Riot does not understand that lethality aatrox healing for 1500 per fight is the same as bruiser aatrox buying 800 hp and healing for 400 of it, oh wait there is a diffrence that diffrence being DAMAGE the universal metric
It is not the same, the lethality is a repeated value, 800 hp is a static value and 400 is the repeated. So not only you take more damage from % max health, you also recover less. Additionally, ADCs do so much damage that you are better off going way more damage to kill them before they can kill you rather than going bruiser and die at approx the same pace cuz of healing and not kill them
The biggest difference between Aatrox in Seasons 8-12 is that he always had some sort of healing item that worked well with his kit. Prior to mythics he had ravenous hunter + Death's Dance which used to give spell vamp. Then after mythics he had gore or eclipse which both gave healing which, though not a lot in Eclipse's case, helped. Now he has nothing and Sundered Sky is an awful item to play with on Aatrox IMO because the auto attack can be unreliable in team fights and the stats are mediocre. Naayil I think forgot to also mention that another reason Lethality Aatrox became so dominant is that after durability patch and further buffs to his base HP, Aatrox can still comfortably get 2.5K+ HP just by levelling, making Lethality plenty durable with base stats alone, further making bruiser unattractive.
aatrox suffers most from not dealing enough dmg to heal. Black cleaver is unreliable and somewhat trash on aatrox since the armor pen is applied AFTER first Q combo, hence making lethality + grudge more attractive. only time i will ever go bruiser on aatrox is against other bruisers and mages (may vary based on champion), lethality is just better against everything else. (also Hubris is sleeper OP on aatrox. i have reached 900 attack damage at lvl 17 with R!)
@@notfajnyyy nobody said aatrox isn't broken, it's about the champ losing his identity. it has been forced to build lethality on him for a while now and it's still the more viable option... a bruiser should never be forced to play lethality it's just dumb.
I think if Riot wanna fix bruiser's they have to reform the damage system in the game, there is too much dmg and im not only talking about only adc but for tanks and bruiser aswell. But I feel its by design, Riot want the game to be fast and full of actions instead of long drawn out fight
More dopamine spikes= more likely to continue playing, though it shouldn't be like this, this is just too much, ADCs going around harassing everyone in lane and win games because they can't lose lane cause every game ends after laning phase.
i think it's mostly because pro play and regular play are on the same patches instead of two completely different things. if they have boring tank metas or even stuff like the ardent support meta in pro play then people won't watch and then everything starts falling apart. less viewership = less sponsors = less money = less workers = less changes = less players. if riot wanted to change how damage works and slow down games they could do it at any time but they know they shouldn't.
watch season 5 montage vs season 14. outplays were more cool back then too now we just got champs mowing down 1v3 with conqueror triumph dodging no skillshots just brute forcing
The thing is, if you look at Aatrox's patch history on the wiki, you can see where everything went downhill. After he got gutted in the aftermath of the goredrinker meta, he was left weak for the rest of the season, but then Riot buffed his health growth by a woping 10 per level on patch 12.14 . This singular change that was given to both him and Rhaast at that time is what allowed them to start building lethality without being oneshot. Instead of reverting the health changes, they altered the passive and W damage type to magic as an attempt at reducing the lethality effectiveness in his kit. BUT, this meant he could not rely on Cleaver anymore, AND then they decided to reduce his Qs base damage and increase his AD ratios. Guess which type of build heavely benefits from AD ratios and which one from base damage? EXATCLY, they are doing everything, but the most obvious solution, which is to revert all the changes he got during season 11-14 because thats when he was mostly balanced right before the mythic items. But nope, instead, we're still stuck in this limbo because they dont want to nerf his AD ratios on Q, buff its base damage, reduce his health growth, and revert the damage type of his passive and W to physical. Lethality Aatrox should be an offmeta for fun build or a niche super skill expressive build, not the norm/meta. If only they'd do the simplest and most obvious solution.
Nah, the only thing Aatrox needs is the same passive penetration/true damage/reliable %health damage on his Q and nerfs to his base defensive stats, bruiser acquired. All other bruisers have their own reliable way to deal decent damage while building beefy, and only Aatrox is a guy with flat numbers except for one auto in a very long combo. Not having this makes bruiser Aatrox shit against tanks, against other bruisers, against Zhonya's mages with 4k hp, and also nerfs his healing quite a bit due to lack of damage. He doesn't even have conquerer's true damage. And even though his ad and scalings are very good, long ass animations make his overall dps very shitty. Of course it is better to stack lethality and armor pen to even make some use of ad steroid and scalings, staying relatively tanky by base defensive stats
Naayil, Eclipse + Rav hydra + absorb life has been doing wonders for me. The rest of my build is usually clever, death dance (if ad heavy) , sundered sky (sometimes) and spirit visage. If the game goes on for an extended time I make sure to have streaks and sundered sky since they're both very good at prolonging a fight and as well as scale nicely with base ad.
