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I wish none of it had been made. The newer “woke” stories actually tarnish the older established lore. I wouldn’t have had so many issues with it if they hadn’t tried to tie everyone and everything back to the other series.. if you have to remind me of the previous better series all the time it just reminds me how bad this current show is.. Star Trek needs to be allowed to die.
Discovery season 2 temporarily saved the franchise. Discovery alone was horrible. Season 1, Season 3 - terrible stopped watching the franchise. Picard season 1 was terrible. I'd seen enough. I don't care about the franchise anymore. It isn't Star Trek. Ironically, Oroville is doing a better job at Trek stories than Paramount, and Oroville ain't that great.
We now have Lower Decks! Of course I'm happy! (Which was inspired, surely, by The Orville, but it's a self-parody. That's awesome!) Mike McMahon (sp?) RULES! RITOS! I am getting another tee-shirt. 😁 Some things are unpredictable. P.S. -- Not crazy about Prodigy. It's for kids and I'm not a kid - and I don't really like that style of animation. With Lower Decks, it's almost like watching live action, not animation. It's wondrous! So, without new Trek, it wouldn't exist. I like SNWs.
Do I wish it had never been made no. Do I wish Brian Fuller wasn't signed on as showrunner yes absolutely. The ONLY good thing to come out of Discovery is SNW. That's it. The CBS CEO knew it was going to piss off fans and too make matters worse CBS shut down all fan films. To push Brian Fuller's vision of the future not Gene Roddenberry's. This is the second time Star Trek has been used to launch something. Voyager premiered to launch UPN and Discovery premiered to launch CBS all access. The key is to give fans what they want not piss them off give them a cheap knock off and say like it or watch Star Trek fade away. 🤔
I was deeply disappointed in and despised how CBS treated fan film makers and Klingon language schools and hid Star Trek behind a paywall. Those people kept Trek alive when no Trek was being produced. It's a great way to kill a franchise.
So true Disney did it with star wars declared all the books non canon, and then proceeded to mine those stories which is good but still a little crappy. Games Workshop of Warhammer40k fame did it too to all the creative animators, which is the lifeblood of franchises
I was a fan of Star Trek Continues and was devastated when they and other fan made series were shut down and replaced with Discovery. A series that IS NOT in keeping with Gene Roddenberry's hopeful vision of the future and instead, as highlighted by this video the vision of Fuller.
I have a case where CBS spies stole a character from our friends fan game they stole and used for Picard season one. It wasnt actually copyrighted but come on already
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD that's not what people hate about new track. New track is dark and torturous and painful and unenjoyable to watch. There is no hope, no optimism, no idealism. It's Star Trek in name only. There's no reason that diversity and inclusion and good storytelling and Canon respectful plots can't coexist.
I definitely think that some credit has to go to Anson Mount and Ethan Peck as they are doing great jobs as Pike and Spock and really give a Star Trek feel back to the audience
Sadly the damage is done, as much as they do a good job, STD has already done irreparable damage, decanonizing these 3 shows and starting fresh is the only way to fix it.
@@TheZamaron it’s already off canon and has been since STD’s first episode. Spock never had a sister. They retconned her in and they Tried to create a justification for why we never knew about her… The fact is, Burnham never needed to be Spocks sister. She didn’t need to have Spocks father as her own. They used recognisable Trek assets to prop her up instead of developing their own original ideas. In QoM, the reboot version of BoT, we see the same. They added some original aspects but after all the changes to that timeline, at the end of the Romulan Commanders life, he repeats the words he spoke to Kirk. Nothing that happened differently mattered to the writers who wrote that episode. They just lifted high chunks of BoT and dropped it into QoM. By then the Commander saw Pike was weak whereas Kirk was tenacious. Though given what we’ve seen in STD, Picard and many episodes of SNW, writing is not Secret Hideouts strong suit. The writers don’t have the breadth of experience to write or adapt a piece of work. DS9’s duet shows a great screenplay, the man in the glass booth, converted into a Trek story. SH miss the target every time they try to adapt a story… and worse, they actually tried to lift from another established IP. Alien…. It’s as if the writers are all 30 and never deep dived into sci fi outside of big budget IP’s in the cinema.
Anson Mount and Ethan Peck are doing fabulous in their roles. Mount as Pike will be one of the best liked Captains of all Trek series I think if things continue to go well.
Strange New Worlds is fantastic. Anson Mount is perfect as Captain Pike. He was the best part of Discovery. While I have watched both Discovery and Picard, I have been very, disappointed with them. I am hoping for a far better final season of Picard. I can’t wait for the next season of SNW.
Strange New Worlds really helped bring back the Star Trek I was used too. Discovery was hard to watch at times. Picard season 2 was much better and season 3 excites me for the future.
@@stonehorn4641 SNW was more fun… but it still demonstrates the problem with Secret Hideouts writing room and production team. They are afraid to be completely, 100% original with their screenplays within the era of Trek the show is set in. If it’s not a member berry that’s 25% different then it’s canon breaking with a mischievous, ‘but there’s a reason it’s different.’
Picard S2 is by far the worst garbage ever produced under the Trek banner, it was embarassingly, cringeworthily bad attimes. Discovery has really plumbed the depths of crap Tv too.
I have been watching Star Trek since the early 80s. My favorite has always been TNG but love them all...Including the "new Trek". All of the series have had issues. But all of them are great. I look forward to what will come from Star Trek. Like you said can't please everyone all of the time, which just means haters are going to hate.
There is nothing 'great' about STD it is a deliberate slap in the face to the very people that made the franchise the success the fans the real fans the ones who have watched it since it was on air not since the '80s since the f****** 60s
I'm not going to apologize that I was born in the 70s so not able to watch them like my parents did back then. Like I said. - haters are going to hate. Pfft the 'real fans'! This is why fandoms have become toxic. Like what you like. We will like what we like. But no reason to pull out the 'I'm better because I was alive when it first aired' card. I love Star Wars as well but was only 1 when it came out in the theater, but that doesn't mean that I like it less than the fans that watched it in the theater! - Guess the comment got deleted but I'm leaving this up just in case another 'Real Fan" from the 60s decides to attack me because of the age difference.
@@SolNexus I would never attack someone over their age. It's not like you chose the date. However.. I've been watching the series since the late 1960s. I was a child of the 1960s. What that means is I have a different perspective from someone that's a "Johnny come lately". Those people are not going to have the points of reference for context of the programming. It's not your fault, it is what it is though.
Great video with a fantastic VO! I still have not gone back to Trek since i heard SNW is using January 6th as the basis for WWIII. There is the liberal/conservative divide right there.
Thanks! I was worried the music was to loud, thanks for watching. About SNW: You're totally right but in defense of SNW, they showed both Jan 6th and the BLM Riots... They were trying to say the divide is what caused it, not a specific event. Thanks for the compliment!
@@ThePopcast agreed with your thoughts in the second half of the comment. I didn't get the impression (as Michelle said) that the events of January 6th alone kicked off World War 3 whatsoever, it's obvious they were talking about the divide in the country as you say. And the riots you mentioned as well as January 6th (extremes of all sides) are just examples of that divide. Besides the events of that day (1/6) are now a historical event in the fabric of this country, like the Bush v. Gore Supreme Court decision, the Montgomery bus boycotts (1956), the Branch Davidian compound incident in Waco, TX (1993) or the Murrah building bombing by McVeigh in OKC (1995).
Wow. I had heard hints that Fuller didn’t get Trek but you’ve made a strong case that he as guilty as Kurtzman for producing the shallow, dour, lecture series for children that STD and STP ended up being. SNW is a good start. It’s what STD should have been. I was so psyched in the beginning I loved Michelle Yeoh, Jason Isaacs and Sonequa Martin-Green from their previous work. Then I watch season 1. It was very disappointing. It was neither Trek nor good SF. It was an expensive multi hour film written by Twitter. I still have hope that SNW can be great, but I’m very leery of STP season 3. Picard almost never acts like Picard. It’s like watching you beloved grandpa suffering with dementia. His greatness surfaces once and a while to punctuate your despair.
When we were done with the research I was actually frustrated with Fuller. Mostly because he's always thrown Kurtzman under the bus even though the whole direction of the show was his idea.
I agree. " It was an expensive multi hour film written by Twitter." The first two episodes of STD felt like a crime drama with a rookie cop making mistakes with a sci-fi facade on top. The writing was lazy and the dialogue awful.
I believe that everyone who loves Star Trek . Is just keeping the franchise alive . TOS and current trek. I love them all . WE NEED SOME TOYS AND ACTION FIGURES.
This is a great video as it relates to describing what has happened behind the scenes over the years. I grew up watching TOS, and I've loved almost everything produced all the way to now.
Also Michael Burnham was trying to prevent a war by firing first to show aggression and win respect like the Vulcans did which was the only thing klingons would understand. However she was stopped before the ship fired so by not firing first caused the war
We as the fans need to admit that star trek has been divisive from the start. Ever since TNG when TOS era fans where complaining about the TNG crew which did happen. Discovery made it's mistakes in the early years we have to admit that but it also has a few, very few, good points, the later two seasons were better but still have work to do. Picard was a better attempt yes but still made a lot of mistakes during the first season and the second season was more of a fan fiction than anything in my opinion. Strange new world's was okay if you can get past the Gorn rip off of Aliens and a few other things but SNW was better than Discovery. I try to reserve my opinion on the newer trek until I have seen what they have done. With Lower Decks and Prodigy they have a opportunity that they don't seem to be willing to truly explore. That's the ability to dive into the creative side of things and blend it with Canon in a manner that will add to the lore and make sense with what we know. Lower Decks they are trying to be to much of a comedy which is okay. Until they focus to much on the comedy of a situation instead of the seriousness of it when the situation obviously calls for a level of seriousness. Prodigy, I know it is the one that is meant for the kids but it makes little to no sense to me what so ever. They are on a experimental class vessel yet that vessel is a training vessel as the holographic version of Janeway we are introduced to is a training program who seems to think that the rest of the main cast are starfleet cadets somehow. They haven't given us enough of an explanation on the overall storyline yet to fully understand anything that's going on. They jump around from plot point to plot point so often that I don't think they know what they are truly doing. New trek is entertaining I'll give them that but it can get annoying when you try to connect it to old trek and figure out how it fits in. Especially when new trek has proven to not be afraid to completely ignore established trek history.
