Yes! Thank you sir! I am wonderfully delighted to know about the Cuatrociénegas bass. I have been to that region but never new there was an endemic species of bass. 😮 I am fourtunate to live in a state with most species of black bass but still have not caught more than smallmouth and largemouth. I need to go on a Pokemon adventure and catch them all! 😁
@@ShoalBandit Today was perfect, I was actually out fishing. When I was done I opened up UA-cam and saw your video and I instantly had a smile on my face.
Watching this from Australia! I'm a marine biologist and have an interest in north american freshwater fishes, such a good resource that gives a comprehensive overview of Micropterus and some really cool info on their ecology and habitat specialization!! Great work!!
Thanks ShoalBandit. I have been waiting for this one. I shared in hopes people will be more aware of the fish around them. Now waiting for that invasive Alabama bass video. People need to know.
Thanks I really appreciate it. Sorry it took so long to get this one out. I've got to make some fishing videos first but the Alabama Bass video is coming.
great video ShoalBandit!! Saw a presentation a year ago or so that suggests adding a 20th species/form, the Delta Bass. So your video may be getting updated before too long haha
Thanks I'm glad you liked it! I'll be updating these once a year so no problem lol. I stumbled onto a paper that mentioned the Delta Bass while I was making this video...interesting stuff!
Really interesting. Being from the Great Lakes region we really only recognize smallmouth and largemouth bass. Most of these other species/subspecies appear to be from the South/Southeastern regions which is maybe why I never knew about them? I am surprised at how distinct some of them look. Thanks for sharing.
Found your channel while trying to identify a species I caught last weekend. Great resource, and I sincerely hope more folks find your content! Would love to be able to send you the pic and see what you think it is.
This is most excellent, thanks for making it! Like others I'm incredibly stoked to have found this vid. It deserves so many more views, as does your channel. But, a thing happened: A.T. Taylor and friends published a new paper (Phylogenomics and species delimitation of the economically important Black Basses) in which some of the 2019 and earlier stuff takes a bit of a beating. I bet you've seen it, but in a tiny nutshell: Most gratifyingly, the upland basses, all of them, are shown to come from a single ancestor. That's great because I found the idea of two ancestors for such obviously similar species hard to swallow. (You could argue that genes from related ancestors could evolve along similar lines in similar environments, but in this case I think it's a stretch and now besides the point.😅) No mention is made of the Cuatrocienegas bass, but the Neosho, Little River and Ouachita smallies are all assigned full species status, and they're not alone. All the upland bass are also assigned species status, although many of the 'new' species' formal descriptions are still incoming. Lastly, the study shows that most of what was considered the transitional zone between LM and Florida bass, is actually home to pure Florida bass. The type specimen of M. salmoides is from within this territory, which in short is, partly, why the name is rendered valid for Florida bass. Largemouth bass then get the next oldest synonym, M. nigricans, and the name M. floridanus falls away. The paper argues for 19 distinct species within Micropterus. Talk about a shake-up! If you haven't read the paper, I bet you'll love it; my description here is my interpretation only and does not do it justice. My only gripe is that Shoal and Suwannee bass barely get a glance in the paper, and I'd love to know more about them. Which is weird because I'm in South Africa and we only have introduced and thriving Florida bass, largemouth, smallmouth and spotted bass (we grow them big though, making me question our spotties) and I'm in denial about the odds of ever laying eyes on more black bass species. Dude can dream. All the best, I look forward to watching all your current and future vids!
Thanks for watching I'm glad you liked it! I have seen the paper you mentioned...lots of interesting stuff! I know some experts take issue with the sample size(s) so I guess time will tell how it all shakes out. BTW I'm doing another video that'll have lots of info about stream specialists (like Shoal Bass and Suwannee Bass) that'll hopefully be out before the end of the year. I couldn't find any pics of South African 'spotted bass' online. I had no idea they had been introduced so that's interesting (and unfortunate if they're Alabama Bass because they'll ruin your Largemouth and Smallmouth fisheries).
