I think the only realistic way to add mokujin would be to do what you said and make him a bonus for a season pass. If they tried to announce mokujin, even for less than a normal fighters price, IGN would immediately have an article titled “Tekken 8 charges money for clone character” before the trailer was even 2 minutes old.
Yeah I think that's ultimately the only way they could go about it and please everyone. And yeah lol I could see the IGN and Polygon articles from here
@@SammysapphiraThey cant sell Moku to people. They sold T7 for $70 ($130 deluxe ed.) and 5 season passes for $20 each & frame data for $4 + w/e cosmetics bs and 30 times $7 to $10 per new character.. If they still ask for money on a piece of wood that has 0 original moves I will book a flight to Japan and put my wood in each of their mouthes....
I'd love to see Mokujin as a free character or as an Eleven in SFV situation. Side note I think Capcom could learn from SNK and do a little for good will.
Mokujin was last in TTT2 and that game had DLC characters (all free btw). I think the best solution would be this: -Make Mokujin a free DLC character but make him a part of the final DLC pack (or balance update) so that all other fighters are already out and would eliminate the need to revisit him multiple times. By waiting until then, it will also give players more of a chance to learn every character and give more incentive to play Mokujin. -Have him only be able to use fighting styles the player owns (obviously; also more reason to have him released last as by that point most people will own all DLC fighters and the game will have generated enough revenue to make coding him worthwhile). -Bring back the female Mokujin model as an alternate costume and a Tetsujin and Kinjin skin as customization options.
Mokujin as a mimic with few adjustments for "just for fun" balance and animation - free. Mokujin with new moveset/readjusted hitboxes with "tournament safe" balance and animation - paid
I think hitboxes aren't an issue, since you're cycling through 32 (33 with Eddy) characters, which is enough handicap already. Or the fact that it kinda evens out, that you have a bigger hitbox for smaller characters, but at the same time a smaller hitbox for bigger characters.
Itd be sorta cool if Mokujin got his own unique moveset, but it borrowed moves from other characters. Like, maybe he has no unique moves, but together he has a unique moveset. Kinda like Seth from SF. Keeps the spirit of the character without having to update him every season
If they don't do anything different with him, then he should be free and shouldn't take up a DLC spot imo. They could even use him as an advertisement and trial play for future DLC. Something like him having a smaller chance to mimic DLC if you don't own it, or he could be used to practice against DLC fighters in training.
MOKUJIN can work in Tekken 8, as, from the lore point of view, it is actually active whenever there is a superior evil force like in 3,5 and 6. Given Azazel is present as a boss here it can be back again or better yet add a spin on it.
They would also need to make a Character Episode for Mokujin aswell! There's a lot that goes into a character these days, so I understand the debate. I think companies footing the bill in the name of PR isn't too bad. I also would understand buying a character like this at a discounted price as I like Mokujin and I like Tekken. I'm wondering if Bandai will choose to monetize outfits in T8 just like they have in Street Fighter. A (T4/T5/T6 costume pack etc).
I'd be willing to pay up to 2.99 for him but even then I think that's a bit much. I would love him though and I'd play him every day. I'd imagine the issue internally he'd be a bit dangerous in a tekken with so many different things to watch out for.
I've been wanting Mokujin to return from the very second I realized he wasn't in TK7. Definitely deserved a spot on the main roster, but since that didn't happen, dlc is a wet dream of mine. And about the pricing, free or nah? I don't really care, i'd get the dlc either way
Mokujin is the ultimate character for a casual competitive player which I think after season 1 or 2 becomes the life blood of a fighting game's community.
I've always liked the "mimic" or the random style/weapon characters in games as they're just really bizarre and no one really knows how a match will go.
Polls like this are useless, because gAmErS are insatiable and when asked "Do you want XYZ?" will answer "Yes!", regardless if they use that feature or even care. It's a question in a vacuum. Better put "Would you rather us work on ABC or XYZ?"
Sure part of the roster. But why waste the slot, literally nobody plays mokujin aside from guys just trying to have a quick laugh. So why bother ? Is what i think they'll say. But yeah mokujin is a fun concept but if he ever becomes a dlc or a free addition. I'll never really play him seriously maybe for laughs but never seriously.
IMO, Mokujin is simply the ultimate proof of Tekken mastery, ever. No other character compares in that regard. So I would LOVE to see him return, as a paid DLC even, as long as they implement with this features: 1- Don't modify the hurt or hitboxes from the original characters, at all. Modify Mokujin's pieces to generally adapt to the body types, just like they did with Roger Mokujin in the past. It doesn't need to be a perfect match visually, just enough to roughly cover the limb lenghts and body thickness. Keep it wooden and simple. 2- Allow players to select which characters will be in the list for the random moveset. Lunalu in Granblue works this way, and it is AMAZING. You can practice the characters you love in random without having to switch every time, it is an AMAZING feature. 3- If your random moveset list is incomplete, your plate will say just "Mokujin". If your list is full, your plate will say "True Mokujin". 4- Create special customization items you can only use if you have ALL the characters selected in your random moveset list. For example, the King Mokujin parafernalia, the Golden Tetsujin skin, etc. 5- Create an special, secondary Rage Art exclusive for Mokujin you can use only if you have ALL the characters selected in your random moveset list. Something mistical and tree-based. 6- Give a special rank title that you can only win if you reach the top rank with Mokujin while having all the characters selected in the random moveset list. "True Master of All Tekken Arts" or something like that, super flashy and with it's own exclusive color. 7- Offer a special trophy to anyone who can win an official tourney using "True Mokujin". This way, Mokujin became an amazing tool for practicing your most beloved characters at online matches, a super inspiring price for mastery and hard work, and a great piece of marketing and entertainment you want to see in action in high level competitive matches. And it would be truly worth the price.
