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"Me & My Husband" - Warriors PMV
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- Опубліковано 5 бер 2021
- Edit: Hi yall! It's come to my attention that the feather behind Spotted's ear could be appropriation of indigenous culture. I didn't intend it as a character design thing as much as symbolism but I still see how it looks like that and I should have incorporated the concept in a different way, I'm sorry.
If you chose to make fanart of this map (that sounds very conceited lol I've had like 1 person make art, this is just in case!) please remove the feather or move it to her pelt or tail instead :)
"So feathers are incredibly sacred to Indigenous cultures. They are an honor to receive, and treasured greatly. They aren’t small, insignificant parts of our culture... The way that artists tend to use the feathers in their design is very reminiscent of these stereotypical caricatures of Indigenous people. We don’t necessarily mind you adding a feather for some reason to your design, but placing it in your character’s hair or behind the ear in a way that is similar to these old caricatures is a no-go."
For more information on this issue check out this great doc: docs.google.co...
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This is pretty old but it was super fun cleaning it up a bit and finishing it! It’s not great quality and I really gave up towards the end but I didn’t intend for it to be incredible anyway lol
NOTE: incase it was unclear, this animatic is in NO WAY trying to romanticize or approve of Thistleclaw and Spotted’s ‘relationship’. The song is about suburban, old-fashioned housewives and feelings of worth being tied to relationships and the cheery tone is supposed to be ironic.
![MAMA TOLD ME [Complete Fall-Themed Crookedstar Warrior's MAP]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/TW1o6XO3ovw/mqdefault.jpg)
![MAMA TOLD ME [Complete Fall-Themed Crookedstar Warrior's MAP]](/img/tr.png)
Hi! I have an OPEN Warriors MAP right now if anyone is interested....👀✨❗❗❗ ua-cam.com/video/FaQsrlr-KZI/v-deo.html
Dam! I would, but I don’t have my pencil with me !! I’m on a holiday, but I can get it back in a few days!! I’m a beginner, but you can see my latest animation in my channel!!
I would but I have a pretty full schedule (I tried spelling that like 5 times)
The dogs being compared to Thistleclaw, Firepaw being compared to younger Spottedleaf as she almost continues the cycle, the leaf being shaken away because she feels guilty, the feather marking her as Thistle keeps bringing more and more, the character designs, the upbeat song choice, everything about this is perfect!! Spottedleaf has never been my favorite but this makes me sad for her :(
Took the words out of my mouth
"almost" ye, almost.
"Almost" uhum, almost
Question, is spotted leafs heart a good book?
@@emmamullen3612 No, it's awful. Could have been executed way better.
I love how you included the cycle of abuse but I feel like it’s worth noting that Spottedleaf didn’t pursue him despite him having obvious feelings for her. Like, he clearly had a crush on her and she could’ve continued the cycle but... she didn’t. She refused to continue what Thistleclaw had done and I don’t think she’s given enough credit for that.
to be Honest i dont think a person should be given credit for not being a child predator but you are right while she reciprocated she never took advantage of firestar’s feelings for her (while she was still alive, anyway). theres something to be said about the erins making spottedleaf a love interest in the prophecies begin without this pretext, though. their retcons are often annoying but sh was just.... flagrantly pernicious
idk if it’s intentional but if you pause at 1:30 you can see a circle as the images change, so literally a “cycle”
@@anoushkashenoy692 I think that's actually symbolism for Spottedleaf seeing her younger self in Firepaw? I mean, she stops herself at 1:37
@@Rosia4309 but in the cycle, she flashes into Thistleclaw for a second which I think is symbolising her just acting the same as Thistle? You could be totally right but idk.
Yeah, she never tried to steal him away either, people always say how she won't leave him alone and haunts him after she dies, but she doesn't. She loves him, she can't help that, she let him know it was okay for him to move on with Sandstorm and anything after that was offering support, and guiding his kits and grandkits was her way of showing that even if they aren't hers and she's not Firestar's mate she cares about them as if they were her own and because she cares about Firestar and his happiness, it's the same with how Feathertail thinks of Lion, Holly, and Jay as her kits but she still approves of Crowfeather moving on, nobody goes after her for that and I don't think it's fair. Spottedleaf doesn't deserve all the hate, and no one no matter how they reply is going to change my mind. Just like how people refuse to change their mind about Spottedleaf being a bad person and character, so see how they like it.
“Warriors are for kids!”
Spotted leaf: “haha, *no.* “
Oh, they’re for kids alright, but not in the right way.
Thistleclaw came to ruin it :)))
@@Fluttershys_bong oh no-
*stoplaughingstoplaughingstoplaughing*
@@Fluttershys_bong hold up-
@@Fluttershys_bong oh.
Even though I hate how they used Thistleclaw in Spottedleaf's Heart, and the SpottedXFire looks like a bad ship for me, this is probably one of my favourite Spottedleaf's PMV.
Not only it is very pretty drawn, it also shows her as a victim of a cruel treatment. She doesn't realizes that she is replicating her abuser's manipulation, in fact, I don't even believe that she actually spoke with anyone about that period of her life.
My god, now I am very sad.
But the PMV is still amazing! Gonna add it to my playlist. Keep working hard!
thank you so much!!!!
No one ever talks about that part :0 but it's so right!
right like this one anamatic was better development than any of those books.
At 1:37ish when she almost puts her paw on his, but instead curls her tail more tightly around herself, I think she realizes how similar that would be to Thistleclaw's treatment of her. Just my opinion tho.
And agreed, @prehistoric orchid
Well, for SpottedLeaf her kit-hood with ThistleClaw was normal! Kids just duplicate their peers behavior because they believe it's "right". It's pretty damn sad :(
yeah,this kinda does show the dangers of that kinda stuff,she thought it was normal and went after a young boy,thankfully in both cases it..didnt go that far,but also,whenever it does happen,its already too far,it would have been interesting if the Erins took a appropriate approach to this situation,but nah,they had to victim blame,Spottedleafs heart could have been a good book to warn kids about the dangers of grooming,i fee like it normalized some gross shit though
spottedleaf did nothing to firestar. firepaw thought spotted was pretty, but spotted didn't reciprocate until way after she was dead and fireheart was a full adult. fans always get it way twisted.