@@ShoalBandit Thanks for the reply, man! I hear you re the sample sizes, will just have to look forward to the 'results' and your videos on it. Can't wait for the stream specialist vids! As far as our 'spots' are concerned, they have been around since 1939, slightly shorter than largies and smallies, and where they all occur together, smallies still tend to dominate even where hybrids are common - there's almost definitely some back crossing going on as well, so it's tough to be 100% certain. But even 'pure' looking spots regularly reach 5lb, perhaps they just eat really well. 😄 I am on a mission to take some measurements and scale counts on the next few I catch. Seems as close as I'll get to my answer. Our 'largemouth' record is clearly full of Florida genes at 18,3lb, while our biggest smallmouths exceed 8lb. We grow 12in + bluegills, too. Nothing to complain about there! I read in another comment that you may be posting some fly fishing vids, too ... yes, please! Keep up the good work, man! Much respect.
@@leroybotha420 Thanks for the support I really appreciate it! It's also really interesting to hear about the SA fisheries. I'm guessing you have real Spotted Bass (M. punctulatus) because Alabama Bass (M. henshalli) and Smallmouth Bass cannot persist together in the same waterbody. You do not want Alabama Bass in SA and I would try to discourage people from moving bass around especially 'spotted bass'.
@@ShoalBandit That makes sense, I have tried to do some scale counts from pics, the spotted bass in SA seem to max out at 70 in the lateral line. That seems to confirm their ID, since Alabama bass would generally have a higher count, right? And as you said, in more than 80 years they have not outcompeted smallmouth. Lateral line blotches also seem fewer and larger than on the 'Bamas in your vids. As far as moving fish, absolutely agreed. It's a big deal around here. We have a very lucrative bass fishing industry, but the movement of all bass and alien species is strictly 'controlled' and for the most part illegal. They've had a severe impact on indigenous species (some of which are amazing sportfish), and we're only now starting to see the fruits of many years of remedial efforts. But they are here to stay and provide great sport to many and even support many livelihoods. I dig them. My first fish ever was a smallmouth, and they still mean a lot to me. Thanks again for your vids, you've made it easy to learn things about them that I've wanted to know for years. Also thanks for taking the time to reply. Big fan. Started from the beginning, ended on Cahaba Bass last night, on with the big Georgia bass tonight. All the best!
@@leroybotha420 Yes Alabama Bass usually have more than 71 lateral line scales (and average around 78) according to the biologists. They also typically have more blotches in the midlateral stripe, and the dorsal blotches DO NOT touch the base of the spiny dorsal fin. I've seen enough that I can usually ID them from a pic. BTW I did see some juveniles on iNaturalist from the Biedouw River (SA) that were definitely Spotted Bass. Thanks again for watching!
Thank you very much I'm glad you liked it! Yes, I will be making a video about the Pygmy Sunfishes at some point. I also got a request a while back to do Esocidae so that's going to be the next big project after Centrarchidae.
I'm really, really worried about the Alabama Bass problem. Basically everything in TN is in the same drainage, and they're already in it. Will they TOTALLY replace smallmouth within their native Mississippi river drainage some day? It seems inevitable.
That's why I'm a big advocate of calling these fish Alabama Bass. Maybe then people will stop moving them around because they're not 'spotted bass'. Spotted Bass and Smallmouth are both native to the Mississippi River drainage so they can persist in the same lake/river system. Smallmouth and nonnative Alabama Bass cannot persist in the same lake/river system for an extended period. I'm going to do a video on this at some point after I get done with some other stuff I've been working on.
I am aware of the differences between spotted and the Alabama Bass.... since there's no length limit and a per day creel limit of 15, I take every one I catch out of Nickajack Headwaters below Chickamauga dam... I am eating up the protein of the invaders...
These videos are awesome dude! I watched the whole series. I got a question/challenge for you; I'm in the North East and recently found there are three native subspecies of Brook Trout (Eastern, Laker, and Salter) I cannot yet conclusively find a way online to identify the three, the only evidence I've found so far is 'where they live' but the Eastern and Salter have a lot of overlap. Anyways keep up the videos, scientific and just plain fishing! you got a new subscriber!
