The #1 Question Viewers WON'T STOP Asking Me
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2024
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#trump #maga #donaldtrump
“Will Vaush ever stop talking about fashion”
No shot.
The fashion segments will continue till morale improves!
Hopefully not
this
Worst Vaush content
I've seen stories of kids sneaking into their parents FB accounts, removing them from hateful right-wing groups, and watching them start to turn around.
That's based af.
This Fucking cults just for taking their parents away from kids deserve the worst.
Imagine being soo Fucking vile you cause kids to have to deprogram their dads and moms
I do that too with my partner when they are in bed, are starting to get sucked into that RW rabbit hole on immigration, anti-China etc.
I swear to god rw bullshit works like the Kraken song in Hotel Transylvania 3. You gotta shut it off first to get anywhere.
That's hilarious. Sad but funny that it would work.
Do you guys remember how Paula Collins said that there should be re education camps for trump supporters and how huge the backlash was against her? After seeing that one clip of a trump supporter praying to donald trump to save him from police I think we all owe her an apology because she was clearly right
Bruh hasan says it all the time
Did you not see the open weeping at the DNC, please tell me the difference.
@@Zetirix The difference? how about the fact that democrats are literally happy with anyone who becomes the nominee. Do you see any diehard biden fans who wouldn’t vote for kamala out of loyalty to him? meanwhile the republican party has become the trump party and cannot survive without trump.
@@Zetirix conservative doesnt know what emotion is and compares it to the act of worshiping a living human as a deity
@@Zetirixaverage republican seeing empathy for the first time in his life
Fake propoganda video title. The #1 question is "can we get another okbv stream?"
Maybe November?
Don't translate...😠
भवतः हृदयस्य धड़कनं कतिपयेषु घण्टेषु स्थगयिष्यति, अस्य शापस्य मुक्तिं प्राप्तुं एकमात्रं मार्गं मम चैनलस्य सदस्यतां कुर्वन्तु……. ..
This is actually how we change conservative minds
The #1 question is why he enjoys carroon child explicit content, and why you guys defend him enjoying that content
@@Tragick_Sinnah, that’s, like, the tenth thing people ask him
For years, my father insisted I try to get along with my increasingly right-wing brother, despite his regular racist comments, because of the importance of family. Once he started listening to Alex Jones, though, he quickly became so bad that even my dad cut off contact with him. He moved out of state and only my mother, who lives on the other side of the country, would still talk to him. She gave up after he tried using the Bible to justify one of his bigoted beliefs and refused to listen when her husband, a pastor, explained why he was misinterpreting what verse it was he used.
That's so sad😢
Yeah, engaging him on a religious level probably wasn't the play.
@@zacheryeckard3051 What's funny is that the religion thing was part of his slide into the cult. One day he was saying edgelord crap like "all Christians are stupid" and a week later he was going on about how Christians are the most persecuted group in the country.
Your brother is dead, that person is not the person you grew up with. Trump killed him.
The problem with these damaging beliefs is that they are all so tangled together. Pull the racist string and it creates a knot on the religion string. Pull the Trump string and it tangles the homophobia string. Extricating one aspect means detangling all of it. Talk to anyone who has deconstructed out of an extreme religious cult. It's a years long process and it has to be self directed. I'm really sorry that has happened with your brother.
As someone who served a Mormon mission and has been deconstructing Mormonism for years, there is a ridiculous amount of truth to what Vaush is saying here.
I didn't go on a mission but while getting out at 17 the things I said to people were so cultish. I got upset at people drinking a single beer! I stood out for years as a former cultist. It's been 14 years since then I'm mostly ok now. The way missionaries talked at sacrament the "glad to be back" and overwhelming love and praise from the welcome party, they know exactly what they're doing.
Wait until people hear about doing baptism for the dead.
Yeah. I served an lds mission in africa before becoming atheist, and my parents remind me alot of what vaush is describing.
Where'd you serve?
@yelloweyeball the fact you get baptized at 8 as if that is the age of informed consent. So gross. Learn a lot about social conditioning growing up and leaving Mormonism
Good for you for deconstructing :)
The "send you out so you can return to the congregation for trauma bonding, it retains you!" That's absolutely and exactly how that works.
Fox is a group hug for all of those persecuted Christians in America.
If we're wrong, why did the effete, pampered rich boy look so sad and wounded as if he witnessed a hundred puppies being kicked?!@@brentwalker8596
Chexmix libtread!
So, what I'm getting is, treat the poor hapless victims of cults (JW, Mormons, lots of Evangelicals and Baptists and so on) as real people, but the leaders do not need any such consideration.
@@FelisImpurrator exactly. I don't remember a single rude person from my Mormon mission. The people who were kind but clearly pointed out their problems with religion? I remember their faces and names. Be kind. Most of these guys are just kids. 18-20 yrs old.
@@davidchidester5463 Also known as victims of literal institutional grooming.
James Randi had a quote that I think about weekly; “You can’t reason someone out of something that they didn’t reason themselves into.”
Yep. People in the UK, mostly England who still stand by Brexit argue they did their own research before voting to leave but we know they didn’t. We know they were brainwashed by Cambridge Analytica who stole their data & targeted them with pro-leave ads based on their political leanings. So if you’re right with you were targeted with anti-immigration ads & if you were left wing you were targeted with workers rights or environmental ads all leaning with pro leave arguments.
Brexit is a cult because it began with “we will be richer & better off outside the EU” but now it’s just blatant “I don’t care about being rich. We still did the right thing”
The insane thing with Brexit is all the benefits of it have been stripped away. There’s no more salvation or reward in view for being in the cult. The cult is just pure “I took part in it & voted cor the winning side”
reminds of the convid crisis. it was a mass hypnosis and there are still tons of socks & slippers types still wearing masks scared. there is no reaching them. they bask and bathe in fear
Randi was quoting Jonathan Swift.
@@pansepot1490 James Randi was still cooler than Jonathan Swift, but I will admit that eating babies strangely seems to be a better fit for Randi than Swift. It's just such a logical resolution.
I did not expect to find a James Randi quote here , not sure why you have the Trump as God emperor for your icon though. He never did have to pay out that million to any charlatan man was a gift to humanity for disproving bullshit sadly his lessons were lost on the generation he spoke the most to.
"the average american isnt going to sit down for explanation on how highways have done harm to rural america" Cars is a 2006 American animated film...
“Going off of vibes” is right. It’s all about identity. It’s all about where you feel most comfortable. That’s how people vote.
To be fair vibes are how all people work, not logic. Logically there is no such thing as better choice or good or bad, it’s based on emotion.
@@Darkloid21 there is logically a better choice
What the fuck is this comment thread
That’s how advertisers sells us stuff.
@@Darkloid21you’re thinking of starting axioms/frameworks. After that groundwork is already set there absolutely are logical processes and choices that are logically consistent or not with those axioms
MtF here. My dad cut me off when I came out 15 years ago, and I actually left and just lived my life as a woman. 2 weeks ago, he called me asking me why I don't call and visit him more. I said, "You know why that is," and he just said "Okay."
In his brain he's blaming it on you. Don't let him manipulate or gaslight you.
Did he leave or did you leave? From this phrase it's a little confusing.
"My dad cut me off when I came out 15 years ago, and I actually left..."