I find it quite ironic since the whole Tekken series revolves around being the King/Queen of the Iron Fist Tournament (Excluding the Mishima Lore I know that's probably not gonna end), only to be defeated by a statue with a wooden fist. -A guy who is stuck playing Tekken 6 (PSP+Xbox One) as his only Tekken game owned.
I want Mokujin with two added abilities: Ability 1 mimics his opponent to create a mirror match. Ability 2 cycles to a different character. His transform animation should be punishable, but possible to safely to pull off after a heavy knockdown. That way he retains his "Random +" design but also gives the Mokujin player some options to salvage a bad match-up.
I personally think that this could be an opportunity for mokujin to still be a mimick character at his core but also be something unique enough to be worth buying. For example, what if mokujin behaved as normally, but he didn't copy any heat related moves from the character. Instead, he had his own unique abilities or traits. And what if one of those abilities let him change styles? Or, better yet, switch to a preselected style from a draw of 4. Just spit balling, but there is a lot of potential for something fun and unique if you add just smidge or creativity to him. I was giving a whole bunch of ideas under that poll of haradas
I envisioned something for Mokujin that takles both lore and balance. Azazel has been awakened once again which should urge Mokujin to come back. But after days of slumber, the Mokujin oak had been mainpulated in some way to the point where Mokujin can change size and would become corrupted by some sort of evil spirits or something. The changing of size in the lore answers the Hitbox situation where Mokujin can be more balanced due to more consistent matchups. Just an idea.
I think there are 2 realistic possiblities for mokujin to comback: he either going to be an actual character with his own moves or a combination of moves from unreleased characters which definetly going to cost dlc money. Or same mimic character given for free as a celebration for some event/milestone (like anniversary or X copies sold)
A version of Mokujin that functions more like Honoka from Dead or Alive would be a lot of fun to see. If he has a unique playstyle made up of moves from a bunch of other characters. He wouldn't have to be updated because he wouldn't require moves from every character to fill out his movelist. Another fun idea would be if his rage art was random, It's just a cutscene so shouldn't effect balance or anything. I'd love to see him throw his head at the opponent Alisa style.
I wouldn’t mind a DLC pack of “Echo fighters” Miharu for xioayu, Sebastian for Lilli, the other Law, we could get mokujin and even combot, Tiger for Eddy Gordo. I wouldn’t mind them as just pallette swaps. I’d pay for it !
I mean snk got us rugal for free. Mokujin is a beloved idea. Every casual I know wants this kind of character back because it’s the epitome of fun. You win, no one gets mad because you can write it off as luck, you lose, same thing. It lets ppl let go of their ego & prevent themselves from taking the game or themselves too seriously & I think that’s genuinely important for long term retention in a fighting game.
I would totally buy mokujin. I love the fact that you can change fighting styles between rounds but taking a fighter's slot. I know it would be heartbreaking for other players but they could decide to only choose some character's fighting styles to put in so the work would be easier like don't put reina's moves on mokujin maybe take away some moves that would be hard to put on mokujin. Something like that so then it would be easier if they decided to make him free
My opinion is fairly straightforward: I love Mokujin and I want him back. It's fun to use him in casual play because he's silly looking and people like to guess which moveset he's using now. About the debate: He doesn't have any moves of his own so in theory he shouldn't be paid DLC, but if he mimics moves from characters one doesn't own, it's teeechnically getting the character for free even if in an extremely impractical way. So, my proposed solution: Free Mokujin DLC, he gets his own promo and whatnot, character episode etc, but they should implement a simple flag check in his programming that doesn't allow for characters a player doesn't own to be added to his rotation. Since the Tekken team is probably going to keep with what they did in T7 and allow you to access DLC characters in practice mode to learn match-ups, I don't see an issue if they choose to go this way.
I believe that its possible for mokujin to be its own character in tekken he could have a move set of his own thats relatively simple but have a stance that learns the last move that was used and and a stance that forgets it, i randomly has characteristics of different characters every round for instance having a wave dash or something gimmicky, probably not the best ideas all round but theres definitely options it just depends on what bandai namco wants to do with the character honestly.
I honestly think they should let Mokujin magically resize himself. They could come up with some story element that allows him to do that now. Sure, they'll have to make more models, but it's more or less just resizing. This allows them to ignore changing hitboxes/hurtboxes (which Harada says it's more complicated than that). And the players will benefit from transferring their character knowledge to Mokujin without any adjusting. In terms of being free or paid? I think he should be free, but they could do it as "bonus character with season pass". The devs don't entirely lose money on it, and people are only paying for the other characters in the season pass and getting Mokujin as a bonus.
Heat is a great chance to make him a little bit more like an actual character. His heat should give him something that stays the same no matter who he's mimicking imo. A small list of cool throwback moves could be an idea. Imagine Mokujin bringing back Ogre, Dr B and Jinpachi's moves. It's a chance to celebrate the Tekken series as a whole.
Honestly I think cases like this are perfect for trying new stuff * Idk, imagine if Mokujin worked as a "stance" character, his stances being 2 different characters for the entire match instead of changing styles between rounds. It would still resemble Mokujin but with something extra on top of that. This might not sound really fun considering how deep Tekken is making picking up a random character to fight not a good idea, but i think Tekken 8's special style controls would work wonders with this Mokujin concept (and theorizing about optimal character combinations sounds kinda fun imo) * As someone said in a video regarding Eleven, why not make it so that Mokujin can also work as a "mirror match" character? Imagine if by holding a certain button at the start of the round Mokujin ALWAYS used the style of the opponent's character. Winning with him like this would be so disrespectful lol * Maybe Mokujin could have some very good moves that are just always there regardless of the style he is currently using? It would kinda defeat the purpose of the character, but im just brainstorming here
I think he will probably end up paid. I would much rather pay money than not have him in game. One thing they should do to ease that is give him something unique in his heat state. Maybe in heat you can switch to a moveset of your choice to run some mixups until it runs out? I can't even imagine what the button combos for each character would look like lol
Actually, they could do something similar to yoshimitsu's soul Calibur 4 appearance. Maybe the time remaining when you hit heat would determine the character you get when it activates. He still wouldnt be competitive, but you could actually run some cool stuff at least for a little while
@@hands-ongaming7180 Is not a random select but a practice/brag tool. I would absolutely pay for it, if it is well developed and feature rich, and not just a last minute throw in.
