Ranking the Clive Barker Novels
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- A subjective ranking, from least favourite to absolute favourite, of the 13 novels of Clive Barker #books #booktube #horror #clivebarker #horrortube #clivebarker
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Coldheart Canyon is seriously underrated. Such a great novel.
Yep. Bizarre how it doesn't seam to get the love it deserves.
Loved your rankings on one of my favorite authors. Mine is different, but I agree that Weaveworld is his greatest novel
Thanks Michael. It's great to see you out there bringing attention to Clive Barker's novels. Damnation Game was his grimmest, hard-core horror novel. I love all his dark fantasy novels, especially Weaveworld and The Great and Secret Show.
Thanks for the kind words. I definitely agree. I wish the current crop of horror writers drew more inspiration from him. I'm not getting the same thrills from recent horror output (Adam Nevill excepted).
It’s been so many years since I have read Weaveworld that I really need to reread it. I remember so little of it, just how immersed I was in the story. I think it’s the first Barker I ever read.
That's a good example of when forgetting is a blessing; you get to read Weaveworld almost as if it's your first time!😀
Weaveworld was my first and remains my all time favourite Clive Barker book
Such a great book!
Weaveworld is the top one of all my favorite Barker’s novel. It’s fast-paced and highly imaginative
Scarlet Gospels above Everville and Imajica? I simply can’t.
Completely agree.
The Scarlet Gospels wasn't even written by Clive beyond the opening chapter. It was ghostwritten by a certain somebody who used Clive's skeleton of the story, and fleshed it out with hundreds of pages of his own shockingly awful dialogue, characters who were little more than off-the-peg stereotypes, terrible pacing and dull, clichéd, vapid prose which quickly alerted any regular Barker reader as to the bait-and-switch when it comes to the book's author.
@@OldDevlin Is this correct? I know that the prequel story Hellraiser: The Toll was written by Mark Allan Miller based on a story by Barker but this is the first I've heard about the scarlet Gospels being ghost written, I would greatly appreciate it if you would elaborate on this.
@@Paul_Bond. I'd rather not elaborate, to be honest. There are reasons that Clive's never openly acknowledged this, and for the same reasons, I'd rather just leave it unsubstantiated.
Let's just deal with a few of the well known facts:
Clive was incapacitated for a number of years and relied on people close to him to run his business, and continue his work (in an editorial capacity) in his absence. He's said openly in an interview that some of these people stole from him, and took advantage of his absence by greenlighting their own work, and rewriting Clive's own work. He's had to completely rewrite his next novel, at it was butchered and rewritten by other parties without his authorisation, but fortunately he was well enough at the right time to stop it being published.
Publishers give authors advances and contracts are signed. If a work is published in an author's name, and said author then claims that it isn't their work, and that it went to press without their approval based on the unscrupulous actions of people who were supposed to be acting in their best interests, the author would find themselves in a whole heap of legal and financial trouble.
Miller no longer works at Clive's company, Seraphim.
@@OldDevlin Thanks very much, I appreciate your reply.
@roysailor3031 ah winge winge ya minge
I am currently reading Imajica for the first time in my life. 75% into the book and I plan to finish it before the end of the year. Honestly I am enjoying it very much. But it won't top my #1 which is Weaveworld. Weaveworld is a fantastic book that I wish I could forget just so that I can read it again "for the first time".
Barker books that I still need to read are The Damnation Game, Mister B. Gone, Galilee and Coldheart Canyon. Think that the next book from Barker that I'll pick up will be Coldheart Canyon.
How's the Adam Nevill ranking progressing?
Hi Urosh. Thanks for sharing. I love hearing about people's experience with authors that I love. I had a very similar experience to yours in reading Imajica. It's also one of those books that gets better the longer it stays in my mind well after having read it (like Weaveworld). I'm currently reading Cunning Folk; should finish in the next few days. Then I have the short The Vessel to read and then I can do my ranking! I should put it out before the end of the month, but I have so many video ideas I want to do, too. So, if not later this month than in January without fail.
practical effects in Cabal movie are awesome!
True that!
