To watch the Gauss Gun Rod Tutorial, go here: tinyurl.com/zfk... In this Quick Tip Kris demonstrates how he uses airbrush primer for both plastic and metal models.
One thing not mentioned is washing your models! If you're using Resin, or if you've been playing with the minis for a while before you prime it you'll want to wash it in warm soapy water (and let dry) before you prime! Mold release and finger oils will make even primer have a hard time sticking!
It's not only resin you want to wash, it's pretty much all minis unless they are 3d printing. They will have some form or other of mold release agent on them which is likely what was causing the flaking in the opening question. Before you even take parts off the sprues you should wash your sprues in luke warm water and a little dish soap. Use an old tooth brush to give them a decent scrub, rinse in luke warm water. After you assemble the figure, if you weren't wearing gloves, you will need to wash it again to remove skin oils from the figure, that can also cause a bad prime.
Zenithal priming should be in everyone's wheelhouse, especially if you have an airbrush. Even if you are only using black or grey to cover the entire model, you should still do a pre-highlight of ivory or white from a 75-90° angle. You'll definitely see a difference.
you all probably dont care but does anyone know a trick to get back into an Instagram account..? I was stupid forgot my account password. I love any help you can offer me
@Johnathan Cairo I really appreciate your reply. I got to the site on google and I'm trying it out atm. Takes a while so I will reply here later with my results.
When I prime I do it for a variety of reasons and it’s not just for paint adhesion. For me, Mr. Surfacer 1500 Black with MLT is my standard go to. But what else besides paint adhesion? “Black basing” as it’s called also provides false shadows for your top coats whether by choice or by chance (like missing a small area(s) behind tank road wheels) which of course gives the model more depth visually. Also, I can adjust my spray as I go to do the same as pre-shading or post-shading all in one step. If you dream of modulation this is easily achieved in the same way. This method also is important to show potential problems. This is particularly true on aircraft in such places as wing roots and wing leading edges. Errors will stick out like a sore thumb using this method which gives you time to go back in and correct if need be before you hit your build with those top coats. I’m by far no expert builder like others but after getting back into the hobby after some 40 years of being away from it I’ve discovered it’s a constant learning cycle and pretty steep learning curve. I’m just passing on my two cents and it’s free to boot. Just my two cents. Thanks for the video!
the vallejo primer is the best on the market. you always get a nice surface it's nearly impossible to overspray. After the drying time you always have the full details of your miniatures.
@@Lachslamer56 THat is exactly my one concern about this type of primer that I can actually scratch it off without much effort. The same thing can't be said about GW canned primer, but the airbrush lays down such a smooth layer of primer.
@@Sassy_Witch I still use the vallejo primer. Always 3 nice even coats with my airbrush. I recommend a 12h drying period. After drying do your paint job and give it a nice coat of vanish. Nothing will peel off or scratch away if you do it right.
How far, roughly, are you pulling back the dual action trigger? Seems like you're going mostly air but just curious. I've been having issues with the "grey" primer but love the black one. I find grey is almost white and seems to pool/speckle no matter what I do thinner size.
The vallejo primer is extremely painfull to use with my airbrush. I don't know why, maybe because this is too thick, but whenever i air brush it, after a few seconds it stops spraying. On the other hand my other vallejo air paints spray flawlessly without thinner.
I agree about the caution about primer too thick will hide the finer details. I rarely do anything but a fine misty light prime that you may still see the under model color.. so it is to be used with caution.
It sounds like the person who requested this might be having problems due to mold release agents still on the miniature's surface; on a couple of Reaper Bones minis and a few white metal ones, I've had similar instances of paint and/or primer peel off because I forgot to wash the minis before painting.
Once I cut a batch of parts and finish trimming and sanding, I get some bowls of dish detergent and scrub each part with a toothbrush, and rinse em real good. Lay out on some paper towel and begin the next batch. Really makes a big difference!
The Badger Patriot 105 comes with a .3 needle, a great general utility airbrush. You know I've experimented with a lot of brand name primers and they were all OK and did the job. In in the last few years after I ran out or primer I discovered all I had to do was just mix cheap craft paint and thin it with floor was wax which is basically a urethane type of product designed to adhere to linoleum and be durable enough to be walked on. So, it thins and has great adhesion and durability, and the best part you can use any color you want. So why pay extra for brand name acrylic primers when you can make it yourself for pennies. And it's in my opinion better.
