Jim Cornette on Smaller Wrestlers
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- Опубліковано 11 жов 2024
- From Episode 275 of the Jim Cornette's Drive Thru
Artwork by Travis Heckel!
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Presentation is one of the most important aspects of pro wrestling, whether you're small or big, skinny or muscular. Without it, wrestlers wouldn't probably make it to the business successfully.
Being small isn't that much of a problem as long as they're in good and believable shape. Rey Mysterio is a perfect example.
Yea cuz Rey got a big fuckin chest… Jungle Boy, Hook, Darby Allen and Johnny Gargano look like teenage boys… Chad Gable in comparison looks like a million bucks + his in ring work/promos are miles ahead. The package, as Jim refers too. Dragon Lee, who’s coming to NXT, is small too but he presents so much larger bcuz of his incredible physique.
Jushin Thunder Liger is another prime example
Chris Benoit and Eddie Guerrero too.
The mask and contacts helped, also Rey was one of a kind.
@@jonathancurran5366 the contact lenses is a recent gimmick for Rey😐 He didn't wear them in his prime
I think he’s saying, you can be short but you still have to look like a full grown man.
These guys who look like skinny high school kids are just not believable against real looking men.
Chris Candido was short but he was also filled out and super jacked up.
Like Ivan Putsky. He was very short and very intimidating at the same time.
Candido was on roids. Should all wrestlers just take steroids to fit this look?
@@leafy4142 yes, yes they should
@Leafy
Yes, if they don’t want to take it. Just go to holywood, don’t try wrestling.
Even Billy Gunn still looks good and healthy in his 50
@@welowee7610 Yeah, because there's no drugs in Hollywood.
Malenko was very short but he was built like an amateur strongman and could grapple and work like no one else. He obviously would likely never wrestle for the big belt but he's exactly the type of smaller wrestler that could wrestle for 20 years and be placed logically in multiple places on a wrestling card and look like he belonged in the ring.
A lot of old timey strongmen were short. Take strongman Arthur Saxon who set records over a century ago that have yet to be matched, let alone beaten, was 5' 8", and considered tall for his profession.
@@thelastmotel omg haven't thought of Saxon in years
Nowadays the fanboys watching will be constantly crying that Malenko is being misused and needs multiple world championship runs. Even that wouldn't be enough either
Loved the Ice Man!!!
@@janinebrittanica4314 He was the guy. Sad how his life fell off after fighting in World War 1.
People still getting on Jim about this are just disregarding everything he says about a wrestler who is lacking in a certain area : either get better, hide it or be really good in some other aspect.
Pretty much explains why explains Jim has nothing but praise and respect for Rey Mysterio Jr. What he lacks in size, he can make up for everything else rather well.
You are a true mark
It’s funny how easy guys like Goldberg had it compared to other guys lacking in genetics
Social media is for worthless pos anyway
And Jim also hates plenty of big guys as much as he does small guys. For example his guy, 'Zippy the Pinhead.'
He’s exactly right about TV. When me (6’4”) and my son (6’2”) went to a Lucha Underground taping, the producers came out and moved us from our front row seats to a back row.
When the wrestlers came out, who looked huge on TV, they were all very short. One of the PAs told me that they didn’t want tall people that close to the wrestlers because it hurt the “illusion!”
So its not just a Vince thing then.
@@insignificantaftermathPROJECTS No, every promoter that ever lived.
@@Rjensen2 yet fans love to blame Vince like he is the devil for having common sense like this lol
Bro this happened to me at an nxt show Adam cole had me moved
I grew up watching 90s superstars so never really imagined becoming a pro. Now I'm bigger then 85% of the aew roster
No ur not who are you
@@theatbfshow7049 actually he likely is...take out the 8 or 9 tall guys and the rest of the 130 guys on the AEW roster average 5'9" 185lbs.
The average American male is 5'10" 210lbs.
People must forget all the good stuff he says about smaller guys like PAC , Gable and Rey Rey or that he seems to b a fan of Darby Allin , and many other examples
Darby Allin should not be wrestling. Dude looks like a prepubescent teenager
I love how backhanded he is with Darby. He wants to like him and hate him at the same time.
