Japan’s ‘lonely death’ surge among elderly
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- Опубліковано 15 тра 2024
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Japan recorded more than 17,000 “lonely deaths” among its elderly in the first three months of 2024, according to the nation’s National Police Agency. The rise in the number of senior citizens dying alone in the country highlights the challenges the government faces in tackling social isolation among older people.
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Many people have kids and still are alone in their last years.
Kids doesn't guarantee that they will take care of you. Everyone is busy with their work and earn money.
@@livliv2384this is true, which made me think twice about getting married or having children.
@@foxycon9059 kinda sad if you think about if even if your kids are busy you can always babysit your grandchildren during weekends and having a bloodline to carry on seems personally fulfilling, can't judge you if you don't think it's financially viable
And on top of what i'm saying why would you want to depend on your kids to take care of you? They are not financial investments in terms of paying off your retirement if you can't even sustain yourself normally while raising kids what kind of a parent are you?
@@ExplosiveLandmine You are 100% Correct but this was not the mindset of many traditionalist and patriarchal cultures. They are 100% wrong of course, but cultures before this modern generation viewed Children as investments, proof of bloodline and conitnuity and reserve for financial backing in old age. Glad this mindset has changed and proven to be otherwise. No Children here.
That's me. Ill be 71 in a few weeks. No family, very few friends. I'm hoping I can at least outlive my cat who's 15 now. I'm tired of this life, but I'm hanging on for him.
Just put me in your life savings lol nah stay healthy and you’ll be fine
I'm 28 but I feel your pain. I'm so sorry
Where do you live?
it is ok. float like a leaf on the river. Let it go... You live a very long life. Be happy and enjoy life.
Weird , living for a cat …
Elderly suffering lonely deaths and young generation is also suffering from suicidal deaths.
What a time to be alive
I doubt we will even be alive in 200 years.
@@Final_SC bro was an optimist, I doubt we reach 20+years
Japan is gone fr
+ declining birthrates
This is me in 30-40 years time. Apology in advance to my neighbours who going to smell my decomposing body.
Don’t worry, they will just think it’s your typical cooking!
(Jk)
So depressing
@@pushsliceBro didn't have to roast him like that😭😭💀
high five
i am with you
Having children doesn't guarantee you won't die alone. There's an epidemic of children estranged from their parents. I personally have several friends who have grown children that have done this and they don't know why! My husband and I have two adult sons (that have their own families). I love them and wouldn't want to burden them with caring for us. That's not why we had children.
Children become estranged from their parents because the parents were/are abusive (even if the parents say otherwise.)
Your friends know exactly why their kids have gone no-contact. They're just too ashamed or stubborn to admit to it.
Adults don't just ghost their parents for no reason (unless they have succumbed to their own toxic dilemmas e.g. drugs, being alienated from friends/family by controlling partners etc).
That’s not true. Children are especially given life so we aren’t lonely. That’s the whole reason we exist in the first place and make more of ourselves. As to not be alone in this plane of existence. Being out of contact with your family is what is weird.
The bond of a child to their parent(s) is one of the strongest in existence. For that bond to be willingly broken by the child, something horrific has to have taken place. As others have already said, your “friends” know exactly why their kids don’t speak to them-whether or not they consciously admit it to you or themselves.
I have kids. I will likely die alone
That’s a really sad final feeling for anyone leaving this world forever.
We all die alone not only in Japan. It's a lonely experience no matter how many people are around you.
Have you died? How would you know
My grandparents didn't die alone in Thailand....except for my grandpa on my mom side who cheated his wife for whole his life and even had a secret family. xD
Unless you die in your sleep, or are alone in life, no, it's a shared experience. It's you who are going away, but everyone suffer together.
not true, having someone you care about and care about you brings peace before death. especially knowing they are well and will live on. nobody is strong enough when they’re born, and nobody strong enough when they’re about to die
I'd much rather die with my family by my side, than being isolated and dying without anyone caring or shedding a tear. What you expressed is your perspective, but it's definitely not the majority perspective.
Sad. They've worked hard their entire life only to die a lonely death in the end😢
@@Lover-ji3je2 week old account calling a 3y old account a bot? Strange
@@randyrandom3358 ah yes. Compare their account age gap and think you have made a point in refuting his argument
Grow up some more and maybe one day you can join in the discussion
Maybe don't work all day for nothing.
