Dwell was good. But having a loose shaft in the distributor was not good enough. So we went with an HEI set up with the correct plugs. Finally, no misfire.
I actually like the points better than the HEI distributor. The HEI puts out more voltage but has to be spinning faster to get a spark. I've had 5 different engines that could start with just a bump of the starter once they had warmed up a little. All 5 had points in the distributor. I've never had an electronic distributor that would fire up the engine with just a bump from the starter. I stopped a guy from bugging me about my old 70 Dodge Coronet by firing it up just with a quick bump. One of his friends told me later that they never heard the starter. They were surprised to hear it fire up so suddenly.
That Pontiac engine brings back some sweet memories of my first certified “muscle car”. The summer between my junior and senior years in high school (August 72) I paid out the sum of $500 for a 66 GTO. The original owner had installed 400 heads on the 389, and for me it was the best car possible for a 17 year old boy. I made one small change though. It had bucket seats, no console, and I swapped the buckets for a bench seat. My girlfriend, now my wife of 48 years, wanted to sit close to me and a pillow between the seats didn’t cut it. 😁
I watched a '66 goat go from bone stock blue w/3-deuce to 4-barrel crap yellow with Cragars and air shocks... I heard it was wrecked after that. Sad to see.
First thing Nick did was checking his dyno and everything else before thinking about the ignition. Giving the previous builder every benefit of the doubt, top class!
@@mstover2809 Yeah that's what I was referring to ^^ Edit: And to the builders credit, he is exempt from blame under the same standard we give Nick. Not a badly built engine at all really.
Now that I think about it Pontiacs were a huge influence early on. Formula 400 Firebird. SD 455 TA. GTO’s were all in the neighborhood. Of course, we all hung out and worked on each other’s cars. Good memories.
That 455 though. Ridiculous power in those TA's and Firebirds. Having my head and whole body planted in the seats when my buddy romped on it is something I'll never forget. That exhaust tone resonating in my chest. And that feeling that you were cruising in one of the baddest cars on the roads is like nothing else. Good memories indeed.
In 1978 my first car was a 72 Plymouth Cuda 340 My friend had a 74 Pontiac Firebird Formula 400 he pulled up beside me on the interstate wanting to race, his Formula 400 pulled over a car length ahead of my 340 Cuda and when my car shifted In 3rd at about 95 we both had automatics the Plymouth caught the Pontiac and passed it I remember the white skipped lines on the interstate looked like a continuous white line I had 4 people in my car there was 2 in Brian’s car I wasn’t going to race but the other kids said get him and kept on but at 17 you don’t think to realize those kids lives were in your hands and now at 60 you realize the danger
Watched a video on UA-cam recently where a young man had an old Ford with cast iron intake and an new Edelbrock carb, who had issues with the heat in California cooking the gas in the aluminum carb because it was sitting on an iron intake. He put a thermal spacer in between the intake and the carb and solved the vapor lock problem.
Nick: Pontiac engines are special for me because I was "baptized" into muscle cars in a '67 Ram Air III GTO. Watching you troubleshoot the issues with this engine took me back in time to HS when me and a dear friend at the time were "trying" to tune his 318 Mopar V8. Long story short, his dad was...you (master tuner/engine builder). He let us fiddle with the car probably 2 hours before, he..appeared with screwdriver, tweaked one thing on the carburetor and she fired right up. Your a treasure trove of knowledge sir👍.
That cam is terrible compared to a more modern grind from today. The .470 lift, the 230/240 duration at .050, and the 113ish LSA is just a strange combination for a "big cam". I personally wouldn't even think of using one, UNLESS it was in a 100% correct factory show car.
I had similar problems 10 yrs ago breaking in a rebuilt 428. Had the points setup, but the later model heads called for a .070 gap plug. Engine broke up badly and wouldn't rev over 4800. Swapped in an HEI and problem solved!!!
Good evening, everybody: a good engine man can iron out issues with just about any engine he deals with. So, any time Nick encounters a problematic engine, he’s shown that he won’t be satisfied until he has figured out what’s going on and taken care of it. Nick, you are da man!!!! Great week to you all!!!!
Got one when I got out of Viet Nam, it had a 389 blew it up then my brother also a Nam Vet put a 400 in it loved it . Whish I still had it! Nam Vet, Tom
That was a fun walk down memory lane! I’ve tuned so many (70’s) engines with little to major misses and low power. All the right parts at the right time cures a lot. Great show. Nice motor, make some noise and bark some tires!
Gotta love those muscle cars Nick. Cousin had a back-yard build 68 Dart GT which we installed a 426 max wedge out of a 64 sport fury. It was like bolting 2 fenders on an engine; ran 11.11@135 first time out at Atco Raceway in Jersey. I myself had. 73 Duster with a 340. Fooled alit of people, especially after seeing a coat hanger holding on the front bumper. Most folks saw the back bumper more, lol. Keep up the good work Nick.
Nick, when I build Pontiacs I use Milodon high volume oil pumps. 100 PSI is too much. I tested multiple Melling pumps as well as others and Milodon had the right pressure and also has a thicker bottom plate.
21:17 if you know Quadra jets you know the secondary metering rod hanger and metering rods are missing, this is equivalent to leaving the secondary jets out of a Holley or Edelbrock. (he did mention this early on in the video)
GREAT VIDEO, Nick and George! I do have to say I felt a little old when Nick referred to the dwell meter as "REALLY old school". I feel like anything more recent is "new fangled". HA!!!!!
Cheers for the update George. Hi Nick I knew you would sort the Poncho out and what a nice shade of blue it is. That Cuda looked real beaut during the intro as did your Charger. Stay well and have a great week all.
Those heads are 1969 Ram Air 3 heads a real good set of factory heads that are hard to come by they got 72cc chambers with 2.11 intake with 1.77 exhaust valves that compared to my 74 455 that came factory with 4X heads that have a 98cc chambers with 2.11/1.66 valves you can see the difference between the two. The Ram Air 3 heads are the heads to get. I'm a mopar guy but I also have a love for Pontiac too
I have those 4X heads on my 78' T/A 400. I'm in the middle of this build contemplating what to do with these heads or get other good iron to make 350-400+ hp/400+tq. I'm also a MoPar guy w/69' Charger 440.
My 455 has about 65 psi cold and 40 to 45 psi hot and have never had a issue with oil pressure on mine and the engine was rebuilt back in the early 2000's
Hey Nick , really good to see an ol Pontiac 400 get tested out on your dyno . On my ol 1970 GTO with a Ram Air 400 , I ran the HEI system in it too . My oil pressure would be high to cold and then settle down was warm up . Pontiacs were cold natured , I would always let it warm up on winter days before going . I use to get up earlier in the winter months getting easy for school to let the ol girl get nice and warm up . Love watching you work in the dyno room , so much knowledge you have . Still need to do those engine books Nick 📚 ...Big Wave and Smile to all .... Hey Nick , I still have an ol Sears engine test set for the early engines and my dwell adjustment tool ....fun times back then . Nick , hope you are feeling better , take care of yourself.
It's really a crap shoot when you get an engine that was partially built by someone else and you don't know what's inside. That engine was pissy right out of the gate but Nick knew where his problem was and fixed it. Another free learning experience 😊
Hello Nick!!! Great show as usual!!! Rochester Q-jet carbs take lower fuel pressure to operate with, than the Holley and Carter carbs do... The Q-jets have smaller float assemblies than other carbs have, and often aftermarket fuel delivery pumps put iut between 7.0 to 8,5 psi ...Use an adjustable pressure regulator and turn it down to 3.0 to 4.5 psi and the engine will run fine...I did this with my 350 chevy engine in my truck and the prior problem with the flooding goes away... Today is: 10/26/24 Mike
Hi Nick it's always a pleasure to watch you in the Dino room .I enjoy it the most when you have a problem and how you work it out .That's the kind of thing you won't find in a book .
Nick, another great Dyno engine room video. I really enjoyed watching you diagnose and troubleshoot the problems on the Pontiac engine. Also, so glad your voice is coming back. 👍
A friend had a blue "68 GTO with a 400 and "slap stick" automatic shifter. Had a really nice white leather interior and the most comfortable (for 2 passengers) backseat that you could ask for.
Egads.. a dwell meter.. I haven't seen one of those in years.. I still have mine though.. in a box of old stuff up on the shelf in the garage.. This is the greatest memory sparker I have had the privilege to watch.. thanks Nick.. to old time..
I just used my old Sun 3 in 1 meter (tach/dwell/voltage) to check battery and alternator voltage on my motorcycle. Still have the Sun timing light that came with it! Probably had it for 45yrs!
