Sports youtubers have very low overhead (compared to say automotive youtubers for example). I imagine tommo charges his sponsors less, and isn't used to big expenses like international flights. Would be good for him to do more videos like this to produce a larger variety of content.
I live in NJ and I was in college during the time of this proposal. One of the main factors that people forget also is that NJ got hit extremely hard in late 2012 by Hurricane Sandy. There was an estimated $30 billion in damages and the public perception of getting money together for a weekend race when there were people still displaced was also a large factor on this never happening.
Also, if I remember that area properly from passing through there enough times on the way to Edgewater, that entire area where the Envue/parking garage is was just one big flat parking lot for the ferry terminal and Arthur's Landing. So there was a LOT of possibility for putting up the pit buildings and whatever other infield construction would be needed
I love the idea of you going to a bunch of defunct or forgotten tracks and showing us what could have been. Plus its a nice opportunity for travel lol. Great vid!
My 2012 NY-GP Predictions: Race Winner: Fernando Alonso Banger Drive: Kimi Räikkönen Clanger Drive: Pastor Maldonado Banger Team: Lotus Clanger Team: Sahara Force India But jokes aside. Wonderful video Tommo and it looked you really had fun to explore it :)
I get this is probably considerably more costly and effort-intensive than your usual stuff (especially the travel) but I'd love to see more like this if it winds up doing well for you. Really interesting concept Wommo
Ultimately I took the opportunity to do this on top of something else I was already doing - and that'll probably be the case going forward for stuff like this. Can't see it hitting a 6 figure banger sadly.
Native New Yorker here, I do agree that this would have been a great thing with the potential to be a great track, if not for racing than for qualifying, like Monaco, if anything the views with Manhattan in the background would have been stunning, shame it never happened, even if it would have turned out to be a clanger of a track, I would have preferred this over Miami.
As an American who lives in New Jersey this would have been an outstanding race. Unfortunately F1 wasn’t popular enough here at the time (no USGP at time and since 2007). Now the sport is popular enough in the US but the area is fully developed with an affluent populace who don’t want their lives disrupted for such an inconvenience. BUT If a marathon can shut down the Verranzano and half Manhattan for most of a day why tf not?
Tommo, if you're near long beach you should do a similar video for the long beach grand prix. The local community is very supportive of it and it totally works.
This might be idealistic but I reckon that instead of building F1 tracks in the middle of cities it's probably best for everyone if they could build some kind of purpose-built facility away from where people live. It's crazy but it just might work.
Didn't watch F1 back then, but seems like it'd have been fairly solid for a street track. Cars would've been screaming down towards the hairpin down that hill.
crazy to see tommo walking around a place i used to frequent. since you asked, NJ in june would be perfect for a grand prix, but if it’s in the afternoon there would be a decent chance of heavy rain randomly. it’s a beautiful place, unlike the rest of jersey, would’ve loved going to this as a track back in the day
@@BwInNewJersey settle brother, i’m from the state. obviously a joke. besides newark airport, that’s no joke (i’m standing on this regardless of the renovations lol)
I hope one day someone makes a mod for this in Assetto Corsa if not then il have to do it myself one day Vettel even said it reminded him of spa out of all the street circuits this is probably one of the most cool and unique and such a shame this wasn't on the calendar1000 times better than Miami
I heard about the Grand Prix on the local news in NJ, but I was more into NASCAR at the time lol. The race would have stuck out a lot, with cars going past people’s doorsteps at 150-200mph, there would’ve been some kickback there if it did take place. But a more serious race that occurred in NY/NJ region was the Meadowlands Grand Prix that took place outside of MetLife Stadium, Indycar was the first to pioneer it there and the circuit was built similar to today’s Miami Grand Prix. My dad told me people loved the racing there until the 90’s when it stopped. I hope if F1 brings a circuit back to the region here, there’s definitely a market here. Also I can’t forget when Formula E brought racing to actual NYC with the Red Hook street circuit and that had a similar layout to this circuit, but that took place in an actual shipping yard, shame that they took that race away to opt for the Portland E-Prix.
Thats not an F1 tracks- it's a circa 2000 CART track (reminds me of Vancouver, Surfers Paradise street circuits) only wider, faster and with elevation change)
You should do this w active F1 tracks too. The ones that are open off season to give a more irl experience, which is an angle we don’t rly get at those speeds
Tommo just here to say this is a genuinely great video. I think its worth sticking with doing similar videos for a while if possibly they might not take off immediately but i think once people actually see one theyd appreciate it. Its just completely different to the normal video format which might make a few people question it. Great stuff though
I'm from the southern part of New Jersey, and there was not even a tenth of the interest there is now for F1. Back then, we weren't even the on the #1 sports channel, ESPN, like we are now, and using BBC's feed. We had just the international feed and remote commentary. Tommo, how much time did it actually take you to walk the track? Obviously, you would have stopped for views, but do you recall the time off the ferry and the time of sunset? I actually recall that the road down hill with the sewage plant at the end to the hairpin was actual paved to remove the camber back then. The US loves camber on the residential roads for drainage. Definitely not compatible for this generation of ground effect. I think if the car was positioned on the crest of the camber, today's car is absolutely scraping the tunnels of the underside. Epic Tommo thumbnail.
