Manx Gaelic recording - Ned Maddrell (Last native Manx Speaker)
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- Опубліковано 18 лип 2010
- This is audio recorded from the 1964 by Brian Stowell of the last native Manx Gaelic speaker, Ned Maddrell. Ned was born in 1877 and died at in 1974 at the age of 97.
Ned, who went to sea at 13, found he was able to keep his Manx "alive" by talking to Gaelic-speaking sailors on British ships. He was brought up in the remote village of Cregneash, where "unless you had the Manx you were a deaf and dumb man and no good to anybody."
This video is for educational purposes and qualifies under fair use guidelines.
Losing a language is a tragedy just as much as losing a species of animal to extinction. Long live diversity and not conformity in this world. Hi from Italy.
nosaltres encara parlem català!
manx has snce been revived poorly scripted by welsh and english phonetics when irish phonetics would be properly authentic...hoowever the fact that its taught again in schools and spoken again is phenomenal.
@@JW-sl9ml I think he meant diversity in the true sense, not the bastardized version that is being shoved down everyone's throats today. The kind where many different colors exist on the palette, but they are not mixed into a big sloppy sludge.
@@annodomini975 Irish? It's a Germanic language isn't it? The Isle of Mann was conquered by the same invaders who took most of the UK. Including Northern Ireland, half of southern Ireland including Dublin (Dyflynn, the black pool - a norse raiding base), and a few other kingdoms in Ireland. Actually the more I think about the conquered regions I think gaelic is a dank meme and Germanic invaders assimilating too readily as always.
@@bashkillszombies Not at all influences from norse yeah sure, words like bád/ Boat but the norse invaders like the norman later descendents were heavily assimilated into gaelic culture, this is where names like McSweeney, Gallagher, mcAuley all come from to name a few, they were what were known as gallowglass/Gáll óglaich- foreign warriors and shows heavy adoption of gaelic culture and norms, retaining their superior weapons and armour...like bruce lee "use what is useful discard what is useless" ..it wouldnt have done much good to have known norse in a land where if you need to trade you must know the native tongue.
anyway the statuttes of killkenny 13th century was an attempt of law implementation by england to stop english lords in ireland speaking gaelic, wearing gaelic clothes and even playing the sport of hurling.
My parents were both native Irish speakers from the Connemara Gaeltacht in Galway. My dad's oldest sister was on the Isle of Mann in the late 1940s and spoke Connemara Irish with Manx speakers who answered her back in Manx. She didn't say that they understood each other word for word, but her explanation made it sound like they were able to communicate pretty well without using English (of which my aunt knew very little or none at that time.)
There is a rapidly shrinking population of Celtic speakers scattered through small communities in the Canadian maritime provinces. I've heard many tales of these people going to the old country (first during the war then to this day as tourists) and both sides being SHOCKED that even tho there's clearly hundreds of years of local changes to the dialect you can STILL tell eachother hundreds of stories and family history in any pub without missing a beat.
Manx Gaelic should be added to Duolingo.
Kinda hard when the number of native speakers is in the single digits
I would love this ! I have just learnt that my ancestors come from Isle of Man :-) and would have spoken Manx :-) I guess I'll have to stick to basic Gaelic
@@kayc7620 Cool!
@@kayc7620 there are resources for learning manx currently, if you look for them
@@kayc7620 basic Gaelic? There’s many different types of Gaelic languages 3 dialects of Irish you can learn as well as Scottish Gaelic
RIP and long live Ned Maddrell (August 20, 1877 - December 27, 1974), aged 97
You will always be remembered as a legend.
@Solstisol
He was officially the last NATIVE speaker of Manx. At the time of his death (1974) there were a few hundred who could speak the language more or less fluently, but not native speakers (Madrell & a few others did recordings for posterity). There are now a few dozen young adults (maybe more) 'neo-native' speakers, who learned Manx from a very young age, including doing lessons in primary school in the language.
That's very good to know. So it is a bit over-dramatized just for catching attention. But no doubt any language is threatened if not spoken culturally.