Aatrox just does not stack black cleaver well enough to justify buying it on him and with durability update, you NEED a % pen item somewhere in your full build, meaning that you have to go for flat pen build aatrox as the rest grant crit
Overall all the Brusier items are poorly designed. Just look at all the defensive and sustain items. Its all anti-burst and burst-healing. No passive healing, no sustain healing (the removal of omnivamp). There are no Bruiser items that would boost your resistances or give some damage reduction while in combat. Nothing that could actually support extended fights were you kite in and out. Not to mention that Bruisers have less items than ADCs and 3 of those items are dead (Hullbreaker, Hexplate, Chainsword) while being the most diverse champion class in the game - meaning Bruisers dont have enough items. You either play to oneshot and survive oneshots or you play "drain tank" and grief your games (ok sometimes drain tank is actually good if the enemy has like 2-3 really tanky champs, but that rarely happens).
chainsword needs some buffs, the item could be very great however the stat and passive wont make it a worthy item to build for brusier even if you need antiheal. There are more important items bruisers need to build to be viable. For example a passive that makes antihealing effects on you 50% less effective. Because all it takes to shut down champions like aatrox, fiora, olaf is one antiheal item or ignite.
@@prod.eiskvlt "however the stat and passive wont make it a worthy item to build for brusier even if you need antiheal" - I've been saying this (spamming Phreaks videos) ever since they released the item. That item has to be either absurdly gold efficient (with stats on the higher end rather than the item being low cost) or it needs another quality added to it like Mortal Reminder has with its armour pen. A cool idea (all tho not sure how healthy it would be for the game) that I've seen years ago was an item (in this case it would be an additional passive on Chainsword) that could convert a % of the enemies blocked healing into your own overtime healing - sort of like DD passive functions - so there is no obnoxious burst healing and therefore neither Assassins or Marksmen could abuse it, because they are to squishy to benefit from it, but Bruisers due to them being naturally tankier would be the only viable users.
@@Geheimnis-c2e its only a ranged meta, because Bruisers dont have the tools to drain tank. Ok maybe not only - another reason is that Marksmen are just to OP.
@@bohomazdesign725 the item would be fine if it gave like 500hp and 60ad. But rn the only option is buying executioners call and keeping it until almost full build than selling it, because the antiheal items suck so much for bruisers, you cant build thornmail or mortal reminded on most bruiser. Them chemsword will fuck up your entire build path and literally make you weaker
I mean so long as all of his healing is based on damage dealt, the meta Aatrox builds will be how he can get the most damage out over a long period of time. If they wanted to shift him to bruiser more then just shift his healing away from being purely based on damage dealt. But honestly I think they should just embrace lethality Aatrox, stop trying to hamstring him and just accept it's a reality.
Make Aatrox heal with pre-mitigation damage, or make him have %hp healing, any other bruiser that DOES build bruiser items have %hp, flat healing or pre-mitigation, Fiora has flat healing and not post-mitigation, so she gains more value by building bruiser, same aswell with Renekton which has flat healing, Illaoi, Darius and Volibear have missing %hp healing, Briar has flat healing, %hp healing and post-mitigation healing, and i can go on and on. The real problem of Aatrox healing is that he heals with post-mitigation healing, so he can't really heal without dealing damage, and surprise surprise, Assasin items are exactly what Aatrox wants and needs, post-mitigation alone just doesn't cut it out if you want a champ to build bruiser items.
Aatrox's whole identify crisis reminds me of whatever the hell happened for a few months following briar's release. On paper you're a bruiser, but you go lethality and suddenly you one shot your target, heal just as much and scale way better in the late game. Took them like 6 patches and adding really good bruiser items to figure something out. And in the process they really changed her scalings soon They're probably gonna do something similar to Aatrox unfortunately
riot has hurt lots of mechanics in the game because of how the balanced the game. Atroxx which is a drain tank has to do damage instead of drain because you one shot or get one shot too much of the time. you also have the same issue with tanks. tanks are tanky as hell but for them to be a threat, they have to still be able to do damage despite their role is to tank. Like there is a truth. Bruisers and Tanks are LOADED with stats. the problems is most of the meta, you one shot or get one shot and as a bruiser; if someone is not dead from your combo, you die.
I loved Aatrox with sundered sky first item. Didn’t really play enough (or ranked for that matter) in that window to see the other side of it but I thoroughly enjoyed it.
I think hashinshin talked about it a lot. He said that pre durablity update, aatrox ablilities were had to long casst times for him to go lethality and not isnatly die. But post durabilit y pdate, he had just enough more health to justify it.
If you remember Grasp + Divine Sunderer Camille, yes, Lethality Aatrox feels just as shit right now with how people stop interacting with you altogether since you can go full damage but other champions still don't have the damage to finish you off anymore so it’s not worth the risk. It's like playing fighting game in easy mode, or if you play tekken7 or 8 then you know the King guy, his combo is not easy to learn but once you have the hang of it then everyone is fucced since it's a stun lock combo and you will be bored of it very soon with how people just forfeit the moment they see your face in their game, just sucks all the fun out of it.
I've been cooking with building Black Cleaver to Sundered Sky then Ravenous Hydra, and i've had some decent success in Gold tier (though the people in gold and plat don't always build anti-heal so it may not be a good measure of effectiveness). That build path lets me feel like a drain-tank when going against a 2v1 or 3v1 situation
no way this was the best sponsor ad I've seen by naayil! He totally convinced me If i were spending money in the game I'd definitely listen to him and click on the link 😂
Unironically one of the best sponsored segments I saw , I know its cringe to talk about something like this , but he did the sponsor justice , did the viewer justice by keeping it short , compact and straightforward.
bet all they need to do to make aatrox a bruiser is add hp based scaling to either the additional slow % on W, or damage on Q. it can be explained that he uses his weight to perform a gravity pull on the target, and the chunkier he is, the harder his Q hits
Agreed, I didnt even had to knowledge it from enthernet and I noticed that aatrox with sunder sky or cleaver is waaay weaker than hydra or eclipse, you can feel it on your own.