@@Cashboys He told me "Cut the girly shit, or I'll cut you off," and then when I changed my name, he told me I hadn't listened, so he was cutting me off financially. In response, I moved away and stopped visiting or speaking to him, thereby cutting him off the rest of the way. Being poor seriously delayed my medical transition, but at least I was around people who accepted me.
Oh, now he’s feeling bad that his child doesn’t want to talk to him anymore? Well that’s too bad for him, he should have been a better, more accepting father.
@@mr.j3rs3y I don't think this post is the best way to move it forward. They would just interpret your post as bad intent, rather than good intent - which is the opposite of what we want for them.
That bit about the oppositional part of cults is very true.
Cult conditioning involves making someone feel like there is nothing for them outside of the cult, that they won't find acceptance outside of it, only the cult has a place for you.
There are people out there who won't find acceptance because there is no safe way for them to open up. We need societal change to make people not fall into cults.
When you cut a cult member out of your circle, *don't forget to let them know that you will still be there to welcome them back if they ever choose to leave.* If people know they have a support system available to return to, they are more likely to take the chance of getting out.
I know a woman whose sister is hyper-religious and raised her children to her way, and the woman I know made a point to have a good relationship with those kids so that if they chose to get out of that life, they had a place they could go that would support them until they got on their feet. Two of the three accepted her support and are now both doing quite well in life.
I’m a bigot to trump supporters due to exposure.
Go to therapy
@jacob_massengale NEVER :v
@@jacob_massengale I don’t need to. I watched Jordan Peterson videos and he is a therapist.
That is evidence alone that it's rational hatred and not bigotry.
@@barrywhite1770 lol
I think about a quote someone said often. "You can't logic someone out of a position that they didn't logic themselves into", or something like that.
“You cannot reason a person out of a position he did not reason himself into in the first place.” Jonathan Swift
Yeah, it’s quoted often in relation to cults and frankly anything people believe without good reason.
@@pansepot1490 Thank you that was it
This is unfortunately something i experienced as well. My father was all in for the Trump cult the second Trump became a political figure. I first became politically literate around the 2020 election, particularly when January 6th happened. As it happened live, he was cheering the rioters on, ecstatic that they were "speaking their mind." Two weeks later he was denouncing it, calling it a false flag from the FBI. Another two weeks pass, he's back to defending it. These people are too far gone to care about reality. They have a pre-determined belief (in this case, "Biden bad") and change their version of reality on a whim to fit that narrative. It doesn't matter how far-fetched, incoherent or hypocritical their "logic" is, so long as it affirms their worldview.
“My feelings don’t care about facts.”
I'm sorry you lost your father to this. My folks are more so median voters with my dad leaning to the right due to religious reasons. I'll always remember the day of the 2016 election when I came home to both of them wearing MAGA hats and asking if I voted yet. I just turned 18 this year and didn't know much about politics. I didn't think too much of it at first, but something about their demeanor was very off and although I didn't see it then, they completely bought into cult mentality.
My dad was in the hospital when he saw Jan 6 happen and watched the whole thing live on TV. He told me from that point that he's never voting for him again. Idk if he'll vote for Harris but I'm sure his wife (re-married, and not my stepmom) is with me on this that she'll be voting for Harris as well. Hopefully we can move him over and my mom is voting for Harris as well because as she says and has finally realized "Trump is a nasty man"
I became politically literate once the murder of George Floyd happened and would like to think at least an amount of my rhetoric and explaining of values/beliefs have helped to move my parents away from the Trump cult. But it wasn't just me, and it can't just be you. It has to be the environment and the other people. They both remarried more left-leaning people after their divorce and I'm suer that has a lot to do with it as well.
I agree with Vaush very much that many of these people are too far gone. My point however is that although your dad is clearly bought into the cult (and again I'm truly sorry for that), there may still be hope for them but it isn't you that can save them. They have to do that themselves. Maybe going no contact would be a good start but if that wouldn't be conducive to your relationship then I would say all you can do is try to calmly explain your points when he engages. If he's as bought in as you say though, there may be no more relationship with him.
I sincerely hope you and your father can mend this and he gets out of his cult mentality. Just please understand that it's not your job or your place to stress over it because he can only ultimately make that decision on his own.
I wish you much luck.
🖤
Hey your dad is channeling my Moms energy , she was also abusive when i was a child and has never cared about reality just making everyone think what she thinks. I dont have any contact with her anymore. I hope your doing well.
@@CAVFIFTEENIsn’t the person your father remarried by definition your stepmom?
“They go off of vibes.” This is so true and you can see it reflected in how frequently and lazily Trump lies in his speeches and interviews. It should be almost effortless to convince his supporters differently about him if they weren’t in a cult.
Animals go off vibes. The only thing separating us from them is reason.
Yeah it's entirely off of vibes and the reason why Trump has this broad appeal to people of different backgrounds is that he is essentially a blank canvass for any specific individual to project themselves onto. Because he doesn't believe in anything, that makes him more malleable to the minds of his cult followers
@@hugegamer5988Nope. We go off vibes too, we just justify it with reason. It was Hume who said reason is a slave to the passions.
We’re animals too you know.
If you watch a lot of animal videos you realize that animals reason too and we are not all that different. Ofc they can’t do algebra but so can’t a lot humans. 😅
@@Darkloid21 maybe the royal we, I have multiple engineering degrees and have struggled to understand vibes my whole life. If you read the comment I wrote it’s that rationality is what separates us, we don’t only run on vibes or you would be gunting in my proximity and not digitizing your thoughts then sending them at near light speed to someone half way round the world. You’re not understanding what words mean, and are arguing against something you just invented.
I can attest to the exposure thing Voosh mentions. I grew up in a WI rural community with only a handful of POC and despite my political view being genuinely left leaning, I was a closet racist and anti-LGBTQ. It wasn't until I moved to the Twin Cities and had a few too many embracing moments that I finally loosened up. It also didn't help that my relatives were openly racist, a lot of their rhetoric rubbed off onto me.
My mom has been a lot better since she moved and had a neighbor that was an old black lady who kept asking her for rides to church and my mom, a racist, ended up attending a black church for a while and kept calling me to tell me that they're such nice people, still kinda racist but my mom used to use hard Rs. She hasn't done that in years now.
Her neighbor is a genius 😍 asking for a favor is a proven way to get someone to like you!
I read Naomi Klein's book DOPPLEGANGLAND earlier this year (great book, scarily prescient in a lot of ways), and in listening to an interview she did for the book, she had a quote that's stuck with me and I've thought a lot about, with regards to the left-right divide and the MAGA cult: "A lot of times, people will get their feelings right, but the facts wrong." Like... yes, be pissed. You should be pissed. But you're pissed at the wrong people, for the wrong reasons.
Yep. While people are dumb, they are not completely stupid. They know something is wrong and they're mad, and they get angrier when they realize they're too dumb to know why. Its a vicious cycle
this is what i always tell people i talk to politically: "get mad at the right things"
Yes. This is what conspiracism and fascism thrive on. People who are smart enough to see that things are not being run in the interests of ordinary people, and want to understand why, but aren’t sophisticated enough to do the work to try and understand real political-economic-social systems.
This is so true. I have a friend online, who means well, but holy hell his political instincts are just all over the place and don't make any sense most of the time.
"A lot of times, people will get their feelings right, but the facts wrong." This is also at the heart of a lot of the work that hbomb and Dan Olsen have done.