@@inspectorspinda agreed. Also, there have been so many other cases of an older cat mating with a younger one, like dustpelt + ferncloud, starflower +clear sky ect
@@toxiccatron867 Both examples being two adults, so nothing compared to the possibility of fire and spotted.
@@inspectorspinda Waiting for someone to age up then still going after them when they have a partner is weird. Regardless, their comment was talking about Spottedleafs heart, which means they're talking mostly about spottedleaf and thistleclaw, not spotted and fire.
@@shrimp1429 actually, no. Dustpelt’s age gap between him and ferncloud is bigger than spotted and fire’s, and spotted leaf wasn’t like thistleclaw at all. Thistleclaw tried to force spotted into being his mate at a young age, while spottedleaf didn’t even confess her feelings, and firepaw was actually sad when she died.
As someone who has been almost murdered and had their innocence taken away at the age of 6 by a pedophile, this hit home for me.
I personally despise Spottedleaf’s Heart. It makes what I went through seem _okay_. And it’s not.
It has changed and shattered me forever, and that book absolutely disgusts me in one way.
But it also shows how Spottedleaf viewed it- as something nice, and good, till those small feelings of uncomfortableness spiraled, and she didn’t realize what was wrong till far too late, like me.
You managed to make me cry over this.
It’s masterfully drawn and constructed- so thank you for making this, it really hit home where it needed to.
I'm so sorry that happened :( I hope you're doing better now
@@fr4yedtail i dunno how to judge whether i’m better or not tbh :’)
i can barely handle being touched, and i don’t like loud noises and sudden movement much
nobody really understands much but my best friend, my parents don’t really get it and get mad about it
but i really appreciate your concern 💖💖💖💖
@@zephi5457 thats ok, having reactions like that is totally normal for having gone through something like that. I'm glad you have a friend who understands at least❤️
@@fr4yedtail yeah, i don’t know what i’d do without her
once again, despite redundant, thank you for taking the time for that, i really do appreciate it 💖💖💖💖💖💖💕💘💖💖
@@nightfires3758
Find a few buddies that make you feel peaceful, having someone to talk to often can really brighten your life.
I absolutely adore the symbolism and how you tied together Spottedleaf's relationship with Thistleclaw and Firepaw. It's so tragic that she ends up repeating the unhealthy behaviors and power dynamics she had learned without realizing it, and you conveyed that so well. I also noticed that she wears a red feather that sticks with her after Thistle gives it to her? I'm assuming that symbolizes how Thistle permanently changed her and ruined her perception on love
I'm also interested in the symbolism with the feather and the leaf.
I personally interpret the red feather being there to show her dream as a warrior while the leaf is replaces that when she becomes a medicine cat// the red feather is there for the duration of her 'relationship' with Thistleclaw and when she shakes it off she lets go of him and this 'relationship' they had
But I think that your interpretation is really neat as well! :0
@@starrsx_ and to add on to that, there’s a moment at 0:53 where she’s sorting herbs, and a leaf falls on her ear to symbolise her love for being a medicine cat. she only shakes it off when Thistleclaw glares at her.
@@rainbowcheeseyy Which is perfect symbolism as she did kind of want to be a medicine cat but thistle heavily discouraged it so she stopped (till she found out he was evil then ran back to the medicine cat lifestyle).
@@bip-bap4774 i think that the leaf symbolised her questioning her relationship with Thistleclaw and/or her wanting to be a medicine cat, but when she shakes the leaf off her head, it’s kinda like her shoving those thoughts to the back of her mind/ignoring those thoughts. since she shakes the leaf off after Thistleclaw growls/snarls at her, as if to say “don’t think that” or “become a warrior, don’t be a medicine cat.” (i haven’t read Spottedleaf’s heart)
i just adore how you show that spottedleaf is timid and fearful of her crush on fireheart, not just her going like 'ooo i love fireheart c'mere give me kiss fireheart', she is slightly aware of what she's doing, she's doing the same thing that thistleclaw did to her.
I hated that when people said spottedleafs heart wasn't canon because of how bad it made thistle look when it seemed pretty accurate to me. It also made a lot of sense from a story point when we know in the future that spotted basically continued the behavior she got from thistle with firepaw.
Kinda sucks that people hate the book purely because they liked thistle and don't think he's evil when he already was. The fact that they're willing to completely refuse it because of thistle when it's about spottedleafs story of her abuse of thistleclaw.
The book is canon and shows great representation of what it's like to be groomed. It reminded me of my own experience with grooming so I really related to spotted throughout the book. Wish more people were less willing to just ignore canon to do the character they personally like doesn't look bad in their brain.
I don't like how the 'response' to grooming was portrayed - none of the clan seemed to notice it was wrong? And Spottedpaw ended up breaking up with him because he was training in the DF, not because he was actively grooming her. I wish that it had been made clearer, especially in a book for kids.
I enjoyed Thistleclaw as a morally grey villain, but this book...yikes. And there's just so many people who pretend it's not canon because they want to keep their shitty fav.
I feel like it does make sense with his character as opposed to what others say too. he preys on a young girl because he was desperate to be shown love and feel in power at a time where he was feeling vulnerable and powerless due to the loss of his previous mate, snowfur.
You explained my thoughts exactly, of course thistle claw has always been a morally grey character but it really bugs me when people give him the "scourge treatment" and baby him just because he was snowfurs mate. Yes, snowfurs death probably sent him over the edge, but even before then he was heavily hinted at being bloodthirsty and hot headed (everyone seems to forget his glee when his own apprentice attacked a kitten?)
