The “revolutionary” Launch skill is part of the problem. No one has to get off the Nimbus, meaning no moment where Baby can potentially surprise anyone. I can also vouch for the fact that I don’t think you’re getting sniped. People are genuinely premading for a stamp.
Remember how everyone was saying "wow what an useless skill,is this really "revolutionary" like they say? Hah what a joke" And now look,everyone is running it
Yeah, honestly I don't think it should work with Nimbus, like sure Puar and Baba will still be able to fly but Nimbus is much faster and should not count as a vehicle.
There are probably more sweaty lobbies because the only people playing are dedicated players because everyone is saying how much the season sucks. Goku Black was a more hype raider and last season was overall better, which brought in newer players or brought some casuals back. I have a feeling that ranked is gonna be either super sweaty or completely dead this season.
I hate Baby. *I hate the way that he walks, the way that he talks, I hate the way that he’s dressed. I hate the way sneaks us, if I catch a Change the fists gonna be direct. We hate the forms that he got, cause he mistakes himself for real villains. And notice I say “we”, it’s not just “me”, it’s what THE BREAKERS feelin’”*
No but seriously, I can’t stop playing super high level Baby players this season and the fact he can just immediately down you in stage one is too op in my opinion. Also, the fact you have to sit and listen to lines like “I’m going to deal with this RIGHT NOW” and “allow me to show you what a fully evolved Tuffle is TRULY capable of.” The voice actor nails it, because I’ve never wanted to see a villain get planted more in my life.
The first nerf he needs is to stop making me see His evolution every fucking match lol But now to be real, he needs saibaman timer to lvl 2 or a quicker lvl 1 evo. Buuut harder to get lvl 3 and 4, is always annoying he gets ape at 4-6 minutes in the match, Maybe a small nerf on the execution time like buu.
@@trashdan1661 yeah, but it disrupt the game a lot Just by chance, Iron on stream got the lvl 3 change and spawned where baby was, on my matches i've seen players die because the one reviving was on the cutscene, and no one was able to reach the guy, and most important, you dont have to think twice as baby to lvl Up on stm because the stm pauses alongside the cutscene, is not only a bother, it can disrupt the game "by accident" and thats bs, believe me I love baby as a character but these small thing Just pile Up one by one.
@@trashdan1661 you dont need a cutscene for that. You can have baby transform, and after 1 or two seconds of baby transforming, you can have the infected players be frozen like with Guldo and then teleported to Baby's position, just like with the animation were people die to area destruction and they are teleported to another area in a downed state.
Like huh, mabye the raider that gives us prep time, isn't so hard after all. It's just that a majority of players don't key rush, or jump him while he is weak.
@@reddawn1873 The OP part of survivors were the skills and passives, such as stuns, memories of battle, etc. Pre-mades took advantage of stun spamming, getting D-change back extremely fast. However, in solo queue, you can’t plan around other builds, and many survivors suck at this game, so when they nerfed the dodge it is much harder to carry and stall the raider.
@@justawhiteman.8550 Here's a thing They were going to win anyways It doesn't matter raiders are incredibly underpowered win entire group of solo players will win regardless of what the raider will do
@@justawhiteman.8550 They could make it so survivors would need triple the current amount of dragon change to gain a level and still win They could double the cool down time and still win
The Fact they literally had to tip toe around the bigger problems to fix a single problem that was around for possibly a year now "Unconscious Control" but avoiding Stunmades and whatever else they had to just win their games it's just sad dude can't even learn to play fair and just Bully Jump the Raiders each and every time
I hope this advice helps Iron. as Baby's Level 1..focus on finding 3 civs and once you find 3 civs.. Surround The place where the STM spawns with infected Civis.. So when the STM phase comes out.. You got civis to stun the survivors which you can hide behind while destroying the STM..
remember you playing the first match as a raider this season and saying that you cant understand how someone can lose as a raider in season 6. that aged very fast
Baby just feels like a hyper snowballer who's a 'skill check' and nothing more. He's hurt so bad by players just not falling for his lvl 1 instant grabs and needing to eliminate players fast for those servants to carry. Sure once he's lv 4 he's nigh unbeatable but at this point you either win hard or you struggle hard. I hadn't had these beat downs yet but I also hadn't played in a while myself but even then I still won survivor games so long as my team didn't hard feed him early.
Heck, Vegeta is jsut better for the Snowballing route purely as he can be a very strong fighter even if he's stuck at lv 2 or 3 and is no longer so held back if he can't get enough civs, players, or gets killed at lvl 1.
Everyone always talks about key rushing baby. Imma be honest i cant remember the last fucking time ive seen randoms actually plant a key in under 10 minutes. Deadass🗿
The first phase is the worst part. I don't really feel Confident playing as baby until phase 3 in most matches. The reverse Shot is a great attack. And if you have servants I really want to say your unstoppable. But yeah, to achieve that you need to get through phase 1 and hope the survivors dont get lucky. You either suck as baby or you wreck shit as baby.
I don't even need to watch the vid to know it's 100% skill issue, I've only lost 1 match as baby since launch and it was because I tried tricking civs rather than just rushing out of lvl 1
Something I've noticed though is you don't use ascend as much as raiders and that ultimately gets you low every time. Flying away and the dashes Baby has aren't going to be fast enough to get you away from survivors who are jumping you
I think the big issue with Baby is that he suffers from his Level 1 the most, like Pre Buff Saibaman. Since he doesn't have any flight, he can't really travel to civillians or survivors fast enough to get to his stronger forms. His Level 3 also has issues, but at least he has those spammy homing blasts as an active. At least his Level 4 is really good, especially with his heal on evolution.
