Thanks to all of you who post on our videos! These videos are not only a way for us to share our ideas, but also a way to be exposed to other thought processes. I have become a better fencer for it, and hopefully others will as well.
I have just started studying this art and one of the things that I am noticing is that the power and speed one can generate with this move is highly overlooked by many. Thanks for the clear explanation.
I haven't been able to pull off hitting with the initial scheitelhau versus a low guard, but it's a fantastic way to draw out someone's defense. It seems like it's fast and direct enough they don't have a lot of options except to move straight to kron.
Thanks for posting these videos, I find the clear demonstrations very useful. I sometimes use Scheitelhau in a defensive mode, while stepping back out of measure, keeping an opponent at bay in reaction to their attack - giving me some time to regroup.
Nice coincidence, we were just yesterday training Scheitelhau, Kron and Durchlaufen combination and noticed your new video on this. I noticed in training that even if the oponent in Albern knew I was going to use Scheitelhau (we were aiming to the head and if the opponent was able to parry with a Kron, he would go under the sword for grappling), 1in 2 to 1 in 5 would hit, maybe less with instructors. So, the Kron is definitely very effective against Scheitelhau, even from the Alber, especially if there is even some telegraphy involved but with the correct timing and speed, Scheitelhau can work quite often. In somewhat freer parrying (with limited attack options) it worked even better against unwary opponents who drifted a bit too close (the opponent did not even need to be in low guard). As for the defending person hitting your hands, our instructor recounted the same explanation as Michael-Forest that he/she will insinctively protect the head and frankly I believe him. It is almost reflex, as the fast nature of the attack does not even leave time for a double-kill... I think the trick is to use very fast push-pull motion with the wrists while extending the arms and to remember to keep arms high. The vertical nature of Scheitelhau allows for the very fast whiplike attack and keeping arms high not only protects them but gives you just that little of extra reach downwards agains an opponent who is a bit late in bringing his sword to the Kron. Of course I have to admit that the flexible nature of a Federschwert can sometimes help too... By the way, Ringeck tells us to let the sword hang over our back in left hand when going for the "tackle" and it does protect better that way, even if it sounded stupid to me when I read it the first time (What do you know, the old masters actually knew what they were talking about...). If fencing from the left shoulder, I let go with the left hand and let the sword up horizontal between myself and the opponent. Well, that's my five cents. I find your videos very good and clear, it is easy to follow how it progresses from attack to counter and counter to that again. Keep up the good work!
Yes, forgot something. Needless to say that this works better against shorter opponents, unless they are unwary. I believe it was Meyer who said that as our bodies are not optimal for all techniques, we should not use those techniques that are not suited to us.
Just found y'all through a tumblr link, ;D. I'm in NC and am glad to see SC has a great HEMA community as well. Re: Scheitelhau, It's quick, telegraphed with a very stern "This IS my range, wake up!" message to it. I can see it put to good use with novice members and with tiring partners to help with sparring sessions.
Nice video, if you try to block with crown a bit closser to the head or body it became more protective and it make it for faster reposte afterwards. At my club we combine a hight long point gard with the crown block close to the head or body if the incoming attack is on the side and it is very versatile and fast. Also because the long point gard is higher is harder for your oponnent to try those kind of oberhow whitout guetting stab in the face or hands. Anyway thanks for sharing it's always nice to see other techniques.
We've been using a "faked" scheittelhau to break alber. Go for one up high, and if the opponent tries to thrust or cut upwards to displace my sword I bring down a clockwise cut aimed at his sword from above. If my opponent moves to just block I either hit him or can do the followup techniques.
This is my interpretation as well. Ringeck seems to tell us to strike short and lower the point to the face from a slightly wider range. This keeps your hands much safer. If you see anything coming from the opponent you don't like, fall on it with the long edge and proceed, or do the Scheitelhau plays if he parries in Kron. I do the cut very large (Ringeck says "long sheitelhau") to provoke the response. My reasoning is that the solution should be simple. If so many people are having trouble with breaking Alber, the solution must be very basic or the glosses would have told us. Falling on something with the long edge is the simplest thing there is. I think Fiore says that low guards are difficult to break without danger, and I think we all agree with him :)
I used to always win matches by going to kron against Scheitelhau and then winding to pflug and a thrust when my opponent would stab low. It was a... "learning" experience to fence another school when they didn't react to kron that way, lol. Can I ask what Feders you're using? My guess is PR, but I'm not certain.
Thanks for showing this great video, I've learned alot. It seems that the wrist structure is broken while doing the crown cut? I wonder does this create some problem?
I suppose it is broken a bit, though with a looser grip the wrists can be kept straighter. I don’t know of any problems it causes. I’m not trying to chop my opponent in half. I’m trying to cut him in the face which in my opinion does not need perfect structure to cause an effect. And if he blocks the Scheitelhau I always yield and wind immediately into another guard with good wrist structure.
Secondo la nostra interpretazione, lo Scheitelhau è un po' differente. Fondamentalmente si tratta di un colpo che tranciando lacera la parte superiore della testa. In qualche modo è più simile a una punta, anche se l'inclinazione va a operare una ferita di genere diverso, motivo per cui rientra nei colpi (hau). Quello che invece fate voi è più che altro un Oberhau e comunque sicuramente non è un Meinsterhau.
Thanks to all of you who post on our videos! These videos are not only a way for us to share our ideas, but also a way to be exposed to other thought processes. I have become a better fencer for it, and hopefully others will as well.
I have just started studying this art and one of the things that I am noticing is that the power and speed one can generate with this move is highly overlooked by many. Thanks for the clear explanation.