Pay attention to auctions you can still find the big sun service machines come up at auction. I was late to the last one that sold for 400. Now that electronics' are cheap and reliable why not change out for better drivability though. I did in my 49 Buick and 31 Franklin
@@John-t1j2u Thanks brother.. But I had to quit working on cars about 5 years ago.. my body is just to crippled up and the pain is so great now it just kills the joy.. So I made that horrible decision.. Plus my old mind is starting to forget things I knew so well.. Getting old has it's benefits and it's detractors.. oh well, nothing I can do to make it change.. Still thanks for the heads up..
The 48 heads are 1969 high compression 72 cc heads, they are 400 ram air heads, they were advertised at 10.75 CR, the 350HO high output engine in 69 used the 48 head also but with a 68 cc chamber, advertised at 10.50 CR, the OEM head gaskets were much thinner than the replacements we use today, and many miles and wear on the valve seats sink the valves to increase the measured CC, in my opinion the compression is too high for pump gas and the ram air 4 cam grind has too much duration and to lazy for a mild street convertible GTO. A rotating crank kit to a 461cid with a dished piston would be a big increase in torque and drivability, of course the customer has to be willing go this route, others will disagree and thats fine, just my 2 cents.
I don’t know the different heads, etc. I had a 1970 Gran Prix with the 400 350 hp. Loved that car. My brother wanted it so bad after army service. Sold it to him. Wish I still had it.
I've always had a hard time getting good warm idle oil pressure from my Pontiacs. If I can get 35psi with a 60psi pump I'm usually really happy but it's usually closer to 25-30. That's with average bearing clearances and 10W40 conventional oil. My Buick buddy has 2 oil pressure gauges on his 455 Buick and the one nearest the oil pump (front) will read 30-35 hot while the rear one, farthest from the pump reads 10. But no worries, at 2500 rpm's they both read 50psi or more.
I would change the relief spring in the block to a 60 for a stock or 75psi for a built motor, you really dont want more than 75 because all that oil ends up in the top end and just creates more drag as it drains back over the cam and crank..
👍Good stuff! Love Nick’s Garage videos no matter what it is they’re doing! Watching Sir Nick do his magic is always good to take in! *Blessings to you guys!
11:53 Those headers are running awfully close to the oil filter. I didn't catch whether the customer plans to use these headers, but I would recommend stock manifolds over this setup. Cooked oil is hazardous to the health of the engine.
#48 heads are '69 4 bbl heads used on the 350 H.O., the 400 4 bbl/4 speed, the 400 Ram Air 3, both 4 speed and automatic and the 428 H.O. They are identical in casting to the 69 #62 heads that would have been stock on a 69 GTO 400/automatic but had a different valve springs to accommodate the 068 camshaft over the 067 used in automatic 4 bbl engines. They both will have 2.11/1.77 valves and approximately 72cc open chambers. Many people think they are Ram Air 3 only but they weren't.
33:10 Yes, I agree.... Many guys didn't have clue what "dwell" was, and what it did. Dwell was the amount of time that the points spend closed, between firing events, and it affects how strong of a spark was produced by the ignition coil. The old poimts ignitions actually used the coil itself as a "storage device" to build up the power that ends up at the spark plugs. The points HAD to be closed long enough so that the primary winding in the coil took in enough current, and resulted in the magnetic field in that winding becoming strong enough, to induce a large enough current in the secondary winding which produced the hi-voltage that goes to the plugs. If the primary winding didn't get to build up enough of a magnetic field to saturate due to the points opening up too early because of too short of a "dwell" time of the points being closed, the secondary winding inside the coil will no longer produce enough hi-voltage to reliably fire the spark plugs at higher RPM's and the higher cylinder pressure as a result of those RPMs. A more modern ignition system doesn't rely on the primary winding in the coil to store the charge anymore. They use electronics to do it instead. Many modern ignition systems step up the 12 volts that went to the coil in a conventional points system to several hundred volts, and then store THAT in a capacitor, and then release that much larger charge all at once into the primary winding in the coil when its time for a spark to be sent to a plug. It's a more powerful, reliable, system that results in a much stronger spark at the plugs. Some of the electronic systems even produce multiple sparks in rapid succession at the plug during each firing event, in case the first spark didn't reliably light off the a/f charge in the cylinder the first time.
It also calls for straight SAE 20 weight in winter and SAE 30 in summer until '72 when it all went 10w-40. BTW Mellings called their pumps "Standard" and it's nominally a 40 psi pump and has a small inlet pipe. and "GTO" which has a bigger pipe and a thicker gear cover and the "Super Duty" and "Ram Air IV" pump was the same pipe, an even thicker cast cover - and set for 100 psi nominal.
Nick, The #48 heads were the heads originally intended for the never-produced "350 H.O." that was slated for use in the low-cost GTO "ET" (which was changed to the high-end "Judge"). The heads, intended for the 350, had 72 cc chambers. Since the 350 H.O. was not produced, these high compression heads were re-allocated and used on the Ram Air III instead. All the other 400 heads of that same vintage, although shown as being 72 cc, are actually 75 cc's if you check them. This gets a somewhat more reasonable compression on a 400. The two heads have the same port designs and flow the same (pretty crappy in stock format). The 48 heads are more expensive because they're "Ram Air III" heads - you're paying for a name designator which means nothing in terms of performance, since both heads have the same NHRA Minimum Chamber Volume and can be milled to the same minimum thickness. I used to have a high pressure spring in my 70' 455 and it had 100 psi oil pressure. One day, the oil filter split right at the seam and the oil shot all over the header. I put a different spring in the pump and it was 60 to 70 and no more burst oil filters.
The Carousel Red 1969 GTO JUDGE that my casting # 48 were no where near 72cc. There were as advertised 66.? CC.. now after a slight Resurfacing left them a perfect 65 ccc... And with a 4speed That Judge was fast!! So when used on a 350ci. Pontiac it produced 330hp the real 350 HO ,,,
Nick, your KILLIN me here AGAIN with the Q jets. How many times have I told you a Q jet CAN NOT OPERATE AT ALL WITH OUT A FULLY SEALED AIR CLEANER ! and the other thing that is giving you problems is in the valley pan, there is no grommet for the PVC valve to the carb. Both of these things have to be addresses before you can open it up. Also, if that is a Ram Air VI cam in that 400 and you don't have the extra .100 longer valves in them heads your bottoming out the springs before you get max RPM. You MUST use the extra long Ram Air VI valves with that cam or your going to get coil bind (this is the same guy that told you to boil the 327 thermostat, so you know you can trust my opinion. ) Now, lets get into that oil pressure. If it is at 100 pounds cold (WOW! that's to much) you should never EVER drop more then 30% hot (that would be 70 pounds min.) This motor dropped to 41 pounds, that's just flat not acceptable at all. Your loosing massive oil pressure somewhere. Did you look at the rod & main bearings? Mic the crank and bore gage the rods. Did you check side clearance on the rods? More then .025 side clearance is no good. How did the cam bearings look? and how loose in the bores were the lifters? Something bad is going on with that 400s bottom end and if you don't find it now, it will return in very short order.
@@IronChief Mine broke the springs with stamped 1.5 rockers on my 1970 / 400 with 13 casting heads. I pulled the heads, bought the longer R/A 4 valves, did another valve job, set spring height and went to roller rockers to cure the problem. ( pain in the butt ! ) These Pontiacs are touchy cridders ! got to check everything.
@@IronChief Why do I think there is a coil bind issue in the valve springs, them fire balls rolling out of the exhaust that Nick checked the Dwell for are a pretty good indicator of it, to me.
That pontiac reminds me of my little brothers 66 gto rebuilt 389 with 3 duce set up really cool when the carbs workl. I remember on one of your episodes where you were working on a 440 with the 6 pack. Nic job brings back memories.
I had a 72 grand Prix with the 400. Hydraulic flat tapped Lifters clicked. Replaced them and pushrods. Still rattled. Finally after running it with STP it finally quieted down.
Who owns a GTO and says I just want a cruiser? I'd be saying "Nick, I have sweet GTO and I want to burn rubber at each and every single stop light and stop sign" lol. And I have good confidence Nick would be more than happy to build it that way!
wow. What is funny is that even a stock V6 eco boost F150 with twin turbo's will run faster then a stock 389 of 1966. Street racing a stock 389 today against 90% of even 4 door nissans is basically a loss. What was fast then is not fast now.
Typically I'll set the water valve on the dyno for 3/4 of a turn out for the cam break in, and during the process I'll vary the manual load to aid in seating the rings.
