I know this video is specifically about the animated adaptations of The Penguin, but it's interesting to me that in one year, we got a version of the Penguin who's a criminal with an odd relationship with his mother, and a version of the Penguin who's a criminal mother with an odd relationship with her sons
I never realized quite how much the penguin has changed and evolved over the years. Personally my favorites are when he's somewhat akin to a DC version of Kingpin, though I feel like Rupert Thorne is more of that role in BTAS.
So did I as I always felt that Batman and Penguin should be like Eliot Ness and Al Capone from the Untouchables as well as Daredevil and Kingpin and Scrooge McDuck and Glomgold
2004's Penguin also got to play the straight man to the other villains. Seeing him getting annoyed by Joker's antics was a treat. Plus Tom Kenny's voice for him is hilarious.
In a fun way, the inconsistency that The Penguin's character and portrayal has had throughout the ages is in itself kind of his consistent trait and i personally see it as another neat connection to his namesake: Penguins are a type of bird, not one bird specifically, and just like a rock-hopper and an emperor are both penguins and when you say "penguin" people could imagine one of the several species living near the antarctic, each portrayal of Oswald Cobblepot is an equally valid answer and interpretation of Gotham's bird-fixated crimelord
The Oswalda Copplepot Penguin is an interesting idea, and I liked how ruthless she was. I have to agree that I'd love to see her again, especially when you consider Batman cost her an empire, and how dangerous she'll be trying to reclaim it.
I really don't care that they made a female version of the Penguin in Caped Crusader simply because I quite like the design they gave her. It looks awesome and stylish. Then again, I like a woman who will just fucking kill me.
@@tvgaming2132 Maybe, but like the man said, if her name wasn't Oswalda, people might think she isn't *really* the Penguin. And given how some portions of the fanbase reacted to a lady bird, that's probably true.
I have a headcannon that her parents wanted to have a boy to inherit their wealth and even had the named Oswald picked out but when they birth a girl they didnt even bother to pick a new name so they just made their original name sound more "feminine". @tvgaming2132
Her design is genuinely one of the best in the series, imo. I can't believe they got Minnie Driver to voice her! The design and the vocal performance were in perfect harmony. I hope she comes back in season 2. It'd be a waste if we never saw her in action again.
Yeah, it kind of has that "shock" factor that makes an otherwise forgettable character really stand out. Like it's clear compared to "The Batman" they didn't want to completely reinvent the Penguin cause otherwise...why bother using him (I can tell by Serum's begrudging view of him that he was kind of saying between his teeth "This...isn't the Penguin though.... it's an entirely new character"), but Oswalda really feels like the take they needed to really make Penguin stand out while still being what he always was, a greedy ruthless thief who has severe social blindness, but instead of using it as a means of justifying revenge against the world, she uses it as a facade to get what she wants, control over the criminal empire. Plus I like how they used her feminine charms to woo the wealthy elites in a rare "non stereotypical" way, cause her power would attract a lot of wealthy guys who would want a strong woman like her by their side, but they juxtapose it with her will to kill her own children. it was strong and wtihout further context, felt a bit overkill, but given it was the first episode, it really was meant to let audience members know "This show is NOT f8cking around...." So her being a female this time kind of does that in 3 ways: 1. There are grotesque female villains, not just male. 2. SHe's willing to kill her own sons...and the wrong one too, raising the stakes of what these villains are willing to do. and 3. This Animated Batman Cartoon is for older audiences and the themes are no longer going to be washed like previous ones using mental illness to explain villainy or keeping the villains one dimensional. The focus is on them but not in a "hopefully they're sympathetic" way, but in a more "People like this exist, not just in Gotham, and they aren't a product of "one bad day"... That's why it's so impactful. She sets the tone that this series is NOT f8cking around.
It's unfortunate that the BTAS team didn't gel with Burton's Penguin. I always enjoyed the monstrous man getting abused by society (something that Birds of a Feather touched upon). Arkham City did a great job combining the grotesque approach with the arms dealer version.
Oswalda's sociopathy is amazing and is a great take on the character. This is what happens when the Penguin has more self confidence and less trials and tribulations as a man making them on edge against anything that even touches their self esteem. Two different breeds of sociopath tha naturally come about because of their differences. It definitely sold me on her iteration and the series
@@koichidignitythief7429 Neither one of those are particularly acrobatic like we see in the show, but it’s a good way to summarize the penguins strength: the fact that people underestimate how dangerous he can be.
'The hook would have been that he had severe mother issues.' Well looks like we finally got that version of the Penguin after all. Cause holy cow does Oz Cobb have mommy issues.
I liked how they made Oswelda. The Penguin in my mind was supposed to be a member of the upper crust high society. While the other incarnations seems to have the Penguin as just a petty thief boss, which could had been replaced with Two-face.
Penguin in The Batman 2004 was really good, I love how both he and Joker are able to fight back without always hiding behind gadgets, it makes sense for him to be a proficient figher since he was like that in the old comics after training in box and judo.
Yeah. 2004 Batman is where every villains can capable on throwing hands at Bats compared to other adaptations where they got easily overpowered by Caped Crusader's fists (Note: Joker punched Batman first in his first debut).
I absolutely love The Batman’s Penguin. Ironically, he’s closer to a cartoon DeVito than the BTAS version in many ways. Speaking on the BTAS version, I think it is a real case of missing the forest for the trees with the writers. They felt saddled with a Penguin unworthy of their original vision, but the one time they put in real effort (Birds of a Feather) they wound up making a real contribution to the evolution of the character. Modern Penguin, I think, is defined by a vicious streak that he tries to hide behind a facade of class. He lies to himself about who he is, and whenever he’s confronted with something that breaks his illusion, like mockery, he erupts. Like an actual Penguin, he’s only an animal that happens to look fancy. In this way, Oswalda remains true to the core spirit of the character.
For me, every version of the Penguin is good in its own way. The BTAS version was like the Danny Devito version, just more sophisticated. The N.B.A version is honestly the version I like the least. I do like the "shady businessman" role he plays, but I hate the giant design change as he is supposed to be the same character with the BTAS version. The Batman 2004 is the first version of the Penguin I have seen. He looks and acts like the Danny Devito version, which invokes a sense of familiarity, and I do like that they chose to give him different types of birds as henchmen. I don't know how to feel about the Kabuki twins and martial arts motif. The Brave and the Bold version has a sense of Nostalgia. I like that they tried to make him resemble his design and mannerisms from the comics and the 60s show. The Justice League Action version honestly seemed to have some potential. He should have appeared more. The C.C. version is an interesting case. I have mixed feelings about Oswalda. I don't hate the gender flip. It's not like this is the first time a villain has been through a change like that. The fact that she is one of the most ruthless animated versions of the character makes it up for it. And I can't wait to see more of her.
I always like the DCAU first design of the Penguin as he feels like a supervillain and remember I about him having so much untapped potential before about him and Batman being like Eliot Ness and Al Capone from the Untouchables and probably make a leader of the Injustice league. When you get to Clayface remember that there are 2 Clayfaces in the 2004 series first being Ethan Bennet who probably no doubt supposed to be the show’s Harvey Dent and the second being Basil Karlo who is no different from the Caped Crusader version.
