Thoughts on this strategy? “Completely broken” comes to mind when archers destroy buildings faster than siege. More World Cup 2v2 action coming to UA-cam soon!
I mean, it only works if there's a skill disparity between the players, right? It's broken in the sense that it shouldn't be possible to achieve unless there's assisting factors.
@@MickeyasGilliady Saladin did lose, his army was forced to retreat after failing to push the English army out of Jaffa, and lost hundreds of men before his army routed from the field. The English and Italian contingent only reported a few soldiers lost. In the words of Baha' al-Din a Muslim historian present at the battle “I have been assured … that on that day the king of England, lance in hand, rode along the whole length of our army from right to left, and not one of our soldiers left the ranks to attack him. The Sultan was wroth thereat and left the battlefield in anger…” Sounds like gg to me.
I think my favorite memory of Team Norway using this strat was back in a different WC when, midway through the game, roughly this exchange happened: MBL: "Viper? Do we have...is there...like..." Viper: "Yes MBL?" MBL: "Backup plan?" Viper: "Oh, ok, sure. What is it?" MBL: (laughs) "I'm asking." Viper: "Oh. (laughs) No. We don't need backup plan, this will work."
As someone from Czech republic, this makes me happy, even though czech team lost. If they played against anyone else, than Viper and MBL, they would have most likely won.
@@Doubleranged1 which esport dont have fans that cheer for good players? have u ever seen dota 2 tournaments such as manila major 2016,ti3 grand final, ti5 grand final? its hype af. ua-cam.com/video/2zKbZ-Tm_Ys/v-deo.html&ab_channel=PutTankInAMall ua-cam.com/video/8AT-OEqDpJ0/v-deo.html&ab_channel=hOlyhexOr ua-cam.com/video/3ElXGllTpp0/v-deo.html&ab_channel=NoobFromUA ua-cam.com/video/bZQx3Op4_oY/v-deo.html&ab_channel=NoobFromUA ua-cam.com/video/zm81T2lsYmE/v-deo.html&ab_channel=NAVIDota2 just watch these and tell me its not hype. t90 is good caster but he lacks hype compared to top tier dota 2 casters.
Was T90 making a joke saying he wishes he was as good as his brother, or does he have another brother that’s actually real good at AOE2? I know he has one brother who’s not very good at all.
@@yoyodude-aoe2726 - Yeah I feel like the skirmisher upgrade is just as good. Skirmishers are a common answer to Mayans and now they dominate fights where they match skirm for skirm.
Hi I'm from Korea, and I started playing AOE2 last week! I've been watching your UA-cam videos for like a month, and finally I decided to play this game, not only watch it :D This game needs several different strategies and good mechanics, so it's very very tough to learn. Watching your videos helped me a lot, I wanna thank you!! I wanna see more videos like this, in which pro players show insane strategies and skills!
Was amazing to watch Viper melt those walls, but with the november update, obsidian arrows nolonger grants bonus damage towards walls, towers and gates.
When you were saying “looking at vipers eco” I was like t90, we are looking at blue we can’t look at vipers eco. Little did I pay attention to the fact that viper was not on his yellow!
Hm, Yezris might've looked like he had the upper hand at times, when he was sweeping Viper's arbs with his Cav, but the problem was that in terms of army cost, Viper was losing way cheaper units that he could easily afford to replace by stealing MBL's hard earned resources, while Yezris had no ally to fall back to and his losses were more expensive than Viper's. Adding siege would've been prohibitively expensive, on top of that.
2v2 Convo with my brother the other day - Me: I'm going Mayans, bro Bro: Should i go Celts for fast siege? Me: I'M GOING MAYANS! Bro: So pick berries and tower, got it
Plumed Archers do not benefit from Obsidian Arrows. When playing in team games and if the Mayan player has a Saracen ally, it also adds the team bonus of +2 attack bonus against buildings for Archers for a total of +8.
They should had mixed in 4-5 Onagers with the cav. Either that OR Send 15-20 cav to MBL as you said ("or" because there would be too little cav in main group to do both)
@@ADCFproductions Impossible, you just don't have time to adapt that. To make Elite Genitours you have to transition... make archers upgrades, make at least 5 or 6 archery camps, make the upgrade... that would cost at least 5 to 10 minutes. In 5 minutes the game was done.
@@artymclabin8584 the logical error is probably more in that obsidian is really hard to shape correctly, I highly doubt you could have made arrow tips better than steel just because you probably couldn't get it as thin and "pointy" without getting brittle
@@artymclabin8584 and a lot more brittle than steel. if you hit steel with obsedian with enough force, the steel will bend while the obsedian will shatter.