Hey Naayil, im a long time fan. Aatrox in season 14 feels really bad, but I think I found a build which feel decent. I was hoping you could try it and let me know what you think. This build goes back to an old Aatrox build a couple years ago which is Sterak's into Serylda's. Compared to full lethality this makes me feel a lot more tanky but still able to deal a good amount of damage. Please let me know what you think. Thanks Naayil
When Riot replied to those guys that tried to blackmail them by saying they have no idea how the game's code works, our immediate thoughts should of been "Oh... oh no". They are workers at the power plant that have no idea what the buttons do but they are going to keep pressing them anyway
With how much damage is in the game the more tanks you have the higher chance of a loss. HP doesn't make you tanky right now. 5k health will get deleted by the 2-4 adcs on each team. This then makes "bruisers" build all damage to combat this. Because of you don't 1 shot the enemy, you will just get 1 shot. The "durability patch" was so successful, but they just had to bring in more damage for phreak's adc ark.
i think at this rate they should just gut the E healing but buff the bonus health ratio a bunch while changing Q ad ratio from total to bonus so that full hp tank aatrox doesnt pop up. IF they really want to make bruiser a thing again. or just like, give us proper bruiser items without nerfing them after one or two patches of being strong.
It not only the fact the he got a sponsor, the fact is that he say that if he recommends something is because he will use it, not because the sponsor say it's good
riot's issue with balancing bruiser's and their items is that there is barely any HP scaling on bruisers, most of the time the only reason they'd build HP is to survive long enough to use another rotation, not because any abilities scale off HP. this is also the problem with bruiser items and why they've historically been a mess, when bruiser items are OP it's assassins and divers that profit, because bruiser item damage also scales off of damage stats, not HP. Death's Dance scales off of AD both with the passive and the incentive to deal massive damage to get the reset. Cleaver scales off attack speed and ability haste, Hydra scales off AD, Shojin scales off AD, Bork scales off attack speed, Eclipse scales off AD, Triforce scales off base AD, Stridebreaker scales off AD. Sundered sky and steraks only scale off of HP in the sense that it slightly improves the survivability the item gives (slightly). Hullbreaker is just not a common bruiser item at all and neither is titanic, same as bloodmail, they're just tank items with AD slapped on for Sion.
u may build leyhality, but that doesn't change the fakt , that u have 4k hp and infinete healing. U simplie unkilable demon king and all that u have is more like bruiser thing then assasin, so building full damage items is not something bad, cuz u basicly playing the same aatrox
making aatrox's E scale with health was actually a change in the right direction, but there are probably more things that can be done to aatrox specifically, not involving the itemization. I'm sick of aatrox getting all the lethality items nerfed for other champions that aren't as good.
Want to read a more funny one? is that even assasins can't deal their desire amount of dmg without going eclipse + Profane hydra, like eclipse + profane hydra is the best route that bruisers AND assasins can go to deal damage and snowball from early game (example Kha'zix in high elo Building eclipse, profane, bc)
If riot wants him bruiser why they dont make him profit from hp or resistances and reduce his dmg, cleaver would make sence and thats what he is supposed to have in stats, it says in colection of champs, aatrox- resistance and dmg.
i thought of something, revert the E "ajustement" (nerf), nerf the W slow, give it a fair HP scaling (more HP = more slow) so u either can go lethality with no W pulls (which to be fair u won't need since u one shot with 2 Qs late game) or you go bruiser and ur W consistently pulls, idk what yall think of that but to me its a healthy way to give bruiser playstyle advantage over lethality
I dont think a slow is gonna make w pull for most champs still unless it also grounds you, too many champs have a dash to just get out of it whenever theres a slow or not
@@parryblockdodge those aren't the issue i'm talking about they naturally counter W, i'm talking about those who just walk the whole way out and even take the pull damage without getting pulled back
let's not forget that they literally murdered pre-rework Aatrox by overhauling his whole kit, except revive ability, but then removed it as well because he was too overpowered even after multiple nerf patches. Riot got no idea what to do with this champ🤦
in my recent ranked game i got hit with 1 aatrox Q and he deleted 1.4k health from me. To be fair my darius died level 1 and perma ran it down so yeah aatrox came out of top as a god
You just can't survive long enough in this meta to justify bruiser so it's literally useless to try to make him go bruiser when it fundamentally doesn't work. Not to mention the W barely pulls and with bruiser you NEED sweetspots or you don't deal damage whereas with lethality you can legit just auto them to death with profane since you have 600+Ad with 30% + 70 lethality
if i were riot i would make aatrox heal from minions and have he's healing scale with ad and hp so he don't build tank like vladimir so even if he doesn't do damage he will still heal or else i give him pen on he's E like darius and morde, think about it if they remove darius pen from he's E he will go lethality thats what keeping him as a briuser
IMO even with passive and W dealing physical damage this Cleaver buff isn't changing much. Aatroz never has such small gaps between his damage instances. Like, cmon, when? Q into W pull? 1 in 100 cases it's 0.01 second difference
6:10 that guy in the chat ”which bruiser other than kled a’d aatrox go lethality ?” Well the others are just not picked anymore, adc took their place 😂
They canta turn Aatrox into a Bruiser because he doesn't benefit nearly as much from CDR as other bruisers do. The 3Q combo only goes on CD at the end, and it is not something aatrox can spam because positioning is needed. Considering aatrox's main damage source is not nearly as spammable as a Renekton Q, going lethality is the best way to ensure Aatrox will do the most amount of damage in a resonable timeflame to kill someone.
