Steve Govea | Abraham Lincoln is a robot. As simple as that. Because the current official textbooks considered U.S. Robotics didn't exist yet during the Civil War, he isn't considered a robot. And again, Donald Trump asked the right question, why did the Civil War happened? He also secretly mentioned that some people considered to be dead by the history books, are actually still alive during the Civil War. And also D.T. is a pony in My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic. Though the pony who was based on the real Donald Trump is actually Big Mac.
I wanted to hear some interesting evidence for this claim, but you literally put forth no facts or arguments, you just said he was gay and how controversial that is.
I was Abraham Lincoln's gay lover. He was extremely gay. He wore lingerie and womens dresses. Its all here in my book at totallynotalie.com/abelovesasses
The only dismissive thing in this, possibly, is that maybe he was bisexual. So many people want to say just gay and straight, yet dismiss the b in lgbt. ;)
Even in the gay community, they don't think that its possible to be bisexual. At least some of the community believes that, I don't know about the whole community.
Caitie Robertson Really? I haven't heard that, but it crossed my mind once that that could be thought. Seems like an absurd thing to think in such a community that has been so misunderstood over the entirety of human history. A bisexual, comes out, then has to deal with the community also thinking that person is a fake. Wow. I am one and can tell everyone it is a reality ;)
also the fact that male relationships back then when much more entailment, just look up photos from the turn of the century they seem a little pardon my French but fruity,
That’s good. Because he wasn’t presenting an argument. He was simply making an assertion, and in this context there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that.
I remember a teacher once knocking this down by saying men at the time often slept in the beds of friends. Seemed like a dodgy answer then as well as now
0:15 "Not many other men... Sleep with other men" What a stupid thing to say. Putting something which happened in the 200+ years ago into todays culture. Back then it was common, VERY COMMON for individuals of the same sex to share a bed and was not anything alien. About him crying, he had some mental issues which were very well recorded.
The 21st Century: Where some sexually-repressed historian single-handedly decides that every major historical figure is gay because they didn't want to (or simply didn't have time to) rail their incredibly homely wives. Or because somebody notices a lot of boys look like women in Leonardo da Vinci or Michelangelo's portraits. No written record. No empirical evidence. Just an imposition, by the historian, of modern sexuality on someone who lived in a time hundreds, if not thousands, of years distant from today, with a completely different set of sexual idiosyncrasies. There *were* actual homosexuals throughout history. Tons of them. Many of them (like Oscar Wilde) were even considered important, or famous. And this kind of speculative, ideologically-driven revisionist claptrap dishonors and cheapens their memories in an effort to sell a book, or proselytize through sound bites.
The irony is you *also* have zero empirical evidence to support your own counter-revisionist claptrap, just speculations about some complete stranger's motives. (Btw, "Clap Trap" sounds like a great name for a brothel, doesn't it?)
Well with current estimates for the total population of gay or lesbian people being less than 4% in the USA I think it is a much safer assumption that most people are straight heterosexual individuals. Especially without any evidence to the contrary. Does that make it true for everyone no. However it does make it far more dubious to assume homosexuality applies to a man that had a wife nearly 200 years after his death.
That guy that Lincoln slept with in the white house said that Lincoln has "the greatest pair of thighs." What, a man can't sleep with another man and then make an innocent comment about how great his thighs are without perverts thinking he's gay?
Hahaha I think you have to put into context given the American culture during the 19th century, today it wouldn't be odd because people have moreso morally evolved into an equal society (plus today it would be called "bromance") lol
thebrassmonkey100 It's a joke dude... I'm pretty sure people don't sleep with their friends, that's messed up lol but thanks for looking out for all of the bro's out there.
Actually yes you can (virtually) prove the sun will come out tomorrow, but even if you couldn't that isn't remotely close to being a suitable comparison. If you are going to claim something about someone, you are going to have to show evidence. Sleeping in the same bed with a man in an era where exceptionally close male friendships were far more commonplace, and many men were used to bunking with their brothers growing up and were less likely to associate that sort of behavior with sexuality, is really weak evidence. Plus, according to many sources, Mary was a difficult person to get along with, and may have even been abusive. The fact that Lincoln did not sleep with her is really not that big of a surprise. So no, you don't know that "Lincoln was a big ole mo."
"Abraham Lincoln was gay" "What?" "Yeah, he slept with another guy" "Wow, in the butt?" "Nah they literally just slept next to each other" "...... ok?" "It was in the White House" "Awww shit - yeah he was gay no doubt"
Tripp's comments on the sexuality of Lincoln have been disputed by many credible historians and there is no definitive proof that Lincoln slept with his bodyguard in the White House . The relationship with Joshua Speed was most likely a close brotherhood . Lincoln fathered 4 children with Mary Todd , with only Robert growing to be an adult . And he had previously been engaged to Ann Ruthlidge who he seemed to have loved til his dying day , nearly going suicidal after her death . Lincoln was most likely a heterosexual man , if anything a bisexual one but there is little evidence to support such a claim , nothing but rumor and gossip . James Buchanan though, totally gay.
