Your suggestion of opening the cover and watching the plunger bob was a game changer! Now I KNOW I have the correct step up spring. You sir, are amazing. Thank you!!!!
I didn't know this either. I always wondered why my Duster had that occasional stumble. I no longer have the car which I kind of regreted the Edelbrock instead of the Holley. I knew how to tune a Holley but not the Edelbrock. I had a well warmed 360 in it, ran well but I knew there was more in it but didn't know how to get it. Thanks Tony, I learn something from every one of your videos.
Wow, all you folks here with the mystery AVS issues. I understand and was always happy to educate my customers like you all. They were happy too, to finally know they didn't have (or buy) a junk carburetor. The word of mouth business I got back from people like you was fantastic, thank you! Tony's the greatest right?
Until they don't. Aluminum carbs do not age well and actually change their tune as they corrode inside. In a dry environment they are fine. In an wet or humid environment, these seem to corrode and give major headaches after a short run time. Tony has not had to change out several of these that were no longer responding to tune it seems. For him to say that the reputation these have is because nobody can tune them is nonsense. And if they are that much harder to tune than a Holley....Anyway. Give me a 1965 AFB any day. A non corroded one that is. I had corroded AFB troubles back in the 1990's on a 1965 Buick Sportwagon with a 300. To deny this massive manufacturing failure is just fanboy shit. These carbs do not last like ANY zinc carb.
Thanks Tony, I haven't been able to work since 2009. I'd stopped thinking about this stuff and thought I'd actually forgotten things. For 20 years before that people thought I was magic on tuning & carbs, even other mechanics, just because I knew the tips you talked about! Carter's are the bomb for a street car and people hated them cause nobody understood how to tune them, so I got tons of happy customers and had a blast. Thanks for reminding me! 👍😁
I've used many of these. Great carbs. A couple of dual setups, but never knew about the empty secondary bowl stumble issue. I'm 53 and still learning. Another great thing about these carbs, no gaskets below float level. So no leaks. Great video, thanks!
The Edelbrock and Holley’s are both excellent , I’ve had numerous variations over the years . Again thanks again Uncle Tony , your channel is a breath of fresh air for us real backyard / driveway knuckle busters . Cheers
I have a Carter AFB 625 CFM on my 40 year old Dodge B300. I don't think it's original to my vehicle. I've had absolutely no trouble after it sat for over 30 years. The carburetor you are holding is an exact replica of mine. I've learned so much about carburetors from you thanks to your no-nonsense way of explaining it. Thank you so much!
I love the Edelbrock carb. My shelf in the shop has a few sitting on it that I got for free or peanuts... because the guy I got it from said "it's a POS..and I'll never get one again...their loss has been my gain...user friendly for a young hot rodder because if you pick the right size it will give you good results right out the box.
The reason is that Holley power valves are either on or off. Edelbrock rods move proportionately by the springs. Original AVS (RoadRunners etc) had 3 step rods.
Finally!! Someone on the same page as me!! I run an avs 650 on my 69 camaro, race it every weeknd! My tow vehicle 454 had a holley 750..junk! Put edelbrock 600 pulls better than my Cummins diesel, now the new avs 650 has secondary air valve, ones adjusted instant throttle response!! No flat spots! Great demo bud!
As a teenager, my dad and I ran a Holley on a 67 mustang for a couple of years; it felt like it was always a science experiment to keep running nicely. Moved to Edelbrock and it was an absolute breeze; literally ran the thing for 20 years without opening the carb up (not recommended). Two years ago, I replaced with another edelbrock and it was a breeze to get tunes again. For street and convenience, I would choose these over Holley all day long.
I'm going through this now with my Holley. Nothing but a nightmare and too much of a hassle to deal with the powervalves and everything inside the freaking float bowl 😒 plus it's developing so many common Holley leaks Switching to Edelbrock!! I just don't want the hassle anymore lol
Amigo u keep in a language that encourages us with street rod cruisers to do it ourselves. I'm not an expert on carburators but i feel more confident than ever. Thanks bro. God bless
Preaching to the choir I had one on my 84 Buick LeSabre with a 70s Cutlass Oldsmobile rocket 350 Ran amazing for 240,000 miles not saying I did not tuned or work on the daily but it was a passion.
youre a genius! Ive always wondered why my edelbrock in my D150 stumbled when I dipped into the secondaries for the first time during a drive. Especially after it sits for a few days. Definitely subscribing!
You are 100% right about guys trash talking Edelbrock carbs because they know nothing about them. Most of them have tried one and didn't know you can't run more than 5.5 lbs of fuel pressure or it leaks gas all over the engine. I have a Carter muscle car series fuel pump designed to work with an Edelbrock carb that has a max pressure of 5.5 lbs and only drops to 5 lbs at full throttle!
many people hate these because they can't tune em. they think turning the idle mixture screws is "tuning"... I personally love them because they give you no trouble once you have the right jets and metering rods in them for your application. and they're not elevation sensitive... not as much anyway.
so glad to finally find a wrench turner that recognizes the real qualities of the Edelbrock. So many other channels just talk shit about the Holley. I had run Holley since the mid 1960's and I can tell you they are a pain in the ass....always going out of tune with vacuum leaks in the nasty valve body gasket and their choke system never was worth a crap, it too would easily cause too much load up. I finally relented in 1997 and put a 650 Edelbrock on a well built ford 400 in a pickup. I never knew life could be so good since that time. The electric choke has been flawless even to this day on that old "78 4x4. The carb never coughs, never fails. I have never experienced the stumble from dry circuits you describe....ever, just start and run, never fail. It is super easy and convenient to pull the top and check/clean float bowl and make metering adjustments if desired. This design is so superior to Holley for street use it is ridiculous. I have a couple of Demons run on a stroker...the ones before Holley got hold of them..... and they have worked extremely well too but none can match the smoothness and easy start of the Edelbrock.
The AFB's were overlooked because they looked to simple to work so everyone went for the " had to better " more complicated Holley band wagon. I've run AFBs on street in dual quad configuration since the mid 60s, easy to flog on the go. Have a nice pair of Holley 650's for MY 360 tribute build of Dad's '74 D100 shorty stepside. FYI Carter manufactured AFBs for marine use. The primaries and secondaries are the same size,4 big holes. I found mine in used marine salvage yards.