Thank you very much I'm glad you liked them! I live in the southeast, so our only native salmonid is the Southern Appalachian Brook Trout. As a Georgia native, I'm not too familiar with the other Brook Trout but I did a quick search and it looks like the Eastern, Laker and Salter Brook Trout are considered distinct ecological forms (not subspecies). If there was a way to conclusively ID them in the field (physical traits, scale counts, etc...), they probably would've been classified as subspecies or maybe elevated to distinct species.
@@ShoalBandit That solves my question! U are good. Freshwater habitats are so under appreciated, I’m in new england and so many fish have been introduced a lot of subspecies were gone before documentation. That or they’re ignored, one thing I have found is theres about 8 or 9 Shiner species in Massachusetts alone.
Yes, Dale Hollow straddles the KY/TN border, TN and KY both claim the fish as a state record, IGFA lists the location as Tennessee, so that was the 'tiebreaker'. Hayes lived in KY and several sources claim the fish was caught in KY waters, but how reliable are those accounts? The video was already extremely long so I just used the IGFA info since that's the resource most anglers use when it comes to world record fish. I'm going to update these videos at some point to keep the info current/accurate, so I'll change the location and/or address the controversy then (if there is one). Thanks for watching!
Any chance these videos could be put into a playlist? I like to point people to your channel for these videos, and have returned to them myself countless times. Thanks for all the work you’ve done, and made available too.
That's a great idea I will definitely do that as soon as I figure out how. Thanks for watching it's good to know people like and appreciate those videos. I have more coming they just take a long time to make.
Great work on the video. The only thing is at times you did repeat information which I think is unnecessary e.g. the largemouth Florida bass hybrid range section. Otherwise super helpful!
Thanks I'm glad you liked the video and I appreciate the feedback! I'm still trying to figure out how to add time stamps in the description so you don't have to watch the whole video. That's the main reason I did that but I'm going to update these at least once a year (so they stay current) and to make changes like the one(s) you mentioned.
Thank you so much for this video! It really helped me wrap my head around the diversity within Micropterus. I have not read the Taylor et al. 2019 paper yet. I saw the maps which were reproduced with Guy Eroh’s article on the Georgia Bass Slam in the Summer 2020 issue of American Currents. I was wondering if it was an error when he referred to the Chattahoochee Bass as related to Shoal Bass, instead of Redeye. Based on the maps, I had assumed there were basically four species groups: largemouth, smallmouth, spotted, and redeye. It makes more sense now that I see how Alabama -> Warrior, Cahaba, Redeye, & Tallapoosa; and Shoal -> Chattahoochee, Altamaha, & Bartram’s. But that raises all sorts of other biogeographical questions that I assume the authors addressed. Why no “upland” species of Alabama in the Tombigbee? Probably too flat. Or in whatever drainage is between the a Chattahoochee and Altamaha? Why no Shoals below the fallline under Altamaha and Bartram’s? I bet there was another spotted-like species on the Atlantic slope that was out-competed or genetically swamped by the Largemouth/Florida group. Why the convergence of “upland” phenotypes from different progenitors? I really need to get a copy of that paper next week.
The geological history of the region and the timing of these events has a lot to do with it. The Flint River is between the Chattahoochee and Altamaha drainages. The Flint begins south of ATL on Hartsfield-Jackson airport property and converges with the Chattahoochee well below the Fall Line at what is now Lake Seminole. The Chattooga River at one time flowed into the Chattahoochee River along what is today the Soque River until it was captured by the Tugaloo River. You don't find igneous or metamorphic rocks below the Fall Line. Sedimentary rock like limestone is found in areas that were previously warm, shallow tropical seas. Erosion has exposed limestone at the surface in the lower Flint and Chipola Rivers-and some other drainages like the Suwannee, Choctawhatchee, etc...
