Casinos LOVE card counters. They can shut them down any time they want to, but still get massive benefits from the buzz about them. They're some of the best free worldwide advertising the casinos could hope for. The buzz around card counting sends flocks of people into the casino who not only suck at card counting, but who have massive leaks that cause them to blow any winnings they get at blackjack by sitting down at other tables and giving it all back.
I have a photographic memory. I can read a book and recite pages years later. When I was in my early 20s, I learned to count cards. The books say to look for single/double decks. I like the 4/6 deck shoes because when the odds go positive, they can go very positive. Counting is possible but you need a great memory and you must be able to handle distractions. The problem is that the extreme mental concentration takes its toll on you. If you cannot detect that, you will start to make mistakes and lose. And yes, I was asked to leave casinos. They were very polite but got their point across. How many can do successful card counting, not many. Only a few will worry casinos. I still can but I do not bother when I play today as I would rather have fun than work my axx off. Knowing the odds and proper play for each hand is enough to play for hours without losing much.
The cost of card counting at this moment may be low, but one could argue that if the casinos did tolerate card counting it would become much more widespread and costs would increase.
Unlikely. The fact is that not many people have the ability to play blackjack perfectly and count cards in the head with that much precision. My guess would be that the majority of people who try to count cards do it wrong and end up losing even more money as a result. When that consultant said that only about 200 people in the country are really card counters, he meant that that's about the number of people who can do it well enough to make any money at all. There are probably tens of thousands of people who try to count cards, but don't do it correctly and so are never even detected because no pit boss will ever notice someone who is losing at blackjack.
There is an example this is false. Before beat the dealer, the most profitable game in American casinos was craps. After people read the book the casinos made a killing. If casino culture was to offer a fair deal and welcomed pros, they would again hit another gold rush.
There are no laws against card counting and most casinos like you to try because once you start gambling you most likely wont stop until you lose all of your money. Now there are laws against using some form of device but there are no laws against using your brain. Even with card counting the odds are still in the favor of the house.
The casinos would just switch over to shuffle machines that start with a fresh deck every time, eliminating card counting completely. There are a lot of laughable falsehoods in this video, but the bit about the supposed slowdown from automated reshuffling machines was the biggest technologically illiterate misstatement of all.
@@davidbelk46 Based on anecdotal experience, I feel that estimate of 200 active, successful card counters is extremely low. After playing just over 18 months myself, mostly in just one local market that isn't known as a gambling mecca, I've spotted literally dozens of other truly skilled players at the table. Consider also the number of active participants on all the online forums, BJA in particular. Some of those are wannabes, to be sure, but more than enough are real AP's with proven track records. Extrapolating from that, I'd guess the true number is at least an order of magnitude higher. Still not enough to make a real dent in the overall profitablity of the casino industry, but not the rarest of species either.
The house edge in blackjack isn't mathematical it's alcohol. Around 1990 I wrote a blackjack program for the Mac which trained you in how to play with optimal strategy as well as by card counting. I called up every casino in Las Vegas and Atlantic City and got their house rules, number of decks and most importantly surrender rules. I ran simulations on all of them. For the most part the house edge was between.5 and 1% but there was one old casino in Atlantic City where the surrender rules were so generous that the player had a .5% advantage. Those odds aren't enough for casinos to make much money. What changes the equation are mistakes by the players. Mistakes are very costly to the players and because most people don't know what they are doing mistakes are common. To help the process along it was the practice of casinos to provide free drinks as long as you were playing, don't know if that's still true but it was back then. Playing correctly requires a lot of concentration, it's very difficult for an amateur even when sober, impossible when drunk.
My God, they stopped giving free drinks decades ago. The only people the casino offers free drinks to are people dropping lots of money. The average player has to pay for drinks.
Even with the best rules, most card counters do not have the bankroll to withstand the variance and will go broke. Disciplined teams with huge bankrolls are dangerous, however casinos can detect and ban them with ease with all the communication and software detection technology available. Casinos do get away with 6-5 blackjack rules only because the general population has been so dumbed down, so no longer have to worry about losing any revenue at blackjack.
Funny story. Several years ago I was tired and decided to cash in my $200 in blackjack winnings. As I was leaving the table, the pit boss suddenly appeared and accused me of leaving and quitting. I was tired, annoyed and thought, Hell, Why Not. So I played the $200, won, and cashed in the $400 while the dealer smirked and the other players rolled their eyes.
There is a lot of merit to your story - I too have had situation where I walked away a winner after playing for only a few minutes. Pit bosses usually give you a dirty look when you do this.