Its awful representation, they basically saw spotted is to blame too. I refuse to accept that as canon. Its a garbage book.
i think it was less thistleclaw being made to be the irredeemable one here and more... how the subject was handled. i'm not against child grooming being a plot point in a children's series, but it HAS to be handled in a manner that makes it clear that the predator's actions are INHERENTLY WRONG. this novella did not handle it that way; instead, it shifted part of the blame on the victim's shoulders, something that should NEVER be done, and only ever implied that thistleclaw's dark forest training was the problem, NOT THE ACTUAL GROOMING. it's not just a bad novella, it's dangerous, in that it handles a problem that its target audience may very well be facing themselves and puts it in a light that might suggest that it's okay to be in these sorts of relationships. THAT is why this novella shouldn't be considered canon material.
Oh this. This is beautiful.
Idk where to start, the ironically cheery music, the excellent art, or the wonderful depiction of the cycle Spottedleaf is unintentionally continuing.
I esp loved the scene at around 1:29 where it kinda switches between Spottedleaf with Firepaw and Spottedpaw with Thistleclaw. Rly unsettling and the "I am loved" kinda shows how Spottedleaf was never shown what healthy love *should* be for her.
Also the use of dogs to show the thinly veiled predatory nature of Thistle is 👌 so on point. Dogs are big, scary, and do noticeable harm (see- brightheart) but subtle manipulation? Much harder to pinpoint, but dangerous all the same and some part of Spottedpaw picks up on that.
I could go on for ages about this dude, it's so good !!
tysm! 😭❤️
Your anatomy is amazing.
It actually looks like she’s a kitten/app/warrior age throughout, which I highly appreciate
Me too. The beginning pounce was revolutionary
I was like THATS a kitten!!!
Your art is amazing and the little symbols you put through the pmv are so touching! Like the leaf on her ear, and she pushing it away because Thistle disaproves it. Or the way she changes the feather to a leaf when she decides to get away from him and be a medcat.
Personally, I don't like Spottedleaf, the way that she acts with Firepaw/heart/star always crept me out. After Spottedleaf's heart, I kinda understood why it didn't look okay. You portrayed her being like Thistle so well! It's pretty sad the way she was a victim, and then repeated what she learned.
the fire x spotted was implemented because she was never shown what healthy love *should* be like. that’s why the unhealthy love she had for him was shown in the video. also, it shows how she copied her own manipulator by being in “love” with fire.
Wow I had to read up on this after watching.
Spottedleaf and Firepaw's feelings towards each other always bugged me because of how little there was to go off of, but I never considered the pedophila aspect of it.
In both cases of Spottedleaf's story, the relationships were dismissed for the wrong reasons. One because she's a medicine cat, and the other because he turns out to be evil. But no issue with the age? The Erins really should have seen how horrible this was. Especially when writing to a young audience. It's scary how the darkest parts of fantasy are the parts that are real.
This pmv however was phenomenal at showing exactly how it should have been in the books. How her own grooming impacted her and led her in the footsteps of the one who took advantage of her. Wonderfully shown here!
@SkyTwerp Yeah but wasn't he like 8 in cat years when he joined
Honestly we can blame spottedleaf/firestar on fan pressure. It never read romance to me from the first arc. More like fire paw had a crush on a pretty she cat and that was the end of it. It was only after fans and I think the wiki monitor at the time pushing for more.
I see where they were trying to go with it, "Cats feel different about ages than humans do." and while that is true, these are anthro characters. They feel and think the same way we do in every prospect in the books, except age??
Edit: I like the concept of Firepaw having a lil boy crush on Spotty, but to go so far with it is a no-go.
@@flamingaxolotl3558 Yeah exactly. When you give a fantasy creature human-level of thought, then you also need (at a minimum) human-level of consent.
I think Thistle x Spotted absolutely had to do with age and it came through pretty clearly that he was manipulating a young child, they just could've been more explicit with "this is bad!!!" considering their audience are younger people. Fire x spotted and other just weirdly justified age gap relationships rub me the wrong way tho fs
As someone who is about 50 to 60% Native American, the feather behind the ear is not offensive. It's just a cat wearing a feather. It's not cultural appropriation.
thank god
Why would anyone be ofended?
@@Snekysnitch "cultural appropriation" or some bs man idk
@@Snekysnitch because people are rtards
Agreed! As someone who is almost full Native, I could care less! In fact, it's kind of nice seeing that it was used as a way to represent strength in certain things, and the fact people are seeing it as a negative thing just seems rude to he culture itself.
I really love the thought that went into this pmv and the analysis of the psychological effect Thistleclaw had on Spottedleaf. Spottedleaf’s Heart as a book def wasn’t handled well, and should have shown the children the warning signs of grooming and it’s dangers better, but I do believe the book does help you understand Spottedleaf’s mind a bit better than in the main series. This pmv shows the cycle of grooming and how Spottedleaf has become normalized to something that psychologically messed her up so much. Also this pmv also made me realize how Thistleclaw’s grooming could have also made her feel like she had to be with a mate to be worthwhile, which is very tragic and awful but it adds way more depth into her character and her struggles. This song is about a woman who was told to be an object for a man her whole life and she feels she has to be dependent to be worthy, and I feel like this reflects upon Spottedleaf and her trauma very well! It also explains why she literally gave up her soul to save Firestar from death when he never loved her the same as he loved Sandstorm. This art is phenomenal, the symbolism is SO AMAZING (specially the feathers and the leaf?? So good), and the thought put into this is evident! Great job!! This story is very tragic and is def a warning call to watchers, but you told it stunningly!
It was sandstorm not firestar. Spotted leaf was protecting her from mapleshade in the battle with the dark forest.