You know what would be fun and they probably wont ever make? If the raider is baby, make so all the civs run around the map. It would be so funny. Lmao
First comment, 14:16 is facts because I had one game where level one baby was still stuck during STM. I kinda felt bad for him because he didn't level up, but everyone knew his weakness. Maybe a buff lowering it down to need less civilians would do the trick.
SBC is dodgeable with good reaction, unless they hold you and Baby Lvl1 needs some kind of buff, like less civs to lvl up, just as they did with vegeta lvl1 now is only 3 civ. Maybe this should be a thing for raiders that can't fly.
Btw iron , i agree with you about the Special beam cannon , i rather run other supers that i feel are more cool looking , Still i understand some ppl rather have the most OP stuff on their characters 24/7
I mean if you play against bad randoms baby feels like the most op raider but if you play against like really good 2 or 3 survivor premade then you have real chance of losing so it just depends on who you get in public matches
Level 3 Baby is not terrible. If anything, Super Baby 2 is one of the strongest level 3s next to Rose Black. 2 good evasives, reverse shot which is basically his own Super Buu's Ill Rain attack. Personally, most of the choices you taken were bad plays, but it entirely depends on how the survivors have been playing as well. Level 2 Baby is kinda lacking in that raw damage potential for me.
ironcane welp it might as well be said now before anyone else here think otherwise Baby Buffs coming soon for next Update/Patch I'm just gonna make the call right there since they did say they would be more focused on balance changes as these seasons go by so yeah....
I mean you do have to memorize civs spawns. Game is almost 2 years old now. It was eventually coming to become competitive like dbd and any other games like it when the time came After a weeks of playing killer klowns from outer its so easy to escape early from the klowns
that still doesn't change the fact that you need 5 civs as baby for his lvl 1. I think if we are really truly saying the difference between losing and winning is not finding a civ 15 seconds faster, then what are we doing? lol that's ridiculous
In my personal opinion, ik baby has a hard time getting past level one with having to get five civs but I think they did that intentionally bc of how OP level four baby is, I've yet to win against baby as survivor in any of my matches and I've been playing this season since launch, I personally have been having the opposite outcomes with baby then iron.
@Joey0716 again, I don't think that takes away these points I've made. People winning with baby against bad groups and people losing as survivors with bad groups doesn't change the fact that fundamentally he is weak.
People are focusing on baby having a rough level 1 compared to the other raiders, to be competitive as a raider you NEED to know the civ spawns, doesn't matter if it's how the game should be, it's the reality. With survivors being able to swap and get stronger abilities you have to stay as competitive as possible as raider, yes 5 civs is crazy but it's not that hard to learn civ spawns and dominate as baby. Just think how easy those matches would've went if iron knew civ spawns, he probably would've won every match instead of getting baited by people flying away from him.
there is no way people are equating me needing to find 5 civilians and not consistently doing so as a skill issue in an RNG spawn based game for resources. It is not a "skill" issue when I spawn in certain areas on certain maps and get a bad spawn and don't find civs. The matches would not have been "easy" I pointed out the flaws in both Baby's lvl 2 and 3. If losing a game is determined by not finding a civ .5 milliseconds faster or checking the wrong area instead of another we are throwing the term "competitive" out the window here because that's ridiculous
@@ironcane Iron you're a good player but your lack of civ knowledge is holding you back for sure, you spent most of the games wandering around because you couldn't find civs and were getting baited by survivors. It took you 3+ mins to evolve, if you evolved even a minute earlier a lot of those matches were winnable, you could've started killing off weakers players before they got d change and had keys. playing raider is a time crunch, time matters a lot more than you give it credit. Not knowing civs spawns is fine for every raider BUT baby, getting a faster level 2 is crucial to his gameplay, like you said he snowballs.
Im pretty new to the game but what is the deal with the special beam cannon? Is it not good or is it too good? Whats up. Lemme know. Ty. Love the content.
