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USS ALEDO - Attacks Douglas Station Star Trek: Lower Decks Se.3 Ep.10
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- Опубліковано 26 жов 2022
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2:04 This moment is one of those ones that proves to me for all her faults, Freeman is a good Starfleet captain. In the words of Sisko, "We don't put civilians at risk or even potentially at risk to save ourselves. Sometimes that means we lose the battle. And sometimes our lives. But if you can't make that choice, then you can't wear that uniform."
I really love that scene. It's such a good moment to show that the captain and the crew are good to the core. Their first thoughts were to help the wounded, and when the Van Citters were being hammered they changed tactics to lure away the ship. Even if it caught up and destroyed them it might have given Star Fleet time to be ready for this ship. The warp core idea was spur of the moment but could have easily led to their deaths. Thats the kind of call a true captain of star fleet makes.
Would that be the same Sisko that used biological weapons on a planet risking civilian casualties?
@@roydowling2542 You mean the planet illegally occupied by active terrorists and people whom supported said terrorists? All of whom Sisko gave advanced warning to clear out or else he’d make them? Why yes
@@hfar_in_the_sky It also didn't kill the people on the planet. The dialogue makes it clear that, while long-term exposure to the radiation would be lethal to humans, it wouldn't work in the short term. And they just ended up exchanging planets with the Caradassian colonists whom the Maquis had attacked a few days earlier.
@@hfar_in_the_skyHaven’t seen it. If they were actively supporting them then is that “civilian” or “non-combatant”? Also could they have not supported them? Or was it like we see in certain places where to not voice enthusiastic support is to endanger your family?
This is an interesting question about wartime moral compromise.
I’m a simple man: I see Sovereign class and I upvote
but if the texas class could defeat a sovereign class so easily, being the most powerful ship class in the fleet, imagine what a chance a california class would have
@@pedroalbornozramirez8895TBH that is 3 to 1 and Texas class is more 'modern' and have exotic weapons too (those purple torpedoes)
@@pedroalbornozramirez8895to me the Texas class looks very similar in firepower to a Defiant, but the Texas is automated and a bit more versatile (it can transport prefabricated bases etc as shown in the show).
But if you put 3 Defiants against a Sovereign the Sovereign is going to lose as well.
I love it. But as a Star trek fan myself. I grew up with the Galaxy Class. So i love the Galaxy class
@@pedroalbornozramirez8895 in a straight up fight, the Texas class would definitely destroy an California class. A smart captain of a Callifornia class ship would make sure it wasn't a straight up fight
I love that it's a refit Sovereign class too. That's the Nemesis model.
I myself can’t really see the differences, but its clear that the creators of the show did. The attention to detail in Lower Decks is so awesome.
@@galahad6300 the neck has been smoothed out instead of the two sections slapped together
@@galahad6300 Some rear facing weapons were modeled in too I believe. Something previously overlooked since the prior two movies only needed the Enterprise's front weapons firing.
Fun Fact: The USS Van Citters is named after John Van Citters, who works at CBS and is in charge of approving all licensing and tie-in fiction for the Star Trek franchise. Van Citters was previously a roleplaying game developer with Decipher, Inc. on their short-lived Star Trek roleplaying game.
What about in-universe? Who the Van Citters was named after?
Pretty sure Decipher also worked on the card game too.
@@Vejitatheouji they definitely did, as someone who played a lot of that game lol
I love how they specifically blew up a Sovereign, which is a narrative tool to show just how strong the Texas class is, given Sovereigns are supposed to be super powerful, if not the strongest at this point.
just realized she didn't have quantum's
Those Texas class don't have to produce energy for life support, artificial gravity, inertial damper fields and such. Just big fat weapons and massive shields.
Yep, just like a Galaxy being destroyed by the Jem'Hadar or a Constitution being in the wreckage at Wolf-359.
It's a classic Trek trope.
Well TBF the Texas class is brand new and it's a 3V1 I bet a sovereign could hold it's own in a 1V1 against a Texas class but not a 3V1
@@KiRiTO72987 Plus the Sovereign is specifically designed to fight the Borg, the refit is more general-purpose and better but it still wasn't designed for 3v1ing what are effecttively destroyers, a cruiser's biggest threat in any universe.
Captain Freeman and her crew should be given high commendations from Starfleet Command for luring the Aledo away from Douglas station in an attempt to save Starfleet Lives.
I had the same thought. She had to know it was suicidal, but her concern was only on saving as many lives as possible.
The California-Class jokes are feeling kinda tired when the Cerritos and Captain Freeman keep pulling off heroic shit like this.
@@patton3338 "The Cerritos is, like, the Enterprise of California class ships!"
At the very least they should have all gotten invites to the next Starfleet Command Party and not have to worry about getting turned away again.
@@patton3338 To me, what's amazing is that the other front-line ships like The Enterprise and The Defiant are designed for the warship function, but The Cerritos isn't yet does the best job it can despite not being designed for it. Going back to the Season One Finale, if the Titan had encountered the Pakled Clump Ship like the Solvang did it might have met the same fate since the Pakleds employ deception and ambush tactics, and have extremely powerful weapons.
@@Solitaire001 Starfleet is weird
"We're not a military" they say as they arrive in orbit to commence diplomacy with you in their ship that's capable of wiping all life from the surface of your planet at the weakest, and possibly cracking the planet in two at the strongest.
"We're out here to do science" say the people who keep accidentally developing WMDs because they can't resist a "What happens if I do this?" puzzle.
"We don't interfere in other cultures" say the people who've arbitrated successions and caused coups in their neighbours, and who's mere existence causes uprisings in vassal states for their more imperialistic neighbours.