Manx is even being revived outside Man. Here in San Diego my grandpa spoke it as a 2nd language and raised my 2 uncles on it. When I moved here the 3 of them started teaching me (mostly by simply using it around me all the time) when I was 8 or so. So I speak it too. Granted, I speak it imperfectly, having learned it as a 2nd language by people who themselves spoke it as a 2nd language, but when I visited Man I was understood just fine. Now me and my two uncles are teaching our little cousins!
i,m from Donegal in Ireland i can follow alot of whats being said here, the tone an way its spoke sound alot like Donegal Irish.
mark collins Im from Limerick and can barely understand Donegal Irish, Ive no chance here
I don't follow
Can you understand Argyl Gaelic?
Ya I know what your saying most of my spoken Irish was picked up in Oideas Gael and the first thing I thought when I heard this is it sounds like Donegal Irish.
@@gracey2727 An bhfuil mórán eolas agat faoin aon canúint go háirithe? Mar i mo thaithí féin ní bhíonn mórán eolas faoin aon canúint beo ag muintir na Poblachta
There are hundreds of good speakers of Manx, there are choirs singing in manx, original novels being written, and even a school which operates full time in Manx, hundreds more are learning it on the Isle of Mann. Children raised in manx have to be seen as L1 speakers, though I do not know how many there are.
+Petroc ap Seisyllt that's fucking awesome
It's not even limited strictly to Isle of Man, either - I, my sister and our cousins on my mom's side of the family were taught Manx by our granddad since early childhood. Granted, he himself learned it as a 2nd language, so he was certainly no NATIVE speaker. And while he may be ETHNICALLY Manx, he was born and raised in San Diego.
But it mattered enough to him that he became proficient enough in it to teach his grandkids - and he apparently INSISTED to our parents that we start learning it as early as possible so we'd become proficient much faster. He wanted to contribute his bit to the preservation of Manx, even if it was from California.
So today, the 8 of us fluently speak Manx as we learned it from our granddad, and still regularly use it when speaking to each other and we definitely take pride in it :). As kids, it was INCREDIBLY fun (not to mention handy as hell) to speak it to each other as "our own thing" - especially when we didn't want others listening in on us lol.
@@Xandermorph i wish i was raised like that
The issue is that all of the Manx speakers alive today who were not taught the language fluently by fluent speakers of the language are not actually speaking the language "correctly." It's the same problem as Latin. You can't take a language on paper and try to resurrect it and do it properly. Now language always changes and evolves. That's natural. The Manx of today has its roots in the past, but its not the Manx of the past.
@@wanderingwizard1361 English of now also isn't the same as even 50 years ago, so while I lament that manx is not as it was 100 years ago, its certainly better than nothing at all, and even if it hadn't gone extinct it still wouldn't be the same language. Evolution is inevitable, I'm just thrilled its being kept alive and celebrated. That alone is worth it. The hope is that other minority languages will be kept alive too.
As an Alaska Native there might be 60 first language speakers of Tlingit left. I saw Eyak “die” about twelve years ago.
I knew of three elders who were from yet another tribe,a brother and sister and their cousin; the sister died then the brother. The remaining speaker was asked about his cousin’s passing and he replied with “Now I have no one left to answer me.” 💔
Yes, Manx as a living language died out long before Ned passed away. There have been revival efforts but making Manx a living language passed on from generation to generation has been proven very difficult. When pupils leave school, there's little incentive or opportunity to keep on speaking Manx. People, at the end of the day, have to live their life before preserving a language.
@@vivida7160 Latvians, Estonians, All Nordic people’s preserve there languages and almost all speak/learn good English, language can preserve the culture inside a nation whilst the lingua francas of the world can remain just that
@@oro7114 So when did Latvian, Estonian, Swedish, Norwegian, Icelandic, Danish or Finnish die out and when did the revival begin? Can you provide dates? Manx died out and the neo-native speakers in schools now are a result of a revival program. You can't study in higher education and get a good job using Manx, and it's a whole lot of extra work studying subjects in both Manx and English. You'll lose out on a job to a person who got a better degree because he didn't need to use his time to study Manx alongside. Would you like to sacrifice getting a properly paid job just so that random people can feel that all languages are living and healthy and the world is a bed of roses?