I built myself a couple of Pontiac 400's back in the 90s for the T/A's that I owned. I always enjoyed them, they were DEFINITELY torquey engines. 1 of them was a solid flat tappet cam motor, and the other was a full roller motor with a pretty big solid roller cam. I used factory 6X head castings on the smaller engine, and did an extensive port job to them. For the larger engine, I bought a new set of bare Edelbrock head castings, and then ported and built them myself. I never did have them flowed after the work was done, but the engine that they were on SURE roared and had a bunch of power. The '78 T/A that it was in ended up going mid 10's at 129mph the track with VERY limited traction due to having street tires on it. The MPH number indicated that the E.T. SHOULD have been lower IF the car would have been able to hook up better off the line. I had to ease it off the line and then bury the throttle after the 60' mark, and even then sometimes it would go up in smoke. Wasn't a very good bracket car for sure, but with the mild converter and the 3.73 gearset im the third member, it was an awesome street cruiser. One of these days, I'd like to build another Pontiac motor with the new technology that we have available today in the way of parts designs and the new materials that they're made of. I would think a motor build today would make more power than the ones I built did 30 years ago.
You know Nick when I was a young man back in the '70s whenever I tuned the motor especially on my Coronet RT I always check the dwell a couple times I use different Springs to change the the 12 angle and everything but I always checked it and people don't know that but that's pretty important I know my Dodge flew like a yeah it went good anyway that you're right not many people know to keep an eyeball on that doil for you aren't man you are the best nick no doubt
It appears to me that oil filter against the headers thinned the oil and that adjusted the pressure I'm sure it was boiling at that point anyway great show Nick
I noticed that as well.. but my thought was more of a clearance issue within the oil pump - if it ain't right, pressure will go too high, so I was taught.
@@monkeybarmonkeyman Well, if pump clearances are too much, pressure will be low. If pump clearances are too tight, the pump will seize or "self-clearance". Pressure is controlled by the relief valve spring, not the clearances.
The volume capability of the oil pump comes into play as the clearances throughout the engine add up. If there isn't enough pumping volume the pump won't build the pressure required to open the relief. High Output pumps are often needed to solve low pressure issues but you need to be careful because more volume means more load on cam and timing shaft and excess oil pushed over the pressure relief valve becomes a waste. Interesting video.
Nick Pontiac experimented with a lot of different heads back in the late 60s casting # 45 common ram air 4 heads 69!casting # 722 / 46 casting as well, big car heads 62 I believe
# 48 heads are 1969 D-port . They have 2.11 / 1.77 valves and compression ratio was 10.75 to 1 factory . Essentially a 69 Ram Air III 400 used in the GTO and Trans Am . Rated at 366 h.p. in the GTO . Ram Air IV was rated at 370 h.p. in the GTO and 335 in the Firebird . The Ram Air IV had a beefier block and bottom end and the heads were round port topped of with an aluminum intake with cast iron heat riser in the center . Also used better exhaust manifolds than the Ram Air III. I installed a 69 Ram Air III in my 77 Trans Am . Cubes is the way to go . My buddies 78 T/A with a mostly stock 455 from a 70 Bonneville was quicker with 3.42 gearing to my 3.73 . He was shifting at around 5500 rpm and I shifted at 6000 rpm with a Crane Ram Air IV T cam and comp cams 1.6 roller tip rockers and poly locks adjusted like a Chevrolet for a couple extra hundred rpm . I could go 6100 or even 6200 rpm no problem . It was first .030 over and then .060 over . Stroker is definitely the way to go today and Butler makes some stout packages . Back in the 70's it was Nunzie Ramano building awesome Pontiac power .
Owned pontiac my whole life and still have at one at 70 years old. The 48 heads were good but someone mentioned shifting s Pontiac at 6000 rpm ??? No way it would be in pcs. I had a 69 block built snd put 12 heads same as 48. I dished the pistons snd got th cr at 9.4 which is max in states either pump gas. Nothing crazy on cam and put a Holly 760 on because it was free. We dyno the crap out of this and got 360 hp snd 450 lbs torque . That motor needs some more twerking as torque is very low for s Pontiac. Remember racing on street light to light like we did 50 years ago was all about torque. That why s well tune pontiac: Oldsmobile snd Buick were e warriors. .
@@douglasduham9749 I agree, torque number is way down for a 400 pontiac. I was a huge pontiac freak, in my younger days. Who knows if that camshaft was really a factory blueprint RAIV "T" camshaft or an "equivalent." Have to watch out for some aftermarket lifter for pontiacs are really chevy lifters and could allow oil groove to become unshrouded, allowing oil psi loss. Most pontiac D port heads, (Not roundport), don't really flow much better over about .400" lift, if stock. Supposedly, the RAIV 'T" camshaft was one of the first cams designed by GM by a computer. With 1.5 rockers, will tame that cam down a bit on lift and duration. Not mentioned was if those heads had the stock bottleneck rocker arm studs, 7/16 at the bottom but necks to 3/8 at the top. Normally those bottle neck rocker studs should be replaced with straight screw in 7/16 studs, which does two things. 1. Makes the rocker stud much stronger. 2. Allows zero lash valve setting (hyd) rather than the stock jamb nut that is torqued down. A rather easy affair as most performance pontiac 4 barrel heads 67-74 had screw in studs and guideplates. Another possibility is the holley adapter lost a ton of torque adapting the factory cast iron intake, which is generally regarded as an excellent intake, even to todays standards. Would have been cool If Nick had tried the customers Q-jet, which, btw is a factory pontiac Q-jet, straight in fuel inlet and have small rectangle cut-outs in the secondary air valves to allow better fuel flow transition as the air valve flappers open up on the secondaries.
I solved my 65 Pontiac GTO problems. I put a 468 CID Big Block Chevy in the car. And that was recently. (2022). Back around 1973 I ran a L-88 Chevy engine in a 65 GTO body I bought from somebody for $150: no engine, tranny, or rear end. I took around 600 pounds off of the car, and ran 4:88 gears. Best ET was 10:26 at 131 MPH. Now you can buy factory cars, electric or combustion that will run 10's or lower.
god video , the dyno sure saves time imagine finding the problem once the engine is in the car . always best to fix before installing . decent numbers for a basic 400
Those Q-jets are a good carb but they take a bit of tinkering to get them right for a modified engine. No metering rods in the secondaries? The secondary jets are quite large, they need some metering rod in them, probably smaller than original but something.
Why wouldn't a engine builder with a engine dyno have a good quadrajet laying around for dyno purpose or even a spread bore Holley. Or a adapter for square bore holley to spread bore intake!
Hello Nick always fun to watch you having fun building and tuning engines. I have a 1976 Pontiac firebird with a 500557 thin block 400 with a basic stock rebuild. My friend owns a junkyard and I found a 400 out of a 1969 grand prix I want to build a hotter version than stock. I have a pair of bare #13 heads I will be porting with all new swirl polished valves. The block has been reconditioned and had to be bored .060 to get rid of rust. I am thinking of getting a forged lightened and balanced rotating assembly. I would like to stay with 3.75" stroke to keep its rev happy personality but the smallest crank kit is 4" stroke which makes it about a 427cid. I will be using stock intake with the plenum divider cut down about an inch with a quadrajet. My car already has a reproduction set of ram air three exhaust manifolds I think they will be good enough I'm sure they are better than the log style small ones the car came with. What is the most powerful 400 Pontiac engine you built? I don't know what cam the engine will need I will let the cylinder heads decide that after I flow them at what lift works best after porting. I would like to say again its always fun to watch you doing what you do best keep up the good work and stay safe
I used a high volume, standard pressure m54ds Melling oil pump. Doesn’t really need a high pressure pump if all the clearances is right and it’s built correct.
Ram air 3 was the standard in all the Pontiacs. Ram air 4 came with all the air duct work and optional exhaust break away. The beast motor was a dealer option installed at the dealer that was a ram air 5. I had two GTOs in my life. I've only seen one ram air 5 in my life. That was in a 69 orange GTO judge convertible in Albuquerque a small garage called purely pmd had two. The other one was going in a70 it was carousel red like mine. This was like 84. And they said clearing house in Pontiac Michigan offered them as a pair. Still in crate the 70 but I heard the 9 start up. She had power. Stirred your soul. ❤❤❤❤
Hello Nick ,George, and Krew at Nick's Garage. !!!!! Hope all yall doing well and happy . George loved the way you did the opening rolling low and fast through the shop , that was a cool view !!!!! I'm late getting in , been under the weather . But seeing the ol Pontiac 400 making some noise sure made me smile and think about those days gone by ...God Bless !!!!!