Gothic school girl darby is not believable,I rather pick Adam Cole over this dweeb,idk what corny is talking about,he should of said pac,now that's a dude that's small but he got the look,the chest that corny is so obsessed with
@@kumodohaizi7234 Baby Cole is boring all he is, is a 1 word catchphrase more superkicks and more destroyers. Atleast darby has a personality.
@QAZ-OMEN what personality?the dude barely says anything,I mean at least coles shows charisma and enthusiasm,the only thing Gothic school girl has going is he's a stuntman
Not that savage was small, but notice how meticulous he was in how he even walked. The robe, the sequins, the walk, the promo. He may have been 6'1-62 but his presence was at least 7'0".
The HGH in the end likely finished off Randy Savage (See Spiderman).
He was Huge and we all saw it coming 🧐
(Source :Poffos)
Randy was 5'11 range.. so was Ric. No one accuses theme of being small. Yet HBK is also 5'11, and Bret is 6'0 and they get credited for breaking barriers lol.
@@indiasupportstrumpwwg1wga927 Randy in a hat though was like 6'1 easy lol
“Do drugs to age yourself.”
- Jim Cornette, 2023
To me it's quite simple, i am all for small guys in wrestling when they have a particular set of skills that make them stand out like Rey insane high Flying moves catalogue, Dean Malenko technical majesty or Darby Allin daredevil style, the problem comes when short people with no personality gets pushed to the moon just because they can flip and flop all over the ring when there's no IT factor to justify their push. Also presentation is everything, it doesn't do it for me when 90% of the roster look the same and act same because I end up caring about none of them once they are jammed together and you can't say who is who
Wardlow and Powerhouse are so misused in AEW, Jim forgot about how badass they look.
Yeah I keep seeing promos for Hobbs but I’d rather see him squash some jobbers and get a belt/title.
Wardlow is Vanilla as fuck, gimmick is just pOwErBoMb and dressing sharply for “angry” promos. Samoa Joe’s & Darby’s TNT reigns are already more memorable.
I don't mind small wrestlers as long as they have something special and unique to them which everyone, big or small should have. "I can wrestle good" is not a gimmick!! Rey Mysterio is smaller than most but arguably one of the best ever.
Watching WCW Cruiserweights these days, they translate really well as you look back and see everything they put into the matches and how much they make sense more than the World Heavyweight Division matches on WCW programming. Small guys can be special in wrestling, as long as te booker continues to make them special and not expect the fans to make them feel special.
Often the best matches on a WCW show.
Usually the openers, and always came out fast and flying
It was a long time before I realised Samoa Joe wasn't that tall. He looks huge and his size doesn't make him look shorter like it does with some well built guys. It was only when I started to see him next to other people that I noticed he was about 5'11.
big e is the same hes only 5ft10 or 5ft11 and otis is only 2 inches taller than gable..
@@jackstraw4222 Big E and Otis look a lot shorter than Joe, though. I think they are a bit shorter, but not as much as it looks.
The Rock N Roll Express was my favorite tag team when i was a kid, but they never came off as Big or large in any kind of way, i actually thought they were on the smaller side compared to others
I think they were both 6’1 and 220. Much like the Rockers. The small guys then are the regular sized guys now.
@christophermarang. thats normal size for a grown man right? hell, I'm 6'2 ,250
@@travissmith6380 5'9 is the average, there on the taller end of normal.
@@christophermarang.3569 neither ricky or Robert were that big
Part of their appeal was facing the larger sized teams and still gutting out the win. If they had faced nothing but guys their size or smaller (bcuz they aren't tiny) they probably wouldn't have the same appeal as underdogs. IMO
Oh god, the little lad! Travis you are a god damned genius.
Smaller wrestlers are fine when they're the EXCEPTION. not the RULE.
I think Jim is right, the small guys are too small to make us think they can beat the bigger guys. I think they should have a lightweight division, because it is too hard to believe a 140 lb. guy can beat a 300 lb. monster.
Pro wrestling and NBA are the only places I know where 6ft is probably considered as small
To Jim it may but if you take a look at legends like Shawn Michaels, Ric flair, Eddie Guerrero. All of them are 5'10. But because they look like men. Jim forgets their height.
@@TheTalk23 Guerrero ain't near that
@@chrischar9428 he might be around 5'6.