Hi! First of all, congrats for the video. I really like your channel. 🙏 So, about this whole Mokujin topic, I have some considerations I'd like to add. Personally, I really like Mokujin as well. I think he became a mascot of Tekken, and I was kinda sad that we wasn't added in Tekken 7, not even as a training dummy, at least. So, to me, I'd be pretty happy to see Mokujin returning on Tekken 8, however, I feel myself on the fence about this whole paid/free DLC topic. Because, as much as I agree that since his style is based on Mimicry (Mokujin-ken, in TTT2) it's easy to say that "they wouldn't have a lot of work adding him", but people are forgetting 2 main things that makes that statement invalid. And I'm not talking about the whole hurtboxes stuff, but about the game's mechanics itself. Think about it: Tekken 8 introduced this whole heat drive system, that allows characters to do unique stuff to their gameplay, and not to mention the rage arts, that are specific to each character. How the hell would Mokujin mimic all the unique stuff that EACH CHARACTER gets when activated the heat drive?? (Kazuya's devil form, Nina's guns, Jack's Proton Cannon, Kuma's weapon fish...) See, the Tekken team would have to completely rethink their strategy over Mokujin's gameplay style, and hell maybe even create some new stuff for him, so it'd not be easy to simply just add him for free in the game, y'know? But what you think? Thanks again man! ✌️
Thanks for the kind comments! And yeah I think it's a much more popular complicated situation than some realise. I get that some may seem him as a glorified random select but for 8 there'd be a ton of stuff you'd have to consider and change around just to fit him in. I didn't even mention the Heat system stuff like you did which would also be a load of extra work on top.
@@scotiaviii exactly. Now imagine having to do all that stuff, to make the character even more unique without losing his essence, just to be for free? I think it'd be kinda unfair. I'm not defending the company or anything, I'm just trying to explain that in the current situation of the game, add a character like Mokujin wouldn't just be simply make a Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V to all characters. As a matter of fact, I think a viable solution for him, it'd be if EACH attack of his was based on another character. Like, each move he would have, would be from a character already in the game, instead of make him copy a whole style through the whole round. I dunno, it's just an idea. And hey, thanks for the response! 😁🙏
@@Saikyokugen Yep I totally agree, I don't want to just automatically defend a big company like Bamco but the whole situation has a lot more to it than just 'random select should be free'. I don't envy the Tekken team at all for whatever choice they end up making, even if it's to not bother with Mokujin at all.
I think Mokujin in a space where Simple mode can be turned on and off might actually make Mokujin a bit of a monster given that it's less info one would need to memorize to be able to handle a round where you get thrown a curveball you don't know as much about.
I have no idea why they didn't have the poll before T8's release and then make him as part of the base roster. It would've been so much easier to justify selling us back say someone like Claudio or Raven as a full price DLC but now they're in this pickle. Either way I'm sure they'll figure it out, Harada's clever enough to not just chuck a poll up like that and have it lead to nothing (I hope lol)
9:35 he's actually not too different from Kirby in Smash Bros. he too has a lot of work to him including DLC when it comes to what copy ability he get and balancing each copy ability with every new dlc character tho with that said, I'd like to see the character back along with Armor King, the kangaro aka Roger, maybe even bring back Pac-Man but not have him using Mokujin as a mech like he does in Street Fighter X Tekken basically I lake the wacky rosters of Tekken, they can even bring in more fighting game characters from other serieses like they did with Akuma, in that chase I think Ryu from Street Fighter could be fun and even tho he made more sense for Mortal Kombat, the Terminator could be interesting to see in Tekken too
I think Mokujin should be released for free alongside the final character, as a free bonus character if you own the entire roster. They could technically call him free, but obviously be cashing in on everyone who ends up getting him. Also you wouldn't have to keep updating him with every new character, and you could be slowly working on him as a side project for all these years. I think another thing, as ridiculous as it sounds, but very real to the people cashing in on this, is that they wouldn't want to give for free what is sold. They wouldn't want to let you play as Anna if you didn't buy Anna, even if it's at random, so being a bonus for people who already have it all would cover that too.
Would have to be free, a bonus, or super cheap. It's a gimmick character, that's kind if bad/hard to be good with. DLC characters have to be worth it by power or hype. Think about it, you're not going to buy a bad character
Mokujin is a huge part of the identity of Tekken, and with the DLC, I understand that making Mokujin in a game with DLC would cause even more headache but just make him only copy the base roster. Boom, easy. Also, obviously, make him free. I don't think making him paid would be in any good will of the playerbase.
sf5 did a good job with this exact issue...make mokujin a free character for those who preorder the season pass 2 like twelve was in sfv...well even if they make him an actual dlc im willing to pay for my main
They should make Mokujin being able to mix inbetween two or three fightingstyles of the players choice, so he will be Able to pull of some sweet combos and completly broken 😂 Make it happen!
Release Mokujin at the end that way he won't need to be updated every time a new characters drops after him. He'll already have all characters that will be in the game
Would Bandai Namco really be taking a loss when they release Mokujin for free, while making all other mainline characters, that have been in the roster since the early games as paid DLC?
Mokujin is not taking anyone's character slot, he's just random select. He, Tetsujin, Kinjin & Combot can all be added to Tekken 8 as all they need to do is make models for them, everything else is recycled content. If Jack-like hit & hurt boxes are a problem, don't have him mimic those characters.