@@NicksGarage Hey Nick and George, major Fan here ...always here with yall !!!!!!!! Just been having alot going on and life getting in the way.... Thank-you for the kind words and reply ..
@@nickpanaritis4122 that all depends on what they are in. like you said try removing the starter with headers not fun .. Learned my lesson with a bad starter in a 80 Camaro the middle of the night in a parking lot. but that poncho oil filter is going to cook that close.. lol
a 400 ram air 3 with a ra4 cam and headers should top 400 hpp easily. Factory rating of 366hp was under rated and that is with factory manifolds and exhaust. 450hp should be within grasp. High 12s with the right gears in 1/4 mile about 14 or high 13s without gear change. This is my experience.
@@nickpanaritis4122 Hi Nick, the stock d port heads un-ported don't respond to much more lift than around .400". The RAIV 400 originally had special and rare round exhaust ports and intake ports that were slightly taller than the typical D port heads. The RAIV heads in 69 and 70 did benefit from the 1.65 rockers and the RAIV "T" camshaft which came out to .470" lift I/E with 1.50 ratio and .516" lift I/E using 1.65 rockers. Factory RAIV engines came with zero lash rockers arms, just like chevy, although non RAIV D port heads had bottleneck rockerstuds, 7/16 at the bottom and 3/8" at the top, with a jamb nut torqued down, not zero lash. A little trivia is the 69-70 RAIV "T" 041 camshaft was first camshaft totally computer designed by GM/ Pontiac.
Yep, if the engine doesn’t start right away or quits during the run you can wipe the cam. Can be very stressful. A lot of time and money can be flushed.
if they're non-car people, why would they understand the stress? that's like saying a person who doesn't know cardiac surgery doesn't understand the importance of doing an anastomosis correctly.
One of the most common 'mistakes*' people make with the QJ is the air valve tension. Been a couple of decades, or more, but IIRC the correct spring tension is 3/4 of a turn - if it's backed off the valve will open earlier and lift the secondary needles too much and run it rich. *AKA butchery by cretins, which may apply here as the missing needles and hanger suggest so.
@@alexbravo4572 Yeah, in that case, not much 😞 - maybe a different depression at the fuel delivery point, but that's it. I've even known people to wire the air valve wide open - some of the things people do to wreck an excellent carb' design is mind-boggling! Holleys aren't quite as good, IMO, but MUCH easier to set up to an acceptable performance level, and much harder to mess up badly.
That is not the factory Quadrajet. Pontiac engines came with a carburetor that had the fuel feed pointing straight out the front, pointing towards the radiator.
# 48 casting are 1969 Ram Air III heads with 68cc chambers yielding 10.75 to 1 compression on stock bore 400 flat top piston with 2.11" intake & 1.77" exhaust valves. Get a good carb and better distributor.
A bud had a 74 lemans GT, with a 400. Lots of torque. It would smoke the poly glass tires right off it. White buckets console, air shocks that were in need of air, every time it went into gear & the throttle hit the mat the rear end would drop & off like a herd of turtles, with smoke. Lol
Oh, that was a spread bore Holley on there. Can you tell me which on? Chevy guys usually use 6210 which is a 650 double pumper. But there are bigger 800 cfm versions (6213). And for some reason, the Holley sold vacuum secondary spread bore Holleys for Mopar applications. 7006 and 7855. These carbs go for very little at swap meets compared with 4150 carbs, but seem to be of equal quality.
Nick I have a machine shop doing my block and my buddy will install the 496 assembly what oil do you recommend for break in for a roller cam ? I told my buddy what about Ams Oil break in ..He said with this set up we can use just 10w -30...I bought the BBC 496 SCAT ROTATING ASSEMBLY WISECO FLAT TOP FORGED PISTONS 496+FT-4.280-2pc..I switched to Dome pistons the cam kit is COMP Cams K11-450-8 Magnum Hyd. Roller Camshaft Kit, Chevy 396/454
A good option is to use the original points distributor (given it is not worn) and a capacitive discharge unit. (I recommend Delta Mark 10) This doubles voltage to the plugs at about 40,000 volts using the stock coil. The points last "forever" as they pass almost no current (think of it like a starter relay) the points never burn. You'll need CDU wires (solid core Capacitive Discharge Unit wires, and can get in radio suppression type) non-resistor plugs, and gapped at .040. My former 1970 GTO has this setup, (my brother purchased and still drives) never a problem, never a misfire, runs strong,.. a strong running GTO. The distributor is curved for its Competition cam, a Ram Air IV equivalent using 1.5 rockers, very important.
Dwell was good. But having a loose shaft in the distributor was not good enough. So we went with an HEI set up with the correct plugs. Finally, no misfire.
Dr Mopar at it again 👍, and with a Pontiac to boot 🤣🇨🇦
Nick: when you say correct plugs, were the ones originally in the engine too cold or too hot?
Good show there... good choice to move to a newer dstb with HEI.
@@joeljenkins2876 ...Too hot.
I actually like the points better than the HEI distributor. The HEI puts out more voltage but has to be spinning faster to get a spark. I've had 5 different engines that could start with just a bump of the starter once they had warmed up a little. All 5 had points in the distributor. I've never had an electronic distributor that would fire up the engine with just a bump from the starter. I stopped a guy from bugging me about my old 70 Dodge Coronet by firing it up just with a quick bump. One of his friends told me later that they never heard the starter. They were surprised to hear it fire up so suddenly.
That Pontiac engine brings back some sweet memories of my first certified “muscle car”. The summer between my junior and senior years in high school (August 72) I paid out the sum of $500 for a 66 GTO. The original owner had installed 400 heads on the 389, and for me it was the best car possible for a 17 year old boy. I made one small change though. It had bucket seats, no console, and I swapped the buckets for a bench seat. My girlfriend, now my wife of 48 years, wanted to sit close to me and a pillow between the seats didn’t cut it. 😁
You had a GTO at 17, and the same wife of 48 years, God bless you, you did things right! I too had the GTO, same wife @ 33 years and counting.
I watched a '66 goat go from bone stock blue w/3-deuce to 4-barrel crap yellow with Cragars and air shocks... I heard it was wrecked after that. Sad to see.
I hope you saved the seats.
$500 in 72 equals $3,700 today!!!
I had a '66 GTO in 1974. Engine was replaced with a 400 just like this one. It was a screamer!
The intro was awesome, that Cuda....... As always a brilliant production.
Glad you liked it! Rock and roll.
@@NicksGarage We are here because we LOVE IT/and You for giving back our memories
First thing Nick did was checking his dyno and everything else before thinking about the ignition.
Giving the previous builder every benefit of the doubt, top class!
Considering Nick replaced the Cam, HE had to know the Dizzy was installed correctly. Doesn't rule out a bad dizzy though, as he found out!
@@mstover2809 Yeah that's what I was referring to ^^
Edit: And to the builders credit, he is exempt from blame under the same standard we give Nick.
Not a badly built engine at all really.
Now that I think about it Pontiacs were a huge influence early on. Formula 400 Firebird. SD 455 TA. GTO’s were all in the neighborhood. Of course, we all hung out and worked on each other’s cars. Good memories.
That 455 though. Ridiculous power in those TA's and Firebirds. Having my head and whole body planted in the seats when my buddy romped on it is something I'll never forget. That exhaust tone resonating in my chest.
And that feeling that you were cruising in one of the baddest cars on the roads is like nothing else.
Good memories indeed.
My first new car was a 74 TA sd-455. Kept it until 2000 and wish I never sold it.
In 1978 my first car was a 72 Plymouth Cuda 340 My friend had a 74 Pontiac Firebird Formula 400 he pulled up beside me on the interstate wanting to race, his Formula 400 pulled over a car length ahead of my 340 Cuda and when my car shifted In 3rd at about 95 we both had automatics the Plymouth caught the Pontiac and passed it I remember the white skipped lines on the interstate looked like a continuous white line I had 4 people in my car there was 2 in Brian’s car I wasn’t going to race but the other kids said get him and kept on but at 17 you don’t think to realize those kids lives were in your hands and now at 60 you realize the danger
Always loved that color Pontiac painted their motors 👍
I never cared for it....
Too light of a color and shows dirt and grease too easily.
Watched a video on UA-cam recently where a young man had an old Ford with cast iron intake and an new Edelbrock carb, who had issues with the heat in California cooking the gas in the aluminum carb because it was sitting on an iron intake. He put a thermal spacer in between the intake and the carb and solved the vapor lock problem.
Good to hear about young people into old iron.