I know I’m kinda late, but I really like this! It shows how her relationship with Thistleclaw really messed her up and made her not see any problems with her liking Firestar. Nice!
oh this is LOVELY....it really demonstrates how she gets stuck in a cycle thats normalized for her and how she unintentionally does the same thing that hurt her to fire. i love your style & designs as well
When the shots between Firestar and Spottedleaf flashed back and forth between images of her and Thistleclaw as they were looking at each other, I legit got goosebumps. Probably one of my favorite pmvs of the year so far. ;;
Yeah, you could also see her reaching her paw closer to fire’s, But she slowly retracts it, because she never wants to be like thistle, and never wants fire to experience the suffering she went through
God this pmv IS SO FANTASTIC!! The way all the images flash to different characters,,, Spotted shaking away the feather Thistle gave her,, god its SO GOOD
It's so nice to see content not afraid to "demonize thistleclaw" or acknowledge the existence of SH and actually help people understand what Spottedleaf went through wasn't ok
Mitski
So true so true
Mktski :o
mitski
Mitski.
mitski gets a yes from me
It makes me sad that it was probably because of Thistleclaw that she thought being with someone young was normal and began To crush on Firestar when he was only a apprentice and she had been a medicine cat for a long time. *Sad noises*
Somebody finally decided to talk about how messed up Spottedleaf and Firepaw’s relationship actually is!! I thought I was the only one that was bothered by it.
Late but no you aren’t alone, it made me uncomfortable too, it seemed off, like REALLY off even after she died, it felt so....weird.
@@duckieboo9065 it feels even weirder when many characters in the books are encouraging it as if there was nothing wrong.
@@Lamrabetnouha Yeah, and with the promise she made to Fire, when he literally has a wife, children and grandchildren, and how they killed her ghost off was...dumb? Like Fire would probably choose Sand over a childhood crush, but that's what i heard at least.
@@duckieboo9065 ikr, I still don't understand why they killed off her ghost like that tho.
really love that you included her repeating the trauma cycle with firepaw(/heart/star) so very sadly true to how that kind of abuse can affect some victims. Spottedleaf's life was short and sad, with a put-on cheery face.... SUCH a good pmv ty for sharing it with us :')
I like how the colors get less vibrant or overly vibrant whenever somehing that may be considered as danger or an unhappy thought appears near spotted but when we see her playing with the leaves as an apprentice, playing on the nursery as a kid, dping med cat things or watching fire its just all vibrant and happy, its a really cool detail.
as a CSA survivor I love this so much. I don’t like when people call Spottedleafs Heart non-canonical because it makes sense as to why Spotted basically nearly groomed Fire and it honestly fits Thistles character. they could’ve done so much better with it, yes, but we shouldn’t ignore the fact that Thistle is a predator either way
But ig Spottedleaf was strong enough to not groom him. After all she said that she was fine with him being mates with Sandstorm.
@@Igottagowalkmyfish Not really that strong as she still stalked his dreams to the point it made even sandstorm uncomfortable..frequent visits from starclan let alone the same cat each time are unheard of and honestly inappropriate. Her mouth said he should move on but her actions did not, she obsessed with him
@@testerwulf3357 true true
Wow, I’m so sorry about what’s happened to you. Also what you said about this, is a good amount of what I think.
this is like the 5th time we’ve been in the same comment sections-
As someone who has been groomed, spottedleafs heart is a book I’ve been avoided. I was thankfully able to realize that “wait he’s 17 and I’m 13 this isn’t right.” Before anything truly bad happened. A lot of people gloss over how spottedleaf was years older than firepaw when he joined the clans. I don’t have a problem with ravenpaw and barley because raven was less than a moon away from becoming a warrior when he left for the barns and they probably waited a few months before getting into a relationship. Sorreltail and brackenfur because they were not in a relationship until she was an adult even if she was still a young one. Squilf and ashfur or squilf and brambleclaw is not a good ship imo. She was a paw when she started dating bramble and she is around 3-4 years younger than ashfur and he’s her uncle!
Ashfur is no longer canonically her uncle.
Wait Ravenpaw and Barley are together?
Why has no one told me this? That’s adorable!
oh man, this reminds me of a friend who was gr00med by a 17 year old (they were 13) but they sadly realized it too late and they are now depressed n obsessed with him. i have tried helping them the best i could but we haven't talked in a while
@@sup7499 they’re not canonly together but a good 99% of the fandom ships it, and it’s canon they cared for eachother very deeply. so i suppose you could say implied ? but i believe that’s why they said the “ship” raven x barely instead of just “the relationship”
@@sun_sign You're right when you said that their not canonly together, although it's made very clear that they are. The reason that its not fully announced in the books is because in homophobic countries the book wouldn't be able to be sold. Also, I haven't yet read their manga yet but I saw someone say that in the manga a kit asked if ravenpaw and barley had kits of their own, pretty much confirming their relationship.
edit: I've read the manga now and Barley's niece asks Ravenpaw if he has any kits with Barley, to which Ravenpaw replies no.
this pmv freaks me out… the “innocent” head tilt when thistleclaw first approached spottedkit. spottedpaw seeing thistleclaw as a dog, trying to “attack” her. continuing the cycle. seeing thistleclaw in herself. seeing the young, clueless version of her in firepaw. this made my gut twist. amazing song choice! 🩷
Honestly, I admire what the Erins *tried* to do with Spottedleaf’s Heart. They wanted to teach kids about some of the dangers of grooming and how it feels through Spottedleaf, but they just didn’t do it very well lol. Also, I think it’s kinda funny that people were like, “Thistleclaw didn’t deserve the DF, he didn’t do anything wrong and it was just Bluefur being suspicious!” And they got a book with a possible explanation, and now they consider it non-canon because they actually like Thistle now??? Anyways, props to u my dude 😄
Even tho he let tigerpaw try to kill tiny for no reason and ppl still say he didnt deserve hell
I consider the book not-canon because it's abhorrently written.