You make a good point about Star Trek's history of divisive reception from fans. A lot of critics in the fandom who are super negative about "New Trek" or "NuTrek" also seem to forget how early seasons of TNG and DS9 struggled with quality and consistency. I grew up watching TNG as my first Trek series, and with a gun to my head I'd probably still say TNG is my favorite. But even before the advent of New Trek I'd struggle when I rewatched a lot of S1 & S2. TNG and DS9 have a complete legacy now when we think of them in hindsight, but IMO an objective viewer who compares S1 of TNG with S1 of Discovery ought to conclude that Disco is a stronger more consistent show. I'm not even trying to say S1 of Disco is *good* with that comparison, as much as reminding folks how weak S1 of TNG was. I had a similar opinion of ENT, which faced *very* similar vitriol from fans during its run to the Disco hate, but I think had a clearly much better start in its first two seasons than TNG did. No Trek show has ever been perfect, but in many ways New Trek has learned its lessons and overcome its weaknesses faster and better than legacy Trek did. SNW may be the most consistently high quality 10 episode run of any Trek show in franchise history. Trek fans ought to be more excited than ever for the future of our fandom.
Nitpicking is a past time all Trek fans have, will and should be able to perform without people berating them for it. From a comm badge that disappears, reappears, then disappears again... to every time Data used a contraction. Trek fans, then and now, are observant and enjoy sharing their observations with the Trek community... It was when Nu Trek refused to admit it was a stealth reboot that things went wrong. If STD was set in the Classic Timeline, then yes... All nitpicks based on continuity are valid. But if SH have created a new continuity that separates their Trek from Classic Trek... Then nitpicks are relegated to observations of instances of divergence in a universe that can and should do it's own thing as a new continuity... There is enough evidence to indicate SH has crafted this alt 'Prime' Continuity to follow instead of the Classic continuity spanning events from TOS to ENT. They just won't admit it, because in ambiguity they obviously believe they are benefiting. From people promoting their shows to people debating their shows, they have essentially scored twice the critics that appeal to a larger audience than either one could separately.
It’s not actually a training vessel, Janeway had her memories deleted and programming tampered with after that robot attacked. She had enough programming remaining to think they were cadets because she sees everything through a Starfleet lens. Her programming took-on that role just as the EMH is much more than a doctor. I thought the plot was tight - they escaped slavery, wanted to get asylum from the Federation, and stopped at a couple of planets along the way. There’s a couple of episodes dedicated to character growth (Kobayashi Maru and Time Amok) so they can act more cohesively. Then they got threatened back so that (narratively) they could kill off that season’s villain. The real Janeway is searching for the ship and Chakotay after it was lost, because of the loyalty and connection she has with Chakotay (which is also why Chakotay made a Janeway hologram to be his… advisor? Assistant? Proto-drive operator? First officer?).
I'm just a Trekkie. I like all of the shows. I think Burnham is a female Kirk. Strange new worlds is great. Showing the Enterprise before Kirk. Pike is a nice change from others captains. Picard is a nice way to lead into another series. Maybe Seven will get a show. She looked good in the captains chair. They need to find a spot for Warf. They could always replace Picard with Riker since he's already been on the show. The possibilities are endless.
I think the executives, producers and showrunners relying on the PC Revolution was there downfall in the Trek universe. Star Trek has always shown diversity and acceptance but not as a way of winning over a younger audience. The Lessons Learned From Roddenberry and his way of weaving it into a story as opposed to smacking it in your face would have come off far better. And as much the others who have commented in this section I do believe that strange new worlds does a far better job than the previous shows. I hope any future shows in the Star Trek universe keep their message prominent but subtle.
"foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." F'ing love Disco, SNW, Picard etc. I like the art of writers, directors, and actors along with the skill of producers to make this thing we call show. Evolution folks.
The great thing about all Star Trek series is the entire Universe is the imaginational limit but the bad thing is, it usually just devolves into a shoot 'em up and more current culture indoctrination. Sometimes I wish they would simply explore strange new worlds.
20:00 The problem with Fullers statement about "Liberal and Conservative" Star Trek Fans is.....there's a whole lot of Star Trek Fans outside the US who have nothing to do and don't want anything to do with the political thinking of the USA. So putting Star Trek fandom in those two categories already alienates (pun intended) a big portion of the fanbase.
Yep, Fuller's statement sounds a little opinionated or arrogant and narrow minded. The world is a huge place and many of us are not defined by USA politics or even interested. Its not healthy.
I don't care at all for New Trek .. maybe I'm just old and out of touch .. ST:SNW is definitely a improvement IMO .. But I still don't love it .. Maybe "my Trek" has run it course ... IDK
I'm right there with you. I still can't figure out if I REALLY like SNW or it's just I've loathed Discovery and Picard so much, that just about anything in comparison would seem great as long as it's not complete shite.
You're not old nor or you out of touch. You have a brain and can discern shit from shinola. All the NuTrek just isn't good. SNW is better, but it's not good and doesn't respect canon.
I'm going to say this. You called it. Well done. Well said. Excellent and well put together video. And, you stated the TRUTH, not just figments of people's imaginations. Thank you.
I'm a Disco lover, but I had patience with the show; in the first two episodes the mutiny was very disturbing, and they killed the captain that I liked more than Burnham in those episodes. But the rest of the season was great. I've rewatched the first two seasons of Disco several times, but for some reason watched the the episodes of S3 and S4 when they premiered and haven't felt like watching them again. I've accepted that Emperor Georgiou has been "redeemed", because I want Michelle Yeoh to have her own ST show; but I can't help but think that there's no way a fascist, murderous cannibal white dude would have ever been given a second chance.
As a lifelong Star Trek Fan, the things that anoy me the most are stuff like that the turbolift shafts that are somehow bigger than the whole ship, the Redesign of the klingons, the Spocks sister thing, that the other bridge Crew are more or less Background actors with no or few things to say. Its not well made. Does it look good? Yeah very Cinematic but it has no substance. To few likeable characters and its always about an Enigmatic galactic threat over and over again. I love strange new worlds but as i live not in the us i have to Torrent it. Same goes for the other Shows...
Fantastic video!!! Me personally, I love and can't wait for more Strang New Worlds, I'm indifferent on Discovery and couldn't care less for Picard which is strange considering TNG was my introduction to Star Trek. Have a great one!
I walked somewhere during enterpises run. Not willing to uy into uet another streaming service, either paramount or Disney tbh. When I heard about the newer series it just reinforced my position. I'm probably not coming back, but I am glad to hear of the turnaround the shows are making
On Short Treks we saw the Academy School I think. Two teens were enemies at school but bonded together as war broke out on planet where their parents worked. This would make a great series and draw a younger audience as well as interest the die-hards. Like a Cobra-Kai regenerating Karate Kid.
I had lost hope in Star Trek until capt pike appeared. In an effort to be inclusive new Trek excluded everyone like me. It had become a hopeless future where humanity had become a race of mewling babies who are only interested in virtue signaling. Lower decks gave me hope Star Trek could be saved , prodigy was a show I found very interesting. Then came strange new worlds, that show for me saved Star Trek, it had inspired hope in me again that Star Trek could be what it was. From the new theme music to the writing that was so beyond anything on discovery. I’m back into Star Trek not because of discovery and it’s pandering and virtue signaling and over the top leftist agenda, no imback because snow showed there is hope and wonder in the universe and that we don’t have to force an agenda down the throats of the fans. New Trek had forgotten that Star Trek isn’t about what you are it’s about who you are.
When Strange New Worlds introduced a nonbinary character it was like 3 lines of dialog and nobody cared. They were a pretty good villain, he's a pretty skilled actor. It was a nonissue. When Discovery had a gender-non-conforming character come out, they spent multiple episodes fixated on that one (pretty minor) aspect of an otherwise fairly interesting character. The Expanse did it best, though.
As someone who watched TNG as a kid growing up the rest of the series to follow, I have not and will not watch the 'new' trek. Fare thee well my fallen compatriots.
I'll do it for you - man cosplays trek cosplay as kid - makes millions off of crude jokes - approaches network execs to make his own trek show, he gets turned down - he then goes back to cosplaying trek, but with money
@21:11 Fuller was long gone by the beginning of the first season and his pilot was completely reworked. What you're seeing in the end result (despite contractually mandated title credit) is not his vision.
Great video, I grew up following all the Trek series, even Voyager, although I am not a Janeway fan. But Discovery has been a letdown. Picard was wonderful fan service and redeemed the franchise partly. Now lower Decks and SNW are both amazing and brings Trek back to form.
Star Trek has always been about going beyond and pushing through to #AnUndiscoveredCountry. I am a self avowed hard-core Trekkie and have been since my childhood, so I love New Trek because it takes me to new concepts rather than just tool around and overly familiar Universe in a new ship doing the same old things. #LifeIsChangeAndIEmbraceIt. I wish others would as well. #LLAP.
I'm a huge Star Trek fan. TOS, TNG, VOY DS9 and even ENT. Like them all. STD was a slap in the face to me. I found it disgusting. Picard was a little better, however they murdered my favorite captain, and I'm not talking about the turning him into an Android bullshit. He wasn't the same man. I stopped watching midway through the first season. SNW is much better. I'm definitely enjoying it, but I'm about 3 episode behind right now with no urgency to catch up. But I will though. It's not perfect, and I haven't decided if it's actually good or just better than the other shit. The jury's still out on that for me. Either way, I love your reviews and thank you guys for making these great videos!