@@vivida7160 Gosh that was weird, I didn’t realise we were arguing. Bit of a snotty response. I just like learning and seeing minority languages thrive.
@@oro7114 I think it's a natural response to someone who responds with something completely off the point. The situation of Manx is totally different than languages that just don't have many speakers on a world level. Latvian is the dominant language in the country of Latvian speakers. Manx is clearly not the dominant language even on the Isle of Man. It was dead. How selfish can you be to not care about other people's lives when it comes to how you like to feel about the world.
When I played this recording my Manx cat started meowing.
You know the old saying, “if cats could speak, they wouldn’t.” That goes double for Manx cats. 😜
@Solstisol Ned Maddrell was the last NATIVE speaker, i.e. he was brought up with Manx in the home, he dreamt and thought in Manx . The interviewer learnt the language by studying it from later age- he is a native speaker of English.
Manx Gaelic deserves the attention of all who love it. Every effort should be made to preserve it and document it in full by the people of the Isle of Man. I am looking at all aspects of Manx Gaelic since 15/08/2020 and would appreciate your advice and encouragement. Dia leat.
My Mum is Manx but when she grew up they didn't teach it in schools. Despite the Scottish Government's best efforts, Scots Gaelic is struggling to stay afloat in the tide of English. It's a tragedy.
I love listening to languages I don't understand. It allows you to imagine people are speaking sense. As soon as you pick up the local lingo, it dawns on you that wherever you go, 95% of words are a waste of breath.
@Solstisol Brian Stowell (the interviewer) is fluent in Manx but is not a native speaker. Ned Maddrell was the last native speaker meaning that he was the last person alive who grew up speaking Manx as his native tongue. (Brian Stowell learned it as a student.) Manx is now being revived and has hundreds of speakers and probably has a few new native speakers by now.
There are quite a few new native speakers.
poor man. he had to see the death of his beloved mother tongue.
Most languages that have existed, like most lifeforms, are extinct. It's the way of evolution.
He didn’t see it die, because it died with him. As soon as he died, the language died, thus he didn’t see it die. Also, it’s being revived, which led me to invent my own term for it: Language Necromancy.
I have read that he dont have this languaje as native tongue, but probably he was the most near to an habbitant with this tongue.
@@jmriveros Even if he learned English first, he was a native Manx who learned Manx as a child, so he qualified (cf. dictionary def). One can have more than one native language.
Evolution is bullshit. A pseudoscientific mythology made by the psychopathic invaders to justify themselves. Don't let them fool you. Neither extinction of species nor cultures and languages ones are natural. It's an aberration.
It's great to have a reference to the old Manx accent like this, given that the accent of the revived Manx is so diluted. It's a shame about the quality, though, I'm finding it difficult to make out even the parts in english. Great video!
@michael1916 It is a shame, but they are reviving the language now and have a school which teaches directly through the medium of Manx Gaelic. So the future is bright :) Still though, the language language has suffered and even the Manx accent has been replaced with an English accent due to mass immigration from England.
Interesting to hear how different Brian and Ned's accents are. Really good for a learner to understand which is native!
RIP unknown stranger
That's really cool. I can hear the Irish, Scottish, Welch, Cornish and all the Gaelic influence on it. Nice to know we are all so close. Tá an lá go deas
Welsh and cornish are related, but far back. Irish and scots gaelic make more of a familiarity, especially as someone who speaks scots gaelic. Ach, deagh puing
@@toriatsikatten8941Its believed a Brittonic language like Welsh was spoken on Ellen Vaninn before the Gaelic language was introduced there which would explain the influence. Is teanga álainn í
@@deaganachomarunacathasaigh4344 Ceapaim tá an Gaelainn na Mhannin baineann agus má tá sí beidh sé "Is teanga álainn í". Níl? Gabh mo leithscéal, táim ag foghlaim Gaelainn.
