I think Ubiquiti is forgetting what made people interested in them to begin with and they're going to irritate a lot of people and not be as enticing to a lot of potential newcomers. Instead of concentrating on fixing their existing issues and bolstering their supply chains, they're concentrating on statistics gathering and optics.
@@Moonraker11 let’s see: MSPs That have been responsible for the router(s), network switches, the nvr, the phone(s). UBNT left a bad taste in a lot of MSP. How do I know? It’s based off of reports from surveys offered over those years. If you look at the Spiceworks community and even UA-cam, if it wasn’t for the content producers I really think the buzz around UBNT would be fizzling. Many people don’t like a lot of the trade offs you take with UBNT. I would assume the average admin likely new and junior level would adore UBNT and likely should as again the content producers actually do a well job of entirely showing you how to configure and monitor your networks. From a personal point of view, I’ve had about 5 routers die or are potentially dying with very minimal support or help from UBNT. Sure you can definitely send them back but not every case is cut and dry. My biggest issue has to definitely be the NVR. I’m leaning very hard on switching to synology. Personally I wish they would buy them and integrate them. The once darling enterprise grade company is shifting to focus on home/prosumer and entry level enterprise but less and less of what we have suggested begged for is getting pushed further away from ever being implemented. Besides since the world is finally learning what many pros before predicted would happen (some disaster comes and now we need remote access), many people and companies are clinging to cloud migrations. So this won’t stop sales for hardware but it will definitely be a sticking point for Cisco and other cloud providers who maybe able to provide more value in that space. Cisco looks very very good if I’m saving money in other area.
I am furious. I bought my stuff without this internet requirement and I want Ubiquiti to change it back or buy all my equipment back so that I may buy something else. This company has stolen from me. Now if they go out of business and I have to factory reset, my equipment is all paperweights. I consider this theft.
Willie, they don’t respond on the forum, the Facebook page, the phone number is a run around. If you actually get to speak to them, tell them I think they are jerks.
I pitched my cloud key and ran the Unifi controller up on a mini PC. Looking hard at NetGates 3100 with Pfsense. Will be down to Switches and APs at that point. If they screw that up I can move off of that too.
I just updated my g2 plus to .027 and 6.045. After reboot it made me login with my UI credentials. Would refuse local connection via 8443. What are you supposed to do if there's no internet connection for this setup, just go get fucked? Time to start looking elsewhere.
We have a firewall that for some reason dont let the cloudkey access internet (its not blocked, its that the cloudkey does not get a proper gateway from dhcp..) so there was no way to set up the cloudkey at all. Had to go to another net wich is more open and set it up there. I hate this new "feature" and going to look elsewhere, I dont like the idea of a cloud account that anyone can hack remotely. 2FA is fine and all but its almost impossible to manage when you have 20 diffrent cloudkeys and 5 technicians that all need access to the cloudkey. Its way to unflexible.
Hey Willie, I've not done this yet, but factory reset it and try using the default factory ubnt account like before. i wonder if Ubiquiti is just trying to get people to sign up but the old local way is still there.
Does the new version allow you to create local account and delete the cloud account, while also having the ability to disable remote access setting, and log in to your controller locally, after activation activation?
Yes, one can create a local account. And, NO.. the remote cloud account cannot be disabled. I believe topic was covered elsewhere by Lawrence Systems, so maybe go check out their video. I want to say the remote access could be disabled, but the remote account was unable to be removed. Something like that.
What a coincidence, had to deal with this last week! :) I upgraded a CK Gen2 firmware and Unifi Controller would no longer start even though it showed that it started properly. A bit of SSH halter, ended up recovering and restoring from a backup.
I believe you can create a SuperAdmin after initial setup and disable the remote access. My take away is to setup the CK in the lab before taking to a customer site which most IT likely do already.
...and what are you doing, if ui will shut down the server, i.e. because of they were hacked, they released a newer controller or what ever? You can't setup a factory reseted device any more. Are you sure, all cloud-account-data will be deleted after you have created a local account and disabled remote access? When this will be so, why they don't leave the "skip"-button at the setup-screen?!
I think/hope you can still create a local account after setting it up with a UI account. I do not like the fact that you are forced, it should be an option.
