I'm glad to see a pro like you doing this because I use a similar, but much cheaper approach. I took an old box fan and mounted it to a piece of plywood. When I'm working, I open a window and place the plywood and fan over it. Additionally, I put a 4" hole in the plywood connected to my dust blower. There are two big advantages to this type of system that you didn't mention: 1) It creates negative pressure, ensuring dust does not drift to other rooms in the building. 2) The blower works more efficiently because it is not pushing air through a filter. As always, your videos are great!
For years I have been working with wood. Back when nobody talked about breathing it. Over the last 10 years I have ramped up my woodworking and still have not prepped my shop to help clean the air. Now that I close to my mid 60's I do feel the affects. Is it too late to consider doing something about it?? I guess it never is. Thanks for the great information.
I would really hate to run that air quality meter in my shop, I know that if I used a blower like you did it would look like the dust bowl started again. Thanks for insight. I guess instead of fences, good air force bases make for good neighbors ;) Thanks.
Great ideas. I've been trying to figure something out a way to get the dust out of my shop for a year now. I've never liked the idea of paying loads of money for a filter that's going to need cleaning.
I would never admit direct venting publicly. We both both live in the same county and I would be willing to bet their EPA division would site you with a violation, like they did to me. All you need is one complaint from a neighbor. Best to you and thanks for your videos over the years.
+The Wood Whisperer How loud is it outside when your Clearvue cyclone is running? I just bought one and before I cut a hole in my garage wall it would be nice to have an example or your input on how loud it is outside. If you own a Decibel meter it would be awsome if you could take some readings of it outside while it is running!
So glad to see someone actually measuring. Too many dust "experts" base their dust collection on imagination and fear of the unknown. I used a dylos when setting up my basement shop and I was surprised to find my ambient air cleaner grabs the finest dust very well in just a few minutes so that my shop air is cleaner than the rest of the house. You make a lot more dust than me of course, but I'll bet the 300 numbers were the same as the outside air and they weren't wood dust. How did your results compare to before when you were using the DC filters inside?
I really like the idea of venting the DC outside, but the downside is all that air that's moving outside requires replenishment air from the outside. You addressed that fact with your large venting system (which is another cool idea), but the same issue exists with the DC vented outside, which you didn't talk about. For 10 months out of the year I'm either heating or cooling, so I couldn't implement this system, but I like the concept.
You need an ERV. Energy Recovery Ventilator. It will recover the heat and moisture from the exhaust air and transfer the energy to the intake, while maintaining separation between the air streams. It is how large commercial buildings achieve efficient ventilation.
You can’t install a shopvac you can turn on when you turn on and use your table saw or whichever machine you’re using? It works just enough initially and using filter boxes for what’s not captured by the shopvac. There are filters for a shopvac that exist or can be “made” near or at true hepa quality. Just food for thought. Box fans have been shown to be efficient and cost effective. If you can get creative to accommodate your circumstances and environment anything is possible. I don’t have a wood shop but I do need and require a sterile cleanroom environment. Fortunately for me there are videos on UA-cam I can gather information and then get creative and experiment to find the best cost effective way to achieve what I need without spending thousands of dollars on hospital grade filtration systems. Good luck I hope you figure out a way to accomplish your filtration needs.
Great video, one idea on the dust collection. You should check out April Wilkerson shop tour video. She has it setup where she can control venting outside or inside to the filter depending on if she is using the AC or heating in the shop. That way you don't suck out all your cool or warm air.
my shop is in an old chicken coop. It's fairly clean, and has windows, so i stick a box fan on the window seal, and another floor fan where I am working, pointed at the window. Clean as a whistle.