What needle size is your airbrush? I tend to have issues when priming with vallejo primers due to the thickness of the primer and most people say is a bad idea to use thinner with a primer.
I havent been airbrushing my minis for too long. I was given a $60 Iwata NEO airbrush and use this (1/3) vallejo primer and (2/3) vallejo flow improver. For the first 10-15 minutes it paints pretty good, but after a while it feels like it starts clogging up and starts to blow back and it bubbles inside the cup. I have to break down the airbrush and clean everything and rinse and repeat. Is that normal?
would be nice to see an example of applying white primer so it looks right since that is the issue i am having.. black primer i haven't had an issue with
How do you clean this primer from your airbrush mine seems to dry inside the airbrush and at the tip even I pause spraying to 20 seconds and premium thinners and acetone don’t work. Cheers
had a problem using thes primers, let it dry put a base color on top, went to mask with liquid mask, it ripped whole the paint off down to grey plastic??
It even says right on the bottle to wait 12 hours before masking--so i always just let them sit for a minimum 12 hours. I'm usually doing gunpla so there's always stuff to work on while i wait anyway. I kind of get into an assembly line method of churning out parts
painting before assembly is a great way of making sure you get all the knooks and crannies... but I find you spend alot of time cleaning off contact points for gluing later on which can slow the whole process down.
best way is to put a little silly putty in the joints where your going to glue it then after your done painting it you can peel that off do a little touch up if needed and then glue it on where its going to go.
Personally I also do sub assembling, however it steals the chance of using putty to mend some joints. It becomes a matter of choice and not what is best.
I am now building a Heller Citroen traction avant. It seems that the Vallejo primer does not "stick" enough. I easily getting damaged. Why is this happening. Should i wash the parts first, is this necessary
Washing your plastic models or figures with a mild detergent like dishwashing liquid before painting is considered a MUST. During the production process of plastic models factories apply a thin film of oil to the injection molds so the finished sprues can be removed more easily. You may not see or smell it, but it is there, and this oil can make it very hard for paint to stick on.
Ive tried using Army painter air primer (black, white and grey) but the paint won't adhere to the plastic models. I am using a couple of drops of flow improver. Any idea why it won't adhere?
Im in the same boat and trying to work out why. I've cleaned my models prior, correct PSI for spraying and everything and still rubs off with a gentle touch.
@@APC117 I’ve reported my issue to Army painter and they sent me a replacement set of all three primers. The paint I bought from Amazon must have been stored in poor conditions as it was useless. The replacements directly from Army Painter are much better. They adhere to the plastic and spray through the airbrush fine. Although can still be rubbed off it I try quite hard.
Are you washing the models before priming? And leave the primer to cure for quite some time before painting over it (24-48 hours or more). it's probably worth sealing the models too.
this is what I'm currently using. www.amazon.ca/Paasche-D3000R-Compressor-Regulator-Moisture/dp/B001CJPWYM/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1468246353&sr=8-3&keywords=airbrush+paasche
I had a small dedicated one like what he listed. I bought a secondary regulator kit for like 8 bucks and put it on my pancake compressor and works amazing. No more listening to that pump running. Its got enugf air in it to spray for a long while and its very consistent because its not trying to keep up the pressure, the airs already in. After a while it will kick on and fill up again
My Vallejo primer beads up, runs, and causes dry tip no matter my psi or paint thinning. Light touch on the trigger, heavy touch on the trigger, flow improver, retarder, it doesn't matter. The Vallejo Mecha primer works a lot better but I still have the same issues often enough to be frustrating. Just ordered some stynylrez hoping for something that behaves.
Not sure if this was stated anywhere else, but what are you using to keep the model attached to that top you have it on? I've seen a lot of painters do that but I can't find out how to make it myself.
I just get an old brush and stipple that very primer onto my minis, let it cure for a few days, then paint...of course wash the minis in soapy water and let dry (even you plastic minis)
+Kris Belleau I find that when I try to brush it on using normal strokes I always get air bubbles win this primer, so the reason I kinda stab it in is to pop all of them. Yeah the primer looks patchy but it works just fine for me. I found a tutorial by Brant Benoit, he does mostly warmahoards stuff with a lot of blending, and I tried his priming method and it worked for me.