Of course the house wins. Otherwise there would be no casinos to go to. All those big floors, fancy decors, free drinks, comped stuff are paid for by gamblers' losses. where else could it come from?
When I was in college, the head basketball coach was Bill Frieder. He said he was banned from several Vegas casinos, including Ceaser's and the Vegas Hilton, because he counted cards.
Apparently card counting does work, from what I've read. Which is a problem for casinos and the political entities that they reside in. Politicians like gambling and gamblers as they might squeeze casinos some high percentage to pay the taxes for politicians. Politicians in bed with the owners of casinos. So politicians can get more easily elected.
A Man for All Markets, Thorpe E. 2017. Hes' the definitive authority, and his initial counting adventure nearly cost him his life. His life journey from college professor, counter and later hedge fund manager is a page turner.
I often wondered about the legality of dragging people into the backroom. What I didn't realize is that the casinos are stupid and chase pennies. I don't much care for casinos anyway. Back in the old days when they were strictly about money laundering and I could get cheap and awesome buffets....yup, I would go there, rent a hotel room, go to a show or two, and throw a few hundred dollars onto the floor. Now I don't even bother going any more. It's not worth it.
I barley graduated high shool. I have been in dozens of casinos. I never walked out with less. I never play more that $20 with the gift the give. Casinos love me I have trouble adding 2+2. Casinos want you to play their game. You should play yours.
I wonder how it will be affected by new wearable to technologies, like the Meta Glasses, where instead of actually counting cards you can keep track of the cards themselves and simply alert you when the deck is hot and give you an actual probability of winning a given hand
Using a computer or mechanical device to gain advantage is illegal from what I have heard. My guess is if they catch you doing that you would get at least banned and probably charged.
That is cheating as using devices are not allowed and could actually get you arrested with a felony charge. The only item that is permitted is using your brain to do the counting and with the decks being shuffled after each hand counting cards is pointless as counting only works when less cards that are in the deck.
this is the issue that made me lose all respect for casinos. they can use completely broken odds as much as they want as long as theyre consistent but if they cant handle the shoe on the other foot, they become hypocritical and invalid.
You need to take at least 10 000 dollars with you to the casino and be prepared to place seriously high bets if your time counting cards is to be worth it. I tried card counting and was quite good at it for a beginner. But I always had only a couple of 100 dollars with me and never made more than 50 dollars in a whole evening.
Use to count in the 90’s & was successful. I’m good with numbers. I got kick out of a number of casinos & was even in the Griffin Book but was never threaten with violence. If asked to leave don’t feign innocence-just leave. It was easier then. It’s almost impossible now with facial recognition. I got the idea from a segment on 60 Minutes then I bought Bryce Carlson’s book on Blackjack. I was so practiced at counting a double deck & I could cut the deck exactly in 2 every time!!
The only game worth playing is craps with no side bets. Playing come/don't will give you the closest to an even game (plus you can't rig craps as the house since people can play the don'ts)
I disagree. If you have some skill poker could make you some money. You just have to be willing to walk away from the table if you find there is a better player than you at the table.
I've been banned by a dozen online casinos and blacklisted at all the others. They know I'm an advantage player and win consistently playing online blackjack. If an online casino see's that you are adjusting your bets, YOU ARE BANNED! YOU ARE BANNED. Also, why do online casinos even offer games like blackjack online when it's far easier to count cards or keep track of your play with a piece of paper?
My tale starts with all low cards in the first four hands ... I quadrupled my bet on the spot ... boy did that draw the pit bosses' attention ... I could feel them breathing down my neck ... but they let me win, and win I did ... even the dealer said something halfway through the shoe ... I kept my _fool_ mouth shut, so it was just me building up red chips is all ... I think that's why the house let it happen ...
So they use a continuous shuffle machine. That eliminates all shuffle time. All casinos need to do is half shoe a card counter and he or she will leave.
It really doesn't work anymore: the edge on card counting with a small number of decks is only a percent or two, and the disasterous results for everyone (Dealer hit soft 17, Blackjack pays 6-5) have trashed any value of counting cards. Turned blackack into Faro.
I have not seen 6-5 blackjack at medium to high stakes tables. I see 6-5 at low stakes. I didn't think that anyone playing $25 or above, would tolerate 6-5. Is the game changing THAT bad?
Its not illegal. Its simply a way to keep track of the game and up your bets when YOU have the advantage. Its called being an advantage player. However, they want people to drink, talk, not to keep track of the game... or how you're betting. in other words, they just want suckers to throw their money away. They dont like people that use strategy. They'd like you to play aimlessly.