The penguin has some really interesting designs over the years and Oswalda just by pure description alone and her episode is dark and yet super interesting but I really wanted to say that the penguin looked like the monopoly man from the 70s show
Great video. Thoughts on The Batman's Penguin were very interesting. Now I really wanna see more videos on The Batman villains. Also love how Daniel Mockridge is always used to represent WB executives.
This overview of all the different cartoons made me realise something about how Penguin is often written and thats how the writting for him is sort of stuck in the past. Puling of bird themed robberies, trick umbrellas a goofy laugh but alot of em dont include alot of what has been added later since the 90s. His focus on being more of a crime boss and a socialite in gotham, the added depth his family name being a founding gotham family with the wayns and eliots. His inferiority complex and severa anger issues aswell as his friendship with the riddler. Now ofc alot of the shows used parts of these but i still feel even with how much i liked Adventures, 2004 and cape crusaders penguin that none of em have feelt like THE definitive penguin, Yet. who knows what the future holds and im excited to see what Oswalda gets to do in further seasons heh.
With Penguin being a shallow thug with an ugly appearance and umbrella and/or bird gimmicks for most of his appearances in both comics and on TV, it makes you wonder how he became established as one of Batman's more popular villains in the first place.
I like 2004's version a lot as a mirror to Bruce, seeing how he views alfred for example. 04 has some depth to it. They do some cool stuff with Clayface and Robin too.
Funny how Oswalda is arguably the most monstrous Penguin we’ve ever gotten in adaptation. Even Danny Devito kidnapping orphans on Christmas couldn’t compete with an underwater graveyard of victims including her own son.
Not everyone. Offhand, Poison Ivy and Mr. Freeze mainly relied on their powers, Firefly mainly relied on his tech, and Dr. Strange used wit over physical combat. Your point is noted for a rather large percentage of the cast, though.
What I’m curious of, with all that the btas team had to deal with in regard to the censors, and the large anti smoking campaigns of the 90s. How did they get away with the Penguin having a cigarette in his mouth all the time, even if he didn’t smoke it.
@@SerumLake Colin Farrel should have used that argument in the 2022 film. I remember him mentioning the censors wouldn't allow a cigar and make it fit the demographic (which seems like a dodgy response for me since that movie has literal torture and literal homicide with a blunt weapon). He finally got permission in his show though, which is done to perfection.
Sorry about that, it didn't even cross my mind that some people may be sensitive to those colours. I won't use that show's title sequence in future videos
The batman penguin and cape crusader were the best 2 by FAR imo. Oswalda was so ruthless, i loved her! I just hope she gets even half an episode in season 2. The batman was a show i watched when it was first premiering, That penguin was so good. The kabuki twins were a mystery of who or what were theyt hat was never solved. But I LOVED how penguin was a legit threat to batman. NOTHING takes me out of a batman episode than the villain not being a threat to batman in ANY way. Smarter, stronger, a better fights, a gadget etc. And penguin knowing some kung fu on top of his umbrella and his deadly skilled twins made him a threat fairly often. Oh and man when he worked with or played off other villains. Hes the straight man to their antics and insanity. And i liked that. I can see why some don't enjoy the kung fu little man, but tbh.. i never liked penguin in older shows cus he was such.. a nothing burger.. batman in my basement REALLY paints the picture for him tbh.
I'd be weary about some of the flashing imagery at the start of the video, with Batman and some of the villains. I think something similar occurred in the Pokemon anime, causing seizures.
I heard that one of the reasons why Penguin and Harley Quinn were changed so drastically in Caped Crusader was because the characters are being used in other media, particularly The Penguin and Harley Quinn shows.
I wonder if this Penguin will run for mayor as it seems to be a rite of passage for Penguin adaptations. Burgess Meredith's Penguin ran for mayor, as did DeVito's Penguin, the DCAU Penguin (in the tie-in comics), Gotham's Penguin and now it's suggested that Colin Farrell's Penguin also has his eyes on it.
I think I loved in the animated version: I preferred The Batman 04: introduced the Wayne/Cobblepot rivalry and his straight man rivalry with the Joker, he had a fun thing with the Geishas, his gluttonous and ruthless personality. Plus his short temper personality and trying to fit into upper class but just a gluttonous animal. I also loved TNBA Penguin where he was running the Iceberg Lounge because it and The Batman help set an idea of what Penguin should be. I also liked Caped Crusader Penguin but I wish we got more with her character than what we did.
It is interesting to note that Penguin's role in animation could have been more consistent, just like his role in the comics. The Penguin in the comics changed from the master thief, present until the 90s, on various occasions because writers wanted to keep the Penguin in a more adult setting (the famous case being Penguin Triumphant). His mob boss role was really one of the best reimaginings of a Batman villain. It kept him fresh and could add new layers to Gotham and Batman, which makes me sad because it was never fully explored in animation. I don't like Oswalda because it felt pointless to make him a woman, adding no more depth. Her sociopathy is interesting, but copying and pasting the design to TNBAs with added height does the same thing. It is interesting how constraints and limitations change with time.
My favorite version of the character is Definitely the Colin Farrell version from the 2022 film the Batman and the 2004 animated series the Batman. (Fun fact, That show Was one of my first introductions to Batman along with Batman begins back in 2005.) What so cool about the latter version is that he is voice by none other than SpongeBob himself who also did a version of Starscream from Transformers Animated!
I am a fan of the Batman cartoon and I really do not understand why some people look down on it. Just because it doesn't meet your standards does not make it bad. It was different and that's OK. And just because something is made 4 "kids" does not mean adults can not like it. I like it and I am not ashamed of that fact. Just because something is "darker" does not make it better. But I digress.... The Penguin is the most versatile villain in media. Each version of Oswald is memorable in one way or another
Speaking of Scooby-Doo, the "The Adventures of Batman" versions of Penguin and Joker are some of the most iconic and infamous foes Mystery Inc. has ever gone up against. That version really fit in well with the Scooby-Doo universe lol
I still think the B:TAS one is my favorite because it combined my all time favorite design (Returns) with the classic Gentleman Criminal angle and Paul Williams was perfect in the role. I love all of Penguin's episodes and feel they don't get the love they deserve from anyone, and I HATED that TNBA changed him so much. Basement is middle-of-the-road but overhated and underrated Blind as a Bat and The Mechanic are solid enjoyable outings and Birds of a Feather is my third favorite episode of the series.
I'm impressed at your ability to continuously make quality content on these subjects... but you do. This was an inspired video, I look forward to Clayface's spotlight and the others.
I think ‘The Batman’ 2004’s characterisation of The Penguin is the best and most underrated version of the character, ironically better than the BTAS version of the character!
There have been so many versions of the Penguin, but, there were only two of them that have ever gotten a reaction out of me. They were Danny DeVito, and Colin Farrell.
I'm very biased to dany devito portrayal of penguin. How ever I love Oswald cobblepot as character in general. I love his theatrical persona. While Im generally not for the monster version but their still fun version, and Oswalda married both well imo.
Penguin from Batman TAS is possibly me favourite villain from that series, he had style, a fragile ppomposity, was sane, and his apirations for respect being somewhat greater than his criminal urges but was continuously denied, both from society and from his criminal peers. Bruce Wayne could've started his redemption with a dinnerinvite.