It also has low endlag making it mindlessly spammable esp at level 4 Doesn't deal full knockback gauge so if you stun a raider & they don't have an combo breaker, it's possible to get two of those for free You can also get a guarenteed combo on it from landing a vanish kick Extremely low risk high reward Motionless, God, & Black Kamehameha can as well yet they don't deal nearly as much damage
I disagree 🥶 I dont think baby is the worst raider rn. Imo your examples are a bit "Extreme" since you didnt really play well. (Which is un-avoidable since you cant predict what players will do) Like the survivors jumping you in that cave, that was unlucky. But understanding how baby works is crucial. When a survivor is in a cave you can down them with volley. Something you said was if you have to memorize civs location then its just not player friendly. That doesn't matter. If you wanna play baby at his best then you have to do that. And its not hard to memorize as long as you play the game actively. If you don't remember then that sucks ig. I do agree baby at lvl 1 is pretty bad since it can be hard countered and he does take awhile to evolve. But you have to be creative. If survivors are tracking your every move, teleport to another civ. Try to keep them close together so you can catch them if they try getting rid lf your infected civs. In all honesty you shouldn't even be going for survivors in sweaty matches at lvl 1. Another thing you said was baby's attacks are slower than goku blacks which i dont think is true and i also dont think it doesn't matter. The AOE attacks are sniping moves. They arent supposed to be used in the heat of the moment. Same thing with goku black. I've had this same complaint with goku black when he first came out. And honestly i think he's worse than baby. Is baby inconsistent? Yes due to his lvl 1. But if we compare both raiders highest highs i think baby is WAYYY better. His lvl 2 is better, his lvl 3 is better, and his lvl 4 is better. Goku blacks biggest weakness at lvl 2 is his ki blast and low damage if you cant land any combos which is pretty hard to land (imo since i don't know the timing for it). At lvl 3 his damage is fine but you have to deal with the super transphere. Baby at lvl 3 i also agree is worse than his lvl 2 but i will also say his ki blasts are better at lvl 3 which helps a lot. Baby having 2 breakstrikes compared to goku black is a HUGE difference. Goku black is definitely more consistent but i cannot say his consistency has won me games or made me feel better playing as him. You can lose at any lvl due to his lvl 2 damage being so weak. Both baby and goku black arent very good at crowd control at lvl 3, both movesets are basically the same. But the key difference is zamasu and servants. They both go down in 1 hit through vanish kicks but zamasu can comeback. I only use servants for ETM btw. But in games where i was forced to use servants you dont just throw them out. Give the servants space. Its important to remember that the first attack they do is a super attack so ofc they'd die easy if you spawn them right next to a survivor. With these things in mind i really do think baby at lvl 1 kind of makes or breaks the game but he can recover because his other lvls are that strong, at least in my experience against stronger survivor teams
@karbyboi8489 champ in one sentence you're saying I played bad, and in another you're saying it's not my fault. Baby's lvl 1 is fundamentally flawed it promotes camping and is at the will of survivors saving infected civs. If you can't catch one survivor and no infected civs are saved you have to find 5 civilians. And again, I've said this before and I'll say this until the end of time. It is not a "skill" to have civilian spawns memorized. A raider player is not labeled "good" because they have all possible RNG positions memorized that is ridiculous. If the game truly comes down to that, I think that is absolutely absurd. I genuinely think saying lvl 3 baby being better than Rose is INSANE. One of his active skills have the potential to be useless, reverse shot is okay, and he has two break strikes which are fine. In a jumping situation Rose has so many more options than Super Baby 2. He can dash and teleport to Zamasu. You can also protect zamasu by using supers. You can't do that with servants for baby.
@@ironcane 💀Yeah I said you played bad because in one part of the vid you went for the shenron summon instead of focusing on the STM and in that same vid, you got jumped by survivors because they went to rescue their buddy. You made a bad decision in one part and then the survivors coming in wasn't your fault, you didn't know that would happen. What I said wasn't contradictory. I never even said memorizing civ spawns were a skill. I agree with you on that, which is EXACTLY WHY YOU SHOULD MEMORIZE WHERE THEY SPAWN 💀💀💀. I'm not trying to justify baby at his lvl 1 needing 5 civs at worst case scenario. I'm saying memorizing and working around baby's weakness will help you evolve faster. Again if you can't remember the spawns then that sucks for you. I understand not everyone can remember spawns but by remembering where they are you are doing yourself a huge favor at getting out of your lvl 1 WAYY faster. Focusing on high level survivors will slow you down. It's RNG, I get it but you'll still have a general idea of where to go at the very least. Saving time is important. Baby at lvl 2&3 having 2 break strikes, especially as early as lvl 2 is crazy strong. And sure servants are useless If you don't kill anyone. But the same can be said for zamasu. If we're talking about worst case scenario, peak survivor game play all it takes it one vanish kick and you can't teleport to zamasu. Baby having 2 break strikes is consistent and that consistency will save you much more than relying on zamasu. Goku black does have a dash, that's good for chasing but honestly? You can probably just fly all the way up, instant descent and get the same results. And every raider can do that. In a jumping situation whats gonna help you more? 2 break strikes? Or teleporting to a zamasu that's not even there? And even if he was there, depending on the phase of the game....your not even teleporting that far. Baby is DEFINITELY better at lvl 3.
@@Bower-j6l I mean some people may prefer that. But the 65% dmg reduction is more than enough to not lose. Where as vegetas great ape takes increased dmg.
@@Jamstaro1 did you watch the video? It's not a "take" when I'm providing my opinion over video evidence man. I didn't wake up and think baby was trash lol
i think other raiders like cell and goku black are better but baby is absolutely unfun to play against. i hate how im forces to play while playing against him. i agree they should make lvl 1 level up faster because that phase is corny and if you get snuck up on or god forbid round start grabbed by him it just makes the rest of the game really unfun because youre playing with 3 abilities. the other levels have counter play but if you're careless in level 1 youll just die. id prefer a dive and even key blasts over the instant kill. itd be funny to see civs shooting at me. i have more fun playing against stronger raiders because they dont have corny unfun mechanics. I'm glad people are starting to not play him anymore in my games 😅
@apollojustice5589 it's not just you, but people misinterpret raiders being good and bad by losses alone. It makes sense in a bubble, but player skill and groups can influence a lot. If you look at these matches Baby is fundamentally weaker than the rest imo and doesn't have many options either.
In my opinion Baby is not bad as people say, Goku Black still felt worse on release than Baby do, Baby is fine it’s just people gotta learn to use him, yall playing predictable which is why the lvl1 sucks to ya, im lvl 50 & never lost, fought premades and all
You think Goku Black felt worse than Baby?!?!? Also, in these games it's not even losing to "skill" per say, there's genuinely nothing you can do when players fly around and don't interact with civs when you're lvl 1. To equate this to skill issue is a little wild imo. Again, not saying I played flawlessly here but to ignore the inherent weaknesses of the raider just because you personally haven't lost is a little biased.