Funny thing about that is I'm pretty sure afb/edlebrock's actually have more moving parts then a Holley which is probably the main reason the Holley design won out in drag racing. Either carb is simple to mess with. Hell, they make externally adjustable jets for Holley if you can't be bothered to drain the bowls and remove 4-8 screws to change jets.
@@peacfulseas Neither did I. I pointed out its funny to me if the perception of Holley was "more parts, more better" since they're actually simpler carburetors.
@@177SCmaro I have experience with both,run both. While the AFBs might have more moving parts(?) tuning a Holley for the novice is far more complicated. Power valves,secondary vacuum springs. None of which the AFBs have and are more forgiving when making changes that don't require a complete teardown. UT,UC channel is aimed mostly aimed at beginners but I'm never too old to learn from anyone with experience.
@@peacfulseas You can get both carburetors with or without secondary air valves/springs and the power valve is mechanically simpler then metering rods (although more of a pain to get to but can be deleted for racing). My main beef with, at least Edelbrock's, is their crappy/inconsistent accelerator pump design which fucked me out of many a race with the infamous random "Edelbrock stumble" at the line. Other than that I found them to be fine carburetors. Great for the street. Ran one on my pickup for years. But when I go racing it's a Holley double pumper-style or nothing.
Ive played with both Holley and Edelbrock but not an expert by no means as I'm younger, 31. I never understood that bogg down until you've mentioned it here. Super glad the way you used getting into secondaries while warming tires warming tires. Many thanks!
Me too since the day I bought it new pulled it out of the box and fired the car up it ran great even the air fuel was damn near right on out of the box never gave me a issue at all
Had an AFB sitting on the shelf along with QJet. Car a bought had a leaky Holly. Grabbed the AFB and bolted it on. Ran fine and idled great; no adjustments. Bought a kit because it was sitting quite a while and will be rebuilding it soon. Q jets are great carbs too. Holly's seam to be more work to set up.
I started liking the AVS/AFB when I realized there were no vertical bowl gaskets to leak. Tuning is much easier than digging into the Holley bowls too. Ride on Tony! You're the best!
Absolutely. The side gaskets on Holley bowls are a pain in the ass to keep ftom leaking, especially on rigs that sit for long periods of time. Getting away from Holley was one of the best things I ever did.
Nice. Good ole 1406, ive had one on my small block ford for years and have never had to mess with it. Super easy to rebuild, and to tune. Thanks for sharing your wisdom man.
Tony I hope you live forever. The car community needs people like you that have knowledge and aren't afraid to share it. Alot of guys out there seem to think higher of themselves when they have all the knowledge.
Uncle Tony you give the best clarity in your tutorials. I'm always impressed with how easy you make understanding things! Thank you for the bother in making these wonderful videos.
Holy shit... This was the most enlightening video on the Edelbrock Carburetor I have ever seen. So many people talk shit abut the Edelbrock, but I have never had any problem with them and they are simple to rebuild and tune. This short little video was a wealth of information...
Running a 78 360 in a 84 dodge prospector, edelbrock 750. Bought the truck and half built engine for 1000 bucks. Your vids are excellent and i can't wait to watch them all! Never too smart to learn something new. Keep it up!
I prefer these carbs for street use on a square port intake. On a spread bore, a good pre computer controlled Q-get, or a Thermoquad that has not been cracked. I find that these carbs are also prone to boiling the fuel in the carb and are sensitive to fuel pressure. A heat shield under the carb works wonders, and keep your fuel pressure to 4-5 psi and they are a set them and forget them carb that will work flawlessly for years.
This was Awesome! Exactly what I was wanting to know. I just helped a friend's son install a Edelbrock RPM air gap and an edelbrock 650 avs carburetor on his 1988 dodge 150 with a 360. It's set up for sea level and we live at about 4950'. Great video Uncle Tony. Thank you!
@@TheCanadianBubba Yes I replaced the 2 barrel on my 76 nova 305/turbo 350 with a quadrajet carb/manifold off a 73 350. more power but mileage went up to 25 highway.
My experience has been the opposite here at ~4,500' above sea level. Usually have to at least change metering rods, but usually 1 or two sizes smaller primary jet and 1 smaller or no secondary jet size.
That secondary circuit was news to me. Thank you for that. I watched you lift that step up spring with the metering rod, that was beautiful! Once again a terrific video and I've always liked these carburetors, the first AFB my father put on our 1968 Chrysler 300 in place of the original Holley back in 1971 was a real eye opener. Keep making your great videos!
I have a few of them on various Mopar’s. I’m always cussing them lol but you are right, I’m no mechanic. I have realized that I always have to put my car up in neutral and rev it real hard to get a good response . I wish you all lived closer Tony
It makes absolutely no logical sense to change metering rods or sprins while it's running. Serves no useful purpose what so ever. Just because you can, doesn't mean you need to or should.
I HAVE 2 650 AVS THUNDER SERIES ON A 496 MOTOR IN MY V-DRIVE BOAT EVERYONE SAID THEY WOULDNT WORK BUT ONCE I LEARNED HOW TO TUNE THEM THEY ARE SO RELIABLE I LOVE THEM.
Tony don't forget they don't like heat. I run a phenolic spacer on mine.. the heat soak boils the fuel out.. but I absolutely love these carbs! Thanks for another great informative video!
Even the old mopar tuning articles had thermoquad and manifold combo tuning secrets. I saw one that had tuning secrets for an STR with a spreadbore top and TQ for drag racing. Apparently almost nothing made more power on a 440 bar a dual quad tunnel ram with 2x 660s (all things being equal).
@@ThePaulv12 Back in the '90s I put (2) 850cfm Thermoquads on a tunnel ram 440 stroked and poked to 500cid.. Dyno'd around 750hp on track tune, and I tuned it back to 650-675hp for cruising. I completely rebuilt and retuned them for the application, and made my own progressive linkage. Ran on rear carb's primaries upto 1/4 throttle, then front carb's primaries were completely open at 1/2 throttle, then both carbs' secondaries opened together. I got rather decent mileage as long as I kept my foot out of the floorboard. Full throttle it would suck in low flying planes.