It's POSSIBLE but as others pointed out, this ignores bisexuality, non-sexualized male intimacy, and cultural changes. Also no one seemed to point out the mental health aspect. Mary Todd Lincoln was notorious for having advanced delusions and became more and more detached from reality over the years. It is unlikely that Mary Todd would have shared a bed with her husband during this time. In addition, many older couples who have been married for many years but suffer from health problems and/or no longer engage in sexual activity will often sleep in separate beds, even these days. What's also downplayed is Lincoln's own intense emotional and mental struggles. Vid wants to make it seem like Lincoln had an "emotional breakdown" after his close friend left, as if he was some sort of besotted teenager who "just, like, couldn't deal with life anymore" once his boyfriend left! This is an incredibly reductionist, short-sighted, immature, and frankly insulting way to interpret history! Lincoln has been described as being a very solemn and sad man, often lost in his thoughts. He may have suffered from undiagnosed depression. There are many secrets about Lincoln's life that we will probably never know. But there is currently no proof, at least in this video, to suggest that being gay was one of them.
Whether or not there is hardcore historical evidence to support this, it's still a very interesting idea. Especially to help potentially shed light on a president who is still rather enigmatic, for someone so highly revered.
Effective to what end? The civil war killed more US citizens than in WWI, WWII, the Vietnam War, and the Korean war combined. And for what reason? Not to end slavery. In fact, Lincoln stated that if he could have ended with civil war without abolishing slavery, he would have. And ironically, he utilized conscription to bolster the Union's forces. So essentially, the man not only supported slavery, but enslaved his own citizens and forced them to fight in a war that would kill 625,000 people.
The 'All men are created equal' speech you are refering to, was written by a slave owner. Slaves were considered 'property' not men or women. Slaves were on the 'stock market' board on Wall Street and therefore considered property, not people.
"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men must boogie down disco!"
Um, this guy doesn't seem to know history. James Buchanan it is suggested was our first gay President. He was the President right before Lincoln. Yes, Lincoln slept in the same bed as other men....so did Thomas Jefferson and James Madison. It is not obvious that Lincoln was gay. Historical concensus is not that Lincoln was gay nor is it trending that way. Andres, as usual, has no idea what he is talking about.
I don't know why this is so hard for people to take? Once I had looked at the evidence that was available from Lincoln's time ,it's kinda hard to miss it. In my opinion, it makes a fascinating man even more fascinating. And really, it's even harder to imagine him having a relationship with a butt crazy woman than anyone else.
Because of how shitty the proof or evidence is. It really wouldn't make sense to call someone gay in that time period when it was more than normal to sleep with a friend or hang out with one.
I'm bisexual, I don't care if someone identifies me as gay as a result. However, I wouldn't say someone who is gay who had a hetero relationship at some point is automatically 'bisexual'. Or that someone who is hetero who has had a gay relationship at some point. It's about who and what one is attracted to. That all being said, I've no idea what Lincoln was and really don't care personally.
He's not just saying Lincoln was sleeping in the same bed with another man, he's using the widely used colloquialism for sex when he said sleeping and he also said outright there was intercourse between them. And of course if you are asleep in the same bed as another man it doesn't mean you're gay, having intercourse with them does, or at least bisexual.
Sorry Andrew, but the evidence for Lincoln's homosexuality is rather thin. Now the evidence for Buchanan's homosexuality is very strong. Of course Buchanan was not someone we should be proud of.
I know this is years later, but thank you for this clip. Now the Walt Whitman poem 'When Lilacs Last in the Dooryard Bloom'd' makes so much more sense!
He's clearly imposing 21st century cultural views, about sexuality on 19th century expressions of platonic love, and friendship. I would also like to add that the term homosexual didn't even appear until after Lincoln's death.
lol, you don't know the history then. Straight was not always straight. Languages evolved.... you went so far back in time the word was different. It happens to all words. Educate yourself. Look it up, I dare you.
You guys should visit other countries...you would be shocked to see how straight men behave with each other. And yes...you would misinterpret everything.
Here you have one of the best presidents the US ever had, and people get furious in the comment section because he might have been gay. Maybe some people need to remember how important this man was? But who cares right? It doesn't matter someone is a good person if they're gay. Unbelievable.
Don't ask, don't tell...oh wait. Repress and have kids anyway...oh wait. Become a pastor of a megachurch and preach against homosexuality...oh wait. I'd like to ask honest people this: If you, hypothetically as a 24y.o. man, took in a 12 year old girl who ran away from her home ala Leon the Professional; etc. could you allow yourself to fall in love with her in a non-sexual way? Like it would hurt if something bad happened to her, a piece of you would be lost kind of way. Most people can, but an obvious breed of person can't, and everyone knows who these creepo peepo are. Being gay is a strawman used to scapegoat impulsive people into making themselves feel better. Instead of talking about the real problem, gay people are used ironically to shield people who are often closeted gay narcissists. And they say post-modernism is the end of it all... we actively shame people who aren't impulsive slobs and did many of them a huge injustice throughout history.
Nothing really to do with sexual orientation, at least directly. Lincoln, broke the constitution, killed states rights, and set the country on the opposite course towards BIG, CENTRALIZED, Controlling, SPENDTHRIFT, TYRANNICAL central government, THE OPPOSITE OF THE FOUNDERS INTENDED, and what most really thinking, productive and free people want!
Gryffix | Okay. How about this? Abraham Lincoln is a Robot with a high pitch voice and gentle outlook. Due to this, some considered him to be effeminate and even gay. Compare him also to Vladimir Putin, that some also considered to be a robot; he is also often potrayed to show a lot of photos that might be attractive to gays.
I hope he was gay, Gryffix for the same reasons you mention. This may be a bias of the opposite kind. If he liked sleeping in the same bed as men, it sounds like he may have been. Most of the people I know don't give a second thought to gayness. Here in Canada our top politicians make a point of going in the annual pride parades. This is how things should be.
"Slept in the same bed" does not mean sexually active. He had a good friend who slept in the same bed one night--which was NOT scandolous or inferential in that time in any way. It was essentially a guest bed.