Im of that exact opinion although i stopped watching STD after season one i dont mind the tone just like stargate universes darker tone. I tuned out of Picard halfway through the first season, that man was like a father figure to me and i didnt recognize him, he let his liberal views shine through way too much and liberals were great back in the day, but unbearable now.
I tried the new shows but they feel flat to me. I tried STW and could not tolerate the cannon bending and breaking they did. I know they can do better but choose not too.
Interesting take, I never felt early Discovery was female centric, it always felt almost like the opposite, like some 15 year old boy trying to make Trek edgy and dark in order to make it seem cooler, also Ash, Saru and Sarek, were featured prominently in season 1, all of them non LGBTQ, not completely evil male characters, plus at the end 2 of the big bads of the season where also female so it's not like they were presenting a clear imbalance. Honestly production design, directing and writing was just subpar, seeing SNW visuals just makes Disco look so muddy and low quality in comparison, and makes it clear they didn't even care to look at TOS or any trek, while designing anything.
That's what's great about people, we can all see things differently and that doesn't mean we're wrong. Hopefully we can always agree to disagree and stay friends. Thank you for sharing!
Another excellent video. Enjoyed it greatly. A really good explanation of why things have terribly gone wrong since 2017. Since the release of ST SNWs and for the first time since TNG and DS9, I look forward to the following week's episode. Looking forward to season 2 too. I stopped watching Discovery and Picard but SNWs brought me back. The first 2 shows were not optimistic, not aspirational, very little good sci-fi, far too many snr officers have personal problems/issues that were not addressed by Starfleet at the Academy or a starship's Counsellor (defied the odds that so many could progress up the promotions ladder), characters self-absorbed, stories had more than their fair share of plot holes or contrivances and the shows were too dark for humour to shine through. Fingers crossed that SNWs continues to respect Roddenberry's Trek. My doubt is, a small fear that in the future SNWs is rejigged a tad to change course to Discovery/Picard Trek. Maybe its just my PTSD talking, contracted during season 1 of Discovery. I have 2 disappointments with SNWs. A loss of diversity after the premature removal of the Aenar character, Hemmer. Too many hu-mons on the Enterprise, bring back our Aenar. Secondly, the power of science is sometimes lacking, where is the 'can do' attitude seen in TOS where Spock and Bones would arrive at a solution, with slim odds of success, to hopefully save the day or die trying. Unfortunately, Hemmer didn't receive this treatment. Btw I like the theme music in your videos.
Anything that carries Star Trek forward is OK with me, USNRET Submariner. I used to watch Star Trek serialized while attending U.S. Submarine School in Groton, CT in the late 70's, every day, then run to make it to the chow hall before it closed. "I have been and always will be" a Star Trek fan.
I think that some people involved in new ST shows don’t just despise hardcore fans, but the original material as well. That’s why they only do the right thing after all other options are exhausted.
Star Trek strange new worlds is fantastic Discovery I stopped watching after season 1 episode 6 when they decapitated the infant and threw it Down in the hole I was like yeah that's not Star Trek no decapitated infants in Star Trek
Such a succinctly put and well researched video! I'd like to sincerely thank @The Popcast for putting this together. It really reflected how I personally felt about all the new Trek series since Discovery. Personally, the only series that I'm even partially interested in watching at the moment are 'Strange New Worlds' and 'Lower Decks'. Picard is dead to me and I've got absolutely no interest in ever going back to it.
A significant element that has hurt much of the new Star Trek offerings is the overt and overwhelming modern social justice (a.k.a. "woke") bias evidenced in the shows. In its origin, and often at its best, Star Trek seamlessly demonstrated diversity and social consciousness. These details were woven into the background of exciting science fiction storytelling. In contrast, modern producers and writers prefer to put their advocacies at the head of their narratives. The new Star Trek comes off as heavy-handed, unrealistic, disingenuous, and even manipulative in the way previous Star Treks didn't. Instead of stimulating imagination and open-mindedness, the often over-the-top political/social messaging and moralizing have pushed away many traditional fans and mainstream viewers. Star Trek is not alone, as polarized ideologies disguised within entertainment have been increasingly and intrusively embedded into current popular culture projects.
Picard is more like a reunion show with TNG characters constantly popping in to prop up the show, and with season 3 having the entire TNG cast there it proves my point. Discovery is one of those "meh" shows. It has no ties to Enterprise or TOS which it is supposed to be in between. The only saving grace for Disco was when they brought Anson Mount in as Captain Pike. I like Star Trek New Worlds as it truly fills in the years between Pike and Kirk being in command of the Enterprise, although I found the season 1 finale to be strange with Kirk and Pike both involved in the TOS episode "Balance Of Terror". I hope they don't try that experiment again where Pike is in command of the Enterprise during TOS episodes.
I have watched every single episode of every Star Trek tv show and I have seen all the movies. From TOS when I was a small child watching with my dad up to the last episode of SNW. (Including the animated TOS series.) Each one of them has been great. Yes, some I liked some episodes better than others but my entire lifetime has involved Star Trek. After the long absence from TV, I was excited for Discovery when it came out. And I wasn't disappointed. (Well, Lorca was terrible but ya know, that was the point.) Each show has been different than the others. DS9 is VERY different than Voyager which is different than Enterprise etc. But that's ok. Each new show brings new characters with unique strengths. I don't think we would have been ready for SNW without Discovery. Some folks are always going to complain (I remember when people didn't like Enterprise at all). I guess it's just part of the process of producing entertainment. I for one, can't wait to see what the future holds.
Oh, and as to the issue of women fans versus men? I am a woman. My boyfriend has always been indifferent to Star Trek. I am the one that generates all the views (well he watches with me.)
I'll offer my perspective, FWIW. I don't think the 'critic' position was addressed adequately, except to set up straw-man arguments of what "we" might be uncomfortable with and to hope that "we can all just get along" as we dance arm-in-arm to a new future of Star Trek Awesomeness. This is perhaps the most positive look at new-Trek that I have seen in a long time and it explains a lot of things well about the back stories of the production, which I was not completely aware of. But I am one of those fans who have chosen to walk away. While I was inspired into advanced studies and work in the STEM field, in part due to the vision and inspiration of old Trek, I don't need to see "myself" or see my "identify" on-screen... indeed, I find that condescending and pandering, especially in the way that the production team has chosen to do it. And quite truthfully, they don't represent me. These are sad, selfish, small people on the screen. I want nothing to do with them, regardless of gender, race, or whatever. There is very little virtue or goodness to find in them or their 'journeys'. I am not against serialized television... I wish they had done more of that 20 years ago. I would have loved to have seen a protracted season, for instance, of dealing with the Borg after their invasion of earth in TNG. Deep Space Nine has only grown better with time. I was less enthused about Voyager myself, and I think Enterprise was cut off when it was just getting its legs (but it probably needed to happen that way). I'm not thrown by the cosmetic changes found in a series being 50 years newer than the original... that's all on the surface. Discovery is beautiful. I really want to like this, but I gave somewhere in season 2 and walked away, never to return, except to heckle by watching the summaries and reviews on the Internet. Of the episodes that I watched, I find there is zero re-watch interest (unlike the years of Star Trek before), as these stories burn themselves out on the initial view and have no residual dramatic or artistic value. The storylines that I have been following from the outside don't interest me at all. As a matter of non-support, I do not subscribe to Paramount+ out of principle that they are doing a terrible job with the Trek I.P. and I do not want to support that until it changes. The characters are shallow and one-dimensional, and most of them I found unlikable. The rest of them, I couldn't for the life of me even remember their names. Most of them are under-developed-- they are nobodies... zeros... place-holders. Of the development that has been invested in Burnham, I find her simply insufferable on so many levels. The stories are dark and stupid. At the base, the writers don't seem to understand 'Trek' and even if they were writing for the Love Boat, they don't seem to have a very good grasp at characterization, drama, suspense, cause-and-effect, relationships, humor, pacing, science, or the science fiction tradition in literature (other than to be a pale copy of some of other properties). They just aren't very good writers in my overall estimation... and that's judging them on the level of the Love Boat, not in respect to a first-class property like Star Trek. As for politics, yeah, I am not in the "California Values" demographic, either. But I am more than willing to engage good discussion of these matters... that is what is lacking in our political discourse today--- that ability to debate, make an argument, arrive at compromises while coming to know better one's own boundaries and unassailable truths, and then find a way to get along. I certainly don't think the writers or the production team have any respect for me as a stakeholder in that discussion... but maybe is is less a matter of respect and more a problem that the writers and producers in that they are not skilled enough to engage the discussion in a responsible, mature, intelligent way. That other show, you know, Star Trek Lite, over there on Fox... they DO know how to hold up the mirror and ask the important questions that actually engage thought and discussion... and that is the tradition of TOS and TNG and the others in a big way. This is the essence of drama, is it not? The tension and resolution of the 'big questions' that face us in our day, retold in a way to abstract it a bit and then return to the world changed? Science Fiction as a literary form is a quintessential medium for this, but the writers and producers are simply not up to it. I am disoriented by the retconning of canon. Canon is not a perfect art or science, but so much of what was good has been completely undermined by the dark and the stupid. One can put aside little inconsistencies for the sake of a good story. These are not good stories or interesting characters. In short, it appears that in the stewardship of the canon has been entrusted to 'small' people. Those running this production, both those in character and those behind the camera, and it is flagrantly obvious they are standing on the shoulders of giants and pissing away the legacy, not really knowing what to do with it... like a teenager taking the keys to an expensive sports car that is not theirs and that they did not earn, and tearing it up. For sure, broadcast TV and streaming it is all about making money and capturing eyes and selling ads an merch and all of that, but it would seem that they are not doing that well, either. As a long-time fan, going almost to the era of the original (I did not see it on broadcast TV, but in syndication in the years following while growing up), it is like a death in the family, maybe a murder. I can't help but be a bit emotional about it. The best thing that could happen is that Paramount and CBS fail, someone else buy the I.P. and put it to bed for a few years to let it recover, and then start with people who really know what they are doing. Sorry... this goes deep with me. Indeed, except to consider the perceived injustices and disappointments in what happened and what could have been, which is the essence of this... essay... Star Trek is largely a thing of the past for me now and now a matter of growing indifference. Hopefully that provides a bit better insight into the mind of a 'critic'.