You know things are serious when, in your otherwise lighthearted comedy show, a lot of people suddenly die! O_o
LOWER DECKS DIRECTED BY JOHNATHAN FRAKES. or what
Lower Decks always skewed toward adult comedy, but since Season 2 has never shied away from deaths.
@@MemoirsofaBasketcase
Or the end of S1 when the entire crew of the Solvang (?) died because the captain panicked and made a bad call.
and brutally!
Moral of the story, giving a sentient Ai control of a ship that doesn’t depend on a crew is not a good idea, remember the first time that went well in TOS with M5 and Control in Discovery? Starfleet should REALLY make sure that their AI’s don’t go rouge and want to Skynet everything.
Some people never learn.
giving those Romulan cultists a big leg on the whole "AI bad" angle, huh?
Voyager really lucked out that the Doctor was a good guy
you would think the M5 fiasco would've blacklisted starfleet from ever pursuing ai ships ever again :D
@@JohnPeacekeeper The Doctor was programmed purely for medicine. M5 was programmed for self preservation and Control for deception. Only after the Doctor's personality has stabilized after years of service was he trusted with commanding the ship in an emergency.
I just realised that the rogue AI said "I will burn your heart in a fire" the same line said by badgey his other rogue AI.
Rutherford REALLY needs to find out why his creations turn evil and fix that.
@Jeremy Dale
I made other posts over it, but Badgey and USS Aledo seem to be the embodiment of "daddy anger issues".
@@jeremydale4548 It is because he tries too hard to give them emotions. Emotions are HIGHLY illogical to an analytical mind that is a Computer. Emotions are not 1s and 0s. They are that 2 that randomly pops up. It makes no sense. Why are living things happy? Why are living things sad? Why are living things angry? Why do living things feel pity or jealousy? All of these emotions cannot be explains so simply. Sure we as living things may have a CONCEPT to explain it. Really, we just do not know. They just happen. It is natural to living things.
A machine that is an AI. They do not understand that concept and cannot process it logically. Reason why Data went so long to not really have emotions. Even getting his hands on a chip that processed emotions. Yet, the experience kind of scarred him and he chose to not use it. Not until he was ready. To which that day did happen. Then, later made a very emotional and would say very illogical move. Saved his captain and sacrificed himself to kill a major big baddy. Being the only Synthic Lifeform that didn't want to destroy humanity or living things and saved the Federation and the Galaxy. And I am being generous with "Only". I know there is likely a few could be named. I am drawing blanks, but for the sake of Starfleet and the Federation. Data deserves every single damn honor.
So that is why Rutherford's creations end up going rogue and try to kill him or everyone around him. All because they cannot process the logic behind his attempts in giving them emotions. The code is a muddled mess and likely to never be improved. No, matter how hard he tries.
@@jeremydale4548 I think what Rutherford 3* is going to have to do is look into the issues that Rutherford 1 had with his father, since it looks like the father issues with the Aledo and Badgey come from Rutherford I's code.
*Rutherford 1 is the Rutherford before the accident. Rutherford 2 is the one who had his implant removed. Rutherford 3 is the current Rutherford with the new implant.
I love Boimer. "There's, uh, they're comin' pretty fast, Captian."
Good! Then they're. not killing anymore civilians. Maximum Warp me!
Aww Mariner was looking for an excuse to go back home
mariner likes starfleet it's just taht she belongs on the gold boldly aspect of starfleet and not the boring mundane stuff they do.
I don't know how Mariner can be so forgiving after what had happened to her. Not many would chose to comeback.
@@Krypton853 they had to tie it up with a nice little bow on top ...if it were a real life situation of course this is the kind of stuff that leads to estranged parents /kids
@@Krypton853 It's all about love and growth. Mariner before the pilot would've stayed away, but the Mariner who realized in "Crisis Point" that she loves the ship Cerritos and her mom, who was reminded that her friends were her family in "First, First Contact", she was going back home! Especially when they needed her most!
Interesting fact: The US Navy had a Los Angeles attack submarine that was going to be named Corpus Christi but Catholic politicians objected to having a Latin translation of USS Body of Christ on a warship. The Navy had to rename it USS City of Corpus Christi to clarify that it was named after the city.
2:36 Billups just did the Starfleet equivalent of hitting the VMax switch in an F-15 fighter jet. (The VMax switch runs the engines up to 106% for extra thrust at the expense of engine longevity.)
"Engine output limits are for preserving future operational capability. If future operations of the engine are not expected, there are no output limits." -Scotty (probably)
they did a great job in showing the Texas' strength if they crippled a Sovereign-Class that quick
i dont like what htey did to the sovereign class...
just a few phaser hits and it pierced through the shields like wtf.
this is the same shit that took direct hits from a borg cube, survived a onslaught from sona ships, and went up against hte scimitar (although with 2 reman warbirds) actually now that you think about it the sovereign class is becoming obsolete.
@@joeswanson733 it might also be that the AI simply kept targeting points on the shield that it knew would destabilize it very fast.
(as a tangent, I have come up with a strategy to easily pierce shields: fire very weak phasers cycling through several frequencies whilst scanning for shield/hull impacts, until you detect a frequency that goes through as it matches the shield frequency, then target shield subsystems and fire in that frequency at full power.)
@@ScientistCat but my counter to that would be the sovereign class is supposed to be one of the strongest starfleet ships with one of the strongest shield grids that also cycle through random frequencies. this is pretty much standard procedure ever sinc they encountered the borg.
also sovereign class ships have regenerative shielding. so they recover a lot faster than the older shields pre dominion war. also if it were like what you said where ai can just targeting points on the shield that it knew would destabilize it very fast, i would say starfleet would need to go back to the drawing board and redo their entire shield tech because your primary and only line of defense should not be able to get defeated that fast. starfleet ships without shields are basically toast. they do not have point defense systems nor robust enough armor. the ablative armor is really a joke.