Yeah having both options would be best or at minimum explain what their doing, roadmap and rational as to why. Even Apple gave some explanation when they decided to kill Flash support, headphone jack etc. Like it or not these companies need to explain roadmap or risk losing their base customers.
No all accounts has to be ui accounts. Its a hazzle. If the CK is offline I cant add a new user, or if i add one but he later gets offline. its a PITA.
It's a real shame to see Ubiquiti moving in this direction, as I take it to mean that they are driving toward SaaS. One of the big benefits to going with Ubiquiti up to this point has been that they didn't rely-on or require "cloud" to operate. I agree it's a nice option for some, but if it does become mandatory my clients and I will be looking into alternatives.
Willie, I wonder if you were to factory default it and keep it from hitting the internet if it would allow you a local config and not require a UI tie in?
Sure it's an inconvenient requirement but I was looking at Engenius and they require cloud management as well. Is this the way they are all moving? I hope Omada doesn't follow suit.
Many do. But it's one thing if they did so from the start or if they lured you into choosing them because they didn't and all of a sudden they cut you off.
I can manage my EnGenius devices locally without connecting to their cloud. I don't have their key, may not get one if I don't need it. I can manage my small network from the first switch I bought.
Willie, What does it do if you yank your WAN cable at your router before you get to the cloud login screen? That is exactly what I do when installing Windows 10 Home. It forces you to a MS account and they took away all the ability to select a local account. But I yank my WAN cable and Windows 10 Home lets me create a local account that way. I know this is still irritating, but I bet it works. At least worth a try!
Well, I've spent a significant amount of money on Ubiquiti hardware, I've recommended it to many other people, I've installed it on friends networks, and I used to swear by it. I think it's great hardware and the prices are right. But, I refuse to do this. When the time comes that I have to reload my cloud key or replace it I will be searching for all new equipment. Too bad, it was good while it lasted. I guess they got too big for their own good. You built your fortune off us, now turning your backs on us....we can too.....bye bye.
I do not like most anything that involves a mothership. I avoid mothership connections when I can. If I had to guess this appears to me to be a first step in a much larger objective for the company. I am looking at Pfsense for the router / firewall and will be staying with the Unifi switches, at least for now. I have a closed security system using Blue Iris. No mothership... My only interest in the company is the networking equipment.
You should have made a way to backup the autobackup of backup folder , then you would have had a backup, i getting the creeps of sd cards, never use that myzelf.
I only have a home setup, and the only reason I use sites is to test settings. But, If it's a binary choice between updating or not, here's the two things i don't get. 1. If I update, my v.1.1.13 , I will keep my sites, and I will *not* be locked in to cloud management, correct? 2. They updated the CK2 to patch a vulnerability in sudo. Isn't that a big enough reason to update in itself?
Is it possible to restore from a backup directly after factory reset? Otherwise would it be an option to log in with the account and then restore from backup? Would this deactivate the cloud access and everything is like before factory reset?
I think its good it doesn't force cloud credentials with existing config. Forcing on factory default new setup...meh it looks like they want that going forward
Actually I don't think 2FA is even needed on the cloudkey (at least until you are forced to use an UI account). You shouldn't have it accessible over the internet at all and if an attacker is on your network and has access to your controllers IP, you got way more serious problems than your Unifi Setup
Two security flaws in the new interface: a) What happens if Ubiquiti goes bankrupt and the lawyers(ore something else) shut down the servers that handle the logon functionality? b) What about backup on UDM Pro and the possibility of moving site copy to NAS / Cloud server without manual intervention ?.
Just proves that they do not want me as a customer. If I cannot administrer my network locally without a cloud connection, I have zero interest in the product.
I think its crap!!!!! I think Ubiquiti is going in the wrong direction. I have a cloud key Gen 2 that can do multi-site management, but the UDM-Pro can't WTH!!!!! I am in the situation where I need to be able to manage all my sites so software on a server is it.
I am furious. I bought my stuff without this internet requirement and I want Ubiquiti to change it back or buy all my equipment back so that I may buy something else. This company has stolen from me. Now if they go out of business and I have to factory reset, my equipment is all paperweights. I consider this theft.
I think they are doing it because more and more average people are buying their products. And people have no clue what a local user is and I think they are trying to make it super fool proof to setup. I am getting so many calls lately to help people setup UBNT gear in their house so UBNT must know this and trying to make it easier to setup at the risk of upsetting us IT guys..