I lived in the California desert for several years, where there was always dust blowing around outside and humidity was in the single digits. I cut a hole in my shop's outside wall and mounted a large evaporative cooler blowing air into the shop. Across the shop I left the entry door (not garage door) open a few inches. The saturated filter media trapped the outside dust and the forced cooled air blew the shop dust outside. This arrangement caused the humidity level in the shop to rise to the low teens, it actually increased comfort and I never had a problem with rust or wood moisture levels. Evap coolers are very effective in dry climates and really cheap to operate, though they do consume a bit of water and they are another set of filters to maintain. I've been wanting to vent my DC outside but since I've moved back to the coast I have much less room and much closer neighbors than you so I just moved the DC outside and kept the filter on it :(
I wish I could vent outside, currently just using a single stage dust collector and a wren air filter on the ceiling of my 4 car garage. A nice HEPA dust collector setup with a shaker to clean the filter is very high on my want list right now
I'm glad that on the second mention of taking all the air out of the shop you did mention that it was getting replaced. I was worried for a wee while, there ;-)
First off, I thoroughly enjoy you channel. I am just setting up my first shop. it is 12x30 with 8ft cielings. You have a lot of great ideas, techniques and methods that are very helpful. Is there an accumulation fine dust outside of the shop. Basically, wondering if it noticeable. I have built a small shed behind my workshop to house the Dust Collector and Air Compressor. I am just starting to setup the Dust Collector and it would be very easy to vent it out of the shed. No bags or filters equal more space as well.
Nice video! I have the same issue in my metal shop. Spent $5000 on foam insulation but now it's so tight it keeps the dust and smoke in. At the same time I don't want to blow out all the warm or cool conditioned air??
+John McKee Just be careful of a furnace or water heater, I can't upgrade my basement shop to much due to these two things you do not want the pilot lights going out and creating gas leaks into the home from the shop area.
Right now I only work on stuff in my parents garage since I live in a small apartment. They have a 3 car garage and I get to use some of the one car side. It's in Florida, so it's mega hot and humid, there's no air conditioning since it's just a garage, and gets crazy dusty with no sort of air filtration or permanent dust collection, just a rigid shop vac that I can hook up to my table saw which does a meh job.
Hey Marc, if you still have the filter, you can use it when you heat/cool the shop, so you're not blowing your heated/cooled air outside. No filter? 3 words: Air heat exchanger.
What about trying to keep the shop warm? It's around 30 degrees outside right now and I have to run two heaters just to keep my single car garage warm enough to work in, much less vent that heated air outside :/
Any chance of a video of the saw dust powder that comes out of that vent on the outside. I am building a house and am thinking about doing what you did with my Clearvue. Just curios how much trash comes out of that vent to see if it is a scant amount that would not bother the neighbors. Perhaps a stationary camera outside trained on the vent with a split screen of you cutting/routering something that makes a lot of dust (MDF for example) with the side screen showing the output. Thanks.
Very nice - I've been thinking of doing the same in my shop - glad to know it works!. What is that tool on the bench, behind and to your left in the opening shots? It's on a white base.
That wall fan you have. My dad back in 1962 put one in the hallway of our house and it would suck all the air up into the attic. Talk about hard on the eardrums is you didn't open a window! Dad grew up on a farm, I think he got the idea from that.
Actually, those are very common in older homes because they were installed before AC and they create a great way to circulate air in a home. However, they really aren't needed today. However, if you burn something in the kitchen, the whole house fan will remove the smoke in no time.
Glad I have a garage door I can open with a large 60000 BTU LNG heater :) When I run the miter saw or table saw, the two worst offenders, I'll open the door garage door half way, and the side door half open, and run a big fan :)
This video inspired me to buy an exhaust wall fan for my wood shop. I have several machines that make sawdust, but my CNC creates the most. Would it be better to place the fan next to my CNC or should I place the fan across the room directly opposite a window for smoother flow?
Very cool ventilation system with the fan. I've seen a lot of guys take a box fan and put a filter in the front of it to draw the dust into the filter. If someone has windows in their shop, do you think you could use a box fax in front of that window to basically draw the dust out like your system? It obviously wouldn't be as strong, but I like the no filter idea.
Would an HVLS fan be another option to keep it cool while you had your air system on? They are very good at destratifying areas like a workshop and there are some small HVLS models out there at the consumer (non industrial) level.
How many feet of Festool Track Saw track do you have over your shoulder in the last shot of this video? Looks like 36 feet to me. Have you ever put it all together in one long glorious length of Track?
You did not show the numbers on your meter when you finished kicking up the dust but you did show it changing as it was running. Can you tell us what the level was before you turned on the fan?
very nice addition Marc. Great idea about the box, i was just thinking damn he is going to let alot of nice cool air out when it isn't running, i know in AZ your "cool" air is a necessity....lol.
your nose is a great filter, and indicator of how much dust youve breathed in. its hard for dust to actually make into your lungs. i find respirators pretty comfortable so i wear mine most of the time. probably the most important piece of safety gear, and also earmuffs (for hearing longevity). some will say safety glasses, but they are over used i feel, i hardly wear those, unless im grinding metal or doing heavy routing. i like the idea of the fan going straight to outside , also makes the shop a hell of a lot easier to keep clean, along with good dust extractors.