I remember back then, watching the likes of Carlito and Chris Jericho talking shit against John Cena (Dr. Thuganomics gimmick), and asking myself how the hell these guys would go against someone as huge as Cena.
cena is not as tall as he seems,hes only 1 inch taller than cm punk and theres plenty of photos showing that ...punk is around 5ft11 max...
It's considered small for the sport they're playing. Not compared to non athletes
Jim is 100% right here. It's not height that's the issue. It's the entire presentation. Can the viewer suspend disbelief when the wrestler is onscreen? Do they look like someone that would kick your a** in a bar fight? Do they look like someone that would make you think twice before stepping to them? Braun Strowman may never get 8 stars from Meltzer but the average joe would not want to challenge him in a bar at 2am. It looks absurd when those wrestlers lose to an opponent that is 50-75 pounds lighter, not just in weight but muscularity too. See Lashley vs. Mustafa Ali; Ali just shouldn't be pinning Lashley unless he hits him with a bat or a shovel.
i dont know why these clips need to be uploaded in 4K, but i notice it and i appreciate you
Wouldn't surprise me if UA-cam pushes videos with high resolution. Can't see them putting anything under 1080p on the front page.
I think Jim likes small wrestlers who don't have to pretend to have video game superpowers to win matches.
Yeah. Besides the idea there are such things as invincible Ewoks kind of comes across as silly.
Most small wrestlers nowadays don’t look believable. Most of them look like scrawny high school teenagers
Yep, he always like Rey Mysterio for example.
to many of them look like have never been to a gym ....i sure dont want to see guys the size of tjp and kalisto jump around looking like clowns...
Darby Allen's shit looks good and makes sense because he's LISTENING to Sting.
Rey Mysterio looks like a middleweight compared to todays wrestlers." Size Wise".
Smaller wrestlers are fine when they are very skilled and the promotion isn't full of small guys. Rey Mysterio wouldn't have been nearly as big a star if the WWE had been full of 5'3 wrestlers all doing a similar style but not as well.
You can have one giant or dwarf on the roster not a dozen.
He was becoming a star at WCW, thought he was going to get pushed after he pulled 2 upsets over Kevin Nash. I am not sure why he didn't, they could have ran with the giant killer gimmick.
And Rey isn't a small guy using all the same moves as big guys. He uses his body as a weapon and his moves look high impact. The 619 to Big Show looks just as damaging as Hogan dropping the leg on Andre.
"drink/do drugs i dont know" 😂
Dynamite Kid (as well as Davey "Boy" Smith) was 5'8" not 5'10". One thing I noticed is that Jim seems to actually believe some of the billed heights in wrestling.
Yeah, I was about to type that, Kid qas 5'8", Davey might've been about 5'10"
Even though Davey's listed at 5'11"
Darby is small but he gets the shit beat out of him every match. He usually wins by the skin of his teeth. He works like a small guy.
Still can’t cut a promo
The complete opposite of Orange Cassidy aka Pockets. Almost all his matches look so phoney against big guys like Ethan Page, Hobbs and Wardlow.
@@pleaseshutup7053 it's part of his gimmick, to act all emo and angsty.
@@TheMrAlgoh terrible excuse ever heard of raven?
@@pleaseshutup7053 raven did promos?
Light-Welter-Middle-Cruiser-Heavy, alternatively, Bantam-Feather-Middle-Heavy-Super Heavy. Not saying every promotion can realistically do this, but they should all strive for it.
Jim loves Daniel Bryan. He’s a smaller guy. He’s loved smaller guys like candido etc.
His name is Bryan Danielson, stop calling him by that stupid WWE gimmick name.
"His name is Robert Paulson"
Anybody?
@@ValiantWrestling he is a stupid wrestler who is not believable at all. Also he is known as Daniel Bryan because most of his popularity is due to WWE
@@ValiantWrestling lol I knew this would upset the marks. So I first spelled it daniel Brian and I was like oh I gotta change it, then I was like wait, the marks will love it. And here u are.
Jim is spot on here. 160 pound guys in MMA are believable in the fact that they can beat the hell out of ordinary people. 160 pound guys in AEW look like middle school kids that would get laughed at by ordinary people. MMA has hurt the trampoline comedy clowns more so than anyone else in the business
thats what iv been saying as well,all the tough small guys go to mma or featherweight boxing....they dont want to be pro wrestlers ...