@@brohvakiindova4452 if they made obsidian arrows a dark age upgrade that gave huge damage to units with no armor upgrades, but then suffered a big drop-off against buildings and armored units, it would have opened up a whole new bag of opportunities.
I think they needed to break down the walls of MBL with the knights after the failed tower push and put the first castle onto a TC to make their castle push about 2-3 minutes faster. They were only about 2 minutes slow on almost killing MBL
Very convenient timing as they just halved the effectiveness of obsidian arrows vs stone walls/towers (not castles though I believe). It's still going to melt stuff though, but just a bit slower.
You might think it's OP but it's just good strategy. Norway had green focus on eco, and blue focus on military. That way, there's less macro to worry about and it evens out.
Ridiculous game indeed!! and now I think I'm gonna play mayans and destroy with arbs. Problem is I forget how talented team Norway are. Thanks for entertaining t90!!
Every year, you should have the AOE2 Winter Olympics (only maps with ice) and AOE2 Summer Olympics (a collection of maps with no ice). The more that you can work closely with Microsoft, the better for AOE in general.
I feel like obsidian arrows on its own needs to be nerfed. Every time I’ve ever seen it used in a pro game, it’s absolutely broken and unstoppable no matter who’s playing.
@@Sam-bn5bb The problem in Obsidian arrows nowadays is that it's impossible to have time when it's done. It's not like Goths flood that you can try wall and go Champions. It's just, after that, the game is gg. You can't adapt.
okay so at a low level yes. At a high level you have to have a really good balance and in order to have the same amount of military you cant afford the tech. Otherwise you get cleared out in battle. HOWEVER after you have already won a decisive battle and have the advantage its great to try to all in with it and snowball a victory. Its nowhere near op at high levels though. You havent paid attention to Mayans win rate in tournaments have you? Its not high and theres only like 1 or 2 matches where obsidian arrows was used and it was never decisive.
Obsidian Arrows ignores masonry/architecture. Same as Manipur Cavalry, Saracen bonus, Indian bonus etc... Only bonus which is blocked by masonry is tarkans, elephants and rams/onagers
i hope 20 units dont get clump together on age of empires 4 So unfair the cav guy got pretty nice engagements but archer stacking on top of each other reducing the number of cav who could stike was to OP
![Ultra Forest Nothing Chopping! [256x Mod Feat TaToH]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/5H4QrPZF7pU/mqdefault.jpg)
Thoughts on this strategy? “Completely broken” comes to mind when archers destroy buildings faster than siege. More World Cup 2v2 action coming to UA-cam soon!
Wouldnt it be viable to counter this with berbers? Horse skirms (forgot the name) and camel archers
I mean, it only works if there's a skill disparity between the players, right?
It's broken in the sense that it shouldn't be possible to achieve unless there's assisting factors.
I feel both impressed and disgusted at the same time.
@@flygonbreloom Don't bring logic into this sir. *Viper destroys me w Spanish archers* T90: OMG THIS IS bRoKeN!
Wouldnt onagers be a viable counter?
True fact: Saladin tried to ally with the Mayans at the battle of Jaffa but Richard the Lionhearted banned that civ pick which is why he lost.
Also, Motamid was in exile.
he didn't lose that battle tho. your fact is more like false
@@MickeyasGilliady Are you saying Saladin won the Battle of Jaffa in 1192? Cuz he certainly didn't...
@@colbunkmust I only said he didn’t lose
@@MickeyasGilliady Saladin did lose, his army was forced to retreat after failing to push the English army out of Jaffa, and lost hundreds of men before his army routed from the field. The English and Italian contingent only reported a few soldiers lost. In the words of Baha' al-Din a Muslim historian present at the battle “I have been assured … that on that day the king of England, lance in hand, rode along the whole length of our army from right to left, and not one of our soldiers left the ranks to attack him. The Sultan was wroth thereat and left the battlefield in anger…” Sounds like gg to me.
MbL's largest military: 1
11
and he didn't even have to produce it xD
@@ADCFproductions he actually did, 11 he made A ram 🤣
@@thomatrix3d524 argh i thought it was the scout!! XD 48
The scout died before the ram was created.
Doesn't need more to defeat his opponents
"Will the castle go up before it's completed?"
-T90 2020
Knew I wouldn’t be the only 1 to catch that literary gem!