@@internetual7350 Sea tá sé. Bhí sé uath-ceartúchán. Cá chomh fada a bhfuil tú a'foghlaim Ghaeildhig agus cén fáth a piocadh tú nGaeildhig?
@@deaganachomarunacathasaigh4344 Is Éireannach mé agus mar sin foghlaim Gaelainn sa scoil agus amach scoil. Is aobhinn liom an teanga agus ceapaim tá sí an-tabhatach mar tá sí ár teanga dúchais agus tá sí i trioblóid mar tá daoine go leor sa tír gan Gaelainn. Is Gaeilgeoir tú, ceart? Fios agam tusa mar féacheann sinn fiséain faoi Gaelainn.
Hello Reader, I am From Scotland i have stumbled across this and been stricken with curiousity and a slight overwhelmming sadness.. let us ponder forward.............. I think the Earth and the trees die, after hearing such sounds from people. They miss it, They're living things to, We have taken so much from here. When can we ever repay mother Earth?
This is what you sound like to your pets
yeah, probably.
Lol
@@roningram5877 swear
An-suimiúil ar fad a Sheáin ach bheadh sé i bhfad níos fearr leis na fotheidil, má tá sé agat. Beir bua!
Níl faraor.
+Sean Ó Briain
Nach bhfuil éinne gur féidir leo foth-theidil a dhéanamh?
+Lorcan Mac Muiris Déarfainn gur féidir, ach táim fíor gnóthach le déanaí.
b'fheidir ar facebook? n'fheadar
OMG this is weird...I speak Irish and I can understand most of wat he's saying!!! How weird!
There's nothing weird about it, he is speaking a dialect of Gaelic, all 3 derived from old Irish Gaelic
Where in Ireland are you from? Like what dialect did you learn
@@gachrudgaelach Its not a dialect..
They're 3 different languages.
The 3 main irish dialects are very different and some can understand other goidelic languages
@@adhamhmacconchobhair7565 If your going to comment at least have some idea what your talking about
@@gachrudgaelach They are different languages. While they are all descendants of Primitive Irish, they aren't dialects. They each have their *own* dialects (Connacht/Munster/Ulster in Ireland, North/South on the Isle of Man, etc.), but they're fairly certainly separate languages.
Amazing to hear - who I assume is Ned - speaking english in a 99% Scottish accent in parts of this great audio clip. I suppose that geographically and historically it would make sense to hear an old-timer speak in a Scots (or part Irish) accent ...even more so as Manx (along with Scottish Gaelic) as many of us know, is the result of the Irish language spreading across the water a long time ago.
However, one of the reasons that I'm amazed by this clip is because the half-dozen folk who I have met from the Isle of Man over the years - most of them born there - all sounded like scousers! ...and many more here on UA-cam have various mixed accents from the north west of England.
I've met many top-quality folk from the north west of England and have nothing against them (so please don't take offence), but If Ned's mostly Scots accent (with a hint of Irish) used to be commonplace (but exists no more), then I'm desperately sad that it too died out (for good so it would seem)
So glad that many youngsters on the island are seemingly being taught Manx these days, but it's weird to think they could be speaking it with a Lancashire or Cumbrian accent! lol
Really wish that when I was at school in the 90s (in Scotland) that my pals and I got taught some basic Gaelic. Sadly, that was never gonna happen in a million years with the Brit-obsessed labour council landscape at the time - who hated anything distinctly Scottish (or un-british) in a historical sense.
It sounds like a north east Antrim accent. Do you know why the Manx accent changed? Just a lot of gentrification from England?
I don't think his English sounds 99% Scottish. It has echoes of Scottish and Ulster English but also of the far Northwest of England (Cumbria).
@@PhilHoy97 If I remember a former colleague correctly (who once worked in the Isle of Man) he said that over the decades, a LOT of people from both Cumbria and Lancashire migrated to the Isle of Man.
@@Optimus18 The IOM is a melting pot really for accents, from what I’ve seen there is a division mostly along class lines: with lower class households tending to have more scouse in their speech, the middle having northern/midlands accents, and upper tending to have more south England accents.