It was common for women to share a bed for fellowship. It was common for men to share a bed, when necessary (camping, when beds were scarce, while travelling, etc.). But as Sullivan says it wasn't common for a man to exclude his wife from his bed in a house full of beds and take a man into it. Since you can't keep straight when Lincoln lived, I think you'd better keep humble about what you know about the sleep habits of Lincoln's times.
I love how every comment for is well thought out and interesting, while every comment against basically boils down to "Eww no... because... no... therefore... I don't want it to be true"
Lincoln was a great man not a gay man, in the old days people didn’t overreact to things like a guy holding a guys hand or sharing a bed etc.......overtime our minds have been hyper-perverted with playboy, porn, movies, music etc
You're right. We need to take it in context with the culture at the time of Lincoln. To add to the claim of the hypersexualised times we live in, the existence of "bromances" might be an attempt by us to remove that ugly taboo left by the hypersexualisation of human behaviour; to reclaim physical affection as that not of sexual nature (unless direct) but also of close friendship.
This guy is a joke. I slept in my grandfathers bed when i was a kid. By his logic that makes me gay. He gave me no points of proof or references other than saying being gay was controversial. Also before anyone else starts, the letters Lincoln wrote to Speed were over Speed's bad marriage as Lincoln perceived it. He also talks in his letters about Elysium. Lincoln was still a young man and a critical thinker, He knew that once his friend got married he would not get to see/spend as much time with him and i believe it did hurt him. He only wanted to be in good company with a like minded critical thinker IMO. I hate when stuff like this happens, people twist stuff to make it fit their own narrative.
You don't need to pretend that Abraham Lincoln was gay in order to support gay rights. Is that an okay thing to say or should I be stoned by the discrimination police?
It's really interesting how Gay people think they're perfectly normal and fine, yet they're quite interested in 'drafting' more people into their ranks. You literally cannot say that Abraham Lincoln was gay, same as the people who say Einstein was Autistic: There is simply not relevant evidence to make such a claim. I mean, If I went around saying that notable homosexuals such as Stephen Fry were actually straight, I'd be deemed as the worst person ever.
Are you claiming heterosexuals don't practice self-harm? They do, and for many of the same reasons homosexuals do: bullying at school, feeling misunderstood by their parents, feeling alone among their peers, etc. It's how society treats their sexuality that causes self-harm behavior. Children use words that they pick up from their environment, not because they inherently know it is wrong. "Gay" does not exist as a synonym for stupid in many other languages. The term is a product of our culture.
An interesting hypothesis, and I think it would be really cool if it were true, but you didn't give enough evidence. I feel like I just ate a light granola bar and rather than becoming satisfied became even more hungry and feel ripped off at how little there was.
This is rather confusing. What was the purpose of Lincoln having a wife? If he had a wife, did he even really love her then? Did she even really love him? Why not just present oneself as a straight bachelor rather than convincing a woman to marry you? Frankly, it all just seems too convoluted.
Gayness isn't an on-off switch, in that you either are or aren't. It's actually a spectrum. There are multiple levels of gayness and straightness. And it's pretty lame that people even give a shit anyway.
2:12. It actually wasn't the White House as people like to say. It was the Summer White House which was a cabin where the presidential family spent some vacations; Mary Todd and his sons didn't go this time. As far as I know, there was only one bed, and the man he shared the bed with was his body guard, which makes in seem like this may have been means of protecting the president, who had already experience threats against his life.
Teacher: Many speculate that our first homosexual president may have been Lincoln actually, based on his intimate relationship with his friends, but there was no real conclusive evidence of him being homosexu- Student: Abraham Lincoln died in a theater.
It was then common for men to share beds in a platonic context, and the fact that Lincoln withheld from no one that he'd share his bed with other men and was never deemed gay by political adversaries suggests that he was in fact straight. This video is nothing but a bit of wishful thinking and convenient omission of facts, which is totally unnecessary considering the fact that there have been plenty of great gay people throughout history.
Having read a bit about this... it seems a sketchy argument at best. From what I understand him sleeping in the same bed with Joshua Fry Speed was due to the boarding accommodations they lived in (not uncommon apparently for young men in such a position at the time). No one else who lived in the room mentioned anything sexual. Him sharing a bed with his bodyguard in the White House seems to have come from a single source and might not even be true (it's worth noting that it was about how close Lincoln and Derickson, the bodyguard, were. The whole 'they even sleep in the same bed when his wife isn't in!' seems to be stated as no more extraordinary than the fact that they travel together, leading some to interpret the comment as a joke. Given how homosexuality was viewed at the time had there been a hint of a sexual relationship I believe it would have been taken more seriously). There's no evidence Lincoln had sex with men. In fact there's more evidence he had relationships with women before Mary Todd. Also, the 'race and IQ' taboo? Hmm...
I'll say it's "controversial". Because people still believe Christopher Columbus discovered America and revere him as a hero. How about showing us evidence to solidify the substance of such a statement?
No, he wasn't. I'm all for gay rights, but Lincoln was not gay, and people claiming he was have no understanding of how men acted towards each other back then.
Actually it was very common for lodging houses to double up males in a bed, and lawyers were one of the most traveled occupations of the time. It would be weirder if Lincoln HADN'T shared many beds with men, since he was a circuit attorney for many years. Also, C.A. Tripp's original co-author quit and called Tripp a fraud - yet more evidence of the inflated nature of homosexuality claims. Honestly I would think it was great if he had been gay, but he wasn't.