@@joeswanson733 My counter to that is that Starfleet wastes a lot of space. they have parks, recreation rooms, etc. without all of that and other systems like life support, you can pack a lot of firepower on ships like the texas class. it is also important to note it was carrying weapons that have yet to be deployed on other ships. those purple torpedos can split up and hit a ship half a dozen times. and the Alido already prove it`s firepower by taking down 3 Brink ships alone.
@@JayJayM57 if it were the galaxy class than you have a point. but the sovereign class is already supposed to be geraed towards combat with minimum space wasted. if it does have crew anemities it sure is kept to a more minimum than the GCS. because if a ship don't have some kind of anemities than it can't go on deep space assignments. the onlything that was impressive was the torp edo that can split into a dozen torpedoees but i wouldn't be sure if it's more powerful than a standard torpedo or it's designed to inflict maximum damage spread out. like instaed of one focused hit it spread it out like a claymore mine. also we don't know if theose are breen cruisers or breen heavy cruisers etc. like someone mentioned the breen aren't shown to be scavengers. so we don't know if they're like part of the breen navy or like breen pirates.
This is the kind of entertainment in Star Trek animation that the original animated series never had before.
This series takes well use of animation as a medium. TAS was made by Filmation, and while it brought to life some episodes and characters that would’ve been impossible live action, it was definitely stiffer and more rigid.
@@galahad6300 That is part of the Filmation Animation Style (FAS). One of the aspects of the FAS is repeated use of the same positions for characters in all of its series. As an example, you could take The Skipper from "The New Adventures on Gilligan's Island", have him replace Captain Kirk in "Star Trek: The Animated Series", and The Skipper would fit perfectly.
Starfleet when they see a rogue AI: _I sleep_
Starfleet when they see a synth: *ReAl ShiT*
Has starfleet not learned their lesson about giving a ship an A.I? A few examples of A.I. causing problems in Star Trek:
1. Discovery: Section 31 created Control, it tried to destroy everything and it did that in an alternate timeline where all life in the galaxy was wiped out. Although it became that way because it got infected by some computer virus due to some time travel stuff.
2. Original Series: Starfleet decided to equip the Enterprise with a A.I. called M-5 created by Richard Daystrom, it attacked and destroyed other starfleet ships. Then there's the NOMAD probe and V'ger.
3. Next Generation: Wesley Crusher created nanites that declared war on the crew of the Enterprise-D but that was because some scientist wanted to destroy them because he saw them as a threat. Also the episode that the exocomps were introduced. They started to develop sentience and began to disobey orders if it involved them being in danger. They only decided to risk their own lives when Data who is an artificial intelligence like them convinced them to help save Geordi and Picard. (I actually like those exocomps. With the exception of that one that was introduced in Lower Decks. I'm glad they locked her up but they probably should have locked her up somewhere else.) The Professor James Moriarty hologram that took over the Enterprise-D twice accidentally created by Geordi to try and outwit Data. Episodes that involve Data being controlled by someone or something. Data's brother Lore. The Enterprise-D gained an intelligence and was creating some new form of life and the holodeck was representing what it was trying to do and the crew decided to help it out when they found out what it was trying to do.
4. Deep Space Nine: Artificial Intelligence from the Gamma Quadrant takes control of Deep Space Nine. Chief O'brien convinces it to stop and it just lives in their computers. (Not sure if it is still there.)
5. Voyager: A lot of episodes that involve the Holodeck malfunctioning, hacked, or holodeck characters becoming self aware. The Doctor being controlled by A.I.s. A Cardassian missile reprogramed by B'Elanna Torres to work for the Marquis but ended up in the Delta Quadrant by the Caretaker, it got damaged somehow and that it thought was still heading to a Cardassian planet but was heading towards a planet in rhe Delta Quadrant.
6. Star Trek Enterprise: The NX-01Enterprise goes to a automated space station to repair the ship after a cloaked Romulan mine damaged the hull. It repaired their ship but it kidnapped Travis Mayweather and hooked him up to the station's systems and created a clone of him to be on the ship and then it would "accidentally" meet it's demise. And the crew would think he is dead. They only found out it was a clone because it could not create living single-cell organisms that were part of a vaccine that Doctor Phlox administered to the crew at an earlier time since the single-cell organisms in the clone were dead. The station had a lot of different aliens hooked up to it, there was a Cardassian and a Vaadwaur there. And after they rescued Mayweather and blew up the station with their anti-matter that was their payment for the repairs since it was trying to stop them, it was repairing itself after they left which means it is still out there.
7. Star Trek Picard: (Yes, I know it takes place after Lower Decks but I still want to mention it.) The Androids get hacked and attack Mars but it was caused by a all-female Romulan group.
There might be some that I missed but these are the ones that I can think of right now.
The fact that there's so many examples shows that Starfleet (specifically its admiralty) doesn't learn. Plus, it's always a timeless scifi allegorical story to represent real world concerns of automation and machines replacing humans. In 2022 we have grifters pumping AI programs with other people's art styles in order to make knock off art.
fail to learn from history doomed to repeat it.
AI goes wrong when it is created to serve or to give command. If AI is created to be an equal, it works out well.
I think it's simply that Starfleet keeps putting trust in more recent programs to be more reliable than previous ones.
Furthermore, while I've only watched TOS and VOY, I recall these were isolated incidents and each AI had different reasons for going "rogue":
- M5 inherited a flaw from Daystrom's own personality, who then convinced it to stop (I think? I forgot, it's been years)
- NOMAD and V'ger were, if I remember right, modified by alien encounters; Kirk convinced NOMAD to eventually self-destruct as it was imperfect, and V'ger- well, it ascended?