And the 3 of us (my grandpa belonged too when he was alive) are members of the San Diego chapter of the Manx Society, which is a group of Manx-descended people - almost all old-timers - me, my uncles and 2 other guys are the 5 youngest people there. About half of us altogether speak at least a little bit of Manx, and about half of THAT half can speak it with more fluency.
I dunno how many Manxmen live outside Man, but there's a decent number in San Diego - enough to form a club at least lol
One of my late relatives a few generations back now, spoke the native manx. Her surname was Boyd and she was one of two sisters from Peel. Her christian name was Emma and apparently she wasnt very amused by the fact that neither my father or my uncle spoke the native tongue. :-]
Amazing language. Amazing place.
I'm glad this language isn't lost. Yet. It's sad there are no more native speakers born to it. Such a long history to come to an end. I find this video very sad in a way. But I'm also sure it has motivated some in the re-birth of the language. And I really do hope there are some native speakers being born.
Brian Stowell. Brian learned Manx later on in his life. He wasn't a native speaker , although he's probably the most competent speaker of Manx today.
@Solstisol David Clement of the School of Scottish Studies interviewed the last two Manx speakers sometime in the seventies. They were from different ends of the island and I think didn't know each other
No sound recording of native speakers from the time when the language was still widely spoken, since it died out too early for that. (But there are some written records in phonetic notation which help understand the pronunciation.) There are, of course, recordings of Revived Cornish.
@SeanOBriain I studied pre-history and early history, and I learned some Scottish Gaelic, too.
I want to see the revival of regional languages and cultures in general. One may say that the 'cultural unification' (melting pot) is a natural process. I think that people start to realise the value of local cultures now, exactly because so much have been lost in the last 100 years. Revival of regional languages would mean a real diversity. Diversity meaning to be proud of your heritage without being negative towards others.
I'm learning German and Japanese now, so my schedule is pretty tight. But I really, really want to learn one of Celtic languages in the future. My personal favorite is Welsh, but Manx is fascinating too.
@Solstisol David Clement of the School of Scottish Studies recorded the last two Manx speakers some time in the seventies. They were from opposite ends of the island and didn't know each other
Iontach go raibh taifeadh mar seo déanta don deireadh cainteoir dúchas
sheol Devalera trucailí sna tríochaidí chun na taifeadtaí sin a dhéanamh.
@AidrianODoughaill I agree - it sounds as if the recording was made at a gathering where everyone is throwing in their tuppence worth and its hard to make out when its is Ned and when it is Brian Stowell or someone else entirely. A precious recording nonetheless.
My two uncles speak it better than I do, probably because they started hearing it when they were toddlers. But even so, the kind of Manx we speak together is probably exactly what you'd expect to hear from a 2nd language speaker's view of what is frankly a ball-buster of a language :P
Even today I don't always lenite my consonants correctly, and if I'm being really lazy I won't do it at all. But really, consonant-lenition is among the hardest aspects of ALL Celtic languages, let alone Manx.
@AidrianODoughaill it's difficult for sure, it's kind of like cb radio, you need to train your ear to listen to it properly. i don't speak manx, but I can make out bits and pieces because it's phonetically similar to irish.
"Yes, please put the microphone there on the table next to A FRIGGING TICKING CLOCK"
If wasn't placed next to a clock - it was a very high quality microphone that was sensitive to any background noise, and it happened to pick up a clock in the room - but it wasn't placed next to it.
@@NikoChristianWallenberg how can you know though
This sounds very similar to donegal irish, beautiful recording
@theworldvideos1 That's a good question, and hard to predict. The future will rest with the families. It will only survive if it is accepted as a community language, rather than merely a scholarly one.
This is my first time hearing a pure native Manx Speaker. I'm felt so bad to hear that this language is extincted, but I'm glad they revived it.
It'd never been extinct, there are about 2000 speakers today
@@MadameCorgi seriously there’s that many?
exactly :)
It would be interesting to know whether in 100 years time, there would be native manx speakers !!!! Of course there are people who speak Manx, as a learned language, but what would they speak it to their children, when they're born - That's a different thing !!!!