Agreed. 13 of them sits in my barn including an original offenhauser 2x 4 barrel,dual plane, spread bore intake made for the quad. Love the sound of a thermoquad
great video. this would have saved me some embarrassment in high school. AFB Carter on my GS455 stage 1 and edelbrock on my s10. always loved these carbs.
The difference between the AFB and the AVzs is that the vacuum secondaries on the AFB are counterweighted, and the AVS are sprung. That means the AVS is adjustable, the AFB isn’t, unless you want to remove weigh from the counterweights. I’ve never seen that done, but in theory it should work. But I wouldn’t try it unless I had a second air valve to replace the one I tried to modify, in case I s rowed things up. I’m not even sure where to remove weight. The best way to do that would be to drill it out. Or, if the carb is too big for the engine you might try adding weight to the counterweights. Ut the. You have to find a metal that is heavier than the metal the counterweights are made out of, drill out the counterweights and somehow replace that mass with heavier metal. You’d be better off finding an AVS. I think the HolleyDemon carb is their take on an AVS. Ok, I was partially wrong. Edelbrock was selling AFB’s but now sell what they call the AVS2. Holley sells an updated version of the AVS. Tossed with a Thermoquad. Both carbs would be worth looking into for a street or stret strip engine. Of course if you found an original carb of either type, whet I sad holds true. Have fun!
It's amazing that no one talks about the biggest drivability improvement which is the wire into the air bleed trick which makes these run like EFI buy eliminating the lean area just off idle in the transfer slot range which is NOT affected by metering rod, spring or jet changes
Best Video I have ever seen on these carbs! well done , no music no bashing just straight up useful info , I am new to edlebrock and wondered why it would fall on its face on the first secondary opening after days of sitting thanks for the info
Wow Tony! Excellent info about the secondary circuit going dry. My edlebrock does exactly what you said, it falls on its face the first time I nail it to the floor, but after that it’s all good. Now I know why, thanks!
Tony, I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one who has the issue with the float bowls drying out. The same thing happens on my grandfathers old ford we're fixing up.
5 років тому+6
I had a hard time finding the EXACT accelerator pump for my Carter AFB. After 3 different rebuild kits and the standard Edelbrock parts, I could not find the correct pump and therefor get my Carter AFB to work properly. That's why I went to Holley. So many people are afraid of Holley and how complicated they are. For me, I find them actually easier to adjust and tune.
I finally found the sweet spot on mine and that's in the garbage. I chased problems for years, sent it back to Edelbrock, and it never ran good. Finally fixed the problem when I put a Holley on there. It was like going from a 2 barrel to 4! Night and day difference and nothing but better performance from the start even before I got it dialed in! That was on my '72 Chevy 402 Monte Carlo. Now, I'm running a Holley Sniper EFI and it is turn key awesomeness! No more cold issues. It really transformed the car into a daily driver that you can hand the keys to the wife. Bye bye carb b.s. and Edelbrock. Hello reliability, driveability, and performance without guesswork.
I totally agree with what's said. Some of the best running street strip cars I've seen have had Edelbrock carbs. Crisp throttle response, still run good even cold, with great drivability especially dialed in. People say the same things about the Quadrajet calling them quadrajunk. I've seen old timers back in the day having awesome running street machines running 12 and 11sec quarter mile times(in the 1990s) and if you dial both the Edelbrock and Quadrajet carbs in right you can make GOOD power and have EFI like throttle response, performance, and good drivability!! Your right, it's not the design but the people who won't crack open a book to better understand how those carbs work!
Thank you Tony. I am a carburetor guy too, although rusty. Just got a car with an edelbrock on it. Don't know anything about it yet but your video makes me want to get into it.
I always liked my edelbrock carbs, biggest problem I've had with them is worn out throttle shafts. The holleys, in my experience, always seemed to last longer.
Carters are cheap and he even said so. And are for people with little understanding of carbs. Holleys are for people that know how to tune an engine . They are better built. Another thing a holley just looks way better.
Awesome info 👍 I just bought a 1982 Corvette stingray the previous owner before me had the engine rebuilt, took out the crossfire injection system and put a regular intake with this exact carb on it. I am not familiar with this set up because I'm used to fuel injection and I rely on my obd2 software to make any adjustments 😅. Just by hearing how you explain to tune it and make adjustments I can tell you had a professional shop. 👍 It's like my trade as well, I'm an HVAC technician I learned from "old school" techs they showed me tips and tricks and explain things differently then my instructor did in school! He mostly used digital gauges and electronic equipment. The techs I learned from used all old school analog gauges and regular temp probes they did tell me the new style is good but almost all new techs don't know how to read analog gauges 😅 Now I pass the knowledge to my younger brother and together we own our own business. Thanks Tony!
LunarOutlaw’s Garage keep In kind Buick’s LOVE CFMs... it’s crazy but true. I had a stock 72 BUICK GS 350 and put a 750 on it and she WOKE up big time. Can’t do it on the chevys but Buick’s go big.
SCcarguy Ever since I started this project I gained a real appreciation for Buick engines. This was originally a Buick for55 stage one but at some point over 40 years ago they switched it over whether they blew the engine up or something I don’t know. Now has a high compression 350 and SP block. But they never go out together so just trying to sort it out
I had an '84 Camaro that originally was a 2.8L V6 that I blew up. I swapped that dog with a 305, Holley Street Dominator intake, and a Carter AFB 625cfm. Now THAT was the sweetness! I used to shock Firebird Formulas with the TBI motors!
I set one up on a four wheel drive big motor application. Used the spring loaded Vinton tipped needle and seat for rough roads and off level. Stomp it and the fuel bowl would run dry. Drilled out the needle and seat to keep the bowl from running dry. Took some fiddling with the fuel level to keep it happy. Could drive it up a wall or have it so sideways you thought it would tip over and never a stumble.