Yes, Weaveworld is also my #1! Imajica is my #2 and Galilee #3. The Great and Secret Show and Everville still remain on my shelves as well. Always hoped there would be a sequel to Galilee.
Thank you for the comment Bethhendy. Most Clive Barker fans seem to like Imajica more than I did. I must not have been in the right frame of mind when I read it, shut in my small flat in Budapest feeling grumpy.
And I thought Cabal
Was one of my favourites Midian is such a haunting place. Loved the old movie Too
Yeah, I loved it the first time I read it, too. Though on the second read, it didn't quite land as well with me.
Cool list and reasoning. My list is very different but that's the appeal of watching these types of videos. We both have Thief of always at 8 though :)
1 Great and Secret Show (love the art universe)
2 Sacrament (this feels like his most personal novel and probably the one that moved me the most)
3 Everville (will he ever write another sequel, I fear not)
4 Abrat Days of Magic, Nights of War
5 Abrat Absolute Midnight (more hopeful he will finish this series, according to his website he's written most of the next 2 books, hope springs eternal)
6 Weaveworld (loved the first half, but felt it lost focus and momentum in the second half. Similar experience with Imajica)
7 Imajica
8 The Thief of Always
9 Mister B gone
10 Cabal
I'm with you on Sacrament. That packs quite an emotional punch.
Where does the warsaw plotline leads to ?
If I remember right, that's where the nefarious 'deal' is made with with a faustian figure. Cut to present day (1985) and the man is trying to get out of the deal, which is what the main story is about.
@@Michael_Wertenberg did not really get what the "deal" was. Also the game/Poker plotline did not really get anywhere to. There was no final Poker game.
im sorry but listening to your synopsis of imajica reveals that you really do need to revisit it
it is far more than what you describe and it seems the material is not fresh in your memory
after seeing it at number 10 and hearing you just kinda brush it off as "meh it's good" was really frustrating
i lost all interest in the rest of your list after that
had you given an accurate description and clear reasons for why it was at number ten i would've been much more inclined to stick around for the rest of your list
honestly i really wouldn't have been bothered about the ranking of any of the books but imajica at #10 made me feel like i probably wouldn't value your opinion on anything that followed
im not even saying imajica should've been #1 because i truly understand it isn't everyone's cup o tea.. though it is easily my favorite
i just think putting it at ten throws everything else into question
thanks
happy holidays 🎀
Hi Belina. Thanks for the comment. A lot of other commentors have expressed similar frustrations because I placed it so 'low'. That's fair. I appreciate the passion behind the comments. I really liked Imajica, but Barker has written so many great books, there are 9 others that hit me harder. Sometimes it's a question of the mindset and expectations when reading a book. Imajica, I read quite late in his bibliography, so I had expectations set very high, whereas for example, The Damnationm Game was able to take me by surprise. I read Imajica after Weaveworld, and that's a tough one to follow. Weaveworld is a masterpiece. And I expected to Imajica to hit me as hard as Weaveworld had. But I only really liked it, not more😑
What would clive think
of "sensitivity readers"
???🤔
I'm not sure what 'sensitivity reader' means. Sounds scary, though.
@@Michael_Wertenberg far leftism!😃
@@johnthehumanist2333 You know Clive Barker is openly gay right?
@@armando5846 I thoght he was bi,but your point???🤔
@@Michael_WertenbergThey’ve been around for a while, but in recent years they’ve been used mainly for yet-to-be-published young adult fiction to try and point out instances of racism/sexism (etc). Because these things have become entirely subjective many would-be authors are falling afoul of overly sensitive readers who apply complex and unfounded criticisms to otherwise entirely reasonable stories.
Although I would not have picked your 2 ..I loved weaveworld. The female monster sisters still give me nightmares... just disturbing
In retrospect, there's a chance that my #2 was in response to a lot of the negative reviews I saw the book getting. Though I do love it, maybe if I did the ranking again there would be some minor adjustments... (Weaveworld would still be #1 thoug🙂)
Mister B Gone sucked. It was like all filler.
I loved it. But I completely understand why it hasn't worked on everyone.
