You are my savior. I just acquired a 1249. I got a good idea what the issues were. I took it to a local shop to be informed that, basically, nobody within a couple thousand miles works on them. The technician explained that, if I am to own a Dual, I will need to be my own tech. I will be using this video and following it second by second. I appreciate how well you recorded exactly what you were doing AND explained little details. Fortunately mine is in a bit better shape.
1249 a much more complex Dual than my 1019 ! My Dual 1019 was purchased in Germany (by me) in 1968, during my tour with the US Army. I did change the output cables, and had problems with the tone arm head. The head has 4 finger like tabs that apply spring pressure on the cartridge assembly for L and R channels. I needed to clean and gently push on these fingers to remake contact...Still runs pretty good today, but I do have an occasional motor noise. Excellent video ! Thank you
When Was a buyer in the Hi Fi trade I started buying Dual turntables in favour of the Gerrard units of the day. They were much better built and easier to service generally. When I was selling a lot of equipment from the same supplier I was invited over to the factory in Germany and I was very impressed at how well and how we it was run. I also got to see the other factories for Sennheiser and AKG
Ist Vunderbar! (Excuse my bad German attempt) I had a bottle of Freon to clean vcr heads. The lid was on, but after a period of storage, it all evaporated. Must not have been on tight enough. Radio Shack. I think I still have the empty jar.
I bought this turntable on Nov 6, 1976 ($175. including the wooden base & dust cover which were considered accessories). Still have it... and still trying to figure out why all of America at that time pronounced the name as "du-AHHL". Lol .. :-)
Duals always looked well built and seemed thoughtfully designed but they shared one major annoyance with most 1970s turntables: no secure place to store accessories like extra spindles (wasn't the 45 adapter a complete spindle in itself?) , extra headshells, etc. It's no wonder that so many of them are floating around with these parts missing. It's good that this sample at least has both small-hole spindles. That motor problem reminds me of my can opener; it simply won't start if it stops in the 2 "dead spots" because the start-up windings were made from aluminum instead of copper, but you can always get it to run by jerking the can as you pull the blade down. I wonder if the Dual motors were using an induction or DC motor to start a synchronous one and just included one that could start up fast enough to get the synchronous motor running at double speed. Didn't BIC models with 24 pole motors occasionally run backwards?
I've got this turntable. The motor does spin faster once in awhile but I have it plugged in to the accessory outlet and use the accessory switch to power it off and on until the speed is correct. Once it is the correct speed, it stays that way. Too bad Dual released this very nice turntable with this problem. I've not been able to find the replacement motor yet.
As I said in the opening I have heard of this problem but had never actually seen one that does it. I have 2 dual one with the 840 and the other with an 860. My 840 has never spun up really fast, so not all of them are bad. It must be a tolerance is off either in the rotor or the frame. Something was out of spec, but it did not affect every motor, but a high percentage of them.
A type of premium lithium grease is all he mentioned. Ask for lithium grease at your local auto parts store; he's used white lithium grease ("Moly-Kote" brand) in other videos. Permatex, another brand, can be found at any auto parts store, or here it is now online: www.amazon.com/Permatex-80345-White-Lithium-Grease/dp/B000HBNV58/
I believe the removable cartridge carrier wasn't introduced for CD-4 cartridges as it pre-dates the introduction of CD-4 records. My first Dual, which I acquired in the late 1960's had this same style of removable cartridge holder
hi sir, do you have a video restoring dual cs1237? i have a problem with starting the tone arms lift but suddenly the platter stops rotating.maybe you can help me.
I just this afternoon pulled my Dual 601 out of the closet to add it to the pile of clean and lubes I plan to do, so your timing on this video is fantastic. I'm the first owner and it has never been serviced, but I haven't used it in 25 years. Dual suggests 5 different lubricants for it. Is anything more than 3-in-1 and lithium really necessary?
Ha. I was working on my 1970's SL 23 turntable today and it did that random high speed thing. I wonder if it could have the same motor or a cloned motor?
Smashing job :-D The same old problem with grease, no matter how much you payed for the deck. Wd40 is usefull stuff but it's no replacement for a drop of real oil, it gets things moving though :-D. I've found a drop of petrol can breakdown some nasty messes, then i clean that off with meths, otherwise the unit sinks lol. What an odd motor fault, i'm amazed the manufacturer missed that error.
I actually got a good deal at a local flea market, I got a Garrard 990B turntable for 21 dollars, all I had to do was oil the platter a little bit and it worked!
