Strut system failing

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  • Опубліковано 28 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 80

  • @ads47
    @ads47 10 років тому +43

    As stated this is NOT a strut failure this is operator error. This is improperly used struts being being used by an instructor who was beyond his scope of knowledge and a safety officer who had no idea what was going on and was very lucky no serious injuries occurred. You can't anchor the object your lifting to the strut your lifting it with. There are many other very safe ways to anchor the struts. If you need to anchor the lifting strut you anchor the lifting section to the object being lifted, and the base section separately. Essentially in this scenario it would have been no different if just ran a chain from the base plate up and over the end of the strut and back to the base and started pumping. If you are ever in Indy or FDIC there are two groups that teach very good heavy rescue/rigging classes that also incorporate using heavy wreckers in rescues safely, and they cover struts and proper bracing/tie backs for them very well Don't blame the equipment,

  • @JimsEquipmentShed
    @JimsEquipmentShed 10 років тому +34

    The video starts at 3:28
    You are welcome.....

  • @Bkdrft
    @Bkdrft 10 років тому +10

    Interesting video. Thank you for sharing for the betterment of us ALL! This made for some interesting discussion at the coffee table which led to some training of our own.
    Hard to tell from a video but there would appear to be a couple of fundamental mistakes present, some of which have already been pointed out.
    Firstly you can’t anchor the base of the strut to the object being lifted. That would be like holding onto an object with one hand and pushing it away with the other. Your objective should be to construct a triangle design with the straps passing under the vehicle, if possible, base plate to base plate.
    Secondly, as any NFPA 1006 - chapter 5 compliant spec ops tech (which auto-x falls under) should be able to identify…. If the RATCHET were operated with the strap running from vehicle-to base plate anchor-and back to vehicle you have effectively created a theoretical 2:1 mechanical advantage pulling AGAINST the base plate. The consequence of which is for every 1000lb of lifting force applied to the straps 2000lb of force will be applied to the base plate anchor! This is probably why the struts failed before the strap did. Check with your departments rope techs for a more detailed explanation/demonstration.
    Other errors have already been discussed so thanks once again.
    “lifes good, firefighting’s better”

  • @billbill529
    @billbill529 10 років тому +7

    That is why the strut support (strap or chain) should go from strut one base under the vehicle to strut two base. It can be done because we do it all the time. It takes no extra time and is much safer...

  • @MrRChitty
    @MrRChitty 10 років тому +2

    The cables which were designed to hold the plate from slipping out should have been attached to a lower point, like the car, not to the truck, which was being lifted. The strut was lifting the truck which the cables were attached to, thus stretching the cables, flexing the foot plate until the strut failed. Glad no-one was hurt. A learned experience.

  • @dfacer
    @dfacer 4 роки тому +3

    One of the best technical rescue training videos ever!!! Very good discussion except for the know it all, arrogant people that try to make themselves feel better about themselves by throwing shade on others, even after the fact (even though some are right). I agree it was operator error and safety oversight that led to this failure and this is and excellent example of the bow concept. Technical rescue is that, technical and can get very complex. We like to try to dumb it down in the fire service by using extreme safety factors to compensate for errors we should have accounted for. I learned a lot from this video and hope to share with others so that we can all strive for better. 'Perfection is not attainable but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence' -Vince Lombardi . True professionalism is not knowing more that your peers it is sharing what you know with your peers to make them and you better. Is this you? Are you a TRUE professional? I hope so and if not it's NEVER to late to start doing this. This was an easy oversight to make even without it happening in the middle of the night with victims screaming and a battalion chief yelling to hurry up. We all make human error (some of us are better than others). The goal isn't to prevent them, it is to limit it. Train a little (like an hour) every day. You will over time catch excellence and that should be our goal. I try to work on it every day and hope to be done at the end of my career.

  • @snuffmc
    @snuffmc 10 років тому +5

    Also, for those of you who are immediately going to the "call a crane" argument, I think you're missing the point of the training. Yes, if this were a real accident and it actually happened in a flat, accessible parking lot, in an area where a crane, or heavy wrecker is available, then yes, call the wrecker, but what if it isn't? What if this is down an embankment? Or somehow occurred inside a warehouse, or parking deck with limited overhead room? Or there's simply no crane or wrecker available within 2 hours? After all, this was in California. If a major earthquake happens, wreckers and cranes may not be the answer. The "what if's" can go on forever, but the point is, they had to lift an object (never mind where, or even what the object actually is) and those were the only tools available at the time. It was training, and they (as well as WE) have learned from their mistakes. Quit trying to pass the buck, and figure it out for yourself. It might be what you're called to do one day.