Every shoe is different. Many hover around 0, some go negative and stay that way, others jump extremely high for a period. As the host said, it's a volume proposition. Card counters wait patiently for the positive counts and hammer the advantage when it appears. It's true that the number of cards played before a shuffle drastically affects the efficacy of card counting. This is part of what the piece is about - the casinos that shuffle early to deter card counters waste time by shuffling more often, which sacrifices more revenue from the 99% of players playing without an edge.
Take 1,000 people and give them detailed instruction on how to count cards. How many will really learn? Maybe 200. Out of those 200 how many will be able to have the discipline to do it over the many hours needed? Maybe 100. Now how many can also have the discipline to have very good money management and risk control skills? Maybe 50. Now how many can resist the free drinks from the very sexy women coming around now every 5 min? So basically you have a teeny tiny itsy bitsy number out of the 1,000 that can actually do card counting as their professional job. The actuality is that professional gambling is a repetitive, mostly boring and certainly NOT glamorous occupation. Meanwhile, the lure that it is even possible creates tons and tons of people (called "the suckers") to come in and play and lose.
Card counting will only slow down how fast you will lose all of your money it wont stop or reverse it. The only way to win against a casino is not to start gambling in the first place.
The casino can reshuffle the deck at any time let me repeat that they can reshuffle the deck at any time for this reason alone you can never win ever did I have fun card counting yes but they can reshuffle and do at any time
Casinos love selling books about card counting. They make amateurs over confident and then fail miserably while trying.
Casinos LOVE card counters. They can shut them down any time they want to, but still get massive benefits from the buzz about them. They're some of the best free worldwide advertising the casinos could hope for. The buzz around card counting sends flocks of people into the casino who not only suck at card counting, but who have massive leaks that cause them to blow any winnings they get at blackjack by sitting down at other tables and giving it all back.
The important question is how much casinos cost America, and the fools that visit them.
Could say about all gambling (and you'd still be right). The marketing ASSAULT on the public for sports betting and online casinos is mind-boggling.
I have a photographic memory. I can read a book and recite pages years later. When I was in my early 20s, I learned to count cards. The books say to look for single/double decks. I like the 4/6 deck shoes because when the odds go positive, they can go very positive. Counting is possible but you need a great memory and you must be able to handle distractions. The problem is that the extreme mental concentration takes its toll on you. If you cannot detect that, you will start to make mistakes and lose. And yes, I was asked to leave casinos. They were very polite but got their point across. How many can do successful card counting, not many. Only a few will worry casinos. I still can but I do not bother when I play today as I would rather have fun than work my axx off. Knowing the odds and proper play for each hand is enough to play for hours without losing much.
Totally agree!!
My lengthier comment is above.
The cost of card counting at this moment may be low, but one could argue that if the casinos did tolerate card counting it would become much more widespread and costs would increase.
Unlikely. The fact is that not many people have the ability to play blackjack perfectly and count cards in the head with that much precision. My guess would be that the majority of people who try to count cards do it wrong and end up losing even more money as a result. When that consultant said that only about 200 people in the country are really card counters, he meant that that's about the number of people who can do it well enough to make any money at all. There are probably tens of thousands of people who try to count cards, but don't do it correctly and so are never even detected because no pit boss will ever notice someone who is losing at blackjack.
There is an example this is false.
Before beat the dealer, the most profitable game in American casinos was craps. After people read the book the casinos made a killing. If casino culture was to offer a fair deal and welcomed pros, they would again hit another gold rush.
There are no laws against card counting and most casinos like you to try because once you start gambling you most likely wont stop until you lose all of your money.
Now there are laws against using some form of device but there are no laws against using your brain. Even with card counting the odds are still in the favor of the house.
The casinos would just switch over to shuffle machines that start with a fresh deck every time, eliminating card counting completely. There are a lot of laughable falsehoods in this video, but the bit about the supposed slowdown from automated reshuffling machines was the biggest technologically illiterate misstatement of all.
@@davidbelk46 Based on anecdotal experience, I feel that estimate of 200 active, successful card counters is extremely low. After playing just over 18 months myself, mostly in just one local market that isn't known as a gambling mecca, I've spotted literally dozens of other truly skilled players at the table. Consider also the number of active participants on all the online forums, BJA in particular. Some of those are wannabes, to be sure, but more than enough are real AP's with proven track records. Extrapolating from that, I'd guess the true number is at least an order of magnitude higher. Still not enough to make a real dent in the overall profitablity of the casino industry, but not the rarest of species either.