American here. I only started following F1 in 2012, but it’s no surprise they couldn’t get funding at the time. Back then I had never heard anybody talk about F1. Like really nobody. I knew who Michael Schumacher was but that’s it.
I live in New Jersey. The right time to do the race would be around Canada and Miami. Right now it around 45 degrees and two days ago it was snowing. Would have to be before Halloween.
Great video, really enjoyed the change of pace! For what it's worth, I consider what you do looking into business side of sponsors and team ownership/dynamics (like the Mission Winnow video) to be journalistic.
I cannot believe Tommo was in NJ. If I was walking down the block in weehawken and saw Tommo I would think someone slipped me drugs 😂. WHAT IS HE DOING HERE??? Guess I'll have to wait til Austin hopefully to see you in person!
As an American thinking back to 2011, I do remember this track proposal. I think there were a number of factors that lead to its failure. There weren’t many younger F1 fans then (pre-DTS) and a lot of older fans had sworn off F1 after the Indy debacle on ‘05 or whatever that was. You’re right, there was also a lot of frustration amongst locals in Ny/NJ over the location. Money-wise, I think they could come up with the money now, but this was also still only a few years post-recession, so it was harder then. There were a lot of environmental groups against it too.
Yeah absolutely, it does make sense why it didn't happen. I can't imagine we'd have got more than a few years out of it to be honest. We could end up saying the same about Vegas in time.
That's such a beautiful day, and a beautiful part of a city of what could've been an F1 track! The track's... geography? feels somewhat similar to Monaco just like what you said, and probably Macau as well, another famous street circuit! Pretty interesting that these three locations have that similar element of the sea and the mountains/hills about it. Even the hilly part on this feels similar to Macau, where it's just a wee bit twisty but still pretty high speed. Honestly I love the Macau circuit whenever I played the sim, has a great blend of challenging twisty parts at the top of the hill and then the famous long straight that still offers great overtaking opportunities, which is kinda similar to this! Love the great work on this bit of journalism mate!
2:00 - That Envue and the parking garage were not built when the track was originally planned. That entire area was just a very large very flat parking lot. The possibilities for putting up the pit buildings and the like were great. 5:19 - Those buildings were most definitely NOT there in 2011. That area was significantly less developed. 8:30 - Just a couple blocks to the left of that huge set of stairs is Hamilton Park, the site of the Alexander Hamilton - Aaron Burr duel that ended Hamilton's life. Yes, I know different Hamilton than we're used to on this channel, but still a highly famous one. 12:10 - Very good point. Boulevard East is a prime real estate location because of the views that you can obviously see, and it's also a rather well-traveled road, which you can also see from the traffic (which was probably around... 3, 3:30 PM in November judging by the lighting). Those people would effectively be unable to leave their driveways and garages for the entire time the circuit would be set up. This would massively affect the parking in the area. And considering Weehawken is the 15th most densely populated city in the US, at nearly 22K/mi^2 or 8500/km^2, that would be a *nightmare*. For comparison, that's about 1.5 times the population density of London. (Although it's still only half the density of its neighbor to the south, Hoboken.) 14:10 - They were able to justify re-paving the entire road leading to Liberty National Golf Course so the PGA players had a better road to drive in on. They could DEFINITELY justify doing so for a racecourse 15:50 - That is the way the Palisades are. The Palisades are a series of geological cliffs running from Jersey City all the way up to Nyack, New York. In Weehawken, they're about 300 feet high, and further north when they are part of Palisades Interstate Park, they're part of a National Natural Landmark Gorgeous views and the occasional roads winding up along the side of them make for breathtaking drives, in multiple senses of the word. 18:25 - June can be HELLISH in New Jersey. Weehawken's average temperatures are a little cooler than some other cities in the area because of the waterfront location, but June still averages around a high of 80F (27C) with a low of 65F (18C). An abnormally hot early Summer could be hell for the drivers. 19:00 - That is most definitely the sewage treatment plant. 21:50 - Yes, I believe it might be a greater elevation change than Monaco (which is 42m/138 ft). According to what I can find, that one descending road alone is a 46m descent just from the right-hander at the top. COTA is 41m/133ft for example Also, there's a bar in the Port Imperial ferry station that used to be my karaoke place about every month before The Fire Nation Attacked. The circuit is one of those that in and of itself would be an amazing circuit to drive. The problem is everything else around it. If you could put it in a simulator and fix the roads, that would be something that would be so fun to try. But in real life, it would be almost impossible. You saw just how many cars used both Boulevard East (the upper road) and River Road (the lower road). Now imagine shutting down those roads for an extended weekend. The traffic on the parallel roads to the west, which is already naturally heavy, would be insane. Also, you'd pretty much have to shut down the ferry service for the weekend as well, and that is how a number of people in the area get back and forth to their jobs in Manhattan. It would run along a street filled with single- and dual-family housing. It might be great to see but it would end up being a major inconvenience to many people in the city. In the end, it was a wonderful idea in a vacuum, but a horrible idea in real life. OH, and also IIRC, a friend of mine was talking about getting the 3-day tickets to the race and quoted me a price of $325. In the early 2010s. And people were complaining about ticket prices today at some tracks? Naw, we know all about making sports STUPIDLY expensive. That said, thank you for this tour of an area I've known for much of my life, and RIP Tommo's calves.