We all come into this life alone and go out of it alone. Being content with yourself is literally the best thing you can ever do. You don't need anyone else to make you OK
People should routinely check homes of elder people.
This is one of the reason I’m leaving Japan this year and go back to my country I’ve been here for 20yrs working single with no kids..I don’t want to die here old and alone
Despite living for 20 years why haven't you married a Japanese women?
Don't get married & definitely don't have kids! Save everything!
@@arbaz79How are you suppose to find a women in a country where everyone have to overwork and obey their boss?
@@Dakota-xi6cg Why not get married? Why definitely not have kids? It seems to me you could be missing much in this life without family.
@@kristinab1078 "Missing out" unless the person is ready I don't think they wanna be part of a family unit, sometimes marriage and children could destroy lives, it's not as easy as you think, a divorce happens and it will ruin the kid, the wife, the husband. It's a lifelong commitment and not an easy one at that. Try thinking that for a change.
I cared for my dad up until his passing. I was there holding his hand as he passed away. It shouldn’t be any other way.
I can’t imagine about to die and not having anyone around you showing that they care and that they are with you to support on your final departure.
It breaks my heart knowing people who even have family pass away alone. Even if the family has other priorities, being with a dying loved one should be the main priority.
I totally understand.
Unfortunately sometimes things happen behind closed doors that have broken down the relationship. Like abuse, neglect or something else.
So, I'm supposed to have a kid so they can hold my hand when I die? selfish.
@@MsSarcasticity of course not. That wasn’t even insinuated in my message so I don’t know what you’re referring to, at all.
@@MsSarcasticity the real question is are you happy to die alone? Everyone deserve love from a friends/family if you doesnt need anyone beside you to help to ease your pain then youre a brave person to die alone
😰🙏💖🇬🇧
That is so sad....it happens in western countries too. Bit some elderly people have found a solution. There are groups who all live together in the same house as flat mates. They all help each other. Some have disabilities while others are fitter. They share chores and cooking etc, each doing what they can within their capabilities. Men and women share the house and all get on well. They are not lonely any more and will not die alone. This is their family now. We should be trying this everywhere.
It's called old folks home.
@@classiccasualgaming Or a nursing home. We have then in NZ not only for the elderly but for disabled people and even orphans who have nowhere else to go, especially if they are disabled or have a mental illness.
Western people are very independent one thing that i really admire but there's always conscequences just because they dont need anybody they forgot their families and the kids have their own family the parents left home alone i may not live in a rich country i can say my family helped me from my depression my culture is family oriented sometimes it's very toxic but still atleast we all need someone beside us when we die 😢 my mom is a very strong brave woman when she about to die she was so cared
This is why I don't buy the whole "You need to get married and have kids or you'll be alone when you're old" argument. There are countless things that can happen over the course of your life that leave you alone in the end, regardless of the actions you take to mitigate the possibility.
You are so right. Totally agree with you👍
Tbh as an introvert who (kinda) chooses to be a loner, I still agree with you AND that argument. It's basically saying "you need to wear a seatbelt so you don't die when you crash." Yeah wearing a seatbelt is the safety protocol known worldwide and it sure decreases your chance of dying, but you're not 100% safe and you can still die. Despite the possibility that we can still die, in the end we obviously will choose to wear a seatbelt, won't we?
But then again, human relationships are not as simple as wearing a seatbelt. That's why I choose to be alone, it's crazy complicated and I refuse to deal with it, for now.
@@sherine9033 Also, putting on a seatbelt takes almost no effort at all and there's essentially no negative consequences that come from doing so. Starting a family is a massive commitment and a nearly inevitable source of lifelong stress. People don't like to talk about it, but countless people have been destroyed as a result of starting a family.
Marriage is a way to enslave men. You are so wrong is not even funny.
That's no reason to give up and make no attempts to build a family. Your fate is in your hands alone
Its happening not only in Japan
Not only in Japan but other first world country as well
so? this video is about jp.
Explain everything. I want to know.
South korea is waving
You didn’t watch the entire video clearly. They mentioned it’s not exclusive to Japan. Smh
I was with my parents when they passed
My 2 sons dont have children and i just hope they are cared for in their final years ❤
People, get to know your neighbors...be neighborly. If you have a single elderly person in your neighborhood, go out of your way to say hello, get to know them little by little, stop in to see how they are doing from time to time, be a friend they can call if an emergency arises. This is what makes communities stronger.