I like the idea of a penguin who was born into a rich family abandoned by his parents because of his medical conditions, and once he realized that he was the rightful heir to a prominent family. He was devastated to learn that they had squandered all their money, trying to have a “normal” baby instead of accepting the unique but otherwise healthy child they did get and he’s now desperate to rebuild his family’s fortune through any means necessary.
My favorite adaptations of the Penguin, when comes to animation, is BTAS (in particular the "Birds of Feather" of episode) and The Batman 2004. I think the Penguin works better when he's portray as this dark reflection of Bruce Wayne, a spoil rude rich man who uses his family money for crime instead of helping improve Gotham.
The Penguin was definitely my favorite villain of The Batman (well, aside from Dracula), but that was definitely _in spite of,_ not because of, the sudden martial arts prowess of the short dumpy weirdo; I just rationalize it to myself as a necessary part of the show's action-heaviness to keep him a threat, instead of relying on trick umbrellas. That decision wasn't all bad though, Joker's monstrous appearance for similar reasons was something I actually enjoyed about that depiction.
It's not just amongst the animated version - the commonality between the various interpretations of The Penguin is their differences. Penguin is in my top 5 of Batman's rogues gallery because of how malleable the character has proven in adaptation, with almost every version being unique & significantly different from the rest.
Is it strange that I'm looking forward to your Two-Face episode of this series, primarily because it might just be the one thing that forces you to talk about Beware the Batman?
You are now imagining a live action version of the female Penguin from TCC... in live action... played by Danny Divito in drag. "He was my favorite son... guess that makes you my favorite. "
I wouldn't say "The Batman" was made for children. While the villains weren't as sympathetic (save for Clayface and perhaps Poison Ivy and the Riddler in his backstory episode) or as emotionally deep (save for Clayface again and Dr. Strange), the story lines themselves were still pretty deep, and the action was a little more brutal with less censorship to deal with at the time. All in all, it was still a cartoon for preteens and teens that adults can also enjoy.
While I love the design of the Animated Series Penguin, there is a lot to be desired with the story and I felt like they really did him dirty. But The Batman’s Penguin was a more sophisticated and well written character that fans deserved. As a big fan of Oswald, I thought that was a great depiction.
Seeing Veronica Vreeland kinda reminds me that there is that lesser-used 'spoiled character with a good heart' stereotype. (Ex: Charlotte LeBouff from 'Princess and the Frog,' Porsha Crystal from 'Sing 2,' and Sweetie from 'Paw Patrol.') The more she interacted with Batman and his villains the more she slowly started changing for the better. She was proof that Batman could bring out the best in Gotham's intolerant high society and that his work isn'tin vain, even descendant Bunny Vreeland got through to Bruce that he could no longer physically protect Gotham anymore and would need to change eventually. She even dropped charges against Harley Quinn after seeing how noble she was in preventing her from being used as ransom or even sold. Perhaps she can one day in the future act as a mole/informant placed inside the Court of Owls as she can see how greedy the top families have become vowing never to become like them or even helping to fund rehabilitation of specific criminals.
Interesting video. While the fence/arms dealer who keeps the other villains schemes ticking over is certainly my favourite take I do very much like the Oswalda version. She was an important statement is intent for the show, let us know that any character could be changed and the villains were allowed to but utter villains, whilst also being entertaining to watch.
I think the Penguin is one of those characters that hasn’t been very successful in animated adaptations. The two biggest traits can become a spectrum of measurement, between Bird Themed Supervillain and Mobster Trying To Break Into High Society. Much like the gangster films of the late 20th century, the Mob Boss being a wierd and unstable person easily lends itself to the mindset of being more fond of animals than humans, both as a metaphor of unappreciated things and as an obsession with control. In a Gotham which focuses more on the Rogue’s Gallery, Penguin is a way to keep the mob style stories intact. In stories about Batman getting started, he’s the first of a new generation, where organized crime has a calling card and motif. It’s not impossible to make a character that successfully combines both. Just a bit hard to avoid flanderization or pushing too hard in one direction.
There's a lot of changes with The Penguin. Whether it's the design, personality, voice, outfit, etc, The Penguin is always one of the most iconic Batman Villains there is. The biggest change with The Penguin is that he got turned into a female named Oswalda in Batman Caped Crusader which is pretty interesting and caught me off guard.🐧🎩
0:50: NOT to be confused with 0:55. 1:13: Whoa, that's surprisingly crisp screen definition. Guess the remasters for this old show ended up schway. Always interesting comparing 70s cartoons with anime of the same era. One may be surprised on how Astro Boy and Mazinger Z seem more easy on the eyes even today. 2:27: Cape animation, hoorah! 3:00: Don't care, I LIVE to dunk on obsolescence like this and Flash Gordon... sorry not sorry, George Lucas. Really says something that, despite being a lesser liked major supervillain in the DCAU, the Penguin there is still a huge improvement over what came before. Helps that the voice actor for him is still sublime and the animation for his eps are quite fluid in spite of the occasional AKOM stuff. Darn, no tie-in comics and, of course, Arkhamverse Penguin. Oh, well, c'est la vie. The Batman 2004 sure seems to have been made by Penguin fanboys and fangirls who wanted to fix fic the guy away from his prior flawed adaptations. Suffice to say, I think the cast and crew succeeded. 8:09: And we don't know what exactly they are, and we love them for it. Better for that to a mystery, like the FreeSpace Shivans. Dunno, that "kid's cartoon" had deep eps like the Season 1 finale about Clayface I's beginnings, and there's also Season 4's "Artifacts" and "Seconds"; gotta admire the latter two, because I'm a sucker for legacy codas and the showcase of overpowered timeloops respectively. Of course the Penguin had to be overshadowed in the other two shows, since characters like Gentleman Ghost, Kite Man, Crazy Quilt, and THE MUSIC MEISTEEEEEEEERRRRRRR needed their spotlights. Time will test perspectives on whether Oswalda will be her own relevant thing or be as expendable as the obsolescents. ...Hope SL doesn't feel exhausted doing an animated series comparison for Harley Quinn later on. As an aside, is Isekai Clayface gonna be a part of the next vid?
Isekai Clayface isn’t in the next video because I genuinely forgot about him! Haven’t seen much buzz about that show to be honest and it doesn’t really seem to be to my tastes, but I’m open to being wrong about it.
As someone who grew up on TAS reruns and watched new episodes of The Batman on Saturday mornings, I personally love both of those versions of the Penguin. TAS has that sophisticated snobbery about him, and 2004 has this insecure little goofbal voice by Tom Kenny. I hope you do go more into The Batman since a lot of people have just written it off as Kung Fu Batman. You’re right it’s not as complex as TAS, but it had a lot of serious moments that stuck with me and sure as hell isn’t kid friendly even for a 4Kids era cartoon.
btas/tnba is my favorite, i would say the arkham version of penguin could be included here since its tech voice over but i get that this is just for animated series
I feel the TAS version got it perfect. Just right blend of comedy with seriousness, flamboyance with genuine menace. I didn’t mind the Caped Crusader version because it felt true to general depiction of the character, but borrowed some elements of the different versions over time; a mob boss with a sense of theatricality, hiding in plain sight, puts on airs of being high society but is really a ruthless thug at heart.