@@Michael_Wertenberg If Mr. B didn't spend like seriously half the book telling me to burn it or that he's seeking up on me when you're told a the start that he was trapped in the book I woulda been pretty alright
"I'm absolutely hooked on your channel. I'm from Brazil 🇧🇷 and stumbled upon it while searching for more videos about Clive Barker. I'm on a personal mission to read all of Clive's books, and my next adventure will be 'Weaveworld.' Despite fantasy not being my go-to genre, I'm genuinely thrilled. Kudos on your channel and the fantastic content about Clive Barker!"
Hi Leandro. Thanks for the kind words😁I love Brazil! Tenho muitas lembrancas. I used to live in Crato, Ceara when I was younger. (Long story.) I'm thrilled you will be reading Weaveworld. I'm thinking you are going to love it! Please let me know how it works out for you. And don't worry about not being a fantasy reader. I'm not a fantasy reader either. In fact, the only fantasy I read is from Clive Barker (with maybe 1 or 2 other random books).
@@Michael_Wertenberg Seriously? I'm from Recife, Pernambuco. Still shocked by this information, it seems like a good story ❤, haha. Returning to Clive, I should start the book by the end of this month. When I finish, I'll come and chat with you here. Thanks for the encouragement! From your videos, we seem to have similar tastes, so I'm excited!!❤❤
Looking forward to it😁@@leandropaulo2921
Imajica is my favorite. Great and secret show #2
Great books. You'll get no arguement from me.
I read THE THIEF OF ALWAY in 1992 and didn't like it. I recently bought IMAGICA though it looked like it would be very hard to get into and I like an easy read. I'm thinking maybe in the future I'll devote time to IMAGICA because it looked cool, the world building looked intricate.
Imajica is great. Gorgeous world building. Most readers love it. (I'm getting a lot of flack in this comment section for ranking it as low as I did🙃). Good luck with it. It's not a difficult read but not a quick one, either. (Hellbound Heart is short and 'easy'. Just saying.)
my first of his books I read was Weaveworld way back in 1988...read a few after that and enjoyed them...Imajica was great - even if long. I dropped off though and haven't read many after...but a few.
.... Enjoyed your rankings and opinions on the CB novels.... Considering my right arm is covered with 30+ tattoos based on his drawings and paintings, I'm a pretty hardcore fan.....
Just found Weaveworld today. I will read it in a few weeks. Thanks for the recommendation.
😃I'm hoping you love it as much as I did (and I'm thinking you will)
Clive Barker, in my eyes has always been underrated. Even his foray into movies and TV aren't known well. I actually really enjoyed his movie and TV work although some were better than others.
I actually wasn't aware that he'd done work for TV. I just looked it up on IMDB and see that he's credited for an episode of Tales From the Darkside and two episodes of Masters of Horror. Will be checking those out this weekend. Thanks for bringing it to my attention!
Ehem Hellraiser is very well known..
I randomly started reading weaveworld bc that’s what my library had and wasn’t sure if it was a good start. I’m only 60 pages in and loving it so I’m glad to hear it’s your favorite. Looks like I’m reading mister b gone next
Weaveworld was fantastic. Reading Imajaca now and not really digging it so far 300 pages in
Enjoy Weaveworld. Let us know how you end up liking it.
@@johnmorrison1002 I had a tough time with Imajica, too. But it is one of those books that, for me, gets better the longer I have to 'digest it'. I like it more now than I did when I was reading it.
Thanks for this video! Been on a horror novel binge lately and this helped me for the legendary works of Barker.
Hi Riffz. Thanks for the kind words😁Enjoy the binge. I know how fun and addictive horror books can be. I've been on a binge too for about 8 months now and don't intend to slow down.
Spoilers"………. The only thing holding Gallilee back is the ending. This build up to something huge! Then… nothing… a “ride off into the sunset” if memory serves me.
Fair point. Maybe that's why I've heard some readers wanting a sequel. I was fine with the ending. They did violently destroy the mansion at least.
Weaveworld is my all time favourite single-volume book. I've read and reread it many times over the years. It's both magical and disturbing.
Yes! I'm happy you've had a great experience with it. Me too! Brilliant!