The house edge in blackjack isn't mathematical it's alcohol. Around 1990 I wrote a blackjack program for the Mac which trained you in how to play with optimal strategy as well as by card counting. I called up every casino in Las Vegas and Atlantic City and got their house rules, number of decks and most importantly surrender rules. I ran simulations on all of them. For the most part the house edge was between.5 and 1% but there was one old casino in Atlantic City where the surrender rules were so generous that the player had a .5% advantage. Those odds aren't enough for casinos to make much money. What changes the equation are mistakes by the players. Mistakes are very costly to the players and because most people don't know what they are doing mistakes are common. To help the process along it was the practice of casinos to provide free drinks as long as you were playing, don't know if that's still true but it was back then. Playing correctly requires a lot of concentration, it's very difficult for an amateur even when sober, impossible when drunk.
They're still in business, so yes they're still using all the tactics.
My God, they stopped giving free drinks decades ago. The only people the casino offers free drinks to are people dropping lots of money. The average player has to pay for drinks.
Even with the best rules, most card counters do not have the bankroll to withstand the variance and will go broke. Disciplined teams with huge bankrolls are dangerous, however casinos can detect and ban them with ease with all the communication and software detection technology available. Casinos do get away with 6-5 blackjack rules only because the general population has been so dumbed down, so no longer have to worry about losing any revenue at blackjack.
I worked in table games for 15 years. It’s not hard to catch them and they’re asked to leave immediately.
Funny story. Several years ago I was tired and decided to cash in my $200 in blackjack winnings. As I was leaving the table, the pit boss suddenly appeared and accused me of leaving and quitting. I was tired, annoyed and thought, Hell, Why Not. So I played the $200, won, and cashed in the $400 while the dealer smirked and the other players rolled their eyes.
There is a lot of merit to your story - I too have had situation where I walked away a winner after playing for only a few minutes. Pit bosses usually give you a dirty look when you do this.
Of course the house wins. Otherwise there would be no casinos to go to. All those big floors, fancy decors, free drinks, comped stuff are paid for by gamblers' losses. where else could it come from?
When I was in college, the head basketball coach was Bill Frieder. He said he was banned from several Vegas casinos, including Ceaser's and the Vegas Hilton, because he counted cards.
Gambling is the hardest easy money ever.
Apparently card counting does work, from what I've read. Which is a problem for casinos and the political entities that they reside in. Politicians like gambling and gamblers as they might squeeze casinos some high percentage to pay the taxes for politicians. Politicians in bed with the owners of casinos. So politicians can get more easily elected.
Seems like you would want people to card count. Most people are going to practice at home, and loose their shirt…
A Man for All Markets, Thorpe E. 2017. Hes' the definitive authority, and his initial counting adventure nearly cost him his life. His life journey from college professor, counter and later hedge fund manager is a page turner.
I often wondered about the legality of dragging people into the backroom. What I didn't realize is that the casinos are stupid and chase pennies.
I don't much care for casinos anyway.
Back in the old days when they were strictly about money laundering and I could get cheap and awesome buffets....yup, I would go there, rent a hotel room, go to a show or two, and throw a few hundred dollars onto the floor. Now I don't even bother going any more. It's not worth it.
I barley graduated high shool. I have been in dozens of casinos. I never walked out with less. I never play more that $20 with the gift the give. Casinos love me I have trouble adding 2+2.
Casinos want you to play their game. You should play yours.
You can count cards without actively counting out loud. Discreetly, and turn a small profit, and move on. More difficult with four decks, but doable.
I wonder how it will be affected by new wearable to technologies, like the Meta Glasses, where instead of actually counting cards you can keep track of the cards themselves and simply alert you when the deck is hot and give you an actual probability of winning a given hand
Using a computer or mechanical device to gain advantage is illegal from what I have heard. My guess is if they catch you doing that you would get at least banned and probably charged.
That is cheating as using devices are not allowed and could actually get you arrested with a felony charge. The only item that is permitted is using your brain to do the counting and with the decks being shuffled after each hand counting cards is pointless as counting only works when less cards that are in the deck.
@@billmankin6204 How would they know if you are playing online 21? They can't see what you're doing to keep track of the cards?
this is the issue that made me lose all respect for casinos. they can use completely broken odds as much as they want as long as theyre consistent but if they cant handle the shoe on the other foot, they become hypocritical and invalid.
You need to take at least 10 000 dollars with you to the casino and be prepared to place seriously high bets if your time counting cards is to be worth it. I tried card counting and was quite good at it for a beginner. But I always had only a couple of 100 dollars with me and never made more than 50 dollars in a whole evening.