I don’t know if you’re inclined to also consider the version of the Penguin who featured in the Arkham video games. Removed from the safe constraints of children’s television, this version has a Bob Hoskins-esque voice from London, as are some of his stooges. He’s still a dealer in all things illegal, mostly weapons, but he’s more aggressive than some other iterations, quite willing to do a lot of harm to ensure he is in control of every weapon shipment into Gotham.
Considering the Penguin is kinda a suck-up to present society at various times it doesn't surprise me the incarnations are different: a man of high society, a supposedly misunderstood grotesque outcast looking to fit in, a bottom-feeder looking to weasel into high society and position into opportunities to takeover, a nightclub face to hide the drugs and weapons underbelly, a remnant of a fallen family trying to claw back up, hoarder of power afraid to lose their power, a self-victimizer oblivious to the pain and suffering dished out, etc
I like the version of Penguin in The Batman Self centred, views himself as elite despite his family name having a lack of money, and in general being a dark reflection of Bruce The martial art and twins aren’t essential so they can be dropped if this version is ever the inspiration or basis of a new interpretation of The Penguin
The Batman is often more action oriented. Aside from the over arching story in the first season of Ethan bennet, which is in my opinion one of the most compelling Batman stories I’ve ever seen.
Oswalda Cobblepot has the potential to become the biggest threat in this series and as someone who is sick to death of The Joker, and desperately wants some good quality female villains, it's exciting to see I also LOVE the fact that the writers didnt buy into the "motherhood changes a woman" "theres nothing stronger than love" garbage that you see less capable writers fall back on Shes ruthless, shes cruel, and to show her completely disregarding the lives of her children, even actively hunting them down is a good shorthand for "You wont be able to guess her next move" Which is just so refreshing
It'll never not be funny to me that the creators of BTAS essentially gave up on the Penguin once they learned they were forced to use the Burton design. Also, confirmed: SL likes his Penguins THICK.
I loved The Batman (2004) version of the Penguin, since he was one of those dark mirror villains of Batman; Bruce Wayne being a billionaire to help people while Oswald Cobblepot is a billionaire who uses his wealth to fulfill his own selfish desires.
I like how, even when discussing character designs or storylines that you really don't like, you never go into a rant about it. At least, I haven't come across such a video of yours. It helps to still look at the material with respect :) Also, you know which song I think kind of fits the Penguin from Caped Crusader? 'When you're good to mama', from the musical Chicago :p
I see Oswalda is leaning hard into the "Penguin is a Mob Boss" mentality and that's good, Caped Crusader is allowed to get a lot darker than the other shows where allowed to, which certainly helps sell the threat.
I know you are focused in on the animated versions of characters, however I am going to say I prefer the Arkham series Penguin, as he is quite rounded and very dark. His appearance in “Batman: Assault on Arkham” (animated) shows more to his character on top of what we see in the games, which is limited to one focused section of the games he appears in (City and Origins). Here is a crime boss with power, remorseless and a straight up killer. He has no qualms about killing foes or friends or even his fellow rogues. He put Mr Freeze and one of zRas’ assassins on display, and had displays to imprison other people, including Batman, Joker (and one of his Hyenas). He is the darkest standard, but I think Oswalda is on the right path to meet him.
I actually like the penguin episode, "the mechanic" it's a bit weak with introducing Batman's mechanic out of nowhere and then never using him again, but it's one of his more menacing appearances and it's notable that he actually kills someone in the show. Which means he might have a higher body count than the joker in the original show as long as the joker toxin victims are considered alive at least. (For the whole dcau though, lex Luthor has them beat in spades, though much more indirectly. )
I think the issue I have with that episode stems from the fact that Akom, a studio that can’t animate vehicles, were given an episode all about cars. I talked to Kevin Altieri about it and he said it was quite challenging to storyboard the episode around AKOM’s abilities.
I feel like had Timm not have said "there weren't enough female villains in batman's rogues gallery" being the reason they genderswapped Oswald in caper crusader, there wouldn't have been that much blowback. Like, instead they could've had her as Oswald's actual mother
Oswalda meanwhile is honestly an interesting way to bring in an aspect of Penguin many I feel forget; Penguin is usually underestimated. Be it for size, physical deformity or, in this case, gender.
Wish you had mentioned the "Harley Quinn" cartoon's Penguin. He wasn't much to talk about but he had importance in a few episodes, quick to murder, and ruled part of Gotham for a time. His nephew also had some importance, kinda being the causing factor of two episodes.
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I know this video is specifically about the animated adaptations of The Penguin, but it's interesting to me that in one year, we got a version of the Penguin who's a criminal with an odd relationship with his mother, and a version of the Penguin who's a criminal mother with an odd relationship with her sons
I just thought of that as well, it’s an interesting role reversal while still maintaining what is a central theme of the character.
I never realized quite how much the penguin has changed and evolved over the years. Personally my favorites are when he's somewhat akin to a DC version of Kingpin, though I feel like Rupert Thorne is more of that role in BTAS.
So did I as I always felt that Batman and Penguin should be like Eliot Ness and Al Capone from the Untouchables as well as Daredevil and Kingpin and Scrooge McDuck and Glomgold
I love the BTAS version. I know not that many like him, but he has a soft spot in my heart.
Black Mask also kinda takes that spot too now, though
I love BCC version, she has style 🥰😻💖💓
2004's Penguin also got to play the straight man to the other villains. Seeing him getting annoyed by Joker's antics was a treat. Plus Tom Kenny's voice for him is hilarious.
In a fun way, the inconsistency that The Penguin's character and portrayal has had throughout the ages is in itself kind of his consistent trait and i personally see it as another neat connection to his namesake: Penguins are a type of bird, not one bird specifically, and just like a rock-hopper and an emperor are both penguins and when you say "penguin" people could imagine one of the several species living near the antarctic, each portrayal of Oswald Cobblepot is an equally valid answer and interpretation of Gotham's bird-fixated crimelord
The Oswalda Copplepot Penguin is an interesting idea, and I liked how ruthless she was. I have to agree that I'd love to see her again, especially when you consider Batman cost her an empire, and how dangerous she'll be trying to reclaim it.
I really don't care that they made a female version of the Penguin in Caped Crusader simply because I quite like the design they gave her. It looks awesome and stylish.
Then again, I like a woman who will just fucking kill me.
My only problem with the CC penguin is her name is so lazy.
Oswalda, really?
@@tvgaming2132 Maybe, but like the man said, if her name wasn't Oswalda, people might think she isn't *really* the Penguin. And given how some portions of the fanbase reacted to a lady bird, that's probably true.
I have a headcannon that her parents wanted to have a boy to inherit their wealth and even had the named Oswald picked out but when they birth a girl they didnt even bother to pick a new name so they just made their original name sound more "feminine". @tvgaming2132
Her design is genuinely one of the best in the series, imo. I can't believe they got Minnie Driver to voice her! The design and the vocal performance were in perfect harmony. I hope she comes back in season 2. It'd be a waste if we never saw her in action again.
