DPAC met with Transport Canada: Big Changes Coming! And Other News!

[@timgoff2872]

It sounds as if with each layer of peeling back the onion, the onion continues to get larger with even more layers! Thank you Don (and DPAC team) for all of the work you are doing to shape the future of drone use. Congratulations DPAC on the second anniversary, with many more anniversaries to come.

[@DonJoyce]

Yes...and lots of tears with this onion peeling...LOL! Thanks for your support!

[@PhantomHodgesDrone]

I would personally like to thank you and the team, for keeping us updated on articles like this because otherwise we would have never know about changes and your fight to help drone pilots here in Canada

[@DonJoyce]

And thank you for your support!

[@davestredulinsky]

Hi Don. Congratulations on the 2 year anniversary of DPAC. Thank you for the meeting summary and all that you do with DPAC.

[@DonJoyce]

Thank you for your support, Dave!

[@Aerosnapper]

The willingness of Transport Canada to engage with the substantial drone community represented by DPAC is welcome and greatly appreciated. This report is clear and concise - qualities that are always greatly appreciated too - thank you, Don - and DPAC. Happy Anniversary

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks, Mike! It was a good meeting!

[@MicheIIePucca]

I only have a sub 250g drone, but, I feel a duty to keep on top of drone regulations, just to avoid surprises and ensure I'm not doing something in violation of the many rules out there. Thank you for providing these updates!!

[@DonJoyce]

Glad to hear you're keeping your eyes on these updates, even as a sub250g drone pilot!

[@Westlake]

Thanks for the update Don and a big congrats on the 2 year anniversary of DPAC, and to the steering committee members for their work and for advocating for us.
Nice to hear that the TC RPAS Taskforce is lending an ear to the suggestions of the committee.
Appreciate all your efforts. :)

[@DonJoyce]

Thank you! Yes, the TC folks are great to work with.

[@philbailey509]

Am I the only one who noticed that you changed to a cartoon at 3:47 !?

[@IamHerk]

No, you are not.

[@DonJoyce]

Yeah...well that's what would happen if I worked for the government! LOL

[@PhilBaileyChannel]

@@DonJoyce Yes, I've been a contractor to government departments before. Indeed, it did turn me into something that only resembled my former self!

[@coffeegonewrong]

Oh good. I was worried the Matrix was glitching.

[@Steph6n]

that gave me an honest fright, I was in such concentration paying attention to a serious topic, I wasn't expecting that!

[@Drones4U2FLY]

Thx again Don for the updates

[@DonJoyce]

You are very welcome! Thanks for watching!

[@PinetreeLine]

Great stuff Don! You and DPAC are doing an amazing job! Thanks Brother!

[@DonJoyce]

Appreciate the support, Doug!

[@rreiter]

Thanks for the updates Don!

[@DonJoyce]

You're welcome!

[@MadMajor86]

Thanks, Don. Great work by your team.

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks!

[@AndrewMoizer]

Appreciate the updates you give Don, and all the work that goes into them. It does sound that things are pretty much set already then.

[@DonJoyce]

It's not really surprising that we should expect only relatively minor tweaks...but disappointing since they have been receiving consistent feedback on the regulations for years.

[@AndrewMoizer]

@@DonJoyceyes, I mean if nothing really changes through the feedback then it’s essentially a waste of time. Obviously they have made their decisions based on some fairly entrenched positions, influenced by someone/something. I guess this stems from the mass market sales of ‘drones’ compared to the niche that was RC/“quadcopters”.
(I almost feel I need to add a “and get off my lawn” to this LOL. )

[@jacquesdubord6844]

Hi Don. Concerning the exemple of a perigrin bird been hit by a drone, birds are everywhere. As a wildlife photographer, I don't see it as an excuse. There are much more birds hitted by airplanes, helicopters and wind turbines every day. I live in St Hubert Quebec not far from the airport where we can observe many Hawks, white Owls, Crows and many others. There are small aircraft schools which many attend for recreational purpose. You know that it is much more easier to avoid a flying bird with a drone than with an airplane. Bye Don and thanks for your implication.

[@Tango4N]

Wind turbines kill a lot of birds too but that conversation will never happen.

[@TheParadigmShiftTV]

I agree, birds are everywhere. Not being able to fly in provincial or other parks is ridiculous. You can be in the middle of nowhere with no one around and no birds and it's still against the rules someone made up. You can torture animals to death by hooking them in the face and suffocating them (fishing) but oh no a drone makes noise! You can even shoot bird in the air (hunting) and no one bats an eye.