@@ironcane I’m not ignoring the lvl1 issue just saying there are ways around it, I didn’t type the ways and all that, hence why I said learn him, but yea Goku Black felt worse day1 than Baby does imo
Honestly baby need a rework For starter there should not be a cutscene EVERY DAMM TIME. For his lv1 1. No longer down survivor or damage them just infect them 2. It should take 3 civ or 2 survivor to evolve to lv2 Lv2 His Barrier cooldown need to be reduced 45 sec, 90 sec is stupid Lv3 Should take 4 survivor to get to great ape. I think nimbus, ship and rise just need a nerf a harsh one.
Iron I think that you're just not taking advantage of the fact that all raiders can fly directly up much faster than survivors. I see in these matches that when you get jumped you just fly always and look back occasionally throwing ki blast. Instant descenting (rarely) too. I think If you flew directly up and paired this with smartly timing instant descent you would be able to avoid quite a lot of damage. Much love.❤
Players can play however they want that's true but the more people go try hard like this and sweat every game... The more players are going to get sick of it and stop playing and this game is just gonna die faster. It's like hey guys we're kinda bleeding out here, we can't really stop the bleeding. That's the developers' responsibility but as the ones playing the game still, we can try and slow down the bleeding by not playing toxic. I know for me personally if I happen to play with a team of sweats and they're bullying the Raider I'll keep a dragonball and won't let them summon and I don't help fight the Raider or with STM. Then if I get a Raider game where I'm going up against a team of low levels and or just aren't very good I kinda just take it slow, give them a chance to actually play the game, and sometimes I'll even let them ETM I wanna be clear here, in either situation I'm not saying throw the game but especially since we're not in ranked yet can't we all just try and enjoy the game casually and not be a toxic try hard ruining it for others. Idk, that's just my take...
@user-nn4mc8ge4u how am I throwing the game if the Raider is being beaten down to a quarter of his health or lower? The rest of my try hard team mates don't need my help to finish the Raider off So no that's not throwing the game bud
@ironcane I don't know how, vegeta outclasses him at every level. Saibaman takes 3 civs or one survivor and is way more useful than the servants. Nappa gets evolution energy from dealing damage and has a really good melee and alt fire. Vegeta has the best melee in the game, and better supers.
The “revolutionary” Launch skill is part of the problem. No one has to get off the Nimbus, meaning no moment where Baby can potentially surprise anyone.
I can also vouch for the fact that I don’t think you’re getting sniped. People are genuinely premading for a stamp.
That skin was pretty much a "Pay to Win" skin The fact that skill came out against the same raider it hard counters was way to intentional.
They need to heavily nerf survivors and buff baby lv 1 only
@@WhoPutsThisStuffHere that goes for both launch skills
Remember how everyone was saying "wow what an useless skill,is this really "revolutionary" like they say? Hah what a joke"
And now look,everyone is running it
Yeah, honestly I don't think it should work with Nimbus, like sure Puar and Baba will still be able to fly but Nimbus is much faster and should not count as a vehicle.
There are probably more sweaty lobbies because the only people playing are dedicated players because everyone is saying how much the season sucks. Goku Black was a more hype raider and last season was overall better, which brought in newer players or brought some casuals back. I have a feeling that ranked is gonna be either super sweaty or completely dead this season.
ironcane and cane black doing the commentary together
I can't wait for the FreakyCane arc, where instead of doing commentary, he just oils up.
I hate Baby.
*I hate the way that he walks, the way that he talks, I hate the way that he’s dressed. I hate the way sneaks us, if I catch a Change the fists gonna be direct. We hate the forms that he got, cause he mistakes himself for real villains. And notice I say “we”, it’s not just “me”, it’s what THE BREAKERS feelin’”*
No but seriously, I can’t stop playing super high level Baby players this season and the fact he can just immediately down you in stage one is too op in my opinion.
Also, the fact you have to sit and listen to lines like “I’m going to deal with this RIGHT NOW” and “allow me to show you what a fully evolved Tuffle is TRULY capable of.” The voice actor nails it, because I’ve never wanted to see a villain get planted more in my life.
Kendrick is not your savior. J cole is not your savior. Lebron is not your savior
The first nerf he needs is to stop making me
see His evolution every fucking match lol
But now to be real, he needs saibaman timer to lvl 2 or a quicker lvl 1 evo. Buuut harder to get lvl 3 and 4, is always annoying he gets ape at 4-6 minutes in the match, Maybe a small nerf on the execution time like buu.
Reason why is because of the level 3 cutscene where he uses players to grant his level 3 but that should only be for that cutscene
@@trashdan1661 yeah, but it disrupt the game a lot Just by chance, Iron on stream got the lvl 3 change and spawned where baby was, on my matches i've seen players die because the one reviving was on the cutscene, and no one was able to reach the guy, and most important, you dont have to think twice as baby to lvl Up on stm because the stm pauses alongside the cutscene, is not only a bother, it can disrupt the game "by accident" and thats bs, believe me I love baby as a character but these small thing Just pile Up one by one.
@@trashdan1661 you dont need a cutscene for that. You can have baby transform, and after 1 or two seconds of baby transforming, you can have the infected players be frozen like with Guldo and then teleported to Baby's position, just like with the animation were people die to area destruction and they are teleported to another area in a downed state.