+Kris Belleau okay maybe not quite stippling more like dabbing it on, take a really old brush. Load it up with some grey primer. And just dab it on using the bristles to pop any air bubbles that might occur all the while not worrying about if it turns out patchy after a coat or two.
Vallejo is really only good for models that are not meant to be handled afterwards, like model kits, they will work on hard plastic figures if you handle them with care, but for metal, resin or soft plastic I prefer to use Alclad Grey Primer, as it is far more resilient. 60/40 ratio of Alclad and Mr Color thinner.
Nothing wrong with a rattle can, but you give up a lot of control as to the density and viscosity of the paint, as well as control of the area to be painted. On larger models this may not be such an issue. On smaller one's this could create a significant problem with covering up details. Remember this is a first application, you are going to be applying additional paints and likely a clearcoat.
AV is the best. But not for priming. AV will rub off. AV primer is the same, it will rub off. Its crazy how people talk about using anything other than AV flow improver. AV flow improver is the only thing that works fully when airbrushing. Oh and AV primer will not sand. I repeat AV primer will not sand.
...quick tip, don't use it! takes too long to dry, requires a whole strip/clean of airbrush and isn't as effective as rattle can automobile primers (Which FW actually recommend for resin).
@J2B Thanks for sharing. I guess there is no one way of doing it and it's down preference or what you are doing it for. I have always had good results with Halfords primer, especially for resin where the extra hold helps. Maybe I need to get a bit more proficient at using primers in the air brush.
How far, roughly, are you pulling back the dual action trigger? Seems like you're going mostly air but just curious. I've been having issues with the "grey" primer but love the black one. I find grey is almost white and seems to pool/speckle no matter what I do thinner wise.
One thing not mentioned is washing your models! If you're using Resin, or if you've been playing with the minis for a while before you prime it you'll want to wash it in warm soapy water (and let dry) before you prime! Mold release and finger oils will make even primer have a hard time sticking!
It's not only resin you want to wash, it's pretty much all minis unless they are 3d printing. They will have some form or other of mold release agent on them which is likely what was causing the flaking in the opening question.
Before you even take parts off the sprues you should wash your sprues in luke warm water and a little dish soap. Use an old tooth brush to give them a decent scrub, rinse in luke warm water.
After you assemble the figure, if you weren't wearing gloves, you will need to wash it again to remove skin oils from the figure, that can also cause a bad prime.
Is this what causes fisheye or speckling
Zenithal priming should be in everyone's wheelhouse, especially if you have an airbrush. Even if you are only using black or grey to cover the entire model, you should still do a pre-highlight of ivory or white from a 75-90° angle. You'll definitely see a difference.
I agree, just be careful of laying too heavy layers of primer down.
you all probably dont care but does anyone know a trick to get back into an Instagram account..?
I was stupid forgot my account password. I love any help you can offer me
@Marley Yousef Instablaster :)
@Johnathan Cairo I really appreciate your reply. I got to the site on google and I'm trying it out atm.
Takes a while so I will reply here later with my results.
When I prime I do it for a variety of reasons and it’s not just for paint adhesion. For me, Mr. Surfacer 1500 Black with MLT is my standard go to. But what else besides paint adhesion?
“Black basing” as it’s called also provides false shadows for your top coats whether by choice or by chance (like missing a small area(s) behind tank road wheels) which of course gives the model more depth visually. Also, I can adjust my spray as I go to do the same as pre-shading or post-shading all in one step. If you dream of modulation this is easily achieved in the same way.
This method also is important to show potential problems. This is particularly true on aircraft in such places as wing roots and wing leading edges. Errors will stick out like a sore thumb using this method which gives you time to go back in and correct if need be before you hit your build with those top coats.
I’m by far no expert builder like others but after getting back into the hobby after some 40 years of being away from it I’ve discovered it’s a constant learning cycle and pretty steep learning curve. I’m just passing on my two cents and it’s free to boot. Just my two cents. Thanks for the video!
the vallejo primer is the best on the market. you always get a nice surface it's nearly impossible to overspray. After the drying time you always have the full details of your miniatures.
It's so easy to scratch off
@@Lachslamer56 THat is exactly my one concern about this type of primer that I can actually scratch it off without much effort. The same thing can't be said about GW canned primer, but the airbrush lays down such a smooth layer of primer.