Pure Guadalupe Bass have been expatriated due Smallmouth hybridization in some parts of the Texas Hill Country. We can thank Texas Parks & Wildlife for that.
Florida Bass were introduced to Cuba over one hundred years ago (1915-1920.) They were imported in 55-gallon drums by the United Fruit Co. to provide sport for industrialists.
I tried to DM you but it didn't work! There's a study fresh off the press that redescribes some of the species your video refers to and has led to an upheaval of IGFA records! I thought of you and this video right away!
Sorry it didn't work my email address is shoalbandit@gmail.com. I've seen the study and you're right; it'll be very interesting to see what happens to the Perry record because I don't think there's any way that fish was a Largemouth Bass. The GA DNR biologists I've talked to have never sampled a Largemouth that far south. They're either Largemouth x Florida hybrids or Florida Bass in that part of the Ocmulgee River.
@@ShoalBandit Out of curiosity, is there a collection of information anywhere with the full scope of known introductions of nonnative bass to ranges they don't appear naturally? I live in and fish mostly in Kentucky. I haven't found any suspicious looking bass anywhere, but it'd be cool to know if I should be on the lookout in certain places. Kentucky's spotted bass record seems very big (7 lb 10 oz), but apparently it was caught from a large pond formed as a lake was draining where I guess the bass became an apex predator (according to a news story about it) and could explain the size of it. I am hoping it's a good sign that there isn't a lot of buzz about the introduction of other bass, but KY does have a redeye bass state record, caught in Martin's fork of the Cumberland River. This is sort of concerning because it is upstream from Lake Cumberland, but I imagine that they wouldn't thrive too far down the river from this section given their preferred habitat. The Fish and Wildlife Department doesn't seem worried about it, but it doesn't hurt to check. Edit: Oops, you mentioned the Cumberland River stocking.
@@PythonDad Unfortunately there is no resource that I'm aware of. That's one of the reasons I started this channel. The fish that has resource agencies in GA, TN, SC, NC, VA, and WV most concerned is the Alabama Bass. They not only reduce the overall number and trophy size potential of Largemouth in a fishery, they also outcompete and hybridize with the Smallmouth Bass. This has lead to the complete local extinction of Smallmouth Bass in several fisheries. The biggest problem and the reason people keep moving Alabama Bass is that anglers still call Alabama Bass 'spotted bass' 14 years after they were described as a separate species. Spotted Bass and Smallmouth are both native to the Mississippi Basin. Alabama Bass are not so their introduction causes all kinds of problems. You're right-Redeye Bass are an upland stream specialist so they can really only thrive in high gradient streams with free-flowing characteristics. The Tennessee Game and Fish Commission stocked Redeye Bass in the upper Cumberland and Tennessee drainages (1950s-1960s) to 'enhance headwater stream fisheries'. Unfortunately subsequent studies have found up to 66% of the bass sampled in these streams are hybrids. When humans move black bass, they're always going to hybridize and backcross with native species and in this case it's been going on since they were introduced 70 years ago.
I have waited my whole life for one single source that talks about all of these wonderful species, this video is much appreciated!
Thank you that's a serious compliment! I'm glad you liked the video!
Yes! Thank you sir!
I am wonderfully delighted to know about the Cuatrociénegas bass. I have been to that region but never new there was an endemic species of bass. 😮 I am fourtunate to live in a state with most species of black bass but still have not caught more than smallmouth and largemouth. I need to go on a Pokemon adventure and catch them all! 😁
McClane's _Standard Fishing Encyclopedia_
Another great video, thanks!
Thank you I'm glad you liked it!
I've had a really rough week and this my day better thank you.
Sorry it took so long man. Now that it's done I'm going to start fishing again so I'll be posting at least once a week.
@@ShoalBandit Today was perfect, I was actually out fishing. When I was done I opened up UA-cam and saw your video and I instantly had a smile on my face.
Watching this from Australia! I'm a marine biologist and have an interest in north american freshwater fishes, such a good resource that gives a comprehensive overview of Micropterus and some really cool info on their ecology and habitat specialization!! Great work!!