It doesn't matter.
Nothing lasts, even pain/sorrow.
I will die happily. I live alone but happily without burdens.
Me too. I think people should focus more on how to live happily rather than how not to die alone.
Yessss. I prefer to pass without causing trauma to others. @@user-sc6uy1rc4j
Implying that elderly with family members aren't also dying alone
My grandma is dying soon and everyone literally cant wait for it. My dad and his siblings pretend to outsiders that we are sad and grandma is happy but even grandma herself knows the truth and probably cant wait to leave this accursed world
It's just the cold hard truth.
Just because you have a partner doesn't mean u arent lonely.
Just because you have friends doesn't mean u arent lonely.
Just because you have family members doesn't mean u arent lonely.
Live for yourself to the fullest and stop letting others and propaganda decides if you should be happy or depressed. In this case, brainwashing news like this instill on us that we should be sad if we dont have family or whatever
do you mind me asking how old are you? I find your post to be full of wisdom beyond what I suspect to be your age.
@@htth8633sarcasm
Nobody should have to die alone and what you're talking about is elder abuse. In NZ we have groups of elderly who share a house and help each other, share the chores etc, Some are disabled but do what they can within their capabilities. They are not lonely anymore, with 6 to a house and they have all kinds of social activities and outings. Nobody dies alone....they have their adopted family to care for them and mourn them.
Look into islam. It will bring your whole life into purposefullness
@@trinityz5540 I saw a documentary on Pakistan. It featured elderly men living alone on the streets, finding shelter where they could. One poor old man was living in a hollow tree trunk. There were also many orphaned children living on the streets, being preyed upon by adult men. Same in Afghanistan....
It's a regular occurrence in Singapore as well.
All Chinese looking are same .
This is even sadder when you consider that this is in Japan, where respect for elders is one of the fundamental values of their society.
Most Asian cultures value respect for elders when you think about it.
Thank you for sharing this!
#Japan
Exactly.
Japan = more drama ,reality is different
Please remember kids is not a burden. If you bring one into this world please love them no matter what the future may bring. This world is already loveless we dont need another monster.
You're either a mother or a really kind man and i respect you
We choose the life we want to live and many hate themselves to the very core. There are many who are not kind, even to themselves.
Kids are a burden for people that don't want them . Thus everyone should not have kids . The proof of that is all around us .
This does not just happen in Japan, it has been happening all over the world since the 90's from observation and hands-on.
#Medical #USA
not alone but lonely, thats what i feel from this.
watch out China, and other E and SE asia nations too..japan is what those countries will be in the future.
Japan still keeping it's stellar reputation as "the future" by being the first pioneers of societal collapse, lol
My mom's friend met an old Japanese man while working in Japan. They became friends and she would take care of him and his house whenever she's in Japan. He was too old to do it himself, and idk why, but the man's son was unable to do take care of him. The old man became an honorary grandpa to the woman's kids and there's constant communication even when my mom's friend is in our home country. During lockdown, she was so worried because she knew no one would take care of him. Last I heard, she was working on her Japanese work visa so that she can become the man's caregiver.
Japans work culture and economy makes it hard to have free time
This really touches my heart… about 6 month ago, in the early hours of the morning, I was in prayer and my thoughts were directed towards an elderly person that was Asian, dying alone. I had the feeling of being afraid come over me so I prayed for this person that they would know that someone across the world was with them through prayer and that they were not alone. It really felt as if I was right next to this person, holding their hand. I then felt peace come over me and then the person passed away. I cried with tears of compassion for this person as if I knew who they were and it felt like I was connected like family. That was an experience that I’ve never had before. I thanked the Lord for allowing me to be a part of someone’s life like that even for a moment in time. This video reminded me of that experience and I’m glad that they realize this about the “lonely deaths” and plan on making changes to help accommodate for the elderly ❤🕊️.
❤
We are seeing this also in the United States. It's a growing concern... especially amongst traditional families.
Traditional families need not be concerned
I have no words.
But in my heart.. I felt that too.. But at least.. I did take care my late father before he passed away.. While seeing his face, he smile on the deathbed.
At least he finally see his sons and daughters are meet him and taking turns to care him.