Is this still the case after 5 years
@@Sassy_Witch I still use the vallejo primer. Always 3 nice even coats with my airbrush. I recommend a 12h drying period. After drying do your paint job and give it a nice coat of vanish. Nothing will peel off or scratch away if you do it right.
Do you thin down the primer with thinner or water or something??
A well informed video Kris! This will help me get started on airbrushing my models over using spray paint. I'm excited to get started! Thanks!
Some nice tips, but I wish you answered the question about primer flaking off the models
How far, roughly, are you pulling back the dual action trigger? Seems like you're going mostly air but just curious. I've been having issues with the "grey" primer but love the black one. I find grey is almost white and seems to pool/speckle no matter what I do thinner size.
Was it pre-thinned in your bottle or do you use it right from the bottle as is? Thanks.
The vallejo primer is extremely painfull to use with my airbrush. I don't know why, maybe because this is too thick, but whenever i air brush it, after a few seconds it stops spraying. On the other hand my other vallejo air paints spray flawlessly without thinner.
What size needle are you using?
Add some flow improver to it?
I use liquidex flow improver, a couple drops for a quarter cup
@@mitchcacciola6807.3
Always use Vallejo primer undiluted.
I find that spray primer works better on resin and metal figures.
I mostly concur with this statement. I've not had any problems with priming metal, plastic or resin.
Agreed. I haven't had any problems straight out of the bottle on polystyrene, such a time saver
Does this work straight out of the bottle or should I use a thinner or a flow improver? Thanks! :)
I've JUSTstarted but have been cutting it with paint: flow improver: thinner
6 drops:2 drops : 4 drops (using Vallejo surface primer)
Is "key" the word you would use for a surface for the paint to grip onto?.
Yes that would be correct.
I agree about the caution about primer too thick will hide the finer details. I rarely do anything but a fine misty light prime that you may still see the under model color.. so it is to be used with caution.
It sounds like the person who requested this might be having problems due to mold release agents still on the miniature's surface; on a couple of Reaper Bones minis and a few white metal ones, I've had similar instances of paint and/or primer peel off because I forgot to wash the minis before painting.
I agree, aside from not showing washing the model this is the process I go through and have not had any bad results.
Once I cut a batch of parts and finish trimming and sanding, I get some bowls of dish detergent and scrub each part with a toothbrush, and rinse em real good. Lay out on some paper towel and begin the next batch. Really makes a big difference!
The Badger Patriot 105 comes with a .3 needle, a great general utility airbrush. You know I've experimented with a lot of brand name primers and they were all OK and did the job. In in the last few years after I ran out or primer I discovered all I had to do was just mix cheap craft paint and thin it with floor was wax which is basically a urethane type of product designed to adhere to linoleum and be durable enough to be walked on. So, it thins and has great adhesion and durability, and the best part you can use any color you want. So why pay extra for brand name acrylic primers when you can make it yourself for pennies. And it's in my opinion better.
Really nice ! =) Using airbrush instead of a Black Chaos can from GW give a result more thinner ? Or better ?
What needle size is your airbrush? I tend to have issues when priming with vallejo primers due to the thickness of the primer and most people say is a bad idea to use thinner with a primer.
Use Vallejo Flow Improver. It will help you a lot with the primer.
I havent been airbrushing my minis for too long. I was given a $60 Iwata NEO airbrush and use this (1/3) vallejo primer and (2/3) vallejo flow improver. For the first 10-15 minutes it paints pretty good, but after a while it feels like it starts clogging up and starts to blow back and it bubbles inside the cup. I have to break down the airbrush and clean everything and rinse and repeat. Is that normal?
I have that same issue with mine. Wondering if anybody else has the solution
would be nice to see an example of applying white primer so it looks right since that is the issue i am having.. black primer i haven't had an issue with
How do you clean this primer from your airbrush mine seems to dry inside the airbrush and at the tip even I pause spraying to 20 seconds and premium thinners and acetone don’t work. Cheers
so is it necessary to thin out the primer with thinner or water? or can i spray it on straight out of the bottle? thanks
What PSI were you spraying at?
depends on your airbrush. probably around 20psi
he said around 20psi.