Yeah, it kind of has that "shock" factor that makes an otherwise forgettable character really stand out. Like it's clear compared to "The Batman" they didn't want to completely reinvent the Penguin cause otherwise...why bother using him (I can tell by Serum's begrudging view of him that he was kind of saying between his teeth "This...isn't the Penguin though.... it's an entirely new character"), but Oswalda really feels like the take they needed to really make Penguin stand out while still being what he always was, a greedy ruthless thief who has severe social blindness, but instead of using it as a means of justifying revenge against the world, she uses it as a facade to get what she wants, control over the criminal empire. Plus I like how they used her feminine charms to woo the wealthy elites in a rare "non stereotypical" way, cause her power would attract a lot of wealthy guys who would want a strong woman like her by their side, but they juxtapose it with her will to kill her own children. it was strong and wtihout further context, felt a bit overkill, but given it was the first episode, it really was meant to let audience members know "This show is NOT f8cking around...." So her being a female this time kind of does that in 3 ways: 1. There are grotesque female villains, not just male. 2. SHe's willing to kill her own sons...and the wrong one too, raising the stakes of what these villains are willing to do. and 3. This Animated Batman Cartoon is for older audiences and the themes are no longer going to be washed like previous ones using mental illness to explain villainy or keeping the villains one dimensional. The focus is on them but not in a "hopefully they're sympathetic" way, but in a more "People like this exist, not just in Gotham, and they aren't a product of "one bad day"... That's why it's so impactful. She sets the tone that this series is NOT f8cking around.
It's unfortunate that the BTAS team didn't gel with Burton's Penguin. I always enjoyed the monstrous man getting abused by society (something that Birds of a Feather touched upon). Arkham City did a great job combining the grotesque approach with the arms dealer version.
Oswalda's sociopathy is amazing and is a great take on the character. This is what happens when the Penguin has more self confidence and less trials and tribulations as a man making them on edge against anything that even touches their self esteem.
Two different breeds of sociopath tha naturally come about because of their differences.
It definitely sold me on her iteration and the series
My favorite penguin is The Batman he’s ruthless, gluttonous, and greedy. Plus it’s interesting having a little acrobatic martial artist.
In his original backstory he is supposed to be an expert in Boxing and Judo.
@@koichidignitythief7429 Neither one of those are particularly acrobatic like we see in the show, but it’s a good way to summarize the penguins strength: the fact that people underestimate how dangerous he can be.
'The hook would have been that he had severe mother issues.' Well looks like we finally got that version of the Penguin after all. Cause holy cow does Oz Cobb have mommy issues.
Matt Reeves’ love of BTAS is well documented!
I liked how they made Oswelda. The Penguin in my mind was supposed to be a member of the upper crust high society. While the other incarnations seems to have the Penguin as just a petty thief boss, which could had been replaced with Two-face.
Penguin in The Batman 2004 was really good, I love how both he and Joker are able to fight back without always hiding behind gadgets, it makes sense for him to be a proficient figher since he was like that in the old comics after training in box and judo.
Fr! And it was fun to see more villains match wits AND fists with Bats :D
He never fail to make me laugh
Magic of Tom Kenny!
Yeah. 2004 Batman is where every villains can capable on throwing hands at Bats compared to other adaptations where they got easily overpowered by Caped Crusader's fists (Note: Joker punched Batman first in his first debut).
@@poweroffriendship2.0 AND Bats offered help BEFORE trying to beat him into a pulp
After playing the Arkham games, I'd say it was a missed opportunity that Bob Hoskins didn't play The Penguin!
That's definitely what they were going for in those games. I expected him to say "it's good to talk" at least once...
Yeah and the same for Philip Seymour Hoffman,Jonah Hill,Timothy Spall,Toby Jones etc
I got to admit, I do like Oswalda.
I absolutely love The Batman’s Penguin. Ironically, he’s closer to a cartoon DeVito than the BTAS version in many ways. Speaking on the BTAS version, I think it is a real case of missing the forest for the trees with the writers. They felt saddled with a Penguin unworthy of their original vision, but the one time they put in real effort (Birds of a Feather) they wound up making a real contribution to the evolution of the character. Modern Penguin, I think, is defined by a vicious streak that he tries to hide behind a facade of class. He lies to himself about who he is, and whenever he’s confronted with something that breaks his illusion, like mockery, he erupts. Like an actual Penguin, he’s only an animal that happens to look fancy. In this way, Oswalda remains true to the core spirit of the character.
I appreciate the kindness you showed to the writers who worked on your less favorite episodes of BTAS.
For me, every version of the Penguin is good in its own way.
The BTAS version was like the Danny Devito version, just more sophisticated.
The N.B.A version is honestly the version I like the least. I do like the "shady businessman" role he plays, but I hate the giant design change as he is supposed to be the same character with the BTAS version.
The Batman 2004 is the first version of the Penguin I have seen. He looks and acts like the Danny Devito version, which invokes a sense of familiarity, and I do like that they chose to give him different types of birds as henchmen. I don't know how to feel about the Kabuki twins and martial arts motif.
The Brave and the Bold version has a sense of Nostalgia. I like that they tried to make him resemble his design and mannerisms from the comics and the 60s show.
The Justice League Action version honestly seemed to have some potential. He should have appeared more.
The C.C. version is an interesting case. I have mixed feelings about Oswalda. I don't hate the gender flip. It's not like this is the first time a villain has been through a change like that. The fact that she is one of the most ruthless animated versions of the character makes it up for it. And I can't wait to see more of her.
I always like the DCAU first design of the Penguin as he feels like a supervillain and remember I about him having so much untapped potential before about him and Batman being like Eliot Ness and Al Capone from the Untouchables and probably make a leader of the Injustice league.
When you get to Clayface remember that there are 2 Clayfaces in the 2004 series first being Ethan Bennet who probably no doubt supposed to be the show’s Harvey Dent and the second being Basil Karlo who is no different from the Caped Crusader version.
The penguin has some really interesting designs over the years and Oswalda just by pure description alone and her episode is dark and yet super interesting but I really wanted to say that the penguin looked like the monopoly man from the 70s show
Great video. Thoughts on The Batman's Penguin were very interesting. Now I really wanna see more videos on The Batman villains. Also love how Daniel Mockridge is always used to represent WB executives.
The shoe fits, right 😉
"tHe PoWeR iS iN tHe BoArDrOoM, nYgMa"
@@SerumLake hope you do other The Batman Villains like Firefly/Phosphorus or Terrible Trio or Harley Quinn or Clayface
This overview of all the different cartoons made me realise something about how Penguin is often written and thats how the writting for him is sort of stuck in the past. Puling of bird themed robberies, trick umbrellas a goofy laugh but alot of em dont include alot of what has been added later since the 90s. His focus on being more of a crime boss and a socialite in gotham, the added depth his family name being a founding gotham family with the wayns and eliots. His inferiority complex and severa anger issues aswell as his friendship with the riddler.
Now ofc alot of the shows used parts of these but i still feel even with how much i liked Adventures, 2004 and cape crusaders penguin that none of em have feelt like THE definitive penguin, Yet.
who knows what the future holds and im excited to see what Oswalda gets to do in further seasons heh.