Nick: Pontiac engines are special for me because I was "baptized" into muscle cars in a '67 Ram Air III GTO. Watching you troubleshoot the issues with this engine took me back in time to HS when me and a dear friend at the time were "trying" to tune his 318 Mopar V8. Long story short, his dad was...you (master tuner/engine builder). He let us fiddle with the car probably 2 hours before, he..appeared with screwdriver, tweaked one thing on the carburetor and she fired right up. Your a treasure trove of knowledge sir👍.
The RA IV cam is pretty raunchy, but it was installed with 1.65 rocker arms, so the 1.5's will tame it a little bit.
Was no point in putting big cam in it
That cam is terrible compared to a more modern grind from today.
The .470 lift, the 230/240 duration at .050, and the 113ish LSA is just a strange combination for a "big cam".
I personally wouldn't even think of using one, UNLESS it was in a 100% correct factory show car.
I had similar problems 10 yrs ago breaking in a rebuilt 428. Had the points setup, but the later model heads called for a .070 gap plug. Engine broke up badly and wouldn't rev over 4800. Swapped in an HEI and problem solved!!!
Agreed
I've never seen any early V-8 engine EVER call for a .070 plug gap... 🤨
Good evening, everybody: a good engine man can iron out issues with just about any engine he deals with. So, any time Nick encounters a problematic engine, he’s shown that he won’t be satisfied until he has figured out what’s going on and taken care of it. Nick, you are da man!!!! Great week to you all!!!!
Thank you!
Got one when I got out of Viet Nam, it had a 389 blew it up then my brother also a Nam Vet put a 400 in it loved it . Whish I still had it!
Nam Vet, Tom
That engine certainly threw out the challenges, hey Nick!
Thanks for letting me drop by, once again (three years on!)
"Come on Nick. Let's get it going." You took the words right out of my mouth. 😂 Love and respect.
That was a fun walk down memory lane! I’ve tuned so many (70’s) engines with little to major misses and low power. All the right parts at the right time cures a lot. Great show. Nice motor, make some noise and bark some tires!
Gotta love those muscle cars Nick. Cousin had a back-yard build 68 Dart GT which we installed a 426 max wedge out of a 64 sport fury. It was like bolting 2 fenders on an engine; ran 11.11@135 first time out at Atco Raceway in Jersey. I myself had. 73 Duster with a 340. Fooled alit of people, especially after seeing a coat hanger holding on the front bumper. Most folks saw the back bumper more, lol. Keep up the good work Nick.
Nick, when I build Pontiacs I use Milodon high volume oil pumps. 100 PSI is too much. I tested multiple Melling pumps as well as others and Milodon had the right pressure and also has a thicker bottom plate.
21:17 if you know Quadra jets you know the secondary metering rod hanger and metering rods are missing, this is equivalent to leaving the secondary jets out of a Holley or Edelbrock. (he did mention this early on in the video)
Yes you can see that in the video. We quadrajet people new immediately.
I did.
Plus he was using a chevy Q-jet.
He said that in the beginning of the video. That thing will never run right with no hanger or metering rods.
GREAT VIDEO, Nick and George! I do have to say I felt a little old when Nick referred to the dwell meter as "REALLY old school". I feel like anything more recent is "new fangled". HA!!!!!
Cheers for the update George. Hi Nick I knew you would sort the Poncho out and what a nice shade of blue it is. That Cuda looked real beaut during the intro as did your Charger. Stay well and have a great week all.
Thanks 👍
Those heads are 1969 Ram Air 3 heads a real good set of factory heads that are hard to come by they got 72cc chambers with 2.11 intake with 1.77 exhaust valves that compared to my 74 455 that came factory with 4X heads that have a 98cc chambers with 2.11/1.66 valves you can see the difference between the two. The Ram Air 3 heads are the heads to get. I'm a mopar guy but I also have a love for Pontiac too
I have those 4X heads on my 78' T/A 400. I'm in the middle of this build contemplating what to do with these heads or get other good iron to make 350-400+ hp/400+tq. I'm also a MoPar guy w/69' Charger 440.
My 455 has about 65 psi cold and 40 to 45 psi hot and have never had a issue with oil pressure on mine and the engine was rebuilt back in the early 2000's
Hey Nick , really good to see an ol Pontiac 400 get tested out on your dyno . On my ol 1970 GTO with a Ram Air 400 , I ran the HEI system in it too . My oil pressure would be high to cold and then settle down was warm up . Pontiacs were cold natured , I would always let it warm up on winter days before going . I use to get up earlier in the winter months getting easy for school to let the ol girl get nice and warm up . Love watching you work in the dyno room , so much knowledge you have . Still need to do those engine books Nick 📚 ...Big Wave and Smile to all .... Hey Nick , I still have an ol Sears engine test set for the early engines and my dwell adjustment tool ....fun times back then . Nick , hope you are feeling better , take care of yourself.
It's really a crap shoot when you get an engine that was partially built by someone else and you don't know what's inside. That engine was pissy right out of the gate but Nick knew where his problem was and fixed it. Another free learning experience 😊
Hello Nick!!! Great show as usual!!! Rochester Q-jet carbs take lower fuel pressure to operate with, than the Holley and Carter carbs do... The Q-jets have smaller float assemblies than other carbs have, and often aftermarket fuel delivery pumps put iut between 7.0 to 8,5 psi ...Use an adjustable pressure regulator and turn it down to 3.0 to 4.5 psi and the engine will run fine...I did this with my 350 chevy engine in my truck and the prior problem with the flooding goes away... Today is: 10/26/24 Mike
Dr. Nick, this is what the dyno is for!, and you never give up, now its go for the GTO, cheers.
Hi Nick it's always a pleasure to watch you in the Dino room .I enjoy it the most when you have a problem and how you work it out .That's the kind of thing you won't find in a book .
Nick, another great Dyno engine room video. I really enjoyed watching you diagnose and troubleshoot the problems on the Pontiac engine. Also, so glad your voice is coming back. 👍
Glad you enjoyed it!
I've never got a carb from a friend that worked right. I'll bet you lose a lot of sleep over this stuff. Keep it going Nick. Love watching you .
A friend had a blue "68 GTO with a 400 and "slap stick" automatic shifter. Had a really nice white leather interior and the most comfortable (for 2 passengers) backseat that you could ask for.
Egads.. a dwell meter.. I haven't seen one of those in years.. I still have mine though.. in a box of old stuff up on the shelf in the garage.. This is the greatest memory sparker I have had the privilege to watch.. thanks Nick.. to old time..
I just used my old Sun 3 in 1 meter (tach/dwell/voltage) to check battery and alternator voltage on my motorcycle. Still have the Sun timing light that came with it! Probably had it for 45yrs!
@@pb68slab18 Oh heck ya! I remember those I had a number of different sun machines when I had my gas station.. Great tools.. Thanks for the share PB!
Pay attention to auctions you can still find the big sun service machines come up at auction. I was late to the last one that sold for 400. Now that electronics' are cheap and reliable why not change out for better drivability though. I did in my 49 Buick and 31 Franklin
@@John-t1j2u Thanks brother.. But I had to quit working on cars about 5 years ago.. my body is just to crippled up and the pain is so great now it just kills the joy.. So I made that horrible decision.. Plus my old mind is starting to forget things I knew so well.. Getting old has it's benefits and it's detractors.. oh well, nothing I can do to make it change.. Still thanks for the heads up..
The 48 heads are 1969 high compression 72 cc heads, they are 400 ram air heads, they were advertised at 10.75 CR, the 350HO high output engine in 69 used the 48 head also but with a 68 cc chamber, advertised at 10.50 CR, the OEM head gaskets were much thinner than the replacements we use today, and many miles and wear on the valve seats sink the valves to increase the measured CC, in my opinion the compression is too high for pump gas and the ram air 4 cam grind has too much duration and to lazy for a mild street convertible GTO. A rotating crank kit to a 461cid with a dished piston would be a big increase in torque and drivability, of course the customer has to be willing go this route, others will disagree and thats fine, just my 2 cents.
All Good.
I don’t know the different heads, etc. I had a 1970 Gran Prix with the 400 350 hp. Loved that car. My brother wanted it so bad after army service. Sold it to him. Wish I still had it.
I've always had a hard time getting good warm idle oil pressure from my Pontiacs. If I can get 35psi with a 60psi pump I'm usually really happy but it's usually closer to 25-30. That's with average bearing clearances and 10W40 conventional oil. My Buick buddy has 2 oil pressure gauges on his 455 Buick and the one nearest the oil pump (front) will read 30-35 hot while the rear one, farthest from the pump reads 10. But no worries, at 2500 rpm's they both read 50psi or more.