Pedophilia has absolutely nothing to do with this. I sincerely doubt that a heterosexual person would "become" gay. However, people who are attracted to the same sex and find themselves within a community that will accept them for who they are will be more likely to come out. They haven't been converted, they're just willing to share their secret once they don't have to fear becoming a pariah. Homosexuality isn't a fetish, it's a term for describing the direction of one's sexuality.
If anyone in the United States in 1860 was likely to have large living quarters with multiple beds, the President would be one of them. So you're saying that bed space was so limited that Lincoln slept with a guy in his bed and his wife in another, which makes no sense even if there were only two beds, and less if you consider the house he lived in. Seriously, dude.
The idea that Lincoln was gay is ridiculous! He might have been gay, that's not the point. The point is that a lot of gay ppl have tried to claim that a lot of ppl have been gay when they didn't marry or they did but they didn't have children, etc. It's obvious that they are trying to claim something that they believe will enhance the validity of their opinion(s) & point(s) of view.
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Abraham Lincoln was a vampire hunter.
Ohmyfawk I'm weak😂😂😂😂
Steve Govea | Abraham Lincoln is a robot. As simple as that. Because the current official textbooks considered U.S. Robotics didn't exist yet during the Civil War, he isn't considered a robot.
And again, Donald Trump asked the right question, why did the Civil War happened? He also secretly mentioned that some people considered to be dead by the history books, are actually still alive during the Civil War.
And also D.T. is a pony in My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic. Though the pony who was based on the real Donald Trump is actually Big Mac.
This makes me like him even more, dragonexosaurus.
Steve Govea and a horrible President
Epic comment
I wanted to hear some interesting evidence for this claim, but you literally put forth no facts or arguments, you just said he was gay and how controversial that is.
Same here. And then he just talked about vlogging, or blogging or whatever.
I was Abraham Lincoln's gay lover. He was extremely gay. He wore lingerie and womens dresses. Its all here in my book at totallynotalie.com/abelovesasses
Even if he was sleeping with a man I’m sure he wasn’t the only one they would freeze if they slept alone
Actually there is MANNNNNY. Documentaries about him sleeping in the same bed with men , it’s been said by a few soldiers lol like do some research
He literally wrote poems and stuff about the male body
The only dismissive thing in this, possibly, is that maybe he was bisexual. So many people want to say just gay and straight, yet dismiss the b in lgbt. ;)
Even in the gay community, they don't think that its possible to be bisexual. At least some of the community believes that, I don't know about the whole community.
Caitie Robertson
Really? I haven't heard that, but it crossed my mind once that that could be thought. Seems like an absurd thing to think in such a community that has been so misunderstood over the entirety of human history. A bisexual, comes out, then has to deal with the community also thinking that person is a fake. Wow. I am one and can tell everyone it is a reality ;)
also the fact that male relationships back then when much more entailment, just look up photos from the turn of the century they seem a little pardon my French but fruity,
Bi is gay, fuck outta here. Most gay people will even say the same shit. U suck, touch, fuck another man ur gay point blank period.
Lil Sponge no maybe he’s ex was bi but left him for another girl, and that’s why he insists that bi = gay
"i think is obvious obvius the man was gay"
Not an argument. Saying an adjective over and over again does not qualify as an argument.
cope
That’s good. Because he wasn’t presenting an argument. He was simply making an assertion, and in this context there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that.
There is a difference between an argument and a speculation. This guy doesn't know that difference, I think.
I remember a teacher once knocking this down by saying men at the time often slept in the beds of friends. Seemed like a dodgy answer then as well as now
This is true currently in other countries . Male friends and also female friends do sleep together. That doesn't make any one gay
Gaybraham Lincoln
Andrei P Too far
Andrei P Too far, but i respect your freedom to say it
Daisuke H LoL
Daisuke H 🤣 Nice portmanteau!
If he slept with men while married, then he commuted adultery; he cheated on his wife for years. Is no-one gonna point that out?
lol no we’re not fucking kindergarteners to not think that 99% of married presidents didn’t have affairs
it should've been "we've already had a gay president: james buchanan" bc he was actually proven to be gay
elizabeth I think Andrew’s point was, that Lincoln was the greatest, whereas Buchanan is arguably one of the worst presidents we’ve had
@@littlehandsgivescovfefe4837 But there is *actual evidence* that Buchanan was gay instead of just modern wishful thinking from activists.
Abraham Lincoln is dead?
0:15 "Not many other men... Sleep with other men"
What a stupid thing to say. Putting something which happened in the 200+ years ago into todays culture.
Back then it was common, VERY COMMON for individuals of the same sex to share a bed and was not anything alien.
About him crying, he had some mental issues which were very well recorded.
UA-cam Comments: Where intelligence goes to die.
Seems like it started in the video.
The 21st Century: Where some sexually-repressed historian single-handedly decides that every major historical figure is gay because they didn't want to (or simply didn't have time to) rail their incredibly homely wives. Or because somebody notices a lot of boys look like women in Leonardo da Vinci or Michelangelo's portraits.
No written record. No empirical evidence.
Just an imposition, by the historian, of modern sexuality on someone who lived in a time hundreds, if not thousands, of years distant from today, with a completely different set of sexual idiosyncrasies.
There *were* actual homosexuals throughout history. Tons of them. Many of them (like Oscar Wilde) were even considered important, or famous.
And this kind of speculative, ideologically-driven revisionist claptrap dishonors and cheapens their memories in an effort to sell a book, or proselytize through sound bites.