Im just wondering if its even worth it, people saying yes want him in the game but will never touch him or play him. If they do play him it will just be for a couple games and thats it. As long as hes not gonna take resources or time for an actual character we want then yea more the merrier. If we get a Tekken Tag 3 safe bet he would be there
@@andret3739 nah...a lot of people like his looks and story He's a legacy nostalgic tekken character so people will be hyped even if he does not have his signature random gameplay
Sometimes i feel amazed how my thoughts syncs with yt recommendations I been thinking about mokujin today, and my thoughts are that he is the part of tekken, a lot of people love the log-man, and i love him too the thing is, to make him bamco (which is obvious) have to rework him from his last appearance in ttt2(both visually and mechanically) and id prefer genius developers of tekken team to put their time into other characters and balancing. I love u mokujin, but u just don't worth the time 🕰️ If they will do the "eleven" scenario(in street fighter 5 they added free character eleven, that just replicates random character, but he sucks because he is just the worst version of random select) so idk really Paid dlc? Bruh add other characters! Free junk? Nah thx im good My perfect scenario of mokujin returning in tekken 8 is making him more than just random select gimmick, if they will give him unique mechanics and make him competitively viable , and interesting and fun.... then mayyyybeeee yes
if mokujin continues being an irrelevant glorified random select button, he should be free and not take a season pass slot if they do something interesting for him, give him an unique moveset but a stance/move that allows him to copy opponent moves like tk4 yoshimitsu then he's welcome as full fledged bought dlc
The hitbox/hurtbox adjustments is actually less work than you're making it out to be in Tekken's case in particular. The hitboxes are tied to like the characters model/skeleton, so Mokujin with Jack range can't even happen from what I understand. Mokujin Jack is actually really bad for this exact reason in fact because he doesn't have extendo arms like Jack-8 does for obvious reasons. They would still probably require adjustments definitely but just saying it's not nearly as much work as you made it out in Tekken's case in past titles prior to at least T7 and I remember the devs even stating as such as well at one point. The trickiest part for Mokujin in T7 as well as T8 to a lesser extent is how does Mokujin get added into roster with resource management and still be fun but not overpowered as well as not be weak? T7 this was super obviously a problem with 2D meter characters such as Eliza, Geese and Akuma, but this problem is still present in T8 due to Leroy retaining his 1 use cane move per match. Last minor point I think worth mentioning [definitely not important but fun trivia more so than actual food for thought] is apparently there is a lore consistency with Mokujin in all the mainline Tekken games, Mokujin doesn't actually get involved in tournaments or stories where the main Mishimas are the main villains of the central story. Tekken 3 was Ogre, Tekken 5 was Jinpachi and Tekken 6 was Azazel. To which it is also worth noting in all these Tekkens Mokujin is part of these villains wanted absolute destruction of the world in Tekken not world domination like Kazuya. Now onto the main point of your video which is the business side and logistics of this. I think we all agree we'd want Mokujin free in a perfect world but I think from more a pragmatic stand point they should bundle Mokujin under a season pass. Perhaps they could even do something like they did with T7 framedata dlc and have a free version and paid version. In Mokujin's case the character is free but the character episode if they make one (unlike dlc characters in T7) is paid dlc.
Thank you for clarifying some of the hitbox and other balancing stuff, I admit I'm not massively knowledgeable on the ins and outs of it so having that explained in more detail is helpful.
I can see this developing into a lei situation where people are going to ask for a character and not play. Perfect world of mokujin would be in the game but please don't bring him back and charge.
There's another important problem about Mokujin that you didn't mention, which is, no one would play him. There are +30 characters in the roster, and most people play 2 to 3 max, which means, most of the times, you will be forced to play characters you don't enjoy. People like the idea of having Mokujin in the game, but in practice, they would try him for a couple of hours, and they'll get bored and drop him because they'll be forced to play Panda, Xiaoyu, Zafina, for example. Mokujin would be fun for a couple of minutes, but the amount people that would play him regularly is so little it's not worth considering. It just doesn't worth the effort, and technical issues he will cause to put him in the game. He will be a source of constant work due to fixes, and updates, and at the end of the day his usage would be very low.
I think the only realistic way to add mokujin would be to do what you said and make him a bonus for a season pass. If they tried to announce mokujin, even for less than a normal fighters price, IGN would immediately have an article titled “Tekken 8 charges money for clone character” before the trailer was even 2 minutes old.
Yeah I think that's ultimately the only way they could go about it and please everyone. And yeah lol I could see the IGN and Polygon articles from here
Actually the article is probably already written, it would be up in seconds 😂
No they wouldn't? Seth released in SFV just fine.
@@SammysapphiraThey cant sell Moku to people. They sold T7 for $70 ($130 deluxe ed.) and 5 season passes for $20 each & frame data for $4 + w/e cosmetics bs and 30 times $7 to $10 per new character.. If they still ask for money on a piece of wood that has 0 original moves I will book a flight to Japan and put my wood in each of their mouthes....
I'd love to see Mokujin as a free character or as an Eleven in SFV situation.
Side note I think Capcom could learn from SNK and do a little for good will.
Mokujin was last in TTT2 and that game had DLC characters (all free btw).
I think the best solution would be this:
-Make Mokujin a free DLC character but make him a part of the final DLC pack (or balance update) so that all other fighters are already out and would eliminate the need to revisit him multiple times. By waiting until then, it will also give players more of a chance to learn every character and give more incentive to play Mokujin.
-Have him only be able to use fighting styles the player owns (obviously; also more reason to have him released last as by that point most people will own all DLC fighters and the game will have generated enough revenue to make coding him worthwhile).
-Bring back the female Mokujin model as an alternate costume and a Tetsujin and Kinjin skin as customization options.
Mokujin as a mimic with few adjustments for "just for fun" balance and animation - free.
Mokujin with new moveset/readjusted hitboxes with "tournament safe" balance and animation - paid
Yeah, this aint ttt2 mokujin that has to copy a hundred characters either 😂
I think hitboxes aren't an issue, since you're cycling through 32 (33 with Eddy) characters, which is enough handicap already. Or the fact that it kinda evens out, that you have a bigger hitbox for smaller characters, but at the same time a smaller hitbox for bigger characters.