This is literally wrong. He literally was a bruiser all the time after his rework prior to past 2 seasons. Every bruiser is designed to kill with multiple rotations of abilities which is why they love CDR but when you can't survive long enough to get multiple rotations off is when bruisers go full damage
@@gorgistanojevik3196except after a certain point, aatrox qs just don’t benefit from cdr because unlike other main damage like renek or riven q, aatrox resets every single time he uses q.
@@zeragrogen5129 You would need nearly 100 haste for it to become overkill. Also, remember that Q isn't only the only important ability in his kit. R is also a crucial ability, so being able to lower that CD is pretty good. Lowered E CD is good as well.
i want riot to deal with other roles like how they deal with bruisers. they are fine leaving broken items for mages/adcs but god forbid bruisers get broken items. most they last is 2 patches then they are nerfed
Riot should stop caring and just balance stuff whit a roulette kind of thing and make it 100℅ unpredictable random and trashy Spin roulette* (Nerf) ok what we nerf Spin roulette* (Tanks) ok tanks how? Spin roulette* (Items cost more) right.
It's kinda hilarious how one person can say a fact about a *top laner* champion, while ADCs are mostly untouched by Rito games. Not meaning to disrespect Naayil, he did good job at explaining what kind of spaghetti is happening with Aatrox in the game. But isn't it at least a little funny? How there's almost nothing to talk about the ADCs? Because there's a big number of champions in there, who simply bust "out of the box". Kai'sa, Smolder, and the likes. It gives me an impression that Riot only cares about the botlane (i wonder why) and just spews out few small patches for other lanes, just so they don't get stoned by the mob.
@@socomical607 sorry, I haven't been keeping in touch with the adc nerfs, so i spoke from my experience and the impression that the game was giving me at this moment.
I would be lying if I said that he is weak now. He isn't but what I wanted to mean is: Riot clearly doesn't want Aatrox to dominate the top meta once again. That's what I see.
Aatrox was prominent in 2 worlds in a row if I'm not mistaken (seasons 12 and 13). He's also been the top pick in top lane the past 2 seasons as well. Early-half of season 13 was his worst, but currently, he's pretty good, especially if played well.
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"Nayil" N.A.Y.I.L. The code should have an A and then another A
There was a memo Naayil, there was a memo
Imagine having 3rd party app just to make the game fun but even then its still not 😭
Naayil, you're shit talking rito as if you knew how to make aatrox build bruiser, tell us what you know that rito doesen't. (no negativity)
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wtf tahm kench?????
Riot does not understand that lethality aatrox healing for 1500 per fight is the same as bruiser aatrox buying 800 hp and healing for 400 of it, oh wait there is a diffrence that diffrence being DAMAGE the universal metric
Isn't 800+400=1200 tho ?
It is not the same, the lethality is a repeated value, 800 hp is a static value and 400 is the repeated. So not only you take more damage from % max health, you also recover less.
Additionally, ADCs do so much damage that you are better off going way more damage to kill them before they can kill you rather than going bruiser and die at approx the same pace cuz of healing and not kill them
yeah more aatrox healing 30k per auto
guys just go eclipse into sundered its basically bruiser build and you heal tons from it. stop crying and let me play my lethality aatrox
The biggest difference between Aatrox in Seasons 8-12 is that he always had some sort of healing item that worked well with his kit. Prior to mythics he had ravenous hunter + Death's Dance which used to give spell vamp. Then after mythics he had gore or eclipse which both gave healing which, though not a lot in Eclipse's case, helped.
Now he has nothing and Sundered Sky is an awful item to play with on Aatrox IMO because the auto attack can be unreliable in team fights and the stats are mediocre.
Naayil I think forgot to also mention that another reason Lethality Aatrox became so dominant is that after durability patch and further buffs to his base HP, Aatrox can still comfortably get 2.5K+ HP just by levelling, making Lethality plenty durable with base stats alone, further making bruiser unattractive.
No fucking way I will read this
@@ostryy0560 k
aatrox suffers most from not dealing enough dmg to heal. Black cleaver is unreliable and somewhat trash on aatrox since the armor pen is applied AFTER first Q combo, hence making lethality + grudge more attractive. only time i will ever go bruiser on aatrox is against other bruisers and mages (may vary based on champion), lethality is just better against everything else. (also Hubris is sleeper OP on aatrox. i have reached 900 attack damage at lvl 17 with R!)
Nah it’s just people haven’t discover lethality aatrox back then.
@@ostryy0560you don't have to flex your lack of reading skills.
Riot are king of : "things work, nobody ask it to change it, lets change it !"
Riot Balancing team is the people who don't play the game but they act like they know how each champion work
"Nobody ask it to change it"
Aatrox being litteraly the most broken toplaner in the game
@@notfajnyyy nobody said aatrox isn't broken, it's about the champ losing his identity. it has been forced to build lethality on him for a while now and it's still the more viable option...
a bruiser should never be forced to play lethality it's just dumb.
@@notfajnyyy i was talking about black cleaver and items.
Ubisoft with Rainbow Six Siege. They legit had a war with their players.