With Penguin being a shallow thug with an ugly appearance and umbrella and/or bird gimmicks for most of his appearances in both comics and on TV, it makes you wonder how he became established as one of Batman's more popular villains in the first place.
Honestly man I think Colin Farrell might legit be the most comic accurate in terms of personality.
I like 2004's version a lot as a mirror to Bruce, seeing how he views alfred for example. 04 has some depth to it. They do some cool stuff with Clayface and Robin too.
Funny how Oswalda is arguably the most monstrous Penguin we’ve ever gotten in adaptation. Even Danny Devito kidnapping orphans on Christmas couldn’t compete with an underwater graveyard of victims including her own son.
everybody knew martial arts in The Batman series,
except for harley quinn for some reason.
Not everyone. Offhand, Poison Ivy and Mr. Freeze mainly relied on their powers, Firefly mainly relied on his tech, and Dr. Strange used wit over physical combat.
Your point is noted for a rather large percentage of the cast, though.
@@Compucles yah lol
depends on which harley, some versions of her are able to hold their own pretty well lol
Okay his designs that incorporate actual penguins into the design are cool. Like the rock hopper and the tall emperor penguin
Oswalda needs another episode focused on her but she gets a lot of misical numbers. Something between Chicago and the Music Meister episodes of BBATB
Honestly I feel 2004’s Penguin was the closest Oswald got to be a credible threat to Batman in a fight.
What I’m curious of, with all that the btas team had to deal with in regard to the censors, and the large anti smoking campaigns of the 90s. How did they get away with the Penguin having a cigarette in his mouth all the time, even if he didn’t smoke it.
They argued that The Penguin didn’t look right without the cigarette holder, and the censors agreed with them.
@@SerumLake Colin Farrel should have used that argument in the 2022 film. I remember him mentioning the censors wouldn't allow a cigar and make it fit the demographic (which seems like a dodgy response for me since that movie has literal torture and literal homicide with a blunt weapon). He finally got permission in his show though, which is done to perfection.
Ngl, you may need an epilepsy warning for 0:17
Ye
It should be slowed down IMO. I'm not even epileptic or anything like that, but that was rough.
Sorry about that, it didn't even cross my mind that some people may be sensitive to those colours. I won't use that show's title sequence in future videos
The batman penguin and cape crusader were the best 2 by FAR imo. Oswalda was so ruthless, i loved her! I just hope she gets even half an episode in season 2.
The batman was a show i watched when it was first premiering, That penguin was so good. The kabuki twins were a mystery of who or what were theyt hat was never solved. But I LOVED how penguin was a legit threat to batman.
NOTHING takes me out of a batman episode than the villain not being a threat to batman in ANY way. Smarter, stronger, a better fights, a gadget etc. And penguin knowing some kung fu on top of his umbrella and his deadly skilled twins made him a threat fairly often. Oh and man when he worked with or played off other villains. Hes the straight man to their antics and insanity. And i liked that. I can see why some don't enjoy the kung fu little man, but tbh.. i never liked penguin in older shows cus he was such.. a nothing burger.. batman in my basement REALLY paints the picture for him tbh.
I'd be weary about some of the flashing imagery at the start of the video, with Batman and some of the villains. I think something similar occurred in the Pokemon anime, causing seizures.
I heard that one of the reasons why Penguin and Harley Quinn were changed so drastically in Caped Crusader was because the characters are being used in other media, particularly The Penguin and Harley Quinn shows.
A case of finding opportunity in adversity.
Now imagine if Spider-Man got the Caped Crusader treatment?
@@srstriker6420 You mean a show set in the 60's? If it's primarily based on the Lee/Ditko/Romita issues I'd be all for it!
@@cinemaarts8795yeah and also subvert expectations
I wonder if this Penguin will run for mayor as it seems to be a rite of passage for Penguin adaptations. Burgess Meredith's Penguin ran for mayor, as did DeVito's Penguin, the DCAU Penguin (in the tie-in comics), Gotham's Penguin and now it's suggested that Colin Farrell's Penguin also has his eyes on it.
7:31 I still find Wesker sympathetic.
I think I loved in the animated version: I preferred The Batman 04: introduced the Wayne/Cobblepot rivalry and his straight man rivalry with the Joker, he had a fun thing with the Geishas, his gluttonous and ruthless personality. Plus his short temper personality and trying to fit into upper class but just a gluttonous animal.
I also loved TNBA Penguin where he was running the Iceberg Lounge because it and The Batman help set an idea of what Penguin should be.
I also liked Caped Crusader Penguin but I wish we got more with her character than what we did.
It is interesting to note that Penguin's role in animation could have been more consistent, just like his role in the comics. The Penguin in the comics changed from the master thief, present until the 90s, on various occasions because writers wanted to keep the Penguin in a more adult setting (the famous case being Penguin Triumphant). His mob boss role was really one of the best reimaginings of a Batman villain. It kept him fresh and could add new layers to Gotham and Batman, which makes me sad because it was never fully explored in animation. I don't like Oswalda because it felt pointless to make him a woman, adding no more depth. Her sociopathy is interesting, but copying and pasting the design to TNBAs with added height does the same thing. It is interesting how constraints and limitations change with time.
My favorite version of the character is Definitely the Colin Farrell version from the 2022 film the Batman and the 2004 animated series the Batman. (Fun fact, That show Was one of my first introductions to Batman along with Batman begins back in 2005.)
What so cool about the latter version is that he is voice by none other than SpongeBob himself who also did a version of Starscream from Transformers Animated!
I am a fan of the Batman cartoon and I really do not understand why some people look down on it. Just because it doesn't meet your standards does not make it bad. It was different and that's OK. And just because something is made 4 "kids" does not mean adults can not like it. I like it and I am not ashamed of that fact. Just because something is "darker" does not make it better. But I digress....
The Penguin is the most versatile villain in media. Each version of Oswald is memorable in one way or another
I honestly love the 2004 batman version of the rouges mainly because everyone just knew how to throw hands and can be a genuine challenge
Speaking of Scooby-Doo, the "The Adventures of Batman" versions of Penguin and Joker are some of the most iconic and infamous foes Mystery Inc. has ever gone up against. That version really fit in well with the Scooby-Doo universe lol
I still think the B:TAS one is my favorite because it combined my all time favorite design (Returns) with the classic Gentleman Criminal angle and Paul Williams was perfect in the role. I love all of Penguin's episodes and feel they don't get the love they deserve from anyone, and I HATED that TNBA changed him so much.
Basement is middle-of-the-road but overhated and underrated
Blind as a Bat and The Mechanic are solid enjoyable outings
and Birds of a Feather is my third favorite episode of the series.
Welcome to the aviary of doom!
I'm impressed at your ability to continuously make quality content on these subjects... but you do. This was an inspired video, I look forward to Clayface's spotlight and the others.
That's nice of you to say. I think it just indicates that I spend too much time sitting around thinking about these shows!
@ well there’s clearly an audience for these deep ruminations so keep at it 😆
I think ‘The Batman’ 2004’s characterisation of The Penguin is the best and most underrated version of the character, ironically better than the BTAS version of the character!
There have been so many versions of the Penguin, but, there were only two of them that have ever gotten a reaction out of me. They were Danny DeVito, and Colin Farrell.