Ram air 3 cam is a better choice for cruise!
Owner of 5 different Pontiac s
My 4,000 pound Trans Am
Ran 7.50 in the 1/8 mile, with
Full interior.
Thank you for all the pointers and assessment, of the running of the engine, all the best to yous and your loved ones
I would change the relief spring in the block to a 60 for a stock or 75psi for a built motor, you really dont want more than 75 because all that oil ends up in the top end and just creates more drag as it drains back over the cam and crank..
👍Good stuff! Love Nick’s Garage videos no matter what it is they’re doing! Watching Sir Nick do his magic is always good to take in!
*Blessings to you guys!
Thanks!
Wow! Thank you so much for your generous support, Kent. We appreciate it!
@@NicksGarage Enjoy the show , keep it up 👍
11:53 Those headers are running awfully close to the oil filter. I didn't catch whether the customer plans to use these headers, but I would recommend stock manifolds over this setup. Cooked oil is hazardous to the health of the engine.
#48 heads are '69 4 bbl heads used on the 350 H.O., the 400 4 bbl/4 speed, the 400 Ram Air 3, both 4 speed and automatic and the 428 H.O. They are identical in casting to the 69 #62 heads that would have been stock on a 69 GTO 400/automatic but had a different valve springs to accommodate the 068 camshaft over the 067 used in automatic 4 bbl engines. They both will have 2.11/1.77 valves and approximately 72cc open chambers. Many people think they are Ram Air 3 only but they weren't.
Good info thanks, I just picked up a 69 400 w/62 heads think factory rated @ 350 hp
33:10 Yes, I agree....
Many guys didn't have clue what "dwell" was, and what it did.
Dwell was the amount of time that the points spend closed, between firing events, and it affects how strong of a spark was produced by the ignition coil.
The old poimts ignitions actually used the coil itself as a "storage device" to build up the power that ends up at the spark plugs.
The points HAD to be closed long enough so that the primary winding in the coil took in enough current, and resulted in the magnetic field in that winding becoming strong enough, to induce a large enough current in the secondary winding which produced the hi-voltage that goes to the plugs.
If the primary winding didn't get to build up enough of a magnetic field to saturate due to the points opening up too early because of too short of a "dwell" time of the points being closed, the secondary winding inside the coil will no longer produce enough hi-voltage to reliably fire the spark plugs at higher RPM's and the higher cylinder pressure as a result of those RPMs.
A more modern ignition system doesn't rely on the primary winding in the coil to store the charge anymore. They use electronics to do it instead. Many modern ignition systems step up the 12 volts that went to the coil in a conventional points system to several hundred volts, and then store THAT in a capacitor, and then release that much larger charge all at once into the primary winding in the coil when its time for a spark to be sent to a plug. It's a more powerful, reliable, system that results in a much stronger spark at the plugs. Some of the electronic systems even produce multiple sparks in rapid succession at the plug during each firing event, in case the first spark didn't reliably light off the a/f charge in the cylinder the first time.
Hey Nick, check your factory manual. My '65 Pontiac shop manual calls for 35 lbs oil pressure.
Ok thanks!
It also calls for straight SAE 20 weight in winter and SAE 30 in summer until '72 when it all went 10w-40.
BTW Mellings called their pumps "Standard" and it's nominally a 40 psi pump and has a small inlet pipe.
and "GTO" which has a bigger pipe and a thicker gear cover
and the "Super Duty" and "Ram Air IV" pump was the same pipe, an even thicker cast cover - and set for 100 psi nominal.
He put a high volume pump in didnt he?
@@blucheer8743 ... No, not high volume, high pressure is what I installed.
@@nickpanaritis4122 I see
And those heads with stock length valves and spring heights will get coil bind with that camshaft!
Nick, The #48 heads were the heads originally intended for the never-produced "350 H.O." that was slated for use in the low-cost GTO "ET" (which was changed to the high-end "Judge"). The heads, intended for the 350, had 72 cc chambers. Since the 350 H.O. was not produced, these high compression heads were re-allocated and used on the Ram Air III instead.
All the other 400 heads of that same vintage, although shown as being 72 cc, are actually 75 cc's if you check them. This gets a somewhat more reasonable compression on a 400.
The two heads have the same port designs and flow the same (pretty crappy in stock format). The 48 heads are more expensive because they're "Ram Air III" heads - you're paying for a name designator which means nothing in terms of performance, since both heads have the same NHRA Minimum Chamber Volume and can be milled to the same minimum thickness. I used to have a high pressure spring in my 70' 455 and it had 100 psi oil pressure. One day, the oil filter split right at the seam and the oil shot all over the header. I put a different spring in the pump and it was 60 to 70 and no more burst oil filters.
Yeah, he was still getting over 90 PSI during the dyno tests which seems too high.
Thank you for the Info.
350HO was produced in `68 and `69. `68`s had 18 heads and `69`s had 48 heads.
One could get a 326HO in 1967.
The 350 HO was definitely produced. Look at the ‘69 firebird Ho
The Carousel Red 1969 GTO JUDGE that my casting # 48 were no where near 72cc. There were as advertised 66.? CC.. now after a slight Resurfacing left them a perfect 65 ccc... And with a 4speed That Judge was fast!! So when used on a 350ci. Pontiac it produced 330hp the real 350 HO ,,,
20:15 flame out the exhaust! Put in the video on purpose by the editor of course. Great show!
No sir. Everything you see in the video is real. No Hollywood effects here.
Back in cccccold Adelaide Australia but still tuned in for my favourite show.
Layer up and enjoy. Thanks for watching, Steve.
I am sending some parts for a 68 Hemi Charger next week to Adelaide.
Nick, your KILLIN me here AGAIN with the Q jets. How many times have I told you a Q jet CAN NOT OPERATE AT ALL WITH OUT A FULLY SEALED AIR CLEANER ! and the other thing that is giving you problems is in the valley pan, there is no grommet for the PVC valve to the carb. Both of these things have to be addresses before you can open it up. Also, if that is a Ram Air VI cam in that 400 and you don't have the extra .100 longer valves in them heads your bottoming out the springs before you get max RPM. You MUST use the extra long Ram Air VI valves with that cam or your going to get coil bind (this is the same guy that told you to boil the 327 thermostat, so you know you can trust my opinion. )
Now, lets get into that oil pressure. If it is at 100 pounds cold (WOW! that's to much) you should never EVER drop more then 30% hot (that would be 70 pounds min.) This motor dropped to 41 pounds, that's just flat not acceptable at all. Your loosing massive oil pressure somewhere. Did you look at the rod & main bearings? Mic the crank and bore gage the rods. Did you check side clearance on the rods? More then .025 side clearance is no good. How did the cam bearings look? and how loose in the bores were the lifters? Something bad is going on with that 400s bottom end and if you don't find it now, it will return in very short order.
They may be using the 1.5 rockers instead of the 1.65 which would make the springs they have okay.
@@IronChief Mine broke the springs with stamped 1.5 rockers on my 1970 / 400 with 13 casting heads. I pulled the heads, bought the longer R/A 4 valves, did another valve job, set spring height and went to roller rockers to cure the problem. ( pain in the butt ! ) These Pontiacs are touchy cridders ! got to check everything.
@@IronChief Why do I think there is a coil bind issue in the valve springs, them fire balls rolling out of the exhaust that Nick checked the Dwell for are a pretty good indicator of it, to me.
I have the 1.5 rockers on. Yes the oil pressure is high and drops when hot. There is a bleed off somewhere. Waiting on my client to see what we do.
@@nickpanaritis4122 which studs are you using? The bottleneck studs are adjusted differently than the 7/16 fully adjustable ones.
Even with the carb and ignition issues, I'm impressed with the smoothness of that Pontiac engine.
Glad to hear your voice seems to be better.
That pontiac reminds me of my little brothers 66 gto rebuilt 389 with 3 duce set up really cool when the carbs workl. I remember on one of your episodes where you were working on a 440 with the 6 pack. Nic job brings back memories.
Casting number 48 are Ram air 3 heads.
Best intro ever George, Chapeau!!
Thanks, franzzzzzzz.
I had a 72 grand Prix with the 400. Hydraulic flat tapped Lifters clicked. Replaced them and pushrods. Still rattled. Finally after running it with STP it finally quieted down.
Who owns a GTO and says I just want a cruiser? I'd be saying "Nick, I have sweet GTO and I want to burn rubber at each and every single stop light and stop sign" lol. And I have good confidence Nick would be more than happy to build it that way!