I think if Riot wanna fix bruiser's they have to reform the damage system in the game, there is too much dmg and im not only talking about only adc but for tanks and bruiser aswell. But I feel its by design, Riot want the game to be fast and full of actions instead of long drawn out fight
More dopamine spikes= more likely to continue playing, though it shouldn't be like this, this is just too much, ADCs going around harassing everyone in lane and win games because they can't lose lane cause every game ends after laning phase.
i think it's mostly because pro play and regular play are on the same patches instead of two completely different things. if they have boring tank metas or even stuff like the ardent support meta in pro play then people won't watch and then everything starts falling apart. less viewership = less sponsors = less money = less workers = less changes = less players. if riot wanted to change how damage works and slow down games they could do it at any time but they know they shouldn't.
watch season 5 montage vs season 14. outplays were more cool back then too now we just got champs mowing down 1v3 with conqueror triumph dodging no skillshots just brute forcing
The thing is, if you look at Aatrox's patch history on the wiki, you can see where everything went downhill. After he got gutted in the aftermath of the goredrinker meta, he was left weak for the rest of the season, but then Riot buffed his health growth by a woping 10 per level on patch 12.14 . This singular change that was given to both him and Rhaast at that time is what allowed them to start building lethality without being oneshot.
Instead of reverting the health changes, they altered the passive and W damage type to magic as an attempt at reducing the lethality effectiveness in his kit. BUT, this meant he could not rely on Cleaver anymore, AND then they decided to reduce his Qs base damage and increase his AD ratios. Guess which type of build heavely benefits from AD ratios and which one from base damage? EXATCLY, they are doing everything, but the most obvious solution, which is to revert all the changes he got during season 11-14 because thats when he was mostly balanced right before the mythic items. But nope, instead, we're still stuck in this limbo because they dont want to nerf his AD ratios on Q, buff its base damage, reduce his health growth, and revert the damage type of his passive and W to physical. Lethality Aatrox should be an offmeta for fun build or a niche super skill expressive build, not the norm/meta. If only they'd do the simplest and most obvious solution.
Nah, the only thing Aatrox needs is the same passive penetration/true damage/reliable %health damage on his Q and nerfs to his base defensive stats, bruiser acquired. All other bruisers have their own reliable way to deal decent damage while building beefy, and only Aatrox is a guy with flat numbers except for one auto in a very long combo. Not having this makes bruiser Aatrox shit against tanks, against other bruisers, against Zhonya's mages with 4k hp, and also nerfs his healing quite a bit due to lack of damage. He doesn't even have conquerer's true damage. And even though his ad and scalings are very good, long ass animations make his overall dps very shitty. Of course it is better to stack lethality and armor pen to even make some use of ad steroid and scalings, staying relatively tanky by base defensive stats
Naayil, Eclipse + Rav hydra + absorb life has been doing wonders for me. The rest of my build is usually clever, death dance (if ad heavy) , sundered sky (sometimes) and spirit visage. If the game goes on for an extended time I make sure to have streaks and sundered sky since they're both very good at prolonging a fight and as well as scale nicely with base ad.
NAAYIL WITH A SPONSOR BEFORE GTA 6 🗣🔥
the game starts 11:24
The promo was edging me so hard for my Naayil aatrox slop
Aatrox just does not stack black cleaver well enough to justify buying it on him and with durability update, you NEED a % pen item somewhere in your full build, meaning that you have to go for flat pen build aatrox as the rest grant crit
Overall all the Brusier items are poorly designed. Just look at all the defensive and sustain items. Its all anti-burst and burst-healing. No passive healing, no sustain healing (the removal of omnivamp). There are no Bruiser items that would boost your resistances or give some damage reduction while in combat. Nothing that could actually support extended fights were you kite in and out.
Not to mention that Bruisers have less items than ADCs and 3 of those items are dead (Hullbreaker, Hexplate, Chainsword) while being the most diverse champion class in the game - meaning Bruisers dont have enough items.
You either play to oneshot and survive oneshots or you play "drain tank" and grief your games (ok sometimes drain tank is actually good if the enemy has like 2-3 really tanky champs, but that rarely happens).
playing draintank in a ranged champ meta is like using a horse in a NASCAR race
chainsword needs some buffs, the item could be very great however the stat and passive wont make it a worthy item to build for brusier even if you need antiheal. There are more important items bruisers need to build to be viable. For example a passive that makes antihealing effects on you 50% less effective. Because all it takes to shut down champions like aatrox, fiora, olaf is one antiheal item or ignite.
@@prod.eiskvlt "however the stat and passive wont make it a worthy item to build for brusier even if you need antiheal" - I've been saying this (spamming Phreaks videos) ever since they released the item.
That item has to be either absurdly gold efficient (with stats on the higher end rather than the item being low cost) or it needs another quality added to it like Mortal Reminder has with its armour pen. A cool idea (all tho not sure how healthy it would be for the game) that I've seen years ago was an item (in this case it would be an additional passive on Chainsword) that could convert a % of the enemies blocked healing into your own overtime healing - sort of like DD passive functions - so there is no obnoxious burst healing and therefore neither Assassins or Marksmen could abuse it, because they are to squishy to benefit from it, but Bruisers due to them being naturally tankier would be the only viable users.
@@Geheimnis-c2e its only a ranged meta, because Bruisers dont have the tools to drain tank. Ok maybe not only - another reason is that Marksmen are just to OP.