Look and listen
20 if the primer is thinned. 30 if you're using it straight from the bottle.
Do you thin your primers? Thanks
nice one.
Wich mm are you using when you primer with the airbrush ?
Thanks
had a problem using thes primers, let it dry put a base color on top, went to mask with liquid mask, it ripped whole the paint off down to grey plastic??
Can i cover the grey with a Tamiya white?
What if im making a model all black would I be able to completely cover the model vs priming it black and then adding a layer of normal black paint?
Scott Fekete yes
Sorry if i missed it in the video, but did you use a thinner with the primer? And if so what kind of ratio roughly?
Is it possible to prime the models with the vallejo airbrush primer with a brush?
Is it ok to use it with MiG acrlic colros ?
I think it's important to add that with Vallejo primer, it really is advisable to let it fully dry for at least 8 hours. Not joking.
I've heard from my group you'd best wait 3-6 days for it to fully cure
Weird. I use Vallejo gray and it dries in about half an hour.
It even says right on the bottle to wait 12 hours before masking--so i always just let them sit for a minimum 12 hours. I'm usually doing gunpla so there's always stuff to work on while i wait anyway. I kind of get into an assembly line method of churning out parts
Do you have to use acrylic seal, after applying the primer?
Hey Kris where do you get your primer at? I have had trouble finding it (I am in southern ontario)
We usually order through BlackKnightgames.ca
Can you mix Vallejo primers to produce a perfect grey.
How long so u wait for primer to dry before u start painting?????
is there a clear primer instead of colour ones?
How much pain you put on air brush to cover 1 model?
Thanks for the tips! 🤙
Do you need to use a face mask and/or us an extractor hood with these primers?
Stewart Stevens if you aren't in a ventilated area then yes
A spray booth with a vent should to the trick.
Personally I like to prime my models when they're not assembled. It makes it easier to get to hardly painted areas.
painting before assembly is a great way of making sure you get all the knooks and crannies... but I find you spend alot of time cleaning off contact points for gluing later on which can slow the whole process down.
best way is to put a little silly putty in the joints where your going to glue it then after your done painting it you can peel that off do a little touch up if needed and then glue it on where its going to go.
Personally I also do sub assembling, however it steals the chance of using putty to mend some joints. It becomes a matter of choice and not what is best.
RREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE GET OUTTT
I am now building a Heller Citroen traction avant. It seems that the Vallejo primer does not "stick" enough. I easily getting damaged. Why is this happening. Should i wash the parts first, is this necessary
Washing your plastic models or figures with a mild detergent like dishwashing liquid before painting is considered a MUST. During the production process of plastic models factories apply a thin film of oil to the injection molds so the finished sprues can be removed more easily. You may not see or smell it, but it is there, and this oil can make it very hard for paint to stick on.
What's the difference between primer and surface primer?
Why i use primer mu airbrush cant out the primer..need mix thinner or not..
This primer need mix thinner..?before spray..😅
had trouble priming a 1/48 scale canberra jet bomber
Ive tried using Army painter air primer (black, white and grey) but the paint won't adhere to the plastic models. I am using a couple of drops of flow improver. Any idea why it won't adhere?
Im in the same boat and trying to work out why. I've cleaned my models prior, correct PSI for spraying and everything and still rubs off with a gentle touch.
@@APC117 I’ve reported my issue to Army painter and they sent me a replacement set of all three primers. The paint I bought from Amazon must have been stored in poor conditions as it was useless. The replacements directly from Army Painter are much better. They adhere to the plastic and spray through the airbrush fine. Although can still be rubbed off it I try quite hard.
guys any idea on what compressor he is using?
I thought this was a makeup review im crying
You use an airbrush for makeup?
😂
I mean it still could be applicable if you are 2" tall and like fighting...
thank you so much ^^
but I always seem to have this problem with Vallejo peeling or rubbing off metal miniatures.
Are you washing the models before priming? And leave the primer to cure for quite some time before painting over it (24-48 hours or more). it's probably worth sealing the models too.