JimmY the nose is an indicator for dust particles that we can actually see (above 30 microns). However, fine dust particles (below 10 microns - not visible to the naked eye) can easily make their eay deep into our lungs. And the smaller the particle the deeper it can reach our lungs. What we should really be concerned is the stuff we can't see.
Being able to vent the DC outside is going to be must for my next shop. Was blowing out the chips also not an option? I think it would be nice to not have to empty my chip separator. Keep up the good work!
Hey Marc -- thanks! Your last few months of delving into this area (on the podcasts + livestreams) has gotten me on board with venting outside (behind a cyclone separator) -- despite living in the MidWest and conditioning for 4-6 months out of the year :) I do have one question about the exhaust fan -- I'm curious what those numbers would look like if you just opened the doors and windows for an hour and then ran the ambient air filter. I understand your need for speed, but for us plain hobbyists, I'm wondering if there's any value of the fan over open doors & windows in smaller shops (200-500sq/ft).
+Taylor C I did run a few tests for this because I wanted to know if I could clear the air faster with the windows and doors open vs the windows and doors closed. Here's what I found. If you turn on the air cleaner, the air is cleared faster when you have the windows open. The constant flow of cleaner outdoor air brings the numbers down faster. But oddly enough, only to a certain point. With the windows and doors open and the air cleaner on, the best I can get the shop air is somewhere in the 300-350 range. The only way I can get the shop air down below 100 is to close the windows and doors and then run the air cleaner for 10-15 minutes. My guess is that the outside air, while relatively clean, keeps some of the settled shop dust airborne. But when we close the windows and doors, the air cleaner is able to clean the closed volume of air and apparently doesn't kick up much of the settled dust. I'm only speculating here because these obviously aren't very scientific tests. But I did determine that the best way to clear the air quickly is with the windows open and the air cleaner on. But at a certain point, closing the windows will get the numbers down even further.
Indeed…you only get 1 set of lungs…..even though i run a box type air filtration system in my small home shop, am about to install a 50cm exhaust fan to assist in the overall ‘room clean’…. I don’t think the small additional expense is over the top at all; the more i can do to keep the crap out of my lungs the better…am about to retire so i want to get the most out of it 😎
And I had to laugh when Marc was wandering around with that blower with no visible dust being raised. Not at all what it would have been like in my shop!
Would a swamp cooler be more efficient than AC for your shop? I lived in Arizona for a short time, and the one thing I noticed is that the swamp cooler kept the dust down.
+John Pleier Swamp coolers only work for part of the year and they work by introducing a lot of humidity into the air, which is something I don't really enjoy in the wood shop.
Perhaps not considerate to the neighbours or the general environment blowing the fine dust out? Did you consider using in an in-shop micro dust collection recirculating system such Jet, Powermatic or Wen?
That louvered fan is common in greenhouses, I have something similar in my greenhouse. Works great in Arizona, but would be a very bad idea just about anywhere else in the US for obvious reasons (temperature, humidity etc.). Glad you like it, but that won't work in the East, South, Midwest, Pacific Northwest or Northern US. I share your paranoia with dust. Wood dust is worse for your lungs than even smoking.
+christschool I would have to imagine there's some kind of setup that would accommodate a fan like that no matter where you live. Might require additional protection on the outside but I'm sure it can be done.
+The Wood Whisperer Humidity is water vapor. Like water, if there is a way to get into some area, water will find a way. Humidity will seep through wood floors, through vapor barriers where they aren't perfectly sealed etc. There is no way to keep humidity out of a shop with a louvered fan and still have something practical. The minute that fan is turned on, humidity is entering the shop, no matter the speed of the fan. In fact, the humidity will have to come in through the make up damper as well. I wish there was a way around it, but there isn't.
+christschool I live in Buenos Aires Argentina and the RH is about 65% in the summer and spring but ..."WINTER IS COMING" and with it high RH (85% on rainy day). If I turn the exhaust fan on, the humidity outside will create a 85% humidity shop environment. So the only time it would be used is when humidity outside is less than 75%...useless until spring or summer. Any suggestions?