[@1stsquadrone810]

Birds are usually flying at certain altitudes, smaller birds are found closer to the ground sparrows etc, the alpha birds fly higher, eagles, hawks etc generaly if you want to avoid birds fly above there position in the skies food chain...flying 300' over a park would substantially avoid disturbing animals and birds, and if you do encounter a bird(s) "punching" out is the safest recommended method for avoiding a bird attack/collisions, birds can not catch up to a drone ascending vertically, dropping down is the worse thing you can do because the bird can easily dive on you as well. another great video Thanks!

[@EDSC_CANADA]

There is a ton of birds nesting within city limits. I've had WAY more bird encounters in populated areas than in nature, so not a valid argument in my opinion. When I'm mapping a roof or doing an inspection in a populated area there is always birds that will check out my drone, every single flight, 100% of the time [usually pigeons or swallows]. The only time I don't experience that is in nature when I'm just filming, and it's maybe the odd time I encounter one but very rare.

[@TomStoncel]

If Transport Canada, Parks Canada, etc. were really concerned about drones disturbing wildlife (noise), they would ban all motorcycles, sports cars, old noisy cars, etc.
You can literally hear these from mountain tops echoing in the valleys. I don't know how many times I've encountered whole convoys of motorcycles or car enthusiast clubs roaring down the Icefields Parkway in the Rockies. But heaven forbid someone uses a single drone at 1/10 the noise, it's a crime against nature.
They're perfectly legal because we live in a car and gas engine-centric society and that's normal. The blatant hypocrisy is telling how biased even smart people are against new technology and accepting of old because it's common.

[@flightographist]

We already have laws for that- they are not enforced.

[@Woodburner100]

I’m to the point on almost everything where I don’t care about any idiotic rules or laws or whatever at all. If I’m going to potentially disturb someone I won’t proceed with whatever I’m doing whether it’s lawful or not. And if I’m not a hazard or a nuisance I’ll do whatever I doggone well please whether it’s lawful or not. I’m just fed up with stupid people, stupid government, stupid rules. I live in the hinterlands and stay out of everyones’ way and if somebody has a problem with that then I can only assume they’re looking for someone to prey on in order to prop up their own moral superiority.
Now that’s a rant from a grumpy old man!

[@zira_fluff4105]

Well said @oldengineguy. We have CAR 900.06 which is essentially the "don't be stupid" rule - it is enough for sub250 and is the only rule that makes sense. All the rest is busy body encroachment rules to keep the narrative of safety and policy makers employed. I live near a provincial park and the number of straight pipe motorcycles (and some cars) that rip through it is insane - but NOTHING is done about it even though noise bylaws are blatantly ignored. And here we have some posters on this YT whining about a little bit of buzzing disturbing them.

[@clydemurray4050]

Great updated information Don thank you

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks, Clyde!

[@martytimusk]

Great content once again Don. Always worth the listen. Thx for all you and DPAC do.

[@DonJoyce]

Thank you, Marty!

[@jimsdroneing]

more great info Don

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks, Jim!

[@AsgardStudios]

Great update, Don! Thanks for taking the lead on all of this.

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks, Hugh!

[@gabrielsenecal382]

Rather thank you Mr. Don. I do appreciate it the update on the meeting with Transport Canada on those topic, always great, keep the good work to all the team of DPAC.

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks!

[@racksonman]

Is there any need to start a conversation with the Conservative MPs or future candidates? We had better keep the future government (based on the polls) on our side.

[@DonJoyce]

Honestly, I don't think the elected officials give drones a second thought. The working bureaucrats continue on from one government leader to the next.

[@Nikonik66]

-I didn't know the Drone Pilot Canada app was $60. 😢
- Flying a drone where a bird could attack it could happen anywhere. And driving through Banff you may hit a deer, sheep, elk or a bear with your car. But cars are allowed. I live in Calgary and everything to the west is practically Provincial or National parks. So much beautiful land to see and someone gets to decide that we can't be trusted to fly safely.

[@thane5665]

My opinion..
...and after many years of successful landscape photography, along with a number of years of drone operation,I applaud the fact that I don't need to hear a drone ripping around me while I try to enjoy solitude and wildlife acting in a natural manner.I don't go to a park to listen to RPAS buzzing around,nor do I expect others to have to deal with it.
I have personally seen the effect RPAS units have on wildlife,and it isn't right.They need the quiet as much as we do.
I would love to capture images at certain locations,but not at a cost to others or wildlife.It's more than just about me.