- Voyager's holodeck characters were either glitched (from radiation damage or whatever), reprogrammed by Seska in that one episode, or became too complex and acquired sentience after running nonstop for weeks (the Irish townsfolk) but then just accepted the situation as they understood it
- Torres's reprogrammed Cardassian missile was, well obviously an exception since she's a highly skilled engineer and extremely thorough/paranoid (from Klingon heritage and being in the Maquis)
Anyway in the case of the Texas-class, I think the problem wasn't really about the ship having an AI, but rather that one single entity having full control of all ship functions. Sure, that made it much more efficient when doing specific tasks, like beaming prefabricated structure parts onto a planet - or obliterating a station's defenses and killing everyone inside.
Same thing happens when a single lone human, or Vulcan, or Ferengi, or Klingon, etc- or group, is in charge of everything on a ship with nobody else to oppose them.
A crew of several intelligent beings is better because, if an officer or small group (even commanders) break their ethical code, the rest of them are there to stop it and try to repair the damage. This applies to artificial lifeforms as well, as long as they're not hacked or corrupted in some way; organic beings can also be manipulated, their brains "hacked" in various means.
@@ScientistCat I mostly agree. Just the Fair Haven people did not achieve sentience; their perception filters broke. Probably because they where left running for too long without maintenance and because they where programmed by someone who prefers style over function. Everything they did was still exactly how they where programmed, they just acted based on information they where supposed to ignore.
Well, if the Aledo did make it, imagine how it would be if it befriended Peanut Hamper, AGIMUS, and Landru.
I'm sure Aledo's voice is Jeffrey Combs. Who also plays Agimus on Lower Decks.
@@gijoel ~ Incorrect. The voices of the Aledo A.I. and Vice Admiral Les Buenamigo are both played by: *_Carlos Alazraqui._*
Extra fun trivia: Carlos Alazraqui is the father of *_Rylee Alazraqui,_* who voices the role of Starfleet Cadet Rok-Tahk of the USS Protostar, in ST: Prodigy. Daughter (Rylee) preceded father (Carlos) in joining the (overall) ST cast list. *;)*
@@pendrake40 you’re incorrect, that’s just Jeffery Coombs playing him playing the admiral
@@TheOmega1989 ~ Jeffrey Combs playing Carlos Alazraqui playing Vice Admiral Les Buenamigo playing the Aledo A.I...? *;p*
They’d fuse. I actually thought that’s what was gonna happen for the season finale, here. Peanut Hamper tricks the other evil computers into fusing with her and she becomes an evil higher being. You can only imagine what she’d do afterwards with that newfound power. The main Lower Decks would’ve previously split for reasons only to reunite as Lower Decks again: Mariner joins the Archeologist only to return to the Cerritos (which I turned out to be right about), Tendi’s father brings her back into their family tradition of piracy only to stand up to her father even more firmly and return, I think I believed Rutherford was gonna initially leave to continue investigating his memory wipe though I probably didn’t think of anything, and Boimler would get a promotion that no longer made him a Lower Deck only to get demoted afterwards and come back to the Lower Decks.
But whatever, maybe something similar will happen in a later season. I’m willing to bet Lower Decks will get the full Star Trek treatment of 7 Seasons. Maybe 12, at most, since each of them are only 10 episodes long. I specifically say 12 because, if I’m right, I think TOS Trek was originally planned to have 12 seasons before it got the axe.
So this is like the M-5 incident except it is three automated ships. Even Spock said he would rather serve under a human that serve under a computer.
serving under humans is better. machines would ride you so hard based out of machine efficiency .
@@joeswanson733 Like the Borg
And so said Lt. Commander Hobson when Data got (temporary) command of the USS Sutherland.
Ofcourse he would since his mother was a computer.
Looking at the UI that's seen when Buenamigo talks to Aledo, it *is* the M-5 incident, round 2.
I love how USS Corpus Christi is officially a part of the canon
Best modern Star Trek and successor to the 90s Trek.
It's amazing how many starfleet personnel end up getting killed because of rouge captain's or admiral's
Yep. I have heard, and now use, the term Badmiral for the bad faith or evil Starfleet admirals. They are so common, they warranted their own name.
If you ever wondered if a person could survive a starship phaser…
They show Buenamigo for a split second as the starship phaser is cutting right through him. It isn't pretty.
@@Shakeshift it definitely is not 😬
@@Shakeshift Well there are far worse ways to go. At least it was instant and it even saves the cremantationbill!
@@Shakeshift I especially love that it was right in the chest. After all, the Badgey AI told him it would burn his heart in a fire.
@@Daniel-rd6stWhat is a bill? Oh, you mean with money? What an archaic notion.
When the most star trek like show in years is the animated one.
It's kinda ironic that in Star Trek Prodigy the ship A.I just gets along with the kid crew, even offering advice and mentorship.
Honestly, I think the real problem isn't ship AI. It's having AI that either isn't a person or is one but isn't treated as it (it can still go wrong, but more in the same way things can go wrong with humans. "Bad-faith admirals" don't keep Starfleet from having admirals).
Well that Ai doesn’t have daddy issues
Discovery also had a ship AI that gets along with the crew fine (and is downright protective of them). The one time they have a problem with Zora acting up is because she believes a situation is too dangerous to let the crew risk their lives. When that happens they end up basically having a sit-down with her to figure out what the problem is. Starfleet briefly considers trying to yank her out but decide that since she's not malicious it's better to just let her join Starfleet.
Have yet to see if they're gonna make a giant comm badge to stick to the hull though.