@@cliff9136 Literary? 11
@@JamesJackel yes
I am convinced this one game is single-handedly responsible for the removal of the Obsidian Arrow upgrade
True dat. Viper be breaking strats like you never know before
yeah, devs overreacted, skill gap was huge and made strategy look more op that it actually was.
@@ahcw2I think it was more due to the fact that a handful or crossbowmen (not even arbalest) could level walls and castles.
"Most ridiculous thing I've ever seen: Mbl building houses."
13:48
Arbalest melting a castle faster than siege : now I’ve seen everything
How the f* that was possible?
@@koltdourden1 saracens teambonus + maya castle tech ^^
I think my favorite memory of Team Norway using this strat was back in a different WC when, midway through the game, roughly this exchange happened:
MBL: "Viper? Do we have...is there...like..."
Viper: "Yes MBL?"
MBL: "Backup plan?"
Viper: "Oh, ok, sure. What is it?"
MBL: (laughs) "I'm asking."
Viper: "Oh. (laughs) No. We don't need backup plan, this will work."
Hhhhnb BB h
Obsidian arrows + saracen teammate = Tsar bomb
It's like mini trebuchet
Tsaracens
Reminds me of the Gastraphetes unit in Age of Mythology. So fun to destroy buildings with those guys
LMAO
@@dogg-paws yooo i loved those bad boys, the sound of all the arrows hitting the building at the same time lol
"Viper has more archery ranges than I have friends".
So relatable!
Yup
The game that caused Obsidian Arrows to be removed from the Mayans Tech Tree.
RIP Siege arbalest. We'll always remember you.
It's no longer a thing
@@plz7210 learn to comprehend what you read
Me: flaming arrows cannot melt steel beams.
Norway A: hold my beer
Norway A: maybe not, but it can melt stone
"vipey vipey, im dying"
lmao now im dying too
At 13:31 we discover Mbl has finally found a solution to getting housed
As someone from Czech republic, this makes me happy, even though czech team lost. If they played against anyone else, than Viper and MBL, they would have most likely won.
I wasn't expecting them playing on such high level! Very interesting game! O:)
Man I was cheering them on the entire time. They played their hearts out.
@@Dunewarrior00 this is what is great about aoe2 competitive. People cheering on good gameplay. Such a difference from many other esports.
@@Doubleranged1 which esport dont have fans that cheer for good players? have u ever seen dota 2 tournaments such as manila major 2016,ti3 grand final, ti5 grand final? its hype af.
ua-cam.com/video/2zKbZ-Tm_Ys/v-deo.html&ab_channel=PutTankInAMall
ua-cam.com/video/8AT-OEqDpJ0/v-deo.html&ab_channel=hOlyhexOr
ua-cam.com/video/3ElXGllTpp0/v-deo.html&ab_channel=NoobFromUA
ua-cam.com/video/bZQx3Op4_oY/v-deo.html&ab_channel=NoobFromUA
ua-cam.com/video/zm81T2lsYmE/v-deo.html&ab_channel=NAVIDota2
just watch these and tell me its not hype. t90 is good caster but he lacks hype compared to top tier dota 2 casters.
Was T90 making a joke saying he wishes he was as good as his brother, or does he have another brother that’s actually real good at AOE2? I know he has one brother who’s not very good at all.
Now I definitely know I'm a Low elo legend. I main Mayans and I researched obsidian arrows for my plumes plenty times, thanks for the techtip T90.
And boys and girls that's how we lost Obsidian arrows.
Rip. Never forget
@@JanusForssling Obsidian arrow 2.0 is okay too
@@yoyodude-aoe2726 - Yeah I feel like the skirmisher upgrade is just as good. Skirmishers are a common answer to Mayans and now they dominate fights where they match skirm for skirm.
Hi I'm from Korea, and I started playing AOE2 last week! I've been watching your UA-cam videos for like a month, and finally I decided to play this game, not only watch it :D
This game needs several different strategies and good mechanics, so it's very very tough to learn. Watching your videos helped me a lot, I wanna thank you!! I wanna see more videos like this, in which pro players show insane strategies and skills!
If you are learning I highly recommend spirit of the laws videos. He breaks down everything about the game
The good old days, when Bombard Arbalests was still a thing.
Vipey! Vipey! I am dying... :D 15:52
I like how you uploaded this the same day they announced an obsidian arrows nerf. No longer does double damage against the stone armor class.
Tau combat strategy, "That's a pretty army you got there... good luck getting close enough to use it."