Damn. I love this real world advice. Seriously. I look really good on paper. My Dad taught me about the real world. This is incredibly important advice for my Sons in the future. Thank you for showing how analog devices can equal or better modern digital fuel metering devices. It’s not as clean or efficient. But it will run when electronics won’t. Under very harsh conditions. I think my Boys would be surprised how great carburetors can be. My youngest has learned a lot with my blown ‘73 ‘Vette small block. It’s not the the future, I know. But learning first principles is knowledge that is irreplaceable. I learned about IC engines watching and helping my Dad restore 1900-1910 stationary gasoline engines. We dug two of them out of dirt and dung in Omaha NE and outside of Medford OR when I was in Jr/Sr High. His “Pride and Joy” was a horizontal engine, Fairbanks Morse, that used breaking points for the spark ignition inside the cylinder using a horseshoe magneto. Usually, I was the “starter”. Holding the intake valve open by my left hand to get it up to speed with Right arm cranking was a finesse maneuver. A person cranking will quickly learn what flooded sounds and feels like. The same with lack of gas/lean. It really brings the point home if you pay attention to how the engine feels and sounds while cranking. Thanks for your videos. I pass them along to my Sons and they soak up your knowledge. Maybe the world will go all electric. But...I don’t think so. The world’s milage may vary.
I love my Summit 600CFM carb for my 73 Mustang 302, and feel like I have it pretty well rounded out now. But for that thing, I had to buy every tuning jet, discharge restriction and secondary spring on Summit to optimize it from factory calibration, with an oxygen sensor no less. My used, $40 Edelbrock I stuck on my $400 84 F150 302? Never a flat spot or economy issue every day of the year after a couple minor adjustments. I may love the cheapo Edelbrock more.
Thanks for your opinion on these carbs, used to run Carters back in the 70's on many of my engines for the street and the avs was super! Need a change on my 87 460 ford stake body work truck from the original Holley factory carb. Do not drive this truck every day and now experiencing leaks on the Holley on the bottom half of the carb. The thing I always liked about the Carters was that the carbs are only 2 piece , top and bottom, and less prone to any leaks. I now plan to replace the Holley with the Edelbrock carb . Thanks for a great video!!
Great info. Thank you for explaining this carb. Pulled the Holley and stuck this on my 85 360. Warm starts suck but now I understand it’s the fuel evaporation. I floor it till it starts and then quickly let off.
We are 4000 ft above sea level where I live. Edelbrocks are the easiest to set up for the thinner air. Since they are set to run at sea level right out of the box we always have to lean out the fuel mixture. Going two steps leaner on the jets and rods for a typical 350 cid engine works like a charm.
Properly explained as usual, no stupid distracting background music that's why he's one of the best!
Background music is everywhere, driving me crazy. ( crazier)
He should edit the sound from the lights
And Speaks ENGLISH
Mind you , Quiet Riot's "Metal Health" would almost be appropriate. :)
I hate music in videos too
Your suggestion of opening the cover and watching the plunger bob was a game changer! Now I KNOW I have the correct step up spring. You sir, are amazing. Thank you!!!!
I had no idea about the secondaries drying out like that. I thought I had a tuning issue. Your the bomb Tony.
With them when you clean out rev you are actually priming instead of unloading.
I just learned that aswell always wondered why first run of the night the old girl would usually fall on her face
same here, now i know i questioned if my secondary's were even working
I didn't know this either. I always wondered why my Duster had that occasional stumble. I no longer have the car which I kind of regreted the Edelbrock instead of the Holley. I knew how to tune a Holley but not the Edelbrock. I had a well warmed 360 in it, ran well but I knew there was more in it but didn't know how to get it. Thanks Tony, I learn something from every one of your videos.
Wow, all you folks here with the mystery AVS issues. I understand and was always happy to educate my customers like you all. They were happy too, to finally know they didn't have (or buy) a junk carburetor. The word of mouth business I got back from people like you was fantastic, thank you!
Tony's the greatest right?
Glad that I’m not the only guy that likes an edelbrock. They just work.
holley's work too
Very few people understand Holleys too. It's rare to meet one who really understands them.
A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
Until they don't. Aluminum carbs do not age well and actually change their tune as they corrode inside. In a dry environment they are fine. In an wet or humid environment, these seem to corrode and give major headaches after a short run time. Tony has not had to change out several of these that were no longer responding to tune it seems. For him to say that the reputation these have is because nobody can tune them is nonsense. And if they are that much harder to tune than a Holley....Anyway. Give me a 1965 AFB any day. A non corroded one that is. I had corroded AFB troubles back in the 1990's on a 1965 Buick Sportwagon with a 300. To deny this massive manufacturing failure is just fanboy shit. These carbs do not last like ANY zinc carb.
@@hyperluminalreality1 I have a 800avs on a fairly wild 383 Chev. I'm live in Ontario Canada. I've had it for over ten years and never had a problem
@@hueroski yes and much better
Thanks Tony, I haven't been able to work since 2009. I'd stopped thinking about this stuff and thought I'd actually forgotten things. For 20 years before that people thought I was magic on tuning & carbs, even other mechanics, just because I knew the tips you talked about! Carter's are the bomb for a street car and people hated them cause nobody understood how to tune them, so I got tons of happy customers and had a blast. Thanks for reminding me! 👍😁
Uncle Tony does it again I've never seen anybody explain how to tune carburetors like this ever
I agree Tony they are the simplest carbs. Witch means less things to go wrong. No rubber power valves or leaking bowl gaskets.
Holley is the worst for leaky seals
However, a Holly with a double pump mechanical secondary tuned properly will out perform Edlebrock. Night and day.
@@hackfreehvac your right but the edelbrock is almost trouble free
The Carter/Edelbrock is my favorite too they are so simple and always reliable
A Quadra-Jet can be too if you understand it right.
Another great set of details . Ty
"Breaking News" ....
No carburetors were harmed in the making of this video !
Hahahahaha
I've used many of these. Great carbs. A couple of dual setups, but never knew about the empty secondary bowl stumble issue. I'm 53 and still learning. Another great thing about these carbs, no gaskets below float level. So no leaks. Great video, thanks!