Thats what a cruiser is.....burning rubber included. Now if he is actually racing against other cars then its not a cruiser.
@@cuzz63 I can get on board with that. But everyone would be racing whether they knew it or not if it were me lol. Is that a Nova I spy in your icon?
I have a stock 389 in my 66 gto, yes it's just for cruising. I burn rubber in the 32 bantam with a 1086 hp 495 ci pontiac.
wow. What is funny is that even a stock V6 eco boost F150 with twin turbo's will run faster then a stock 389 of 1966. Street racing a stock 389 today against 90% of even 4 door nissans is basically a loss. What was fast then is not fast now.
They DID burn rubber at each and every single stop light and stop sign when they were 100% factory stock.... lol
I love the QJet carb myself. It is not as easy to tune as the Holley, but I like it better than the Holley.
Typically I'll set the water valve on the dyno for 3/4 of a turn out for the cam break in, and during the process I'll vary the manual load to aid in seating the rings.
I built myself a couple of Pontiac 400's back in the 90s for the T/A's that I owned. I always enjoyed them, they were DEFINITELY torquey engines. 1 of them was a solid flat tappet cam motor, and the other was a full roller motor with a pretty big solid roller cam. I used factory 6X head castings on the smaller engine, and did an extensive port job to them.
For the larger engine, I bought a new set of bare Edelbrock head castings, and then ported and built them myself. I never did have them flowed after the work was done, but the engine that they were on SURE roared and had a bunch of power.
The '78 T/A that it was in ended up going mid 10's at 129mph the track with VERY limited traction due to having street tires on it. The MPH number indicated that the E.T. SHOULD have been lower IF the car would have been able to hook up better off the line. I had to ease it off the line and then bury the throttle after the 60' mark, and even then sometimes it would go up in smoke. Wasn't a very good bracket car for sure, but with the mild converter and the 3.73 gearset im the third member, it was an awesome street cruiser.
One of these days, I'd like to build another Pontiac motor with the new technology that we have available today in the way of parts designs and the new materials that they're made of. I would think a motor build today would make more power than the ones I built did 30 years ago.
Wow Nick starting to think that Pontiac engines don’t like to be videoed but I knew you would figure it out can’t wait to see Engine in the GTO
I had a 72 Pontiac lemans sport. Loved that car. This video brings back good times!! Ty nick
Glad you enjoyed it.
So good to watch Nick do his thing.
Love the color Pontiac used on the block and heads. Thanks guys!
You know Nick when I was a young man back in the '70s whenever I tuned the motor especially on my Coronet RT I always check the dwell a couple times I use different Springs to change the the 12 angle and everything but I always checked it and people don't know that but that's pretty important I know my Dodge flew like a yeah it went good anyway that you're right not many people know to keep an eyeball on that doil for you aren't man you are the best nick no doubt
It appears to me that oil filter against the headers thinned the oil and that adjusted the pressure I'm sure it was boiling at that point anyway great show Nick
I noticed that as well.. but my thought was more of a clearance issue within the oil pump - if it ain't right, pressure will go too high, so I was taught.
@@monkeybarmonkeyman Well, if pump clearances are too much, pressure will be low. If pump clearances are too tight, the pump will seize or "self-clearance". Pressure is controlled by the relief valve spring, not the clearances.
@@Cougracer67 Thanks then for the correction! Never too old to learn!
The volume capability of the oil pump comes into play as the clearances throughout the engine add up. If there isn't enough pumping volume the pump won't build the pressure required to open the relief. High Output pumps are often needed to solve low pressure issues but you need to be careful because more volume means more load on cam and timing shaft and excess oil pushed over the pressure relief valve becomes a waste.
Interesting video.
Wish this guy was closer so he could do my AMC. He's seems worth every cent of whatever he charges.
Rhoads lifters would really help the engine with that RA IV cam.
Nick Pontiac experimented with a lot of different heads back in the late 60s casting # 45 common ram air 4 heads 69!casting # 722 / 46 casting as well, big car heads 62 I believe
Fun episode, enjoy the troubleshooting process..Puzzled as to why Nick didn’t go to his Holley carb sooner.
Went to a MSD and 6A box and didn't have any more miss fires
# 48 heads are 1969 D-port . They have 2.11 / 1.77 valves and compression ratio was 10.75 to 1 factory . Essentially a 69 Ram Air III 400 used in the GTO and Trans Am . Rated at 366 h.p. in the GTO . Ram Air IV was rated at 370 h.p. in the GTO and 335 in the Firebird . The Ram Air IV had a beefier block and bottom end and the heads were round port topped of with an aluminum intake with cast iron heat riser in the center . Also used better exhaust manifolds than the Ram Air III. I installed a 69 Ram Air III in my 77 Trans Am . Cubes is the way to go . My buddies 78 T/A with a mostly stock 455 from a 70 Bonneville was quicker with 3.42 gearing to my 3.73 . He was shifting at around 5500 rpm and I shifted at 6000 rpm with a Crane Ram Air IV T cam and comp cams 1.6 roller tip rockers and poly locks adjusted like a Chevrolet for a couple extra hundred rpm . I could go 6100 or even 6200 rpm no problem . It was first .030 over and then .060 over . Stroker is definitely the way to go today and Butler makes some stout packages . Back in the 70's it was Nunzie Ramano building awesome Pontiac power .
Owned pontiac my whole life and still have at one at 70 years old. The 48 heads were good but someone mentioned shifting s Pontiac at 6000 rpm ??? No way it would be in pcs. I had a 69 block built snd put 12 heads same as 48. I dished the pistons snd got th cr at 9.4 which is max in states either pump gas. Nothing crazy on cam and put a Holly 760 on because it was free. We dyno the crap out of this and got 360 hp snd 450 lbs torque . That motor needs some more twerking as torque is very low for s Pontiac. Remember racing on street light to light like we did 50 years ago was all about torque. That why s well tune pontiac: Oldsmobile snd Buick were e warriors. .
@@douglasduham9749 I agree, torque number is way down for a 400 pontiac. I was a huge pontiac freak, in my younger days. Who knows if that camshaft was really a factory blueprint RAIV "T" camshaft or an "equivalent." Have to watch out for some aftermarket lifter for pontiacs are really chevy lifters and could allow oil groove to become unshrouded, allowing oil psi loss. Most pontiac D port heads, (Not roundport), don't really flow much better over about .400" lift, if stock. Supposedly, the RAIV 'T" camshaft was one of the first cams designed by GM by a computer. With 1.5 rockers, will tame that cam down a bit on lift and duration. Not mentioned was if those heads had the stock bottleneck rocker arm studs, 7/16 at the bottom but necks to 3/8 at the top. Normally those bottle neck rocker studs should be replaced with straight screw in 7/16 studs, which does two things. 1. Makes the rocker stud much stronger. 2. Allows zero lash valve setting (hyd) rather than the stock jamb nut that is torqued down. A rather easy affair as most performance pontiac 4 barrel heads 67-74 had screw in studs and guideplates. Another possibility is the holley adapter lost a ton of torque adapting the factory cast iron intake, which is generally regarded as an excellent intake, even to todays standards. Would have been cool If Nick had tried the customers Q-jet, which, btw is a factory pontiac Q-jet, straight in fuel inlet and have small rectangle cut-outs in the secondary air valves to allow better fuel flow transition as the air valve flappers open up on the secondaries.
I solved my 65 Pontiac GTO problems. I put a 468 CID Big Block Chevy in the car. And that was recently. (2022). Back around 1973 I ran a L-88 Chevy engine in a 65 GTO body I bought from somebody for $150: no engine, tranny, or rear end. I took around 600 pounds off of the car, and ran 4:88 gears. Best ET was 10:26 at 131 MPH. Now you can buy factory cars, electric or combustion that will run 10's or lower.
Hello Nick from Texas, love what you do, and your videos are awesome. Keep those videos coming. Good job!!
god video , the dyno sure saves time imagine finding the problem once the engine is in the car . always best to fix before installing . decent numbers for a basic 400
Those Q-jets are a good carb but they take a bit of tinkering to get them right for a modified engine. No metering rods in the secondaries? The secondary jets are quite large, they need some metering rod in them, probably smaller than original but something.
Why wouldn't a engine builder with a engine dyno have a good quadrajet laying around for dyno purpose or even a spread bore Holley. Or a adapter for square bore holley to spread bore intake!
Nick wasted his time and ours messing around with a junk carb.
@@craigbenz4835 and he didnt build the engine.
Only fitted the heads.
The guts of it was done by someone else.