Will youtube still be around to show a video of the last English speaker?
God, I hope not.
AbuBishir i hope :vvvvv
Both are bad lol
@MacKinley
What 🤣
Beep boop.
Despite me not knowing what hes saying I'm still sad that the Englishmen of the past tried to destroy these languages.
Shads mixed up English is a recent language The native British were also deprived of their language by the Norman conquerors , albeit a few hundred years earlier. No particular people want to oppress others, saving the very people who still do , and it sure isn't the English.
England is no more !
Better find a new scapegoat.
Tbf it was other Manx peoplle who saw/see the language of something of the past which needed to be destroyed in order to be more modern and international. The mantra was 'that was never a real language'. Oh the joys of globalism. As Manx culture and national identity became less Gaelic and more Britsh the need for Manx Gaelic obviously became less so. So called Manx speakers today don't really speak Manx as it was since the Manx never wrote anything down. Most resources are in fact Irish in origin and Scottish less so.
Alex TY
Alex Well, But IOM was never part of the UK but a crown dependency.
Gods Elect England still exists, it’s just a country in the United Kingdom now.
@MattSteidl I'm sorry - but a handful of similar words doesn't imply that two languages share the same roots. Telefís is Irish for television, but you wouldn't say that Irish is derived from Greek or Latin. Show me a peer reviewed journal to backup your claims.
😢
@MattSteidl Like I said - I'm not disputing a geographical influence. That does not state anything with regards to the roots of Germanic and Celtic languages being of the same stock.
Scots and modern English both evolved from the same language, but Scots is not English. Scots has been evolving on it's own for centuries. I suppose a parallel could be drawn between Swedish and Norwegian. Both fairly mutually intelligible, but different languages. The debate on whether Scots is a language or a dialect is in dispute, but since there is no real universal definition of each - it's difficult to say.
@MrNorthernSol There are some genuine Scots speakers left in the countryside of the Northeast around rural Aberdeenshire. But in general what you said is accurate.
@MrNorthernSol Doric is a variety of Scots innit
@MrNorthernSol Doric isn't based on Scandinavian varieties. It is influenced by them, but it isn't a scandi lang. Perhaps you're thinking of Norn.
No such thing as i defined " scots language" east and west dialect, for example ,are unique in themselves
Sad to hear the last Manx speaker.
Fascinating. Though a bit hard to make out, the pronunciation sounds like a mixture of Welsh, Scottish and Cumbrian or Lancashire. I think the accent or pronunciation of a language is very important part of it. I wonder how different it is to a modern Manx accent? Which from what Ive heard, is very similar to nearby northern English accents.
Now i think that is what my parents who only speak Polish and some Russian hear when i watch movies in english
Why aren't there closed captions on this video ? I'm sure you could contact the manx museum to look in to it ..
*I appreciate that this video was uploaded almost 10 years ago now, but with respect to Sean Ó Briain who uploaded it, it's as misleading today as it was back in July of 2010. The most common definition of the term **_native speaker_** is; **_"Someone who learned to speak a language as part of his or her childhood development"._** On that basis, clearly Ned (Maddrell) wasn't even close to being **_"...the last native Manx Gaelic speaker"._*
*Literally thousands of children on the Isle of Man were being taught Manx Gaelic in school during Mr Maddrell's lifetime, and long after he passed away in 1974. I, along with my four brothers, our parents, aunts, uncles and cousins etc, are ALL fluent in Manx Gaelic, which we regularly chat to each other in. Not as some sort of novelty or teaching exercise, but as our regular mother tongue. So I wouldn't be too keen to try and confine Manx Gaelic to the history books just yet!*
I respectfully disagree with you, but appreciate your comments. There's a difference between learning a language at school, at it being the primary language of a household for a child (which is really what a native speaker is). Also, fluency in a language is different from you being a native speaker.
I speak Irish. I learned Irish all throughout school - but I see a difference between myself and someone who grew up in an Irish speaking region, where their command of the language is so much stronger, more poetic and they can express themselves in a much more dynamic manner. Irish is native to Ireland, I speak Irish - but I am not a native speaker.