I grew up in a majority white 3rd-ring suburb, white family, white friends, vast majority of peers were white. White co-workers, white customers. After High School, I spent a few years in non-union labor, again pretty much all white. I discovered conservative radio at lunch looking for a talk station one day and quickly fell into conservative thinking and stayed that way until I became a college student and started to meet more people, then gradually I got more liberal on certain things until I moved to the city and transferred to state university. The more diverse people I met and inequality I encountered. The more liberal I became. I went from studying to be a cop, to studying to be a psychologist, the to studying to be a social worker.
When you talk about cultists acclimating themselves to rejection, I couldn't help but think of the PUA's who tell their marks to "cold approach" innumerable women, using their off-putting, creepy ice breakers.
These men never succeed and continue their inexorable slide down the slippery slope to abject gynophobia.
you're so right
Gynophobia is a funny word kinda
"I am straight, but that thing...[female private parts]....that thing scares me" lol
Those men do succeed.
@@ngotemna8875 Many men seem to freak out over vaginas so...
@@annaclarafenyo8185they dont. 1 in 100 at absolute best. Those are some lousy results. Getting good at dating and hookups requires a basic level understanding of women as human that hookup gurus lack
Best thing I ever did was cut ties with my extended family who never accepted me for being gay. Even losing out on inheritance from my grandmother was well worth getting away from them, and finding making my own family. A few of my cousins have reached out to me over the years and apologized for not standing up for me, but my aunts and uncles have only grown more hateful over the last decade, from what I gather.
Christians:We love you, we just hate the sin
Also christians:
The most frustrating part for me is that every trump supporter I know doesn't even seem to believe that he isn't lying nonstop, they just act like everyone does it. When I point out that he just completely made up some bullshit out of nowhere, the response is always "yeah but Biden does it too". How the fuck are you supposed to argue with someone that will openly admit that the claims from the people they support are lies, but then still believe them? I legitimately couldn't fathom this level of brain rot just a couple years ago
I have a work colleague and this is his approach
"They all lie"
He is either unwilling or unable to differentiate from a mis statement or embellishment and outright utter bullshit.
It's the same thing with Trumps crimes "they're all criminals"
I try to give an example "yes but you can't look at someone who Jay walked and another person who committed first degree murder and say that there's no difference between the two because they both broke the law"
When someone does that, I would say, "Can you give me a few examples?" Then actually listen and interject with more. Sure, mostly every politician does tell white lies in one way or another, but what Trump does is on a hellish other level where every time he opens his mouth a lie comes out. I mean, it's super obvious and if you can't admit that, you're not living in the real world.
The rightwingers have almost universally gone fully insane. Like you said, nobody who's like that Is even cappable of holding any kind of normal talk.
I saw the shift happen with whattifaltist, like yeah offcourse he was always fucked but goddamnit he went off the roockers; I had unnoticedly gone into the rabbitthole during COVID and was following some rightwingers but not the main ones just the ones adjacent to my interests, and I had taken a liking to whattifaltist insane dives. Then I springed back towards the left about at the Time I found vaush who Made a video of whattifaltist who i had stopped watching for no particular reasson and I saw how insane he had gotten, I watched a few of his videos after that as a White noise but after a while he just became Fucking unwatchable. Like dude didnt just flatly lied like that before, he now literally just says incoherent shitt that nobody sane would take
As an ex-jw there are SO many similarities between jws, Mormons and trump supporters I swear to God. Almost like I've been studying to understand their logo my whole life ahhahah
lol
I know. I’ve never been JW but I have watched a ton of videos by former JWs, and other ex cultists. They all operate on the same mechanisms.
JWs are like Trump supporters?
How so?
I can never be rude to Jehovah's Witnesses no matter how tired or irate I may be. They are always so polite and nice. I just hear them out and wish them well and then they never follow up because I tell them I'm trans and I guess that means I'm going to burn in hell or something.
As a previous JW myself, it could be that their doctrine can cover literally EVERYTHING else other than trans people, so when you say it, they don't know what to do. Also, they don't believe in Hell like most Christian sects, they believe when you die, that's it, you "fall asleep" in death.
I always figure they don't want to be bothering me any more than I want to be talking to them. Just nod and agree, let them do their spiel, and send them on their way. I assumed that's what everyone did.
That's so nice actually wow. If I ever loose my mind enough to become religious again maybe I'll check them out
At some point they have to self realize how weird it is to spend so much of their life complaining about trans people
I don't think they ever will. Segregationists in rural Alabama like my grandparents stayed racist until the day they died, it just became less okay to say the N word in public.
Transphobia is a mental illness. I've never seen so many people obsess over other peoples parts besides transphobes.
@katyungodly In my personal opinion the only way some will change is through social ostracism. And even then so many will refuse because of their pride.
I saw a quote from an interview with Gramham Lineham where he was basically like "if I changed my mind about this now it would mean I've wasted so much of my life on something awful"
I had an uncle who we had to cut off because he became a loonie after moving to Florida. He fell for the propaganda and became a totally different person. Sadly, while he was cut off from us, he passed away. I know we made the right choice at the time, but I still feel bad sometimes. I hope someday the G.O.P is held liable for every family member they've taken from people.
I tried fixing (sounds harsh, but it's true) 2 people in my school that were adjacent to my friend group. It wore me out so much and one day, I just snapped and broke all contacts. One of my best, but also hardest decisions I've ever made. To me, it was like throwing a project I've worked on for 2 years into the trash. You normally can't save people. Obviously, family is a lot harder to get rid off, especially since family is an incredible priviledge, so only try it when you're certain that you can manage without. It was their choice to lose you, not your choice to lose them.
My father, who voted for trump in 2016 and 2020, had a stroke earlier this year (he’s mostly recovered!) and I think it changed his brain cos he’s fully for Kamala and it’s an incredible 180
The anti fetterman. The unfettered man.
Evil fetterman strikes again
Did it have anything to do with having personal experience of the medical system?
@@YourXavier interesting thought…I remember my Trump loving mom saying she actually enjoyed being in the hospital because it was the first time in her life she was doted on, asked if she needed anything, they brought her meals, were kind to her, she felt taken care of.
There was a short time a long time ago I watched Mr Repzion, before all he ended up just doing UA-cam drama videos, and the same thing happened to his dad too.
Exjw survivor here! Yep he's exactly right, dealing with right wing cultists is exactly the same as dealing with religious cult folk. It's impossible to reason them out of it, you could show them inarguable proof you're right and they will find ways of rejecting it, especially via rejecting you.
And yep, door to door preaching is exactly like that. If you're wondering it's about 10'000 hours of door knocking per convert - definitely not worth the effort if that's what it was all about. The only true growth comes from us unfortunate born-ins, and they need to retain as many as possible.
I guess thats why they keep complaining about "groomers" and corrupting children. Conservatism would be destroyed in a single generation if you disrupted the little cycle they got going there.
I've had to let go, all I have left in my entire extended family is my mom. Everything my family talks about is untrue and alternate reality stuff, and very hostile. Vaush is 100% right on about rural life. Also you can be estranged from family for 15/20 years or more and still reconnect. It's possible.
I still stay in contact, and I never mention politics. They constantly bring it up unprompted! It’s all fantasies and phantasms. They live with wildly irrational fears and in a world of make-believe.