The irony is you *also* have zero empirical evidence to support your own counter-revisionist claptrap, just speculations about some complete stranger's motives. (Btw, "Clap Trap" sounds like a great name for a brothel, doesn't it?)
Well with current estimates for the total population of gay or lesbian people being less than 4% in the USA I think it is a much safer assumption that most people are straight heterosexual individuals. Especially without any evidence to the contrary. Does that make it true for everyone no. However it does make it far more dubious to assume homosexuality applies to a man that had a wife nearly 200 years after his death.
+MorsInvicta That's a logical fallacy, try again.
I am Gay and love red headed men! Lol
Umm. Da Vinci was actually found guilty of being gay in court
That guy that Lincoln slept with in the white house said that Lincoln has "the greatest pair of thighs."
What, a man can't sleep with another man and then make an innocent comment about how great his thighs are without perverts thinking he's gay?
Hahaha I think you have to put into context given the American culture during the 19th century, today it wouldn't be odd because people have moreso morally evolved into an equal society (plus today it would be called "bromance") lol
thebrassmonkey100 It's a joke dude... I'm pretty sure people don't sleep with their friends, that's messed up lol but thanks for looking out for all of the bro's out there.
JESUS CHRIST the toxic masculinity in this comment is overflowing.
You wrote this 6 years ago.....
Youre gay now aren't you
(or don't have a girlfriend and are living in a basement)
I'm open to believing but where is the proof? The onus is on him to present irrefutable evidence.
Actually yes you can (virtually) prove the sun will come out tomorrow, but even if you couldn't that isn't remotely close to being a suitable comparison. If you are going to claim something about someone, you are going to have to show evidence. Sleeping in the same bed with a man in an era where exceptionally close male friendships were far more commonplace, and many men were used to bunking with their brothers growing up and were less likely to associate that sort of behavior with sexuality, is really weak evidence. Plus, according to many sources, Mary was a difficult person to get along with, and may have even been abusive. The fact that Lincoln did not sleep with her is really not that big of a surprise.
So no, you don't know that "Lincoln was a big ole mo."
Name one
@@bobthabuilda1525 There IS proof that the sun came out YESTERDAY, tho, stupid. Hopefully wherever you are now, you've gotten that first logic class.
"Abraham Lincoln was gay"
"What?"
"Yeah, he slept with another guy"
"Wow, in the butt?"
"Nah they literally just slept next to each other"
"...... ok?"
"It was in the White House"
"Awww shit - yeah he was gay no doubt"
Why would two guys who aren't gay sleep with one another in the White House!? Which prob. even had many guest rooms back then.
@@iihh517 Better protection, I feel better when I sleep next to someone. It makes me feel safer, I’m a bit of a scaredy cat.
No, the letters they sent to each other, you should read them...
@@RLDRemembranceDid those letters talk about their butt stuff?
show proof not rumor
Tripp's comments on the sexuality of Lincoln have been disputed by many credible historians and there is no definitive proof that Lincoln slept with his bodyguard in the White House . The relationship with Joshua Speed was most likely a close brotherhood . Lincoln fathered 4 children with Mary Todd , with only Robert growing to be an adult . And he had previously been engaged to Ann Ruthlidge who he seemed to have loved til his dying day , nearly going suicidal after her death . Lincoln was most likely a heterosexual man , if anything a bisexual one but there is little evidence to support such a claim , nothing but rumor and gossip . James Buchanan though, totally gay.
YOU DON'T KNOW MUNCH ABOUT THE BEHAVIOUR OF MEN
Wow even back in 2011 people were making assumptions about people with zero evidence.
What about James Buchanan?
He wasn't a great president :S
He wasn’t gay. He was a party goer
He did admit in a love letter to William Rufus King that he was "woo-ing" other men.
It's POSSIBLE but as others pointed out, this ignores bisexuality, non-sexualized male intimacy, and cultural changes.
Also no one seemed to point out the mental health aspect. Mary Todd Lincoln was notorious for having advanced delusions and became more and more detached from reality over the years. It is unlikely that Mary Todd would have shared a bed with her husband during this time. In addition, many older couples who have been married for many years but suffer from health problems and/or no longer engage in sexual activity will often sleep in separate beds, even these days.
What's also downplayed is Lincoln's own intense emotional and mental struggles. Vid wants to make it seem like Lincoln had an "emotional breakdown" after his close friend left, as if he was some sort of besotted teenager who "just, like, couldn't deal with life anymore" once his boyfriend left! This is an incredibly reductionist, short-sighted, immature, and frankly insulting way to interpret history! Lincoln has been described as being a very solemn and sad man, often lost in his thoughts. He may have suffered from undiagnosed depression.
There are many secrets about Lincoln's life that we will probably never know. But there is currently no proof, at least in this video, to suggest that being gay was one of them.
Lincoln loved him some logs if you get what I mean?
Lincoln literally slept in the same bed as another guy. If he’s not full on gay he’s at least bisexual or homoromantic
@@noahkohn2048 Gonna redirect you to
> non-sexualized male intimacy
Whether or not there is hardcore historical evidence to support this, it's still a very interesting idea. Especially to help potentially shed light on a president who is still rather enigmatic, for someone so highly revered.
The Three Stooges always slept together in all of their episodes.....LOL
It's true! I guess they were banging each other nightly! Bet this guy hides under the bed
Oh, shit! 😂 Don't say that! You made me laugh, and I spilled my beer. My beer!
Laurel and Hardy too.
So did the Marx Brothers . . . but then again . . . they were brothers !