10:00 Emperor Penguin? Try one of those 6 foot tall Prehistoric Penguins
I'm very biased to dany devito portrayal of penguin. How ever I love Oswald cobblepot as character in general. I love his theatrical persona. While Im generally not for the monster version but their still fun version, and Oswalda married both well imo.
As always, informative, and I learned a thing or two I either didn't know or had forgotten.
The Penguin’s problem is that he’s pretty much just a really good visual design never had a really consistent character or motivation attached to it.
5:27 True, that was his best episode.
the first time i ever saw penggguin was on the scbooy doo show
Penguin from Batman TAS is possibly me favourite villain from that series, he had style, a fragile ppomposity, was sane, and his apirations for respect being somewhat greater than his criminal urges but was continuously denied, both from society and from his criminal peers. Bruce Wayne could've started his redemption with a dinnerinvite.
12:30 I like that he’s a weird lil gremlin that knows kung-fu though!
I like the idea of a penguin who was born into a rich family abandoned by his parents because of his medical conditions, and once he realized that he was the rightful heir to a prominent family. He was devastated to learn that they had squandered all their money, trying to have a “normal” baby instead of accepting the unique but otherwise healthy child they did get and he’s now desperate to rebuild his family’s fortune through any means necessary.
Personally the episode
'Ive got batman in my basement' it's one of my favorites mostly because I love the 'home alone' vibes.
Well, that just goes to show that there's someone for everyone ;)
My favorite adaptations of the Penguin, when comes to animation, is BTAS (in particular the "Birds of Feather" of episode) and The Batman 2004. I think the Penguin works better when he's portray as this dark reflection of Bruce Wayne, a spoil rude rich man who uses his family money for crime instead of helping improve Gotham.
The Penguin was definitely my favorite villain of The Batman (well, aside from Dracula), but that was definitely _in spite of,_ not because of, the sudden martial arts prowess of the short dumpy weirdo; I just rationalize it to myself as a necessary part of the show's action-heaviness to keep him a threat, instead of relying on trick umbrellas. That decision wasn't all bad though, Joker's monstrous appearance for similar reasons was something I actually enjoyed about that depiction.
Oswalda makes me wonder how her male counterparts would treat their kids if they had any.
I started watching Caped Crusader the other day because of this channel, and I've been having a splendid time with it.
I hope they can have two penguin in show, now Oswalda arrested so they can still introduce Oswald to help his sister escape
Oooo that's actually a great idea. Let everyone be happy by having a new Penguin and the classic one! Good idea, man.
Nicely written, sir.
It's not just amongst the animated version - the commonality between the various interpretations of The Penguin is their differences. Penguin is in my top 5 of Batman's rogues gallery because of how malleable the character has proven in adaptation, with almost every version being unique & significantly different from the rest.
Is it strange that I'm looking forward to your Two-Face episode of this series, primarily because it might just be the one thing that forces you to talk about Beware the Batman?
11:33 i absolutely love her design
You are now imagining a live action version of the female Penguin from TCC... in live action... played by Danny Divito in drag.
"He was my favorite son... guess that makes you my favorite. "
I never knew I wanted to see that...
Might want to put in a seizure warning for this video. That red and blue flashing gave me head ache. It's also what got porygon booted from the anime.
Sorry I gave you a headache, I won't include that show's title sequence in future videos.
Keep it up on your work and this video and channel
I love this video and channel
Thanks you for your video and channel
I love Batman all franchise
Cmon 12:30 actually makes penguin TOUGH
Right!?
I wouldn't say "The Batman" was made for children. While the villains weren't as sympathetic (save for Clayface and perhaps Poison Ivy and the Riddler in his backstory episode) or as emotionally deep (save for Clayface again and Dr. Strange), the story lines themselves were still pretty deep, and the action was a little more brutal with less censorship to deal with at the time. All in all, it was still a cartoon for preteens and teens that adults can also enjoy.
While I love the design of the Animated Series Penguin, there is a lot to be desired with the story and I felt like they really did him dirty. But The Batman’s Penguin was a more sophisticated and well written character that fans deserved. As a big fan of Oswald, I thought that was a great depiction.
Seeing Veronica Vreeland kinda reminds me that there is that lesser-used 'spoiled character with a good heart' stereotype. (Ex: Charlotte LeBouff from 'Princess and the Frog,' Porsha Crystal from 'Sing 2,' and Sweetie from 'Paw Patrol.') The more she interacted with Batman and his villains the more she slowly started changing for the better. She was proof that Batman could bring out the best in Gotham's intolerant high society and that his work isn'tin vain, even descendant Bunny Vreeland got through to Bruce that he could no longer physically protect Gotham anymore and would need to change eventually. She even dropped charges against Harley Quinn after seeing how noble she was in preventing her from being used as ransom or even sold. Perhaps she can one day in the future act as a mole/informant placed inside the Court of Owls as she can see how greedy the top families have become vowing never to become like them or even helping to fund rehabilitation of specific criminals.
Animation? In general! Whether it be the Burton monster man or the mafioso gangster are definitely different from the Gentleman of Crime.
Interesting video.
While the fence/arms dealer who keeps the other villains schemes ticking over is certainly my favourite take I do very much like the Oswalda version. She was an important statement is intent for the show, let us know that any character could be changed and the villains were allowed to but utter villains, whilst also being entertaining to watch.
Seizure warning during the first 50 or so seconds
I think the Penguin is one of those characters that hasn’t been very successful in animated adaptations. The two biggest traits can become a spectrum of measurement, between Bird Themed Supervillain and Mobster Trying To Break Into High Society. Much like the gangster films of the late 20th century, the Mob Boss being a wierd and unstable person easily lends itself to the mindset of being more fond of animals than humans, both as a metaphor of unappreciated things and as an obsession with control. In a Gotham which focuses more on the Rogue’s Gallery, Penguin is a way to keep the mob style stories intact. In stories about Batman getting started, he’s the first of a new generation, where organized crime has a calling card and motif.
It’s not impossible to make a character that successfully combines both. Just a bit hard to avoid flanderization or pushing too hard in one direction.
The Batman 2005 version was one of my favorites. His design and agility were interesting
What about Tom Kenny?😏
Wow and Emperor penguin idea.... I did not even think of that. Also shit she is rather heartless.
There's a lot of changes with The Penguin. Whether it's the design, personality, voice, outfit, etc, The Penguin is always one of the most iconic Batman Villains there is. The biggest change with The Penguin is that he got turned into a female named Oswalda in Batman Caped Crusader which is pretty interesting and caught me off guard.🐧🎩
0:50: NOT to be confused with 0:55.
1:13: Whoa, that's surprisingly crisp screen definition. Guess the remasters for this old show ended up schway.
Always interesting comparing 70s cartoons with anime of the same era. One may be surprised on how Astro Boy and Mazinger Z seem more easy on the eyes even today.
2:27: Cape animation, hoorah!
3:00: Don't care, I LIVE to dunk on obsolescence like this and Flash Gordon... sorry not sorry, George Lucas.
Really says something that, despite being a lesser liked major supervillain in the DCAU, the Penguin there is still a huge improvement over what came before. Helps that the voice actor for him is still sublime and the animation for his eps are quite fluid in spite of the occasional AKOM stuff.