Itd be sorta cool if Mokujin got his own unique moveset, but it borrowed moves from other characters. Like, maybe he has no unique moves, but together he has a unique moveset. Kinda like Seth from SF. Keeps the spirit of the character without having to update him every season
See: Combot in Tekken Tag 2.
@@Lenoh Combot was an incredible idea
If they don't do anything different with him, then he should be free and shouldn't take up a DLC spot imo. They could even use him as an advertisement and trial play for future DLC. Something like him having a smaller chance to mimic DLC if you don't own it, or he could be used to practice against DLC fighters in training.
MOKUJIN can work in Tekken 8, as, from the lore point of view, it is actually active whenever there is a superior evil force like in 3,5 and 6. Given Azazel is present as a boss here it can be back again or better yet add a spin on it.
Shoot The clash between Kazuya and Jin should be enough to awaken him
As long as the funny wood guy is in the game im happy
I feel a intresting concept would be your ghost appearing as Mokujin
They would also need to make a Character Episode for Mokujin aswell! There's a lot that goes into a character these days, so I understand the debate. I think companies footing the bill in the name of PR isn't too bad. I also would understand buying a character like this at a discounted price as I like Mokujin and I like Tekken. I'm wondering if Bandai will choose to monetize outfits in T8 just like they have in Street Fighter. A (T4/T5/T6 costume pack etc).
If they give him out for free I think no one would be mad about a drawn slide show with wood sounds though.
I'd be willing to pay up to 2.99 for him but even then I think that's a bit much. I would love him though and I'd play him every day. I'd imagine the issue internally he'd be a bit dangerous in a tekken with so many different things to watch out for.
I've been wanting Mokujin to return from the very second I realized he wasn't in TK7. Definitely deserved a spot on the main roster, but since that didn't happen, dlc is a wet dream of mine.
And about the pricing, free or nah? I don't really care, i'd get the dlc either way
Mokujin is the ultimate character for a casual competitive player which I think after season 1 or 2 becomes the life blood of a fighting game's community.
I've always liked the "mimic" or the random style/weapon characters in games as they're just really bizarre and no one really knows how a match will go.
I feel like being able to pick 3 character for Mokujin to cycle throughwould be really cool. Kind of a mini KOF mechanic
Polls like this are useless, because gAmErS are insatiable and when asked "Do you want XYZ?" will answer "Yes!", regardless if they use that feature or even care. It's a question in a vacuum. Better put "Would you rather us work on ABC or XYZ?"
I think there are instances where "do you want this?" is a valid question, but this is a good point
Free DLC would be the best outcome, but being a reward for buying a season pass or something seems fair enough. I been missing him since T6
Mokujin is such a fun concept and I don't get why it's not in all of the games just because.
Sure part of the roster. But why waste the slot, literally nobody plays mokujin aside from guys just trying to have a quick laugh. So why bother ? Is what i think they'll say. But yeah mokujin is a fun concept but if he ever becomes a dlc or a free addition. I'll never really play him seriously maybe for laughs but never seriously.
IMO, Mokujin is simply the ultimate proof of Tekken mastery, ever. No other character compares in that regard.
So I would LOVE to see him return, as a paid DLC even, as long as they implement with this features:
1- Don't modify the hurt or hitboxes from the original characters, at all. Modify Mokujin's pieces to generally adapt to the body types, just like they did with Roger Mokujin in the past. It doesn't need to be a perfect match visually, just enough to roughly cover the limb lenghts and body thickness. Keep it wooden and simple.
2- Allow players to select which characters will be in the list for the random moveset. Lunalu in Granblue works this way, and it is AMAZING. You can practice the characters you love in random without having to switch every time, it is an AMAZING feature.
3- If your random moveset list is incomplete, your plate will say just "Mokujin". If your list is full, your plate will say "True Mokujin".
4- Create special customization items you can only use if you have ALL the characters selected in your random moveset list. For example, the King Mokujin parafernalia, the Golden Tetsujin skin, etc.
5- Create an special, secondary Rage Art exclusive for Mokujin you can use only if you have ALL the characters selected in your random moveset list. Something mistical and tree-based.
6- Give a special rank title that you can only win if you reach the top rank with Mokujin while having all the characters selected in the random moveset list. "True Master of All Tekken Arts" or something like that, super flashy and with it's own exclusive color.
7- Offer a special trophy to anyone who can win an official tourney using "True Mokujin".
This way, Mokujin became an amazing tool for practicing your most beloved characters at online matches, a super inspiring price for mastery and hard work, and a great piece of marketing and entertainment you want to see in action in high level competitive matches. And it would be truly worth the price.
I find it quite ironic since the whole Tekken series revolves around being the King/Queen of the Iron Fist Tournament (Excluding the Mishima Lore I know that's probably not gonna end), only to be defeated by a statue with a wooden fist.
-A guy who is stuck playing Tekken 6 (PSP+Xbox One) as his only Tekken game owned.
I want Mokujin with two added abilities: Ability 1 mimics his opponent to create a mirror match. Ability 2 cycles to a different character. His transform animation should be punishable, but possible to safely to pull off after a heavy knockdown. That way he retains his "Random +" design but also gives the Mokujin player some options to salvage a bad match-up.
Absolutely! Let’s go. Mokujin is the ultimate knowledge check.
I personally think that this could be an opportunity for mokujin to still be a mimick character at his core but also be something unique enough to be worth buying.
For example, what if mokujin behaved as normally, but he didn't copy any heat related moves from the character. Instead, he had his own unique abilities or traits. And what if one of those abilities let him change styles? Or, better yet, switch to a preselected style from a draw of 4.