I love captain pike because it makeup for the cage TOS we get see plke legacy I grow up watching the original startrek know pike as man and the wheelchair I love William Shatner but I think pike deserves his shot in the captain chair
Picard was ok the first season except for the last episode. Season 2? I managed to watch 2 episodes before resigning to never watching it again. I've seen the full complete seasons of the OG Star Trek, TNG, Voyager, DS9 & Enterprise at least 3 times each, all the movies and the first 3 in the theaters (I'm old) and was let down by Discovery and Picard. This is coming from someone who liked Strange New Worlds is amazing. There might be hope yet.
Of the 5 series that truly are Star Trek to me and that started it all, (TOS, Next Gen, DS9, Voyager, & Enterprise), I was a fan of all. I can't even relate to those who reject any one of them. I'm not all that hard to please when it comes to Trek. I tried, made a few good running starts, to get into Discovery, and just couldn't. It was just too dark. If I want to immerse myself in something dark, Trek is not now and will likely never ever be my go-to. Same thing with Picard. I was so hopeful and wanted to like it, but, again, just too dark, and too.., too many things I can't quite put my finger on, but whatever it is, I just can't. That said, SNW had been on 2-3 months when I could muster the courage to give it a chance. Metaphorically speaking, I watched peeking through my fingers and holding my breath - and was so pleasantly surprised when I could take down my hands, fully open my eyes, take a breath, and Trek on!! Hope is not dead! I turn to Trek for hope. I need hope, so I turn to Trek a lot. It's nice to have new characters to invest in. It's just great. Anson Mount as Pike is fantastic! I've been a fan of Rebecca Romihn since The Librarians and am thrilled with her #1. La'an is 100% right. She's a ton of fun (newbie cadets, what do they know?)!
Ethan Peck's sexy Spock is sublime. LOVE Ortegas!! And, I was just saying to my husband, I hope Nichelle Nichols has been able to see Celia Rose's younger Uhura portrayal. It's hard to imagine she would be disappointed. As for me...the girl crushing on Uhura goes on and on. LOVE Hemmer too (been enthralled with the Aenar since Enterprise introduced them, and Hemmer, well, I'm crushing on him too).
I'm still working my way through the last season of Discovery and I have yet to watch Strange New Worlds. I also need to watch the 2nd season of Lower Decks. I have to say, Picard has been the most disappointing for me so far. I've truly enjoyed parts of it, but the overall storytelling just feels lazy. It's rather unfortunate since I'm a long time fan and I've been watching the original airing of episodes since the beginning of TNG. I do agree with the break down of Discovery and I have been enjoying this most recent season, but the tone and new look of the Klingons early on did irk me a great deal. I mean it's not like they really messed with any of the other legacy aliens. They have a thoroughly established look, so I'm not sure why they thought that was necessary. I understand things change, but there's so much untapped universe out there for them to explore and yet all they can ever do is go back to the well and mess with everything long time fans love about the franchise. I know sometimes that its probably the safer bet when it comes to making sure you're turning a profit and you can't always cater every detail to long time fans, but for the love of god just do something new for once if you can't do the older series justice. I mean nothing against Strange New Worlds, it actually looks pretty good, but how many iterations of Spock are we going to get?
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD lol settle down there, I wasn't really knocking Discovery overall or it's diversity. In fact that's something I've always appreciated about Star Trek but ok. By the way, your Caps Lock appears to be on.
So long Kurtzman, JarJar Abrams (a guy who doesn't like ST and made the films into action Star Wars, and he even suck in that franchise), Bad Robot and Secret Hideout are behind the production, together with the 25% rule in the contract, is Star Trek dead. The ratings are in the ground and the merchandise doesn't sell. It was never simpler for me to save money.
There seems to be far more criticism and Opinions of what everyone wants or expects from Star Trek, I just turned 71 and remember the 1966 airing of TOS. And with all that Star Trek has been and is since then, I believe that any Trek is better than no Trek... Except for maybe "The Final frontier" Shatner in the Captains chair - Great. In the Directors chair, not so much.
Have never watched Discovery or Picard, SNW is ok, but to enjoy it, I like to think of it as an alternate reality, because of lore destruction, I do enjoy Lower Decks.
Sorry but this looks like a paid video to put the current people running the show in a better light. There is no redemption for what they have done to the franchise. Only a total rollback. You have Q just make it all a nightmare.
in hindsight putting fuller in charge was the mistake that killed trek and all kurtzman did was see the flawed concept to fruition instead of changing the concept to fit more into the star trek. ithis entire iteration of trek should never have been made
If they’re theory that women were the primary fans, and women LOVED the previous series, then why change the previous formula that women loved? None of this makes any sense.
I like parts of STD and later seasons are better. I think STD helped paved the way for SNW being so good. If they started out with SNW I think it would have been bad. These are all somewhat new producers and writers to Star Trek that it’s taking time for them to learn. It stinks that it didn’t start off with a huge bang, but I think they are learning and hopefully producing better Trek going forward.
I’ve watched all Star , Trek series and films from the first one show in Great Brittany , to the latest one ,all series and films ,I’m 72 years old and I love them all , they give me joy,happy memories and hope of the future space exploring
I'm firmly in the "never say an unkind word about Star Trek" camp. I loyally followed Voyager and Enterprise, but mumbled the whole time how I wished they'd find a new way to tell the same stories (aside from the individual stand-out episodes you thoughtfully mention here). Now I finally have it. Four shows, year round, very different, all in the same lore-rich universe. Some are better than others; they all have their individual flaws, but I am here for every minute. Even when they're clunkers.
For me Star Trek revolves around the 60s tv star ship design, Next Gen was a disgrace to the Enterprise and JJ Abram's movies didn't help either.......
There's nothing wrong with franchises trying something different. _DS9_ did so and I loved it. It's also fine, as I age, that franchises make shows that are not targeted to me, and hence I may not enjoy them. I've experienced this already; "That's not my XX." Sad, but I move on. But what's difficult to accept is when a franchise is taken in a new direction by making fundamental changes to the subject matter, seemingly attempting to invalidate what came before. With a vast array of time and space in which to tell the new story, over-writing past convention feels unnecessarily hostile and purposefully insulting as a fan. As if the new creators simply knocked down what preceded it out of spite... or insecurity. I end up walking away from the program just the same, but it's hard to fathom what the studio has gained fostering such an antagonistic break up.
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It may have worked. if it wasn't for discovery or Picard we would have not gotten SNW
I wish none of it had been made. The newer “woke” stories actually tarnish the older established lore. I wouldn’t have had so many issues with it if they hadn’t tried to tie everyone and everything back to the other series.. if you have to remind me of the previous better series all the time it just reminds me how bad this current show is..
Star Trek needs to be allowed to die.
Discovery season 2 temporarily saved the franchise. Discovery alone was horrible. Season 1, Season 3 - terrible stopped watching the franchise. Picard season 1 was terrible. I'd seen enough. I don't care about the franchise anymore. It isn't Star Trek. Ironically, Oroville is doing a better job at Trek stories than Paramount, and Oroville ain't that great.
We now have Lower Decks! Of course I'm happy!
(Which was inspired, surely, by The Orville, but it's a self-parody. That's awesome!) Mike McMahon (sp?) RULES! RITOS! I am getting another tee-shirt. 😁
Some things are unpredictable.
P.S. -- Not crazy about Prodigy. It's for kids and I'm not a kid - and I don't really like that style of animation. With Lower Decks, it's almost like watching live action, not animation. It's wondrous! So, without new Trek, it wouldn't exist.
I like SNWs.
Do I wish it had never been made no. Do I wish Brian Fuller wasn't signed on as showrunner yes absolutely. The ONLY good thing to come out of Discovery is SNW. That's it. The CBS CEO knew it was going to piss off fans and too make matters worse CBS shut down all fan films. To push Brian Fuller's vision of the future not Gene Roddenberry's. This is the second time Star Trek has been used to launch something. Voyager premiered to launch UPN and Discovery premiered to launch CBS all access. The key is to give fans what they want not piss them off give them a cheap knock off and say like it or watch Star Trek fade away. 🤔
I was deeply disappointed in and despised how CBS treated fan film makers and Klingon language schools and hid Star Trek behind a paywall. Those people kept Trek alive when no Trek was being produced. It's a great way to kill a franchise.
Great point, that was very scummy
So true Disney did it with star wars declared all the books non canon, and then proceeded to mine those stories which is good but still a little crappy. Games Workshop of Warhammer40k fame did it too to all the creative animators, which is the lifeblood of franchises
I was a fan of Star Trek Continues and was devastated when they and other fan made series were shut down and replaced with Discovery. A series that IS NOT in keeping with Gene Roddenberry's hopeful vision of the future and instead, as highlighted by this video the vision of Fuller.
I love what they did keeping people from stealing their stuff
I have a case where CBS spies stole a character from our friends fan game they stole and used for Picard season one.
It wasnt actually copyrighted but come on already
There is nothing that jar jar Abrams and Alex Klutzsman can't ruin.