My first Clive Barker book was Weaveworld and absolutely loved it. Based on my love of Weaveworld, what would you suggest/recommend as the next Clive Barker dark fantasy novel?
Great question! Imajica is his most celebrated (though it's quite a thick one). I have a preference for the 2-part series The Great and Secret Show/Everville, but the first part leans more towards horror than the second part. I'd say Imajica if you want more fantasy leaning and The Great and Secret Show/Everville if you want more horror leaning. They both contain the two elements and you won't go wrong whichever you choose (though The Great and Secret Show is set on Earth while Imajica has some fantastic world-building!)
@@Michael_Wertenberg Thank you so much! This really helped. I will probably end up reading both as they do sound quite good.
You have imbued this video with a real Ginsburg-era vibe----I agree with all you are saying but of course I have a different ranking and I would hope that I had the same powers of persuasion that you have displayed here in justifying my 'ordering'.
Imajica is my favorite. Weaveworld was my first too. I agree about what you said on The Great And Secret Show which was 'freedom of assembly' at its best'. Galilee was all about 'aloofness'.....Wonderful video. This is my second time viewing it.
I love this comment! Thank you😁
Absolutely adore Weaveworld! Happily to completely agree with its placement!
😁
Thanks for the video! I found it when trying to research whether the 3rd Book of the Art came out. I read both in the 2000s in high school (lol if only my parents knew what I was reading!), and I was sure the 3rd had to be out. Turns out it isn't, but there's a lot more to read from him!
😁I know the feeling. Every year I fall for the hype of his 'new release', Deep Hill. But one of these years it will actually come out... maybe. If not, it's true, he's given us so much already! Thanks for watching and for the positive vibes😁
Good list but would have gone with Weaveworld then the 2 books of the art. Cant believe WeVeworlx is not a film
Yeah, Quiddity and The Sea of Our Dreams in Everville is brilliant! Weaveworld is so epic, perhaps a Netflix series... But it would take a hell of a director to pull it off.
I'm presently reading Galilee. Not very impressed, really
I'm sorry to hear that. Maybe it will grow on you. It's true it is a bit of a departure for Barker. While it still has fantasy and horror elements, it also gives us some romance.
Mister B. Gone isn't particularly scary, unless you get tripped out by meta/cognitohazard type stuff, but I'd argue that it is disturbing... at least if you get grossed out by bathing in warm baby's blood 😅
Also, where's Abarat on this list!?
Fair point😅I didn't include any graphic novels or short story collections, only traditional type novels. Would you believe, I've never read a graphic novel in my life! Nothing against them, just haven't taken the opportunity yet...
@@Michael_Wertenberg is Abarat considered a graphic novel? I've only listened to them as audiobooks.
Thanks for the reply 👍 😀
Wow--you ranked The Scarlet Gospels higher than Everville and Imajica?!? It's widely believed that Barker didn't even write it. It was genuinely awful.
I'll have to disagree. Gorgeous tour of hell and an interesting internal conflict with Pinhead. But Everville and Imajica are amazing too.
I'm not aware of any evidence that The Scarlet Gospels was ghostwritten (though I've heard the assertions). I do know it was heavily edited, cut down by St. Martin's Press from 230,000 words to a little over 100,000. You do bring up a good point, though. The Scarlet Gospels was relatively early in my re-discovery of Clive Barker after reading The Books of Blood, Cabal, and The Thief of Always decades prior and only revisiting the Books of Blood a year or so prior to reading The Scarlet Gospels. All his other works, I read afterwards. It makes a huge difference the order in which one reads an authors catalogue.@@OldDevlin
Very interesting. I'm sorry to hear he had to go through that. Thanks for sharing.@@OldDevlin
@@Michael_Wertenbergwhat did who go through?
@@gaminganimators7000 My bad. I was responding to another comment in the wrong place. A commentor said Clive Barker was sick and being taken advantage of by supposed friends at the time of the creation of The Scarlet Gospels. I don't know this, it's only what the commentor said.
Great video!
Thank you, Sogoma 😁
Imajica at number TEN? Are you out of your mind? Mister B Gone is NINE places above freakin IMAJICA??