It seems that the motor sometimes starts up in 2-pole mode, being 4-pole. Correct me on that (skipped some parts of the vid as I'm writing this), but is that a cap that it's connected to? Maybe power factor correction cap? Is it good? It may probably cause the problem as well. Odd anyway.
@@750kv8 It was designed for 50 Hz. The 840 motor never had a problem in 50hz countries. But in 60hz countries it would spin up to double speed. I guess the German engineer misread his slide rule when designing the layout of that one.
@@12voltvids - Looking at pictures of both 840 and 860, the 840 seems to have aluminium shading rings. 860 has copper ones. Seems to me that Dual tried to cut some corners with the 840.
Hi 12voltvids, your videos are these Dual turntables are amazingly easy to understand step by step and I thank you for all this hard work. I have three questions for my Dual 1249. After I cleaned the motor and oiled it and also cleaned the yellow plastic wheel at the bottom where the cam moves into it, do I need to lubricate the outer teeth of it or do i need to oil the grooves where the black cam moves in to it?. The second question is that my tone arm was working fine from start to end but now it stops in the middle of the record and even does not go back to resting stand and does not turns off. I think there is something I touched or went out of order while cleaning.. The third question is that drive motor is spinning great, the pitch control knob moves fine in both the directions, the pitch belt moves fine but the pitch does not change with moving it.....Both the 33 and 45 both speed works though......Please reply as I am stuck here. Thank you again.
Someone has worked on that turntable prior to you. The steurpimple has been replaced or the tonearm would not work. The next failure on this unit will be the Dearing Ring. I also heard there’s a fix in the works for the SM840 motor issue. More to come.
I heard that this problem with the motor only affects the US and other countries that use 60Hz, European models work fine at 50Hz. I wonder if someone came up with a mod to convert the frequency... It shouldn't be hard to do - Rectifier to DC then an oscillator generating 50Hz...
One might be able to use a 12V power supply and an inverter for a 50Hz country; I just wonder if the output wave form from a car inverter would be clean enough.
I have a 1249 I’m trying to revive. The tone arm will raise up on start but does not swing into the startup position. It just drops back down and stops the turntable. Any advice?
Defective motor design. The 940 motor was designed for 50 hz, and running on 60 hz they sometimes run wild and lock up at double speed. Only the Germans could design motor as complex as that. I mean hey it is basically a squirrel cage motor, one of the simplest designs, but the germans took a simple design and made it complex. Just look at their cars. My dad had a merc and I had a bimmer briefly. Big mistake.
@@bugdrvr Oh you mean like BMW that has no dip stick to measure the oil level. Of a Mercedes diesel that uses a bicycle cable to operate the damper. Pull to open, push to close. Great, so when the turbo fails and the engine goes into run away, you can push all you want on the damper button, but the vacuum is so high that you can't close the damper and stop the engine, so basically you stop it by throwing a rod through the block. Great German design.
No it is a design flaw. When the Germans fuck up, they really fuck up. Has to be changed to a new motor. Many have tried to correct by adding diodes and resistors but this creates noise that gets picked up.
I ask for advice on replacement steuerpimpel. I bought a turntable Dual 1249 without this part. To buy, I need to know its dimensions, height, external and internal diameters. I would be very grateful for the help with the answer. Sincerely yours, Ilya
Hi, I started working on a 601 recently.. the tonearm won't lift up at the start and at the end of the record. it just drags back across the record to its resting arm. could you think of a reason for this? thanks in advance.
Triac controller? The "controller" is a mechanical switch activated by a lever. This is an AC synchronous motor. The motor speed is controlled by the AC line frequency. For 50 Hz countries you change the pulley to a larger one.
Ahh, ok. Well I wasn't familiar with that turntable so I had no idea. Not sure how an AC syncro motor could just "change" speeds like this unless the poles are in the wrong positions or something. It just makes me wonder. And since they all did it, sounds like a design issue.
@@12voltvids It stays in the atmosphere for ages and the lack of production would not have a significant effect yet. Likely to be the complete lack of sunspots has a more significant effect.
Could you not wire in a 555 and a transistor to automatically turn the motor on and off every time it starts? That would solve the issue. Thanks for the brilliant vid. Actually how much time did you spend on this job? That would help this complete novice figure out how long it would, should or could take me.
I dislike shaded pole motors but that's because I'm a weird tape nut. Funky things. They do work usually through, except (apparently) in weird designs.