What we think? What everybody thinks. That they've screwed the pooch yet again. Now, I've seen my fair share of companies lose their credibility, but doing it ferociously, 24/7, completely deliberate and on purpose is truly a first. Yeah, the Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away, and we can go pound sand if we don't like it. But if they think themselves on the same pay grade over at UBNT, they should seriously go see a doctor or something. My customers are running Aruba now. Eff'em.
I’m not understanding why everybody is so frustrated when you still have local logins. It does not have to be managed via the cloud, but isn’t that the entire point of having this stuff Internet connected... ease of use and ease of updates? If you want things unbelievably locked down, why use this unify approach? It seems to me that unify is designed for security through getting out patches to every piece of equipment quickly, rather than hiding from the Internet it’s actually embracing the connectivity of such a system.
@@dank9561 I somewhat agree, although I learned recently that it’s really a good idea to know what your local usernames are on the cloud key just in case the cloud is down or something breaks the connection.
I think Ubiquiti is forgetting what made people interested in them to begin with and they're going to irritate a lot of people and not be as enticing to a lot of potential newcomers. Instead of concentrating on fixing their existing issues and bolstering their supply chains, they're concentrating on statistics gathering and optics.
Ubiquiti service quality and products are changing. Seeing more negative changes than good in the last 6 months.
It’s definitely been more negative in the last 3 years. Entire teams have left Ubnt in some capacity.
@@kristopherleslie8343 Can you expand upon this a bit more? What teams have left UBNT and do you know why they have left?
@@Moonraker11 let’s see:
MSPs
That have been responsible for the router(s), network switches, the nvr, the phone(s). UBNT left a bad taste in a lot of MSP. How do I know? It’s based off of reports from surveys offered over those years.
If you look at the Spiceworks community and even UA-cam, if it wasn’t for the content producers I really think the buzz around UBNT would be fizzling. Many people don’t like a lot of the trade offs you take with UBNT.
I would assume the average admin likely new and junior level would adore UBNT and likely should as again the content producers actually do a well job of entirely showing you how to configure and monitor your networks.
From a personal point of view, I’ve had about 5 routers die or are potentially dying with very minimal support or help from UBNT. Sure you can definitely send them back but not every case is cut and dry. My biggest issue has to definitely be the NVR. I’m leaning very hard on switching to synology. Personally I wish they would buy them and integrate them.
The once darling enterprise grade company is shifting to focus on home/prosumer and entry level enterprise but less and less of what we have suggested begged for is getting pushed further away from ever being implemented.
Besides since the world is finally learning what many pros before predicted would happen (some disaster comes and now we need remote access), many people and companies are clinging to cloud migrations. So this won’t stop sales for hardware but it will definitely be a sticking point for Cisco and other cloud providers who maybe able to provide more value in that space. Cisco looks very very good if I’m saving money in other area.
I am furious. I bought my stuff without this internet requirement and I want Ubiquiti to change it back or buy all my equipment back so that I may buy something else. This company has stolen from me. Now if they go out of business and I have to factory reset, my equipment is all paperweights. I consider this theft.
@@fallsdp another reason people are leaving. The list keeps adding up as they alienate new clients and existing ones.
Willie, they don’t respond on the forum, the Facebook page, the phone number is a run around. If you actually get to speak to them, tell them I think they are jerks.
Exactly, there's no way you'll get a response.
And I'm officially not recommending people purchasing Cloud keys or UDMs. This is uncrossable for me.
I pitched my cloud key and ran the Unifi controller up on a mini PC. Looking hard at NetGates 3100 with Pfsense. Will be down to Switches and APs at that point. If they screw that up I can move off of that too.
I just updated my g2 plus to .027 and 6.045. After reboot it made me login with my UI credentials. Would refuse local connection via 8443. What are you supposed to do if there's no internet connection for this setup, just go get fucked? Time to start looking elsewhere.
We have a firewall that for some reason dont let the cloudkey access internet (its not blocked, its that the cloudkey does not get a proper gateway from dhcp..) so there was no way to set up the cloudkey at all. Had to go to another net wich is more open and set it up there.