Ned was most probably the last native speaker of Manx. The Manx language is still alive and there are new native speakers, but the saibhreas of the lanuage is partially lost. The blas is not the same as Ned's generation.
I'm happy to see Manx's revival and followed it for years, but a lot of the language's core was lost when Ned died. Brian Stowell did a great job preserving some of it. may he RIP.
@@AnGhaeilge Thanks very much for your reply Sean. I was genuinely interested in reading what you have to say. Needless to say I agree with your last paragraph wholeheartedly, but I don't have a problem at all in accepting that we'll have to agree to disagree regarding everything else. Just out of idle curiosity, does it seem like (almost) 10 years since you uploaded this video? So much happens over a whole decade. It reminded me of the considerable number of family and good friends I've lost since July 2010. Primarily just from old age, so I found it quite emotive watching your video again today. Thanks again Sean, and best wishes to you.
I would live it if you could add a few Manx subtitles.
@@DrAnne-mc8er How I interpret the term *native speaker* is someone for whom the language in question is the language they were 'born into' - the language in which their parents first spoke to them ('mother tongue') and the language in which they first learned to speak. There may well now be children born into Manx-speaking homes, where Manx is used as the sole or primary language (and a wonderful thing this is too), who can legitimately be called *native speakers* . But it is important to make the distinction between these post-revival children, who did not have a generation of native speakers before them to learn from, and pre-revival speakers such as Ned Maddrell. Terms like *original native speaker* and *neo-native speaker* could be useful here. This reminds me of the situation in Brittany, where, although there are still some original native speakers, the vast majority of Breton speakers are of the neo-native variety, having learned their Breton from those with French as their first language; the phonetic influence of French is very noticeable.
@@rhapsag Hi Busker! Thank you so much for your thought-provoking opinions and comment. I suppose in the most basic of terms, I'm just concerned... fearful even, that Manx Gaelic will go the way of all the other _'lost tongues of the British Isles'._ I fully acknowledge and respect your interpretation of a _'native speaker',_ even though I personally don't think of a _'native speaker'_ the same way. Neither is right or wrong. I suppose it's just down to personal opinion, which I'd like to think you don't have a problem with.
Again personally, I don't differentiate between a _'native speaker'_ and a _'fluent speaker',_ who lives in their native country. Though as I say, I accept that's just personal opinion. I'm very interested in your UA-cam name by the way. Do you speak Welsh? Do you actually _'sing'_ in Welsh? I absolutely love traditional folk songs sung in Welsh. Do you play a guitar or other instruments? Sorry to sound so nosey, but I am genuinely interested. Anyway, take care, stay healthy, and please be considerate of those around you x.
@bugstrut It is a language. Irish, Scottish Gaelic and Manx all share the same roots - but they are all individual languages and are not all mutually intelligible. Although, some phrases and words would be understood - the spelling and pronunciation varies from language to language. The accent of the Manx people I'd attribute to alot of people from England moving to the Island, causing a direct influence on the accent. It's rare to hear an authentic manx accent, few have it. Mostly the elderly.
They belong to a dialectical continuum , that before the 17th century was the gaeldom (the sense that all Gaels where a common people or "nation", the English broke apart the gaeldom, as prior to it the common European term to refer to the Irish (Gaelic) peoples was Scot, still reflected even today when referring to countries, Ireland is scotia major, Scotland is scotia minor, and nova Scotia in Canada is named after the gaeldom as that colony was founded when the gaeldom was a far more relevant concept.
Slane Ihiat to ya Mr. Stowell. :)
3X3
@Solstisol:
Per the title of the video, he was the last _native_ Manx speaker. One can still learn Manx (much like one can learn Latin, even though there are no native speakers alive), but the original line of native Manx speakers ended with this gentleman.
There are revival efforts underway to resurrect the language within modern Manx communities. It should be noted the people in today's Manx communities are all native English speakers.
@SeanOBriain At least thats somehting, Good to see children learning the language :) thats crazy that even the manx accent is disapearing.