That motor is a 4-pole permanent magnet synchronous motor where they tried to build it with only two coils. It should have 4. Sometimes when starting it jumps past the 4-pole speed of 1800 RPM and accelerates to the 2-pole speed of 3600 RPM. Cheap, cheap cheap....
I've seen plenty of 2 coil, 4 pole motors that work fine. The synchronous portion can't usually start by itself , since it has no bias in either direction and little torque until it synchs up at single or double speed, so I'd guess it's a start-up issue. Maybe they used an induction armature that can spin just fast enough at 60 Hz to send it into double-time mode.
If I needed to send you equipment for repairs, how can I contact you to send it to you please.? Please foreward me contact information so I can send equipment to you for repairs. Thank you.
@@jimreardon6599 yes but how does a motor with fixed windings change speed ? Is there some kind of capacitor involved here? I read some comments so no need to answer... pretty strange though love to no the mechanics behind that one... I currently own 3 dual turntables. I've already figured out the steurpimple now I see from the comments the dearing ring can go out..lol and I thought the worst problem was that notched speed control belt...lol
I got this same model to "tinker with" while picking up another turntable for 10.00 recently, SUCKER !!! Clearly designed to be high maintenance, unsure if it is worth all the work and specialized knowledge. It might as well be made by Mercedes !! For Sale ! CHEAP in DFW !!
Yep those German turntables I tell you might as well be a Mercedes or a BMW! Back in me '80s and '90s when I was in the service business we threw away so many dual and BSR and Gerard record changers because of all those mechanical problems you fix it and the people that owned it would use it to play their Bing Crosby and Frank Sinatra records at Christmas and then it wouldn't get played a game until the next Christmas and by that time it was gummed up again so then they'd come back and they'd say you fix this for me last year and I used it once and now it doesn't work and they'd want it fixed again but they want it fixed for free I'm a kick up a big stink. It was no point telling them hey this is old mechanical crap which incidentally wasn't that old the time because many of them were made in the 70s so we're talking a unit that was maybe 10 to 15 years old at the time. They just do not like to be left dormant if you overhaul one of these changes and you play it everyday it will never break down or very seldom break down but if you leave it sit for a few months there's a good chance that it's going to require service again. I have a 12:14 that I gave to my daughter and she listened to it for a while and then she moved out so it was sitting in her room for a few months and my son says hey can I have that system to play my records on I said sure and guess what I had to service it again before he could use it because sitting for 6 months had not done it any good but he plays it almost every day and it's working fine that's the key for these old mechanical units doesn't matter how well you lubricate them they still need to be used and they need to be used regularly because they will seize up they did that when they were still relatively new and they have not improved with age.
You are my savior. I just acquired a 1249. I got a good idea what the issues were. I took it to a local shop to be informed that, basically, nobody within a couple thousand miles works on them.
The technician explained that, if I am to own a Dual, I will need to be my own tech.
I will be using this video and following it second by second.
I appreciate how well you recorded exactly what you were doing AND explained little details.
Fortunately mine is in a bit better shape.
1249 a much more complex Dual than my 1019 ! My Dual 1019 was purchased in Germany (by me) in 1968, during my tour with the US Army. I did change the output cables, and had problems with the tone arm head. The head has 4 finger like tabs that apply spring pressure on the cartridge assembly for L and R channels. I needed to clean and gently push on these fingers to remake contact...Still runs pretty good today, but I do have an occasional motor noise. Excellent video ! Thank you
When Was a buyer in the Hi Fi trade I started buying Dual turntables in favour of the Gerrard units of the day. They were much better built and easier to service generally. When I was selling a lot of equipment from the same supplier I was invited over to the factory in Germany and I was very impressed at how well and how we it was run. I also got to see the other factories for Sennheiser and AKG
I'll be damned! Never seen a mechanically controlled pitch adjustment. Learn something new every day.
that is the so called "vario pulley" from DUAL , see my youTube ua-cam.com/video/lcpp5EKPXAY/v-deo.html
My Dual 1239 has an 840 motor and I can honestly tell you that that motor is a "tractor": it has never given me any problems since 1978!!!
Ist Vunderbar! (Excuse my bad German attempt) I had a bottle of Freon to clean vcr heads. The lid was on, but after a period of storage, it all evaporated. Must not have been on tight enough. Radio Shack. I think I still have the empty jar.
Thats a very nice looking unit, very clean.
I bought this turntable on Nov 6, 1976 ($175. including the wooden base & dust cover which were considered accessories). Still have it... and still trying to figure out why all of America at that time pronounced the name as "du-AHHL". Lol .. :-)
Thanks for the great instruction and breakdown, for some reason mine didn’t come with a fishing weight?