@@jamesmackey1238even then they’re the ones bringing that stuff up
A family friend I was drinking with said that soros was gonna flip a switch to activate undocumented migrants to take over the country. Like they’re all sleeper agents. These people are deeply unwell.
@@ernestoacosta7918 I hate this soooooo much.
I am German and this year we hosted the football European Cup.
An aquaintance (friend of a friend) brought up that you can finally be proud of germany again, show the flag and the yada yada.
I mentioned that i disliked that the UEFA, a private company, gets massive amounts of taxpayer's money to finance this.
Even though it's a multibillion dollar profit event for them.
Germany had to pay 650 million euros for all of this and i don't think that's fair considering our crumbling infrastructure.
"You just hate Germany and want to see it fail" he screamed at me at the end.
Rightwingers coopting patriotism while it's them who hate everything this country stands for is so infuriating.
I love my country,see its potential and want to make it better so that my fellow Germans can live happier lives! They just want to kick out immigrants. That's not patriotism at all!
Sorry for the rant
I grew in a fundamental christian church. We had to knock on doors as a young female teenager. I never had anyone be mean when they answered the door. I think it was because of my age. Looking back I'm glad I always partnered with my only friend (guy). Pairs of young girls alone at strangers doors...who probably wouldn't tell anyone if some happened because of purity culture...
(it's your fault because your shirt was too tight etc etc, which is also insulting to men like they can't help but be a predator if clothes are tight etc)
That's horrible .I hate religion for what it does to women...
You have to admit dressing appropriately lowers the lust value considerably - even though men should have self control in any case.
Consider this. Which woman would they lust after more - a woman who dresses inappropriately or one who dresses decent?
@@Cashboys Prefacing it by tacking on the "men should have self control" doesnt make you sound any less rapey when you're still trying to argue about how a woman's way of dress is more or less likely to see them assaulted. Doesnt matter how a woman is dressed if a man is looking to assault them they could be dressed in the most unflattering atire it wont make a difference. Like cmon if a sitcom from the 70's was able to understand how a woman looks or dresses doesnt make a difference then why don't you?
@@Cashboys This is factually wrong.
I implore you to look up the "What were you wearing"-Exhibit by the Dovecenter.
A gr@pist will do that regardless of your choice of clothing.
@@ngotemna8875 Intimacy also plays a lust-factor role. In all of the examples - except 3 that were actually kids - it seems a man and a woman were alone together without being married.
When I have children I'll teach them to not be alone with the opposite gender. They may think it's bad at first, but will eventually thank me in the future.
Its hard to get people out if a cult. Mostly you can't.
Sometimes they figure it out on their own.
Absolutely nothing I ever said made a lick of difference when talking politics with my father. He woyld consistently be cornered by knowing nothing about any subject but it didn't matter. I don't know what Trump eventually did to embarass him, but he finally stopped supporting trump. (I have a feeli g it was the racism that finally hit a point of no denial) We shall see what the future looks like but yes, emotions are why he supported the GOP and it's why he stopped.
But there are also Haley voters still in the GOP. They aren't yet part of Trump's cult but still aren't ready to burn their Republican team jersey, so to speak.
Cult... lol. Says the people who fell for double masks, blm, defund the police, and open borders. Hahahhahha
Yeah, I had a hard time telling my libs buddies that blm was a scam. That defund the police would never work. That open borders will lead to a disaster. That the jabs didn't stop the spread.
Can't get them outta the cult
I was raised a Jehovah's Witness and most of my family still is, I didn't realize just how much of a cult it is until long after I "fell away." While it is one of the least destructive cults (in terms of real-world effect and lack of Waco Texas moments), I find it to be one of the most insidious. Honestly it is one of the most intelligently crafted cults I have ever seen, and having witnessed it (pun intended) first hand, it's quite spooky. They give you just enough freedom to make you think it's not a cult, all while still engaging in most of the aspects commonly found in other cults.
I don't wanna be associated with anyone voting for him at this point, i just don't respect them anymore, i don't need them in my life, i deserve better
Based
That's the spirit! There are plenty of people out there who are nice to you and want to be friends with you. You just gotta find em. The only person forcing you to suffer existence with hateful people is yourself.
This is the way. I didn't cut contact with my maga family but I don't want to hear their shit. They've been shitty to me for a decade before Trump hit the stage and stopped arguing politics with me because "I always have an answer to everything" to which I agreed.
There's nothing wrong with demanding a standard of decency with people you want to be cordial with.
It's remarkable too because one of the most common things you see on the right, even still, is this notion that the right uses logic and the left uses emotion.
They can't both be true though. One has to be correct.
It's up to individuals to find the objective truth for themselves.
Neither side is based in reason. Both are grounded in distinct value systems. We derive values from preferences, not reason.
@@lucyferos205 That is incorrect. The left political positions are based on reason, the right political positions are based on emotion.
Oh its sort of true on both sides.
Left uses emotion/logic to do good shit, gets pissed about evil shit. Right uses emotion/logic to do evil shit, gets pissed when evil shit is resisted. You never see a nazi leader stirring supporters up into a blood frenzy to build houses and implement social welfare, you know?
@@lucyferos205 except the average right-leaning persons moral ("value") system is internally incoherent, ie useless for any sort of critical thinking since it can be used to justify anything.
You can forget the logistics of mass deportations. The social unrest alone would destroy the economy for decades if not for good.
I keep asking "you don't think ICE isn't just going to black bag any Hispanic or brown person they want?". Vance said explicitly 25 million people "who should have been deported"
@@calebharris292 There'd be street violence en masse. Then martial law.
Putin and Xi would see that as a feature not a bug
@@Teeveepicksuresmartial law? I doubt that would go the way they think. Everything burns
Yeah, agricultural companies who make around $12B a year would have to actually pay workers more than $1-$4 a day... oh no...
I'll never forget talking with a co-worker (we were cashiers) back in 2019-2020. I said, "you realize you're in a cult, right?"
And I swear to god he said "I kinda like the idea of being in a cult."
Had to just give up there
Regarding the "radicalized racism" part. I think the funniest thing I ever saw was when I mentioned that a lot of Hiberno-English Vernacular is shared with AAVE/Ebonics. They were trying to say Ebonics is a Bastardized version kf the language and then I got to remind them(in all my autistic glory) that they share a lot with Hiberno-Englush dialects and vernacular because of how closely the Irish immigrants and freed slaves worked along side one another. Also how that lasted for decades till the early 1900s. Their brains melted.
Can you share any sources on this? I'd love to learn more
“In all my autistic glory,” 😂😂😂 Love that.
@@nightbringar7558 there’s a lot of excellent channels by linguists on UA-cam. That’s how I learned that AAVE even exists (I am not American). Sorry I can’t be more specific but I am sure that if you search UA-cam with the appropriate keywords and go on from there you’ll find way to learn more.
@nightbringar7558 I can definitely look through my old linguistics files and check. I don't have them at this exact moment. But if you want just a couple of simple examples off the top of my head, look up "Habitual Present Tense, AAVE and Hiberno-English"
It's the most commonly referred to "error" in English grammar, i.e. "He be workin' " which is actually not incorrect, but it isn't based on standard English vernacular. It's a very specific tense of speech that signals the consistent or repetitive (habitual) action that someone is taking, broadly or specific, over a long period of time(such as going to work the same day, or engaging in behaviors that they are well known for). It's a meshing of the present "to do" and "to be" verb tenses. On Hiberno-English, it would sound like "he do be workin" but in AAVE it would be that as well as "he be workin' ," depending in region.