[@EDSC_CANADA]

@@thane5665 the last time I was in Lake Louise I was not allowed to fly my Mini 2 drone. Yet a helicopter flew up and down the mountain directly over all day while we hiked. It was a little louder than a Mini 2. Funny how we justify building houses in Banff and Canmore and Lake Louise and thousands of tourists and buses, build ski resorts and Olympic ski resorts and roads, but a small drone is harmful to nature? Really? Should we remove the canoes you can rent from Lake Louise? I bet the fish are really upset by the swirling of the paddles.

[@guyquenneville]

So if a dog owner posts on a local social media that they are looking for their lost dog and need help in a search, does that mean its now an 'advertised event' and a drone pilot would need a SFOC to assist in the search ?

[@DonJoyce]

Interesting question. My gut feeling is 'not an advertised event' because it's not really an event....but certainly a grey area!

[@brynnjones3084]

Yes

[@brynnjones3084]

My experience dealing with regulatory bodies is the answer is your in the wrong until you have the opportunity or properly placed voiced to argue otherwise. I agree with Don's view here I however have had 10 years of direct government regulator interactions

[@IrwinFilms]

Don, big Thanks for everything you continue to do for us Canadian drone pilots. I can say with confidence I would not be flying without your help.

[@DonJoyce]

Thank you so much for the kind words! Safe and happy flying!

[@spikekavalench]

Very diplomatic. I am less so. I think TC and Nav Canada are going way too far in their oversight of what are mostly harmless toy airplanes and drones. I mean, seriously, log books for toy airplanes!?! There needs to be a defining line between recreational and professional drones and I’d raise the 250 gram line to 500. Let each individual accept their own responsibility and liability up to that weight limit. I agree that drone operator permits are a good idea but disagree with individual registrations on non-serial numbered toy planes and drones. One registration per owner. Accomplishes the same goal.

[@DonJoyce]

I have proposed many times that the rules be simplified down to 'the pilot is responsible for situational awareness' and for the conversion of most of the procedural things from rules to best practices (eg, a log book is a best practice, but should not be the law!). Here's an interesting video I did in 2022: ua-cam.com/video/UIERZwH2u6M/v-deo.html

[@brynnjones3084]

Don ty for keeping on tc and others about language clarification. Interpretation of laws is how they are challenged or enforced

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks!

[@the1andonly]

From May until October we have drone meet ups here in Edmonton and they're advertised on social media.(within the group). It's a great way for local drone enthusiasts to meet, fly and exchange experience. Should we be worried about Transport Canada showing up at our next meeting, handing out fines? The informal meetings are as fun as could be and they probably wouldn't happen if they required an SFOC.

[@DonJoyce]

A drone event advertised on a 'closed' social media site like a drone facebook group is not public, so it would not turn it into an advertised event. That scenario was even discussed at the meeting. It's just when you invite the public that things get SFOC-ish.

[@like2haunt]

This brings up a question whether a club website promoting a flying location (Come fly with us here!), that is publicly visible, is perpetually in need of an SFOC? I guess a possible solution would be to not include the site location information? I can see where this rule could be abused by the authorities if they choose to do so.

[@the1andonly]

@@DonJoyce Thanks for clarifying that.

[@billkulcsar5818]

Excellent video Don. Can't wait to see the updates on national parks and flying near events events

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks! Yes, lots of work happening!

[@danzillatheterrible]

Thanks Don!

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks for watching, Dan!

[@toonj64]

Here's the thing though regarding Parcs and wildlife... it's basically a moot point. It's not like wildlife limit themselves to official parcs, they are literally everywhere.
I feel mostly around my house and the quantity and variety of birds that I could easily hit or get attacked by is staggering.
So should I just not fly? Of course the "don't be an idiot" rule always applies so don't disturb wildlife on purpose. But most places worth flying are filled with wildlife.

[@DonJoyce]

Sure, I understand that. But for a location like a park that is intentionally trying to preserve wildlife (amongst other objectives), I feel it makes sense to minimize the risk of disturbing or injuring our woodland critters.

[@Ebikeadventure5981]

Thanks Don

[@DonJoyce]

You're welcome!

[@windsoraerialdronephotography]

Keep up the great work Don!

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks, will do!

[@sartolmc]

As always, deep thanks to DPAC to organize these meetings with TC and huge thanks to share the info! Happy birthday! 🫡

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks!