Well put!
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD too bad that was more important than telling good stories and giving characters we ALL could care about.
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD that's not what people hate about new track. New track is dark and torturous and painful and unenjoyable to watch. There is no hope, no optimism, no idealism. It's Star Trek in name only. There's no reason that diversity and inclusion and good storytelling and Canon respectful plots can't coexist.
I definitely think that some credit has to go to Anson Mount and Ethan Peck as they are doing great jobs as Pike and Spock and really give a Star Trek feel back to the audience
Sadly the damage is done, as much as they do a good job, STD has already done irreparable damage, decanonizing these 3 shows and starting fresh is the only way to fix it.
@@TheZamaron it’s already off canon and has been since STD’s first episode.
Spock never had a sister. They retconned her in and they Tried to create a justification for why we never knew about her… The fact is, Burnham never needed to be Spocks sister. She didn’t need to have Spocks father as her own. They used recognisable Trek assets to prop her up instead of developing their own original ideas.
In QoM, the reboot version of BoT, we see the same. They added some original aspects but after all the changes to that timeline, at the end of the Romulan Commanders life, he repeats the words he spoke to Kirk. Nothing that happened differently mattered to the writers who wrote that episode. They just lifted high chunks of BoT and dropped it into QoM. By then the Commander saw Pike was weak whereas Kirk was tenacious.
Though given what we’ve seen in STD, Picard and many episodes of SNW, writing is not Secret Hideouts strong suit. The writers don’t have the breadth of experience to write or adapt a piece of work.
DS9’s duet shows a great screenplay, the man in the glass booth, converted into a Trek story. SH miss the target every time they try to adapt a story… and worse, they actually tried to lift from another established IP. Alien…. It’s as if the writers are all 30 and never deep dived into sci fi outside of big budget IP’s in the cinema.
@@davfree9732 I know, which is why I massively hate STD, it breaks even the most basic visual continuity,
@@TheZamaron There is always the Orville.
Anson Mount and Ethan Peck are doing fabulous in their roles. Mount as Pike will be one of the best liked Captains of all Trek series I think if things continue to go well.
Strange New Worlds is fantastic. Anson Mount is perfect as Captain Pike. He was the best part of Discovery. While I have watched both Discovery and Picard, I have been very, disappointed with them. I am hoping for a far better final season of Picard. I can’t wait for the next season of SNW.
Strange New Worlds really helped bring back the Star Trek I was used too. Discovery was hard to watch at times. Picard season 2 was much better and season 3 excites me for the future.
Picard s2 was terrible. It had two good episodes. It was everything I hate about modern trek.
SNW is the only saving grace trek has now.
@@stonehorn4641 SNW was more fun… but it still demonstrates the problem with Secret Hideouts writing room and production team. They are afraid to be completely, 100% original with their screenplays within the era of Trek the show is set in.
If it’s not a member berry that’s 25% different then it’s canon breaking with a mischievous, ‘but there’s a reason it’s different.’
Discovery was hard to watch AT TIMES? Decapitated Infants much?
Couldn't have said it better.
Picard S2 is by far the worst garbage ever produced under the Trek banner, it was embarassingly, cringeworthily bad attimes. Discovery has really plumbed the depths of crap Tv too.
More. More. More. Make it so!
I have been watching Star Trek since the early 80s. My favorite has always been TNG but love them all...Including the "new Trek". All of the series have had issues. But all of them are great. I look forward to what will come from Star Trek. Like you said can't please everyone all of the time, which just means haters are going to hate.
Same, right back to early 80's!
There is nothing 'great' about STD it is a deliberate slap in the face to the very people that made the franchise the success the fans the real fans the ones who have watched it since it was on air not since the '80s since the f****** 60s
I'm not going to apologize that I was born in the 70s so not able to watch them like my parents did back then. Like I said. - haters are going to hate. Pfft the 'real fans'! This is why fandoms have become toxic. Like what you like. We will like what we like. But no reason to pull out the 'I'm better because I was alive when it first aired' card. I love Star Wars as well but was only 1 when it came out in the theater, but that doesn't mean that I like it less than the fans that watched it in the theater!
- Guess the comment got deleted but I'm leaving this up just in case another 'Real Fan" from the 60s decides to attack me because of the age difference.
@@SolNexus I would never attack someone over their age. It's not like you chose the date. However.. I've been watching the series since the late 1960s. I was a child of the 1960s. What that means is I have a different perspective from someone that's a "Johnny come lately". Those people are not going to have the points of reference for context of the programming. It's not your fault, it is what it is though.
Excellent coverage as always!
Thank you BlackCell!
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD what's a whire?
Great video with a fantastic VO!
I still have not gone back to Trek since i heard SNW is using January 6th as the basis for WWIII. There is the liberal/conservative divide right there.
Spot on. They just can't seem to stop pushing an agenda. SNW is more of the same. Star Trek Continues is how you properly make a TOS era show.
Thanks! I was worried the music was to loud, thanks for watching. About SNW:
You're totally right but in defense of SNW, they showed both Jan 6th and the BLM Riots... They were trying to say the divide is what caused it, not a specific event. Thanks for the compliment!
@@ThePopcast agreed with your thoughts in the second half of the comment. I didn't get the impression (as Michelle said) that the events of January 6th alone kicked off World War 3 whatsoever, it's obvious they were talking about the divide in the country as you say. And the riots you mentioned as well as January 6th (extremes of all sides) are just examples of that divide. Besides the events of that day (1/6) are now a historical event in the fabric of this country, like the Bush v. Gore Supreme Court decision, the Montgomery bus boycotts (1956), the Branch Davidian compound incident in Waco, TX (1993) or the Murrah building bombing by McVeigh in OKC (1995).
@@ThePopcast Oooh, i didn't know that! Thanks for letting me know- i was totally ignorant on that point.
Thanks, Podcaster. I'm happy with all Trek as an original Trekker from 9/8/66, except Section 31.
And I LOVE Section 31. Oh well.....
@@trekkersdelight9677, and see, there is a Trek for us all!! 🇺🇸 This is America, dadgum it! BTW, where is my flying car 🚗 that I was promised?
Wow. I had heard hints that Fuller didn’t get Trek but you’ve made a strong case that he as guilty as Kurtzman for producing the shallow, dour, lecture series for children that STD and STP ended up being. SNW is a good start. It’s what STD should have been. I was so psyched in the beginning I loved Michelle Yeoh, Jason Isaacs and Sonequa Martin-Green from their previous work. Then I watch season 1. It was very disappointing. It was neither Trek nor good SF. It was an expensive multi hour film written by Twitter. I still have hope that SNW can be great, but I’m very leery of STP season 3. Picard almost never acts like Picard. It’s like watching you beloved grandpa suffering with dementia. His greatness surfaces once and a while to punctuate your despair.
When we were done with the research I was actually frustrated with Fuller. Mostly because he's always thrown Kurtzman under the bus even though the whole direction of the show was his idea.
I agree. " It was an expensive multi hour film written by Twitter."
The first two episodes of STD felt like a crime drama with a rookie cop making mistakes with a sci-fi facade on top. The writing was lazy and the dialogue awful.
Well done video. Expresses many of the same concerns I have had, although I have given each new show a chance.
We love Star Trek because we lived this kinda life in our past and the series bring out theses memories
I believe that everyone who loves Star Trek . Is just keeping the franchise alive . TOS and current trek. I love them all . WE NEED SOME TOYS AND ACTION FIGURES.
I'm just luvin it all all all!Trekking it up Boo!
Who else appreciates Enterprise even more after watching Discovery, Picard.
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD you just go around posting the same work bulshit without any thought or Insight? Clearly you do.
Everyone with a brain, Sam. And that explains Andy's comment.
This is a great video as it relates to describing what has happened behind the scenes over the years. I grew up watching TOS, and I've loved almost everything produced all the way to now.
Also Michael Burnham was trying to prevent a war by firing first to show aggression and win respect like the Vulcans did which was the only thing klingons would understand. However she was stopped before the ship fired so by not firing first caused the war
I love Picard ! Even though a lil' confusing at times..
We as the fans need to admit that star trek has been divisive from the start. Ever since TNG when TOS era fans where complaining about the TNG crew which did happen. Discovery made it's mistakes in the early years we have to admit that but it also has a few, very few, good points, the later two seasons were better but still have work to do. Picard was a better attempt yes but still made a lot of mistakes during the first season and the second season was more of a fan fiction than anything in my opinion. Strange new world's was okay if you can get past the Gorn rip off of Aliens and a few other things but SNW was better than Discovery.
I try to reserve my opinion on the newer trek until I have seen what they have done. With Lower Decks and Prodigy they have a opportunity that they don't seem to be willing to truly explore. That's the ability to dive into the creative side of things and blend it with Canon in a manner that will add to the lore and make sense with what we know. Lower Decks they are trying to be to much of a comedy which is okay. Until they focus to much on the comedy of a situation instead of the seriousness of it when the situation obviously calls for a level of seriousness.
Prodigy, I know it is the one that is meant for the kids but it makes little to no sense to me what so ever. They are on a experimental class vessel yet that vessel is a training vessel as the holographic version of Janeway we are introduced to is a training program who seems to think that the rest of the main cast are starfleet cadets somehow. They haven't given us enough of an explanation on the overall storyline yet to fully understand anything that's going on. They jump around from plot point to plot point so often that I don't think they know what they are truly doing.
New trek is entertaining I'll give them that but it can get annoying when you try to connect it to old trek and figure out how it fits in. Especially when new trek has proven to not be afraid to completely ignore established trek history.
You make a good point about Star Trek's history of divisive reception from fans. A lot of critics in the fandom who are super negative about "New Trek" or "NuTrek" also seem to forget how early seasons of TNG and DS9 struggled with quality and consistency.