I’m from Jersey, and I remember the very beginning when this was proposed (I was like 8 years old). It put so much interest into the sport for me thinking I was gonna have a race in my backyard
I wish you would have also been able to look at the Gran Turismo 4 track. I loved driving that! I think that and Seattle were my favorite city tracks from the games.
Lovely jubbly video Tommo. One thing I was thinking though is there doesn’t seem to be many possibilities for spectators/grandstands which I guess F1 need for ticket sales. Gotta come to Melbourne soon for the GP 👌🏻
Formula E did race in Brooklyn, but in the docks near where the Queen Mary 2 embarks from. That would not really work for F1 because it didn’t have a Paddock (the cars went into a loop with a bunch of big tents for the teams to use.) There is an even older proposal to run a b shaped track around the World Trade Center (this was for Indy Car)… when that failed they raced in the parking lot at the Meadowlands in NJ (very much like the Miami GP).
Fantastic video! Love the "IRL" Travel content. As an American I approve! Sorry about our infrastructure though! In 2011 many folks didn't know what F1 was in the US. For quite a while F1 was only on the Speed Channel (A very niche channel only gearheads watched.) and Telemundo a Spanish speaking channel. But when they moved to NBC and eventually ESPN it became more mainstream here. Netflix certainly helped a lot too. In the Speed Channel era Former F1 Driver David Hobbs and former Benneton race engineer Steve Matchett were wonderful to listen to. They were very unbiased, and it was a joy to watch. But unfortunately, we had commercials back then lool Today ESPN lets us watch the Sky Sports F1 feed uninterrupted.
It was nice to hear the Gran Turismo music in the background which got me thinking: If Formula One wanted to race in the Big Apple, couldn't they just use the New York City circuit from GT4? Probably not, but it would be fun.
Thank you, sir. I've always been crushed that NY GP didn't take place. Now we have Miami and Vegas, two embarrassments of greed. Ugh. To answer your question as an F1 fan from Senna v Prost, I was completely in favor of NY over TX. I was already planning a trip around it, tentatively 😂
Very cool video Tommo! I also agree with you in that even in current times with F1 rising in the US, the NY GP wouldn't last more than 5yrs I am willing to bet. Las Vegas is a better recent add, but FOM should look at Phoenix if they want a 3rd (street) track in the US (not saying they should though...24 races already a max effort). Too many residents, in to close proximity to the circuit with too many local stakes involved for that NY circuit to endure. Cheers.
Yes, I remember Bernie and one the NASCAR big wig promoters announcing it (Bruton Smith or Humpy Wheeler) I remember the excitement at the elevation changes and people asking 'how did you find the track'? As it progressed/didn't progress I seem to remember some issues with city labor forces in New Jersey. I can't remember if this was the time the two guys who were building COTA were suing each other before it was completed.
As an NYC local who has visited that area plenty - you're just south of Edgewater NJ for the majority of this video - and who became an F1 fan in the Barrichello/Stewart-Ford days, another potential nail in the coffin was local interest. It wasn't until maybe DTS that conversations started to happen about F1 at my workplace. That said, that part of NJ is a bit of a bear to get to once you're over the George Washington Bridge. Quite a few choke points, methinks from area experience, to make this a feasible successful event, even if this were to be proposed today.
Im a New Jersey resident that lives not far from port authority. This would have been amazing, especially growing up. Hopefully the track thats supposed to be in Atlantic City can actually be used for F1. 🤞
I remember when this was announced at first back in 2011, and since NJ was my home state of course I was excited. Formula 1 in my home state of NJ where racing is almost non-existent in that particular area (except that one IndyCar race in the early 90's), why wouldn't I be excited. However, with all of the external factors against the race, plus the affects of Hurricane Sandy just didn't make it feasible enough for F1 to be there. One more thing, you mentioned if it were today if the race would of been funded more easier with DTS and the popularity of F1 coming more into play, honestly I don't think it would have been easier. If anything, I think it would of been harder to get the funds for the race more than ever.
Based on the architecture and how much that part of New Jersey has grown recently, a lot of those 4- or 5-story apartment buildings (even the old-timey-looking ones) were probably only built within the last 10 years and probably would not have been built if there was a regular grand prix there.