Thank you very much I really appreciate the compliment!
THANK YOU for using the correct term 'angler'!
I've been waiting on this one. Listening now!
I’ve watched this multiple times I love these videos
Thank you I really appreciate it! I'm actually going to update these (this winter most likely) to keep the info current.
Great videos for information to chase bucket list fish. Much appreciated
Thank you very much hope you get those bucket list fish!
Thanks ShoalBandit. I have been waiting for this one. I shared in hopes people will be more aware of the fish around them. Now waiting for that invasive Alabama bass video. People need to know.
Thanks I really appreciate it. Sorry it took so long to get this one out. I've got to make some fishing videos first but the Alabama Bass video is coming.
Thank you!
Amazing content, thank you
Thanks for watching I'm glad you liked it!
Like Highlander, there can only be one. Ha. Excellent as usual. Thanks for the excellent content
Thank you I'm glad you liked it!
Excellent work. great detail. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you very much! It took a long time to make so I appreciate the feedback. Thanks for watching!
great video ShoalBandit!! Saw a presentation a year ago or so that suggests adding a 20th species/form, the Delta Bass. So your video may be getting updated before too long haha
Thanks I'm glad you liked it! I'll be updating these once a year so no problem lol. I stumbled onto a paper that mentioned the Delta Bass while I was making this video...interesting stuff!
Really interesting. Being from the Great Lakes region we really only recognize smallmouth and largemouth bass. Most of these other species/subspecies appear to be from the South/Southeastern regions which is maybe why I never knew about them? I am surprised at how distinct some of them look. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for watching I'm glad you liked it!
Found your channel while trying to identify a species I caught last weekend. Great resource, and I sincerely hope more folks find your content!
Would love to be able to send you the pic and see what you think it is.
Thanks for watching I really appreciate it!
I'll do my best to ID your fish...pic(s) can be sent to: shoalbandit@gmail.com
@@ShoalBandit awesome! Will be sure to send
This is most excellent, thanks for making it! Like others I'm incredibly stoked to have found this vid. It deserves so many more views, as does your channel. But, a thing happened: A.T. Taylor and friends published a new paper (Phylogenomics and species delimitation of the economically important Black Basses) in which some of the 2019 and earlier stuff takes a bit of a beating. I bet you've seen it, but in a tiny nutshell: Most gratifyingly, the upland basses, all of them, are shown to come from a single ancestor. That's great because I found the idea of two ancestors for such obviously similar species hard to swallow. (You could argue that genes from related ancestors could evolve along similar lines in similar environments, but in this case I think it's a stretch and now besides the point.😅) No mention is made of the Cuatrocienegas bass, but the Neosho, Little River and Ouachita smallies are all assigned full species status, and they're not alone. All the upland bass are also assigned species status, although many of the 'new' species' formal descriptions are still incoming. Lastly, the study shows that most of what was considered the transitional zone between LM and Florida bass, is actually home to pure Florida bass. The type specimen of M. salmoides is from within this territory, which in short is, partly, why the name is rendered valid for Florida bass. Largemouth bass then get the next oldest synonym, M. nigricans, and the name M. floridanus falls away. The paper argues for 19 distinct species within Micropterus. Talk about a shake-up!
If you haven't read the paper, I bet you'll love it; my description here is my interpretation only and does not do it justice. My only gripe is that Shoal and Suwannee bass barely get a glance in the paper, and I'd love to know more about them. Which is weird because I'm in South Africa and we only have introduced and thriving Florida bass, largemouth, smallmouth and spotted bass (we grow them big though, making me question our spotties) and I'm in denial about the odds of ever laying eyes on more black bass species. Dude can dream. All the best, I look forward to watching all your current and future vids!
Thanks for watching I'm glad you liked it! I have seen the paper you mentioned...lots of interesting stuff! I know some experts take issue with the sample size(s) so I guess time will tell how it all shakes out. BTW I'm doing another video that'll have lots of info about stream specialists (like Shoal Bass and Suwannee Bass) that'll hopefully be out before the end of the year. I couldn't find any pics of South African 'spotted bass' online. I had no idea they had been introduced so that's interesting (and unfortunate if they're Alabama Bass because they'll ruin your Largemouth and Smallmouth fisheries).