@@jackstraw4222 No doubt. I’m not saying all of these smaller wrestling guys can’t handle themselves. But, does anyone really think Pockets, the Bucks, etc are a threat to people in general. I sure as hell don’t.
160lb guys in MMA are weight cutters coming down from as heavy as 200lbs tbf.
Randy Orton I believe has the best overall look. Could you imagine him coming back w a full beard tho?
We need bald heel Randy back from 2009, who just didn’t give a fuck and was punting everyone and looked like a badass, I was legit scared of him.
Darby allin has charisma? Every time he talks he sounds like he's cruisin on lake havisoma 🤣.
Look at Marty jannetty one of the smaller guys but yet could knock you the hell out, also a former Golden gloves winner
Marty would look huge compared to most pro wrestlers today...
@@danielburger1775 marty jannetty vs Rey mysterio
Thing is wrestling is all about look. You don’t want to watch a guy who you think you could beat up!
Oh, cool .... They call wrestlers under 5'8'' = small. That means Chris Benoit and Eddie Guerrero were not small.
Worst is the way they dress makes them look even smaller and younger. Skinny jeans and hoodies.
Also that indierific zipup vest that EVERYONE wears, think Corbin, Rollins, Theory. Every Indie wrestler who wears one of these looks terrible
Yeah. It makes them look like children
Example: Hook
@@mramos1126 hook is usually in sweatpants or joggers. Skinny jeans are not a thing anymore except for some mid 30s holdouts but same difference. They all dress like they’re going to class.
Eddie Guerrero was 5 feet, 8 inches. He weighed 220ish. But he looked 250-270. Cornette is right. It’s the presentation that matters.
Rey mysterio the goat
Weight Classes. Use them.
Exotic Adrian Street was a great small wrestler. Knew how to get the heat as a heel.
Brian Cage is built like Luger but wrestles like a cosplay trampoline cowboy.
Uncle Corny is just saying what we all thinking. The whole package, that why I use to watch wrestling.
I love that Jim has always respected and loves the GMOAT, Rey Mysterio!
From what I heard Tattoo Face Man is a AAA Baseball player
That's all anybody knows it hilarious
What about Jonathan Gresham? I always found him believable.
Same here
Jim like Gresham too, he always say "short but built like a brick".
I always thought dino bravo was short, but the dude was built like a tank!
Jim is a little lad who loves berries and cream
I'm meeting up with my brothers and sisters tomorrow to have ice creams on the sea front in memoriam of mother, who died a couple of weeks before Christmas. All I can think of is BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM, BLACKCURRANT AND CREAM.
I'm surprised he didn't mention Marko Stunt, he's billed as 5ft 2inches and 117lbs.
hes probably only 4ft10...this guy is a midget..and has no place on wrestling only as a jobber .....
I'm 6'2", 250lbs. I'd tower over the midget wrestlers. lol
Sid Vicious had the best body for a big guy. And imagine if someone like Big Show or Omos were built like Lex Luger when he was in his prime.
The sad thing about Sid (who is my favorite wrestler), is that he never really learned how to sell well. It always looked awkward and stiff. And he hated the politics, was a big gullible, and his heart wasn't in the biz. But man, a good Sid Vicious squash match was a thing of beauty.
Well thinking of boxers the one I'd least want to face is actually one of the shorter heavyweights, no one in their right mind would want to mess with prime Mike Tyson
Buster Douglas?
I think that the look of a guy does matter to some extent, but a great character/personality can make up for a guy not being visually impressive. You just have to make up for any shortcomings in other ways.
I don't know why he continues to shit on Kip Sabian. The guy changed his look when he came back, and it's a *huge* improvement. Before he looked the same as hundreds of other wrestlers, now he looks very unique and different. He stands out. The box thing is stupid, but if they put the guy in a good angle and gave him a chance to shine I think he could be a big breakout star.
I would love to know his thoughts on Dean Malinko.
"Stinko Malenko".
Boring
What about little Spike Dudley?
Spike Dudley's size was a major part of his gimmick.