As an American, I think it would have been a difficult location to create into a track. The roads are battered and repaving would have been far more difficult than places like Vegas. The municipality in the New Jersey is very restrictive and since it boarders a body of water, logistics are more challenging. Viewing areas would be limited which means extreme crowding , especially given the popularity of F1 in the US today. I like the track layout, backdrop and elevation changes but the location would have never worked out. However, I would love to see the track in a driving sim!
Hey Tommo, cool video, i live around 40 minutes from there. It’s a shame that the Grand Prix plan failed. Hopefully one day, but I highly doubt it! By the way the weather around June m would be similar to Central Europe.
I want a GP and Manhattan, but I know it will never happen. I've spent hours and hours designing a track in lower Manhattan that would be good for racing and even remotely close to being a grade-A circuit. I know if they made it on there, the traffic would be insane, among a multitude of issues. But if one day we get a NYC race that would be pretty awesome.
You're in my backyard! My building would have overlooked part of the proposed track. Unfortunately, it's true, even if there was will from the FIA (there isn't) and financial backing (I suppose there could be), there's no chance of it ever happening now. My two cents below: As New York has gotten more expensive to live in, this part of New Jersey, from Jersey City further south up to Fort Lee further north, has sort of become an extension of New York City. Many choose to live here and commute to the city for work (myself included); real estate/rent and taxes are a bit lower, so you can get a nicer home/apartment for similar money. The result is that this area is significantly more crowded than it was a decade ago. On what would be the lower level of the track, there's been a lot of commercial and residential development sprung up, taking up the area that would have been designated for the paddock, but even beyond that, the straights on the upper and lower levels are major arteries for traffic, with no great alternatives. Traffic would be a nightmare, even if only for a week, which I think would make it a non-starter for political approval.
thankyou tommo, always wondered what it was like on that side of the river,. i appreciate the lack of background music as well. nice to get to enjoy your work. how would i describe your role? F1 comment/creator.
@@AlwaysOneMore The US is like the size of Europe, when there’s a growth in audience somewhere it’s normal for a sport to add more events there, most people are just mad at the fact F1 is growing in the United States
Go to surfshark.com/tommo for 4 extra months of Surfshark at an unbeatable price!
Tommo unlocked being outside, praise the lord
Tommo on Tour
I liked the casey style shot in front of casey
Outommo
Sports youtubers have very low overhead (compared to say automotive youtubers for example). I imagine tommo charges his sponsors less, and isn't used to big expenses like international flights. Would be good for him to do more videos like this to produce a larger variety of content.
Achievement Unlocked: Touch Grass? 🙃
I live in NJ and I was in college during the time of this proposal. One of the main factors that people forget also is that NJ got hit extremely hard in late 2012 by Hurricane Sandy. There was an estimated $30 billion in damages and the public perception of getting money together for a weekend race when there were people still displaced was also a large factor on this never happening.
This is a great bit of local knowledge to add. Thank you for sharing. 🙏
Ah man, that's a great point. The optics would've been absolutely awful.
shite even I forgot about Sandy. still miss the OG seaside pier
Also, if I remember that area properly from passing through there enough times on the way to Edgewater, that entire area where the Envue/parking garage is was just one big flat parking lot for the ferry terminal and Arthur's Landing. So there was a LOT of possibility for putting up the pit buildings and whatever other infield construction would be needed
I love the idea of you going to a bunch of defunct or forgotten tracks and showing us what could have been. Plus its a nice opportunity for travel lol. Great vid!
More the merrier!
@@TommoMcCluskeyyou’ll need to walk the original Spa next
You need to do more of these ❤🔥
Channelling my inner Amys xoxo
@@TommoMcCluskey I felt like this was a Matt Amys-type video
My 2012 NY-GP Predictions:
Race Winner: Fernando Alonso
Banger Drive: Kimi Räikkönen
Clanger Drive: Pastor Maldonado
Banger Team: Lotus
Clanger Team: Sahara Force India
But jokes aside. Wonderful video Tommo and it looked you really had fun to explore it :)
Underestimate Pastor at your own peril Kira! 😅
I loved it ! The concept of this video was awesome, I would love to see more of that in the future
For sure!
Thank you Romain! 🫡
No way you actually did it. Awesome.
I did! 🫡
I get this is probably considerably more costly and effort-intensive than your usual stuff (especially the travel) but I'd love to see more like this if it winds up doing well for you. Really interesting concept Wommo
Ultimately I took the opportunity to do this on top of something else I was already doing - and that'll probably be the case going forward for stuff like this. Can't see it hitting a 6 figure banger sadly.
I grew up in an apartment building a few blocks from this route. Wild.
Nice ends. 👌
the editing is goated in this video
Cheers Jack!
Native New Yorker here, I do agree that this would have been a great thing with the potential to be a great track, if not for racing than for qualifying, like Monaco, if anything the views with Manhattan in the background would have been stunning, shame it never happened, even if it would have turned out to be a clanger of a track, I would have preferred this over Miami.
As an American who lives in New Jersey this would have been an outstanding race. Unfortunately F1 wasn’t popular enough here at the time (no USGP at time and since 2007). Now the sport is popular enough in the US but the area is fully developed with an affluent populace who don’t want their lives disrupted for such an inconvenience.