@@bohomazdesign725 the item would be fine if it gave like 500hp and 60ad. But rn the only option is buying executioners call and keeping it until almost full build than selling it, because the antiheal items suck so much for bruisers, you cant build thornmail or mortal reminded on most bruiser. Them chemsword will fuck up your entire build path and literally make you weaker
I mean so long as all of his healing is based on damage dealt, the meta Aatrox builds will be how he can get the most damage out over a long period of time. If they wanted to shift him to bruiser more then just shift his healing away from being purely based on damage dealt. But honestly I think they should just embrace lethality Aatrox, stop trying to hamstring him and just accept it's a reality.
Make Aatrox heal with pre-mitigation damage, or make him have %hp healing, any other bruiser that DOES build bruiser items have %hp, flat healing or pre-mitigation, Fiora has flat healing and not post-mitigation, so she gains more value by building bruiser, same aswell with Renekton which has flat healing, Illaoi, Darius and Volibear have missing %hp healing, Briar has flat healing, %hp healing and post-mitigation healing, and i can go on and on.
The real problem of Aatrox healing is that he heals with post-mitigation healing, so he can't really heal without dealing damage, and surprise surprise, Assasin items are exactly what Aatrox wants and needs, post-mitigation alone just doesn't cut it out if you want a champ to build bruiser items.
been saying this for years bruh, over 2 years of lethality XDDD
Aatrox's whole identify crisis reminds me of whatever the hell happened for a few months following briar's release.
On paper you're a bruiser, but you go lethality and suddenly you one shot your target, heal just as much and scale way better in the late game.
Took them like 6 patches and adding really good bruiser items to figure something out.
And in the process they really changed her scalings soon
They're probably gonna do something similar to Aatrox unfortunately
BEST STREAMER I LOVE AFTER DANTES MUCH LOVE FOR YOU BRO
riot has hurt lots of mechanics in the game because of how the balanced the game. Atroxx which is a drain tank has to do damage instead of drain because you one shot or get one shot too much of the time. you also have the same issue with tanks. tanks are tanky as hell but for them to be a threat, they have to still be able to do damage despite their role is to tank.
Like there is a truth. Bruisers and Tanks are LOADED with stats. the problems is most of the meta, you one shot or get one shot and as a bruiser; if someone is not dead from your combo, you die.
I loved Aatrox with sundered sky first item. Didn’t really play enough (or ranked for that matter) in that window to see the other side of it but I thoroughly enjoyed it.
I think hashinshin talked about it a lot. He said that pre durablity update, aatrox ablilities were had to long casst times for him to go lethality and not isnatly die. But post durabilit y pdate, he had just enough more health to justify it.
If you remember Grasp + Divine Sunderer Camille, yes, Lethality Aatrox feels just as shit right now with how people stop interacting with you altogether since you can go full damage but other champions still don't have the damage to finish you off anymore so it’s not worth the risk. It's like playing fighting game in easy mode, or if you play tekken7 or 8 then you know the King guy, his combo is not easy to learn but once you have the hang of it then everyone is fucced since it's a stun lock combo and you will be bored of it very soon with how people just forfeit the moment they see your face in their game, just sucks all the fun out of it.
bro as red kay / Rhaast palyer i have to say bruiser with lethality is busted but the old days of bruiser kayn were much better
He is his own person, named Rhaast, thank you very much
Its Rhaast invalid Kayn/Rhaast Player 😂
Bro just had to be Rhaastist like that
@@geoDB. haha xD
@@geoDB. bro y u do this dont judge me
I've been cooking with building Black Cleaver to Sundered Sky then Ravenous Hydra, and i've had some decent success in Gold tier (though the people in gold and plat don't always build anti-heal so it may not be a good measure of effectiveness). That build path lets me feel like a drain-tank when going against a 2v1 or 3v1 situation
no way this was the best sponsor ad I've seen by naayil! He totally convinced me If i were spending money in the game I'd definitely listen to him and click on the link 😂
I wish riot actually listened to genuine OTPs of certain champs and how to make them better
Unironically one of the best sponsored segments I saw , I know its cringe to talk about something like this , but he did the sponsor justice , did the viewer justice by keeping it short , compact and straightforward.
AYO THE Whole video was worth that clip jesus christ!
bet all they need to do to make aatrox a bruiser is add hp based scaling to either the additional slow % on W, or damage on Q.
it can be explained that he uses his weight to perform a gravity pull on the target, and the chunkier he is, the harder his Q hits
Agreed, I didnt even had to knowledge it from enthernet and I noticed that aatrox with sunder sky or cleaver is waaay weaker than hydra or eclipse, you can feel it on your own.
Sponsor before a naayil video? U know what I won't even skip it brother deserves this. Good shit 👏
Hey Naayil, im a long time fan. Aatrox in season 14 feels really bad, but I think I found a build which feel decent. I was hoping you could try it and let me know what you think. This build goes back to an old Aatrox build a couple years ago which is Sterak's into Serylda's. Compared to full lethality this makes me feel a lot more tanky but still able to deal a good amount of damage. Please let me know what you think. Thanks Naayil
When Riot replied to those guys that tried to blackmail them by saying they have no idea how the game's code works, our immediate thoughts should of been "Oh... oh no".
They are workers at the power plant that have no idea what the buttons do but they are going to keep pressing them anyway
With how much damage is in the game the more tanks you have the higher chance of a loss. HP doesn't make you tanky right now. 5k health will get deleted by the 2-4 adcs on each team.
This then makes "bruisers" build all damage to combat this. Because of you don't 1 shot the enemy, you will just get 1 shot.