Duals always looked well built and seemed thoughtfully designed but they shared one major annoyance with most 1970s turntables: no secure place to store accessories like extra spindles (wasn't the 45 adapter a complete spindle in itself?) , extra headshells, etc. It's no wonder that so many of them are floating around with these parts missing. It's good that this sample at least has both small-hole spindles. That motor problem reminds me of my can opener; it simply won't start if it stops in the 2 "dead spots" because the start-up windings were made from aluminum instead of copper, but you can always get it to run by jerking the can as you pull the blade down. I wonder if the Dual motors were using an induction or DC motor to start a synchronous one and just included one that could start up fast enough to get the synchronous motor running at double speed. Didn't BIC models with 24 pole motors occasionally run backwards?
I've got this turntable. The motor does spin faster once in awhile but I have it plugged in to the accessory outlet and use the accessory switch to power it off and on until the speed is correct. Once it is the correct speed, it stays that way. Too bad Dual released this very nice turntable with this problem. I've not been able to find the replacement motor yet.
As I said in the opening I have heard of this problem but had never actually seen one that does it. I have 2 dual one with the 840 and the other with an 860. My 840 has never spun up really fast, so not all of them are bad. It must be a tolerance is off either in the rotor or the frame. Something was out of spec, but it did not affect every motor, but a high percentage of them.
@@12voltvids Thanks for the info!
Thanks, great piece of engineering 👍
You used WD and 123 oil, but what exactly did you put on the plastics?
A type of premium lithium grease is all he mentioned. Ask for lithium grease at your local auto parts store; he's used white lithium grease ("Moly-Kote" brand) in other videos. Permatex, another brand, can be found at any auto parts store, or here it is now online: www.amazon.com/Permatex-80345-White-Lithium-Grease/dp/B000HBNV58/
I believe the removable cartridge carrier wasn't introduced for CD-4 cartridges as it pre-dates the introduction of CD-4 records. My first Dual, which I acquired in the late 1960's had this same style of removable cartridge holder
hi sir, do you have a video restoring dual cs1237? i have a problem with starting the tone arms lift but suddenly the platter stops rotating.maybe you can help me.
I've heard that the SM-840 motor works fine on a 50Hz mains and that speed problem only happens at 60Hz.
i realize it is kind of off topic but do anybody know a good site to stream new movies online?
@Jad Brayden Flixportal :D
Yea,ive also 1249 and live in 50Hz land. Never had this problem. And the motor is a SM840.
I enjoyed this one. I'm working in my 1219 and there is lots of useful methodology here.
Lastly, what model Casio are you wearing?
Thanks..Matt
I just this afternoon pulled my Dual 601 out of the closet to add it to the pile of clean and lubes I plan to do, so your timing on this video is fantastic. I'm the first owner and it has never been serviced, but I haven't used it in 25 years. Dual suggests 5 different lubricants for it. Is anything more than 3-in-1 and lithium really necessary?
And is white lithium bicycle grease appropriate at that?
Ha. I was working on my 1970's SL 23 turntable today and it did that random high speed thing. I wonder if it could have the same motor or a cloned motor?
Smashing job :-D
The same old problem with grease, no matter how much you payed for the deck.
Wd40 is usefull stuff but it's no replacement for a drop of real oil, it gets things moving though :-D.
I've found a drop of petrol can breakdown some nasty messes, then i clean that off with meths, otherwise the unit sinks lol.
What an odd motor fault, i'm amazed the manufacturer missed that error.
I actually got a good deal at a local flea market, I got a Garrard 990B turntable for 21 dollars, all I had to do was oil the platter a little bit and it worked!
Thanks for the great info and calm work
My bike also needs also get a cleaning and oil, as I can see, you are an greate expert. May I send it to you via FedEx?
It seems that the motor sometimes starts up in 2-pole mode, being 4-pole. Correct me on that (skipped some parts of the vid as I'm writing this), but is that a cap that it's connected to? Maybe power factor correction cap? Is it good? It may probably cause the problem as well. Odd anyway.
No cap. That is the switch. Motors were manufactured wrong.
@@12voltvids - Being a motor nerd, makes me wonder what went wrong with such a simple motor.
@@750kv8
It was designed for 50 Hz. The 840 motor never had a problem in 50hz countries. But in 60hz countries it would spin up to double speed. I guess the German engineer misread his slide rule when designing the layout of that one.