BUT If a marathon can shut down the Verranzano and half Manhattan for most of a day why tf not?
That is one day. They don't have to move in walls and put up all the infrastructure a race demands .
Absolutely love the concept of this video! Would love to see proposed tracks that never-were or even defunct f1 tracks.
Tonight, Tommo touches concrete
Stomping
Tommo, if you're near long beach you should do a similar video for the long beach grand prix. The local community is very supportive of it and it totally works.
This might be idealistic but I reckon that instead of building F1 tracks in the middle of cities it's probably best for everyone if they could build some kind of purpose-built facility away from where people live. It's crazy but it just might work.
Insane idea that.
you could even design the track to go in certain directions, that would be interesting
If only there was a way to simulate this track. 🤔
they did that with korea, complete failure
You say that, but this track really was one I was just cranked to see. It was so wild
That was a great video Tommo! That track would have been interesting but you're right, the residents in that area would have hate it.
Thank you Carlos! In practice, I don't think it'd have lasted more than a few years tbh. But we'll never know!
You should do the track walk at Albert Park if you ever make is down under. Beautiful stroll around a lovely part of Melbourne
That is on my bucket list for SURE
Vibes: immaculate. Track: absolutely stunning. It's a shame it never happened. Thanks for the tour, Tommo
Didn't watch F1 back then, but seems like it'd have been fairly solid for a street track. Cars would've been screaming down towards the hairpin down that hill.
Awesome video, love it. And i find it sad that the race didn't actually happen, cause the layout looks quite decent, definitly better than Miami.
Seeing this makes me sad knowing we could of had this, and we got miami
Do you remember the Meadowlands Grand Prix for CART/Indy? We walked so they could stumble drunkenly into the next South Beach bar. 🤣
crazy to see tommo walking around a place i used to frequent. since you asked, NJ in june would be perfect for a grand prix, but if it’s in the afternoon there would be a decent chance of heavy rain randomly. it’s a beautiful place, unlike the rest of jersey, would’ve loved going to this as a track back in the day
Yeah I imagined June would be decent - although given I recorded this on Monday, can't believe how decent the weather was!
There are lots of beautiful places here if you actually travel the state.
"a beautiful place, unlike the rest of jersey"
that's one way to tell everyone you've never been to most of new jersey.
@@BwInNewJersey settle brother, i’m from the state. obviously a joke. besides newark airport, that’s no joke (i’m standing on this regardless of the renovations lol)
I hope one day someone makes a mod for this in Assetto Corsa if not then il have to do it myself one day Vettel even said it reminded him of spa out of all the street circuits this is probably one of the most cool and unique and such a shame this wasn't on the calendar1000 times better than Miami
I remember Speed Channel host, Steve Machett, being there. I miss their show.
I heard about the Grand Prix on the local news in NJ, but I was more into NASCAR at the time lol. The race would have stuck out a lot, with cars going past people’s doorsteps at 150-200mph, there would’ve been some kickback there if it did take place. But a more serious race that occurred in NY/NJ region was the Meadowlands Grand Prix that took place outside of MetLife Stadium, Indycar was the first to pioneer it there and the circuit was built similar to today’s Miami Grand Prix. My dad told me people loved the racing there until the 90’s when it stopped. I hope if F1 brings a circuit back to the region here, there’s definitely a market here. Also I can’t forget when Formula E brought racing to actual NYC with the Red Hook street circuit and that had a similar layout to this circuit, but that took place in an actual shipping yard, shame that they took that race away to opt for the Portland E-Prix.
Thats not an F1 tracks- it's a circa 2000 CART track (reminds me of Vancouver, Surfers Paradise street circuits) only wider, faster and with elevation change)
You should do this w active F1 tracks too. The ones that are open off season to give a more irl experience, which is an angle we don’t rly get at those speeds
This is awesome. What a nice surprise, I was wondering after you mentioned the NYC visit
Great video! Nice to see it from this perspective over 10 years on.
Cheers McPhilen - I had to at least try and get a look at it whilst I was there. Was absolutely worth it.
Tommo just here to say this is a genuinely great video. I think its worth sticking with doing similar videos for a while if possibly they might not take off immediately but i think once people actually see one theyd appreciate it. Its just completely different to the normal video format which might make a few people question it. Great stuff though
Quality video Tommo! More videos like this please!
I'm from the southern part of New Jersey, and there was not even a tenth of the interest there is now for F1. Back then, we weren't even the on the #1 sports channel, ESPN, like we are now, and using BBC's feed. We had just the international feed and remote commentary.
Tommo, how much time did it actually take you to walk the track? Obviously, you would have stopped for views, but do you recall the time off the ferry and the time of sunset?
I actually recall that the road down hill with the sewage plant at the end to the hairpin was actual paved to remove the camber back then. The US loves camber on the residential roads for drainage. Definitely not compatible for this generation of ground effect. I think if the car was positioned on the crest of the camber, today's car is absolutely scraping the tunnels of the underside.