The Edelbrock and Holley’s are both excellent , I’ve had numerous variations over the years . Again thanks again Uncle Tony , your channel is a breath of fresh air for us real backyard / driveway knuckle busters . Cheers
That dry secondary quirk is exactly the bug I’ve been chasing. This makes so much sense, you’re a genius.
I have a Carter AFB 625 CFM on my 40 year old Dodge B300. I don't think it's original to my vehicle. I've had absolutely no trouble after it sat for over 30 years. The carburetor you are holding is an exact replica of mine. I've learned so much about carburetors from you thanks to your no-nonsense way of explaining it. Thank you so much!
Man just the wealth of knowledge that this man has is staggering.
I love the Edelbrock carb. My shelf in the shop has a few sitting on it that I got for free or peanuts... because the guy I got it from said "it's a POS..and I'll never get one again...their loss has been my gain...user friendly for a young hot rodder because if you pick the right size it will give you good results right out the box.
Yes sir.👍
$100 will still get you a new take off POS.
LOL
Been my favorite since 1960. 👍👍
The reason is that Holley power valves are either on or off.
Edelbrock rods move proportionately by the springs.
Original AVS (RoadRunners etc) had 3 step rods.
Wish I could find some old Quadra-Jet carbs like that since people talk so much shit about them.
Finally!! Someone on the same page as me!! I run an avs 650 on my 69 camaro, race it every weeknd! My tow vehicle 454 had a holley 750..junk! Put edelbrock 600 pulls better than my Cummins diesel, now the new avs 650 has secondary air valve, ones adjusted instant throttle response!! No flat spots! Great demo bud!
I'm nominating Uncle Tony for sainthood on his carburetor explanations alone. If the powers that be are grease monkeys, he's a shoe in.
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I love edelbrock carbs. Argue with people all the time about them. Thanks for setting people straight concerning there easy tuning and reliability
As a teenager, my dad and I ran a Holley on a 67 mustang for a couple of years; it felt like it was always a science experiment to keep running nicely. Moved to Edelbrock and it was an absolute breeze; literally ran the thing for 20 years without opening the carb up (not recommended). Two years ago, I replaced with another edelbrock and it was a breeze to get tunes again. For street and convenience, I would choose these over Holley all day long.
I'm going through this now with my Holley. Nothing but a nightmare and too much of a hassle to deal with the powervalves and everything inside the freaking float bowl 😒 plus it's developing so many common Holley leaks
Switching to Edelbrock!! I just don't want the hassle anymore lol
Amigo u keep in a language that encourages us with street rod cruisers to do it ourselves. I'm not an expert on carburators but i feel more confident than ever. Thanks bro. God bless
Preaching to the choir I had one on my 84 Buick LeSabre with a 70s Cutlass Oldsmobile rocket 350 Ran amazing for 240,000 miles not saying I did not tuned or work on the daily but it was a passion.
My hot rod sat for over 8yrs poured a little fire maker In the carb.. and it fired right up.. great carburetors. Thanks utg for this video 🤘🤘👍👍
My Edlebrock was plug and play for my car. Never had a problem with it the whole time I owned it.
AAAANNND That's why we love Uncle Tony. Short. Simple. Concise. Not just the what, but the why and how, so ya understand the method entirely.
youre a genius! Ive always wondered why my edelbrock in my D150 stumbled when I dipped into the secondaries for the first time during a drive. Especially after it sits for a few days. Definitely subscribing!
You are 100% right about guys trash talking Edelbrock carbs because they know nothing about them. Most of them have tried one and didn't know you can't run more than 5.5 lbs of fuel pressure or it leaks gas all over the engine. I have a Carter muscle car series fuel pump designed to work with an Edelbrock carb that has a max pressure of 5.5 lbs and only drops to 5 lbs at full throttle!
many people hate these because they can't tune em. they think turning the idle mixture screws is "tuning"... I personally love them because they give you no trouble once you have the right jets and metering rods in them for your application. and they're not elevation sensitive... not as much anyway.
so glad to finally find a wrench turner that recognizes the real qualities of the Edelbrock. So many other channels just talk shit about the Holley. I had run Holley since the mid 1960's and I can tell you they are a pain in the ass....always going out of tune with vacuum leaks in the nasty valve body gasket and their choke system never was worth a crap, it too would easily cause too much load up. I finally relented in 1997 and put a 650 Edelbrock on a well built ford 400 in a pickup. I never knew life could be so good since that time. The electric choke has been flawless even to this day on that old "78 4x4. The carb never coughs, never fails. I have never experienced the stumble from dry circuits you describe....ever, just start and run, never fail. It is super easy and convenient to pull the top and check/clean float bowl and make metering adjustments if desired. This design is so superior to Holley for street use it is ridiculous. I have a couple of Demons run on a stroker...the ones before Holley got hold of them..... and they have worked extremely well too but none can match the smoothness and easy start of the Edelbrock.
Been years since I tuned these things but your KISS explanation is spot on Tony, Thanks for the refresher .
This is the best general description I have found. I'm new to Edelbrock, I learned a lot. Thanks!! ✌️🇺🇲
The AFB's were overlooked because they looked to simple to work so everyone went for the " had to better " more complicated Holley band wagon. I've run AFBs on street in dual quad configuration since the mid 60s, easy to flog on the go. Have a nice pair of Holley 650's for MY 360 tribute build of Dad's '74 D100 shorty stepside. FYI Carter manufactured AFBs for marine use. The primaries and secondaries are the same size,4 big holes. I found mine in used marine salvage yards.
Funny thing about that is I'm pretty sure afb/edlebrock's actually have more moving parts then a Holley which is probably the main reason the Holley design won out in drag racing. Either carb is simple to mess with. Hell, they make externally adjustable jets for Holley if you can't be bothered to drain the bowls and remove 4-8 screws to change jets.
@@177SCmaro Yup if your schooled in all that but most aren't. Chill dude Never said one was better than the other.
@@peacfulseas Neither did I. I pointed out its funny to me if the perception of Holley was "more parts, more better" since they're actually simpler carburetors.