It's absolutely fascinating and also shines a light on how cultures share and cross over in interesting ways. The tense itself comes from Geailge(Irish) the language. As it's one of the more complex European languages. Not too dissimilar from the complexity of Indigenous American languages. Diné and Geailge have a lot of grammatical parallels even though they are completely different languages. It is really worth a look.
Hope this helps!
@pansepot1490 cripes... for some reason my comment responding to sources got deleted :( it didn't have any links in it so I dunno. UA-cam is weird.
The "exposure to others in college" bit is 100% true. Grew up in a hyper-conservative religious family in the South. Never encountered a gay person at any more than a glance. Ended up being assigned a gay roommate in the college dorm. Completely changed my view on gay people, how mistreated they were, and helped open up my perspective on many other issues as a result.
Did have a somewhat "libertarian" stint for a few years in the mid-to-late 2000s right out of college due to the personal connection disconnect that occurred right after college, but grew out of that after started dating the person who I later married.
Yeah I was deep in the Christian cult but I made a friend who challenged me on the gay issue and I had no answer other than "the Bible says so", which obviously isn't very convincing.
If you aren't sure whether to cut friends off who you are abusive or say things you find gross, then get better at making friends. I dropped some of my friends who went RW conspiracy minded after years of trying to argue them out of it and appeal to their better instincts. It's draining to have that kind of relationship. It sucks to cut people off, but better people exist and you can find them. Keep making new acquaintances with people like you and you won't have to choose between a social support network and being around people who say and do things you find abhorrent.
I lost my brother to conservative ideology. After Biden got elected, he started spiraling further into fascist rhetoric. He started accusing anyone who disagreed with him as being a communist degenerate. Eventually, he had a mental breakdown and blocked literally everyone out of his life. He has a wife and a daughter, and I haven’t spoken to them in over a year. I miss my brother and my niece so much, it hurts. The greatest pain of my life since my father passed away when I was only nine years old.
Sorry to hear that man. I can relate a little since I had a simular experience with the friend group I had since I was 6. I miss them a lot even though they got messed up. Hope you're doing ok.
My brother says he wants him in so he can’t run again, so someone out there is still making excuses
I'm sorry but that's some of the dumbest sht I've heard. I'm sure you know. You want to know how you keep him from running again? Vote against him, and vote for those who will convict him...
You know what else would keep him from running? Dying of old age and not holding office again
@@okapifarms9698 Imagine he gets elected and THEN dies. .... JD Vance, President of the United States of America. **laughs in Peter Thiel**
Before Rome became a dictatorship, by law you had to wait 10 years after being consul (like president) before you could take office again. To begin with, this law was followed. By the end, there were people serving 5 consecutive terms even though the law was still on the books. Putin is attempting to do something similar in Russia.
If Trump was willing to blatantly steal classified information and share it with foreign adversaries, why wouldn't he try to find a way around the 2 term limit??
@@abaddon2148The take is dumb, but there is some nuance in there. Who do conservatives have after Trump’s second term? I feel like after Trump, Republicans will struggle HEAVILY to win any future elections.
You're right, because back then u had both hardcore right wing nutters but also centrists, frustrated fencesitters and memers. Trump was the most hilarious joke of a candidate and imagine how hilarious it would be if he were to win? Come 2nd election the memers are gone because the joke is already too old to be funny, so he lost, and then after jan6 i'm guessing a HUGE part of centrists fell off because trump acts like a sore loser and is cringe when he's losing. Most people who aren't married to either right or left are willing to debate either actually consider their position or even if as entertainment, but whoever is left now behind trump is just a forevertrumper at this point probably and those are the cultists that are afraid to think for themselves.
14:25 this. This is exactly what convinced me to cut my family off once I've moved out and to stop trying to salvage our relationship. I deserve better? Maybe, but I'm a mentally ill cripple who was raised to devalue myself and to serve others as a way of accepting love, I sure as shit ain't cutting them out because "I deserve better." Even though it's 100% true, that doesn't mean I accept it.
But I refuse to reward the people who made me this broken mess. You don't get those happy twilight years when you mess up this badly.
"You can't control someone's heart."
"You can with a little something I call a, Deep Cycle Marine Battery."
I cast repeated and prolonged electrical shock
Yes, or LSD
My mother was sort of 'on the fence' for years. She hated Trump but was a 'lifelong republican', despite having a lot of liberal leanings. It was just how she was raised. However once she got around people who shared her more liberal beliefs, she started changing more and more. She's still a 'centrist' for the most part, but votes blue.
But see, I knew of the older women she befriended before she did. They literally started a leftist group in our small town, and she's listening to them more and more. Love my mom.
This resonates too much right now. My mom said some stupid shit, just very basic ignorant racist things. I talked to her about it in as patient a way as possible and she had a melt down at the very idea that she could have done something racist. I wasted a month trying to figure out how to talk to her, only to learn she'd entirely given up talking until I apologized for saying she did a racist thing. It hurt, but I've been so much happier and less stressed once I realized her being stupid and having access to me is a her problem.
I was cheering for Trump in 2016. I’ll never forget the silence next day going to class, you could hear a pin drop.
But over the years ive come to regret him. Everybody is so bonkers now, and its all because Trump forever raising the temperature.
Vaush is fckn right, man. Trump is like Jesus Christ to his supporters, and its so fckn weird.
I believe that some people can still be reasoned with, you just have to find an individual way to speak to their concerns.
My sister is very 'science-pilled' for example and was quite unaccepting of trans people, convinced it was a mental illness etc. The studies regarding the brain-phenotype/makeup of people that identify as trans really helped to make her reconsider the issue.
For others, especially on issues like ukraine or immigration it helps to break down the 'problem' step by step and try to speak more to individual concerns or issues rather than the overall thing (imagine talking to a toddler)
Ofc this is limited to ppl who aren't in a cult, but even with those it might be possible to find issues where they are more reasonable on and start from there.
Yup, everyone is different and come out of cults for different reasons.
When someone thinks they're being logical but just hasn't actually looked into it you can definitely still get through to them, I started going down the alt-right rabbit hole when athiest youtube started to turn into anti-sjw youtube, because I thought I was being logical getting information from people who had presented actual logical arguments deconstructing bad religious arguments, but they weren't being logical about that stuff and weren't giving the full picture. When Trump and Brexit happened I finally snapped out of it, and as I've learned more and more I've only ever moved further to the left. For people like me simply being educated works, unfortunately I'm not sure there are many people like that left in the right, I think almost all of them have already been scared off at this point
You can't reason with republicans. If you could, there would be no republicans.
These people have been in Trump's pocket since 2015, a few people have broken away, but the only way they can break the Trump cult of personality is to see Trump for the Conartist he really is on their own.
Usually only happens when they are the ones to get turned on.