💯
i don't even care if lincoln was gay he was effective at what he did which was being a lawyer/politian/president
Effective to what end? The civil war killed more US citizens than in WWI, WWII, the Vietnam War, and the Korean war combined. And for what reason? Not to end slavery. In fact, Lincoln stated that if he could have ended with civil war without abolishing slavery, he would have. And ironically, he utilized conscription to bolster the Union's forces. So essentially, the man not only supported slavery, but enslaved his own citizens and forced them to fight in a war that would kill 625,000 people.
There is a little speech about how "all men are created equal" that you should read.
That's exactly what he wants you to think...it's the whole purpose of the video...to drive home his point.
The 'All men are created equal' speech you are refering to, was written by a slave owner. Slaves were considered 'property' not men or women. Slaves were on the 'stock market' board on Wall Street and therefore considered property, not people.
And a vampire hunter
He could have been bi.
+531chaz does it make a difference
+madotsuki not against killing yourself At the time, no, it wouldn't.
Bi people are pretty gay :)
@@531chaz you're bi
He was if anything bisexual. In his journals he was truly heartbroken when his fiancee died. Borderline suicidal.
"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men must boogie down disco!"
Um, this guy doesn't seem to know history. James Buchanan it is suggested was our first gay President. He was the President right before Lincoln. Yes, Lincoln slept in the same bed as other men....so did Thomas Jefferson and James Madison. It is not obvious that Lincoln was gay. Historical concensus is not that Lincoln was gay nor is it trending that way. Andres, as usual, has no idea what he is talking about.
Lincoln was as straight as a Log...I think, I gotta do research now.
Nope
@@Bragelbro In the 5 years since I left that comment I came to that conclusion
DC BigTurbo You have a real commitment to knowledge😂
It's a belief, none of us knows for sure
Its not being gay that is a smear, its the false accusation to further his own agenda.
In Asia even today whole families sleep in one bed.
also , having nightly conversations can be an interesting thing
You didn't offer any proof. You just want him to be gay.
Still a better love story than twilight.
But guess what.....he wasn't gay. Crazy.
I don't know why this is so hard for people to take? Once I had looked at the evidence that was available from Lincoln's time ,it's kinda hard to miss it. In my opinion, it makes a fascinating man even more fascinating. And really, it's even harder to imagine him having a relationship with a butt crazy woman than anyone else.
Because of how shitty the proof or evidence is. It really wouldn't make sense to call someone gay in that time period when it was more than normal to sleep with a friend or hang out with one.
It's amazing how people are willing to twist and distort history in order to justify their own life choices.
Well...we'll never know.
Who da faq is this lincoln bloke never heard of him was he on the real housewives of Atlanta or something
+YamiGirl No, he's on Beverly Hills, do you even watch the damn show?
Olas Kazagwa Only Atlanta im afraid :(
YamiGirl He was a homosexual painter from Boston
@@yamigirl161 I'm gay
Emancipation Proclamation
I'm bisexual, I don't care if someone identifies me as gay as a result. However, I wouldn't say someone who is gay who had a hetero relationship at some point is automatically 'bisexual'. Or that someone who is hetero who has had a gay relationship at some point. It's about who and what one is attracted to. That all being said, I've no idea what Lincoln was and really don't care personally.
How did he make that question about himself?!
Jeeez. Just answer the question my self centered friend.
He's not just saying Lincoln was sleeping in the same bed with another man, he's using the widely used colloquialism for sex when he said sleeping and he also said outright there was intercourse between them. And of course if you are asleep in the same bed as another man it doesn't mean you're gay, having intercourse with them does, or at least bisexual.
Of course he was gay, why do you think he fought for the black man so much *wink wink*
Sorry Andrew, but the evidence for Lincoln's homosexuality is rather thin. Now the evidence for Buchanan's homosexuality is very strong. Of course Buchanan was not someone we should be proud of.
I know this is years later, but thank you for this clip. Now the Walt Whitman poem 'When Lilacs Last in the Dooryard Bloom'd' makes so much more sense!
Can you help it make sense to me, please? 🙏
@@jess_n_atx what even is the poem
So! It’s not any of our business. I don’t know if Lincoln was gay. Nor do I care.
He's clearly imposing 21st century cultural views, about sexuality on 19th century expressions of platonic love, and friendship. I would also like to add that the term homosexual didn't even appear until after Lincoln's death.
lol, you don't know the history then. Straight was not always straight. Languages evolved.... you went so far back in time the word was different. It happens to all words. Educate yourself. Look it up, I dare you.
Lincoln wasn't gay. It was actually common for men to sleep in the same bed together at that time.
so did people just vote down on this video because they heard something that made them uncomfortable?
Probably, but unfortunately.....thats life.
Bananasauce As a Lincoln historian it makes me uncomfortable to see how revisionist historians are distorting the facts.
Bananasauce Yes. People have a right to their opinon though, even if it's uneducated and biased.
***** interesting
Adam Rath
People are entitled to their own opinions Adam, but they aren't entitled to their own facts.
yes, he was too busy hunting vampires to toot some horn!!
You guys should visit other countries...you would be shocked to see how straight men behave with each other. And yes...you would misinterpret everything.
Robertson Abraham especially in Jamaica. Guys act gay as a joke pretty commonly.
@@alexthompson8977 If that's true how come there been a number of incidents where homosexuals were gunned down for being queer ?
@@harvey1954 fir being queer. People here still have a sense of humour you know
He had to sleep with men at times when it was necessary to keep warm
I love the sound effects of them snoring. And Moe smacking the others: wake up and go to sleep!