Hernan garcia F Hernan, I live in the U.S. South, where humidity is routinely above 75% for most of the year and in the Summer, typically over 90%. I would suggest a Jet Air Filtration System, Model AFS-1000B. I have the more expensive Powermatic version, but the Jet is the same machine essentially. If your shop is larger then 2 of these would be good to have. The filter system is better than a louvered fan because they will filter at the same time they are circulating. If you are looking to reduce humidity, then a dehumidifier is the way to go. I will supplement my air conditioning with a dehumidifier during the most humid periods and this works very well. Make sure your shop is as air tight as possible when humidity is high. Since you live in Buenos Aires, salt may also be a concern, depending on how close you are to the coast. If this is a concern, let me know because there are some useful methods of preventing salt from rusting your tools.
You need an ERV. Energy Recovery Ventilator. It will recover the heat and moisture from the exhaust air and transfer the energy to the intake, while maintaining separation between the air streams. It is how large commercial buildings achieve efficient ventilation.
The "particle counter" is an "Area sample ". And not a personal sample. Please contact a Certified Safety Professional (CSP) or Certified Industrial Hygienists (CIH) to help you evaluate your shop. I am retired, but I can help you with evaluations.
Well placed shot with the "Clean or Die" sign in the background. :)
I'm glad to see a pro like you doing this because I use a similar, but much cheaper approach. I took an old box fan and mounted it to a piece of plywood. When I'm working, I open a window and place the plywood and fan over it. Additionally, I put a 4" hole in the plywood connected to my dust blower.
There are two big advantages to this type of system that you didn't mention:
1) It creates negative pressure, ensuring dust does not drift to other rooms in the building.
2) The blower works more efficiently because it is not pushing air through a filter.
As always, your videos are great!
Great upgrades. I've had the Dylos for a few years and it has been a real eye opener.
Love the strategically placed, "clean or die" at the end.
+robertgreen94 I didn't notice it at first (had to go back to see it). Thanks for pointing it out, it made my day.
Noise tolerant neighbors you say? Sounds like the perfect place to run a chainsaw mill!
+Matthew Cremona Well, they might not be THAT tolerant. ;)
+Matthew Cremona move to the stix. 6am is a perfect time for a beer and to run to chainsaw!! lol
Spider cremona spider cremona build whatever cremona can
Sorry I had to
+Adam Craig The only thing that's better than beer and chainsaws is when the stadium holds hard liquor and handgun nights
+Living Wood Creations -wood turning videos- Shoot I was going to post the same thing! Spidermona shoots webs of saw dust!
For years I have been working with wood. Back when nobody talked about breathing it. Over the last 10 years I have ramped up my woodworking and still have not prepped my shop to help clean the air. Now that I close to my mid 60's I do feel the affects. Is it too late to consider doing something about it?? I guess it never is. Thanks for the great information.
I would really hate to run that air quality meter in my shop, I know that if I used a blower like you did it would look like the dust bowl started again. Thanks for insight. I guess instead of fences, good air force bases make for good neighbors ;) Thanks.
Great ideas. I've been trying to figure something out a way to get the dust out of my shop for a year now. I've never liked the idea of paying loads of money for a filter that's going to need cleaning.
I would never admit direct venting publicly. We both both live in the same county and I would be willing to bet their EPA division would site you with a violation, like they did to me. All you need is one complaint from a neighbor. Best to you and thanks for your videos over the years.
+The Wood Whisperer How loud is it outside when your Clearvue cyclone is running? I just bought one and before I cut a hole in my garage wall it would be nice to have an example or your input on how loud it is outside. If you own a Decibel meter it would be awsome if you could take some readings of it outside while it is running!
With starting to think of the new shop these are some great things to consider here, thanks Marc.
Very good video! I like how you explain your thoughts about dust problems.
So glad to see someone actually measuring. Too many dust "experts" base their dust collection on imagination and fear of the unknown. I used a dylos when setting up my basement shop and I was surprised to find my ambient air cleaner grabs the finest dust very well in just a few minutes so that my shop air is cleaner than the rest of the house. You make a lot more dust than me of course, but I'll bet the 300 numbers were the same as the outside air and they weren't wood dust. How did your results compare to before when you were using the DC filters inside?