The "durability patch" was so successful, but they just had to bring in more damage for phreak's adc ark.
bro this taping stuff is wild, i expected the service to be free but NO; LEAGUE PLAYERS PAY CASH TO SOCIALIZE.
Heya, fairly new to channel.
I keep wondering - why do you build BlackCleaver 99% as 1st item? Not Eclipse or SunderedSky ? For the move speed on hit?
i think at this rate they should just gut the E healing but buff the bonus health ratio a bunch while changing Q ad ratio from total to bonus so that full hp tank aatrox doesnt pop up. IF they really want to make bruiser a thing again. or just like, give us proper bruiser items without nerfing them after one or two patches of being strong.
It not only the fact the he got a sponsor, the fact is that he say that if he recommends something is because he will use it, not because the sponsor say it's good
riot's issue with balancing bruiser's and their items is that there is barely any HP scaling on bruisers, most of the time the only reason they'd build HP is to survive long enough to use another rotation, not because any abilities scale off HP. this is also the problem with bruiser items and why they've historically been a mess, when bruiser items are OP it's assassins and divers that profit, because bruiser item damage also scales off of damage stats, not HP. Death's Dance scales off of AD both with the passive and the incentive to deal massive damage to get the reset. Cleaver scales off attack speed and ability haste, Hydra scales off AD, Shojin scales off AD, Bork scales off attack speed, Eclipse scales off AD, Triforce scales off base AD, Stridebreaker scales off AD. Sundered sky and steraks only scale off of HP in the sense that it slightly improves the survivability the item gives (slightly). Hullbreaker is just not a common bruiser item at all and neither is titanic, same as bloodmail, they're just tank items with AD slapped on for Sion.
When would you know when it's best for a mid or top laner to be the one to be split pushing besides having one be feed or behind.
u may build leyhality, but that doesn't change the fakt , that u have 4k hp and infinete healing. U simplie unkilable demon king and all that u have is more like bruiser thing then assasin, so building full damage items is not something bad, cuz u basicly playing the same aatrox
Gg for the sponsor man !
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EUW and NA seem like fun server
making aatrox's E scale with health was actually a change in the right direction, but there are probably more things that can be done to aatrox specifically, not involving the itemization. I'm sick of aatrox getting all the lethality items nerfed for other champions that aren't as good.
You could do the same rundown of Azir and Ryze being destroyed by Riot only bc of 0.0001% of playerbase (proplay)
Want to read a more funny one? is that even assasins can't deal their desire amount of dmg without going eclipse + Profane hydra, like eclipse + profane hydra is the best route that bruisers AND assasins can go to deal damage and snowball from early game (example Kha'zix in high elo Building eclipse, profane, bc)
If riot wants him bruiser why they dont make him profit from hp or resistances and reduce his dmg, cleaver would make sence and thats what he is supposed to have in stats, it says in colection of champs, aatrox- resistance and dmg.
finally someone sponsored Naayil xd
His disappointment in 5:20 was so real it made me laugh 😂😂😂
When will we get a tank build?
aatrox with omnivamp eclipse was fun and broken as hell lol.
I mean, why is it so hard to reduce the base damage on Q 's and passive and add a Bonus HP scaling on this spells?
If you give a champion such an insane ad ratio on an ability lethality will always be a viable option
I've wait years for the 100% R healing to be back, but now W is sh*t, passive heals less and doesn't proc cleaver
Like bro im glad you got a sponsor! But this season is fucked!!! No teammate in this world can fix this game.
i thought of something, revert the E "ajustement" (nerf), nerf the W slow, give it a fair HP scaling (more HP = more slow) so u either can go lethality with no W pulls (which to be fair u won't need since u one shot with 2 Qs late game) or you go bruiser and ur W consistently pulls, idk what yall think of that but to me its a healthy way to give bruiser playstyle advantage over lethality
I dont think a slow is gonna make w pull for most champs still unless it also grounds you, too many champs have a dash to just get out of it whenever theres a slow or not
@@parryblockdodge those aren't the issue i'm talking about they naturally counter W, i'm talking about those who just walk the whole way out and even take the pull damage without getting pulled back
If you nerf w slow, it will be painful laning before you have items
@@angusjohnston7172 are u implying it's not already? xd
@@DIAX9 true but I don't want people without boots walking out the back in laning
I remember old naayil bedore face reveal but with face his videos look better
i love how he skipped gamer girl and said someone to play aram with
I think the even bigger joke is to buff the only bruiser item that assasins where building out of all bruiser items
i mean make W and passive deal Ad dmg again but scale with hp?
MY MAN GOT SPONSORS NOW!!
let's not forget that they literally murdered pre-rework Aatrox by overhauling his whole kit, except revive ability, but then removed it as well because he was too overpowered even after multiple nerf patches. Riot got no idea what to do with this champ🤦
FIRST SPONSOR FOR NAAYIL!!
This pretty much happened to briar aswell
we're edging with this sponsor
in my recent ranked game i got hit with 1 aatrox Q and he deleted 1.4k health from me. To be fair my darius died level 1 and perma ran it down so yeah aatrox came out of top as a god
Can u do a Video why u Build Ur new build Like u do
Honestly I think giving Aatrox at this point AP scaling would somehow make him more capable of being an AP bruiser than AD bruiser lol
You just can't survive long enough in this meta to justify bruiser so it's literally useless to try to make him go bruiser when it fundamentally doesn't work.