That option kinda lame imo. Only 3 should be an all cutscene. 2 and 4 unnecessary @@ero-senninsama1734
See when people finds the raiders weakness its game over
Like huh, mabye the raider that gives us prep time, isn't so hard after all. It's just that a majority of players don't key rush, or jump him while he is weak.
oh this didn't age well at all
The Gammas and Magenta: Allow us to introduce ourselves
The survivor nerfs suck, all it did was make solo que not fun and barely affected pre-mades.
The hell are you talking about
@@reddawn1873 The OP part of survivors were the skills and passives, such as stuns, memories of battle, etc. Pre-mades took advantage of stun spamming, getting D-change back extremely fast. However, in solo queue, you can’t plan around other builds, and many survivors suck at this game, so when they nerfed the dodge it is much harder to carry and stall the raider.
@@justawhiteman.8550 Here's a thing They were going to win anyways It doesn't matter raiders are incredibly underpowered win entire group of solo players will win regardless of what the raider will do
@@justawhiteman.8550 They could make it so survivors would need triple the current amount of dragon change to gain a level and still win
They could double the cool down time and still win
The Fact they literally had to tip toe around the bigger problems to fix a single problem that was around for possibly a year now "Unconscious Control" but avoiding Stunmades and whatever else they had to just win their games it's just sad dude can't even learn to play fair and just Bully Jump the Raiders each and every time
I hope this advice helps Iron. as Baby's Level 1..focus on finding 3 civs and once you find 3 civs.. Surround The place where the STM spawns with infected Civis.. So when the STM phase comes out.. You got civis to stun the survivors which you can hide behind while destroying the STM..
Bro planning around the stm spawning while your lvl 1 means baby is trash lol
I mean. I enjoy trash.. I loved playing as Buu in S2 for that reason.
@@ironcane True but gotta say that's a pretty fun strat. Though I be more focused on trying to get them to get grabbed so I level form it.
@ironcane So what you are saying is Baby especially at LV1 is gonna get a Saibaman Buff "1 Survivor to transform to LV2 or 3 Civs for LV2" hmm? 🤔
I be doing this n it’s fun I’ve beat a premade like this, waiting for rank for real test
remember you playing the first match as a raider this season and saying that you cant understand how someone can lose as a raider in season 6.
that aged very fast
Baby just feels like a hyper snowballer who's a 'skill check' and nothing more. He's hurt so bad by players just not falling for his lvl 1 instant grabs and needing to eliminate players fast for those servants to carry. Sure once he's lv 4 he's nigh unbeatable but at this point you either win hard or you struggle hard. I hadn't had these beat downs yet but I also hadn't played in a while myself but even then I still won survivor games so long as my team didn't hard feed him early.
Heck, Vegeta is jsut better for the Snowballing route purely as he can be a very strong fighter even if he's stuck at lv 2 or 3 and is no longer so held back if he can't get enough civs, players, or gets killed at lvl 1.
Everyone always talks about key rushing baby. Imma be honest i cant remember the last fucking time ive seen randoms actually plant a key in under 10 minutes. Deadass🗿
The first phase is the worst part. I don't really feel
Confident playing as baby until phase 3 in most matches. The reverse Shot is a great attack. And if you have servants I really want to say your unstoppable. But yeah, to achieve that you need to get through phase 1 and hope the survivors dont get lucky.
You either suck as baby or you wreck shit as baby.
Raiders are OP until everyone gets enough time to figure out how to play against them.
I don't even need to watch the vid to know it's 100% skill issue, I've only lost 1 match as baby since launch and it was because I tried tricking civs rather than just rushing out of lvl 1
8:44 All female characters are dudes.
Something I've noticed though is you don't use ascend as much as raiders and that ultimately gets you low every time. Flying away and the dashes Baby has aren't going to be fast enough to get you away from survivors who are jumping you
Although that's true and fair, I'd don't think that would've been the difference between winning and losing on these matches
I think the big issue with Baby is that he suffers from his Level 1 the most, like Pre Buff Saibaman. Since he doesn't have any flight, he can't really travel to civillians or survivors fast enough to get to his stronger forms. His Level 3 also has issues, but at least he has those spammy homing blasts as an active. At least his Level 4 is really good, especially with his heal on evolution.
@@swagdoll420 And they already made an answer to that so the question is will they do it to LV1 baby as well 🤔
That second match was definitely against a premade, I know because I was that Bulla, I did use afterimage to get out of the civ.
See i told yall. Baby was like how op vegeta used to be and buu used to be
Baby was never op imo
Baby never felt op more so just annoying
Baby is really good. OP? Nah, that’s Black. Or at least most Sweats play him.
38:34 Stun locked himself 💀
Look at how they massacred my boy
baby just feels like vegeta if his lvl 1 was buns
You know what would be fun and they probably wont ever make? If the raider is baby, make so all the civs run around the map.
It would be so funny. Lmao
First comment, 14:16 is facts because I had one game where level one baby was still stuck during STM. I kinda felt bad for him because he didn't level up, but everyone knew his weakness. Maybe a buff lowering it down to need less civilians would do the trick.
7:30 you really can tell he hasn’t watched gt
Brother I misspoke ik that's baby vegeta lmaooo
Good. GT isn't worth his time
@@ovahexI think the Baby arc is actually really solid, not Z Tier but on Par with Super.
The rest though??...