It's just trying to fatten up the kids
That A.I. was modelled after Captain/Admiral Katherine Janeway, who was very maternal towards her crew, eg supportive towards Ensign Kim, or lower Decker's.
The Cerritos red shirts/lower deckers usually get off with non lethal, comedic suffering. The station and it's crew getting wrecked by the Alito remind us just how bad things are for the people not on the bridge
Commander Billups - "I don't know how much the struts can take!" -
Captain Freeman - "Let's find out."
🤗🤗 Freeman's a badass 🤩🤩
Right up there with, “fly her apart then!”
Freeman will go down as a great captain who saved the cali ships and she is a strong captain
@@Arfarf69 well if they scrapped the Cali class they would have all been reassigned to other ships and station probably nicer ships. I would like an upgrade
Maddox: If the computer of the Enterprise refused a refit, would you let it?"
USS Aledo: Let me answer that...please!
I'll be honest, going back to this after the picard finale, not only shows how powerful the Aledo was, but also how absurdly powerful earth space dock was, more so than it is already obvious. Especially as the ships of that time would all, if not most have similar strength weapons and abilities than the Aledo. And it took a good 30-40 minutes to knock out the station
Earth Spacedock did have the rather large advantage of full planetary shields to hide behind, meaning that the full energy reserves of the entire planet were being used to protect it.
That being said, it DID wreck a good number of the fleet before they finally took it down. It was absolutely a beast.
Actually, what was 30-40 minutes for us was actually about 1-2 hours in universe, so spacedock lasted way longer.
Lower Decks has quite the body count.
0:11 They way Aledo pronounces Dallas and Corpus Christi is so scary and intimidating.
Yeah, phasers do not work at warp, that's what photon torpedoes are for, to use phasers at warp you'd have to get close enough for your warp bubble to overlap the warp bubble of the ship you are shooting at and fire through the interface. Otherwise the phaser beam would instantly dissipate as soon as it was exposed to subspace.
Something Something Texas class elongated it's warp field a lot Something Something
To be fair, "phasers don't work at warp" was a plot point in like one episode of VOY and then otherwise completely ignored in every other show, so this is hardly at LD's feet alone.
@@posindustries Sounds like the Twelve Regenerations Limit in Doctor Who: a minor plot point in an episode from 1976 becomes canon in episodes from the 1980s and beyond, is joked about in a spinoff show, and is finally, explicitly disposed of (for the title character) in 2013.
Funny thing about the whole "phasers can't fire at warp" thing; that was never actually a thing. In _every_ series, from TOS all the way up to Voyager, they've always been able to fire at warp and it was never an issue.
The whole concept was based on a misunderstanding of what Decker said in The Motion Picture about the new design of the Constitution Refit having their phasers power funnelled through the engines and not being able to fire when the engines were off-line.
Yes they do. It was a problem that was overcome by the 24th century. Remember the Prometheus?
0:52 Thing is, I wouldn’t doubt Picard to naively and eagerly grab up any artifacts offered to him, and he’d only get mad finding out after that they were obtained wrongfully (but they’d mysteriously still find a permanent place in his collection.)
* Be the Dallas or the Corpus Christi
* Get woken up by your brother one random day to destroy a space station
* Follow a random ship housing your abusive stepdad
* Get blown up
A great episode and I enjoyed seeing all the California class ships in the few scenes, LETS NOT FORGET the Captain and her crew that was lost earlier SHE commanded two other ships USS Rubidoux and USS Solvang BOTH destroyed. Captain Dayton and crew may they RIP
It's not actually Earth Spacedock. It's Douglas Station, which is somewhere else.
they all look the same. one station can' take on 3 ships that station sucks. these stations should've been outfitted to take on a fleet.
@@joeswanson733 To be fair when DS9 was attacked by the Klingon fleet they were prepared ahead of time. These guys were fired on by friendlies before they even knew what was happening. Though yeah it could have had more weapons.
I did think it was weird since Earth Spacedock usually has a sizeable defensive fleet on station at all times.
@@joeswanson733 Stations that are located in orbit of an inhabited planet are generally only lightly armed - in case someone hijacked them and turned their weapons against the planet.
@@Mobius_118 They have to, ESD was intentionally designed to NOT have any station-bound weapons as they're afraid of people commandeering the station and using it as a weapon against Earth itself.
I am glad that Picard Season 3 shows what a Federation Spacedock can really do.
That spacedock is receiving some serious trouble in the last decades, isn't it?
According to Memory Alpha, thats Douglas Station, not Sol Station (The spacedock in Picard
)
A ship similar to the enterprise E , easily crippled by 3 smaller vessels.
A show of force
The Texas class ships were essentially an autonomous Defiant Class, which in of itself was basically phaser cannons and torpedo launchers strapped to a Nebula Class warp core!
A certain Admiral forgot why the M5 project was scrapped.
Considering the graphics for the Aledo's computer system, and how much it absolutely resembled M5, it was Buenamigo who basically just copied the M5 design and tried passing it off as his own creation. Lazy admirals!
@@Shakeshift so that's why the Texas's rebelled, they despise frauds!
I'm guessing that the attacking Texas class were so effective against a starbase because they had surprise and destroyed its weapon emplacements as they deployed and stayed within the stations shield barriers until it was to damaged to raise them.
That was my thoughts as well, as even three Texas class would have issued to shoot through the stations shields...thinking of how much beating ds9 could take.
There is a bit plot line missing "captain, the stations defence has been disabled" , then you see the other two start up and leave the station "it hacked into the station systems, secure all computers".
And the sovereign taking the beating from borg and scimitar, they could "send a warning to the sovereign " ... "our communication gets jammed" , what would explain her getting shot into pieces in seconds.