I grew up watching TNG as my first Trek series, and with a gun to my head I'd probably still say TNG is my favorite. But even before the advent of New Trek I'd struggle when I rewatched a lot of S1 & S2. TNG and DS9 have a complete legacy now when we think of them in hindsight, but IMO an objective viewer who compares S1 of TNG with S1 of Discovery ought to conclude that Disco is a stronger more consistent show. I'm not even trying to say S1 of Disco is *good* with that comparison, as much as reminding folks how weak S1 of TNG was. I had a similar opinion of ENT, which faced *very* similar vitriol from fans during its run to the Disco hate, but I think had a clearly much better start in its first two seasons than TNG did.
No Trek show has ever been perfect, but in many ways New Trek has learned its lessons and overcome its weaknesses faster and better than legacy Trek did. SNW may be the most consistently high quality 10 episode run of any Trek show in franchise history. Trek fans ought to be more excited than ever for the future of our fandom.
Nitpicking is a past time all Trek fans have, will and should be able to perform without people berating them for it.
From a comm badge that disappears, reappears, then disappears again... to every time Data used a contraction. Trek fans, then and now, are observant and enjoy sharing their observations with the Trek community...
It was when Nu Trek refused to admit it was a stealth reboot that things went wrong. If STD was set in the Classic Timeline, then yes... All nitpicks based on continuity are valid. But if SH have created a new continuity that separates their Trek from Classic Trek... Then nitpicks are relegated to observations of instances of divergence in a universe that can and should do it's own thing as a new continuity...
There is enough evidence to indicate SH has crafted this alt 'Prime' Continuity to follow instead of the Classic continuity spanning events from TOS to ENT. They just won't admit it, because in ambiguity they obviously believe they are benefiting. From people promoting their shows to people debating their shows, they have essentially scored twice the critics that appeal to a larger audience than either one could separately.
It’s not actually a training vessel, Janeway had her memories deleted and programming tampered with after that robot attacked. She had enough programming remaining to think they were cadets because she sees everything through a Starfleet lens. Her programming took-on that role just as the EMH is much more than a doctor.
I thought the plot was tight - they escaped slavery, wanted to get asylum from the Federation, and stopped at a couple of planets along the way. There’s a couple of episodes dedicated to character growth (Kobayashi Maru and Time Amok) so they can act more cohesively. Then they got threatened back so that (narratively) they could kill off that season’s villain.
The real Janeway is searching for the ship and Chakotay after it was lost, because of the loyalty and connection she has with Chakotay (which is also why Chakotay made a Janeway hologram to be his… advisor? Assistant? Proto-drive operator? First officer?).
Great video thanks Popcast cheers.😊
I'm just a Trekkie. I like all of the shows. I think Burnham is a female Kirk. Strange new worlds is great. Showing the Enterprise before Kirk. Pike is a nice change from others captains. Picard is a nice way to lead into another series. Maybe Seven will get a show. She looked good in the captains chair. They need to find a spot for Warf. They could always replace Picard with Riker since he's already been on the show. The possibilities are endless.
Love “Captain Pike” it’s like he’s almost “Kirk” and Puhleese don’t show Shatners sneeze-laughing ever again
I think the executives, producers and showrunners relying on the PC Revolution was there downfall in the Trek universe. Star Trek has always shown diversity and acceptance but not as a way of winning over a younger audience. The Lessons Learned From Roddenberry and his way of weaving it into a story as opposed to smacking it in your face would have come off far better. And as much the others who have commented in this section I do believe that strange new worlds does a far better job than the previous shows. I hope any future shows in the Star Trek universe keep their message prominent but subtle.
"foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." F'ing love Disco, SNW, Picard etc. I like the art of writers, directors, and actors along with the skill of producers to make this thing we call show. Evolution folks.
The great thing about all Star Trek series is the entire Universe is the imaginational limit but the bad thing is, it usually just devolves into a shoot 'em up and more current culture indoctrination. Sometimes I wish they would simply explore strange new worlds.
20:00 The problem with Fullers statement about "Liberal and Conservative" Star Trek Fans is.....there's a whole lot of Star Trek Fans outside the US who have nothing to do and don't want anything to do with the political thinking of the USA. So putting Star Trek fandom in those two categories already alienates (pun intended) a big portion of the fanbase.
Yep, Fuller's statement sounds a little opinionated or arrogant and narrow minded. The world is a huge place and many of us are not defined by USA politics or even interested. Its not healthy.
I love all the Star Trek series!
Just filled with joy and then quickly filled with rage and disappointment
I don't care at all for New Trek .. maybe I'm just old and out of touch .. ST:SNW is definitely a improvement IMO .. But I still don't love it .. Maybe "my Trek" has run it course ... IDK
I'm right there with you. I still can't figure out if I REALLY like SNW or it's just I've loathed Discovery and Picard so much, that just about anything in comparison would seem great as long as it's not complete shite.
You're not old nor or you out of touch. You have a brain and can discern shit from shinola. All the NuTrek just isn't good. SNW is better, but it's not good and doesn't respect canon.
I'm going to say this. You called it. Well done. Well said. Excellent and well put together video. And, you stated the TRUTH, not just figments of people's imaginations. Thank you.
I'm a Disco lover, but I had patience with the show; in the first two episodes the mutiny was very disturbing, and they killed the captain that I liked more than Burnham in those episodes. But the rest of the season was great. I've rewatched the first two seasons of Disco several times, but for some reason watched the the episodes of S3 and S4 when they premiered and haven't felt like watching them again.
I've accepted that Emperor Georgiou has been "redeemed", because I want Michelle Yeoh to have her own ST show; but I can't help but think that there's no way a fascist, murderous cannibal white dude would have ever been given a second chance.
As a lifelong Star Trek Fan, the things that anoy me the most are stuff like that the turbolift shafts that are somehow bigger than the whole ship, the Redesign of the klingons, the Spocks sister thing, that the other bridge Crew are more or less Background actors with no or few things to say. Its not well made. Does it look good? Yeah very Cinematic but it has no substance. To few likeable characters and its always about an Enigmatic galactic threat over and over again.
I love strange new worlds but as i live not in the us i have to Torrent it.
Same goes for the other Shows...
Fantastic video!!! Me personally, I love and can't wait for more Strang New Worlds, I'm indifferent on Discovery and couldn't care less for Picard which is strange considering TNG was my introduction to Star Trek. Have a great one!
I walked somewhere during enterpises run. Not willing to uy into uet another streaming service, either paramount or Disney tbh. When I heard about the newer series it just reinforced my position. I'm probably not coming back, but I am glad to hear of the turnaround the shows are making
On Short Treks we saw the Academy School I think. Two teens were enemies at school but bonded together as war broke out on planet where their parents worked.
This would make a great series and draw a younger audience as well as interest the die-hards.
Like a Cobra-Kai regenerating Karate Kid.
I had lost hope in Star Trek until capt pike appeared. In an effort to be inclusive new Trek excluded everyone like me. It had become a hopeless future where humanity had become a race of mewling babies who are only interested in virtue signaling. Lower decks gave me hope Star Trek could be saved , prodigy was a show I found very interesting. Then came strange new worlds, that show for me saved Star Trek, it had inspired hope in me again that Star Trek could be what it was. From the new theme music to the writing that was so beyond anything on discovery. I’m back into Star Trek not because of discovery and it’s pandering and virtue signaling and over the top leftist agenda, no imback because snow showed there is hope and wonder in the universe and that we don’t have to force an agenda down the throats of the fans. New Trek had forgotten that Star Trek isn’t about what you are it’s about who you are.
When Strange New Worlds introduced a nonbinary character it was like 3 lines of dialog and nobody cared. They were a pretty good villain, he's a pretty skilled actor. It was a nonissue.
When Discovery had a gender-non-conforming character come out, they spent multiple episodes fixated on that one (pretty minor) aspect of an otherwise fairly interesting character.
The Expanse did it best, though.
@@DAndyLord Jesse Keitel (Capt. Angel) uses she/her pronouns.
Star Trek FOREVER
As someone who watched TNG as a kid growing up the rest of the series to follow, I have not and will not watch the 'new' trek. Fare thee well my fallen compatriots.
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD WHIRE GUY NEW ALIENS 👽??
You should do a history of the Orville .
I'll do it for you - man cosplays trek cosplay as kid - makes millions off of crude jokes - approaches network execs to make his own trek show, he gets turned down - he then goes back to cosplaying trek, but with money
What they did there, is what you would call a "wake up call" if enough of the right people paid attention to and saw that episode of SNW.
so happy trek went beyond the agressors bothering the rest of us
@21:11 Fuller was long gone by the beginning of the first season and his pilot was completely reworked. What you're seeing in the end result (despite contractually mandated title credit) is not his vision.
Great video, I grew up following all the Trek series, even Voyager, although I am not a Janeway fan. But Discovery has been a letdown. Picard was wonderful fan service and redeemed the franchise partly. Now lower Decks and SNW are both amazing and brings Trek back to form.
Star Trek has always been about going beyond and pushing through to #AnUndiscoveredCountry.
I am a self avowed hard-core Trekkie and have been since my childhood, so I love New Trek because it takes me to new concepts rather than just tool around and overly familiar Universe in a new ship doing the same old things.
#LifeIsChangeAndIEmbraceIt.
I wish others would as well.
#LLAP.
I'm a huge Star Trek fan. TOS, TNG, VOY DS9 and even ENT. Like them all.
STD was a slap in the face to me. I found it disgusting. Picard was a little better, however they murdered my favorite captain, and I'm not talking about the turning him into an Android bullshit. He wasn't the same man. I stopped watching midway through the first season.
SNW is much better. I'm definitely enjoying it, but I'm about 3 episode behind right now with no urgency to catch up. But I will though. It's not perfect, and I haven't decided if it's actually good or just better than the other shit. The jury's still out on that for me.