Actually, there are pretty good indications that James Buchanan was our first gay president (#15 to Lincoln's #16).
Here you have one of the best presidents the US ever had, and people get furious in the comment section because he might have been gay. Maybe some people need to remember how important this man was? But who cares right? It doesn't matter someone is a good person if they're gay. Unbelievable.
Don't ask, don't tell...oh wait. Repress and have kids anyway...oh wait. Become a pastor of a megachurch and preach against homosexuality...oh wait.
I'd like to ask honest people this: If you, hypothetically as a 24y.o. man, took in a 12 year old girl who ran away from her home ala Leon the Professional; etc. could you allow yourself to fall in love with her in a non-sexual way? Like it would hurt if something bad happened to her, a piece of you would be lost kind of way. Most people can, but an obvious breed of person can't, and everyone knows who these creepo peepo are.
Being gay is a strawman used to scapegoat impulsive people into making themselves feel better. Instead of talking about the real problem, gay people are used ironically to shield people who are often closeted gay narcissists. And they say post-modernism is the end of it all... we actively shame people who aren't impulsive slobs and did many of them a huge injustice throughout history.
Nothing really to do with sexual orientation, at least directly. Lincoln, broke the constitution, killed states rights, and set the country on the opposite course towards BIG, CENTRALIZED, Controlling, SPENDTHRIFT, TYRANNICAL central government, THE OPPOSITE OF THE FOUNDERS INTENDED, and what most really thinking, productive and free people want!
Maybe you should remember how important jesus was.
Gryffix | Okay. How about this? Abraham Lincoln is a Robot with a high pitch voice and gentle outlook. Due to this, some considered him to be effeminate and even gay. Compare him also to Vladimir Putin, that some also considered to be a robot; he is also often potrayed to show a lot of photos that might be attractive to gays.
I hope he was gay, Gryffix for the same reasons you mention. This may be a bias of the opposite kind. If he liked sleeping in the same bed as men, it sounds like he may have been. Most of the people I know don't give a second thought to gayness. Here in Canada our top politicians make a point of going in the annual pride parades. This is how things should be.
"Slept in the same bed" does not mean sexually active. He had a good friend who slept in the same bed one night--which was NOT scandolous or inferential in that time in any way. It was essentially a guest bed.
“Abraham Lincoln’s obviously gay, but all I have to back that up is a rumor.”
That's not a counterargument to what was brought up. Lincoln's power was limited, he did what he could with his political power.
There is probably stronger evidence that Hitler was gay
It was common for women to share a bed for fellowship. It was common for men to share a bed, when necessary (camping, when beds were scarce, while travelling, etc.). But as Sullivan says it wasn't common for a man to exclude his wife from his bed in a house full of beds and take a man into it.
Since you can't keep straight when Lincoln lived, I think you'd better keep humble about what you know about the sleep habits of Lincoln's times.
Now I get the whole "log cabin republican" term
Lincoln was the GOAT.
I love how every comment for is well thought out and interesting, while every comment against basically boils down to "Eww no... because... no... therefore... I don't want it to be true"
Lincoln was a great man not a gay man, in the old days people didn’t overreact to things like a guy holding a guys hand or sharing a bed etc.......overtime our minds have been hyper-perverted with playboy, porn, movies, music etc
You're right. We need to take it in context with the culture at the time of Lincoln.
To add to the claim of the hypersexualised times we live in, the existence of "bromances" might be an attempt by us to remove that ugly taboo left by the hypersexualisation of human behaviour; to reclaim physical affection as that not of sexual nature (unless direct) but also of close friendship.
This guy is a joke. I slept in my grandfathers bed when i was a kid. By his logic that makes me gay. He gave me no points of proof or references other than saying being gay was controversial. Also before anyone else starts, the letters Lincoln wrote to Speed were over Speed's bad marriage as Lincoln perceived it.
He also talks in his letters about Elysium. Lincoln was still a young man and a critical thinker, He knew that once his friend got married he would not get to see/spend as much time with him and i believe it did hurt him. He only wanted to be in good company with a like minded critical thinker IMO. I hate when stuff like this happens, people twist stuff to make it fit their own narrative.
oh my god, it was called the lavendar streak
You don't need to pretend that Abraham Lincoln was gay in order to support gay rights. Is that an okay thing to say or should I be stoned by the discrimination police?
It's really interesting how Gay people think they're perfectly normal and fine, yet they're quite interested in 'drafting' more people into their ranks. You literally cannot say that Abraham Lincoln was gay, same as the people who say Einstein was Autistic: There is simply not relevant evidence to make such a claim.
I mean, If I went around saying that notable homosexuals such as Stephen Fry were actually straight, I'd be deemed as the worst person ever.
No. Gay people don't want to draft people into their "ranks"...
It's actually more the opposite - heard about gay conversion therapy?
Are you claiming heterosexuals don't practice self-harm? They do, and for many of the same reasons homosexuals do: bullying at school, feeling misunderstood by their parents, feeling alone among their peers, etc. It's how society treats their sexuality that causes self-harm behavior.
Children use words that they pick up from their environment, not because they inherently know it is wrong. "Gay" does not exist as a synonym for stupid in many other languages. The term is a product of our culture.
An interesting hypothesis, and I think it would be really cool if it were true, but you didn't give enough evidence. I feel like I just ate a light granola bar and rather than becoming satisfied became even more hungry and feel ripped off at how little there was.
Even if there is evidence that Lincoln was LGBT, it would still be a leap to say that Lincoln was fully homosexual as opposed to bi or vice versa.