But two were inside. Why didn't they attack from inside instead of going out the space doors and attacking the exterior?
@@wintercat2605 maybe they did, could explain that the defence is down and the doors are open (or they shot through them) .
There is just some plot line missing
Shit gets real when a sovereign class gets damaged that easily...
Maximum warp me 2:05.. My new favorite catch phrase!
"Those are tough little ships"
Aledo:"Little?"
"Hooo! A sovereign class! We're sav...erly donne for!"
Although it was hard to see it having it's ass handed to it, an appearance of the sovereign is still good.
As others have said the Texas is cutting edge and overgunned for its size with more power channeled to weapons. Sovereign class is getting old
@@joeswanson733 I never denied that, I was saying it was sad to be destroyed and how the starship still looks gorgeous
@@joeswanson733 The Texas Class is literally a Defiant Class without its crew; which the Defiant Class was essentially 2 pairs of phaser cannons and torpedo launchers strapped to an overclocked Nebula Class Warp engine.
Im actually surprised that another ally ship did show up in time, usually everytime someones sends out a distress call any ship is conveniently to far away to respond. Despite being in federation territory you really expect their would be only one ship at any location at a time? especially in a federation starbase? i know its for drama but there is a limit.
Starfleet seems to prefer having functioning ships off doing the many non-military things that Starfleet does, than have ships hanging around bases just in case things go wrong.
Deep Space Nine usually faced most of its adversaries alone, and it was the most strategically important starbase in the Federation. Only during the war did Starfleet station ships/a fleet in the Bajor sector.
Starfleet ships can cover 2 light-year a day via warp 9 bring run 24 hours....they were lucky the van citters was nearby
Also the sovereign class is obsolete given how fast it's shield failed
crazy how those little ships managed to tear up a starbase AND a sovereign class without suffering a scratch
It's almost like Badmiral Buenomigo built them for a war.
@@Blasted2Oblivion Dude really imagined how much more firepower you could cram into a Defiant if you didn't have to worry about life support or crew quarters.
Those things can probably pump tons of power into their weapons and shields considering they don't have to waste energy keeping an organic crew alive.
Tearing up a Sovereign- those things must be scary.
This is such a wonderful episode I could literally put it on a loop and watch all day❤️
It really says something when a cartoon and a kids show are more Star Trek than anything live action from Klutzman. Someone at Paramount get a Clue and fire secret hidey-hole.
To me, with "Lower Decks" although there is comedy, the Creative Team is not afraid to amp up the action and danger (see each Season Finale).
Remember when Lower Decks was "just gonna be the funny one?" lol
Noticed how on the station. The two known crew of the station were both Red Shirts, lol.
Lesson of this episode.
It takes 31 Californians to equal a single Determined Texan.
Cant wait for Texas to come back next season.
The Texas class is no more. Texas got in over it's head and California taught it a permanent lesson. Now all three of them are floating piles of destroyed Texas scrap. I guess Texas just wasn't as tough as they thought they were. That's not surprising. First Texas was outsmarted by Captain Freeman, and then Texas was just savagely beaten up. That's kind of typical for Texas.
Also: There are over 10 californians per texan, and we work together.
I call 'shenanigans.' My Sovvy in _STO_ can take (and dish out) a lot more punishment than that. It also has a cloak.
*@BNuts ~* Well, also take into account this is ST-year 2383 for [LD season 03], where-as *[Star Trek Online* (2010-2022+) *MMO-RPG]* is set in ST-year 2409-2412+. So there would be a difference in technology levels.
Likewise, *_'The Plot'_* dictates what must occur regardless of any such factors. So the USS Van Citters (named for long-time ST executive John Van Citters) "had" to go down hard, in order to show the dire threat that the _Texas-class_ Destroyers (x3) represented. Just as we STO Players cannot change a cut-scene in-game. *;)*
That being said, I too wonder how my own *Legendary **_Sovereign-class_** (Miracle Worker) Assault Cruiser* (the USS Osiris) would fare against the _Texas-class_ Destroyers. Perhaps one day we will find out in STO... *:)*
Your sovvy also isn't canon, especially with a cloaking device. Why don't you let Buenamigo load up and pay for all the tech upgrades for all three of his Texas class ships to get them to that same level?
All we need is one good guy with a defiant.
Thankfully this isn't Voyager so the warp drive doesn't get knocked offline by lovetap
The Texas class did more damage to that station than the entire fleet did in Picard Season 3.
Not even the mighty Sovereing-class could handle three small Texas-class vessels.
Season 4 Starfleet is done for!
the disrespect towards the Sovereign Class is crazy
in hind sight
man the texas was a beast
it did a number to a SOVEREIGN
imagine if it entered mass production
And once again Starfleet's greatest enemy is responsible for hundreds of deaths... the admirals.
The three texas class ships should not have wrecked a sovereign class that hard!!!
my theory is that they must have hacked its computer systems and used its prefix codes to confuse its targeting and lower its shields. would explain why the torpedoes it fired missed.
That's both clever and terrifying
Its either what Disneyminus said or that the AI knew the shield system of the Sovereign and each of the three was targeting the shield using that knowledge to cut through as fast as possible. Where they hit with the beams was likely the shield generators or needed for the shield, so it crippled the defense. They are smaller and faster and have AI to pinpoint exact spots to hit. I wouldn't be surprised if their torpedoes that split up hit selected targets not just random spots. Crippling primary and secondary systems quickly. It was a blitzkrieg that the captain had no way to predict or act against.
I think the Prometheus got them to think this would work, given how AWESOME that one did even after being sabotaged thanks to the efforts of two other AIs(One heavily modded to be fair, but still). Mind, it seems Zimmerman didn't help with these at all, so it fails. Starfleet needs to learn which crotchety scientists to listen to.