[@pierrerobert4672]

Merci Don

[@DonJoyce]

Pas de quoi!

[@abtechgroup]

Another great video, thank you

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks!

[@sartolmc]

As the co-owner of an operating drone services company specialized in advertised events since 2017 and since we had rogue unwanted and illegal drones 1 out of 2 events, I strongly support the reinforcement of SFOC for these situations. Even for a soccer game (where in fact a drone is disturbing by its sound and unsportsmanlike by the information it can provide to one of the 2 teams). We are working hard to maintain safety at our events and rogue pilots that disregard laws are plain dangerous and careless. Yes, even sub-250.

[@Cloudy-Media]

We are 1000% with you. Last year we did 12 events and had issues with other drones at every single one of them, only one was over 250gr.

[@vadimus2007]

How dare they to compete with your business, right? Them pesky sub-250g, they should be grounded permanently! Sky should be privately owned by business entities like yourself!

[@flightographist]

Your weedwacker, lawnmower and snowblower are a public nuisance, you can hear them a mile away- unlike a sub 250, outlaw them immediately! Make lawn care a special event requiring a special operations certificate, go a step further why don't you- cash bond required in the event of future pain, suffering and traumatic injury lawsuits?. Try thinking about it without your own self interest in the forefront of your mind.

[@coffeegonewrong]

@@vadimus2007I think you misunderstood. I read it as concern for people not following the rules or safe flight practices. Also, if his company was hired to take photos or footage by the event organizers, got all the insurance, permits, and approvals…. Then has to dodge rogue drones to avoid a safety concern because they felt entitled to do whatever they want…
Yeah, totally just about money.
If it’s an ongoing issue, have you considered having it in your contract that you’ll provide the event with signs saying:
- the Organizers have given approval/paid for your company to fly at this event and the organizers would like their moneys worth ( Their event insurance is on the hook too)
- the local laws that may apply to drone flights (Parks in my area require City film permit w/ insurance for any size flight)
- a pointer to the TC drone page and fact sheet
This might discourage some and may even educate a few of those drone owners who got one and never learned the rules. ( Real estate agents I’ve heard are a common culprit)

[@alhaviland2106]

Don
I would be cautious about what TC has to say about CYWG not being a military airport.
DND does not respond to TC or the Minister of Transport. (and certainly not NAVCanada).
DND is self-regulating and responds solely to the Minister of National Defense.
Just because it does not say "MIL" in a NAVCanada document does not change the military status of the aerodrome.

[@DonJoyce]

There was considerable debate on the subject, with my NRC counterpart aligned to my view. But at some point, you need to 'let the Wookie win'. After all, any fine related to flying a drone in the area of CYWG without an SFOC would come from TC...and they are adamant that an SFOC is not required.

[@alhaviland2106]

@@DonJoyce If you were to fly a drone over Cold Lake (CYOD), it is not TC that will catch you... DND will pass the information to TC and expect TC to take appropriate action.
The "MIL" annotation in the CFS only means that the aerodrome is owned and operated by DND and is not certified or inspected by TC.
In Winnipeg the runways are Certified by TC, but that doesn't mean it is not a DND aerodrome as well. I can say with a high degree of certainty that if a drone is observed over CYWG and it was not coordinated with both NAVCanada and DND, DND would obligate TC to take appropriate action regardless of what was discussed in meetings where DND was not represented.

[@carlosamat]

good info… thank you

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks for watching!

[@IreneB-su9fr]

Congratulations on your 2nd anniversary :-).
I agree with @ sartolmc. Unfortunately there is a high possibility of inappropriate handling of drones. Especially at sporting events where a drone could not only create an unsafe situation but also an unfair competitive edge. Which could lead to more drones in the air to nullify that. Perhaps you could ask TC to exempt events where all involved agree that an SFOC is not needed.
I think it is unfair to single out drone owners in regard to federal and provincial parks.
I would like to think most of us I have no intention of hurting animals and would ultimately protect them as best we can.
My thanks to you and the DPAC for update

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks, Irene!

[@nickstevens6398]

Great info Don and I liked your joke! 😂

[@DonJoyce]

LOL...so my comedy career is off and running!

[@Cloudy-Media]

For advertised events we have signs saying drone operations in progress, no need to make it sound scary. Any event publicly posted should be treated as an advertised event due to people being able to show up and not necessarily know there are drones and make sure the drone operation has taken all precautions required. I strongly believe ALL drones regardless of size needs a SFOC to fly at events and some other safety measure as a parachute because a 249gr drone falling from 200ft still carries more than enough energy to severely injure someone.