Thank you for posting this, Big Think! 😀
If Abraham Lincoln was married and have children, yet also had relations with men, wouldn’t that make him bisexual? 🤷🏼♀️
Abraham Lincoln. . . was not gay.
Gaybraham Lincoln was the gayest gay there ever was.
Jared Bork No. The gayest gay there ever was, was the lord of the vampires, Gayracula.
Marinanor
Count dracula ? No.
Cock blockula !
Adam Collins (tips fedora) ya really deserve it m10
If only it was that simple. He passed the 13th Amendment to end the Civil War.
Aw, look at all the homophobic republicans that down voted this video.
Wow it's almost like it's a disagree button... being used for exactly that... crazy right?
This is rather confusing.
What was the purpose of Lincoln having a wife?
If he had a wife, did he even really love her then?
Did she even really love him?
Why not just present oneself as a straight bachelor rather than convincing a woman to marry you?
Frankly, it all just seems too convoluted.
He was sleeping with his soldier because back then if you didn’t sleep with anyone you’d freeze. It’s ridiculous what people are thinking 🙄🙄
Instead of with his wife?
Gayness isn't an on-off switch, in that you either are or aren't. It's actually a spectrum. There are multiple levels of gayness and straightness. And it's pretty lame that people even give a shit anyway.
2:12. It actually wasn't the White House as people like to say. It was the Summer White House which was a cabin where the presidential family spent some vacations; Mary Todd and his sons didn't go this time. As far as I know, there was only one bed, and the man he shared the bed with was his body guard, which makes in seem like this may have been means of protecting the president, who had already experience threats against his life.
Teacher: Many speculate that our first homosexual president may have been Lincoln actually, based on his intimate relationship with his friends, but there was no real conclusive evidence of him being homosexu-
Student: Abraham Lincoln died in a theater.
It was then common for men to share beds in a platonic context, and the fact that Lincoln withheld from no one that he'd share his bed with other men and was never deemed gay by political adversaries suggests that he was in fact straight. This video is nothing but a bit of wishful thinking and convenient omission of facts, which is totally unnecessary considering the fact that there have been plenty of great gay people throughout history.
Having read a bit about this... it seems a sketchy argument at best. From what I understand him sleeping in the same bed with Joshua Fry Speed was due to the boarding accommodations they lived in (not uncommon apparently for young men in such a position at the time). No one else who lived in the room mentioned anything sexual. Him sharing a bed with his bodyguard in the White House seems to have come from a single source and might not even be true (it's worth noting that it was about how close Lincoln and Derickson, the bodyguard, were. The whole 'they even sleep in the same bed when his wife isn't in!' seems to be stated as no more extraordinary than the fact that they travel together, leading some to interpret the comment as a joke. Given how homosexuality was viewed at the time had there been a hint of a sexual relationship I believe it would have been taken more seriously). There's no evidence Lincoln had sex with men. In fact there's more evidence he had relationships with women before Mary Todd.
Also, the 'race and IQ' taboo? Hmm...
This guy wants Lincoln to be gay so bad.
I'll say it's "controversial". Because people still believe Christopher Columbus discovered America and revere him as a hero. How about showing us evidence to solidify the substance of such a statement?
He's got a kind of bald spot under his mouth on the right side of his beard, and it is bugging the crap out of me.
i told my brother that Lincoln was gay and he started to get mad at me i don't know why so now i'm in my room
It wasn't as repressed as later. It was rampant among soldiers in civil war.
No, he wasn't. I'm all for gay rights, but Lincoln was not gay, and people claiming he was have no understanding of how men acted towards each other back then.
He specifically said that for guys its wrong. I don't care if he thinks that it's hot for girls, its just that his hypocrisy makes me sad.
Two people in the same bed, not having sex, and arguing over trivial things? They weren't just gay, they were gay married.
Actually it was very common for lodging houses to double up males in a bed, and lawyers were one of the most traveled occupations of the time. It would be weirder if Lincoln HADN'T shared many beds with men, since he was a circuit attorney for many years.
Also, C.A. Tripp's original co-author quit and called Tripp a fraud - yet more evidence of the inflated nature of homosexuality claims.
Honestly I would think it was great if he had been gay, but he wasn't.
Do you seriously not realize how naive that statement is? He slept in a bed with men while his wife was elsewhere.
It's ironic that Lincoln was a Republican too. Wouldn't the GOP love that irony.
He liked men? Why does that even matter? Stupid society.
Ironically, both Abraham Lincoln and Walt Whitman were Republicans ...
Pedophilia has absolutely nothing to do with this. I sincerely doubt that a heterosexual person would "become" gay. However, people who are attracted to the same sex and find themselves within a community that will accept them for who they are will be more likely to come out. They haven't been converted, they're just willing to share their secret once they don't have to fear becoming a pariah.
Homosexuality isn't a fetish, it's a term for describing the direction of one's sexuality.
Abraham Lincoln was also racist. Another thing many people fail to mention.
If anyone in the United States in 1860 was likely to have large living quarters with multiple beds, the President would be one of them. So you're saying that bed space was so limited that Lincoln slept with a guy in his bed and his wife in another, which makes no sense even if there were only two beds, and less if you consider the house he lived in. Seriously, dude.
The idea that Lincoln was gay is ridiculous! He might have been gay, that's not the point. The point is that a lot of gay ppl have tried to claim that a lot of ppl have been gay when they didn't marry or they did but they didn't have children, etc. It's obvious that they are trying to claim something that they believe will enhance the validity of their opinion(s) & point(s) of view.