@@teacoon6399 that’s why I say the Erins TRIED to write a decent story lol
YES
@@teacoon6399 practically every book is badly written or mostly badly written, the whole series isn't canon then? i get the could've made this book a LOT better, like miles better, but you can't just say spottedleaf didn't go through it because bad writing
I don’t like Spottedleaf but now that I think about it, her situation is the same as people who accidentally portray their own traumas onto other people and recreate their abuser’s actions to fill the gap in them, and she did to Firepaw (who should’ve been 10-13 in human years when he met Spottedleaf) what Thistleclaw did to her
I believe spottedleaf would have been in her early 20s since ,from my memory, she was described as a young adult
@@Partyboxd
Considering the timeline I’d say she would be in her 30’s
@@Partyboxd I believe they described Spotted as not too older than Firepaw when he first came to the clans, from what I remember.
SUCH A LATE REPLY LMAO
@@kumeoii ITS ALL GOOD LOL
@@Partyboxd LOL
The symbolism is really top notch. I really love the coloring too, especially on spotted fur. I think its important to show how damaging these things are and how they become a cycle, so excellent job spreading awareness.
This is what I wished spottedleafs heart should have been. If the Erin’s had actually explored the theme properly, there could have been a really poignant message and cautionary tale. But, as per every warriors book ever, the little pieces are promising but undeveloped (and in spottedleafs heart, dangerous), only to be outshined by headcannons and fan works like this that put the pieces together in a logical way
when i realized you were showing how she was repeating that cycle...god, chills. The drawings and storytelling are so lovely. That's an instant subscribe from me
The way that at 1:37 Spottedleaf reaches for Firepaw's paw but deciding against it might be a sign of her remembering Thistleclaw's actions is really cool.
I know this is a 2 year old pmv at this point but I do want to talk a bit about how I interpreted the shot at "When he walks in, I am loved, I am loved" where Spottedleaf and Firepaw are standing facing each other because I think there's actually a lot of really interesting stuff packed into those few seconds that you can dig into if you slow it down and look at how the flashing replacements are somewhat sequential.
We start with Firepaw and Spottedleaf in the present.
Spottedleaf then becomes Spottedkit looking up at Firepaw. She remembers how she felt about Thistleclaw and she can feel similar feelings bubbling up about Firepaw.
After that, Thistleclaw stands in Firepaw's place, and Spottedkit becomes Spottedleaf again. She's still grappling with her feelings about Thistleclaw, but this time from the perspective of an adult rather than a child.
Then, Firepaw's place is taken by Spottedkit, and Spottedkit and Spottedleaf make eye contact. Spottedleaf feels like she's looking at a version of her younger self through Firepaw.
And then, Firepaw is back in place, and Thistleclaw takes Spottedleaf's. Now, after seeing Firepaw as her younger self, she's seeing herself as another version of Thistleclaw, her abuser.
And then it switches back to Firepaw and Spottedleaf.
If this was intentional, and I think it almost has to be, I applaud how much storytelling you managed to put into such a short amount of time!
it was! glad it was understood
HOLY CRAP THIS IS SO SO WELL DONE!!! i am so so happy you made the connection between spottedthistle and spottedfire. it is very clear thru what you did that she is repeating what she was taught by thistleclaw.
this pmv is stunning. i love the use of the song lyrics and how you actually made spottedleaf look little when she was a kit + paw. you rlly have fleshed spottedleaf into a wounded character who repeats all she has known her entire life. welllll donee :)
I love the way this shows the tragedy of Spottedleaf's situation while also addressing concerns with her behavior towards Firepaw. I think it's easy to fall into the trap of "there was nothing wrong with her" or "She was 100% a gr**mer" and I think this is a nice change of pace. I like the idea of her seeing Firepaw's feelings, thinking it's normal to reciprocate (because in her experience with Thistle, she didn't get to know boundaries and might not have even understood that he had strong feelings for her as an apprentice, she might've though she was SUPPOSED to reciprocate as an older cat), but also in the back of her mind thinking of Thistleclaw and not ending up doing it. It portrays the cycle of abuse, condemns any potential of SpottedFire, but doesn't demonize an abuse victim who didn't do anything overtly wrong.
I like this look on it too, I think stuff like this needs to be talked about it more. But Spottedleaf's age was ret-conned later on, their age gap is a result of that. She was never given a canonical age from the start, just vaguely described as "young and pretty". In the context of the first series, it can be assumed she wasn't much older than Firepaw, if at all. She also never really showed attraction or tried to pursue him until after she had died.
To those worried about the feather on the ear, please don’t say anything about it unless you’re indigenous. We don’t need you guys getting offended for us, thank you. :)
Hmm. I like how she was ABOUT to put her paw on Firepaws and stopped. I think she realizes how bad the situation with Thistleclaw was and she didn’t WANT to repeat it for his sake. She only began to react in a more loving way once he was officially a warrior and I suppose officially 18+. Which Dustpelt respectfully did for Ferncloud too, though she might have been just about old enough too since all the apprentices wanted to be made warriors then
1:36 Damn, that little part of Spottedleaf pulling her paw back as if stopping herself from repeating the cycle of abuse she was taught moons ago is so fucking deep to me...
why does every medicine cat in these books never actually want to be a med cat
On top of that, ALL of them(beyond Featherwhisker) had a crush. I swear to god.
- Spottedleaf: crush on Firestar
- Yellowfang: mates with Raggedstar
- Cinderpelt: crush on Firestar
- Leafpool: mates with Crowfeather
- Jayfeather: crush on Half Moon
- I didn’t read about Alderheart, but I’ve heard he and medicine cats after him also had ships.
┻━┻︵ \ (°□°) / ︵ ┻━┻
Edit to add: literally everyone complains this is a stupid rule, and they bring up valid points as to why it’s stupid. So everyone has forbidden ships, that shouldn’t be forbidden. Thanks Erin Hunter.
@@hcspaw2168 Alderheart had feelings for Needletail and Velvet
Wrong, mothwing exists
@@Crow_withaphone fr
@@Crow_withaphone I mean, The New Prophecy did imply something going on with Mothwing and Leafpool up until Twilight when Leafpool got with Crowfeather.