@@holyelixir4580 "on par with super"
yeah we aint forgetting the animation of the first 2 arcs of dbs dude
@1_Flare Yeah, because the animation of Goku and Vegeta vs. Omega is so much better. I LOVE reusing the same frames 50 times over.
SBC is dodgeable with good reaction, unless they hold you and Baby Lvl1 needs some kind of buff, like less civs to lvl up, just as they did with vegeta lvl1 now is only 3 civ. Maybe this should be a thing for raiders that can't fly.
Thank God I don't have this problem playing as baby lol.
Baby is totally not the worst he is the most campy raider in the game if you loss as him it really is on you
@@johndom8034 you aren't real you aren't real you aren't real
@@ironcane lol
Thx for replying man keep up the content
What happened to everyone saying he was strong?
Honestly raider is just so stressful
Btw iron , i agree with you about the Special beam cannon , i rather run other supers that i feel are more cool looking , Still i understand some ppl rather have the most OP stuff on their characters 24/7
I mean if you play against bad randoms baby feels like the most op raider but if you play against like really good 2 or 3 survivor premade then you have real chance of losing so it just depends on who you get in public matches
Level 3 Baby is not terrible. If anything, Super Baby 2 is one of the strongest level 3s next to Rose Black. 2 good evasives, reverse shot which is basically his own Super Buu's Ill Rain attack. Personally, most of the choices you taken were bad plays, but it entirely depends on how the survivors have been playing as well. Level 2 Baby is kinda lacking in that raw damage potential for me.
ironcane welp it might as well be said now before anyone else here think otherwise
Baby Buffs coming soon for next Update/Patch I'm just gonna make the call right there since they did say they would be more focused on balance changes as these seasons go by so yeah....
I mean you do have to memorize civs spawns. Game is almost 2 years old now. It was eventually coming to become competitive like dbd and any other games like it when the time came
After a weeks of playing killer klowns from outer its so easy to escape early from the klowns
that still doesn't change the fact that you need 5 civs as baby for his lvl 1. I think if we are really truly saying the difference between losing and winning is not finding a civ 15 seconds faster, then what are we doing? lol that's ridiculous
@@ironcane 5 is civs is crazy only had 2 games like that
In my personal opinion, ik baby has a hard time getting past level one with having to get five civs but I think they did that intentionally bc of how OP level four baby is, I've yet to win against baby as survivor in any of my matches and I've been playing this season since launch, I personally have been having the opposite outcomes with baby then iron.
@Joey0716 again, I don't think that takes away these points I've made. People winning with baby against bad groups and people losing as survivors with bad groups doesn't change the fact that fundamentally he is weak.
Goatcane post. Today is a good day. Everyday is a good day
Fucking already?
Raiders can't catch a break(ers)
People are focusing on baby having a rough level 1 compared to the other raiders, to be competitive as a raider you NEED to know the civ spawns, doesn't matter if it's how the game should be, it's the reality.
With survivors being able to swap and get stronger abilities you have to stay as competitive as possible as raider, yes 5 civs is crazy but it's not that hard to learn civ spawns and dominate as baby.
Just think how easy those matches would've went if iron knew civ spawns, he probably would've won every match instead of getting baited by people flying away from him.
there is no way people are equating me needing to find 5 civilians and not consistently doing so as a skill issue in an RNG spawn based game for resources. It is not a "skill" issue when I spawn in certain areas on certain maps and get a bad spawn and don't find civs.
The matches would not have been "easy" I pointed out the flaws in both Baby's lvl 2 and 3. If losing a game is determined by not finding a civ .5 milliseconds faster or checking the wrong area instead of another we are throwing the term "competitive" out the window here because that's ridiculous
@@ironcane Iron you're a good player but your lack of civ knowledge is holding you back for sure, you spent most of the games wandering around because you couldn't find civs and were getting baited by survivors.
It took you 3+ mins to evolve, if you evolved even a minute earlier a lot of those matches were winnable, you could've started killing off weakers players before they got d change and had keys.
playing raider is a time crunch, time matters a lot more than you give it credit. Not knowing civs spawns is fine for every raider BUT baby, getting a faster level 2 is crucial to his gameplay, like you said he snowballs.
I will miss this game i have to sell my xbox and get a good pc but there is no cross save.
I bought breakers day one it hurts
Im pretty new to the game but what is the deal with the special beam cannon? Is it not good or is it too good? Whats up. Lemme know. Ty. Love the content.
SBC is way too good, it does a lot of damage, and it fires near instantly, making it harder for raiders to react to it.
It also has low endlag making it mindlessly spammable esp at level 4
Doesn't deal full knockback gauge so if you stun a raider & they don't have an combo breaker, it's possible to get two of those for free
You can also get a guarenteed combo on it from landing a vanish kick
Extremely low risk high reward
Motionless, God, & Black Kamehameha can as well yet they don't deal nearly as much damage
Baby is definitely bad. Level 1 sucks. Can key rush him before even getting to lvl 2 and until he gets to lvl 3 he literally has Ginyu health SMH
The worst? Bruv, have you played Ginyu recently?!
Idk maybe he feels strong to me cause my teammates always get washed every time I fight Baby. Is he really that bad?
That doesn't make baby inherently strong tho. Any raider would look strong in that case
@@ironcane I know that but it's always a feeling of every time I see Baby, I'm probably going to have a bad time.
I disagree 🥶 I dont think baby is the worst raider rn. Imo your examples are a bit "Extreme" since you didnt really play well. (Which is un-avoidable since you cant predict what players will do) Like the survivors jumping you in that cave, that was unlucky. But understanding how baby works is crucial. When a survivor is in a cave you can down them with volley.