Either way, I love your reviews and thank you guys for making these great videos!
Im of that exact opinion although i stopped watching STD after season one i dont mind the tone just like stargate universes darker tone. I tuned out of Picard halfway through the first season, that man was like a father figure to me and i didnt recognize him, he let his liberal views shine through way too much and liberals were great back in the day, but unbearable now.
I tried the new shows but they feel flat to me. I tried STW and could not tolerate the cannon bending and breaking they did. I know they can do better but choose not too.
I just adore all of your trek content my man. Great job! Channel recommended for any trekker.
*Thank You Sir!*
They've gotten much craftier at mimicking Star Trek with SNW.
Star Trek is Soap Operas for Science Fiction and Fantasy fans. It doesn't matter what they make, I'll probably keep watching.
Burnham and Spock are not half siblings. Burnham was an adopted orphan raised by Spock's parents.
Interesting take, I never felt early Discovery was female centric, it always felt almost like the opposite, like some 15 year old boy trying to make Trek edgy and dark in order to make it seem cooler, also Ash, Saru and Sarek, were featured prominently in season 1, all of them non LGBTQ, not completely evil male characters, plus at the end 2 of the big bads of the season where also female so it's not like they were presenting a clear imbalance. Honestly production design, directing and writing was just subpar, seeing SNW visuals just makes Disco look so muddy and low quality in comparison, and makes it clear they didn't even care to look at TOS or any trek, while designing anything.
That's what's great about people, we can all see things differently and that doesn't mean we're wrong. Hopefully we can always agree to disagree and stay friends. Thank you for sharing!
Lower decks & SNW are fantastic. Prodigy is not my thing. Picard & disco are just fine.
Another excellent video. Enjoyed it greatly. A really good explanation of why things have terribly gone wrong since 2017.
Since the release of ST SNWs and for the first time since TNG and DS9, I look forward to the following week's episode. Looking forward to season 2 too.
I stopped watching Discovery and Picard but SNWs brought me back. The first 2 shows were not optimistic, not aspirational, very little good sci-fi, far too many snr officers have personal problems/issues that were not addressed by Starfleet at the Academy or a starship's Counsellor (defied the odds that so many could progress up the promotions ladder), characters self-absorbed, stories had more than their fair share of plot holes or contrivances and the shows were too dark for humour to shine through.
Fingers crossed that SNWs continues to respect Roddenberry's Trek. My doubt is, a small fear that in the future SNWs is rejigged a tad to change course to Discovery/Picard Trek. Maybe its just my PTSD talking, contracted during season 1 of Discovery.
I have 2 disappointments with SNWs. A loss of diversity after the premature removal of the Aenar character, Hemmer. Too many hu-mons on the Enterprise, bring back our Aenar. Secondly, the power of science is sometimes lacking, where is the 'can do' attitude seen in TOS where Spock and Bones would arrive at a solution, with slim odds of success, to hopefully save the day or die trying. Unfortunately, Hemmer didn't receive this treatment.
Btw I like the theme music in your videos.
Thanks you for this comment! I agree, Hemmer wasn't treated fairly.
Ty. Yep, bad judgement by SNWs to remove Hemmer.
Anything that carries Star Trek forward is OK with me, USNRET Submariner. I used to watch Star Trek serialized while attending U.S. Submarine School in Groton, CT in the late 70's, every day, then run to make it to the chow hall before it closed. "I have been and always will be" a Star Trek fan.
congrats 2 100K subs and almost 100K views!
Loved the new Star Track: Strange New World! Watched it with my boys!
I think that some people involved in new ST shows don’t just despise hardcore fans, but the original material as well. That’s why they only do the right thing after all other options are exhausted.
Best Star Trek ever babies!!!
I love all star trek after the 2009 movie... truly
Star Trek strange new worlds is fantastic Discovery I stopped watching after season 1 episode 6 when they decapitated the infant and threw it Down in the hole I was like yeah that's not Star Trek no decapitated infants in Star Trek
Such a succinctly put and well researched video! I'd like to sincerely thank @The Popcast for putting this together. It really reflected how I personally felt about all the new Trek series since Discovery. Personally, the only series that I'm even partially interested in watching at the moment are 'Strange New Worlds' and 'Lower Decks'. Picard is dead to me and I've got absolutely no interest in ever going back to it.
A significant element that has hurt much of the new Star Trek offerings is the overt and overwhelming modern social justice (a.k.a. "woke") bias evidenced in the shows. In its origin, and often at its best, Star Trek seamlessly demonstrated diversity and social consciousness. These details were woven into the background of exciting science fiction storytelling. In contrast, modern producers and writers prefer to put their advocacies at the head of their narratives. The new Star Trek comes off as heavy-handed, unrealistic, disingenuous, and even manipulative in the way previous Star Treks didn't. Instead of stimulating imagination and open-mindedness, the often over-the-top political/social messaging and moralizing have pushed away many traditional fans and mainstream viewers. Star Trek is not alone, as polarized ideologies disguised within entertainment have been increasingly and intrusively embedded into current popular culture projects.
What is the background music track that starts at 1:58 and where did it come from? Thanks!
Not my Star Trek any more just to Woke and gay and way to much crying 4 Me. Don’t like any of them so Canceling my CBS subscription.
DISCOVERY!
MAKE IT SO!
Picard is more like a reunion show with TNG characters constantly popping in to prop up the show, and with season 3 having the entire TNG cast there it proves my point. Discovery is one of those "meh" shows. It has no ties to Enterprise or TOS which it is supposed to be in between. The only saving grace for Disco was when they brought Anson Mount in as Captain Pike. I like Star Trek New Worlds as it truly fills in the years between Pike and Kirk being in command of the Enterprise, although I found the season 1 finale to be strange with Kirk and Pike both involved in the TOS episode "Balance Of Terror". I hope they don't try that experiment again where Pike is in command of the Enterprise during TOS episodes.
I have watched every single episode of every Star Trek tv show and I have seen all the movies. From TOS when I was a small child watching with my dad up to the last episode of SNW. (Including the animated TOS series.) Each one of them has been great. Yes, some I liked some episodes better than others but my entire lifetime has involved Star Trek. After the long absence from TV, I was excited for Discovery when it came out. And I wasn't disappointed. (Well, Lorca was terrible but ya know, that was the point.) Each show has been different than the others. DS9 is VERY different than Voyager which is different than Enterprise etc. But that's ok. Each new show brings new characters with unique strengths. I don't think we would have been ready for SNW without Discovery. Some folks are always going to complain (I remember when people didn't like Enterprise at all). I guess it's just part of the process of producing entertainment. I for one, can't wait to see what the future holds.
Oh, and as to the issue of women fans versus men? I am a woman. My boyfriend has always been indifferent to Star Trek. I am the one that generates all the views (well he watches with me.)
I'll offer my perspective, FWIW. I don't think the 'critic' position was addressed adequately, except to set up straw-man arguments of what "we" might be uncomfortable with and to hope that "we can all just get along" as we dance arm-in-arm to a new future of Star Trek Awesomeness.
This is perhaps the most positive look at new-Trek that I have seen in a long time and it explains a lot of things well about the back stories of the production, which I was not completely aware of. But I am one of those fans who have chosen to walk away. While I was inspired into advanced studies and work in the STEM field, in part due to the vision and inspiration of old Trek, I don't need to see "myself" or see my "identify" on-screen... indeed, I find that condescending and pandering, especially in the way that the production team has chosen to do it. And quite truthfully, they don't represent me. These are sad, selfish, small people on the screen. I want nothing to do with them, regardless of gender, race, or whatever. There is very little virtue or goodness to find in them or their 'journeys'.
I am not against serialized television... I wish they had done more of that 20 years ago. I would have loved to have seen a protracted season, for instance, of dealing with the Borg after their invasion of earth in TNG. Deep Space Nine has only grown better with time. I was less enthused about Voyager myself, and I think Enterprise was cut off when it was just getting its legs (but it probably needed to happen that way). I'm not thrown by the cosmetic changes found in a series being 50 years newer than the original... that's all on the surface. Discovery is beautiful. I really want to like this, but I gave somewhere in season 2 and walked away, never to return, except to heckle by watching the summaries and reviews on the Internet. Of the episodes that I watched, I find there is zero re-watch interest (unlike the years of Star Trek before), as these stories burn themselves out on the initial view and have no residual dramatic or artistic value. The storylines that I have been following from the outside don't interest me at all. As a matter of non-support, I do not subscribe to Paramount+ out of principle that they are doing a terrible job with the Trek I.P. and I do not want to support that until it changes.
The characters are shallow and one-dimensional, and most of them I found unlikable. The rest of them, I couldn't for the life of me even remember their names. Most of them are under-developed-- they are nobodies... zeros... place-holders. Of the development that has been invested in Burnham, I find her simply insufferable on so many levels.
The stories are dark and stupid. At the base, the writers don't seem to understand 'Trek' and even if they were writing for the Love Boat, they don't seem to have a very good grasp at characterization, drama, suspense, cause-and-effect, relationships, humor, pacing, science, or the science fiction tradition in literature (other than to be a pale copy of some of other properties). They just aren't very good writers in my overall estimation... and that's judging them on the level of the Love Boat, not in respect to a first-class property like Star Trek.