Epic Tommo thumbnail.
Incredible video, thank you for filling a gap in my F1 history!
iK toronto is smaller then NYC but def come here in the summer for the Indy race, its crazy experience.
Big fan of this style of video!
Great video Tommo. Love the concept. Sad to see it hasn't got the views you normally get but I loved it. Keep it up lad!
This was real ✨Investigative Journalism ✨ Tommo.
Excellent work, and super interesting! well done and thank you!!!
Great change of pace and format compared to the typical formula. Good job.
American here. I only started following F1 in 2012, but it’s no surprise they couldn’t get funding at the time. Back then I had never heard anybody talk about F1. Like really nobody. I knew who Michael Schumacher was but that’s it.
Really enjoyable video Tommo! I appreciate the extra effort something like this would take, it really shows. U da goat of f1 youtube
I live in New Jersey. The right time to do the race would be around Canada and Miami. Right now it around 45 degrees and two days ago it was snowing. Would have to be before Halloween.
Spooky
Great video, really enjoyed the change of pace!
For what it's worth, I consider what you do looking into business side of sponsors and team ownership/dynamics (like the Mission Winnow video) to be journalistic.
This track would have been awesome. Great video Tommo you really showed how great New York is.
Cheers Franco, glad you enjoyed it!
I cannot believe Tommo was in NJ. If I was walking down the block in weehawken and saw Tommo I would think someone slipped me drugs 😂. WHAT IS HE DOING HERE??? Guess I'll have to wait til Austin hopefully to see you in person!
😂😂😂
As an American thinking back to 2011, I do remember this track proposal. I think there were a number of factors that lead to its failure. There weren’t many younger F1 fans then (pre-DTS) and a lot of older fans had sworn off F1 after the Indy debacle on ‘05 or whatever that was. You’re right, there was also a lot of frustration amongst locals in Ny/NJ over the location. Money-wise, I think they could come up with the money now, but this was also still only a few years post-recession, so it was harder then. There were a lot of environmental groups against it too.
Yeah absolutely, it does make sense why it didn't happen. I can't imagine we'd have got more than a few years out of it to be honest. We could end up saying the same about Vegas in time.
Awesome video Tommo, would love to see more of these!
Really cool video, Tommo! Thanks, mate!
That's such a beautiful day, and a beautiful part of a city of what could've been an F1 track! The track's... geography? feels somewhat similar to Monaco just like what you said, and probably Macau as well, another famous street circuit! Pretty interesting that these three locations have that similar element of the sea and the mountains/hills about it. Even the hilly part on this feels similar to Macau, where it's just a wee bit twisty but still pretty high speed. Honestly I love the Macau circuit whenever I played the sim, has a great blend of challenging twisty parts at the top of the hill and then the famous long straight that still offers great overtaking opportunities, which is kinda similar to this! Love the great work on this bit of journalism mate!
Incredible concept and execution for this video!!
This was awesome! Nice one man🤙🏼
2:00 - That Envue and the parking garage were not built when the track was originally planned. That entire area was just a very large very flat parking lot. The possibilities for putting up the pit buildings and the like were great.
5:19 - Those buildings were most definitely NOT there in 2011. That area was significantly less developed.
8:30 - Just a couple blocks to the left of that huge set of stairs is Hamilton Park, the site of the Alexander Hamilton - Aaron Burr duel that ended Hamilton's life. Yes, I know different Hamilton than we're used to on this channel, but still a highly famous one.
12:10 - Very good point. Boulevard East is a prime real estate location because of the views that you can obviously see, and it's also a rather well-traveled road, which you can also see from the traffic (which was probably around... 3, 3:30 PM in November judging by the lighting). Those people would effectively be unable to leave their driveways and garages for the entire time the circuit would be set up. This would massively affect the parking in the area. And considering Weehawken is the 15th most densely populated city in the US, at nearly 22K/mi^2 or 8500/km^2, that would be a *nightmare*. For comparison, that's about 1.5 times the population density of London. (Although it's still only half the density of its neighbor to the south, Hoboken.)
14:10 - They were able to justify re-paving the entire road leading to Liberty National Golf Course so the PGA players had a better road to drive in on. They could DEFINITELY justify doing so for a racecourse
15:50 - That is the way the Palisades are. The Palisades are a series of geological cliffs running from Jersey City all the way up to Nyack, New York. In Weehawken, they're about 300 feet high, and further north when they are part of Palisades Interstate Park, they're part of a National Natural Landmark Gorgeous views and the occasional roads winding up along the side of them make for breathtaking drives, in multiple senses of the word.
18:25 - June can be HELLISH in New Jersey. Weehawken's average temperatures are a little cooler than some other cities in the area because of the waterfront location, but June still averages around a high of 80F (27C) with a low of 65F (18C). An abnormally hot early Summer could be hell for the drivers.
19:00 - That is most definitely the sewage treatment plant.