Darn, no tie-in comics and, of course, Arkhamverse Penguin. Oh, well, c'est la vie.
The Batman 2004 sure seems to have been made by Penguin fanboys and fangirls who wanted to fix fic the guy away from his prior flawed adaptations. Suffice to say, I think the cast and crew succeeded.
8:09: And we don't know what exactly they are, and we love them for it. Better for that to a mystery, like the FreeSpace Shivans.
Dunno, that "kid's cartoon" had deep eps like the Season 1 finale about Clayface I's beginnings, and there's also Season 4's "Artifacts" and "Seconds"; gotta admire the latter two, because I'm a sucker for legacy codas and the showcase of overpowered timeloops respectively.
Of course the Penguin had to be overshadowed in the other two shows, since characters like Gentleman Ghost, Kite Man, Crazy Quilt, and THE MUSIC MEISTEEEEEEEERRRRRRR needed their spotlights.
Time will test perspectives on whether Oswalda will be her own relevant thing or be as expendable as the obsolescents.
...Hope SL doesn't feel exhausted doing an animated series comparison for Harley Quinn later on. As an aside, is Isekai Clayface gonna be a part of the next vid?
Isekai Clayface isn’t in the next video because I genuinely forgot about him! Haven’t seen much buzz about that show to be honest and it doesn’t really seem to be to my tastes, but I’m open to being wrong about it.
As someone who grew up on TAS reruns and watched new episodes of The Batman on Saturday mornings, I personally love both of those versions of the Penguin. TAS has that sophisticated snobbery about him, and 2004 has this insecure little goofbal voice by Tom Kenny.
I hope you do go more into The Batman since a lot of people have just written it off as Kung Fu Batman. You’re right it’s not as complex as TAS, but it had a lot of serious moments that stuck with me and sure as hell isn’t kid friendly even for a 4Kids era cartoon.
btas/tnba is my favorite, i would say the arkham version of penguin could be included here since its tech voice over but i get that this is just for animated series
I feel the TAS version got it perfect. Just right blend of comedy with seriousness, flamboyance with genuine menace. I didn’t mind the Caped Crusader version because it felt true to general depiction of the character, but borrowed some elements of the different versions over time; a mob boss with a sense of theatricality, hiding in plain sight, puts on airs of being high society but is really a ruthless thug at heart.
Thanks for the video.
You’re welcome 🙇♂️
I don’t know if you’re inclined to also consider the version of the Penguin who featured in the Arkham video games. Removed from the safe constraints of children’s television, this version has a Bob Hoskins-esque voice from London, as are some of his stooges. He’s still a dealer in all things illegal, mostly weapons, but he’s more aggressive than some other iterations, quite willing to do a lot of harm to ensure he is in control of every weapon shipment into Gotham.
Holy shit man, thank you for the frame 1 seizures… immediately showing off flashing light like that at the start of a video should be illegal!
Considering the Penguin is kinda a suck-up to present society at various times it doesn't surprise me the incarnations are different: a man of high society, a supposedly misunderstood grotesque outcast looking to fit in, a bottom-feeder looking to weasel into high society and position into opportunities to takeover, a nightclub face to hide the drugs and weapons underbelly, a remnant of a fallen family trying to claw back up, hoarder of power afraid to lose their power, a self-victimizer oblivious to the pain and suffering dished out, etc
I like the version of Penguin in The Batman
Self centred, views himself as elite despite his family name having a lack of money, and in general being a dark reflection of Bruce
The martial art and twins aren’t essential so they can be dropped if this version is ever the inspiration or basis of a new interpretation of The Penguin
The Batman is often more action oriented. Aside from the over arching story in the first season of Ethan bennet, which is in my opinion one of the most compelling Batman stories I’ve ever seen.
Oswalda Cobblepot has the potential to become the biggest threat in this series and as someone who is sick to death of The Joker, and desperately wants some good quality female villains, it's exciting to see
I also LOVE the fact that the writers didnt buy into the "motherhood changes a woman" "theres nothing stronger than love" garbage that you see less capable writers fall back on
Shes ruthless, shes cruel, and to show her completely disregarding the lives of her children, even actively hunting them down is a good shorthand for "You wont be able to guess her next move"
Which is just so refreshing
Great video as usual my friend! Wonder if you’ll do something similar like this for the joker and the riddler one day?
if these videos do well, absolutely.
It'll never not be funny to me that the creators of BTAS essentially gave up on the Penguin once they learned they were forced to use the Burton design.
Also, confirmed: SL likes his Penguins THICK.
I loved The Batman (2004) version of the Penguin, since he was one of those dark mirror villains of Batman; Bruce Wayne being a billionaire to help people while Oswald Cobblepot is a billionaire who uses his wealth to fulfill his own selfish desires.
I like how, even when discussing character designs or storylines that you really don't like, you never go into a rant about it. At least, I haven't come across such a video of yours. It helps to still look at the material with respect :)
Also, you know which song I think kind of fits the Penguin from Caped Crusader? 'When you're good to mama', from the musical Chicago :p
I see Oswalda is leaning hard into the "Penguin is a Mob Boss" mentality and that's good, Caped Crusader is allowed to get a lot darker than the other shows where allowed to, which certainly helps sell the threat.
I know you are focused in on the animated versions of characters, however I am going to say I prefer the Arkham series Penguin, as he is quite rounded and very dark. His appearance in “Batman: Assault on Arkham” (animated) shows more to his character on top of what we see in the games, which is limited to one focused section of the games he appears in (City and Origins). Here is a crime boss with power, remorseless and a straight up killer. He has no qualms about killing foes or friends or even his fellow rogues. He put Mr Freeze and one of zRas’ assassins on display, and had displays to imprison other people, including Batman, Joker (and one of his Hyenas). He is the darkest standard, but I think Oswalda is on the right path to meet him.
I actually like the penguin episode, "the mechanic" it's a bit weak with introducing Batman's mechanic out of nowhere and then never using him again, but it's one of his more menacing appearances and it's notable that he actually kills someone in the show. Which means he might have a higher body count than the joker in the original show as long as the joker toxin victims are considered alive at least. (For the whole dcau though, lex Luthor has them beat in spades, though much more indirectly. )
I think the issue I have with that episode stems from the fact that Akom, a studio that can’t animate vehicles, were given an episode all about cars. I talked to Kevin Altieri about it and he said it was quite challenging to storyboard the episode around AKOM’s abilities.
I feel like had Timm not have said "there weren't enough female villains in batman's rogues gallery" being the reason they genderswapped Oswald in caper crusader, there wouldn't have been that much blowback. Like, instead they could've had her as Oswald's actual mother
Oswalda meanwhile is honestly an interesting way to bring in an aspect of Penguin many I feel forget; Penguin is usually underestimated. Be it for size, physical deformity or, in this case, gender.
Wish you had mentioned the "Harley Quinn" cartoon's Penguin.
He wasn't much to talk about but he had importance in a few episodes, quick to murder, and ruled part of Gotham for a time.
His nephew also had some importance, kinda being the causing factor of two episodes.
Da Penguin do be change’n 🐧
8:51 True... but how many penguins can you say have fought dracula and lived to to tell the tale?