Just spit balling, but there is a lot of potential for something fun and unique if you add just smidge or creativity to him. I was giving a whole bunch of ideas under that poll of haradas
I envisioned something for Mokujin that takles both lore and balance. Azazel has been awakened once again which should urge Mokujin to come back. But after days of slumber, the Mokujin oak had been mainpulated in some way to the point where Mokujin can change size and would become corrupted by some sort of evil spirits or something. The changing of size in the lore answers the Hitbox situation where Mokujin can be more balanced due to more consistent matchups. Just an idea.
They could just make mokujin a skin for every character
Genius now the mokojin army is back once more
I think there are 2 realistic possiblities for mokujin to comback: he either going to be an actual character with his own moves or a combination of moves from unreleased characters which definetly going to cost dlc money. Or same mimic character given for free as a celebration for some event/milestone (like anniversary or X copies sold)
A version of Mokujin that functions more like Honoka from Dead or Alive would be a lot of fun to see. If he has a unique playstyle made up of moves from a bunch of other characters. He wouldn't have to be updated because he wouldn't require moves from every character to fill out his movelist. Another fun idea would be if his rage art was random, It's just a cutscene so shouldn't effect balance or anything. I'd love to see him throw his head at the opponent Alisa style.
Why not have him be a bonus for the first dlc a person buys? Like a promotional bonus thing you get with your first dlc purchase.
I wouldn’t mind a DLC pack of “Echo fighters” Miharu for xioayu, Sebastian for Lilli, the other Law, we could get mokujin and even combot, Tiger for Eddy Gordo. I wouldn’t mind them as just pallette swaps. I’d pay for it !
Combot would be fine too.
I mean snk got us rugal for free. Mokujin is a beloved idea. Every casual I know wants this kind of character back because it’s the epitome of fun. You win, no one gets mad because you can write it off as luck, you lose, same thing. It lets ppl let go of their ego & prevent themselves from taking the game or themselves too seriously & I think that’s genuinely important for long term retention in a fighting game.
I would totally buy mokujin. I love the fact that you can change fighting styles between rounds but taking a fighter's slot. I know it would be heartbreaking for other players but they could decide to only choose some character's fighting styles to put in so the work would be easier like don't put reina's moves on mokujin maybe take away some moves that would be hard to put on mokujin. Something like that so then it would be easier if they decided to make him free
Holy fuck I saw the thumbnail and legit just had this talk with my friend
We neeeed him in Tekken 8
My opinion is fairly straightforward: I love Mokujin and I want him back. It's fun to use him in casual play because he's silly looking and people like to guess which moveset he's using now.
About the debate: He doesn't have any moves of his own so in theory he shouldn't be paid DLC, but if he mimics moves from characters one doesn't own, it's teeechnically getting the character for free even if in an extremely impractical way.
So, my proposed solution: Free Mokujin DLC, he gets his own promo and whatnot, character episode etc, but they should implement a simple flag check in his programming that doesn't allow for characters a player doesn't own to be added to his rotation. Since the Tekken team is probably going to keep with what they did in T7 and allow you to access DLC characters in practice mode to learn match-ups, I don't see an issue if they choose to go this way.
I believe that its possible for mokujin to be its own character in tekken he could have a move set of his own thats relatively simple but have a stance that learns the last move that was used and and a stance that forgets it, i randomly has characteristics of different characters every round for instance having a wave dash or something gimmicky, probably not the best ideas all round but theres definitely options it just depends on what bandai namco wants to do with the character honestly.
I honestly think they should let Mokujin magically resize himself. They could come up with some story element that allows him to do that now. Sure, they'll have to make more models, but it's more or less just resizing. This allows them to ignore changing hitboxes/hurtboxes (which Harada says it's more complicated than that). And the players will benefit from transferring their character knowledge to Mokujin without any adjusting.
In terms of being free or paid? I think he should be free, but they could do it as "bonus character with season pass". The devs don't entirely lose money on it, and people are only paying for the other characters in the season pass and getting Mokujin as a bonus.
Heat is a great chance to make him a little bit more like an actual character. His heat should give him something that stays the same no matter who he's mimicking imo.
A small list of cool throwback moves could be an idea. Imagine Mokujin bringing back Ogre, Dr B and Jinpachi's moves.
It's a chance to celebrate the Tekken series as a whole.
Honestly I think cases like this are perfect for trying new stuff
* Idk, imagine if Mokujin worked as a "stance" character, his stances being 2 different characters for the entire match instead of changing styles between rounds. It would still resemble Mokujin but with something extra on top of that. This might not sound really fun considering how deep Tekken is making picking up a random character to fight not a good idea, but i think Tekken 8's special style controls would work wonders with this Mokujin concept (and theorizing about optimal character combinations sounds kinda fun imo)
* As someone said in a video regarding Eleven, why not make it so that Mokujin can also work as a "mirror match" character? Imagine if by holding a certain button at the start of the round Mokujin ALWAYS used the style of the opponent's character. Winning with him like this would be so disrespectful lol
* Maybe Mokujin could have some very good moves that are just always there regardless of the style he is currently using? It would kinda defeat the purpose of the character, but im just brainstorming here
I think he will probably end up paid. I would much rather pay money than not have him in game.
One thing they should do to ease that is give him something unique in his heat state. Maybe in heat you can switch to a moveset of your choice to run some mixups until it runs out?
I can't even imagine what the button combos for each character would look like lol
Actually, they could do something similar to yoshimitsu's soul Calibur 4 appearance. Maybe the time remaining when you hit heat would determine the character you get when it activates.
He still wouldnt be competitive, but you could actually run some cool stuff at least for a little while
So you’d pay for a random select button? Bozo
@@hands-ongaming7180 Is not a random select but a practice/brag tool. I would absolutely pay for it, if it is well developed and feature rich, and not just a last minute throw in.
@@ardidsonriente2223 so the $ 70 you already paid isn’t enough ? Bozo logic
Hi! First of all, congrats for the video. I really like your channel. 🙏
So, about this whole Mokujin topic, I have some considerations I'd like to add.