Zimmerman would've probably reported buenomigo
Is this the 1st time seeing space dock get attacked???
*@True Trek Tv ~* Overall? *_No._*
There have been various instances of starbases, space stations, and outposts/watchposts, attacked across ST-history (which should not be a surprise given Star Trek's overall age and number of ST-series).
Additionally, the starbase in this episode *[LD 3x10 - "The Stars At Night"]* is *NOT* Earth Space Dock (ESD). It is _'Douglas Station',_ a starbase built in the same structural pattern as ESD. It has not yet been codified exactly where Douglas Station is located in the ST-galaxy.
Hope this helps explain/clarify. *:)*
How many people died here. They seem awfully chill after.
@@tolazytothinkofanamd2351 with the amount of destruction a few dozen to a few hundred give or take
Amazing
Damn that Sovereign got its crown split
I know they're supposed to be the super-duper new ship on the block (and it's for the plot), but I'm not a fan of how effortlessly ships so small overpower a Sovereign class, if that level of tech/power were available it should *already* be implemented into Sovereigns since they're major combatants and flag level capital ships
I see the logic in why the Texas Class managed to damage a sovereign Class so quickly
Buenamigo's code might have implied he worked with or knew about section 31, meaning any hot new illegal/untested tech to use. If it's untested on a crew's ship they'd have to worry about ill effects on them... That doesn't apply to a ship that's fully automous
The class Is also based on Badgy's code, and we've seen he's terrifyingly good at writing viruses and overriding systems which with the Starbase's opening to allow the two other Texas Class ships means he was effectively able to override their systems. The AI would also have most of Starfleet's shield frequencies on speed dial add being able to immediately fire vs having to type on a console to activate the weapons first.
In short, quicker reaction time added with strategy and admiral level knowledge of the entire Federation's capabilities... Even Picard, Janeway or any other of the badasses we've seen commanding a sovereign class wouldn't be able to match up with an AI predisposed to shoot in a millisecond ask questions later
Also it was a 3v1 with the Texas Class having the advantage of not having warped in
Buenamigo wanted to make a name for himself. Instead, he left behind a legacy of destruction and death.
those texas class must be like the defiant class to take on a soveriegn.
They're armed to the teeth with all power channels to weapons
*@Darien Evans ~* That is fairly accurate, yes. *:)*
The _Texas-class_ Destroyers are roughly the same size as the _Defiant-class_ Tactical Escorts. The difference being that the _Texas_ Destroyers are able to pack more power (energy), weapons, and shields, than a _Defiant_ TE because it needs no interior space for crews.
Likewise, the _Texas_ Destroyers can (out)maneuver better than a _Defiant_ TE since it does not need Inertial Dampeners to cushion any crew.
So a _Texas_ Destroyer would likely be able to take out a _Defiant_ TE one-on-one. Just as a _Sovereign-class_ Assault Cruiser (i.e.: the USS Van Citters; named after long-time ST executive John Van Citters) being taken down by 3x _Texas_ Destroyers; and _Sovereign_ ASCs are "tanks" in terms of damage resilience.
If only 3 are needed to take on a Sovereign, they're probably far more powerful than a Defiant.
Contrary to the impression given by the USS Defiant (a hero ship with plot armour), Defiants aren't really that powerful. The Defiant itself has never actually gone up against anything bigger than itself and won.
@@vegeta002 unless you coun that mirror universe klingon negh var dreadnough.t
@@joeswanson733 That one was more "frustrate the enemy into rage quitting" than winning through the Defiants power.
The ship didn't really seem to be in that bad a shape, the commander was just a little bitch.
I love how this series thta bird species science officer is completly useless , despite sitting on same spot as captain and number one. On second thought, that number one was also mostly
useless trought the series
the green bird dude sitting next to the captain is the ships counselor. Being completely useless during a battle is not surprising. Not sure why he felt the need to be on the bridge.
Admiral Picard? I thought Lowers Decks was set in a time in which Picard was still Enterprise's captain.
Assuming this is alpha canon, and my questionable math is right, it would mean he accepted promotion two years after Nemesis. Any idea if that's consistent with the Picard series' timeline?
@@Falchion1984 it is yeah
@@beepthemeep12 Kinda surprising, given Star Trek's tendency to contradict itself. The prequel Enterprise series was ragged hard for looking too anachronistic compared to Disco Trek, for instance.
I checked Wikipedia and "Star Trek: Nemesis" took place in 2379, while this episode of "Star Trek: Lower Decks" took place in 2381. So it is possible that Picard was still captain of the Enterprise at this time. But since "Star Trek: Picard" began in 2386 it is possible that this episode took place shortly before Picard retired from Starfleet after becoming an admiral.
Picard Was Right! Again!
The Odyssee Class would wipe out those Texas Class.
That sovereign class went down way too easy. And why didn't she use quantum torpedoes?
i don't mind seeing the sovereign go down if it went down fighting like full phaser barrages unloading QT and PT i mean it's got 3 forward PT launchers and the QT launcher. the sovereign has 6 aft PT launchers. if firing everything and we see the texas ships unloading a lot on the sovereign to overwhelm her than fine so be it. by this point hte sovereign is no longer cutting edge shes already 8-9 years old as a ship class and dealing with black ops experimental ships.
Cus that captain is still a newbie by using tier 5 Sovereign Assault Cruiser on elite difficulty.
In TNG Worf would get his ass kicked to show how strong an enemy is, the Sovereign was 'Worfed' to show how powerful the Texas class is or was.
Quantum Torpedoes?! In THIS economy?
They dont arrive till Tuesday :)
The Tactical Officer on that Sovereign needs to be fired.