I hate this new "feature" and going to look elsewhere, I dont like the idea of a cloud account that anyone can hack remotely. 2FA is fine and all but its almost impossible to manage when you have 20 diffrent cloudkeys and 5 technicians that all need access to the cloudkey.
Its way to unflexible.
Sold all my Unifi stuff cheap, went to Aruba AIo and won't look back ! Good Video Willie !
Hey Willie, I've not done this yet, but factory reset it and try using the default factory ubnt account like before. i wonder if Ubiquiti is just trying to get people to sign up but the old local way is still there.
Does the new version allow you to create local account and delete the cloud account, while also having the ability to disable remote access setting, and log in to your controller locally, after activation activation?
Yes, one can create a local account. And, NO.. the remote cloud account cannot be disabled. I believe topic was covered elsewhere by Lawrence Systems, so maybe go check out their video. I want to say the remote access could be disabled, but the remote account was unable to be removed. Something like that.
What a coincidence, had to deal with this last week! :)
I upgraded a CK Gen2 firmware and Unifi Controller would no longer start even though it showed that it started properly.
A bit of SSH halter, ended up recovering and restoring from a backup.
I believe you can create a SuperAdmin after initial setup and disable the remote access. My take away is to setup the CK in the lab before taking to a customer site which most IT likely do already.
...and what are you doing, if ui will shut down the server, i.e. because of they were hacked, they released a newer controller or what ever? You can't setup a factory reseted device any more. Are you sure, all cloud-account-data will be deleted after you have created a local account and disabled remote access? When this will be so, why they don't leave the "skip"-button at the setup-screen?!
I think/hope you can still create a local account after setting it up with a UI account. I do not like the fact that you are forced, it should be an option.
Yeah having both options would be best or at minimum explain what their doing, roadmap and rational as to why.
Even Apple gave some explanation when they decided to kill Flash support, headphone jack etc. Like it or not these companies need to explain roadmap or risk losing their base customers.
No all accounts has to be ui accounts. Its a hazzle. If the CK is offline I cant add a new user, or if i add one but he later gets offline.
its a PITA.
Shouldn't need a Cloud Key. An internal Network should be able to run with the Internet plug pulled....
I found this video to try find out if Ubiquiti gear was worth using. This has told me to avoid them. Thanks for the info.
It's a real shame to see Ubiquiti moving in this direction, as I take it to mean that they are driving toward SaaS. One of the big benefits to going with Ubiquiti up to this point has been that they didn't rely-on or require "cloud" to operate. I agree it's a nice option for some, but if it does become mandatory my clients and I will be looking into alternatives.
Willie, I wonder if you were to factory default it and keep it from hitting the internet if it would allow you a local config and not require a UI tie in?
So glad I stayed away from cloud keys. Years ago setup a cloud controller and it’s been so solid. 👍🏼
Guess how long that thing's gonna stick around. Look where the self-hosted UniFi Video went. I wouldn't get my hope up.
lol why blur at 9:21? theres a whole second left you can see still.....
Sure it's an inconvenient requirement but I was looking at Engenius and they require cloud management as well. Is this the way they are all moving? I hope Omada doesn't follow suit.
Many do. But it's one thing if they did so from the start or if they lured you into choosing them because they didn't and all of a sudden they cut you off.
I can manage my EnGenius devices locally without connecting to their cloud. I don't have their key, may not get one if I don't need it. I can manage my small network from the first switch I bought.
Willie, What does it do if you yank your WAN cable at your router before you get to the cloud login screen? That is exactly what I do when installing Windows 10 Home. It forces you to a MS account and they took away all the ability to select a local account. But I yank my WAN cable and Windows 10 Home lets me create a local account that way. I know this is still irritating, but I bet it works. At least worth a try!
Well, I've spent a significant amount of money on Ubiquiti hardware, I've recommended it to many other people, I've installed it on friends networks, and I used to swear by it. I think it's great hardware and the prices are right. But, I refuse to do this. When the time comes that I have to reload my cloud key or replace it I will be searching for all new equipment. Too bad, it was good while it lasted. I guess they got too big for their own good. You built your fortune off us, now turning your backs on us....we can too.....bye bye.
I do not like most anything that involves a mothership. I avoid mothership connections when I can.