  • @carlhaiser1021
    @carlhaiser1021 9 років тому +15

    I have read through some comments and it WAS HUMAN Error 100%!!!! The bottoms of the struts are NOT to be tied to what you are lifting. If you do that then the strut is like a bow and at some point it will break. You attach the base to the other strut base, or the car on the bottom. Think about it people. If you attach the base of the strut to what you are lifting you are pushing against yourself. that is like trying to lift your self while standing on your hands.

    • @FullFledged2010
      @FullFledged2010 8 років тому +2

      +Carl Haiser 100% agreed! even i could see the thing was clearly bending before it snapped in half.
      Its like making a longbow out of a strut

    • @danoberste8146
      @danoberste8146 8 років тому

      +Carl Haiser, You're right. One leg of the triangle has to be free to move. In this incident the control arm isn't going to get any longer.The chain and strap isn't going to get any longer. The weak link in this system is the hydraulic strut.
      I'm glad this department posted this video. It's not always easy to publicize your mistakes, but eveyone who watches this will be better prepared to avoid this mistake in the future.
      Be Safe All.

    • @Matt-ny1ue
      @Matt-ny1ue 4 роки тому

      you smart bro

  • @jordanwenner8744
    @jordanwenner8744 11 років тому +2

    It was a strut failure on the passenger side. This older "first gen." (no longer sold) Enerpac Hydraulic Ram that Paratech incorporated into their strut systems had a weak link. This was an older model being used here. With those, the cup on top of the yellow cylinder was bolted with two bolts and that was the weak point when "going heavy" with 45+ degree angles. it "flexed" at the bolts and more than once these have sheared as shown here. The fix.... They updated them with a cup that slid down and over the cylinder a few inches and was bolted thru the top of the cup onto the cylinder. This prevented any flexing at the bolts and there are no reported failures at this cup/cylinder junction.

  • @vinnybrindisi7318
    @vinnybrindisi7318 11 років тому +1

    The anchors strap should have gone under the car and to the D handle of the other lifting strut, NOT to the truck they are trying to lift The propose of the strap is to keep the struts from kicking out. None of the strap should be anchored to the car, I'm assuming they will be winching or grip hoisting the car out from under the truck.
    The straps are the weak point in this system, they are only rated to 3300lbs. In this lift you should be using chain with a binder.
    Glad nobody was hurt !

  • @jakeauby1141
    @jakeauby1141 6 років тому +2

    I am not a firefighter, and I even questioned the way they attached those chains to the strut

  • @resq76
    @resq76 11 років тому

    First thank God no one was injured. With that being said, I agree with the comment below. The lower strap has to be perpendicular to the ground, or at least as close as possible. Going to a high anchor point, you are "bending" the strut. The same as a bow and arrow bending when the string is pulled back from two points. Struts are designed to have the load inline. If you notice the second second set of struts captured the load without incident. Anchor to each other to the black car better opt.

  • @donaldraver
    @donaldraver 11 років тому +4

    Lets look at the lift point the front wheel a anchor point that has two degrees of movement yes it is cinched up to "prevent " movement. Removal of the front tire would have allowed access to the frame for stabilization and lift. A box crib under the outriggers on the truck and using airbags along with the struts would have have given a greater safety factor. I have been to these types of trainings and I come away with the feeling of I would rather have a heavy knuckle boom crane on my Rescue/ Squad truck like the rest of the world has on theirs

  • @snuffmc
    @snuffmc 10 років тому +1

    I'm not sure that was a strut "failure" as much as it simply slipped off the LUG NUT that it appears to be up against. Why have $20K worth of lifting tools, but not a $20 lug wrench to take the wheel off to gain better access to the frame? BTW, Kudos for posting this and letting us all learn from it.

  • @gumundurpetur9114
    @gumundurpetur9114 8 років тому +3

    Hopefully this video is used to teach how NOT to fasten the jacks. It´s a big thing to admit you oversaw a critical error but noble if you can learn from your mistakes and prevent others from doing the same mistake. It´s quite obvious in hindsight that you don´t secure the bottom of the jacks to the thing you are lifting with them... Ps. Keep up the good work guys :)

  • @donDiegoEstebanMgLKenNDJohnson

    It's a cherry picker, boys. Chock the rear wheels and use the truck's outriggers and articulating boom to your advantage thus putting all the extra weight in the truck's ass end, then deploy your struts to stabilize only and remove the vehicle. This is a poor scenario because in the real world that truck would have sent the entire front-end of the passenger car into the front seat of the cabin while the hood likely decapitated every passenger taller than 3ft tall.