I’ve seen a few people snap out. I helped snap my dad out and since my mom just did what he said politically I got a twofer. He just realized while watching a speech that the man was a moron ( dad used the r slur but it was progress) . I jumped in immediately with facts and shared values that the Republicans professed but didn’t vote for and pulled him all the way out in a few weeks ( well after I stopped laughing, he said it with such disgust in his voice i was rolling on the floor) . One of the things is my parents liked to feel morally and intellectually superior so I made sure they felt supporting the good side was where they understood we stood. You have to be ready to pounce! You have to cut in if they backslide. You have to get them onto good sources of info and feed their ego. Introduce them to one of the news source apps that rates each one by how left, right or center it is. This feeds the need to be conspiratorial while feeding them the correct info.
@@puppybasket3906 Mad Props for breaking the hold Trump had over him. When I talk to Trump Supporters using facts, the facts just go in one ear & out the other.
@@user-em6ie2be7x he’s gained more people since 2015. A friend of mines hated Trump now voting for him this time around
Well, the Democrats could've put up a better argument than Harris peddling communism. I'm independent center-right, and I *personally* don't like him, but Harris literally said, that your merits to succeed in the world don't matter to her and her ideology. In so that everyone should end up at the same place. I earned on my merits more than the median income in 2023 for the country... how is that supposed to make me feel?
The worst part about Trumpian politics is that it brought all of the worst aspects of people out. I ended up losing a relationship in 2016 because my then girlfriend and her father were Trump supporters. I didn't realize they were bigoted racists before because I'm a straight white guy. Probably still a good thing it ended when it did though.
We're so far past the "persuade them with logic" phase with his supporters. Those who can be swayed by logic already have been, and as we saw at the DNC with the multitude of former Republican politicians and strategists supporting Harris, those people have cut ties. We've moved on to the next phase of "goad them out with ridicule," so those who support Trump for clout and social acceptance (rather than logical reasoning) realize they're not being feared and respected, but laughed at and called weird.
Next two phases are going to be 3) "abandon them in loneliness," where we give up helping them but also don't care because the following is too small for anyone in it to have any influence or social significance, resulting in their social needs overcoming their needs to stick to a terrible ideology. And finally 4) "let 'em die off in misery," where his final few fleeting followers are too few and disconnected to have any meaningful interactions with anyone, and their remains are identified by an estranged nephew after their neighbors complain about a smell from her studio apartment that has been getting worse over the last 3 months.
I'm not sure social ostracisation will work, as many conservative families are fine ignoring bigotry and weirdness. My grandfather would say the N word and my family kind of just cringed and laughed it off like "oh there goes pawpaw being racist again, how silly is he?" and then he died being remembered as a kind and good person because he was still kind to all the other racist white people in our community. It was really strange to me.
I recently let go. He had been my friend on and off for 6 years, but no matter how much empathy i tried to show him. No matter how dainty or firm I was with him, his insecurity never let him connect with the people around him. That pushed him into anti-social behaviour and him getting called out for sexist or racist opinions just played into his victim complex. I wish we could be friends but that effected others around me.
My own way is that I treat people above 20 years of age as only able to change over months, years, or decades.
They need to find their own process and we can only recommend nonpartisan sources of information like longform moderated debate.
Wow.. it’s never even occurred to me to be nasty to JWs and Mormons who come to my door. :/
That’s so sad.
Most people aren’t. Former JW here. V isn’t entirely right about this
Most people aren't. They just reinforce their own cult belief with the rare people who do. Don't fall for their victim complex
Some folks are just mean to those that have worldviews they don't like, often from their own bad experiences with folks holding those worldviews. Hypothetically, someone traumatized from religious folks may express default hostility towards a JW or Mormon knocking on their door in part because of that previous trauma
I don't. I greet them warmly and let them know right away that I don't want them to waste their time and let them know I'm not religious in any way and am more agnostic than anything. They will shorten up their speech usually after this and will still give you their little book they give to everyone. One time I took the opportunity to engage in a little conversation about magic underpants when I got visited by 2 mormon kids. XD The conversation actually was taken light heartedly and we all kinda laughed about it. I think I left them in a good mood.
@@admiralpaco507 idk i think most people are pretty nice but the religious have a persecution complex from the two bad people they deal with
I was that middle school asshole. Though I got better sooner. I started to turn around my more backwards views in high school. But i definitely became a radical lefty in college.
It was largely because I grew up in the rural midwest where there were literally 2 black kids and like 4 hispanics and everyone else was pasty white. On the playground the boys would play a game called "smear the queer".
I will say though, I think a significant factor for me was having decent parents who taught me right from wrong, even when they were nit always perfect progressives either. It all forlstered a willingness, and desire, to learn and grow to be better.
gay dude here.... totally grew up playing smear the queer (that game where you catch a football and then have to run away from a violent horde of people trying to tackle you) fun game, but like... yikes... it's dawning on me what that probably taught me subconsciously...
I'm glad that my edgy contrarian teenager phase consisted of becomming a lefty.
Though i did almost fall into the incel-pipeline
@@dukestamina Yea, cishet myself but being more knowledgeable and accepting as an adult, looking back is kind of a yikes. Also thanks for the explanation of what the game is, did not think of including that myself.
I cut ties with my two fascist brothers several years ago. My sister, and my dad still sometimes try to get me to simply put my head in the sand. And accept them. I tell them that this is not what I want, and it that sucks. However, just forgiving and forgetting would be far worse. That I would be condoning and encouraging my brothers bigotry. And that would be a terrible thing for them ,and me. I have said that if they choose to change. I would be open to embracing them once again. However, from what I have heard. They haven't changed a bit. So yeah, I have accepted that I may well be estranged from my brothers for the rest of my life.
They are noting special man
This is something I actually learned fairly early on in my life, you can't argue them out of their position. When I graduated high school I took a year off because of a really bad breakup and just had no idea what I wanted to do with my life. I played a lot of WoW in that time and there was this guy in my guild who was super conservative into Alex Jones and Fox New, I was always very left leaning so we would get into arguments on vent and skype late at night. This was 2010-2011 way before MAGA but he had a lot of the same behaviors. I would get him agree with me on something only for him to move the goal post or come back the next day acting like no such thing happened. Eventually I just realized his views were not going to change and I just stopped engaging with him outside of raids.
Quite a few Trump supporters have told me that they just believe the opposite of what's happening.
5:57 I bet you that the best argument most people have ever seen against the highways is Pixar’s Cars.
Fr
The young asshole highschool going to college and letting it go kid was literally 100% me.
Man I just miss my family members, I miss my friends. I want so badly to help them climb out of this insane downward spiral and it hurts so bad when some days it feels like they've gone past a point of no return. It's scary out there, man. But all I know is that we can't give up on these people, they're victim's. And we gotta stop them somehow before they truly hurt somebody.
I learned to let go during covid, my family ignored every single rational option and bought into every single conspiracy theory
Unfortunately, I have to admit he's right. I recently reconnected with a childhood friend and while she seemed to be somewhat reasonable and I really did think I could change her mind because she didn't support Trump specifically, she's just too brainrotted by Fox News and the conservative community where she lives.
Now she's going around telling people I'm argumentative about people's "opinions" because I dared to tell her off for casual transmisogyny (media influenced of course because she is supposedly totally fine with me (trans guy) and my girlfriend being trans but trans women as a whole are "mocking women").
So yeah, unfortunately she's too far gone for me to bother anymore. I hope someone else can do it, but I've spent years of my life trying to drag the good person out of her and she just won't let anyone do it. If she doesn't want to mature past the age of 14 she doesn't have to, I suppose
Logic didn't get them into the MAGA cult. Logic won't get them out.