Not to mention the W barely pulls and with bruiser you NEED sweetspots or you don't deal damage whereas with lethality you can legit just auto them to death with profane since you have 600+Ad with 30% + 70 lethality
Nah bro but buying your team withe this sponsor is wild 💀
if i were riot i would make aatrox heal from minions and have he's healing scale with ad and hp so he don't build tank like vladimir so even if he doesn't do damage he will still heal or else i give him pen on he's E like darius and morde, think about it if they remove darius pen from he's E he will go lethality thats what keeping him as a briuser
IMO even with passive and W dealing physical damage this Cleaver buff isn't changing much.
Aatroz never has such small gaps between his damage instances. Like, cmon, when? Q into W pull? 1 in 100 cases it's 0.01 second difference
there is no way bro got a sponsor , bills cant be that high
100% bro got a gamer girl from his sponsor as payment
Its funny how every single OTP community is upset at riot, except the Lux community.
6:10 that guy in the chat ”which bruiser other than kled a’d aatrox go lethality ?”
Well the others are just not picked anymore, adc took their place 😂
no fucking way you got a sponsor on yt. congrats bro
i just rewtched my own clips of s12 i guess aatrox. remember eclipse, serylda, cleaver build? how tf was it bruiser? only cleaver had hp
They canta turn Aatrox into a Bruiser because he doesn't benefit nearly as much from CDR as other bruisers do.
The 3Q combo only goes on CD at the end, and it is not something aatrox can spam because positioning is needed.
Considering aatrox's main damage source is not nearly as spammable as a Renekton Q, going lethality is the best way to ensure Aatrox will do the most amount of damage in a resonable timeflame to kill someone.
This is literally wrong. He literally was a bruiser all the time after his rework prior to past 2 seasons.
Every bruiser is designed to kill with multiple rotations of abilities which is why they love CDR but when you can't survive long enough to get multiple rotations off is when bruisers go full damage
@@gorgistanojevik3196except after a certain point, aatrox qs just don’t benefit from cdr because unlike other main damage like renek or riven q, aatrox resets every single time he uses q.
@@zeragrogen5129 You would need nearly 100 haste for it to become overkill. Also, remember that Q isn't only the only important ability in his kit. R is also a crucial ability, so being able to lower that CD is pretty good. Lowered E CD is good as well.
take a shot everytime he says "Bruiser"
They know the drill already, just enjoy few next patch. It's not gonna last
MY MAN GOT SPOSORONEOSNROSNROED
i want riot to deal with other roles like how they deal with bruisers. they are fine leaving broken items for mages/adcs but god forbid bruisers get broken items. most they last is 2 patches then they are nerfed
I love lethality aatrox. Idk why but its fun.
Wheres the dating show at
Riot should stop caring and just balance stuff whit a roulette kind of thing and make it 100℅ unpredictable random and trashy
Spin roulette*
(Nerf) ok what we nerf
Spin roulette*
(Tanks) ok tanks how?
Spin roulette*
(Items cost more) right.
I THOUGHT IT WAS MY CLIENT I ACTUALLY HOVER MY MOUSE TO ACCEPT THE GAME
good video
Meanwhile bruiser aatrox players still winning in challanger...
i miss the good goredrinker
bro straigth yapping 10 mins straigth
It's kinda hilarious how one person can say a fact about a *top laner* champion, while ADCs are mostly untouched by Rito games. Not meaning to disrespect Naayil, he did good job at explaining what kind of spaghetti is happening with Aatrox in the game. But isn't it at least a little funny? How there's almost nothing to talk about the ADCs?
Because there's a big number of champions in there, who simply bust "out of the box". Kai'sa, Smolder, and the likes. It gives me an impression that Riot only cares about the botlane (i wonder why) and just spews out few small patches for other lanes, just so they don't get stoned by the mob.
You do realize they've been directly and indirectly nerfing Marksmen, right? I'm an ADC hater myself but I see when they actually nerf them.
@@socomical607 sorry, I haven't been keeping in touch with the adc nerfs, so i spoke from my experience and the impression that the game was giving me at this moment.
@@deepsix8328 fair enough. I don’t blame you for that. They’re pretty annoying right now even with the nerfs done to them.
Sadly adcs are trash to Play. If they are weak who the heck will Play that trash
@@communisttears3628 explains Kai'sa buffs tbf. Might be wrong, like i said. Wasn't looking into adc meta
I'm convinced that riot doesn't want Aatrox to be a champion that is as strong as he is in previous seasons
He is the same power if not more it's just played differently
I would be lying if I said that he is weak now. He isn't but what I wanted to mean is: Riot clearly doesn't want Aatrox to dominate the top meta once again. That's what I see.
@@gorgistanojevik3196 well aatrox has been a constant pick in top lane in more than one season
Aatrox was prominent in 2 worlds in a row if I'm not mistaken (seasons 12 and 13). He's also been the top pick in top lane the past 2 seasons as well. Early-half of season 13 was his worst, but currently, he's pretty good, especially if played well.
I wish goredrinker was back.
If you pay for a teammate you’re cooked
might aswell give aatrox ap scaling
Look, all I'm saying is lethality Aatrox is hella fun and infinitely more useful than bruiser.
Fuck getting kited if one Q heals for like 30% hp.
at least the are buffing black cleaver
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO WHO THE FUCK IN NAYIL? THE DOUBLE AA THING GUYS. I AINT USING NO GOD DAMN CODE UNTILL ITS NAAYIL