Something you said was if you have to memorize civs location then its just not player friendly. That doesn't matter. If you wanna play baby at his best then you have to do that. And its not hard to memorize as long as you play the game actively. If you don't remember then that sucks ig.
I do agree baby at lvl 1 is pretty bad since it can be hard countered and he does take awhile to evolve. But you have to be creative. If survivors are tracking your every move, teleport to another civ. Try to keep them close together so you can catch them if they try getting rid lf your infected civs. In all honesty you shouldn't even be going for survivors in sweaty matches at lvl 1.
Another thing you said was baby's attacks are slower than goku blacks which i dont think is true and i also dont think it doesn't matter. The AOE attacks are sniping moves. They arent supposed to be used in the heat of the moment. Same thing with goku black.
I've had this same complaint with goku black when he first came out. And honestly i think he's worse than baby. Is baby inconsistent? Yes due to his lvl 1. But if we compare both raiders highest highs i think baby is WAYYY better. His lvl 2 is better, his lvl 3 is better, and his lvl 4 is better.
Goku blacks biggest weakness at lvl 2 is his ki blast and low damage if you cant land any combos which is pretty hard to land (imo since i don't know the timing for it). At lvl 3 his damage is fine but you have to deal with the super transphere. Baby at lvl 3 i also agree is worse than his lvl 2 but i will also say his ki blasts are better at lvl 3 which helps a lot. Baby having 2 breakstrikes compared to goku black is a HUGE difference. Goku black is definitely more consistent but i cannot say his consistency has won me games or made me feel better playing as him. You can lose at any lvl due to his lvl 2 damage being so weak.
Both baby and goku black arent very good at crowd control at lvl 3, both movesets are basically the same. But the key difference is zamasu and servants. They both go down in 1 hit through vanish kicks but zamasu can comeback. I only use servants for ETM btw. But in games where i was forced to use servants you dont just throw them out. Give the servants space. Its important to remember that the first attack they do is a super attack so ofc they'd die easy if you spawn them right next to a survivor.
With these things in mind i really do think baby at lvl 1 kind of makes or breaks the game but he can recover because his other lvls are that strong, at least in my experience against stronger survivor teams
@karbyboi8489 champ in one sentence you're saying I played bad, and in another you're saying it's not my fault.
Baby's lvl 1 is fundamentally flawed it promotes camping and is at the will of survivors saving infected civs. If you can't catch one survivor and no infected civs are saved you have to find 5 civilians.
And again, I've said this before and I'll say this until the end of time. It is not a "skill" to have civilian spawns memorized. A raider player is not labeled "good" because they have all possible RNG positions memorized that is ridiculous.
If the game truly comes down to that, I think that is absolutely absurd.
I genuinely think saying lvl 3 baby being better than Rose is INSANE. One of his active skills have the potential to be useless, reverse shot is okay, and he has two break strikes which are fine.
In a jumping situation Rose has so many more options than Super Baby 2. He can dash and teleport to Zamasu. You can also protect zamasu by using supers. You can't do that with servants for baby.
@@ironcane 💀Yeah I said you played bad because in one part of the vid you went for the shenron summon instead of focusing on the STM and in that same vid, you got jumped by survivors because they went to rescue their buddy. You made a bad decision in one part and then the survivors coming in wasn't your fault, you didn't know that would happen. What I said wasn't contradictory.
I never even said memorizing civ spawns were a skill. I agree with you on that, which is EXACTLY WHY YOU SHOULD MEMORIZE WHERE THEY SPAWN 💀💀💀. I'm not trying to justify baby at his lvl 1 needing 5 civs at worst case scenario. I'm saying memorizing and working around baby's weakness will help you evolve faster. Again if you can't remember the spawns then that sucks for you. I understand not everyone can remember spawns but by remembering where they are you are doing yourself a huge favor at getting out of your lvl 1 WAYY faster. Focusing on high level survivors will slow you down. It's RNG, I get it but you'll still have a general idea of where to go at the very least. Saving time is important.
Baby at lvl 2&3 having 2 break strikes, especially as early as lvl 2 is crazy strong. And sure servants are useless If you don't kill anyone. But the same can be said for zamasu. If we're talking about worst case scenario, peak survivor game play all it takes it one vanish kick and you can't teleport to zamasu. Baby having 2 break strikes is consistent and that consistency will save you much more than relying on zamasu. Goku black does have a dash, that's good for chasing but honestly? You can probably just fly all the way up, instant descent and get the same results. And every raider can do that.
In a jumping situation whats gonna help you more? 2 break strikes? Or teleporting to a zamasu that's not even there? And even if he was there, depending on the phase of the game....your not even teleporting that far. Baby is DEFINITELY better at lvl 3.
The clap is back!
Baby made me stop playing the breakers 😂😂😂
lvl 1 is my favorite part lol
I feel like u can't stream snipe streamers and say u beat a streamer
14:10 ?
I hate to say it but yeah baby isnt that great, in fact the games i won as him had several people dc, it pains me to see how they massacred my boy
He needs to take three civilians to evolve or two players in level one level four is just a weaker great ape
This is outright not true baby lvl 4 is better in everyway literally just minus the tail mechanic.
And that’s why he’s worse
@@Bower-j6l I mean some people may prefer that. But the 65% dmg reduction is more than enough to not lose. Where as vegetas great ape takes increased dmg.