@@177SCmaro I have experience with both,run both. While the AFBs might have more moving parts(?) tuning a Holley for the novice is far more complicated. Power valves,secondary vacuum springs. None of which the AFBs have and are more forgiving when making changes that don't require a complete teardown. UT,UC channel is aimed mostly aimed at beginners but I'm never too old to learn from anyone with experience.
@@peacfulseas
You can get both carburetors with or without secondary air valves/springs and the power valve is mechanically simpler then metering rods (although more of a pain to get to but can be deleted for racing). My main beef with, at least Edelbrock's, is their crappy/inconsistent accelerator pump design which fucked me out of many a race with the infamous random "Edelbrock stumble" at the line.
Other than that I found them to be fine carburetors. Great for the street. Ran one on my pickup for years. But when I go racing it's a Holley double pumper-style or nothing.
Ive played with both Holley and Edelbrock but not an expert by no means as I'm younger, 31. I never understood that bogg down until you've mentioned it here. Super glad the way you used getting into secondaries while warming tires warming tires. Many thanks!
Have had no issues with my edelbrock, easy to tune as well. Thanks Uncle Tony!
Me too since the day I bought it new pulled it out of the box and fired the car up it ran great even the air fuel was damn near right on out of the box never gave me a issue at all
Had an AFB sitting on the shelf along with QJet. Car a bought had a leaky Holly. Grabbed the AFB and bolted it on. Ran fine and idled great; no adjustments. Bought a kit because it was sitting quite a while and will be rebuilding it soon. Q jets are great carbs too. Holly's seam to be more work to set up.
I started liking the AVS/AFB when I realized there were no vertical bowl gaskets to leak. Tuning is much easier than digging into the Holley bowls too.
Ride on Tony! You're the best!
Absolutely. The side gaskets on Holley bowls are a pain in the ass to keep ftom leaking, especially on rigs that sit for long periods of time.
Getting away from Holley was one of the best things I ever did.
Nice. Good ole 1406, ive had one on my small block ford for years and have never had to mess with it. Super easy to rebuild, and to tune. Thanks for sharing your wisdom man.
How do you know it's easy to rebuild if you never had to mess with it??
Thirdgen83 I’ve rebuilt several for customers. Check out my work. @carburetorculture instagram
Tony I hope you live forever. The car community needs people like you that have knowledge and aren't afraid to share it. Alot of guys out there seem to think higher of themselves when they have all the knowledge.
I'm an ls guy, but man your videos make me want to keep my old sbc and build it! Awesome content.
Uncle Tony you give the best clarity in your tutorials. I'm always impressed with how easy you make understanding things! Thank you for the bother in making these wonderful videos.
Holy shit... This was the most enlightening video on the Edelbrock Carburetor I have ever seen. So many people talk shit abut the Edelbrock, but I have never had any problem with them and they are simple to rebuild and tune. This short little video was a wealth of information...
I had a '59 Studebaker wagon running a Carter on the 289, she flew!!
Running a 78 360 in a 84 dodge prospector, edelbrock 750. Bought the truck and half built engine for 1000 bucks. Your vids are excellent and i can't wait to watch them all! Never too smart to learn something new. Keep it up!
I prefer these carbs for street use on a square port intake. On a spread bore, a good pre computer controlled Q-get, or a Thermoquad that has not been cracked. I find that these carbs are also prone to boiling the fuel in the carb and are sensitive to fuel pressure. A heat shield under the carb works wonders, and keep your fuel pressure to 4-5 psi and they are a set them and forget them carb that will work flawlessly for years.
fuel pressure is key, holleys like more than the Eddys for sure! great tip!
This was Awesome! Exactly what I was wanting to know. I just helped a friend's son install a Edelbrock RPM air gap and an edelbrock 650 avs carburetor on his 1988 dodge 150 with a 360. It's set up for sea level and we live at about 4950'. Great video Uncle Tony. Thank you!
I like the quadrajet for daily driver.
Better mileage than a two barrel... if you can keep your foot out of it : ]
@@TheCanadianBubba Yes I replaced the 2 barrel on my 76 nova 305/turbo 350 with a quadrajet carb/manifold off a 73 350. more power but mileage went up to 25 highway.
That secondary kick is awesome in those Qjets
@@RedBanksClassics- Baw-whah !
@@TheCanadianBubba exactly!👍
I love when people give information away for free. Thank You kind sir.
Just be aware, they are assembled to run lean, so you will need the tuning kit. Great advice as usual.
True... if I didnt add a o2 sensor to my new motor build I probably would have had a melt down in a week. Love the avs2 tho
My experience has been the opposite here at ~4,500' above sea level. Usually have to at least change metering rods, but usually 1 or two sizes smaller primary jet and 1 smaller or no secondary jet size.
100% YES.
I put one on out of the box, ran it maybe 2 miles, and the plugs are LEAN - very light brown.
Someone could have explained this a millions times to me and i still wouldnt have understood fully, but tony you sir are a genius.
They work great! I have one on my car, haven’t had to touch it since 2004.
Just stumbled on your channel, my dad is loving that I'm speaking his language now, carbs 😂
I love my edelbrock. I'm not much of a carb tuner, so it's nice when the work well out of the box.
I have to agree, the Edelbrock carbs are very simple and great carbs. They're just plain reliable.
Excellent video. The needles and jets are so much like the way a motorcycle carb works. very understandable to me.
Best video walk through on UA-cam. Great info for an old dog like myself who’s looking for new tricks. Excellent Job Tony. Thanks
That secondary circuit was news to me. Thank you for that. I watched you lift that step up spring with the metering rod, that was beautiful! Once again a terrific video and I've always liked these carburetors, the first AFB my father put on our 1968 Chrysler 300 in place of the original Holley back in 1971 was a real eye opener. Keep making your great videos!
I have a few of them on various Mopar’s. I’m always cussing them lol but you are right, I’m no mechanic. I have realized that I always have to put my car up in neutral and rev it real hard to get a good response . I wish you all lived closer Tony
Never knew you could watch the metering rods when the car was running - makes sense though. I need to try that.
It makes absolutely no logical sense to change metering rods or sprins while it's running. Serves no useful purpose what so ever. Just because you can, doesn't mean you need to or should.