  • @keanuchungusmode9453
    @keanuchungusmode9453 Рік тому

    when was the last time this crazy elaborate time consuming assembly of struts was placed on vehicles for real extrications?

  • @MaxSafeheaD
    @MaxSafeheaD 10 років тому +4

    ok, I don't understand. it looks like the base of the ram was strapped and chained to the chassy ... once the initial slack had been taken up, I can't see how extending the jack would do anything more than push the wheel into the wheel-arch.
    What am I missing?

    • @badazzone1
      @badazzone1 9 років тому

      MaxSafeheaD your right that was some dumb work

    • @mrmedicman1
      @mrmedicman1 9 років тому

      MaxSafeheaD I may not be understanding your comment right....if you are referring to wasting your lift by the suspension compressing up into the wheel well, the common practice is to fill the void between the crossmember and the frame with solid cribbing. I can't see on this video if they did that or not.

    • @MaxSafeheaD
      @MaxSafeheaD 9 років тому

      Jeff Hudgens
      OK so then the wheel won't move but then ... if you've chained the base of the jack to the truck you're not going to be able to then jack the truck up! It looks like that's what they did.

    • @graenicholls4657
      @graenicholls4657 9 років тому

      MaxSafeheaD I was watching this thinking exactly the same thing. Maybe they were supposed to be releasing the chains slowly as they jack it. The strut can't lift the truck and pull against that chain/strap without something going wrong.

  • @vinnybrindisi7318
    @vinnybrindisi7318 11 років тому

    and I wouldn't be using air in the "progress capture " strut either , they each need to be maned and hand tightened as the truck is lifted.

  • @superstapler3829
    @superstapler3829 11 років тому

    I was going to say something, but everyone else already took the good comments, so I'll just reiterate. Train, know your equipment, use your head, and wear your PPE.

  • @maddog5857
    @maddog5857 11 років тому +1

    I wish that I had some video from a different angle. What is the red strap on the rear doing? Is the front strut lifting at the wheel and tied off at the axle?

    • @dbfarming5010
      @dbfarming5010 4 роки тому +1

      Joseph Matousek the red strap is holding the suspension of the car so when they lift the truck off it the car doesn't come up with the truck

  • @raginghate
    @raginghate 9 років тому +19

    up....up...up...
    03:25
    thank me later.

    • @Badger65
      @Badger65 8 років тому

      You da real MVP.

    • @Die_Quelle
      @Die_Quelle 8 років тому

      legends say they still say up.

  • @АлмазСабиров-п8в

    Желаю ни кому не попадать в такие ситуации, где придется использовать такое оборудование, оно прекрасно но и очень сложное, так что ждём подъемный кран.

  • @Fireman044
    @Fireman044 9 років тому +2

    This was 100% strut failure, not human error. JT Wenner Sr is exactly correct. This strut failed a bolt that is not being used by this manufacturer anymore. It simply failed at that point. They literally went to the hardware store and purchased another grade 8 bolt and reused the same strut. The Instructor nor students did anything wrong. Yes the strut was placed correctly and was not upside down as previously mentioned, yes they watched all of the movement in the vehicle and no the strut did not bend. This evolution was done correctly, the Strut simply failed, and yes thank god nobody got hurt. Nice observations, but bad to assume if you were not there.

    • @MrRChitty
      @MrRChitty 9 років тому +2

      The video is here for a reason. No, I wasn't there, but it is super clear where the tie offs were. The struts are lifting the chassis. You can't see that clearly, but if they were on the axle, you'd see the axle give. The tie off point is on the same chassis that is being lifted. This is very clear. You can't do that. Simple geometry. You're lengthening the strut, thus lifting the chassis, the tie off point is getting tighter and tighter and tighter. Until the point of failure.
      The plates need to be joined at the bases from one side to the other. Then, each plate needs to be tied to the rear axle. This is the pivot point, thus no changes in distance as the vehicle is lifted. This does two things. First the plates can't separate from each other and they can't slide forward as they should be lifting towards the rear of the truck. By being tied to the rear axle prevents the vehicle rolling back (as your going to lift that direction) and the plates don't slide forward. (I know, you chock the wheels) The current set up doesn't allow for the vehicle to be lifted without stretching the tie offs. That's the failure. It is 100% human error.
      We did a similar lift on our shift to demonstrate this same concept and with success.
      Thanks for the video, it is a great teaching tool and most certainly glad nobody was hurt.

