A Closer Look at the Ways to Preserve Starting Pitchers

[@NickStevensR]

Greatly appreciated the parenting talk at the end of the episode! Entire episode was a great discussion.

[@pistolrx9313]

Thanks Eno and DVR and Britt!

[@MikeAndNellie]

I’m here for all the parenting talk! I have a daughter in high school and have been shocked by the professionalization of youth sports, compared to my own youth. Great discussion around all of the conflicting emotions, too.

[@josephnewman713]

2021 had so many 5+ pitcher outings because almost no one threw 100 innings in 2020.

[@IdliAmin_TheLastKingofSambar]

Yup. Heck, it wasn’t almost no one, it was literally no one. I think the league leader (Lance Lynn, maybe?) was around 80 IP in 2020. Maybe if you tack on pre-pandemic spring training and summer camp innings, some guys might have gotten close, not sure. That bizarro season seems to be an underappreciated factor in all of this.

[@IdliAmin_TheLastKingofSambar]

33:00 Yes, and I would argue that we’ve already seen this during the “steroid” era. We assume that the explosion of offense was solely the result of PEDs, but remember: _pitchers were using PEDs, too._ Maybe it was because of PEDs _AND_ a mismatch of an old-school pitching approach being deployed against hitters who were suddenly way better and who were taking a new, homer-happy approach. I’m also curious whether the third time-through-the-order penalty changed much year over year, relative to league average. That might give us a clue. This should be obvious, but that’s why the sixth inning is the sweet (or bitter) spot for starting pitchers: a pitcher who is doing pretty well is likely to hit the third time through right around the sixth inning, maybe slightly earlier. Teams are going to be most worried about the 3x penalty against the other team’s best hitters, so that’s when they’re likely to pull guys. The complete arsenal thing Eno mentioned around 38:00 might be a thing: guys with wider arsenals (and solid command) are better equipped to turn a lineup over a third time.

[@thpnob8419]

Should the stars be allowed to pitch more/push the amount of pitchers per game? Sure. Push Yamamoto, push Wheeler and Cease. But in general the way the average SP is used I have no issue with and don’t really see any way that if say José Butto went 6 with 150-120 pitches instead of 5 and 100 it’s somehow more appealing

[@Idontknowmeself]

Youth coaches can be absolute psychos when it comes to this stuff. I had a coach when I was 13 who let me throw 143 pitches in 7 innings because he wanted to win and my parents weren’t at the game to stop him. I specifically remember having elbow issues after that game (never had them before) and I ended up getting TJ surgery at 19

[@toddbrown2506]

I have never understood why don’t have 3 inning relievers , more 3 inning saves

[@joett84]

Also, why penalize a team if their starter gets bombed in the first inning and has to come out. Then it's going to be even harder for them to catch up minus their DH.

[@AdamB-oy8kn]

I think this isn’t as big of a problem as writers are making it out to be. I think the average baseball fan watches mostly just their team and would prefer a win rather than a pitcher pitch x number of innings.

[@joett84]

We don't need any rules that take the DH away. Nobody wants to go back to watching pitchers bunt and the number 8 hitter being walked to bring up the pitcher. The game is evolving with openers and piggybacking starters and there's nothing wrong with that.

[@ryunanderson7845]

People who grew up watching guys pitch 250+ innings will find these trends disturbing, just as people who grew up in the late 1800s with guys throwing 450 innings found the trends of the early 20th century disturbing. Baseball surely must have died out shortly thereafter!

[@DerekDominoes]

Eno seems overly sensitive about rules that might diminish the Driveline influence on pitching strategy.

[@V1ZNS.]

Kids playing Little League at 3 or 4 is awesome, what are we talking about. Kids love to run around, throw the ball around and draw in the dirt with other kids.

[@edfagan4251]

You're trying to win games, not have individual players compile stats.

[@wesleykreeger3165]

Cat is out of the bag...

[@Mamss_]

I love this pod, but can we please stop discussing solutions to arm injuries without any new data. Feels like it’s the focus of every other episode with nothing new being stated.

[@drmeithos]

Pitchers are expendable. They are the Washington generals and hitters are the globetrotters. Baseball needs star hitters more than star pitchers.