Use to count in the 90’s & was successful. I’m good with numbers. I got kick out of a number of casinos & was even in the Griffin Book but was never threaten with violence. If asked to leave don’t feign innocence-just leave. It was easier then. It’s almost impossible now with facial recognition. I got the idea from a segment on 60 Minutes then I bought Bryce Carlson’s book on Blackjack. I was so practiced at counting a double deck & I could cut the deck exactly in 2 every time!!
Card counting is simply good poker playing.
Even professional card counters, over the long run, are financially better off working at McDonalds, though the challenge is not quite the same...
The only game worth playing is craps with no side bets. Playing come/don't will give you the closest to an even game (plus you can't rig craps as the house since people can play the don'ts)
I disagree. If you have some skill poker could make you some money. You just have to be willing to walk away from the table if you find there is a better player than you at the table.
@@Donkeyearsa Fair. I consider poker to be more a game of skill than of chance. I was mainly thinking chance games.
Disclaimer: I suck at poker.
I've been banned by a dozen online casinos and blacklisted at all the others. They know I'm an advantage player and win consistently playing online blackjack. If an online casino see's that you are adjusting your bets, YOU ARE BANNED! YOU ARE BANNED. Also, why do online casinos even offer games like blackjack online when it's far easier to count cards or keep track of your play with a piece of paper?
How is stacking the odds in ones favor not cheating? It's what the house does,
Casino can't stand if their customers are not losing money!
My tale starts with all low cards in the first four hands ... I quadrupled my bet on the spot ... boy did that draw the pit bosses' attention ... I could feel them breathing down my neck ... but they let me win, and win I did ... even the dealer said something halfway through the shoe ... I kept my _fool_ mouth shut, so it was just me building up red chips is all ... I think that's why the house let it happen ...
So they use a continuous shuffle machine. That eliminates all shuffle time. All casinos need to do is half shoe a card counter and he or she will leave.
It really doesn't work anymore: the edge on card counting with a small number of decks is only a percent or two, and the disasterous results for everyone (Dealer hit soft 17, Blackjack pays 6-5) have trashed any value of counting cards. Turned blackack into Faro.
I have not seen 6-5 blackjack at medium to high stakes tables. I see 6-5 at low stakes. I didn't think that anyone playing $25 or above, would tolerate 6-5. Is the game changing THAT bad?
short answer: NOT ENOUGH !
Its not illegal. Its simply a way to keep track of the game and up your bets when YOU have the advantage. Its called being an advantage player. However, they want people to drink, talk, not to keep track of the game... or how you're betting. in other words, they just want suckers to throw their money away. They dont like people that use strategy. They'd like you to play aimlessly.
It's as if you watched the video.
In most cases your count will be 0 if the decks are shuffled. Also the casino does not use the whole deck
Every shoe is different. Many hover around 0, some go negative and stay that way, others jump extremely high for a period. As the host said, it's a volume proposition. Card counters wait patiently for the positive counts and hammer the advantage when it appears.
It's true that the number of cards played before a shuffle drastically affects the efficacy of card counting. This is part of what the piece is about - the casinos that shuffle early to deter card counters waste time by shuffling more often, which sacrifices more revenue from the 99% of players playing without an edge.
Take 1,000 people and give them detailed instruction on how to count cards. How many will really learn? Maybe 200. Out of those 200 how many will be able to have the discipline to do it over the many hours needed? Maybe 100. Now how many can also have the discipline to have very good money management and risk control skills? Maybe 50. Now how many can resist the free drinks from the very sexy women coming around now every 5 min? So basically you have a teeny tiny itsy bitsy number out of the 1,000 that can actually do card counting as their professional job.
The actuality is that professional gambling is a repetitive, mostly boring and certainly NOT glamorous occupation.
Meanwhile, the lure that it is even possible creates tons and tons of people (called "the suckers") to come in and play and lose.
Card counting will only slow down how fast you will lose all of your money it wont stop or reverse it. The only way to win against a casino is not to start gambling in the first place.
Crime pays better than card counting.
The casino can reshuffle the deck at any time let me repeat that they can reshuffle the deck at any time for this reason alone you can never win ever did I have fun card counting yes but they can reshuffle and do at any time
why not do videos?...more fun to watch...you will get more views/subs
Card counting is bullshit. My casino has an 8 deck shoe. Always split the cards to play 3.5 to 4 decks.
This is YouTUBE, not YouRadio. Video please. Or leave content production to those who can handle that medium.