Hey Marc. I was wondering why you didn't vent outside at first. Nice to see you are going Full Pentz! Thanks for the update.
I'm sure Bill Pentz would still find the air quality in this shop completely unacceptable... ;)
I really like the idea of venting the DC outside, but the downside is all that air that's moving outside requires replenishment air from the outside. You addressed that fact with your large venting system (which is another cool idea), but the same issue exists with the DC vented outside, which you didn't talk about. For 10 months out of the year I'm either heating or cooling, so I couldn't implement this system, but I like the concept.
You need an ERV. Energy Recovery Ventilator. It will recover the heat and moisture from the exhaust air and transfer the energy to the intake, while maintaining separation between the air streams. It is how large commercial buildings achieve efficient ventilation.
Cool setup. I just put in a fan w/ filter and it's already filling up as well. I guess you can't be too careful.
Man, wish I had a way to exhaust fine dust out of my shop. Unfortunately, most of my shop wall is below ground in our garage/basement area.
You can’t install a shopvac you can turn on when you turn on and use your table saw or whichever machine you’re using? It works just enough initially and using filter boxes for what’s not captured by the shopvac. There are filters for a shopvac that exist or can be “made” near or at true hepa quality. Just food for thought. Box fans have been shown to be efficient and cost effective. If you can get creative to accommodate your circumstances and environment anything is possible. I don’t have a wood shop but I do need and require a sterile cleanroom environment. Fortunately for me there are videos on UA-cam I can gather information and then get creative and experiment to find the best cost effective way to achieve what I need without spending thousands of dollars on hospital grade filtration systems. Good luck I hope you figure out a way to accomplish your filtration needs.
Great video, one idea on the dust collection. You should check out April Wilkerson shop tour video. She has it setup where she can control venting outside or inside to the filter depending on if she is using the AC or heating in the shop. That way you don't suck out all your cool or warm air.
my shop is in an old chicken coop. It's fairly clean, and has windows, so i stick a box fan on the window seal, and another floor fan where I am working, pointed at the window. Clean as a whistle.
I lived in the California desert for several years, where there was always dust blowing around outside and humidity was in the single digits. I cut a hole in my shop's outside wall and mounted a large evaporative cooler blowing air into the shop. Across the shop I left the entry door (not garage door) open a few inches. The saturated filter media trapped the outside dust and the forced cooled air blew the shop dust outside. This arrangement caused the humidity level in the shop to rise to the low teens, it actually increased comfort and I never had a problem with rust or wood moisture levels. Evap coolers are very effective in dry climates and really cheap to operate, though they do consume a bit of water and they are another set of filters to maintain. I've been wanting to vent my DC outside but since I've moved back to the coast I have much less room and much closer neighbors than you so I just moved the DC outside and kept the filter on it :(
I wish I could vent outside, currently just using a single stage dust collector and a wren air filter on the ceiling of my 4 car garage. A nice HEPA dust collector setup with a shaker to clean the filter is very high on my want list right now
Glad we could help out with the Guild scholarship. It's a great program!
I'm glad that on the second mention of taking all the air out of the shop you did mention that it was getting replaced. I was worried for a wee while, there ;-)
First off, I thoroughly enjoy you channel. I am just setting up my first shop. it is 12x30 with 8ft cielings.
You have a lot of great ideas, techniques and methods that are very helpful.
Is there an accumulation fine dust outside of the shop.
Basically, wondering if it noticeable.
I have built a small shed behind my workshop to house the Dust Collector and Air Compressor.
I am just starting to setup the Dust Collector and it would be very easy to vent it out of the shed.
No bags or filters equal more space as well.
Nice video! I have the same issue in my metal shop. Spent $5000 on foam insulation but now it's so tight it keeps the dust and smoke in. At the same time I don't want to blow out all the warm or cool conditioned air??
Happy healthy shop, interesting video Mark
This is very helpful. I am redoing my basement shop and these are good ideas.
+John McKee Just be careful of a furnace or water heater, I can't upgrade my basement shop to much due to these two things you do not want the pilot lights going out and creating gas leaks into the home from the shop area.
Yes I will, Thanks
The problem with particulate dust is that you don't know you have a problem until you have a PROBLEM!!