But in the end... death will apart us.
Cant believe even the Prime Minister is addressing the low birth rate of Japan. Actions speak louder than words my guy, you better start putting in policies to change the toxic work culture
There is no way that the government can "tackle" this issue. They can only mitigate it at best. As long as they pursue a neoliberal economic system and expect people act individualistically to grow the economy by pursuing jobs in the big cities, families will be fractured, and parents will be abandoned to wither in their country homes.
I have just come to realize how lonely elderly people struggle and are so alone. It is devastating.
come alone and leave alone what is so big deal unless you yet to realize the meaning of life and death ....
you dont come alone, peope are born. They dont hatch from eggs
@@1vbAPiYkYou are so dumb. We all born alone and die alone. You can't take someone with you to death. That's entitled and selfish. Just accept it.
@@1vbAPiYk yes, eric is right, people are born alone.
when you come into the world, it's just you coming into the world.
when you leave the world, it's just you leaving the world.
this is perfectly natural, no need to make a fuss about it.
@@michaelgusovsky plot twist: you are born with a parasitic twin, so technically you are not born alone or die alone
@@Me-hm6fv even in that rare circumstance, to be a human being is to be conscious, to be self-aware - our awareness is not shared with anyone.
it makes no difference if another human is born around the same time.
one's experience of coming into this existence, and departing it, is a personal experience - our thoughts, feelings, emotions, and understanding are all our own. no one else experiences it as we do.
this is what is meant by, we come in to the world alone, and depart alone.
Here's the proof. That having children or no children. You will still end up alone in your golden years. I wish people would cut the BS & face the harsh reality of getting older. Children do become adults. And as part of life we gotta work make a living & do whatever we please in our own lives. Not everybody is a saint in having the compassion & patience to take care of a person 24/7 its really tough. Esp conditions of having a serious illness (aka: cancer, dementia etc... ) In my opinion the sugarcoating gotta stop. Treat your kids better. Do not see them as money maker to get out of poverty or burdens.
As sad and depressing as this is,it is not new and successive governments have not bee able to come up with and implement effective policies
It's only a phenomenon in Japan and similar cultures because the government expects children to look after aged parents and does not support the setting up of aged care facilities. In western countries, the elderly who are not living with children are staying in aged care facilities. At least someone will know quick enough if they passed on one night.
This is happening in Spain too😢
I hope when I become an elder. Lots of computers would be developed for elders to play computer games with other elders. So I won't be lonely.
The man bowing after he closed the door on the coffin wall hit me pretty hard
Many relatives and family have become too selfish and disinterested in aging parents and family members....
Its sad to die alone and lonely. That kinda moment makes you wonder and think of your life decisions.
Gone are the days your kids will care for you when you get old. Apparently this is happening in Japan. Now I took care of my mom during her final years.
Their culture is work, work, work until you fall dead. No surprise this is happening.
What's the background music called?
It's called "a place only we know" by Sun Shapes
@@netnomad47 thank you very much my friend!
Very sad. I hope more families start loving and caring for their old . We all get old .🌎
That thumbnail is just depressing but the topic and content of this vidoe is even more so. So sad about how this is the reality
this will be us in 30-40 years
I couldn’t be there for my mom because covid only let 2 in at a time. I told my oldest brother and dad to go while I stood in the parking garage. Glad I got to be there for my dad. It was a sad but beautiful moment. And 2 days before he passed I made sure he enjoyed his final day being responsive. Wish more people could have that support 😢
Thanks to social media, this problem will only get much, Much worse, and on a global scale.
The downside of forcing your kids to leave the nest.
Maybe the kids were delinquents or rascals, partying, drinking, smoking, listening to loud music, bringing friends, girlfriends, boyfriends all the time.
@@user-lvqk2wdp8sjnthis is Japan we’re taking about , not a western country that has succumbed to the woke mafia lol
How did you ever get that idea??
A natural conclusion for those who spend their lives putting themselves first.
Or putting their employer first, as so many Japanese men were encouraged to their entire lives.
I live in China. Everything is miserable here, but no one dares to complain.
Seriously if there is next life, I wish to be born in any other country, except China.
That profile pic 😂. Winnie the Pooh silencing a woman. Be careful 😳
I woul have never thought it was this bad in China. The way you put it sounds painful. Don't give up, nothing lasts for ever, try to see a positive side on this madness.