I HAVE 2 650 AVS THUNDER SERIES ON A 496 MOTOR IN MY V-DRIVE BOAT EVERYONE SAID THEY WOULDNT WORK BUT ONCE I LEARNED HOW TO TUNE THEM THEY ARE SO RELIABLE I LOVE THEM.
As I've never had an Edlebrock Carb and am acquiring my first one! GREAT INFO! Thnx!
Tony don't forget they don't like heat. I run a phenolic spacer on mine.. the heat soak boils the fuel out.. but I absolutely love these carbs! Thanks for another great informative video!
thanks for the great school on this carb.
Awesome information on these carbs I haven't found anywhere else. No one explains the metering rods this way.
Love the channel, Uncle Tony! My best to Uncle Kathy!
I have a 1406 600cfm w/ performer 390 intake on my 1975 F-100 4x4 with a 360. Takes some figuring out but I like the carb!
Thermoquad is still my choice for best all-around carburetor.
Even the old mopar tuning articles had thermoquad and manifold combo tuning secrets.
I saw one that had tuning secrets for an STR with a spreadbore top and TQ for drag racing. Apparently almost nothing made more power on a 440 bar a dual quad tunnel ram with 2x 660s (all things being equal).
@@ThePaulv12 Back in the '90s I put (2) 850cfm Thermoquads on a tunnel ram 440 stroked and poked to 500cid.. Dyno'd around 750hp on track tune, and I tuned it back to 650-675hp for cruising. I completely rebuilt and retuned them for the application, and made my own progressive linkage. Ran on rear carb's primaries upto 1/4 throttle, then front carb's primaries were completely open at 1/2 throttle, then both carbs' secondaries opened together.
I got rather decent mileage as long as I kept my foot out of the floorboard. Full throttle it would suck in low flying planes.
Yes, the better Mopar tuners knew the TQ was good carb, too many other guys pulled them off and went to Holleys.
Agreed. 13 of them sits in my barn including an original offenhauser 2x 4 barrel,dual plane, spread bore intake made for the quad.
Love the sound of a thermoquad
great video. this would have saved me some embarrassment in high school. AFB Carter on my GS455 stage 1 and edelbrock on my s10. always loved these carbs.
The difference between the AFB and the AVzs is that the vacuum secondaries on the AFB are counterweighted, and the AVS are sprung. That means the AVS is adjustable, the AFB isn’t, unless you want to remove weigh from the counterweights. I’ve never seen that done, but in theory it should work. But I wouldn’t try it unless I had a second air valve to replace the one I tried to modify, in case I s rowed things up. I’m not even sure where to remove weight. The best way to do that would be to drill it out. Or, if the carb is too big for the engine you might try adding weight to the counterweights. Ut the. You have to find a metal that is heavier than the metal the counterweights are made out of, drill out the counterweights and somehow replace that mass with heavier metal. You’d be better off finding an AVS. I think the HolleyDemon carb is their take on an AVS. Ok, I was partially wrong. Edelbrock was selling AFB’s but now sell what they call the AVS2. Holley sells an updated version of the AVS. Tossed with a Thermoquad. Both carbs would be worth looking into for a street or stret strip engine. Of course if you found an original carb of either type, whet I sad holds true. Have fun!
It's amazing that no one talks about the biggest drivability improvement which is the wire into the air bleed trick which makes these run like EFI buy eliminating the lean area just off idle in the transfer slot range which is NOT affected by metering rod, spring or jet changes
I actually thought my carb was leaking gas out overnight, did not it was just evaporating.
Michael Sammy phenolic spacer helps them a lot!!!! They hate heat!!
Best Video I have ever seen on these carbs! well done , no music no bashing just straight up useful info , I am new to edlebrock and wondered why it would fall on its face on the first secondary opening after days of sitting thanks for the info
Thanks uncle Tony, just what I need for my ElCamino.
Wow Tony! Excellent info about the secondary circuit going dry. My edlebrock does exactly what you said, it falls on its face the first time I nail it to the floor, but after that it’s all good. Now I know why, thanks!
Man I love how you explain carburetors!
Tony, I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one who has the issue with the float bowls drying out. The same thing happens on my grandfathers old ford we're fixing up.
I had a hard time finding the EXACT accelerator pump for my Carter AFB. After 3 different rebuild kits and the standard Edelbrock parts, I could not find the correct pump and therefor get my Carter AFB to work properly. That's why I went to Holley. So many people are afraid of Holley and how complicated they are. For me, I find them actually easier to adjust and tune.
I finally found the sweet spot on mine and that's in the garbage. I chased problems for years, sent it back to Edelbrock, and it never ran good. Finally fixed the problem when I put a Holley on there. It was like going from a 2 barrel to 4! Night and day difference and nothing but better performance from the start even before I got it dialed in!
That was on my '72 Chevy 402 Monte Carlo. Now, I'm running a Holley Sniper EFI and it is turn key awesomeness! No more cold issues. It really transformed the car into a daily driver that you can hand the keys to the wife. Bye bye carb b.s. and Edelbrock. Hello reliability, driveability, and performance without guesswork.
My favorite carb too Tony. They work so good it feels like fuel injection sometimes.
I totally agree with what's said. Some of the best running street strip cars I've seen have had Edelbrock carbs. Crisp throttle response, still run good even cold, with great drivability especially dialed in. People say the same things about the Quadrajet calling them quadrajunk. I've seen old timers back in the day having awesome running street machines running 12 and 11sec quarter mile times(in the 1990s) and if you dial both the Edelbrock and Quadrajet carbs in right you can make GOOD power and have EFI like throttle response, performance, and good drivability!! Your right, it's not the design but the people who won't crack open a book to better understand how those carbs work!
Thank you! That was a good breakdown.
Thank you Tony. I am a carburetor guy too, although rusty. Just got a car with an edelbrock on it. Don't know anything about it yet but your video makes me want to get into it.
I always liked my edelbrock carbs, biggest problem I've had with them is worn out throttle shafts. The holleys, in my experience, always seemed to last longer.