[@DonJoyce]

Thanks for the suggestion.

[@IamHerk]

Here is a ridiculous example regarding a "public event" interpretation...
The mobile game Pokemon Go publically advertises outdoor community "events". For example, "Community day classic April 7 2024 2pm-5pm". As this is an advertised outdoor public event with no location boundry, anyone wanting to fly anywhere in Canada during this Pokemon Go event would need to apply for an SFOC.
I know common sense, but if clarification of a "public event" isn't defined, my example above would apply. Common sense is not a defence in Canadian law.

[@IamHerk]

And thank you Don for helping all of us with your passion for our hobby.

[@DonJoyce]

Not that I'm suggesting your example is or isn't an advertised event, but just for clarification, if an event doesn't have a defined boundary (I think they use a fishing derby as an example), then you must stay 30m horizontally from any participant. Of course, I'm not sure if Peekachoo counts as a participant...

[@IamHerk]

@@DonJoyce ok, thanks for pointing out the "defined boundry" part. Pikachoo appears to be safe if we comply. Lol

[@sophiesmith9446]

Hi Don, Thanks for the great videos as usual! I'm coming up on the 2 year mark for recency requirements (advanced certificate) - can I just complete the recency questionnaire "self paced study program" or should I also retake a basic exam again?

[@DonJoyce]

There are several options, described in this video ua-cam.com/video/5weCvtYV52I/v-deo.html , plus the new DPAC Safety Course!

[@morganbills2749]

So a quick question, would drone races have to have an sfoc, since they are quite often advertised on facebook? or does it only count towards events that have nothing to do with drones?

[@DonJoyce]

A drone racing event, like the droning event I described in my video, is considered a 'special aviation event' (virtually the same as an Advertised Event) if the public is invited. If it is advertised only amongst the 'droning community', then you would not need an SFOC since it would not be 'public'. Perhaps adding 'Members only' or some such wording to event postings would be a good precaution. So cumbersome!!

[@morganbills2749]

@@DonJoyce Thanks!

[@Richblackhat]

"stay tuned" ok

[@DonJoyce]

LOL...thanks

[@EDSC_CANADA]

Thank you for the updates Don! Regarding birds, there is a ton of birds nesting within city limits. I've had WAY more bird encounters in populated areas than in nature, so not a valid argument in my opinion. When I'm mapping a roof or doing an inspection there is always birds that will check out my drone, every single flight, 100% of the time [usually pigeons or swallows]. The only time I don't experience that is in nature when I'm just filming, and it's maybe the odd time I encounter one but very rare. We justify building ski resorts and hotels and condos in the Banff and Canmore area and bringing thousands of tourists there to hike there yet we are concerned with a tiny drone flying around safely? Seems hypocritical. ua-cam.com/users/shortsnhr9sHtfb2g

[@BBFPV-ww3ne]

Further to your point: Anyone could go out into the mountains and accidentally set off an avalanche while skiing, snowmobiling,
Etc, taking out hundreds of trees, nesting areas, and I’m sure killing little critters. Nobody seems to bat an eye at that. But yet a small drone is going upset that balance of nature. 🙄

[@northernwrx]

Any updates on the bvlos regulations ?

[@DonJoyce]

As mentioned in the video, they are on track to coming into effect in early 2025.

[@northernwrx]

@@DonJoyce is your organization tracking the requirements or pushing for any technical specs?

[@bigsid3011]

Bureaucratic nonsense.

[@DonJoyce]

Can't disagree. A LOT of room for simplification here.

[@SocialistDistancing]

A lot of redtape and bureaucracy.

[@FZDRONEPHOTOGRAPHY]

im sorry but hawks and falcons dont reside soley in national parks, if so by that reasoning, all drone flying should be prohibited over forests/wildlife areas in general.

[@DonJoyce]

I hear you, but with the increasing encroachment of humanity on nature, I respect the attempt to give our feathered friends some places of peace. After all, we don't NEED to drone over parks.

[@FZDRONEPHOTOGRAPHY]

@@DonJoyce have you been to Newfoundland yet? Gros Morne is absolutely beautiful! Wish I can get a few shots there but hey I can always go there in person and enjoy it too with my phone lol.

[@hecenriq]

Thanks Don

[@DonJoyce]

You are welcome!