GREAT ideas.
Right now I only work on stuff in my parents garage since I live in a small apartment. They have a 3 car garage and I get to use some of the one car side. It's in Florida, so it's mega hot and humid, there's no air conditioning since it's just a garage, and gets crazy dusty with no sort of air filtration or permanent dust collection, just a rigid shop vac that I can hook up to my table saw which does a meh job.
I'm in the same boat, parents garage, in the desert. consider getting the clear vue cyclone, it's an awesome upgrade to a shop vac
Hey Marc, if you still have the filter, you can use it when you heat/cool the shop, so you're not blowing your heated/cooled air outside.
No filter? 3 words: Air heat exchanger.
What about trying to keep the shop warm? It's around 30 degrees outside right now and I have to run two heaters just to keep my single car garage warm enough to work in, much less vent that heated air outside :/
Any chance of a video of the saw dust powder that comes out of that vent on the outside. I am building a house and am thinking about doing what you did with my Clearvue. Just curios how much trash comes out of that vent to see if it is a scant amount that would not bother the neighbors. Perhaps a stationary camera outside trained on the vent with a split screen of you cutting/routering something that makes a lot of dust (MDF for example) with the side screen showing the output. Thanks.
Very nice - I've been thinking of doing the same in my shop - glad to know it works!. What is that tool on the bench, behind and to your left in the opening shots? It's on a white base.
That wall fan you have. My dad back in 1962 put one in the hallway of our house and it would suck all the air up into the attic. Talk about hard on the eardrums is you didn't open a window! Dad grew up on a farm, I think he got the idea from that.
Actually, those are very common in older homes because they were installed before AC and they create a great way to circulate air in a home. However, they really aren't needed today. However, if you burn something in the kitchen, the whole house fan will remove the smoke in no time.
christschool LOL Absolutely!!!!
Glad I have a garage door I can open with a large 60000 BTU LNG heater :) When I run the miter saw or table saw, the two worst offenders, I'll open the door garage door half way, and the side door half open, and run a big fan :)
This video inspired me to buy an exhaust wall fan for my wood shop. I have several machines that make sawdust, but my CNC creates the most. Would it be better to place the fan next to my CNC or should I place the fan across the room directly opposite a window for smoother flow?
Your videos are just great and very informative. Many many thanks Marc. Great job you're doing.
Awesome! Now I know I havta do something about the air in my shop!
thanks for the guild preview! I really should spend more time in the guild!
I feel ya brother! Best of luck to you in all you do.
I'm just curious - what Air Force base are you by? In a different video you showed your backyard and it looked like Nellis AFB area landscaping.
Very cool ventilation system with the fan. I've seen a lot of guys take a box fan and put a filter in the front of it to draw the dust into the filter. If someone has windows in their shop, do you think you could use a box fax in front of that window to basically draw the dust out like your system? It obviously wouldn't be as strong, but I like the no filter idea.
Would an HVLS fan be another option to keep it cool while you had your air system on? They are very good at destratifying areas like a workshop and there are some small HVLS models out there at the consumer (non industrial) level.
How many feet of Festool Track Saw track do you have over your shoulder in the last shot of this video? Looks like 36 feet to me. Have you ever put it all together in one long glorious length of Track?
Interesting that the ceiling mounted filter really cleaned up the air.
You did not show the numbers on your meter when you finished kicking up the dust but you did show it changing as it was running. Can you tell us what the level was before you turned on the fan?
very nice addition Marc. Great idea about the box, i was just thinking damn he is going to let alot of nice cool air out when it isn't running, i know in AZ your "cool" air is a necessity....lol.
your nose is a great filter, and indicator of how much dust youve breathed in. its hard for dust to actually make into your lungs. i find respirators pretty comfortable so i wear mine most of the time. probably the most important piece of safety gear, and also earmuffs (for hearing longevity). some will say safety glasses, but they are over used i feel, i hardly wear those, unless im grinding metal or doing heavy routing. i like the idea of the fan going straight to outside , also makes the shop a hell of a lot easier to keep clean, along with good dust extractors.
JimmY the nose is an indicator for dust particles that we can actually see (above 30 microns).
However, fine dust particles (below 10 microns - not visible to the naked eye) can easily make their eay deep into our lungs. And the smaller the particle the deeper it can reach our lungs.