That's my biggest problem, it would go lean transitioning into the secondary and surge no matter how i jetted it. 800cfm version.
Carters are cheap and he even said so. And are for people with little understanding of carbs. Holleys are for people that know how to tune an engine . They are better built.
Another thing a holley just looks way better.
Chris Montreuil Agree 100%. But they are huge. Definitely not low profile.
Awesome info 👍 I just bought a 1982 Corvette stingray the previous owner before me had the engine rebuilt, took out the crossfire injection system and put a regular intake with this exact carb on it. I am not familiar with this set up because I'm used to fuel injection and I rely on my obd2 software to make any adjustments 😅. Just by hearing how you explain to tune it and make adjustments I can tell you had a professional shop. 👍 It's like my trade as well, I'm an HVAC technician I learned from "old school" techs they showed me tips and tricks and explain things differently then my instructor did in school! He mostly used digital gauges and electronic equipment. The techs I learned from used all old school analog gauges and regular temp probes they did tell me the new style is good but almost all new techs don't know how to read analog gauges 😅 Now I pass the knowledge to my younger brother and together we own our own business. Thanks Tony!
Wow! And that's even after you threw it around everywhere.
Yeah lol
Wow. You answered some questions I had. Classic car novice here. Really appreciate the no BS style you have. Thanks!
Oh sweet cool I have to figure out how I’m gonna get mine set it up for my Buick 350 so I appreciate this video
LunarOutlaw’s Garage keep In kind Buick’s LOVE CFMs... it’s crazy but true. I had a stock 72 BUICK GS 350 and put a 750 on it and she WOKE up big time. Can’t do it on the chevys but Buick’s go big.
SCcarguy Ever since I started this project I gained a real appreciation for Buick engines. This was originally a Buick for55 stage one but at some point over 40 years ago they switched it over whether they blew the engine up or something I don’t know. Now has a high compression 350 and SP block. But they never go out together so just trying to sort it out
Buick Olds and Pontiac are all the same they run great with a 750cfm
First off i wanted to thank you for this no nonsense explanation it was very helpful when tuning my carb on my 66 stang.
Always Welcome advice.. Thanks Always Uncle Tony.. learning is growing.. Oi oi oi..
I had an '84 Camaro that originally was a 2.8L V6 that I blew up. I swapped that dog with a 305, Holley Street Dominator intake, and a Carter AFB 625cfm. Now THAT was the sweetness! I used to shock Firebird Formulas with the TBI motors!
Ask and you shall receive! Lol! Thanks Uncle Tony. Now I'll have a guide to set mine up.
I set one up on a four wheel drive big motor application. Used the spring loaded Vinton tipped needle and seat for rough roads and off level. Stomp it and the fuel bowl would run dry. Drilled out the needle and seat to keep the bowl from running dry. Took some fiddling with the fuel level to keep it happy. Could drive it up a wall or have it so sideways you thought it would tip over and never a stumble.
I used to run one of those on a hemi 265
Damn. I love this real world advice. Seriously. I look really good on paper. My Dad taught me about the real world. This is incredibly important advice for my Sons in the future. Thank you for showing how analog devices can equal or better modern digital fuel metering devices. It’s not as clean or efficient. But it will run when electronics won’t. Under very harsh conditions. I think my Boys would be surprised how great carburetors can be. My youngest has learned a lot with my blown ‘73 ‘Vette small block. It’s not the the future, I know. But learning first principles is knowledge that is irreplaceable. I learned about IC engines watching and helping my Dad restore 1900-1910 stationary gasoline engines. We dug two of them out of dirt and dung in Omaha NE and outside of Medford OR when I was in Jr/Sr High. His “Pride and Joy” was a horizontal engine, Fairbanks Morse, that used breaking points for the spark ignition inside the cylinder using a horseshoe magneto. Usually, I was the “starter”. Holding the intake valve open by my left hand to get it up to speed with Right arm cranking was a finesse maneuver. A person cranking will quickly learn what flooded sounds and feels like. The same with lack of gas/lean. It really brings the point home if you pay attention to how the engine feels and sounds while cranking. Thanks for your videos. I pass them along to my Sons and they soak up your knowledge.
Maybe the world will go all electric. But...I don’t think so. The world’s milage may vary.
1:01 "The ultimate sweetness". No, that would be the Thermoquad. :)
the Thermoquad was a good carb love the sound when the secondary's open up
Yes I always had good service with them.
79tazman that vacuum cleaner sound lol I miss that!
@@79tazman Me, too. Kinda like storm drains.
Yes the thermoquad was a good carb, until the phenolic center warped.
I know this is an older video but you did an OUTSTANDING job explaining how this worked. I'm using the information you provided now. Thank you!
I love my Summit 600CFM carb for my 73 Mustang 302, and feel like I have it pretty well rounded out now. But for that thing, I had to buy every tuning jet, discharge restriction and secondary spring on Summit to optimize it from factory calibration, with an oxygen sensor no less. My used, $40 Edelbrock I stuck on my $400 84 F150 302? Never a flat spot or economy issue every day of the year after a couple minor adjustments. I may love the cheapo Edelbrock more.
Thanks for your opinion on these carbs, used to run Carters back in the 70's on many of my engines for the street and the avs was super! Need a change on my 87 460 ford stake body work truck from the original Holley factory carb. Do not drive this truck every day and now experiencing leaks on the Holley on the bottom half of the carb. The thing I always liked about the Carters was that the carbs are only 2 piece , top and bottom, and less prone to any leaks. I now plan to replace the Holley with the Edelbrock carb . Thanks for a great video!!
Thanks TONY very well explained!
Great info. Thank you for explaining this carb. Pulled the Holley and stuck this on my 85 360. Warm starts suck but now I understand it’s the fuel evaporation. I floor it till it starts and then quickly let off.
Always good to hear about tips for streetability, too, in an Internet often going for max dyno numbers, etc. :)
We are 4000 ft above sea level where I live. Edelbrocks are the easiest to set up for the thinner air. Since they are set to run at sea level right out of the box we always have to lean out the fuel mixture. Going two steps leaner on the jets and rods for a typical 350 cid engine works like a charm.