21:50 - Yes, I believe it might be a greater elevation change than Monaco (which is 42m/138 ft). According to what I can find, that one descending road alone is a 46m descent just from the right-hander at the top. COTA is 41m/133ft for example
Also, there's a bar in the Port Imperial ferry station that used to be my karaoke place about every month before The Fire Nation Attacked.
The circuit is one of those that in and of itself would be an amazing circuit to drive. The problem is everything else around it. If you could put it in a simulator and fix the roads, that would be something that would be so fun to try. But in real life, it would be almost impossible. You saw just how many cars used both Boulevard East (the upper road) and River Road (the lower road). Now imagine shutting down those roads for an extended weekend. The traffic on the parallel roads to the west, which is already naturally heavy, would be insane. Also, you'd pretty much have to shut down the ferry service for the weekend as well, and that is how a number of people in the area get back and forth to their jobs in Manhattan. It would run along a street filled with single- and dual-family housing. It might be great to see but it would end up being a major inconvenience to many people in the city.
In the end, it was a wonderful idea in a vacuum, but a horrible idea in real life. OH, and also IIRC, a friend of mine was talking about getting the 3-day tickets to the race and quoted me a price of $325. In the early 2010s. And people were complaining about ticket prices today at some tracks? Naw, we know all about making sports STUPIDLY expensive.
That said, thank you for this tour of an area I've known for much of my life, and RIP Tommo's calves.
It's a mix of Baku/Monaco, I like it! Would take that over Miami for sure
I’m from Jersey, and I remember the very beginning when this was proposed (I was like 8 years old). It put so much interest into the sport for me thinking I was gonna have a race in my backyard
Not so British bias having an American flag around you in the thumbnail now is it Tommo
Red white & blue comes in many forms.
@@TommoMcCluskey Raaaaah 🇺🇸 🇺🇸 🇺🇸
Wouldnt be surprised if someone randomly confused you with Liam Payne with a beard, total freak out!😂
RIP Liam tho
I wish you would have also been able to look at the Gran Turismo 4 track. I loved driving that! I think that and Seattle were my favorite city tracks from the games.
Lovely jubbly video Tommo.
One thing I was thinking though is there doesn’t seem to be many possibilities for spectators/grandstands which I guess F1 need for ticket sales.
Gotta come to Melbourne soon for the GP 👌🏻
Formula E did race in Brooklyn, but in the docks near where the Queen Mary 2 embarks from. That would not really work for F1 because it didn’t have a Paddock (the cars went into a loop with a bunch of big tents for the teams to use.) There is an even older proposal to run a b shaped track around the World Trade Center (this was for Indy Car)… when that failed they raced in the parking lot at the Meadowlands in NJ (very much like the Miami GP).
Love the video Tommo! Very cool thought experiment
tommo is like every Brit when they go abroad, immediately claim they want to live there
I live near by and lived right on what would have been the track, great to see how we could have had an f1 race. I so wish it had happened.
Fantastic video! Love the "IRL" Travel content. As an American I approve!
Sorry about our infrastructure though!
In 2011 many folks didn't know what F1 was in the US. For quite a while F1 was only on the Speed Channel (A very niche channel only gearheads watched.) and Telemundo a Spanish speaking channel. But when they moved to NBC and eventually ESPN it became more mainstream here. Netflix certainly helped a lot too. In the Speed Channel era Former F1 Driver David Hobbs and former Benneton race engineer Steve Matchett were wonderful to listen to. They were very unbiased, and it was a joy to watch. But unfortunately, we had commercials back then lool
Today ESPN lets us watch the Sky Sports F1 feed uninterrupted.
That bus misses the Apex by a mile.
Love these type of videos. Props to you tommo
Superb work sir! 🍻
Tommo, brilliant content idea. Let’s do more
here to support the F1 content goat 🙏 F1 need to make a historic channel and hire you and Mr V
Great video. Love the mix up of content. 👏🏼 Welcome back to the US.
Really enjoyed this video, would love to see more like it.
Love the new type of content. 🎉 You mentioned poor viewership. FYI this video didn't appear on my homepage! 😢
It was nice to hear the Gran Turismo music in the background which got me thinking: If Formula One wanted to race in the Big Apple, couldn't they just use the New York City circuit from GT4? Probably not, but it would be fun.
Enjoyed this video very much. Thank you!
This is such a cool video idea. Banger Tommo 🎉
Omfg you’re using the GT4 menu songs and it fills my heart with joy
Thank you, sir. I've always been crushed that NY GP didn't take place. Now we have Miami and Vegas, two embarrassments of greed. Ugh. To answer your question as an F1 fan from Senna v Prost, I was completely in favor of NY over TX. I was already planning a trip around it, tentatively 😂
Very cool video Tommo! I also agree with you in that even in current times with F1 rising in the US, the NY GP wouldn't last more than 5yrs I am willing to bet. Las Vegas is a better recent add, but FOM should look at Phoenix if they want a 3rd (street) track in the US (not saying they should though...24 races already a max effort). Too many residents, in to close proximity to the circuit with too many local stakes involved for that NY circuit to endure. Cheers.