What we should really be concerned is the stuff we can't see.
Is it a crazy idea to run the outblown air thrue water? i bet near 0 fine dust leaves the shop this way :)
True but when you sent all the air outside of the shop you also sending all the warmth out of the shop in the winter.
great video! did you drill out your self? looking into venting my DC out the wall as well.
What wood products do you make for income? Nice videos, really enjoy them! I'm new to woodworking so any suggestions would be appreciated!
Being able to vent the DC outside is going to be must for my next shop. Was blowing out the chips also not an option? I think it would be nice to not have to empty my chip separator. Keep up the good work!
That would be convenient bit you wouldn't want chips going through the turbine on your DC. Might suck up set that find your day.
Thanks for the Video - very very helpful.
Did you post information on your digital dust counter somewhere?
you do Awesome work - a real inspiration.
Yup. Link to original post is in the description.
How did this end up working out? That 5HP moves a lot of air very quickly.
Hey Marc -- thanks! Your last few months of delving into this area (on the podcasts + livestreams) has gotten me on board with venting outside (behind a cyclone separator) -- despite living in the MidWest and conditioning for 4-6 months out of the year :)
I do have one question about the exhaust fan -- I'm curious what those numbers would look like if you just opened the doors and windows for an hour and then ran the ambient air filter. I understand your need for speed, but for us plain hobbyists, I'm wondering if there's any value of the fan over open doors & windows in smaller shops (200-500sq/ft).
+Taylor C I did run a few tests for this because I wanted to know if I could clear the air faster with the windows and doors open vs the windows and doors closed. Here's what I found. If you turn on the air cleaner, the air is cleared faster when you have the windows open. The constant flow of cleaner outdoor air brings the numbers down faster. But oddly enough, only to a certain point. With the windows and doors open and the air cleaner on, the best I can get the shop air is somewhere in the 300-350 range. The only way I can get the shop air down below 100 is to close the windows and doors and then run the air cleaner for 10-15 minutes. My guess is that the outside air, while relatively clean, keeps some of the settled shop dust airborne. But when we close the windows and doors, the air cleaner is able to clean the closed volume of air and apparently doesn't kick up much of the settled dust. I'm only speculating here because these obviously aren't very scientific tests. But I did determine that the best way to clear the air quickly is with the windows open and the air cleaner on. But at a certain point, closing the windows will get the numbers down even further.
Why not get Jet to send you the POWERMATIC PM1250??? I sure would love to hear a review of that filter fan!
Great discussion! and I love the shirt!
Also great for clearing the shop after taco night or a chili cook-off.
Indeed…you only get 1 set of lungs…..even though i run a box type air filtration system in my small home shop, am about to install a 50cm exhaust fan to assist in the overall ‘room clean’…. I don’t think the small additional expense is over the top at all; the more i can do to keep the crap out of my lungs the better…am about to retire so i want to get the most out of it 😎
How often were you cleaning out your cyclone filter?
What was the brand of the air quality meter that you had in the video and about how much do they run?
And I had to laugh when Marc was wandering around with that blower with no visible dust being raised. Not at all what it would have been like in my shop!
+Frank Pratt Well to be fair, the shop was recently cleaned. So all I was blowing up were the spots we miss during a typical vacuuming. :)
Well said and well presented as always.
I met a guy who paints heavy equipment with no resperator or mask of any kind indoors. it's the craziest thing I've ever seen.
Very informative Marc.
Thanks!
nice additions
Would a swamp cooler be more efficient than AC for your shop? I lived in Arizona for a short time, and the one thing I noticed is that the swamp cooler kept the dust down.
+John Pleier Swamp coolers only work for part of the year and they work by introducing a lot of humidity into the air, which is something I don't really enjoy in the wood shop.
I figured it would make you feel like you are back in Jersey with the humidity. Keep up the good work, I really have learned allot from ya.
Hi!
Ate you venting your dust outside in your new shop?
Unfortunately no.
I'm looking over your shoulder at the 5:00 mark and I see that you also make pizza in your shop. Marc, is there anything you can't do!?!? ;-)
I really dig the blow it outside school of thought.
I want to do the same thing with the 4" dryer vent but I don't like the idea of a dust-caked wall.
