OOP 2015 Keynote - Robert C. Martin ("Uncle Bob"): Agility and Architecture
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- Опубліковано 15 жов 2024
- Do agile methods abandon architecture for speed? Do they replace good design decisions with mindless testing? Are agile methods just another way to hack-and-slash systems together without the appropriate discipline, due-diligence, and documentation?
In this Keynote Robert C. Martin describes how the principles of Agile Software Development lead to rich and robust architectures, high degrees of discipline, due consideration of design and architecture, and all appropriate levels of documentation.
Uncle Bob videos is one of those types of videos for me where I open it up whenever I see them in recommended. And even if I can't watch it now, I add it to watch later list and keep it in my tabs. And then I watch it later.
I love that he has fun when he speaks. It's contagious.
from 39:30 he's referring to this slide imgur.com/HXjEBAz video editor got it wrong :)
+Spoygg V (Ivan) Thanks for that, I was going to go find it. Could only see a little tease of it on the video.
Thanks! I thought I wasn't smart enough to understand his wisdom. (I still am not, but hey)
Someone should make a gif of that "Don't know, don't care, not important" part @ 25:40
twitter.com/dimalezhnev/status/1230386543178719232
correction: twitter.com/dimalezhnev/status/1230387131366940672
That was a great experience! Thank you!
This talk was the reason why i'm reading martin fowler's book "Refactoring", in the video, Robert says (at around 12:00) that martin implied but did not clearly say it, that you need unit tests in order to better the design of the code.
I don't see why he says that, Martin dedicated chapter 4 to building tests, and talked all throughout chapter 1 about runining the tests after every little modification in the code during the refactoring process.
I think Robert was most likely talking about tdd rather than self testing code, that's why he says it was clarified by Kent beck.
39:40 ... i see 'API' in the backround of uncle bob but not on the slide... and this is making me question my sanity ! Am i hallucinating ?
Yes it seem he is referring to another diagram
As always - Uncle Bob rocks! :)
instaBlaster
Still good 8 years later.
Biological Parent concept is good :)
I love this guy
I want to see an implementation of what he proposes
This was very good! Thank you.
He's like a tech Lewis Black
Watch at 1.25 speed and safe some minutes :)
Mikasa did you also learn english lessons at 1.25 speed to saFe some time... cuz you actually have to slow down to be good at something my dear snowflakes
@@crabsynth3480 Bashing a guy for getting a word wrong. Real classy. Maybe he's not a native speaker. Did you think of that, genius?
Also that's not how you use 'snowflake', dipshit.
Uhm, there was an avalanche of design patterns. So much so that the anti-pattern movement started.
40:00-40:50 - another picture is commented
Did he say the first woman lived 120,000 years ago or 120 million years ago?
Neither. He said our common female ancestor lived about 120000 years ago - not the first woman by any definition. Similarly our common male ancestor lived about 70000 years ago.
"that's about 400 years, so now we're back in the 1200 ADs."
is my math off or does that imply we're living in the 1600s?
I saw a dozen of his talks and even though he's funny and entertaining, I can't seem to say that he can get his message across. In fact, when you see the end of this video I think the crowd seem to think the same.
+kobac I think his ideas are pretty obvious, eventually you realize all his ideas as a group are pretty hard to follow. You can follow one or two, but if you follow every idea, your code would become really SOLID.
The problem is that we program following rules like a ritual. We don't tend to rethink what we are doing... so to repeat something he already said: we write crap. We are used to write crap and we never take the time to look at the code... because we know all the stuff he says is true, but we don't put it in practice because we are used to give estimates and therefore we are used to hurry as if that were a good thing...
Who says hurrying up is a good thing?
When you go to the doctor do you tell him to hurry up when he is examining you?
Or when he is operating you?
Or your lawyer, do you tell them to hurry up?
Why do we accept and take for granted that there is always someone telling us to hurry up? Or quality is unimportant here?
Am I bozo who will never deliver working software if someone is not hurrying me up?
I've heard several software engineers who say they cannot deliver if there is not someone telling them to hurry up. That is so sad. It is like they lost their own brain and now they are convinced they are trained monkeys who need instructions.
The Audience is perfectly fine dude .. maybe you just dont know the basics... and are unable to connect the dots. Whats hard to understand my friend? This is top-notch A1 quality free knowledge... Just do the following;
0. Google source code Dependencies and flow of control... understand Solid principles as well... question yourself in which classes would you put your vars and functions into... aim for high cohesion/low coupling.. google google google.
1. google UML arrows/pointers...
2. Write down your Requirements and extract nouns and verbs to make use cases and classes from them... google this method if u dont know how... make your UML diagrams.
3. come back to this talk... pause and look at all the Diagrams
4. Think about those uml Arrows and their Direction to understand where your objects should reside in this Architecture.
5. Create your interfaces and structure them in these diagrams fashion.. think about the functions and variables of the boundary objects ... etc etc.
6. google Test driven development - it gamifies coding
7. Buy plane tickets and sip some liqour over the Atlantic while u test your entities, response models and presenter... Test everything except the view.
8. Enjoy your Victory over Chaos.
Its not rocket science but hey rocket science aint that hard either... this is Engineering... easy to learn ... years to master... it requires Self Reflection and Persistence... ok .. im off to coding over the Atlantic ... ciao
Regards.
According to Stephen Fry on the UK programme Quite Interesting, everyone in Europe is related to Charlemagne .
Is this leading us into CQRS?
if you're writing an application with a web front end, you have a lot of javascript business logic offering the ability to do client side awesomeness, how can that be independent?
+judgewest2000
Its just a GUI framework. The only difference is that you are dependent on javascript but this is an implementation detail and not an architecture.
+Lothar Scholz quite an important detail, you write JS client side logic, you're not gonna on a whim change that into an iPhone native app (putting aside the phonegappers of the world of course :-)
Are you telling me that you were involved in a project where client-side JS implemented business logic? Do tell more.
Glib Shpychka headlined proudly and making no apologies
judgewest2000 that's fascinating. can you share details?
genius
Lots of people like Uncle Bob, and he brings some good concepts to the table. But his speeches and books are filled up with too much fluff for my tastes. Skip the poetic stories - I ain't got time for that! Just tellmehowtocode!!!!
Greenspud Trades the problem is you are from the youtube generation ... trying to read a book which is the format of the ... well the book generation... why are you doing that ? Just watch his videos on youtube or go to his website ... what are you going to get out of a book that you cant get from his Free Papers or videos or other discussions... then theres premium content if you can afford it... go to his Website.. if you need things explained... itll cost you tho... im saving up so i can binge watch them all together.