Personally, I really like Mokujin as well. I think he became a mascot of Tekken, and I was kinda sad that we wasn't added in Tekken 7, not even as a training dummy, at least.
So, to me, I'd be pretty happy to see Mokujin returning on Tekken 8, however, I feel myself on the fence about this whole paid/free DLC topic.
Because, as much as I agree that since his style is based on Mimicry (Mokujin-ken, in TTT2) it's easy to say that "they wouldn't have a lot of work adding him", but people are forgetting 2 main things that makes that statement invalid. And I'm not talking about the whole hurtboxes stuff, but about the game's mechanics itself.
Think about it: Tekken 8 introduced this whole heat drive system, that allows characters to do unique stuff to their gameplay, and not to mention the rage arts, that are specific to each character. How the hell would Mokujin mimic all the unique stuff that EACH CHARACTER gets when activated the heat drive?? (Kazuya's devil form, Nina's guns, Jack's Proton Cannon, Kuma's weapon fish...)
See, the Tekken team would have to completely rethink their strategy over Mokujin's gameplay style, and hell maybe even create some new stuff for him, so it'd not be easy to simply just add him for free in the game, y'know?
But what you think? Thanks again man! ✌️
Thanks for the kind comments! And yeah I think it's a much more popular complicated situation than some realise. I get that some may seem him as a glorified random select but for 8 there'd be a ton of stuff you'd have to consider and change around just to fit him in. I didn't even mention the Heat system stuff like you did which would also be a load of extra work on top.
@@scotiaviii exactly. Now imagine having to do all that stuff, to make the character even more unique without losing his essence, just to be for free? I think it'd be kinda unfair. I'm not defending the company or anything, I'm just trying to explain that in the current situation of the game, add a character like Mokujin wouldn't just be simply make a Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V to all characters.
As a matter of fact, I think a viable solution for him, it'd be if EACH attack of his was based on another character. Like, each move he would have, would be from a character already in the game, instead of make him copy a whole style through the whole round. I dunno, it's just an idea.
And hey, thanks for the response! 😁🙏
@@Saikyokugen Yep I totally agree, I don't want to just automatically defend a big company like Bamco but the whole situation has a lot more to it than just 'random select should be free'. I don't envy the Tekken team at all for whatever choice they end up making, even if it's to not bother with Mokujin at all.
They should use A.I. to make character's Moveset based from Previous Tekken Games.
Off topic, seeing Jin and Hwarang switch there outfits is so sweet, and the bro kind of sweet
I think Mokujin in a space where Simple mode can be turned on and off might actually make Mokujin a bit of a monster given that it's less info one would need to memorize to be able to handle a round where you get thrown a curveball you don't know as much about.
Mokujin is hell of fun as it is. One day in tah 2 one friend and me playes 100 matcjes, both usong only Mokujin, It was a good day
I have no idea why they didn't have the poll before T8's release and then make him as part of the base roster. It would've been so much easier to justify selling us back say someone like Claudio or Raven as a full price DLC but now they're in this pickle. Either way I'm sure they'll figure it out, Harada's clever enough to not just chuck a poll up like that and have it lead to nothing (I hope lol)
9:35 he's actually not too different from Kirby in Smash Bros. he too has a lot of work to him including DLC when it comes to what copy ability he get and balancing each copy ability with every new dlc character
tho with that said, I'd like to see the character back along with Armor King, the kangaro aka Roger, maybe even bring back Pac-Man but not have him using Mokujin as a mech like he does in Street Fighter X Tekken
basically I lake the wacky rosters of Tekken, they can even bring in more fighting game characters from other serieses like they did with Akuma, in that chase I think Ryu from Street Fighter could be fun
and even tho he made more sense for Mortal Kombat, the Terminator could be interesting to see in Tekken too
If Mokujin is Playable, We can see Tetsujin, & Kinjin as Costumes.
I think Mokujin should be released for free alongside the final character, as a free bonus character if you own the entire roster. They could technically call him free, but obviously be cashing in on everyone who ends up getting him. Also you wouldn't have to keep updating him with every new character, and you could be slowly working on him as a side project for all these years. I think another thing, as ridiculous as it sounds, but very real to the people cashing in on this, is that they wouldn't want to give for free what is sold. They wouldn't want to let you play as Anna if you didn't buy Anna, even if it's at random, so being a bonus for people who already have it all would cover that too.
would love for it to be free and replace the random button.
If Tag 2 adds a Wooden Wing & Tail just to mimic Orge, Thry can Resize Mokujin for Jack-8.
Would have to be free, a bonus, or super cheap. It's a gimmick character, that's kind if bad/hard to be good with. DLC characters have to be worth it by power or hype. Think about it, you're not going to buy a bad character
Mokujin is a huge part of the identity of Tekken, and with the DLC, I understand that making Mokujin in a game with DLC would cause even more headache but just make him only copy the base roster. Boom, easy. Also, obviously, make him free. I don't think making him paid would be in any good will of the playerbase.
sf5 did a good job with this exact issue...make mokujin a free character for those who preorder the season pass 2 like twelve was in sfv...well even if they make him an actual dlc im willing to pay for my main
They should make Mokujin being able to mix inbetween two or three fightingstyles of the players choice, so he will be Able to pull of some sweet combos and completly broken 😂 Make it happen!
mokjin could always be a costume for every character, or just replace random select
At least anything Testujin/Mokujin/combat could be a training dummy in practice mode
I desperately want to see someone get TGO/GoD with Mokujin
They should make him with unique style.
Would be cool but that wouldn't be Mokujin
From a lore standpoint mokujin should have been in Tekken 8. There was mad evil going on
If Mokujin is DLC, he should change Movesets per Round.
Mokujin is the random chracter select screen his still there
Hmm, he should be free imo. Also if he has access to DLC characters as well, then it can kind of act like a demo for players before they buy DLC.