"She is standing on the apron and can see over the top rope" - Jim Cornette
this is exactly orange Cassidy, i can't believe anything his does , the fact ppl sell his punch.
It's essentially the suspension of disbelief that Jim's talking about. Smaller guys can go, and we all smaller guys who are complete killers. It's about smaller guys coming off as dangerous or able to compete with a guy who's 6'4.
Wrestling should bring back a Junior Heavyweight division.
Let the big guys fight the big guys, and the small guys fight the small guys.
Promote Junior Heavyweight as 'different to' rather than 'worse than' Heavyweight.
Seeing Fin Balor vs a guy like Lashley is absurd, unless it's a complete squash.
U consider Finn Balor Small???
@@theatbfshow7049 Don't you?
Not for nothing but Ivan Putski and Pedro Morales we’re not overly tall but they were built like brick houses and has fire in the ring.
Jonny ‘SameFace’ has Left the Chat …. 👀
Mike Tyson is the best example of what Jim is trying to say.
Joe Frazier as well, who was only like 5'9"
@@bigfatchubbybritboy9445 Nah, Frazier was 5'11'' - 6'0"
Rey Mysterio in ECW was awesome his Matches with Psicosis in 1995 was amazing We went from that To Boring Johnny Gargano he has zero personality I don't get the hype about him the IWC is weird sometimes
What happened to it being 'heavyweight' wrestling? The real problem is that a lot of the guys who are obviously well under 200 pounds are mixing it up with huge guys and we are expected to just accept it. In boxing and mma there are weight divisions, and with good reason. Even the 'smaller' guys back in the day..Shawn Michaels, Bret Hart, Jeff Hardy, at least they could pass as being 200+ pounds, if barely. I love Rey Mysterio, but he was the one who really started the idea of the 150 pounder being in there with heavyweights.
Bret Hart was 6' and definitely a minimum of 230lbs in his heyday. He only seems small in comparison to the massive giants in the WWF, he was a big dude in pretty much any other context and would be a heavyweight in legitimate combat sports. This is part of the power of presentation and narrative, because you never hear Flair being called small and he was shorter than Bret.
Ray is a real short guy compared to the guys he said in this video
I don’t think Jim has this right. Guys don’t have to look like they can kick the shit out of big guys. But they need to accept that in a match vs a big guy they are the underdog and tell an in ring story.
Ex:
Gargano better use his speed and not get caught by Braun or he’s in trouble. Work the match around that.
The problem is they don’t want to use their brains to tell a story, they want to pretend like they’re on equal ground.
The biggest problem with pro-wrestling culture and “smart” marks is that they treat pro-wrestling like it’s a math problem that has set formulas, which completely defeats the purpose and the essence of Pro-Wrestling.
I think you are on to something. There is something to said about Simplicity David and Goliath story will always work. But I think it’s fair to say wwe and aew have failed delivering stories like how they use to and I believe that’s the root of why fans always complain
@@pleaseshutup7053 No, David vs Goliath only works in the long term when David also looks better than the audience. That's why Daniel Bryan as a champion actually lost viewers but Hogan made it a global thing.
Polish Power Ivan Putski! He was one of my favorites
Dynamite kid was never 5ft10!
Jonathan Gresham is a beast.
Idk why they ever got rid of cruiserweight titles. We need one of those now more than ever. Like Darby Allin could really take down Joe. They shouldn't be going at each other. Complete opposite weight classes.
Especially if AEW is keeping up those meaningless fight records. Why pretend to be a serious fight promotion with stats but without weight classes?
@@griffservo8074 right? Like, I love a lot of the smaller guys. It's just when they are up against somebody with 150+ lbs on them it's really hard to suspend disbelief.
I hope Jim doesnt think Lex was 6'6! (Try 6'2 range).
Adam cole is phenomenal shape
Back in the day, a lot of the smaller wrestlers who got over projected size.
What about Rockstar Spud he should be list after he's 5ft 4.