Yes, I probably am out of my mind.
Hi. So sorry, but I have to agree, imajica at number ten!!!! Are you joking??? Please tell me you are taking the piss!! Imajica is Clive Barker at his creative peak. The book exhausted him and very wisely never want that far again. I agree with weaveworld as number two, but imajica at number 10!!!! Sorry, I respect your opinions but you are simply wrong.. no way, not buying it. Mister b gone is better than imajica???? You cannot be seriousm
I love the enthusiasm! It's just my opinion based on my experience reading his work. Who knows what my mindset was like when reading. Maybe life was very tough on me when I read Imajica and things were going swimingly when I read Mister B Gone and that helped shaped my opinions. Could be. I just had a better experience with Mister B Gone than I did with Imajica. And Imajica is amazing! It's only so low because I love Clive Barker's work and I love some of his other books a bit more.@@steveneaton6438
@@Michael_Wertenberg hi. Pleaas don't misunderstand me, we are all entitled to our views, and they are all valid. You make some good points that I didn't consider. I started reading mr.barker whilst at school. Everyone else loves pop stars,, I loved a writer. And yes, I got bullied. I bought his books as soon as they came out j saw nightbreed three times in one week at rhe cinema. Your points are well made, but still, imajica is more worrhy than number ten. I beg you to reconsider. Read it again, starting tonight. as much as I have enjoyed his subsequent books, imajica is his masterpiece. For me. Feel free to disagree.
@alanbissett4651 stop your crying
Clive Barker is the king of getting you involved immediately in the book. Weaveworld is the only Clive Barker book I have read (I have had it since it was released in hardback), is one of my favorites, so it was great to hear your rankings about his other books. Thank you.
Your welcome. And thanks for the kind words😁
Wow that was a surprisingly high ranking for Mister B Gone! I do think it’s a fun read for sure, but for my money, it’s not a patch on the vast majority of his other works. I guess for me it just ends up feeling a little… superfluous, I guess. I very much agree with your #1 though. His best work in a sea of greats.
Great list!
Thanks for the feedback and the kind words😀I've been getting a lot of comments about how high I ranked Mister B. Gone. But I've never read anything comparable, and I place a high value on inventiveness.
Hey Michael. I’ve read The Last Illusion but haven’t read The Great and Secret Show or Everville yet. Do you recommend reading the latter two before reading The Scarlet Gospels? Not sure how relevant D’Amour’s backstory and prior escapades are to the novel. Thanks
Hi Zach. It's true that I have a preference for The Great and Secret Show and Everville (my appreciation for Everville has grown over the 2 or so years since I read it; it's one of those books that simmers in the immagination and gets better over time. At least, that was the case for me.) The Scarlet Gospels features Harry d'Amour like The Last Illusion, (he also appears in The Great and Secret Show but only as a minor character) so if you want to follow that character, The Scarlet Gospels would be a good follow up. Even if, chronologically for the character, The Great and Secret Show and Everville happen first, he contributes so little to those stories that if you're reading specifically for that character, you may be disappointed. Even if The Scarlet Gospels is a sequel to The Hellbound Heart, you can read it as a stand-alone. So ultimately, I prefer the two books of the art, but The Scarlet Gospels will give you much more Harry d'amour. And you can always read the books of the art after. The order isn't really important, I think. Hope that helps. And, happy reading!
Thanks, yes that helps. I was under the impression both Books of the Art had D'Amour as the main character for some reason. I'll probably queue up Scarlet Gospels soon then and save BOTA for a later time since they're both pretty hefty. I was also waiting on finding another copy of Hellbound Heart (I had a first paperback edition with that awesome cover art but lost it at some point over the years...sad) so I could refresh my memory on it before reading Gospels, but I never see anything other than beat up copies of Gallilee and Sacrament at the used books stores...
Imajica, Everville are 1 and 2 for me!
Fine choices, indeed!
@@Michael_Wertenberg I got into the short stories after reading those two, then life happened, so will be reading the rest in your ranked order, solid vid!
@@walkinchubby Godspeed! Let me know how it works out for you.