I haven't been able to pull off hitting with the initial scheitelhau versus a low guard, but it's a fantastic way to draw out someone's defense. It seems like it's fast and direct enough they don't have a lot of options except to move straight to kron.
Thanks for posting these videos, I find the clear demonstrations very useful.
I sometimes use Scheitelhau in a defensive mode, while stepping back out of measure, keeping an opponent at bay in reaction to their attack - giving me some time to regroup.
Good thought!
Nice coincidence, we were just yesterday training Scheitelhau, Kron and Durchlaufen combination and noticed your new video on this.
I noticed in training that even if the oponent in Albern knew I was going to use Scheitelhau (we were aiming to the head and if the opponent was able to parry with a Kron, he would go under the sword for grappling), 1in 2 to 1 in 5 would hit, maybe less with instructors. So, the Kron is definitely very effective against Scheitelhau, even from the Alber, especially if there is even some telegraphy involved but with the correct timing and speed, Scheitelhau can work quite often. In somewhat freer parrying (with limited attack options) it worked even better against unwary opponents who drifted a bit too close (the opponent did not even need to be in low guard).
As for the defending person hitting your hands, our instructor recounted the same explanation as Michael-Forest that he/she will insinctively protect the head and frankly I believe him. It is almost reflex, as the fast nature of the attack does not even leave time for a double-kill...
I think the trick is to use very fast push-pull motion with the wrists while extending the arms and to remember to keep arms high. The vertical nature of Scheitelhau allows for the very fast whiplike attack and keeping arms high not only protects them but gives you just that little of extra reach downwards agains an opponent who is a bit late in bringing his sword to the Kron. Of course I have to admit that the flexible nature of a Federschwert can sometimes help too...
By the way, Ringeck tells us to let the sword hang over our back in left hand when going for the "tackle" and it does protect better that way, even if it sounded stupid to me when I read it the first time (What do you know, the old masters actually knew what they were talking about...). If fencing from the left shoulder, I let go with the left hand and let the sword up horizontal between myself and the opponent.
Well, that's my five cents. I find your videos very good and clear, it is easy to follow how it progresses from attack to counter and counter to that again. Keep up the good work!
Yes, forgot something. Needless to say that this works better against shorter opponents, unless they are unwary. I believe it was Meyer who said that as our bodies are not optimal for all techniques, we should not use those techniques that are not suited to us.
Good thoughts. Thanks for sharing.
In realtà, è più probabilmente lo scheitelhau che può essere utilizzato per abbattere la corona, non il contrario.
Just found y'all through a tumblr link, ;D. I'm in NC and am glad to see SC has a great HEMA community as well.
Re: Scheitelhau, It's quick, telegraphed with a very stern "This IS my range, wake up!" message to it. I can see it put to good use with novice members and with tiring partners to help with sparring sessions.
Glad you found us!
Nice video, if you try to block with crown a bit closser to the head or body it became more protective and it make it for faster reposte afterwards. At my club we combine a hight long point gard with the crown block close to the head or body if the incoming attack is on the side and it is very versatile and fast. Also because the long point gard is higher is harder for your oponnent to try those kind of oberhow whitout guetting stab in the face or hands. Anyway thanks for sharing it's always nice to see other techniques.
We've been using a "faked" scheittelhau to break alber. Go for one up high, and if the opponent tries to thrust or cut upwards to displace my sword I bring down a clockwise cut aimed at his sword from above. If my opponent moves to just block I either hit him or can do the followup techniques.
Good! Thanks for the input.
This is my interpretation as well. Ringeck seems to tell us to strike short and lower the point to the face from a slightly wider range. This keeps your hands much safer. If you see anything coming from the opponent you don't like, fall on it with the long edge and proceed, or do the Scheitelhau plays if he parries in Kron. I do the cut very large (Ringeck says "long sheitelhau") to provoke the response. My reasoning is that the solution should be simple. If so many people are having trouble with breaking Alber, the solution must be very basic or the glosses would have told us. Falling on something with the long edge is the simplest thing there is. I think Fiore says that low guards are difficult to break without danger, and I think we all agree with him :)
I used to always win matches by going to kron against Scheitelhau and then winding to pflug and a thrust when my opponent would stab low. It was a... "learning" experience to fence another school when they didn't react to kron that way, lol.
Can I ask what Feders you're using? My guess is PR, but I'm not certain.
KalteGeist Yes, Regenyeis
Thanks for showing this great video, I've learned alot. It seems that the wrist structure is broken while doing the crown cut? I wonder does this create some problem?
I suppose it is broken a bit, though with a looser grip the wrists can be kept straighter. I don’t know of any problems it causes. I’m not trying to chop my opponent in half. I’m trying to cut him in the face which in my opinion does not need perfect structure to cause an effect. And if he blocks the Scheitelhau I always yield and wind immediately into another guard with good wrist structure.
Aaron i got a new sword cutlass and ill be there this Saturday.
Is this also a useful move if the attacker is smaller than the defender? In the current setup the attacker is taller, which clearly is an advantage.
i dont use the scheitelhau at all because what you said @02:10: it does not protect anything on your body. But I want to utilize it much more.
Secondo la nostra interpretazione, lo Scheitelhau è un po' differente. Fondamentalmente si tratta di un colpo che tranciando lacera la parte superiore della testa. In qualche modo è più simile a una punta, anche se l'inclinazione va a operare una ferita di genere diverso, motivo per cui rientra nei colpi (hau). Quello che invece fate voi è più che altro un Oberhau e comunque sicuramente non è un Meinsterhau.
We use it to attack the head when someone attacks us low.
9:04 interesting sound
It's funny hearing all these german words from an american
Haha. I do my best. :)