Menurutku di negara manapun tidak ada yang baik, Amerika Serikat pun angka kelahiran menurun
What this report doesn’t mention is that these individuals are extremely conservative. They will write their own children off if they refuse to obey them. Not in small things, but regarding major life decisions like career paths. I know this because I’ve had Japanese friends (mostly exchange students) my entire life, as we were lucky enough to be host families for many years while I grew up. I still keep in touch with most of them.
This channel only shows weird stuff about Japan always.
Just weeks ago there's mass stabbing in china where 3people died and more than 23are injured nothing about it here.
Building collapse in northern china still nothing 😅😅
China is a huge country! It's by far more interesting to know how people in global Asia live. I think that's what they do as a channel.
Shut up with more of your Anti-China hate comments
If you mean to say this channel avoids bad news about China, well I have the exact OPPOSITE impression.
@@hc1897How? This channel is putting out Japanese and Korean agism, while avoiding the actual fact that China also suffers the same problem.
@@hc1897China ten years from now won't be worth a thing.
They thought killing all second children was the answer....now they realize how bad they fkd up
This is also happening in the US and everywhere else in the world, especially among the poor and homeless.
This makes me so sad
Sad hear that condolences 🙏 ☹️ 😔 😢😢respect family members
Cause japan is adopting the west culture, where the children are encourage to move out..
and sometime even forced to move out in the name of independent or self-reliant.. while it may sound nice..
in actuality, it doesn't.. from parents or spouses.. you have to be dependent on each other.. harmonize in the family..
but make no mistake.. dependent is not equal to parasitism..
That's a part of it but a larger number of Japanese people often move out of smaller cities and go to Tokyo. Then they lose ties to their parents.
Unless you’re a twin, we are all born alone and will die alone. It’s normal to be alone.
Was your mother not there?
BS.
Technically speaking, people die alone (except for those very rare cases where the concerned chose to die thru "duo euthanasia") so, perhaps, it is a misnomer to call it a lonely death. I read that it is only in death that humans (or whatever "essence" in them) finally realize they are alive. While we are living, we are busily thinking of (and doing, too) ways and means to either keep or better our lifestyle that we are hardly alive. The "lonely death" is only a PERCEPTION because we never experience actually dying and live to tell about it. In my view, passing on quietly and quickly, without drama, is the best form of dying. Who cares if the body is found later after the fact? Only the living gives a heck about it calling it "lonely" - the dead is probably happy to be liberated from the limited space that is the mortal body.
If we change our perception about death - and see it as something like the clouds turning into rain and vice versa - then no death is a lonely death. Instead, every death is just a way to give life to another life. So what's the big deal? 🤷♀️
Not only the lonely death of elderly ppl there is also an increase number of suicide rate among youngsters in both japan and s.korea
In india our 3 generations lives together
I wouldn't mind living with 3 to 5 generations of me under one roof.
@@sharinaross1865Trust me you don't want that. We lived like that for years & it was absolutely toxic & suffocating. And yes I'm Indian.
@@user-pq2cp7eu9g thank you for comment
yeah, i didn't fall for "making kids on early age" there is no guarantee your kids will take care of you when you get old and it is unlikely when you are toxic to them in their childhood days
Should there be guarantees? Those are usually based on obligations. What if the child reacted badly to those obligations that were being taught? Or what if the parents badly taught those obligations? The parents have no excuse for making the rules look oppressive, and the child has no excuse at all from keeping them.
Here in Philippines, we have very strong family bond..even if you grow old not having your own kids(making your own family) ..rest assured you will not die alone.. I'm very happy our tradition is like this because not everyone gets to have their happy endings in terms of romance.
Its sad people go like this. They should have someone to accompany them in the path to passing on. Humanity isn’t right at the moment.
Hmmm. My sad reality also.
I don't worry about dying alone. I worry more about my pets if I die and no one knows.
0:52 wow that is respectful
I mean we all die alone. No family members standing by your death bed are dying with you lol.
What is this music?
Most of our societies are youth based, and older people are often seen as unusable.
A sad reality that even poor countries don't have to face
If I live 40+ more years, this will be me
Why aren't there senior and assisted living communities? Aren't there any nursing homes?
A select group of people have made human life miserable for all.