@@12voltvids - Looking at pictures of both 840 and 860, the 840 seems to have aluminium shading rings. 860 has copper ones. Seems to me that Dual tried to cut some corners with the 840.
apart from the motor that turntable looks quite respectable.
Aside from the motor it is.
Hi, any idea how to assemble singl-multi switch on Dual 1249, I am having trouble with V-spring.
Hi 12voltvids, your videos are these Dual turntables are amazingly easy to understand step by step and I thank you for all this hard work. I have three questions for my Dual 1249. After I cleaned the motor and oiled it and also cleaned the yellow plastic wheel at the bottom where the cam moves into it, do I need to lubricate the outer teeth of it or do i need to oil the grooves where the black cam moves in to it?. The second question is that my tone arm was working fine from start to end but now it stops in the middle of the record and even does not go back to resting stand and does not turns off. I think there is something I touched or went out of order while cleaning.. The third question is that drive motor is spinning great, the pitch control knob moves fine in both the directions, the pitch belt moves fine but the pitch does not change with moving it.....Both the 33 and 45 both speed works though......Please reply as I am stuck here. Thank you again.
Someone has worked on that turntable prior to you. The steurpimple has been replaced or the tonearm would not work. The next failure on this unit will be the Dearing Ring. I also heard there’s a fix in the works for the SM840 motor issue. More to come.
I heard that this problem with the motor only affects the US and other countries that use 60Hz, European models work fine at 50Hz. I wonder if someone came up with a mod to convert the frequency... It shouldn't be hard to do - Rectifier to DC then an oscillator generating 50Hz...
One might be able to use a 12V power supply and an inverter for a 50Hz country; I just wonder if the output wave form from a car inverter would be clean enough.
I have a 1249 I’m trying to revive. The tone arm will raise up on start but does not swing into the startup position. It just drops back down and stops the turntable. Any advice?
Stuerpimple
Why doe's it change speed like that? shorted coil?
Defective motor design. The 940 motor was designed for 50 hz, and running on 60 hz they sometimes run wild and lock up at double speed. Only the Germans could design motor as complex as that. I mean hey it is basically a squirrel cage motor, one of the simplest designs, but the germans took a simple design and made it complex. Just look at their cars. My dad had a merc and I had a bimmer briefly. Big mistake.
@@12voltvids I fix Porsches for a living and am very familiar with the Germans designing answers to questions no one asked.
@@bugdrvr Oh you mean like BMW that has no dip stick to measure the oil level.
Of a Mercedes diesel that uses a bicycle cable to operate the damper. Pull to open, push to close. Great, so when the turbo fails and the engine goes into run away, you can push all you want on the damper button, but the vacuum is so high that you can't close the damper and stop the engine, so basically you stop it by throwing a rod through the block. Great German design.
could that be an AC motor cap or some type, problem?
No it is a design flaw. When the Germans fuck up, they really fuck up. Has to be changed to a new motor. Many have tried to correct by adding diodes and resistors but this creates noise that gets picked up.
I ask for advice on replacement steuerpimpel. I bought a turntable Dual 1249 without this part. To buy, I need to know its dimensions, height, external and internal diameters. I would be very grateful for the help with the answer. Sincerely yours, Ilya
Make one our of the center insulator from a piece of rg6 coax.
Dual : Normal Speed - Or. - Super Fast (for fun) !
fantastic video
Thank you so much for your skill show
Hi, I started working on a 601 recently.. the tonearm won't lift up at the start and at the end of the record. it just drags back across the record to its resting arm. could you think of a reason for this? thanks in advance.
Dry grease in the arm lifter. Does the cueing lever lift it?
@@12voltvids moving the cueing lever lifts only a little. I guess I'll have to refill the lift tube too right?
@@paniofvetfac1987 grease dries out and makes it stick.
@@12voltvids thank you very much for the quick reply.
Thanks, great video!
Is it the motor? or is there a triac-based controller in there?
Triac controller? The "controller" is a mechanical switch activated by a lever. This is an AC synchronous motor. The motor speed is controlled by the AC line frequency. For 50 Hz countries you change the pulley to a larger one.
Ahh, ok. Well I wasn't familiar with that turntable so I had no idea. Not sure how an AC syncro motor could just "change" speeds like this unless the poles are in the wrong positions or something. It just makes me wonder. And since they all did it, sounds like a design issue.
Your non environmentally friendly cleaner wouldn't be any more environmentally friendly if you added it to the local land fill! Best just use it up!