Guys the feather discussion does not bother me! It's fine! (see the vid description) Something was brought to my attention (TWO YEARS AGO BTW) and I wrote a note on it, thats it. If you want to debate the subject (paticularly if you're Indiginous) thats fine, discussions like that are really important. I just don't want to see any more comments trying to like defend(??) me or be insulted on my behalf--- its fine, guys. I'm not being cancelled or anything. It was a brief note about a cat animatic. There is no huge drama here, just someone bringing something to my attention!
ya know, i decided to look up the ages of spottedleaf and whitestorm after seeing this and the fact that she is younger then his own son really makes this even worse, like whitestorm would have like been a senior apprintece/young warrior when SHE WAS BORN
Really appreciate some people in the animation community stepping up and making content that the Erin's are too cowardly to make
thE FRICKIN...... when fireheart and spottedleaf turn into spottedpaw and thistleclaw- I got cHILLS
oh wow this is so good, your spottedleaf is so cute and i’m glad to see such a thoughtful take on their ‘relationship!’ the abstracts ideas vis imagery is super strong
1. I love the idea of this! The leaf-feather symbolism, I can't!
2. I love how you portrayed how toxic ThistleSpotted influenced Spottedleaf to choose a young tom.
3. The moonpool schene with spotted is a masterpiece.
4. HER DESIGN IS TOO PRETTY
Ps. I can't stop watching it over and over again
I know that this is kind of old, but I couldn't *not* point this out. This animation portrays Spottedleaf as a wounded, traumatized character rather than the flirty medicine cat that most fan work(as well as the books) show her to be. It really makes her into an actual character that people can relate to and sympathize with, rather than some one-dimensional forbidden love interest for Fireheart. I admire the hell out of this animation and the creator of it for giving people a new, much more realistic perspective on Spottedleaf.
Oh my god this is amazing!!! The art is fantastic!!! And the timing-perfection! Thank you for drawing connections between Spottedfire and spottedthistle, I feel like no one sees that connection haha!
FINALLY. Someone making a PMV about this. It's fantastic! Too many people rant about how Thistleclaw x Spottedpaw was disgusting then ignored Spottedleaf doing basically the same to Firepaw. I love how sad and realistic this entire thing is.
Could you explain to me how it is the same? I never saw anything like an emotional manipulation by her to Fireheart, I think she was always taking care of him and the other members of the clan, also I always respect the relationship of Fireheart and Sandstorm, I even sacrifice her soul for her.
If it is because of the great age difference, I personally don't care because they are cats, I am sure that in real life there are pairs of mates with greater age differences.
When the so g said,"me and my husband." My headphones alert went off and the video sounded like it said, "me and my low battery."
“Me and my low battery..”
Lyrical genius
It’s incredibly refreshing to see SH portrayed as the horrific thing it was instead of just pushing it off to the side and pretending it didn’t happen because of how it was written. SH was poorly done, but this pmv definitely fixes a lot of what was wrong with it. Thistle is clearly shown as being a predator which!! Yeah!
The ties between what happened to spottedleaf and how she acted towards firepaw/heart/star are something I never really considered before this, but holy sh- it makes so much sense now. I highly doubt that was intentional when they were writing warriors but it just makes sense in hindsight
Overall- good video, big brain, holy hell this is great!
I hate what they did to Thistleclaw. He was a huge comfort character to me back in the day. Im a CSA survivor,, and then out of nowhere they made him a p*dophile.
That broke my heart.
Dude, what? He’s always been evil, ever since he was in Bluestar’s Prophecy he was evil. They didn’t “do anything” to Thistleclaw; Thistleclaw was always bad.
@@pansysoupbrand6558 He's never been a great cat, and by no means am i justifying his ill-intentions from before.. However, I consider p**ophilia to be on a completely seperate LEAGUE of just.. Heinous.
One that I don't believe has any place in Warriors while being marketed as a series for young adolescents when it's protrayed in such a half-assed light. There was absolutely zero reason to take pre-established characters from a pre-established narrative and changing lore last-minute into something so detrementally serious just for "more dePtH" to a long dead character in a little side novel. It puts such a bad taste in my mouth and doesn't even BEGIN to touch upon how poorly the entire scenario was written and the way it ended.
This is also not mentioning the sudden jarring change in mentality that was given to Thistleclaw in this one-off book that even the author who wrote it apologized for.
He went from an angsty widower who thought violence was the answer to straight up something as despicable and dead serious as a full blown _child predator._
That is NOT on the same league from what he was before. I'd be damned if I said that wasn't "something."
I could go on and on.
Wow, its almost like evil people can be evil-er
@@geministrial950 I didn't call him good lmao.
Also if you think child predation is on the same leauge of "bad" and "evil" as the average stereotypical "grrr violence is the answer im angsty" in the world of warrior cats.. I literally just don't wanna explain why thats just a no brainer.
You're also missing the point of how just inappropriate the entire thing really was from a storytelling standpoint.
I'm glad to finally find someone who agrees with me on this :') I've noticed a lot of people saying he was "already evil" before Spottedleaf's Heart and that's so weird to me
one of my favourite songs and one of my favourite characters. i absolutely love this, the way you portrayed it was beautifully sad.. i loved the greying colours and the symbolism with the leaves, and the fact that her relationship with firestar was like a mirror of her childhood.
I really love the pmv, so much so that I was rewatched this multiple times. I just noticed that in 1:38 the colors become more dull. I don't know if it was intentional, but if it was, I really like that detail. It shows that Firestar was growing more distant from Spottedleaf and got a new love interest, he moved on. And I feel like Spottedleaf felt awful about that because she genuinely loved Firestar.
I love how SpottedLeaf's mom saw this creepy tom that's basicly her age and said: thats a great cat to be near my small daughter!