    • @vinnyb.1314
      @vinnyb.1314 9 років тому +3

      +MrRchitty Yes , the strut failed ...but it failed because of user error !!! You can't secure the base of the lifting strut to the object being lifted , the two base should have been secured together with either ratchet strap or chain...from base to base under the car. The bolt you mention did fail because it was the week link. If it wasn't the bolt it would have been something else in the system , be it the ratchet strap or maybe a hydraulic seal on the pump . But yes, it was most definitely user error .

  • @thatcandian_guy3312
    @thatcandian_guy3312 9 років тому +1

    In my opinion they should have been doing this... Lift an inch.. Crib an inch, but equipment mal functions happens all the time!

  • @113firewolf
    @113firewolf 11 років тому

    This appears to be human error. The hydraulic strut was upside down. There for the ends were not properly locked together. The second set of struts did their job and held the load. Glade no one was injured. This is why you should know how your equipment works and continue to train.

  • @thedagoyc3
    @thedagoyc3 11 років тому

    Just an observation, was the strut rated for the lift? and the system for securing the strut appear to be at a very steep angle on the vehicle they are trying to lift. In other words:. Is the is the strut working against the anchor straps thus pulling against itself? Should the anchor point been lower onto the vehicle below? as it appears it is on the support strut in the window? Like I said not second guessing just observations and questions...

  • @ericmac564
    @ericmac564 3 роки тому +1

    This video should be renamed. Also, if you continually add force, and nothing is happening, the hair on the back of your neck should be standing on end. Eventually potential energy will become kinetic energy.

  • @monera9675
    @monera9675 11 років тому

    yikes, at least the firefighter was in good spirit, you ok : Yup!

  • @jblah2957
    @jblah2957 7 років тому

    bless you camera man.

  • @HybridPhoenix08
    @HybridPhoenix08 10 років тому

    Failure at 3:28 when the 3rd guy walks into the picture. Change the speed setting to 0.25!

  • @StoicNemesis
    @StoicNemesis 11 років тому

    EARTHQUAKE!!!...its ok just allergies
    On a serious note glade to see your guy is ok. Do you have any info on what caused the strut to fail?

  • @raulperezlopez8883
    @raulperezlopez8883 10 років тому

    lo mejor, el estornudo del cámara a mitad de grabación... Bueno, lo mejor es que no le pasó nada al bombero.

  • @BenjaminEsposti
    @BenjaminEsposti 9 років тому +2

    1:43 bless you.

    • @v31003
      @v31003 4 роки тому

      If that sneeze were today with no mask...ahhh!!!

  • @MicahMcdowellSRT
    @MicahMcdowellSRT 7 років тому

    I thought it meant the cars struts were failing with a truck on top and I was like "ya think??"

  • @jasontetterton6900
    @jasontetterton6900 10 років тому +2

    This video is definitely titled incorrectly. This was not a strut failure, this was human error, plain and simple. The suspension has play in it, no one in their right mind would attack a strut to a wheel.. it appears to be braced at the top of the wheel.

    • @Hoscorp
      @Hoscorp 10 років тому +1

      Exactly, the wheel is turning slowly.

  • @The911Diggler
    @The911Diggler 11 років тому

    Like trying to lift a bucket while standing in it pulling on the handle

  • @maddog5857
    @maddog5857 11 років тому

    Watching again, I would have called in a crane or a heavy wrecker

  • @GamezGames19
    @GamezGames19 8 років тому +3

    Who even has such a silly crash

    • @MrWolfSnack
      @MrWolfSnack 8 років тому +3

      Look at interstates and freeways during a pileup in the winter or in foggy weather and ask that question again.

  • @reverendBomber
    @reverendBomber 10 років тому +1

    Literally watched it bend and no one said anything....

  • @quintkent
    @quintkent 11 років тому

    This us why you wear full ppe even during training.

  • @repalmore
    @repalmore 9 років тому +1

    No disrespect to the hard working guys who are putting their lives on the line to help other but a tow truck is better equipped to do this kind of work. That being said, tow trucks aren't always available. Guess it's better to have this than wait what may be too long for a truck. Hope everyone is OK.