Look, both of them are extremely strong. You can believe what you want.
Idk man, i feel like getting either is basically a win either way
Yeah... Not a great take... Mans can hit lvl 2 just as fast as broly.... Instantly down 1-2 survs within ten seconds? Nah that's just bs fast
@@Jamstaro1 did you watch the video? It's not a "take" when I'm providing my opinion over video evidence man.
I didn't wake up and think baby was trash lol
weren't you arguing the survivors are trash now?
Survivor nerfs were in the wrong spots. That doesn't mean that baby can't also be weak or strong.
Solo is, pre-made isn't
i think other raiders like cell and goku black are better but baby is absolutely unfun to play against. i hate how im forces to play while playing against him. i agree they should make lvl 1 level up faster because that phase is corny and if you get snuck up on or god forbid round start grabbed by him it just makes the rest of the game really unfun because youre playing with 3 abilities. the other levels have counter play but if you're careless in level 1 youll just die. id prefer a dive and even key blasts over the instant kill. itd be funny to see civs shooting at me. i have more fun playing against stronger raiders because they dont have corny unfun mechanics. I'm glad people are starting to not play him anymore in my games 😅
You got killed by xbox players in first game.
Thanks for the fun fact
Baby is a good snowball character but buu is simply better at snowballing i wouldn't buy him go for zamasu/goku black
See i agree with u until i get one shot instantly at the start of the game ._.
Baby is good wydm? I've only lost once with him.
@apollojustice5589 it's not just you, but people misinterpret raiders being good and bad by losses alone. It makes sense in a bubble, but player skill and groups can influence a lot.
If you look at these matches Baby is fundamentally weaker than the rest imo and doesn't have many options either.
In my opinion Baby is not bad as people say, Goku Black still felt worse on release than Baby do, Baby is fine it’s just people gotta learn to use him, yall playing predictable which is why the lvl1 sucks to ya, im lvl 50 & never lost, fought premades and all
You think Goku Black felt worse than Baby?!?!? Also, in these games it's not even losing to "skill" per say, there's genuinely nothing you can do when players fly around and don't interact with civs when you're lvl 1.
To equate this to skill issue is a little wild imo. Again, not saying I played flawlessly here but to ignore the inherent weaknesses of the raider just because you personally haven't lost is a little biased.
@@ironcane I’m not ignoring the lvl1 issue just saying there are ways around it, I didn’t type the ways and all that, hence why I said learn him, but yea Goku Black felt worse day1 than Baby does imo
The worst, i doubt it, not op, defenetly.
Gonna be honest its depends on who you run into ive suprised plenty and you stream they most likely sniped your asss
But lowkey baby lvl 3 n 4 are mid af
Might go back to broly
this is why nimbus needs to have a duration and the cooldown shouldn't start til after its timed out...
PLZZZZ drop the hot tub stream🙏🙏🙏
Maybe you’re just bad with him. I’m level 81 with him and own.
Did you watch the video?
2x the ironcane
Nope.
Honestly baby need a rework
For starter there should not be a cutscene EVERY DAMM TIME.
For his lv1
1. No longer down survivor or damage them just infect them
2. It should take 3 civ or 2 survivor to evolve to lv2
Lv2
His Barrier cooldown need to be reduced 45 sec, 90 sec is stupid
Lv3
Should take 4 survivor to get to great ape.
I think nimbus, ship and rise just need a nerf a harsh one.
To be fair, Baby is a really cool raider, both character wise and gameplay concept
Iron I think that you're just not taking advantage of the fact that all raiders can fly directly up much faster than survivors. I see in these matches that when you get jumped you just fly always and look back occasionally throwing ki blast. Instant descenting (rarely) too. I think If you flew directly up and paired this with smartly timing instant descent you would be able to avoid quite a lot of damage. Much love.❤
@user-he7rd6pl8y you're not the first person to point that out and that's a great tip!
However in the context of these matches I lost to STM not dying
Players can play however they want that's true but the more people go try hard like this and sweat every game...
The more players are going to get sick of it and stop playing and this game is just gonna die faster.
It's like hey guys we're kinda bleeding out here, we can't really stop the bleeding. That's the developers' responsibility but as the ones playing the game still, we can try and slow down the bleeding by not playing toxic.
I know for me personally if I happen to play with a team of sweats and they're bullying the Raider I'll keep a dragonball and won't let them summon and I don't help fight the Raider or with STM.
Then if I get a Raider game where I'm going up against a team of low levels and or just aren't very good I kinda just take it slow, give them a chance to actually play the game, and sometimes I'll even let them ETM
I wanna be clear here, in either situation I'm not saying throw the game but especially since we're not in ranked yet can't we all just try and enjoy the game casually and not be a toxic try hard ruining it for others.
Idk, that's just my take...
There’s a difference between giving the raider a chance vs throwing.. and you’re throwing lol
@user-nn4mc8ge4u how am I throwing the game if the Raider is being beaten down to a quarter of his health or lower? The rest of my try hard team mates don't need my help to finish the Raider off
So no that's not throwing the game bud
Yeah, baby is pretty bad, he's literally a worse vegeta imo.
The fact people have said the opposite boggles my mind
@ironcane I don't know how, vegeta outclasses him at every level. Saibaman takes 3 civs or one survivor and is way more useful than the servants. Nappa gets evolution energy from dealing damage and has a really good melee and alt fire. Vegeta has the best melee in the game, and better supers.