@akeiraa-tr3mi her mother is SwiftBreeze acordind to the wiki
This is one of the most interesting animation I ever seen. The circle of abuse when Spottedleaf grew older, how Spottedleaf didn’t know what happened to her until she grew older, I just love how you show it!
This totally changed how I feel about Spottedleaf.
This video explains EXACTLY why spottedleaf is one of my favorite cats, I find her story so unbelievably tragic and this shows exactly what I mean
This PMV points out that yeah, Thistleclaw is nasty, beyond nasty, but actually reminded me that Spottedleaf did... essentially the same thing without realizing it. There was so much unspeakable emotion in the simple facial expressions and interacts of the characters, this was beautiful. Thank you.
i love how you portrayed the cycle of abuse in this!!!!!! spottedleaf obviously should never have felt that way for firepaw but so many people ignore that it stems from her being groomed herself... your art and this pmv is awesome :D
What an excellent use for this song 👀 I think your video addresses the whole Spottedleaf situation very tastefully. And your art is excellent, of course! I’m so glad your video popped up in my recommended feed!
While I'm never going to be a fan of spottedleaf's heart and how the retconned thistleclaw to excuse the fact he was in the dark forest (and how terribly it handled the very dark subject matter it tackled in general) this pmv is absolutely gorgeous and if they were going to have that kind of plot point, this is exactly what i would have wanted out of it. ive rewatched this so many times since i stumbled across it and the subtle symbolism is so nice. My favorite part had to be when firepaw walked up to spotted and the images cycled through old flashes of spottedleaf and thistleclaw. It's such a simple and impactful way to show how this has become a cycle, and just how long lasting and damaging the effects of grooming can be, especially when spottedleaf never truly learned better. There was practically no one she could have gone to about this.
One thing that did confuse me a bit was the scene where spotted reaches for fire's paw but stops herself, and then the forms shift. Are they meant to be spotted and thistle? Or another cat? Because the brown of that cat more closely resembles the brown cat in the shot following it. It also kinda looks like it is still just spotted and fire, only with the colors faded, and im also really curious about what the faded colors symbolize.
Thank you so much! Honestly, I just thought the color thing was angsty haha, like representing how she feels inside
Random, but I like the way you drew thistleclaws eyes. It really does make him look unsettling.
I like the idea that when Spottedleaf dies, she doesn’t become bitter/evil (like some AUs I’ve seen), but instead she can think back on her life and realize she and Firepaw shouldn’t/couldn’t ever have been more than friends. She would never want to be like Thistleclaw, who she can see in herself at times (as the PMV shows). Idk, that’s just a little headcanon I thought of while watching this. :)) rlly cool btw
(btw, the evil Spottedleaf AUs are all super cool and creative, no hate to them at all ❤)
Wow!! I love this sm! The symbolism with the leaf and feathers are so clever. My favorite part is at "I am loved," when the images of fire and spotted change to spotted and thistle, it's so unnerving and haunting as it shows the cycle of her unhealthy view of a relationship
Funfact about me actually: whenever i get uncomfortable or bothered or smth like that (usually abt trauma) i watch this video on repeat, idk why, it just is like conforting ig?? It makes me feel im not alone?? but i guess its silly to say you dont feel alone bc of a warrior cats character
Great video and great art! I think since spottedleaf's heart people are quick to jump to thistle's defence and say it's "out of character" or "an excuse to get him in the dark forest" forget that as far back as Forest of secrets Thistleclaw is shown to be bad news
Yeah, bad news in the sense that he likes bloodshed. Not in this kind of way.
I love everything about this animatic sm.
It's a really scarily accurate portrayal of grooming but you managed to capture it with a level of sensitivity that I dont think Spottedleaf's Heart could manage.
The leaf falling on her feather scene and the feather symbolism in generally really stuck with me when rewatching this.
All around this is just very, very good you did a great job with this and I hope ur proud! :)
From what I’ve read in the series it did feel like Spottedleaf was interested in Firepaw and I think that might’ve been a trauma response. Not saying that it makes it ok because he was literally an apprentice. But I do think it was a trauma response cause yknow how people that have been abused or neglected as a child usually end up doing the same to their kids? But I really think Spottedleaf doesn’t get enough credit for not continuing the cycle of trauma.
Yes, as doing the BARE MINIMUM of being a lawful person by just NOT GROOMING KIDS should always be congratulated. Hey, I’m not doing it, why aren’t you credit me for that?
I want an AU where Thistle’claw saw spottedleaf as a daughter, not a fvcking LOVE INTEREST
i want an AU where Thistleclaw never existed
I feel so bad for SnowFur and SpottedLeaf for dealing with him....
yas@@puginagift2916
All the stupid people calling it appropriation, don't listen to them, you can draw whatever you like and they can suck it up. it looks beautiful
A feather behind the ear is given to respected members of indigenous culture and or to their elders, and the feather goes back thousands of years ago and is sacred to their culture. (This is going off based on what I have researched/learned, but you should do your own research to have a better understanding of it, and it's very much recommended as you'll learn a lot more than you'd think.)
They're not being stuck up, it's just a factor of religion like how some people pray in churches or do other celebrations such as Hanukkah instead of Christmas just because it's different cultures. Please do not comment before doing your own research! /lh /gen
@@rosepeltanimations its just a cat with a feather lmfao people really do want to complain about anything these days
@@Kilathasaurus I’m not complaining…? Dude just do your own research, even the creator acknowledge their own mistake so maybe you should too.