The question we SHOULD be asking is what happens to the MAGA movement when Trump is gone? Because he ain't got than many years left. And there is no one in the GOP (that we know of) who can excite the MAGA base they way Trump did. He brought a lot of new people into the party. And most of these new people are only there because of him. I highly doubt they would support a generic republican.
If he loses he'll probably do the same thing he did after he lost in 2020 and claim the election was stolen and have some involvement in the 2026 midterms. And because of his ego it won't surprise me if he ran again in 2028.
Another fascist will replace him.
Trump.jr?
@@pamonja4301 Maybe. But he'll be in the shadow of his father and compared to him all the time. I don't think anyone would want that.
Maga is an ideal, not trump
@@pamonja4301 Trump jr is like RFK jr to JFK lol
Free re-education at Camp Freedom & Democracy
Reconstruction 2: the good ending
We cut my wife's parents off from both my wife and our kids. 2.5 years later they came crawling back. Relationship between them seems okay. They aren't convinced, but they generally leave politics alone.
Same happened to my adopted daughter's biological grandparents. They were cut out due to politics. They lost 5+ years of their grandchild's life they will NEVER get back. But at LEAST they keep it to themselves around her.
Not a 100% success story. But it's something? I guess?
I keep saying the only thing you can do that works is to give people a reason TO change their mind, something to change their vote FOR; If their current reasoning is based on whatever, offer them a logically-consistent alternative, like Vaush said, something they can easily look up and find hard data supporting the points you gave them. AND THEN YOU LEAVE THEM ALONE FOR A WHILE, because turtling in 2024 is an impenetrable defense.
Whats weird to me is that I'm with you with this opposition stuff, they absolutely want to be confrontational. But at the same time, the Weird Meme gets them so hard because so much of their identity is wrapped into "I'm the normal one, I am America, anybody else not like me is the weirdos". I see it a lot with my father where he's aged out of being target audience for most ads and media and he feels like he's lost something, like he's not special anymore.
I guess its just more continual cognitive dissonance from the right. Simultaneously reveling in being "the underdog" while opining that "we are the majority, YOU are the weird ones"
Fascism is rooted in cognitive dissonance. "I am unique and special, but also I'm normal and part of the majority"
"my enemy is weak and stupid, but they're also this massive powerful threat to society.
I always say you can't reason people out of something they weren't reasoned into.
You should cover Project 2025 guy trying to claim other people are racist for calling him out on the fact that he was talking about black people when he made a tiktok about how stop and frisk use to be only for “criminals”
It’s so surreal that if I showed this video to liberal family members they would agree with like everything vaush is saying
It's easier to convince a liberal than a fascist, this is why Republicans need to be kept out of office at all costs
I wish Vaush would talk less about politics and focus more on fashion. Politics is boring. Who cares about Trump? Fashion is a way more interesting topic
US policy will stay the same no matter who wins Trump Biden Jill or RFK, But Fashion that matters
@@daraghokane4236 Biden? Wat?
I just listened to Smile and then I see your pfp c:
@@ofanichanyou are the second coolest person in Vaush’s community (besides me)
@@BigOwl51 Oh...........i thought i was the coolest...... =(
Reminder that family is a choice. It is the most important choice you will make in your entire life. Who do you choose to let in? Who do you push away? Who do you sacrifice your own happiness for? What are you willing to give? What do you need them to give? Your parents do not deserve respect just because they are related to you. Don't buy into that filial piety shit. This is especially a problem in immigrant families, but it applies to everyone. Respect is earned, not taken. If your parents treat you like shit and make you unhappy, dump them. You would never take that shit from a partner. You would dump them. The only reason you feel differently about your parents/siblings/whatever is because you have a childhood connection with that person. You have nostalgia for the good times. You think you can change them. You think they'll get better. Think about how ridiculous it is to say any of these things about a partner. People are people. Choose life. Cut them off. If they truly love you, they will chase after you and do everything to get you back. Sometimes they will be lying, sometimes they will be genuine. It's up to you whether to accept it. If they don't really try, then they don't actually love you. I'm sorry but they don't, and they maybe never did. They just loved the idea of having a child, but they don't love you. And there's no such thing as one-sided love. If they don't love you, then you can't love them. It's not love to torture yourself and let someone take advantage of you. Be free. Choose life.
The Jehovah's Witness bit reminded me of when a preacher came to campus so a friend and I were doing free tarot readings to try to rile him up, and some mormons came by, so I offered them a free reading as well. They were actually super nice, so I matched that energy, and I felt super bad when the card for "repression" came up in both my friend's and my readings for them 💀
Has to be one of if not the best Vaush take in years. Thank you so much.
As a previous JW, Vaush is both right and wrong about them. While the end result of going door to door is an immunity to criticism, at base the reason why they do it is that they both believe the message they have saves lives and that NOT spreading it as a lack of love for their fellow man with will leave them blood guilty at Armageddon if they didn't reach out to as many as they could. Also, about that conversation rate, they convert about 1 in a 1000, give or take, though I haven't been part of them for years, so it may have changed...
The excuse for the behavior given to the common rabble is different from the motivation behind the behavior from leadership. There is a reason more than just JWs send people door to door. Mormons do it and so do many other fundamentalist sects and cults. Evangelists are trained to be offensive and annoying, it's not an accident.
The point is to cause a retreat to the in-group, to instill the message that the outside world is a cruel place that will never fully accept you. It often doesn't occur to anyone that you'd never behave like this without prompting from religious leaders.
Of course that's what they TELL you lmao.
It's half true bc I live in a rural area of Texas with a lot of Trump supporters. As a trans woman I have "friends" they'll be nice and say they're supportive of me. Then they'll post transphobic crap on social media but it's ok bc I'm their trans friend? Which I call it out and it just makes things awkward.
They're not your friends. Treating you like a human being is the bare minimum.
Probably the best way to deal with these people is point of the hatred, not the facts. My uncle used to listen to Rush all the time. We were on a drive and he turned on the radio. After we got to where we were going he asked me what I thought of Rush and I point blank said, he sounds like a rude asshole. He’s talking about politicians personalities rather than their policy decisions. What can one learn from him other than just absorbing his hatred? He never talked about Rush and when he turned on the radio it was on a music channel. He’s someone that supports Republicans because he feels failed by democrats, so maybe he’s different than most, but don’t engage on what is being talked about, engage on why and how it’s being talked about.
Get them off all social media. I guarantee you, that is a necessary step. Speaking from personal experience.
I invited my mom to something I'm doing with my friends and I'm having so much anxiety over wondering if I shouldn't have. I want to expose my mom to my friends but the problem is, I don't want to expose my friends to my mom. I've thought about inviting my friends to family things before, or vice versa, inviting family to things with friends, but if I don't like dealing with my family's politics, why would I want to do that to my friends? It's not like I think my mom would be rude either, I'm honestly more worried about her bringing up her weird health and antivax shit than I am about her being anti queer
Advice: say "Remember, this argument is originally about 'X'. Have I convinced you of it yet?" when the subject feels like it's drifted. SO many times have conservatives somehow got the subject changed or pitted me against a more extreme version of my position.
One time I lost a SLAM DUNK (like actually easiest ever) debate because the subject kept changing and drifting making me somehow defend a more and more extreme position. And they were NOT BAD FAITH PEOPLE. It just happened ACCIDENTALLY.