@@ShoalBandit Thanks for the reply, man! I hear you re the sample sizes, will just have to look forward to the 'results' and your videos on it. Can't wait for the stream specialist vids! As far as our 'spots' are concerned, they have been around since 1939, slightly shorter than largies and smallies, and where they all occur together, smallies still tend to dominate even where hybrids are common - there's almost definitely some back crossing going on as well, so it's tough to be 100% certain. But even 'pure' looking spots regularly reach 5lb, perhaps they just eat really well. 😄 I am on a mission to take some measurements and scale counts on the next few I catch. Seems as close as I'll get to my answer. Our 'largemouth' record is clearly full of Florida genes at 18,3lb, while our biggest smallmouths exceed 8lb. We grow 12in + bluegills, too. Nothing to complain about there!
I read in another comment that you may be posting some fly fishing vids, too ... yes, please! Keep up the good work, man! Much respect.
@@leroybotha420 Thanks for the support I really appreciate it! It's also really interesting to hear about the SA fisheries. I'm guessing you have real Spotted Bass (M. punctulatus) because Alabama Bass (M. henshalli) and Smallmouth Bass cannot persist together in the same waterbody. You do not want Alabama Bass in SA and I would try to discourage people from moving bass around especially 'spotted bass'.
@@ShoalBandit That makes sense, I have tried to do some scale counts from pics, the spotted bass in SA seem to max out at 70 in the lateral line. That seems to confirm their ID, since Alabama bass would generally have a higher count, right? And as you said, in more than 80 years they have not outcompeted smallmouth. Lateral line blotches also seem fewer and larger than on the 'Bamas in your vids. As far as moving fish, absolutely agreed. It's a big deal around here. We have a very lucrative bass fishing industry, but the movement of all bass and alien species is strictly 'controlled' and for the most part illegal. They've had a severe impact on indigenous species (some of which are amazing sportfish), and we're only now starting to see the fruits of many years of remedial efforts. But they are here to stay and provide great sport to many and even support many livelihoods. I dig them. My first fish ever was a smallmouth, and they still mean a lot to me.
Thanks again for your vids, you've made it easy to learn things about them that I've wanted to know for years. Also thanks for taking the time to reply. Big fan. Started from the beginning, ended on Cahaba Bass last night, on with the big Georgia bass tonight. All the best!
@@leroybotha420 Yes Alabama Bass usually have more than 71 lateral line scales (and average around 78) according to the biologists. They also typically have more blotches in the midlateral stripe, and the dorsal blotches DO NOT touch the base of the spiny dorsal fin. I've seen enough that I can usually ID them from a pic. BTW I did see some juveniles on iNaturalist from the Biedouw River (SA) that were definitely Spotted Bass. Thanks again for watching!
This is an amazing Video and series, are you going to do one about the Elassoma Genus or the Pygmy Sunfish
Thank you very much I'm glad you liked it! Yes, I will be making a video about the Pygmy Sunfishes at some point. I also got a request a while back to do Esocidae so that's going to be the next big project after Centrarchidae.
I'm really, really worried about the Alabama Bass problem. Basically everything in TN is in the same drainage, and they're already in it.
Will they TOTALLY replace smallmouth within their native Mississippi river drainage some day? It seems inevitable.
That's why I'm a big advocate of calling these fish Alabama Bass. Maybe then people will stop moving them around because they're not 'spotted bass'. Spotted Bass and Smallmouth are both native to the Mississippi River drainage so they can persist in the same lake/river system. Smallmouth and nonnative Alabama Bass cannot persist in the same lake/river system for an extended period. I'm going to do a video on this at some point after I get done with some other stuff I've been working on.