It seems like the big men of wrestling nowadays either stink up every match they're in (Omos) or try to wrestle like they weigh 150 pounds (Luchasaurus)
Ricky Morton was under six feet with a bird chest
So it’s not the size, it’s what you do with it.. 😂 😂
Maurice Mad Dog Vachon was not a tall guy
Rey Mysterio maybe be 5'6 but he is muscular. Pac is 5'8 but is a machine. It's about presentation not size. Another thing worth mentioning. If you are 5'10 you aren't short. That is the average size. Look at mjf,Darby Allen, Ricky stark, Austin theory, Ric flair, Kevin Owens and many more. So I disagree with Jim when he brings up sizes like 5'9 to 5'11. Because you are average height.
"Then there's other wrestlers who are 6'6", 280 lbs, built like Luger and they're still the shits."
Luger, for example.
What small guys these days dont understand is that Spike Dudley was small as hell and skinny but he looked like a misfit and a wild man. He was convincing as an underdog who could claw and bite his way through a match.
Adam Cole looks the size of Spike but acts like he can go toe to toe with a Samoa Joe which is absurd.
Even handsome smaller guys like London and Kendrick were booked strong but wrestled like they were in peril.
Small guys like David vs Goliath should wrestle with peril in mind. Not act like they can do it all because Marvel or DC have convinced fans that everyone can achieve and everyone has to be relatable.
Spike got mauled on more than one occasion.
@@Rodshark75 but it was believable because he was the size of Spike!
Darby Allin is smaller than Johnny Gargano, & Jim speaks higher of Darby in every metric.
Tazz is 5ft 9in and was ECW most badass wrestler.
5"7
Wrestling is a visual medium like movies. The best actors in the world aren't necessarily the ones at the top making the most money. Gary Oldman is one of the best actors of all time but he didn't get to play Batman. In fact he seldom plays leading men in movies. Whereas Hemsworth, Pratt, Rock etc are always front and center for the biggest movies of the year because they have a leading man look and leading man size. Wrestling really needs to go back to this. Guys who look like they could work in Wallmart in the main event is what's destroying wrestling. Being able to work is an important factor but just because you can work doesn't mean you cant get in main event shape and make your stuff more believable.
Eddie guerrero was 5'8 but very believable against brock lesnar
I think Corny is forgetting about Rey....
I think the problem is that the majority of AEW wrestlers fall on the shorter frat boy looking side. Look at Mike Pappas next to Jungle Boy, Cassidy or Adam Cole. It's about looking believable.
all them look like trash,the most boring ordinary looking ,esp that jobber jungle boy ...none of them look like they ever been to a gym....
I do not hate small guys. Look at guys like Shawn, Rey hell even Bret they made it look real. I just hate any wrestler that turns the ring into a circus act Omega, the Young Clucks, and the like. If we still had the territories, they all be kicked out by now.
Also like Jim said all the new wrestlers look like kids,
Is Garganos appearance really so bad tho? I mean I get it he’s small but he’s a talented wrestler, at least he’s not Pockets or Jungle Boy
Bryan Danielson
What is the actual height of Danielson? He seems so tiny.
Brian Danielson is actually 5'10
5'9 tops
No way 5’10” he’s barely above the top rope.
@@theatbfshow7049 he's 5'7
hes no taller than Renee paquette...neither had any height on the other...
Not every wrestler has to look the same as in a 6 foot+ bodybuilder
No, but they should strive to have some sort of appeal and look about them that makes them dangerous.
Don't have to be a 6 foot bodybuilder for that.
Gargano seems like a decent guy but my goodness, I dont care that he was scripted to wrestle clinics in a small NXT arena to die hards, on Raw he seems so goofy and sounds like a guy id see in the retro gaming night at the local cafe or the guy who gives me my ice skates at the rink.
there are smaller guys and there are kids like hook, allin, cassidy and adam cole...
even juventud was more believable than those guys. there was a time when we had cruiserweights, but now they are all the same in the eyes of the bookers and that makes it ridiculous.
another problem is, back in the day smaller guys could actually wrestlie, like malenko, but this isn't the case either nowadays.
Bring back the midgets!
Guess he isn’t a fan of Gator X
Look up some midget matches from Mid-South and I’m not exaggerating in the least when I say those dudes look like they could take on a lot of modern wrestlers in a shoot or at the very least have much better physiques
most of the old school guys would beat these current stars down and out wrestle them...guys like zayn and owens wouldn't stand a chance....
Two words: Jimmy. Jacobs.
Little lord fauntelroy