I find it fascinating that F1 has been so stubborn to return to Indianapolis for whatever reason. Even 14 years later... sheesh.
That sock smell is so specific and so relatable
Yes, I remember Bernie and one the NASCAR big wig promoters announcing it (Bruton Smith or Humpy Wheeler) I remember the excitement at the elevation changes and people asking 'how did you find the track'? As it progressed/didn't progress I seem to remember some issues with city labor forces in New Jersey. I can't remember if this was the time the two guys who were building COTA were suing each other before it was completed.
Having worked down in Lincoln Harbor nearby I have never seen this area with this little traffic.
As an NYC local who has visited that area plenty - you're just south of Edgewater NJ for the majority of this video - and who became an F1 fan in the Barrichello/Stewart-Ford days, another potential nail in the coffin was local interest. It wasn't until maybe DTS that conversations started to happen about F1 at my workplace. That said, that part of NJ is a bit of a bear to get to once you're over the George Washington Bridge. Quite a few choke points, methinks from area experience, to make this a feasible successful event, even if this were to be proposed today.
Hopefully you'll make a video soon on the Las Vegas F1 Track being Abandoned
Im a New Jersey resident that lives not far from port authority. This would have been amazing, especially growing up. Hopefully the track thats supposed to be in Atlantic City can actually be used for F1. 🤞
Brilliant video! The footage here is CRISPY! Curious what camera you were using to get these beauty shots of manhattan!
I remember when this was announced at first back in 2011, and since NJ was my home state of course I was excited. Formula 1 in my home state of NJ where racing is almost non-existent in that particular area (except that one IndyCar race in the early 90's), why wouldn't I be excited. However, with all of the external factors against the race, plus the affects of Hurricane Sandy just didn't make it feasible enough for F1 to be there. One more thing, you mentioned if it were today if the race would of been funded more easier with DTS and the popularity of F1 coming more into play, honestly I don't think it would have been easier. If anything, I think it would of been harder to get the funds for the race more than ever.
I definitely see the similarities to Baku, the layout map may not look the same but a lot of the small details are there
this is an awesome bit of content 👍🏽
Based on the architecture and how much that part of New Jersey has grown recently, a lot of those 4- or 5-story apartment buildings (even the old-timey-looking ones) were probably only built within the last 10 years and probably would not have been built if there was a regular grand prix there.
As an American, I think it would have been a difficult location to create into a track. The roads are battered and repaving would have been far more difficult than places like Vegas. The municipality in the New Jersey is very restrictive and since it boarders a body of water, logistics are more challenging. Viewing areas would be limited which means extreme crowding , especially given the popularity of F1 in the US today. I like the track layout, backdrop and elevation changes but the location would have never worked out. However, I would love to see the track in a driving sim!
Smashing Tommo!! Definitely Want another one of these. Do a track walk for North Korea🙏🙏
this video was so fun!
Hey Tommo, cool video, i live around 40 minutes from there. It’s a shame that the Grand Prix plan failed. Hopefully one day, but I highly doubt it! By the way the weather around June m would be similar to Central Europe.
I want a GP and Manhattan, but I know it will never happen. I've spent hours and hours designing a track in lower Manhattan that would be good for racing and even remotely close to being a grade-A circuit. I know if they made it on there, the traffic would be insane, among a multitude of issues. But if one day we get a NYC race that would be pretty awesome.
You're in my backyard! My building would have overlooked part of the proposed track. Unfortunately, it's true, even if there was will from the FIA (there isn't) and financial backing (I suppose there could be), there's no chance of it ever happening now. My two cents below:
As New York has gotten more expensive to live in, this part of New Jersey, from Jersey City further south up to Fort Lee further north, has sort of become an extension of New York City. Many choose to live here and commute to the city for work (myself included); real estate/rent and taxes are a bit lower, so you can get a nicer home/apartment for similar money. The result is that this area is significantly more crowded than it was a decade ago. On what would be the lower level of the track, there's been a lot of commercial and residential development sprung up, taking up the area that would have been designated for the paddock, but even beyond that, the straights on the upper and lower levels are major arteries for traffic, with no great alternatives. Traffic would be a nightmare, even if only for a week, which I think would make it a non-starter for political approval.
Also yes - it's always that windy, and yes - when there's no traffic, the downhill and lower level are a lot of fun to drive in a normal car.
thankyou tommo, always wondered what it was like on that side of the river,. i appreciate the lack of background music as well. nice to get to enjoy your work. how would i describe your role? F1 comment/creator.
YOU NEED TO GO TO MONACO, you will love it
There should be a track in New York it would be cool
Mate there’s already 3 races in the USA, and COTA is the only one we need or want.
@@AlwaysOneMore The US is like the size of Europe, when there’s a growth in audience somewhere it’s normal for a sport to add more events there, most people are just mad at the fact F1 is growing in the United States
21:41 i think you under estimate the elevation change at monaco and spa