    • @HJabroni
      @HJabroni 9 років тому +1

      +Robert Palmore Yes, I agree with you and i'm sure no disrespect is taken by any FD members. As a member of a fire department that has that same equipment, I'd just like to clarify that the reason for that is not because that type of failure is likely to happen in an operation done correctly, but because of the greater ease and minimal equipment and manpower used while using a heavy tow versus setting up those struts. That was 100% user error as already explained by previous comments. And like you mentioned, that equipment is there in case the tow isn't readily available.

    • @MrWolfSnack
      @MrWolfSnack 8 років тому

      Finding and locating a heavy lift truck and waiting for it to get there takes too much time. It would be a nice idea if fire departments had large wreckers in their fleets but they are really expensive.

  • @timoteus3492
    @timoteus3492 10 років тому

    never herd about cranes ?

  • @62ericg
    @62ericg 7 років тому

    The strut didn't fail, that safety officer did. You secure the strut to another strut when lifting, not to the load.

  • @COOLDON76
    @COOLDON76 10 років тому

    Just going to say Holy Sh!t. and leave it at that !!!
    Someone was lucky this day. Or unlucky depending on how you want to look at it. Lucky they didnt die, unlucky this happened.

  • @jasonandregan
    @jasonandregan 11 років тому +1

    NOT STRUT FAILURE, HUMAN FAILURE. THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU'VE DONE HERE. PUMPING THAT MANY TIMES AND NOT GETTING RESULTS....LETS STOP AND THINK...THINK ABOUT THE FORCES AT PLAY.
    WITH THAT MANY GUYS ONLY FOCUSING ON MAKING VIDEOS....NOBODY NOTICED....
    LOOK WHERE THE CLOSEST STRUT IS ANCHORED BACK TO.
    THANK GOD NOBODY GOT WIPED OUT.

  • @joerose4658
    @joerose4658 6 років тому

    don't you guys hear about a crane? crain that truck and there is no "up" "up" anymore......

    • @Joshua79C
      @Joshua79C 6 років тому

      This would help in a multi vehicle pile up, especially if the occupants were injured and at risk of critical condition, seeing as it can take a while to clear other vehicles out of the way just for the wrecker to gain access.

  • @alexschweigart775
    @alexschweigart775 11 років тому

    bless you at1:50

  • @Dozer355
    @Dozer355 11 років тому

    Holy shit

  • @ryansutherland4632
    @ryansutherland4632 6 років тому

    The Angle is alllllll wrongggggggg

  • @GettinSquirrely
    @GettinSquirrely 10 років тому +2

    Well, that's gotta be the most boring video I've seen in weeks.

  • @Voss2120
    @Voss2120 10 років тому

    HEY look its SDFD

  • @ncfd3224
    @ncfd3224 10 років тому

    I will put my .02 cents in. NEVER use your equipment beyond what it is designed to do, EVER! If you do not understand the working limits, contact your manufacturer so they can inform you of proper lifting angles, weights and techniques. You will see an NFPA standard soon on Struts and Strut Systems. Remember, if your gut tells you this isn't quite right, 99% of the time you should listen!

    • @frankbrennan9537
      @frankbrennan9537 9 років тому

      +Glenn Mate Sr. Hi Glenn, Hope all is well...Yeah, this is a clear example of not following the directions. Been there in other contexts and have a few scars to prove it, I like to think I learned my lesson :) . I just am glad these guys shared the video- good learning here. These are GREAT tools that have been a wonderful addition to our capability ( just made save from a pedestrian trapped under a light rail train last month using the HFS system)Hope to see you at the next meeting

  • @Juliosalmeron
    @Juliosalmeron 7 років тому

    Terrible

  • @bantheblue
    @bantheblue Рік тому

    This had bad new written on it from the beginning. Just look where they had everything anchored 🤦🏽‍♂️

  • @MrRChitty
    @MrRChitty 10 років тому +1

    The cables which were designed to hold the plate from slipping out should have been attached to a lower point, like the car, not to the truck, which was being lifted. The strut was lifting the truck which the cables were attached to, thus stretching the cables, flexing the foot plate until the strut failed. Glad no-one was hurt. A learned experience.

    • @mrmedicman1
      @mrmedicman1 9 років тому

      MrRchitty Try hooking your base plate to a different object and let me know how that works out for you. Where exactly is you stabilization triangle then? You could try pickets, but unless you marry the two objects (which would have defeated the purpose of the lift) then you cant secure your base to a different vehicle.