The imperium will sacrifice billions to do it if necessary. Even if it not necessary.
11 shots of this army took down the castle...
If my castles died to archers i'd instantly resign!!
becaus its stupid af :D
VIPY, VIPY, IM DYING!
Talking about the Norway troll when someone chose yellow in a game against Viper.
18:32 at this point we say "no do prdele" in Czechia. Very similar to "Oh shit"...
Was amazing to watch Viper melt those walls, but with the november update, obsidian arrows nolonger grants bonus damage towards walls, towers and gates.
When you were saying “looking at vipers eco” I was like t90, we are looking at blue we can’t look at vipers eco. Little did I pay attention to the fact that viper was not on his yellow!
🤣
im so glad this video was recommended to me I use to watch these all the time then they just went away for me.
This game reminds me of the Gastraphetes unit in Age of Mythology. So fun to destroy buildings with those guys
I love how viper was 2 vs 1 and then he 1 vs 2. Absolute.
23:15 the very thin dark green line... Don't diss the holy ram!
xD
Pros using noob strats with extra steps aaaaa i love it
Hi T90, somehow the full Bo5 is flagged as private and therefore can't be watched. At least not by me.
Arb go brrrr
Broken strat but well played from the chezch brothers.
Spirit of the Law maybe regretting his words about Saracens now!
"I wish I was as good as my brother" I only play with my brothers....
Hm, Yezris might've looked like he had the upper hand at times, when he was sweeping Viper's arbs with his Cav, but the problem was that in terms of army cost, Viper was losing way cheaper units that he could easily afford to replace by stealing MBL's hard earned resources, while Yezris had no ally to fall back to and his losses were more expensive than Viper's. Adding siege would've been prohibitively expensive, on top of that.
2v2 Convo with my brother the other day -
Me: I'm going Mayans, bro
Bro: Should i go Celts for fast siege?
Me: I'M GOING MAYANS!
Bro: So pick berries and tower, got it
Folks I suggest you also check out Nili's cast of this game - he roasts DracKeN on another level.. :D
That was really fun, especially murder holes.
i just cant watch his videos, his accent annoys me on an unbelievable level lol
I forgot how much I miss this overlay.
That was an Ass whooping. My key board would be in pieces lol. Viper is the goat
So nice that you think it will go into late game where the opponent can make camel archers xD
Great fucking game, goddamn. I thought Czech might have gotten the comeback there, but MbL slinging really saved the day. GG
In update 44725 for the Definitive Edition, it was replaced by Hul'che Javelineers. (Just found this)
Plumed Archers do not benefit from Obsidian Arrows. When playing in team games and if the Mayan player has a Saracen ally, it also adds the team bonus of +2 attack bonus against buildings for Archers for a total of +8.
Arbalesters take out a castle? I smell OP on that.
Biggest problem generally in AoE2 are how strong arbalest line is. This is just its most sickenign form.
Already having seen the video from Nilis perspective makes T90s cast even better ^^
RIP obsidian arrows
Man I thought it would be time for Genitours! since both players can build them, no sling required.
21:55 Nope, Viper still managed to win in the Arbs v Knights battle in the South
i was here, that was marvelous to watch
They should had mixed in 4-5 Onagers with the cav.
Either that OR
Send 15-20 cav to MBL as you said
("or" because there would be too little cav in main group to do both)
can't believe they didn't take advantage of the elite genitours the berbers have, both civs could have make them! they're very very good against arbs.
@@ADCFproductions Impossible, you just don't have time to adapt that. To make Elite Genitours you have to transition... make archers upgrades, make at least 5 or 6 archery camps, make the upgrade... that would cost at least 5 to 10 minutes. In 5 minutes the game was done.
15:35 Hell is about to break loose and you thought this was winnable for Czech Republic B?! Sry, but you are hilarious xD
AOE logic: glass arrows do extra damage against wood and stone buildings.
obsidian is not glass. obsidian is actually a rock harder than steel
@@artymclabin8584 the logical error is probably more in that obsidian is really hard to shape correctly, I highly doubt you could have made arrow tips better than steel just because you probably couldn't get it as thin and "pointy" without getting brittle
@@artymclabin8584 and a lot more brittle than steel.
if you hit steel with obsedian with enough force, the steel will bend while the obsedian will shatter.
@@artymclabin8584 obsidian is volcanic glass. And it’s very brittle.
@@brohvakiindova4452 if they made obsidian arrows a dark age upgrade that gave huge damage to units with no armor upgrades, but then suffered a big drop-off against buildings and armored units, it would have opened up a whole new bag of opportunities.