I am aware of the differences between spotted and the Alabama Bass.... since there's no length limit and a per day creel limit of 15, I take every one I catch out of Nickajack Headwaters below Chickamauga dam... I am eating up the protein of the invaders...
These videos are awesome dude! I watched the whole series. I got a question/challenge for you; I'm in the North East and recently found there are three native subspecies of Brook Trout (Eastern, Laker, and Salter) I cannot yet conclusively find a way online to identify the three, the only evidence I've found so far is 'where they live' but the Eastern and Salter have a lot of overlap. Anyways keep up the videos, scientific and just plain fishing! you got a new subscriber!
Thank you very much I'm glad you liked them! I live in the southeast, so our only native salmonid is the Southern Appalachian Brook Trout. As a Georgia native, I'm not too familiar with the other Brook Trout but I did a quick search and it looks like the Eastern, Laker and Salter Brook Trout are considered distinct ecological forms (not subspecies). If there was a way to conclusively ID them in the field (physical traits, scale counts, etc...), they probably would've been classified as subspecies or maybe elevated to distinct species.
@@ShoalBandit That solves my question! U are good. Freshwater habitats are so under appreciated, I’m in new england and so many fish have been introduced a lot of subspecies were gone before documentation. That or they’re ignored, one thing I have found is theres about 8 or 9 Shiner species in Massachusetts alone.
@@BtrDedThnFed Glad I could help! We have many of the same problems here unfortunately. That's actually why I started this channel.
The largest Smallmouth was actually caught in the Kentucky waters of Dale Hollow Lake which straddles the Kentucky Tennessee border.
Yes, Dale Hollow straddles the KY/TN border, TN and KY both claim the fish as a state record, IGFA lists the location as Tennessee, so that was the 'tiebreaker'. Hayes lived in KY and several sources claim the fish was caught in KY waters, but how reliable are those accounts? The video was already extremely long so I just used the IGFA info since that's the resource most anglers use when it comes to world record fish. I'm going to update these videos at some point to keep the info current/accurate, so I'll change the location and/or address the controversy then (if there is one). Thanks for watching!
Any chance these videos could be put into a playlist? I like to point people to your channel for these videos, and have returned to them myself countless times.
Thanks for all the work you’ve done, and made available too.
That's a great idea I will definitely do that as soon as I figure out how.
Thanks for watching it's good to know people like and appreciate those videos. I have more coming they just take a long time to make.
@@ShoalBandit thank you for that! I could only imagine how much work goes into these videos!!
@@RoamingWhispers No problem thanks for the suggestion!
Great work on the video. The only thing is at times you did repeat information which I think is unnecessary e.g. the largemouth Florida bass hybrid range section. Otherwise super helpful!
Thanks I'm glad you liked the video and I appreciate the feedback! I'm still trying to figure out how to add time stamps in the description so you don't have to watch the whole video. That's the main reason I did that but I'm going to update these at least once a year (so they stay current) and to make changes like the one(s) you mentioned.
Thank you so much for this video! It really helped me wrap my head around the diversity within Micropterus.
I have not read the Taylor et al. 2019 paper yet. I saw the maps which were reproduced with Guy Eroh’s article on the Georgia Bass Slam in the Summer 2020 issue of American Currents. I was wondering if it was an error when he referred to the Chattahoochee Bass as related to Shoal Bass, instead of Redeye. Based on the maps, I had assumed there were basically four species groups: largemouth, smallmouth, spotted, and redeye. It makes more sense now that I see how Alabama -> Warrior, Cahaba, Redeye, & Tallapoosa; and Shoal -> Chattahoochee, Altamaha, & Bartram’s. But that raises all sorts of other biogeographical questions that I assume the authors addressed. Why no “upland” species of Alabama in the Tombigbee? Probably too flat. Or in whatever drainage is between the a Chattahoochee and Altamaha? Why no Shoals below the fallline under Altamaha and Bartram’s? I bet there was another spotted-like species on the Atlantic slope that was out-competed or genetically swamped by the Largemouth/Florida group. Why the convergence of “upland” phenotypes from different progenitors?