If I had to guess this appears to me to be a first step in a much larger objective for the company. I am looking at Pfsense for the router / firewall and will be staying with the Unifi switches, at least for now.
I have a closed security system using Blue Iris. No mothership... My only interest in the company is the networking equipment.
On initial startup when you signed into your UI account there was a 'create account' link, does that allow you to create a local account?
Sadly it does not. It prompts you to create a UI account
You should have made a way to backup the autobackup of backup folder , then you would have had a backup, i getting the creeps of sd cards, never use that myzelf.
I only have a home setup, and the only reason I use sites is to test settings. But, If it's a binary choice between updating or not, here's the two things i don't get. 1. If I update, my
v.1.1.13 , I will keep my sites, and I will *not* be locked in to cloud management, correct? 2. They updated the CK2 to patch a vulnerability in sudo. Isn't that a big enough reason to update in itself?
The sudo vulnerability requires the malactor to already have a login to your system.
Is it possible to restore from a backup directly after factory reset? Otherwise would it be an option to log in with the account and then restore from backup? Would this deactivate the cloud access and everything is like before factory reset?
I think its good it doesn't force cloud credentials with existing config.
Forcing on factory default new setup...meh it looks like they want that going forward
I had this issue with my UDM Pro but I was able to create a local user. Is this not the case with the UCKG2?
Un-Blurred PII @9:21 Willie
the question is , is this stated in the release notes?
I cant even log in with my details which also was saved. I can log into my account but not the controller
What about the out of the box situation, new cloudkey, new usg, internet requires username and password. How can it connect to the internet?
Friends don't let friends use USG
Actually I don't think 2FA is even needed on the cloudkey (at least until you are forced to use an UI account). You shouldn't have it accessible over the internet at all and if an attacker is on your network and has access to your controllers IP, you got way more serious problems than your Unifi Setup
Two security flaws in the new interface:
a) What happens if Ubiquiti goes bankrupt and the lawyers(ore something else) shut down the servers that handle the logon functionality?
b) What about backup on UDM Pro and the possibility of moving site copy to NAS / Cloud server without manual intervention ?.
for question A you could downgrsde the firmware to 1.1.13 as that is the last version that dosnt require an SSO account
I don’t like it.
Just proves that they do not want me as a customer.
If I cannot administrer my network locally without a cloud connection, I have zero interest in the product.
I think its crap!!!!! I think Ubiquiti is going in the wrong direction. I have a cloud key Gen 2 that can do multi-site management, but the UDM-Pro can't WTH!!!!! I am in the situation where I need to be able to manage all my sites so software on a server is it.
I am furious. I bought my stuff without this internet requirement and I want Ubiquiti to change it back or buy all my equipment back so that I may buy something else. This company has stolen from me. Now if they go out of business and I have to factory reset, my equipment is all paperweights. I consider this theft.
I wonder if there's a legal option to fight it. There is literally no reason to deny local logins.
I think they are doing it because more and more average people are buying their products. And people have no clue what a local user is and I think they are trying to make it super fool proof to setup.
I am getting so many calls lately to help people setup UBNT gear in their house so UBNT must know this and trying to make it easier to setup at the risk of upsetting us IT guys..
Perhaps this is An update not upgrade? Must have missed something .
What we think? What everybody thinks. That they've screwed the pooch yet again. Now, I've seen my fair share of companies lose their credibility, but doing it ferociously, 24/7, completely deliberate and on purpose is truly a first. Yeah, the Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away, and we can go pound sand if we don't like it. But if they think themselves on the same pay grade over at UBNT, they should seriously go see a doctor or something. My customers are running Aruba now. Eff'em.
I really don’t mind need to use my UI account the only thing I would mind if they have not fixed the multi sites
I’m not understanding why everybody is so frustrated when you still have local logins. It does not have to be managed via the cloud, but isn’t that the entire point of having this stuff Internet connected... ease of use and ease of updates?
If you want things unbelievably locked down, why use this unify approach? It seems to me that unify is designed for security through getting out patches to every piece of equipment quickly, rather than hiding from the Internet it’s actually embracing the connectivity of such a system.
@@dank9561 I somewhat agree, although I learned recently that it’s really a good idea to know what your local usernames are on the cloud key just in case the cloud is down or something breaks the connection.