20:29 Viper missplay, he left a lot of the arbalest AFK next to the trees. Otherwise he would've probably won that fight
those castles are MELTING to arrows wtf
All that heavy cavalry massacred at 21:34 was painful to watch
23 seconds in and he already climaxed 🤣🤣
Aoe2 devs be like “18:33 WTF is that!!”. Needs nerfing. Hence why Obsidian arrows got nerfed in their latest update.
Next round should add on two under 900 players against MBL and Viper
Shit was ruthless.
T90 we believe in you and Daniel, even if you dont win it will be a good game to watch, good luck and have fun ^^
15:43 Starfox 64 references, AMAZING!
hahahaha imagine in medivial century arbalest shooting down a castle faster then rams :D
always wanted to see saracen and mayan team bonus work in this way
I think they needed to break down the walls of MBL with the knights after the failed tower push and put the first castle onto a TC to make their castle push about 2-3 minutes faster. They were only about 2 minutes slow on almost killing MBL
I'll never understand how a bunch of arbalests can bring down a castle...with bolts. Are those bolts tek arrows from Turok?
Viper with the Bombard Arbalest 11
Very convenient timing as they just halved the effectiveness of obsidian arrows vs stone walls/towers (not castles though I believe). It's still going to melt stuff though, but just a bit slower.
I mean...... if you have 60 arbs with it its only ognna give you liek 2-3 seconds extra. That just helps against the early early push with it.
You might think it's OP but it's just good strategy. Norway had green focus on eco, and blue focus on military. That way, there's less macro to worry about and it evens out.
We need to see a game the viper vs like 7 noobs it would be an awesome watch!
Ridiculous game indeed!! and now I think I'm gonna play mayans and destroy with arbs. Problem is I forget how talented team Norway are. Thanks for entertaining t90!!
And they just patched oby arrows xD
RIP this strategy Obsidian Arrow just got nerfed
holy fuck I've never seen arbs take a castle down in that time!
That's why you put house in this game,
must nerf someone for sure
This is oddly satisfying to watch
This is a classic Viper troll turned up to 11 with MBLs help
Archers like Gun !
50 Arbalests = 1 MILLION
Holly shit that was nuts
The full bo5 is private @t90
Now, this was wild
This was epic. I watched it twice!
Damn Viper and Mbl out here playing with the 9x tech mod lol.
i feel like someone could have just made a shit load of elite skirmishers
they nerfed obsidian arrows after this game.
Every year, you should have the AOE2 Winter Olympics (only maps with ice) and AOE2 Summer Olympics (a collection of maps with no ice). The more that you can work closely with Microsoft, the better for AOE in general.
Viper is MBL's army lol
@t90official come on, put all matches on youtube, we want to follow the tournament too.
this was so fun to watch
Jeez that strat from Norway is stupidly broken and needs to be fixed/nerfed and banned until it is.
I feel like obsidian arrows on its own needs to be nerfed. Every time I’ve ever seen it used in a pro game, it’s absolutely broken and unstoppable no matter who’s playing.
@@Sam-bn5bb The problem in Obsidian arrows nowadays is that it's impossible to have time when it's done. It's not like Goths flood that you can try wall and go Champions. It's just, after that, the game is gg. You can't adapt.
okay so at a low level yes. At a high level you have to have a really good balance and in order to have the same amount of military you cant afford the tech. Otherwise you get cleared out in battle. HOWEVER after you have already won a decisive battle and have the advantage its great to try to all in with it and snowball a victory. Its nowhere near op at high levels though. You havent paid attention to Mayans win rate in tournaments have you? Its not high and theres only like 1 or 2 matches where obsidian arrows was used and it was never decisive.
@@IceWraith101 last video the viper said that obsidian arrows is op in some situations (update video 17/11). Hera said as well.
You have to cast some of the battle Royal modes
The Czechs played a tight game
Post the entire sets please! Twitch is very bad to watch recorded games
Česko do toho! 🥳
Murder hoooles!!!
To be fair, against obs arrows research masonry/arch and it makes it almost useless
Obsidian Arrows ignores masonry/architecture. Same as Manipur Cavalry, Saracen bonus, Indian bonus etc... Only bonus which is blocked by masonry is tarkans, elephants and rams/onagers
i hope 20 units dont get clump together on age of empires 4
So unfair the cav guy got pretty nice engagements but archer stacking on top of each other reducing the number of cav who could stike was to OP