I really need to get a copy of that paper next week.
The geological history of the region and the timing of these events has a lot to do with it. The Flint River is between the Chattahoochee and Altamaha drainages. The Flint begins south of ATL on Hartsfield-Jackson airport property and converges with the Chattahoochee well below the Fall Line at what is now Lake Seminole. The Chattooga River at one time flowed into the Chattahoochee River along what is today the Soque River until it was captured by the Tugaloo River. You don't find igneous or metamorphic rocks below the Fall Line. Sedimentary rock like limestone is found in areas that were previously warm, shallow tropical seas. Erosion has exposed limestone at the surface in the lower Flint and Chipola Rivers-and some other drainages like the Suwannee, Choctawhatchee, etc...
Pure Guadalupe Bass have been expatriated due Smallmouth hybridization in some parts of the Texas Hill Country. We can thank Texas Parks & Wildlife for that.
They made a big mess that's for sure and have spent lots of time and money trying to fix it.
I think there is also a Cuban largemouth bass, I don’t know if its related to the Florida largemouth.
Florida Bass were introduced to Cuba over one hundred years ago (1915-1920.) They were imported in 55-gallon drums by the United Fruit Co. to provide sport for industrialists.
I tried to DM you but it didn't work! There's a study fresh off the press that redescribes some of the species your video refers to and has led to an upheaval of IGFA records! I thought of you and this video right away!
Sorry it didn't work my email address is shoalbandit@gmail.com. I've seen the study and you're right; it'll be very interesting to see what happens to the Perry record because I don't think there's any way that fish was a Largemouth Bass. The GA DNR biologists I've talked to have never sampled a Largemouth that far south. They're either Largemouth x Florida hybrids or Florida Bass in that part of the Ocmulgee River.
That smallmouth drawing is the worst thing I have ever seen lmao.
Science has come a long way since 1802! Lol
@@ShoalBandit Out of curiosity, is there a collection of information anywhere with the full scope of known introductions of nonnative bass to ranges they don't appear naturally? I live in and fish mostly in Kentucky. I haven't found any suspicious looking bass anywhere, but it'd be cool to know if I should be on the lookout in certain places. Kentucky's spotted bass record seems very big (7 lb 10 oz), but apparently it was caught from a large pond formed as a lake was draining where I guess the bass became an apex predator (according to a news story about it) and could explain the size of it. I am hoping it's a good sign that there isn't a lot of buzz about the introduction of other bass, but KY does have a redeye bass state record, caught in Martin's fork of the Cumberland River. This is sort of concerning because it is upstream from Lake Cumberland, but I imagine that they wouldn't thrive too far down the river from this section given their preferred habitat. The Fish and Wildlife Department doesn't seem worried about it, but it doesn't hurt to check.
Edit: Oops, you mentioned the Cumberland River stocking.
@@PythonDad Unfortunately there is no resource that I'm aware of. That's one of the reasons I started this channel. The fish that has resource agencies in GA, TN, SC, NC, VA, and WV most concerned is the Alabama Bass. They not only reduce the overall number and trophy size potential of Largemouth in a fishery, they also outcompete and hybridize with the Smallmouth Bass. This has lead to the complete local extinction of Smallmouth Bass in several fisheries. The biggest problem and the reason people keep moving Alabama Bass is that anglers still call Alabama Bass 'spotted bass' 14 years after they were described as a separate species. Spotted Bass and Smallmouth are both native to the Mississippi Basin. Alabama Bass are not so their introduction causes all kinds of problems.
You're right-Redeye Bass are an upland stream specialist so they can really only thrive in high gradient streams with free-flowing characteristics. The Tennessee Game and Fish Commission stocked Redeye Bass in the upper Cumberland and Tennessee drainages (1950s-1960s) to 'enhance headwater stream fisheries'. Unfortunately subsequent studies have found up to 66% of the bass sampled in these streams are hybrids. When humans move black bass, they're always going to hybridize and backcross with native species and in this case it's been going on since they were introduced 70 years ago.