or you stop the free streaming option like Apple Music.
Robb sounds like company man smh
Who is Robb?
if what he was saying is true and they were responsible for having to pay for catering/concessions then they should be able to get some sort of %
The problem with streaming isn't the revenue, it's the amount of access it gives consumers. Spotify is paying artists 70% of the revenue per stream so the artist isn't getting screwed. Keep in mind that your average person streaming a song wouldn't actually pay money for an individual track if they had to. Streaming in general is honestly just a terrible system and if you ask me, the iTunes model in the 2000s was the perfect compromise. How many people have thousands of songs saved in their streaming libraries but play the same 20-30 songs on repeat? Well over 50% of the songs in my likes are things I heard and thought "oh, this sounds nice, I guess I'll save it and probably never come back to it again". Maybe 10% of the songs in my library are tracks I actually come back to on a regular basis. The other 40% are songs that are part of albums I liked that I decided to download.
Spotify works very well as a radio service but you shouldn't be able to download thousands of songs per month for $10, it just doesn't make any sense. I'd gladly pay $7-10 to own albums like Illmatic, DSOTM, The Sun's Tirade, MBDTF, etc. I'm happy I don't HAVE to, but if that was the way it was, I'd deal with it and just listen to specific radio stations and pay tastemakers for their playlists/ears. At least in those scenarios, artists could get ad revenue and get paid a flat rate. This goes for the entertainment industry period tbh.
As for concert sales, Live definitely sounds like they're conducting themselves in a sociopathic ass manner and they definitely need to face consequences for that.
Fact of the matter is tho, it's hard to make a buck as a creative if you're not in the 1%, and nowadays with all the exploitation, it's almost impossible without stressing yourself into an early grave.
To the response of Jennifer Lopez and Lil Baby comments on not being able to sell out arenas, my question is are they really considered “high caliber” artists to begin with trying to do arena tours in the first place?? Because in my opinion no, and I don’t feel bad at all when such artists complain about such things because I would just say “know your place and where you stand”
In the past couple of years I’ve seen The Weeknd, J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar live and a Kpop group named TWICE and they had NO issue selling out tickets. And of course titans like Taylor Swift and Beyonce could sell out in less than 24 hours. So all of these artists wanting MORE of the profit should probably rethink their business strategies a little. I feel bad for more of the smaller artists of course because their tour profits are their literal livelihoods, but all of these multi-millionaire artists need to check their popularity more before going on such ambitious tours
Rod is one million percent wrong. It doesn't matter if they "provided the venue" or not. No talent, no show, no show, no packed house. A venue with no talent is just a bar. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I doubt every artist inks this type of bogus ass deal. I promise you more independent artist knew better because the understand the logistics.
Larussell ain't from LA he from the Bay
Lol i doubt kendrick rate per stream is .0000 what ever fraction of a penny it is
marcus aurelius? Why they talking about roman figure? xD
If you really fuck with an artist buy their album and merch it’s that simple imo
I agree. I think at the very least people should directly support the artists they REALLY really like. I get that if you have large tastes it's hard to buy every single hat, vinyl, CD, cassette etc., but if you go around saying someone is your fav, I think it's worth giving them your $10-$30ish bucks at least once in a while, especially if they're not some major label act.
Is rod slow or something?
😂
First 🫡
Yeah why put your music on a site that tells you it took nothing for you to make this. I'll pass on that every time
Don’t feel bad Feefo, it’s not your fault you’re a fan of music. These artist take crappy deals for a bag & now they’re complaining about the bag when they already signed off for the bag lol. For most of us it’s either Spotify or Pirate Bay & these artist better be glad we’re choosing Spotify. They can go the direct to consumer way if they want.
Not everyone can be successful being underground
@@Newportnews98 True, but if you truly love making music & performing you’d do it no matter what. These underground artist are only underground because they seriously care about their art.
First
Rod should have stayed behind the camera.
Big facts