Hello Nick always fun to watch you having fun building and tuning engines. I have a 1976 Pontiac firebird with a 500557 thin block 400 with a basic stock rebuild. My friend owns a junkyard and I found a 400 out of a 1969 grand prix I want to build a hotter version than stock. I have a pair of bare #13 heads I will be porting with all new swirl polished valves. The block has been reconditioned and had to be bored .060 to get rid of rust. I am thinking of getting a forged lightened and balanced rotating assembly. I would like to stay with 3.75" stroke to keep its rev happy personality but the smallest crank kit is 4" stroke which makes it about a 427cid. I will be using stock intake with the plenum divider cut down about an inch with a quadrajet. My car already has a reproduction set of ram air three exhaust manifolds I think they will be good enough I'm sure they are better than the log style small ones the car came with. What is the most powerful 400 Pontiac engine you built? I don't know what cam the engine will need I will let the cylinder heads decide that after I flow them at what lift works best after porting. I would like to say again its always fun to watch you doing what you do best keep up the good work and stay safe
Brings back memories of my Fathers 67 GTO 400
I used a high volume, standard pressure m54ds Melling oil pump. Doesn’t really need a high pressure pump if all the clearances is right and it’s built correct.
Ram air 3 was the standard in all the Pontiacs. Ram air 4 came with all the air duct work and optional exhaust break away. The beast motor was a dealer option installed at the dealer that was a ram air 5. I had two GTOs in my life. I've only seen one ram air 5 in my life. That was in a 69 orange GTO judge convertible in Albuquerque a small garage called purely pmd had two. The other one was going in a70 it was carousel red like mine. This was like 84. And they said clearing house in Pontiac Michigan offered them as a pair. Still in crate the 70 but I heard the 9 start up. She had power. Stirred your soul. ❤❤❤❤
I never doubted that Nick would sort it out. That’s some great power from a 400, can’t wait to see it in the car (future video?). Thanks again!
I like the 400s , love the 455s , good show fellas 👌
Thanks for watching, Clint.
The HEI is a WINNER..!!!
Hello Nick ,George, and Krew at Nick's Garage. !!!!! Hope all yall doing well and happy . George loved the way you did the opening rolling low and fast through the shop , that was a cool view !!!!! I'm late getting in , been under the weather . But seeing the ol Pontiac 400 making some noise sure made me smile and think about those days gone by ...God Bless !!!!!
Thanks Sarge! Goad you stopped by.
@@NicksGarage Hey Nick and George, I'm a major Fan ....always here ....just life getting in the way right now ...
@@NicksGarage Hey Nick and George, major Fan here ...always here with yall !!!!!!!! Just been having alot going on and life getting in the way.... Thank-you for the kind words and reply ..
You're the master, Nick. Can't wait to see what you figure out.
Love Nicks analysis terms....10:55....."100 psi of oil pressure....oh well." 30:34....."It's even running worse......oh well."
That right header is SO close to oil filter !!!
Don't you love headers?
@@nickpanaritis4122 that all depends on what they are in. like you said try removing the starter with headers not fun .. Learned my lesson with a bad starter in a 80 Camaro the middle of the night in a parking lot. but that poncho oil filter is going to cook that close.. lol
Love watching Dr. Nick at work 💪🏻
#48 Pontiac Heads are 1969 Pontiac Ram Air III 3 Heads.
366 Hp 400 GTO and Firebird
i love this channel been around since the beginning. You can learn a lot of great information from Nick he's a genius.
I used to race a pontiac 400 in the 70s and 80s, always used a ram air 4 cam and that doesn't sound like one.
a 400 ram air 3 with a ra4 cam and headers should top 400 hpp easily. Factory rating of 366hp was under rated and that is with factory manifolds and exhaust. 450hp should be within grasp. High 12s with the right gears in 1/4 mile about 14 or high 13s without gear change. This is my experience.
Yes i agree, no lope that i can hear? An 041 cam sounds way more radical especially in a 400 cid
@@dondakota920 .. should be using 1.65 rockers for more power.
@@nickpanaritis4122 Hi Nick, the stock d port heads un-ported don't respond to much more lift than around .400". The RAIV 400 originally had special and rare round exhaust ports and intake ports that were slightly taller than the typical D port heads. The RAIV heads in 69 and 70 did benefit from the 1.65 rockers and the RAIV "T" camshaft which came out to .470" lift I/E with 1.50 ratio and .516" lift I/E using 1.65 rockers. Factory RAIV engines came with zero lash rockers arms, just like chevy, although non RAIV D port heads had bottleneck rockerstuds, 7/16 at the bottom and 3/8" at the top, with a jamb nut torqued down, not zero lash. A little trivia is the 69-70 RAIV "T" 041 camshaft was first camshaft totally computer designed by GM/ Pontiac.
@@jlh8296 ..Thank you for this info.
non car people don’t know the urgency and stress of a 20 minute cam break in, which feels like an hour 😅
Haha. Especially when Nick didn't build the engine.😉
Yep, if the engine doesn’t start right away or quits during the run you can wipe the cam. Can be very stressful. A lot of time and money can be flushed.
The reason I only install hydraulic or solid roller cams.
if they're non-car people, why would they understand the stress? that's like saying a person who doesn't know cardiac surgery doesn't understand the importance of doing an anastomosis correctly.
@@DavidMiddleton-w6x that’s the lamest analogy. Good try friend
One of the most common 'mistakes*' people make with the QJ is the air valve tension. Been a couple of decades, or more, but IIRC the correct spring tension is 3/4 of a turn - if it's backed off the valve will open earlier and lift the secondary needles too much and run it rich.
*AKA butchery by cretins, which may apply here as the missing needles and hanger suggest so.
Well, I guess adjusting the air valve tension wouldn't matter since there are no metering rods or hanger. LoL
@@alexbravo4572
Yeah, in that case, not much 😞 - maybe a different depression at the fuel delivery point, but that's it.
I've even known people to wire the air valve wide open - some of the things people do to wreck an excellent carb' design is mind-boggling!
Holleys aren't quite as good, IMO, but MUCH easier to set up to an acceptable performance level, and much harder to mess up badly.
It’s a 400 with Ram Air 4 cam but it has Ram Air 3 heads on it. Love watching Nick .
That is not the factory Quadrajet. Pontiac engines came with a carburetor that had the fuel feed pointing straight out the front, pointing towards the radiator.
Wouldn't it better to go with a standard volume oil pump? I prefer standard volume, especially for stock applications.
Hey Nick QJets are a pane to adjust.
# 48 casting are 1969 Ram Air III heads with 68cc chambers yielding 10.75 to 1 compression on stock bore 400 flat top piston with 2.11" intake & 1.77" exhaust valves. Get a good carb and better distributor.
A bud had a 74 lemans GT, with a 400. Lots of torque. It would smoke the poly glass tires right off it. White buckets console, air shocks that were in need of air, every time it went into gear & the throttle hit the mat the rear end would drop & off like a herd of turtles, with smoke. Lol
Oh, that was a spread bore Holley on there. Can you tell me which on? Chevy guys usually use 6210 which is a 650 double pumper. But there are bigger 800 cfm versions (6213). And for some reason, the Holley sold vacuum secondary spread bore Holleys for Mopar applications. 7006 and 7855.
These carbs go for very little at swap meets compared with 4150 carbs, but seem to be of equal quality.
Nick I have a machine shop doing my block and my buddy will install the 496 assembly what oil do you recommend for break in for a roller cam ? I told my buddy what about Ams Oil break in ..He said with this set up we can use just 10w -30...I bought the BBC 496 SCAT ROTATING ASSEMBLY WISECO FLAT TOP FORGED PISTONS 496+FT-4.280-2pc..I switched to Dome pistons the cam kit is COMP Cams K11-450-8 Magnum Hyd. Roller Camshaft Kit, Chevy 396/454
I had used Motul and Valvoline with Zinc additive.
A good option is to use the original points distributor (given it is not worn) and a capacitive discharge unit. (I recommend Delta Mark 10) This doubles voltage to the plugs at about 40,000 volts using the stock coil. The points last "forever" as they pass almost no current (think of it like a starter relay) the points never burn. You'll need CDU wires (solid core Capacitive Discharge Unit wires, and can get in radio suppression type) non-resistor plugs, and gapped at .040. My former 1970 GTO has this setup, (my brother purchased and still drives) never a problem, never a misfire, runs strong,.. a strong running GTO. The distributor is curved for its Competition cam, a Ram Air IV equivalent using 1.5 rockers, very important.
Had a 70 Gran Prix with the 400 engine. Sweet running engine.