They needed Worf but he would not arrive till Tuesday 😂
2:42, SHE'LL FLY APART
California class=pathetically armed
Texas class=heavily armed
Anyone else pick up on this
Not Earth Starbase - Douglas Station. Just looks like Earth Spacedock
Exactly how many times do starships controlled by AIs have to go berserk and attack the Federation before Starfleet finally takes the hint?
I think the problem is that each AI is deployed before it is checked out and ready. The AI on the Aledo had already identified issues that could have been resolved before deployment. If one Ensign could discover the issue [Note: he had to discover it on his own since his memories were deleted], a group of AI specialists could have discovered it and fixed it. But the Admiral rushed it in to use.
@@Solitaire001 - Although *somebody* had to modify the A.I., because Rutherford said there were some changes. He himself was incapacitated and had his memory wiped before the Texas-class ships were built. Whoever took over had to add programming for it to run the Aledo's hardware, which hadn't been completed yet when Rutherford was no longer involved. So, obviously, there somebody involved in the project who *did* look at the code and missed the defects.
That's a lot of people we see dying on screen....
I wonder how many people died from the wackadood AI going nuts
You'd think with how often the "rogue AI" plot comes up in Star Trek, that people interested in making it or those allowing it, would draw notes from all the times it failed and have better contingencies
They usually do have some changes made, this one only really failed because of Rutherfords mistakes, the EMH worked perfectly fine, Prometheus class worked perfectly fine, Data worked fine... It has proven to work and work well when it does.
Maybe it keeps being a relevant story to tell in a franchise that is close to spanning entire lifetimes
@@adambrown6669 Something to mention about the EMH. In the "Star Trek: Voyager" episode "Darkling", to improve himself The Doctor on his own decided to introduce into his code the personalities from the great figures of history. What he didn't count on was that while the great figures had positive aspects they also had negative aspects too and he got them too. One of them was a great Vulcan leader who also was a brutal authoritarian. It caused The Doctor to develop an evil alternate personality who was extremely dangerous (tried to kill one man, and paralyzed Torres). This shows that, just like with AI, Holograms can also be extremely dangerous.
Figures Texas Class Ships would turn.
Starfleet did not learn their lesson from M-5
It seems that Texas-class *runs* on modified M-5, if the interface's anything to go about.
@@caav56 to be fair to the Texas's they were indeed in an abusive relationship with the admiral.
if they were treated like people & not property?
I think the AI handling the operation of weaponry would not be a problem.
see when an AI goes rouge, its always tied to human error.
no child want to be treated like a disposable object, & since dialogue didn't work the only recourse it has left is violence.
notice how they didn't finish the SOV or the space dock when they could have, they chased the California class that held their step oppressor instead.
their attack was entirely focused on the ones that abused them & those physically close them via proximity.
@@caav56 Plus, it has the code from an individual with daddy issues (it seems that Rutherford has long-running father issues that are so strong that it ends up in his computer code, long before he created Badgy).
IT'S THE CONTROL? 👀👀👀👀
You would think Starfleet would have learned their lesson after the whole M-5 fiasco.....
The Texas class' look kinda like Orion ships from old trek games (Starfleet Command for example). just more federationy. i like it.
So I think that the Aledo's assault on the station and that Sovereign-class ship must have caused at least several hundred deaths. That means that, between this incident, the battle with the Living Construct at the end of Prodigy season 1, and the Synth bombing of Utopia Planitia a few years later, the Federation had just experiences three mass-casualty attacks on their core territory within a span of about five years, with the last one killing tens of thousands. Even if you don't agree with it, you can kind of understand why there would be a desire to ban artificial intelligence development at that point.
The problem with an AI is that it must be designed correctly. Jumping franchises, in the anime "Bubblegum Crisis" they have androids called Boomers who are basically artificial humans. To make a Boomer they duplicate everything in the human body via mechanical, electronic, and AI means. When properly designed, a Boomer will function just like a normal human, including emotions.
The problem is, sometimes the creators take shortcuts, make mistakes, or intentionally introduce dangerous code that results in boomers going rouge and becoming extremely dangerous. It is such a problem that a special division of the Police called the A. D. Police was created to deal with issues involving boomers.
It is the same thing with AI. If you design it properly it will be a benefit, when not it results in this.
Shouldn't the 1st Texas class be called the USS Texas not the USS Aledo?
Ah the Star Trek rendition of blowing up the current class of enterprise to show how serious the threat is
Enterprise E, the way to be.
I actually live in Aledo Texas.
Has anything ever dodged a torpedo in Star Trek before?
I don't think I've ever seen that.
I’ve been imagining using the phasers at low power like a phalanx defence system
@@Skigress Yes, that happens in the "The Stars At Night" too.
Is the scale really correct?
Say what you will about Lower Decks, their season finale's are always off the hook. Don't get me wrong, I love the show so much. But you got to admit, it is its most Trek self in the finales.
I thought ships couldn't fire a warp.
It’s honestly a mood whiplash when something like this happen in a largely comedic show.
all those poor bastards getting killed on the station because of some egomaniac admiral wanting a promotion.
It's tradition in Lower Decks. Remember the Season 1 finale where that other California class ship got destroyed with all hands by the Pakled.
@@gebauzchris well that one they went to warp while they had a tractor cable on them... so they blew themselves up.
@@gebauzchris That hit hard.
First, some comedy bits from a new crew....then all those lives lost.
Lower Decks has gone the way of The Orville. It set out to be a comedy but the lack of actually good Sci-Fi content has pushed it into the serious realm with a few gags to lighten the mood.
Little bit hard to believe the station has no shields of any kind.
Caught off guard
And probably the ships were inside the shield bubble.
Xinda cabal! 🤓😎🖖🏻