Freon damages the ozone. I doubt the 5 cans I have will cause much damage compared to all the other crap we pump into the atmosphere.
@@12voltvids Hey, I'm on your side. Use the stuff up. Right now the ozone hole is the smallest it's been in decades.
@@davidwinokur2131
Because they banned the stuff that damages it.
@@12voltvids It stays in the atmosphere for ages and the lack of production would not have a significant effect yet. Likely to be the complete lack of sunspots has a more significant effect.
Could you not wire in a 555 and a transistor to automatically turn the motor on and off every time it starts? That would solve the issue. Thanks for the brilliant vid. Actually how much time did you spend on this job? That would help this complete novice figure out how long it would, should or could take me.
I need a photo of V-spring in placement on a Dual 1249 switch plate, anyone have?
If I were doing this kinda stuff I'd take out that large transparent yeller gear and wash it out in hot soapy water
What about the steuerpimpel?!
What about?
Play the Maybe Motor betting wheel game. Name that speed.
I dislike shaded pole motors but that's because I'm a weird tape nut. Funky things. They do work usually through, except (apparently) in weird designs.
I was going to make a joke there but I just remembered what happened to Don Cherry.
That motor is a 4-pole permanent magnet synchronous motor where they tried to build it with only two coils. It should have 4. Sometimes when starting it jumps past the 4-pole speed of 1800 RPM and accelerates to the 2-pole speed of 3600 RPM. Cheap, cheap cheap....
I've seen plenty of 2 coil, 4 pole motors that work fine. The synchronous portion can't usually start by itself , since it has no bias in either direction and little torque until it synchs up at single or double speed, so I'd guess it's a start-up issue. Maybe they used an induction armature that can spin just fast enough at 60 Hz to send it into double-time mode.
I guess some people have used weights to remedy the speed issue. Not sure how it supposed to help but that probably explains the fishing tackle.
very nice video.thenks
I had luck with 840 motor runaway, tighter belt solved start up runaway
No belt on idler drive.
…..give me my four-speed voice of music record changer any day...hasn't missed a beat in fifty years...….
If I needed to send you equipment for repairs, how can I contact you to send it to you please.? Please foreward me contact information so I can send equipment to you for repairs. Thank you.
strange that the motor can change it's speed like that...
Bad design. There was a recall on these 840 motors
@@jimreardon6599 yes but how does a motor with fixed windings change speed ? Is there some kind of capacitor involved here? I read some comments so no need to answer... pretty strange though love to no the mechanics behind that one... I currently own 3 dual turntables. I've already figured out the steurpimple now I see from the comments the dearing ring can go out..lol and I thought the worst problem was that notched speed control belt...lol
👍👍👍 cfc
bolts removed with pliers you should get arrested lol
Piss off, I don't have a nut driver that size.
👍
I got this same model to "tinker with" while picking up another turntable for 10.00 recently, SUCKER !!!
Clearly designed to be high maintenance, unsure if it is worth all the work and specialized knowledge.
It might as well be made by Mercedes !! For Sale ! CHEAP in DFW !!
Yep those German turntables I tell you might as well be a Mercedes or a BMW! Back in me '80s and '90s when I was in the service business we threw away so many dual and BSR and Gerard record changers because of all those mechanical problems you fix it and the people that owned it would use it to play their Bing Crosby and Frank Sinatra records at Christmas and then it wouldn't get played a game until the next Christmas and by that time it was gummed up again so then they'd come back and they'd say you fix this for me last year and I used it once and now it doesn't work and they'd want it fixed again but they want it fixed for free I'm a kick up a big stink. It was no point telling them hey this is old mechanical crap which incidentally wasn't that old the time because many of them were made in the 70s so we're talking a unit that was maybe 10 to 15 years old at the time. They just do not like to be left dormant if you overhaul one of these changes and you play it everyday it will never break down or very seldom break down but if you leave it sit for a few months there's a good chance that it's going to require service again. I have a 12:14 that I gave to my daughter and she listened to it for a while and then she moved out so it was sitting in her room for a few months and my son says hey can I have that system to play my records on I said sure and guess what I had to service it again before he could use it because sitting for 6 months had not done it any good but he plays it almost every day and it's working fine that's the key for these old mechanical units doesn't matter how well you lubricate them they still need to be used and they need to be used regularly because they will seize up they did that when they were still relatively new and they have not improved with age.
Buy a Lenco: problem solved :-)
I have a thorens myself and one of these days I will hook it up again.