YES, this book is about god damn CATS. people rlly need to grow up these days lmao
@@rosepeltanimationsthis comment is rather old, but would this include feather pens? Because I have a smeargle (pkmn) OC who wears a feather on his ear for art stuff, since his tail is less precise
(I am writing via Google Translator)
I rarely write comments, especially through a translator, but this video caused me a lot of emotions
why one fan-made animatic tells the story better than the original book. The Hunters understood what they were taking on and realized that this was a very NOT CHILDREN'S topic. and if they decided to cover it in a CHILDREN'S book (or at least a book for minors), then why did they do it so poorly? there are absolutely no consequences from Thistleclaw's antics, except for the Spottedleaf and Firepaw lines. Such violence leaves behind deeper and most often irreparable psychological trauma. To all this, no moral can be extracted from the books, the situation boils down to the fact that Thistleclaw was simply training in the dark forest, and the fact that he was dating a cat even younger than his own son remains in the background. I'm sad that my favorite writers killed the entire message that the book had. Many thanks to the author and fans who covered this topic instead of the Erins. I am in a close relationship with a victim of pedophilia, and he is very happy that they talk, draw, write about such a sensitive topic.
I mostly doesn't really comment to videos, but OH MY GOD-
The representation, the animation, the designs, the mood of this PMV.. I literally watched it like 20 times!? Spottedleaf is a very underrated character, and I like her so much actually!
I love the scenes where Thristleclaw's shadow attacks Spottedleaf, and I can understand all of her feelings throughout the PMV.
Thank you for uploading this!!:)
*don't
Sorry my English is bad haha-
Coming back to this old comment, I like her younger version, but not her older one, because she's weird to Firestar!!! And I do not support that-
It is a crime to be this underrated.
This pmv gives a lot more character to Spottedleaf than any of the books ever did. I'm not joking. Personalities, motives and all are consistent. The drawings speak to us better than a narrative
If you pause right at 1:32, it’s spotted leaf looking at her younger self. Youre welcome.
Your art is super good, I love it! Also the idea of this pmv is absolutely amazing, Spottedleaf is my favourite chearacter and I'm so happy someone made a pmv about her, beautiful job! ^^
This video is how I discoverd mistski, and somehow every time I watch I still get that horrible feeling in my chest. Spottedleaf is so overlooked.
This animatic brought me to tears.
1:28 i love how this part shows the way the cycle of things affected her
Every shot with Thistle and Spotted together terrifies me. My heart literally starts speeding up.
Oh wow! I love it!
Honestly, I don't like Spottedleaf because FireXSpott makes me feel uncomfortable and ... I'm scared of her okay? xD
But i love this pmv! It's amazing! I'm pretty sure you used magic for it!
🧙
I hated Spottedleaf in the first series, but to be honest, my opinion of her has really changed. I think she has a really interesting backstory, and it explaines alot about her.
This animation is one of my FAVOURITE warrior cat animations
I always stumble upon this from time to time and every time I do I always watch it
this is such a good pmv
i love the designs, the movements, emotions, theyre so expressive
and the book itself disgusts me, but this was the best one ive seen about it
god, its just
wow
I gotta say I just keep going back to this one. Its so well made and I love the song choice! While I imagine the Erins didn't intend this, the way that Spottedleaf ended up going after a young boy made this so very interesting, and it would have been cool to see more actual good trauma writing in warriors that didn't involve death. Sadly Spottedleafs story was terribly written but this animatic makes it so much better! incredible work
the anatomy... it gives me a happy feeling
1:28 - 1:32 always gives me chills GOD
Spottedleaf isnt many people's favourite character but I love how this PMV shows her story in a different light. Theres definitely a sense of tragedy to her cycle of abusive, the age gap between her and fireheart seems much more unsettling now. (Also the upbeat music representing spottedleafs denial just makes everything hit so much harder)
I dont trust ppl who say spottedleaf's heart isnt cannon, i get that it wasn't written all that good but completley saying its uncannon is so stupid
I thought ppl considered non-canon because the way it portrayed these types of relationships as the victim’s fault, turns out they just wanna Stan Thistleclaw eww
@@mochamonster6956 I don't really view it as canon because of how it's written actually. Fuck Thistleclaw, he's a pos.
It's hard to explain, but I view what HAPPENED as canon, but not how the book portrayed it.
I don't see the the way it was written as canon, but the fact that Thistle did this shit is canon in mind. The book is horribly written and is disgusting in how it handles the topic. I'd love to see it rewritten properly, but they (the erins, the writting partners, whomever) did a shit writing job.
Memories from when i asked what everyones favorite cat from the books are and someone said:
“Thistleclaw, I dont know why LOL”
what
I used to be like that, but I have trouble liking him as much as I used to because of my own experience. Now I just think he's fun to draw.
Imagine if someone says in the comments " What a lovely ship! I love the ship spotted × thistle"
@akeiraa-tr3mi ⚱️ here you go!
As someone of Cherokee descent (I think from around the time of World War 1 or so), don’t think putting feathers behind the ear is offensive. If anything, I feel like white people complaining about it is more offensive.
Yes, I know some of the critics of that art trope are indigenous, but we’re not a monolith. You have to listen to indigenous voices, not just indigenous voices you agree with.
spottedleaf didnt deserve her fate :( she was such a good character, its sad she was only ever in the first book
She actually has her own book! SpottedLeafs Heart, it’s what this book is talking. It was really sad.
@@M0V3D_ACC0UNT really?? im only on fire and ice and didnt know that, thank you !! i might actually buy it
@@UnhealthyCatObsession.. Nice, hope you enjoy the series so far!
@@UnhealthyCatObsession.. I meant to say this video was talking about spotted leafs heart- not the book one last thing before you get the book tho, there are mentions of grooming and paedophilia so just to make sure ur comfortable with seeing that when u read it
@@M0V3D_ACC0UNT i dont mind topics , but thanks!
Thank you for being one of the few people to acknowledge how messed up Spottedleaf and Firestar’s relationship is as well
really love how you used vibrant and dull colors to show emotion!! this is a really good pmv!
I like how Spottedleaf looks really soft and Thistleclaw is more pointy.
I love how you designed her face based on how she looks in the book art. Nice.
The fact that Spottedleaf did it too. She was in love with firepaw when she was 40+ moons (4 years old) and he was 6 month old. 😢