That can happen no matter what side you're on.
An example is when you bring up issues with abortion, they jump to the extreme and say, "What about the 1.5% of abortion cases that are life threatening?"
@@Cashboys No need for extremes. Bodily autonomy trumps any anti-abortion argument anyways
A government shouldn't have the right to override your decision of what you do with your body.
If Joe Biden needs a kidney transplant to survive and you are the one and only possible match, should the government be allowed to force you to give up your organ?
(Don't worry, you'll get it back after 40 weeks)
No, that would be ridiculously inhumane, right?
No difference to a fetus needing your organs.
Also, at the end of the day, the mother is the legal guardian of the fetus and as such has the right to make medical decisions for them.
Like ending life-prolonging treatment (aka "pulling the plug") when the child is in a coma.
You cannot save them. Leave them be and move on.
Wrong. Be a good friend/aqantence reguardless of politics and hope they think twice when they find out your political leanings. Be a good example of the types they try to smear.
@@jacob_massengale And when that doesn't work?
@xaldynnemo47 don't be so attached to the opinions of others. Focus on living life well. If you can't get along with someone, leave them be.
@@jacob_massengale Which is exactly what op said
@@galaxyocicat5660 whos op?
iv got an uncle who was jehova witnes with his wife and like 5 kids. but all their kids one by one became atheist and now they are out of that cult lol. Just took literally all 5 of their kids rejecting the "religion" for them to break free from its mind control.
I’ve made headway by asking questions not demanding logic
When people have to explain trump they struggle because he truly is that bad and they do know that.
“What did I think of the Elden Ring DLC”
I want to dispel a myth: That abusers don't leave you. They absolutely can, and it can absolutely be for bad/selfish reasons. I've experienced it before.
Here are some examples of how an abuser may leave you, if they:
1. No longer find you useful for their purposes
2. Got bored of abusing you
3. Found a better/new victim
4. Are going to face extreme consequences if they keep abusing you
5. Are too cowardly to accept their responsibility (so they remove you to stop thinking about it)
5. Think you may prevent them from abusing their other victims
6. Find it too difficult to you you
7. Find it too easy to abuse you
At the same time, there are many, many bad ways one can exit a relationship in a way that's bad. Often it's literally scorched earth. They realise they don't want to abuse you, and so they "get rid of the evidence" (i.e. make YOU leave by any means necessary, using their power over you). Sometimes it's a petty attempt to "get their revenge" over your perceived unwillingness to submit.
Sometimes they will wait for the perfect moment to leave you, to maximise the pain, because their. victim may deserve it. Sometimes they leave because they realise they can't keep the charade up and need 'fresh meat'.
The only Cult I identify with is the Cult Mechanicus.
❗Debates are NOT a waste of time... It's not about the person you're debating, or most of their following. It's about the percentage of their audience who are not yet FULLY pulled into their cultish content. You said it yourself in your first Pakman conversation, a bunch of your audience are people who were previously in right wing echo chambers, but were pulled over by people like you and him, due to your interactions with the other side
It's more of a yelling match than it has ever been before, so yes. Debates are a waste of time.
@@PillowWillow007 whether it's calm or a yelling match (Vaush has had plenty of both... The idea it would only be yelling now is silly), regardless, Vaush still will make better arguments and is more rhetorically skilled than basically any conservatives he'd be debating. Even if he made a positive impression on less than 1% of their audience, that is STILL useful
@Onetwo These are exactly my thoughts. I was a right-winger back in 2018 and 2019, and Vaush was a huge reason as to why I was able to break apart from the right and lift the veil of political blindness.
As you've also said. It's not about the people you can't "save" or the person you are debating actually, it's about the thousands and thousands of people like me and others back then questioning their political ideology and beliefs, the ones you can still pull away from the right-wing. And in the process you make your debate opponent look like an utter fool towards parts of their audience that still sits on the fence and is still somewhat capable of rational thought.
I am sad that Vaush apparently totally forgot about it. It was people like him who got me out of the right wing death grip many years ago.
What about the impact of exposing your audience to the other sides bs
@@mickdipiano8768 this is only a factor if you are less skilled rhetorically than the person on the other side. Ultimately it's a numbers game which Vaush would likely win in terms of who would influence more people from the debate.
Whereas there are some other people on the left... (Bless them) a lot less rhetorically skilled, who would be playing a more risky game if they went up against a Charlie Kirk or a Ben Shapiro or someone.
Obviously too, you should only debate conservatives with a sizeable platform. Don't give a spotlight to someone with minimal audience for you to try to influence
Thank you for not hesitating to call JW a cult (former JW child)
I cut off my brother in 2016. We spent our childhoods debating political stances where I stayed in one spot, and he drifted drastically right. In 2019, he apologized, but the rift remains
You will almost certainly fail at changing a Trump supporter's mind, but if you're going to try, don't demonize them, and don't hold their past positions against them. A lot of leftists have a smug "How could you ever support Trump??" attitude, which is perhaps justified, but very counterproductive to changing minds.
I try to be compassionate irl but online i can't help but be a mean a-hole about it :/
Good points!!
My brain literally wouldn't let me go to sleep last night after watching part of this, because I was able to spout off factually accurate and well reasoned arguments against Trump for 40 minutes straight without having to repeat myself or even look anything up. If there was any person who could have heard my internal monologue and desperate plea last night, I would hope that none of them would still vote for this evil man. Yet despite that, I know that if I did go on this same rant to people, a significant portion would never change their mind. "...this is how democracy dies...with thunderous applause..." literally one of the most horrendously true statements about a galactic dictatorial imperialist that fits perfectly when spoken in the context of trump... 😢
The one chatter at 17:35 ish has independently stumbled into the LEAP Method. It is used to help people communicate with people with delusions and actually does work. Well kind of. You can never talk someone out of a delusion, but this does help you stay on good terms and, ideally, eventually convince them to seek help.
I’m a former republican who left after Trump took control of the party. That’s not what changed my mind though. I’m currently in college to change my career from enlisted military to chaplain and I purposely chose a liberal college to better understand the opposing viewpoint. Now that I fully understand both sides, there’s no way I could stay in a party being taken over by a fascist element. Vaush is right, there has to be a will to at least try to understand the other side but most people think they’re right. They want to stay right where they are because they think they’re on the side that is right and they will fight to stay there as they are - change is scary and difficult, it’s easier to stay where you are / who you are currently them to change.
As many others pointed out before. It's not so much about the actual debate partner (often of questionable intelligence), but about the direct influence you can have on your opponents follower base. I was a right-winger back in 2018 and 2019, and Vaush was a huge reason as to why I was able to break apart from the right and lift the veil of political blindness.
It's not about the people you can't "save" or the person you are debating actually, it's about the thousands and thousands of people like me and others back then questioning their political ideology and beliefs, the ones you can still pull away from the right-wing. And in the process you make your debate opponent look like an utter fool towards parts of their audience that still sits on the fence and is still somewhat capable of rational thought.
I am sad that Vaush apparently totally forgot about it. It was people like him who got me out of the right-wing death grip many years ago.
Can confirm. Push back from my friends paired with the isolation of Covid put my in a place of heavy self reflection. It was then I realized I was falling down the alt right pipeline and got myself out. Unfortunately I think it only worked because I hadn’t fully fallen into it yet.