Release Mokujin at the end that way he won't need to be updated every time a new characters drops after him. He'll already have all characters that will be in the game
Would Bandai Namco really be taking a loss when they release Mokujin for free, while making all other mainline characters, that have been in the roster since the early games as paid DLC?
They could make him a moveset and be a pay for dlc character or clone moveset and free for everyone
What about Dr. B? He had a unique moveset in Tag 2
Mokujin is not taking anyone's character slot, he's just random select.
He, Tetsujin, Kinjin & Combot can all be added to Tekken 8 as all they need to do is make models for them, everything else is recycled content.
If Jack-like hit & hurt boxes are a problem, don't have him mimic those characters.
Im just wondering if its even worth it, people saying yes want him in the game but will never touch him or play him. If they do play him it will just be for a couple games and thats it. As long as hes not gonna take resources or time for an actual character we want then yea more the merrier. If we get a Tekken Tag 3 safe bet he would be there
mokujin is the only character i want for tekken 8
They should add Mokujin but with his own gameplay
Mokujin having his own gameplay defeats the purpose of Mokujin
@@andret3739 nah...a lot of people like his looks and story
He's a legacy nostalgic tekken character so people will be hyped even if he does not have his signature random gameplay
@@andret3739 Trust me Mokujin with a new playstyle will get a lot more attention than simply making a brand new character
Turning Mokujin into a composite character like Double from Skullgirls is a take I haven't seen before, surprisingly enough.
Thats so fucking stupid the whole point of mokujin is that he copies a random character
Omg please give us Mokujin
imagine paying for a randomizer. Mokujin should be a free DLC. Yall expect me to pay for a character that plays like all my other characters?
Make Mokujin as everyones skin male get the 1p model female get the 2p model and leo gets um uh it can go both
Sometimes i feel amazed how my thoughts syncs with yt recommendations
I been thinking about mokujin today, and my thoughts are that he is the part of tekken, a lot of people love the log-man, and i love him too
the thing is, to make him bamco (which is obvious) have to rework him from his last appearance in ttt2(both visually and mechanically) and id prefer genius developers of tekken team to put their time into other characters and balancing. I love u mokujin, but u just don't worth the time 🕰️
If they will do the "eleven" scenario(in street fighter 5 they added free character eleven, that just replicates random character, but he sucks because he is just the worst version of random select) so idk really
Paid dlc? Bruh add other characters!
Free junk? Nah thx im good
My perfect scenario of mokujin returning in tekken 8 is making him more than just random select gimmick, if they will give him unique mechanics and make him competitively viable , and interesting and fun.... then mayyyybeeee yes
Just make him random select going forward.
if mokujin continues being an irrelevant glorified random select button, he should be free and not take a season pass slot
if they do something interesting for him, give him an unique moveset but a stance/move that allows him to copy opponent moves like tk4 yoshimitsu then he's welcome as full fledged bought dlc
The hitbox/hurtbox adjustments is actually less work than you're making it out to be in Tekken's case in particular. The hitboxes are tied to like the characters model/skeleton, so Mokujin with Jack range can't even happen from what I understand. Mokujin Jack is actually really bad for this exact reason in fact because he doesn't have extendo arms like Jack-8 does for obvious reasons. They would still probably require adjustments definitely but just saying it's not nearly as much work as you made it out in Tekken's case in past titles prior to at least T7 and I remember the devs even stating as such as well at one point. The trickiest part for Mokujin in T7 as well as T8 to a lesser extent is how does Mokujin get added into roster with resource management and still be fun but not overpowered as well as not be weak? T7 this was super obviously a problem with 2D meter characters such as Eliza, Geese and Akuma, but this problem is still present in T8 due to Leroy retaining his 1 use cane move per match. Last minor point I think worth mentioning [definitely not important but fun trivia more so than actual food for thought] is apparently there is a lore consistency with Mokujin in all the mainline Tekken games, Mokujin doesn't actually get involved in tournaments or stories where the main Mishimas are the main villains of the central story. Tekken 3 was Ogre, Tekken 5 was Jinpachi and Tekken 6 was Azazel. To which it is also worth noting in all these Tekkens Mokujin is part of these villains wanted absolute destruction of the world in Tekken not world domination like Kazuya. Now onto the main point of your video which is the business side and logistics of this. I think we all agree we'd want Mokujin free in a perfect world but I think from more a pragmatic stand point they should bundle Mokujin under a season pass. Perhaps they could even do something like they did with T7 framedata dlc and have a free version and paid version. In Mokujin's case the character is free but the character episode if they make one (unlike dlc characters in T7) is paid dlc.
Thank you for clarifying some of the hitbox and other balancing stuff, I admit I'm not massively knowledgeable on the ins and outs of it so having that explained in more detail is helpful.
I can see this developing into a lei situation where people are going to ask for a character and not play. Perfect world of mokujin would be in the game but please don't bring him back and charge.
Add a mokujin vs mokujin ranked mode
I want Ganryu
I’d rather have mokujin than combot
They should make him like lunalu from grandblue fantasy versus rising so that u can choose which character u get randomized
Make him dlc and he uses moves no longer in a character's moveset.
I would absolutely luagh they rrlease mokojin and every one calling it op
There's another important problem about Mokujin that you didn't mention, which is, no one would play him.
There are +30 characters in the roster, and most people play 2 to 3 max, which means, most of the times, you will be forced to play characters you don't enjoy.
People like the idea of having Mokujin in the game, but in practice, they would try him for a couple of hours, and they'll get bored and drop him because they'll be forced to play Panda, Xiaoyu, Zafina, for example.
Mokujin would be fun for a couple of minutes, but the amount people that would play him regularly is so little it's not worth considering. It just doesn't worth the effort, and technical issues he will cause to put him in the game.
He will be a source of constant work due to fixes, and updates, and at the end of the day his usage would be very low.