+Adam R Every time it rains, the dust will go away. :)
+The Wood Whisperer That works if you don't live in California where rain is a fantasy in most parts.
Like the "Clean or Die" poster.
Perhaps not considerate to the neighbours or the general environment blowing the fine dust out?
Did you consider using in an in-shop micro dust collection recirculating system such Jet, Powermatic or Wen?
That was all discussed in the video.
How long a cut could you make with all those festool track saw tracks????
+Ruprect99 I've never done the math.
+The Wood Whisperer Looks like about a mile!! 😀
Nice setup. In my 8ft by 8ft shed I open the door lol
How many hot dogs have you sent through the fan?
+RenaissanceWW - All of them.
I see you put Matt's face on Spiderman. :)
Am I the only one who thought this was going to be an April Fool's video? Nice dust collection.
Very professional
Say hello to my little friend 🤣
That louvered fan is common in greenhouses, I have something similar in my greenhouse. Works great in Arizona, but would be a very bad idea just about anywhere else in the US for obvious reasons (temperature, humidity etc.). Glad you like it, but that won't work in the East, South, Midwest, Pacific Northwest or Northern US. I share your paranoia with dust. Wood dust is worse for your lungs than even smoking.
+christschool I would have to imagine there's some kind of setup that would accommodate a fan like that no matter where you live. Might require additional protection on the outside but I'm sure it can be done.
+The Wood Whisperer Humidity is water vapor. Like water, if there is a way to get into some area, water will find a way. Humidity will seep through wood floors, through vapor barriers where they aren't perfectly sealed etc. There is no way to keep humidity out of a shop with a louvered fan and still have something practical. The minute that fan is turned on, humidity is entering the shop, no matter the speed of the fan. In fact, the humidity will have to come in through the make up damper as well. I wish there was a way around it, but there isn't.
+christschool I live in Buenos Aires Argentina and the RH is about 65% in the summer and spring but ..."WINTER IS COMING" and with it high RH (85% on rainy day). If I turn the exhaust fan on, the humidity outside will create a 85% humidity shop environment.
So the only time it would be used is when humidity outside is less than 75%...useless until spring or summer.
Any suggestions?
Hernan garcia F Hernan, I live in the U.S. South, where humidity is routinely above 75% for most of the year and in the Summer, typically over 90%. I would suggest a Jet Air Filtration System, Model AFS-1000B. I have the more expensive Powermatic version, but the Jet is the same machine essentially. If your shop is larger then 2 of these would be good to have. The filter system is better than a louvered fan because they will filter at the same time they are circulating. If you are looking to reduce humidity, then a dehumidifier is the way to go. I will supplement my air conditioning with a dehumidifier during the most humid periods and this works very well. Make sure your shop is as air tight as possible when humidity is high.
Since you live in Buenos Aires, salt may also be a concern, depending on how close you are to the coast. If this is a concern, let me know because there are some useful methods of preventing salt from rusting your tools.
You need an ERV. Energy Recovery Ventilator. It will recover the heat and moisture from the exhaust air and transfer the energy to the intake, while maintaining separation between the air streams. It is how large commercial buildings achieve efficient ventilation.
how it be if was in cold weather
The "particle counter" is an "Area sample ". And not a personal sample.
Please contact a Certified Safety Professional (CSP) or Certified Industrial Hygienists (CIH) to help you evaluate your shop.
I am retired, but I can help you with evaluations.
nice doing scholarships! thanks for sharing!
I spy a hanging emergency pizza peel. Nice info by the way.
Good advice
Is that the "Fah-Q" paddle in the background at 4:22?
An exhaust fan right beside your air conditioner...?
+athhud The one I never use, yes. :) And I don't plan to use the vent at the same time as the AC all that often.
This video is a must, tnx for sharing it!!! :D
Good stuff ! Thanks.
Love that shirt! I mean I know you always have cool shirts but I definitely like that one! hehe
Very good man i like it, it can't get better than that my friend cool :)
When my shop gets dusty, I open a window. That is my height tech solution!
I have a fan just like that in my shop
Awesome vid.
Wait let's talk about the "real" elephant in the room... Did Mark actually shave for this video?
Laughed a lot. Thank you!!!
You do know that is illegal almost everywhere in the country. If caught the fines are huge.
Now you have tats and grey hair? Wow I got onto the Wood Whisperer train a little late.