I have a grown daughter in LA. I'm retired in Danbury, CT. My ex husband died, my elderly mother, and a sister from dementia. I have a sister in Austin TX and a brother in Wash State. I dont expect my daughter ,to take care of me. She never married.I'm on long waiting lists for senior housing now. It's quite normal to grow old by yourself. We out live people often.
Am going to grow old myself but I hope whats left of my family in the future will be there...that will leave me and my younger brother. After I and he passed away the family name will die off.
Afterlife...how quaint!!
It is you alone against this horrible world, whether you are surrounded by ppl or no ppl, make no difference, whether you leave this world as a group or not, you are still alone,
I think I’ll be dying alone as well. I can foresee my future. But then again aren’t we all going to die alone? I don’t want people surrounding me when I’m dying that’s embarrassing..
You're never really alone if you think about it you still have your family on the other side waiting for you.
南华早报是马云控股的吗？还是新加坡的官报？
Why is it occurring with people so much younger in ROK than in Japan? Human lifespan really does seem to be shortening.
this is so sad :(((
I am one of those people. I am not married because I am hiding in a cupboard.
This is gonna be pretty common going forward
If the government has a list of everyone's details, they should make it a point to visit people over a certain age. They have their addresses!
Future generations wont have this problem. We can just go through 5 decades of videogame backlog
The lan partys in those places are gonna be wild
@zevil89 what do you mean? you mean that future generations will spend 50 years of their time playing video games?
@@Parasite743 Future generations will be spending their retirement playing video games and they wont have the time to feel lonely.
@@zevil89 ahh i got it now. Thanks for responding, and you do have a point there.
My future. I have to find a way to put myselfout. I had surgery last week and they put me under and I didn't feel a thing, I simply blanked out. Had something gone wrong I'd have not felt anything. I think a Japanese lady died like that in my building. The stinch was horrible and all her furniture and belongings had to be thrown away. Now the employees of the building try to stay more in touch with the older residents.
How sad...
This had been happening since the beginning of time.
It is the saddest to think they outlived their children.
Same with me in America 🇺🇸 lonely every single day I’m 30 years old with no family or friends never been married just me and the world 🌎 alone my mom and dad and younger brother died just me now if I do end up dying a early premature death then im happy being alive living is miserable I hate my job and everything.
I'm glad that I lived in a country where poeple still care about their parents even after they already have their own family...
Era kamu akan sprti di video ini nantinya, simpan uang yg bnyk biar saat kmu tua bisa bayar suster.
Same thing in America too
My dad lives in a nursing home 3 hours away, and my family still regularly goes to visit him, to let him know he's loved. Our parents may not be our responsibility, but caring for them out of love as they cared for us, and likely as they cared for their parents out of that same love, is just the decent thing to do.
Many people were/are terribly abused by their parents. Children become estranged from their parents because the parents were/are abusive (even if the parents say otherwise.)
I don't think there will even be 5 people at my funeral so I will slip into the afterlife as a loner
I won't even have close to 5. Not even a funeral - which I don't want anyway - but maybe 3 people might miss me for a short time but they'll move on and I'll be forgotten.
Seek always to care for the elderly, whomever they may be. Try to check in on them, especially if you see they don’t have family that frequently visits.
Been alone most of our adult life. We are happier even given this inevitability.
There is also Hikokimori in Japan.
Will maybe if Japan stop having their taxes so high and stop making their own people work so hard the new generation will have time to get merry have a family and take care of the elderly.
It’s their own fault with taxes so high and making their own young generation work so much they don’t have the time to want a family or take care of the elderly. It’s their own fault 😡
They have always been this way. The used to send the elderly to homes, not for care, but to die. They got very little care, and not medical care at all. So this does not surprise me.
Not happening in the current yen crash and the highest debt country. If they stop now, their future generation will suffer, Japanese work hard now to avoid misery upon their future generation
A handful are working as digital nomads in Thailand and Vietnam.
they can do both hard work and children
Different cultures with Chinese and Thailand. They are respect for parents.
How many female infants were murdered during the one child policy, so much for the respect for life.
@@georgeacun3619 lol one child policy was barely enforced
@@georgeacun3619 his comment said respect for PARENTS, not respect for babies
@@BuzzKirill3D China troll
Chinese culture and CCP mandates are two different things. Get educated
Don’t associate lonely and alone as two of the same.