Great! Thank you very much!:)
what air compressor do you use I need a new one mine Is completely broken :(
this is what I'm currently using. www.amazon.ca/Paasche-D3000R-Compressor-Regulator-Moisture/dp/B001CJPWYM/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1468246353&sr=8-3&keywords=airbrush+paasche
I had a small dedicated one like what he listed. I bought a secondary regulator kit for like 8 bucks and put it on my pancake compressor and works amazing. No more listening to that pump running. Its got enugf air in it to spray for a long while and its very consistent because its not trying to keep up the pressure, the airs already in. After a while it will kick on and fill up again
My Vallejo primer beads up, runs, and causes dry tip no matter my psi or paint thinning. Light touch on the trigger, heavy touch on the trigger, flow improver, retarder, it doesn't matter. The Vallejo Mecha primer works a lot better but I still have the same issues often enough to be frustrating. Just ordered some stynylrez hoping for something that behaves.
did it work better? I'm having the same issues with grey and especially white vallejo primer...
Thanks dude.
you are welcome!
Thanks
welcome
Not sure if this was stated anywhere else, but what are you using to keep the model attached to that top you have it on? I've seen a lot of painters do that but I can't find out how to make it myself.
the handle is custom made by my self. They will be for sale in miniwargaming store soon enough.
I just get an old brush and stipple that very primer onto my minis, let it cure for a few days, then paint...of course wash the minis in soapy water and let dry (even you plastic minis)
when using a stippling motion do you find the primer kind of froths up and introduces air bubbles?
+Kris Belleau I find that when I try to brush it on using normal strokes I always get air bubbles win this primer, so the reason I kinda stab it in is to pop all of them. Yeah the primer looks patchy but it works just fine for me. I found a tutorial by Brant Benoit, he does mostly warmahoards stuff with a lot of blending, and I tried his priming method and it worked for me.
+Kris Belleau okay maybe not quite stippling more like dabbing it on, take a really old brush. Load it up with some grey primer. And just dab it on using the bristles to pop any air bubbles that might occur all the while not worrying about if it turns out patchy after a coat or two.
Vallejo is really only good for models that are not meant to be handled afterwards, like model kits, they will work on hard plastic figures if you handle them with care, but for metal, resin or soft plastic I prefer to use Alclad Grey Primer, as it is far more resilient. 60/40 ratio of Alclad and Mr Color thinner.
We don’t have any experience so by watching your video we need a baseline. Do tell us it depends on what you feel.
So I just started my Airbrush journey and I thought you had to thin down every acrylic paint, even the primer.
What PSI are you shooting?
25 psi for most prime and basecoat jobs.
is that Mike Oldfield music in the background?
nope, just good ol Kevin MacLeod at www.incompetech.com
isn't a spraycan faster and cheaper?
Nothing wrong with a rattle can, but you give up a lot of control as to the density and viscosity of the paint, as well as control of the area to be painted. On larger models this may not be such an issue. On smaller one's this could create a significant problem with covering up details. Remember this is a first application, you are going to be applying additional paints and likely a clearcoat.
Spray cans give a worse finish (and you can't control them too much) plus they're really expensive in the long run.
Oh, un-diluted primer, good to know :D.
Fancy 30 second intro's are annoying. We already have to watch a 15 second commercial before your video starts.
That formatting came out terribly.
Mask?
Always. Unless you love sniffing paint and want all those millions of particles into your lungs.
AV is the best. But not for priming. AV will rub off. AV primer is the same, it will rub off. Its crazy how people talk about using anything other than AV flow improver. AV flow improver is the only thing that works fully when airbrushing. Oh and AV primer will not sand. I repeat AV primer will not sand.
...quick tip, don't use it! takes too long to dry, requires a whole strip/clean of airbrush and isn't as effective as rattle can automobile primers (Which FW actually recommend for resin).
@J2B Thanks for sharing. I guess there is no one way of doing it and it's down preference or what you are doing it for. I have always had good results with Halfords primer, especially for resin where the extra hold helps. Maybe I need to get a bit more proficient at using primers in the air brush.
what pressure do you use for undiluted primer?
How far, roughly, are you pulling back the dual action trigger? Seems like you're going mostly air but just curious. I've been having issues with the "grey" primer but love the black one. I find grey is almost white and seems to pool/speckle no matter what I do thinner wise.
I don't pull the trigger very far, but sometimes as the tip dries or the paint feels like it may start to clog I pull the trigger farther.
I am new to airbrushing and am actually watching this video looking for a solution the problem you mentioned here. Did you ever figure it out?