As for politics, yeah, I am not in the "California Values" demographic, either. But I am more than willing to engage good discussion of these matters... that is what is lacking in our political discourse today--- that ability to debate, make an argument, arrive at compromises while coming to know better one's own boundaries and unassailable truths, and then find a way to get along. I certainly don't think the writers or the production team have any respect for me as a stakeholder in that discussion... but maybe is is less a matter of respect and more a problem that the writers and producers in that they are not skilled enough to engage the discussion in a responsible, mature, intelligent way. That other show, you know, Star Trek Lite, over there on Fox... they DO know how to hold up the mirror and ask the important questions that actually engage thought and discussion... and that is the tradition of TOS and TNG and the others in a big way. This is the essence of drama, is it not? The tension and resolution of the 'big questions' that face us in our day, retold in a way to abstract it a bit and then return to the world changed? Science Fiction as a literary form is a quintessential medium for this, but the writers and producers are simply not up to it.
I am disoriented by the retconning of canon. Canon is not a perfect art or science, but so much of what was good has been completely undermined by the dark and the stupid. One can put aside little inconsistencies for the sake of a good story. These are not good stories or interesting characters. In short, it appears that in the stewardship of the canon has been entrusted to 'small' people. Those running this production, both those in character and those behind the camera, and it is flagrantly obvious they are standing on the shoulders of giants and pissing away the legacy, not really knowing what to do with it... like a teenager taking the keys to an expensive sports car that is not theirs and that they did not earn, and tearing it up. For sure, broadcast TV and streaming it is all about making money and capturing eyes and selling ads an merch and all of that, but it would seem that they are not doing that well, either.
As a long-time fan, going almost to the era of the original (I did not see it on broadcast TV, but in syndication in the years following while growing up), it is like a death in the family, maybe a murder. I can't help but be a bit emotional about it. The best thing that could happen is that Paramount and CBS fail, someone else buy the I.P. and put it to bed for a few years to let it recover, and then start with people who really know what they are doing.
Sorry... this goes deep with me. Indeed, except to consider the perceived injustices and disappointments in what happened and what could have been, which is the essence of this... essay... Star Trek is largely a thing of the past for me now and now a matter of growing indifference. Hopefully that provides a bit better insight into the mind of a 'critic'.
Honestly, lower decks S1 & 2, and the surprisingly delightful prodigy kept me going to SNW
I love captain pike because it makeup for the cage TOS we get see plke legacy I grow up watching the original startrek know pike as man and the wheelchair I love William Shatner but I think pike deserves his shot in the captain chair
Picard was ok the first season except for the last episode. Season 2? I managed to watch 2 episodes before resigning to never watching it again. I've seen the full complete seasons of the OG Star Trek, TNG, Voyager, DS9 & Enterprise at least 3 times each, all the movies and the first 3 in the theaters (I'm old) and was let down by Discovery and Picard. This is coming from someone who liked
Strange New Worlds is amazing. There might be hope yet.
Of the 5 series that truly are Star Trek to me and that started it all, (TOS, Next Gen, DS9, Voyager, & Enterprise), I was a fan of all. I can't even relate to those who reject any one of them. I'm not all that hard to please when it comes to Trek. I tried, made a few good running starts, to get into Discovery, and just couldn't. It was just too dark. If I want to immerse myself in something dark, Trek is not now and will likely never ever be my go-to. Same thing with Picard. I was so hopeful and wanted to like it, but, again, just too dark, and too.., too many things I can't quite put my finger on, but whatever it is, I just can't. That said, SNW had been on 2-3 months when I could muster the courage to give it a chance. Metaphorically speaking, I watched peeking through my fingers and holding my breath - and was so pleasantly surprised when I could take down my hands, fully open my eyes, take a breath, and Trek on!! Hope is not dead! I turn to Trek for hope. I need hope, so I turn to Trek a lot. It's nice to have new characters to invest in. It's just great. Anson Mount as Pike is fantastic! I've been a fan of Rebecca Romihn since The Librarians and am thrilled with her #1. La'an is 100% right. She's a ton of fun (newbie cadets, what do they know?)!
Ethan Peck's sexy Spock is sublime. LOVE Ortegas!! And, I was just saying to my husband, I hope Nichelle Nichols has been able to see Celia Rose's younger Uhura portrayal. It's hard to imagine she would be disappointed. As for me...the girl crushing on Uhura goes on and on. LOVE Hemmer too (been enthralled with the Aenar since Enterprise introduced them, and Hemmer, well, I'm crushing on him too).
I'm still working my way through the last season of Discovery and I have yet to watch Strange New Worlds. I also need to watch the 2nd season of Lower Decks.
I have to say, Picard has been the most disappointing for me so far. I've truly enjoyed parts of it, but the overall storytelling just feels lazy. It's rather unfortunate since I'm a long time fan and I've been watching the original airing of episodes since the beginning of TNG.
I do agree with the break down of Discovery and I have been enjoying this most recent season, but the tone and new look of the Klingons early on did irk me a great deal. I mean it's not like they really messed with any of the other legacy aliens. They have a thoroughly established look, so I'm not sure why they thought that was necessary.
I understand things change, but there's so much untapped universe out there for them to explore and yet all they can ever do is go back to the well and mess with everything long time fans love about the franchise.
I know sometimes that its probably the safer bet when it comes to making sure you're turning a profit and you can't always cater every detail to long time fans, but for the love of god just do something new for once if you can't do the older series justice. I mean nothing against Strange New Worlds, it actually looks pretty good, but how many iterations of Spock are we going to get?
@@DRINKERSBALDHEAD lol settle down there, I wasn't really knocking Discovery overall or it's diversity. In fact that's something I've always appreciated about Star Trek but ok. By the way, your Caps Lock appears to be on.
You're going to love them, in my opinion!
@@alexv6324 Andy is just copying and pasting that same racist typo'd comment all over everyone's comments on this video.
Yea! SCREW THE WHIRE GUYS!!
😂😂
Strange New World and Lower Decks are really good.... actually Strange New Worlds is Fantastic!!!!! Sooooo soon great!!!
What issacs said sounds a lot like a Malfoy to me
So long Kurtzman, JarJar Abrams (a guy who doesn't like ST and made the films into action Star Wars, and he even suck in that franchise), Bad Robot and Secret Hideout are behind the production, together with the 25% rule in the contract, is Star Trek dead. The ratings are in the ground and the merchandise doesn't sell.
It was never simpler for me to save money.
New Trek is like New Coke for those of you old enough to get the reference.
Exactly! 👍
I thought Picard Season 1 was better than its second season set around drab alternate 2020s LA, with intrigue and hope at the end.
SNW is a dreadful. The only positive that can be said about it is that it is slightly less shit than DISCO & STP
There seems to be far more criticism and Opinions of what everyone wants or expects from Star Trek, I just turned 71 and remember the 1966 airing of TOS. And with all that Star Trek has been and is since then, I believe that any Trek is better than no Trek... Except for maybe "The Final frontier" Shatner in the Captains chair - Great. In the Directors chair, not so much.
Have never watched Discovery or Picard, SNW is ok, but to enjoy it, I like to think of it as an alternate reality, because of lore destruction, I do enjoy Lower Decks.
Discovery and Picard suck. I like Strange New World
Subscribed!
Sorry but this looks like a paid video to put the current people running the show in a better light. There is no redemption for what they have done to the franchise. Only a total rollback. You have Q just make it all a nightmare.
This has to be the best Star Trek commentary ever! Thank you.. You guys always do such a great job! 👍
in hindsight putting fuller in charge was the mistake that killed trek and all kurtzman did was see the flawed concept to fruition instead of changing the concept to fit more into the star trek.
ithis entire iteration of trek should never have been made
If they’re theory that women were the primary fans, and women LOVED the previous series, then why change the previous formula that women loved? None of this makes any sense.
Please also be brave enough to break new characters and let Nimoy have Spock! Not to mention others, I don't want to see another person play Picard!
They have cured my love for all new Trek.
Star Trek Strange New Worlds is great. It’s original Trek. Anson Mount’s Pike is fantastic.
Great! Now do The Orville. The best new Star Trek out there followed by SNW.
On it!
I like parts of STD and later seasons are better. I think STD helped paved the way for SNW being so good. If they started out with SNW I think it would have been bad. These are all somewhat new producers and writers to Star Trek that it’s taking time for them to learn. It stinks that it didn’t start off with a huge bang, but I think they are learning and hopefully producing better Trek going forward.
Which sounds better? CBS Trek: The Fugazi Years, or CBS Trek: Decade of the Fugazi, or CBS Trek: The Fugazi Franchise
I guess that depends on what the hell fugazi is
Yes ,Pike,Deeply😊
I’ve watched all Star , Trek series and films from the first one show in Great Brittany , to the latest one ,all series and films ,I’m 72 years old and I love them all , they give me joy,happy memories and hope of the future space exploring
I'm firmly in the "never say an unkind word about Star Trek" camp. I loyally followed Voyager and Enterprise, but mumbled the whole time how I wished they'd find a new way to tell the same stories (aside from the individual stand-out episodes you thoughtfully mention here). Now I finally have it. Four shows, year round, very different, all in the same lore-rich universe. Some are better than others; they all have their individual flaws, but I am here for every minute. Even when they're clunkers.
For me Star Trek revolves around the 60s tv star ship design, Next Gen was a disgrace to the Enterprise and JJ Abram's movies didn't help either.......
The new show is GREAT! Im a TOS guy (alive when it was airing the first episodes) and SNW has the HEART of TOS and will be a HUGE hit!
There's nothing wrong with franchises trying something different. _DS9_ did so and I loved it.
It's also fine, as I age, that franchises make shows that are not targeted to me, and hence I may not enjoy them. I've experienced this already; "That's not my XX." Sad, but I move on.
But what's difficult to accept is when a franchise is taken in a new direction by making fundamental changes to the subject matter, seemingly attempting to invalidate what came before. With a vast array of time and space in which to tell the new story, over-writing past convention feels unnecessarily hostile and purposefully insulting as a fan. As if the new creators simply knocked down what preceded it out of spite... or insecurity. I end up walking away from the program just the same, but it's hard to fathom what the studio has gained fostering such an antagonistic break up.