Tha e mar Gaelg Alabanach, cinnte. Chan eil e Eirreanach.
@xhemexx The spelling is not orthodox because written Manx is relatively new. The pronounication, verbs, nouns, adjectives and structure are quite similar to Irish and Scottish Gaelic. It is not related or does not resemble any Germanic languages.
@Hibernian hail The I.European languages are thought to have originated somewhere in the Russian Steppes, and spread in two distinct directions. The people who spread these languages also, for the most part, maintained certain cultural practices and structures that can be traced through many I.European/Iranian ancient peoples. The Celtic languages developed later on in Europe from a parent I.Euro language and not the other way around. The name, these early I.Europeans had for themselves, seems to be 'Aria' or something along those lines(hence the term 'Arrian' and also where the name 'Iran' comes from). Those who travelled East into Anotolia*, Persia, Afghanistan and India, were named I.Iranians, to differentiate them from those who went in the other direction, into Europe. Sanskrit, Pashtun, Farses, Sikh are all examples of Indo Iranian languages..none of which are Celtic. Sanskrit legends were found to be similar to Irish ones. These two were specifically compared, because they are both on the extreme edges of where I.European/Iranian languages reached in ancient times...NOT because people thought that Sanskrit was a form of the Irish language.
Would put you in mind of Donegal Gaeilge
This man is a character in Thomas Pynchon's "V".
Is there any recording of Cornish?
Yeah, I learned that awhile back and I was too lazy to correct it. It is confusing how there are two languages with nearly the same name.
Clearly there are two people talking here, if not three. Which one is Ned Madrell?
It's hard to hear because of the background noise, but this sounds like Irish to me. I've listened to some younger learners of Manx and it's diverged a bit more from Irish. The reason for this may be a break in continuity from speakers who have passed away and/or the misinterpretation of written to spoken. Although we in Ireland reformed our spelling which differentiates it more from Scots Gaelic. The written form of Manx gaelic has broken down and words are given an English written pronunciation. There's nothing wrong with that, just a different approach... One could argue, it makes it easier for the learner. It's fairly easy to read Manx.. Go n-éirí libh!
For some reason I can't reply to most comments on here. But I must say something to the fellow who calls himself 'Hibernian Hail'. Celtic languages are simply a branch of Indo-European languages, as are the Germanic languages. Germanic languages ARE NOT Celtic, both originated from a single parent language(I.European) and split off into thier own tongues. The Germanic languages are thought to have split off earlier than when Latin and Gaulish languages split apart. This explains why there are many similarities between Latin and Gaulish(Though we do not have a full picture of Gaulish). You seem to be mistaking the Celtic Languages as the parent languages, off of which all others split. This is NOT the case....There is no serious theory that exists that supports your statements.
The Celtic people were a MASSIVE cooperative group with common language and beliefs. You seem to be bound on some shit someone named "after the fact". The Celts kicked everyone's asses until the Roman Empire , So until then You were a Celt, You spoke it, you traded with it, They killed your Giants and slayed the beasts,and they were here in North America. They never called themselves Proto-Indo-Europeans, That is one thing I KNOW FOR SURE..And all their enemies called them CELTS....
William Dziekanowski It's like arguing we all actually speak TADPOLE from our Evolution 2 billion years ago from worm to amphibian with a ribbit. These were the first time our ancestors made sounds in the air, we are proto-gaseos vibratacons .
Gaulish is most similar to Ancient Greek with words like 'Epos' popping up in both
I believe the original poster is talking about "Scottish Gaelic" when he says scots which obviously is a mistake on his part.
@SeanOBriain It DOES. In Roman times, on the Continent, many Germanic tribes were regarded as Celts and vice versa. Because in the early days they used to have similar cultures and habits and even a common proto language. Example with Scottish Gaelic and Bavarian/German: lament, cumha, Kummer. Children, Cloinne, Kloine. Girl, maighdeann, Maedchen. Eagle, iolair, Odler etc.
@SeanOBriain "The Bavarians emerged in a region north of the Alps, originally inhabited by the Gauls, which had been part of the Roman provinces of Raetia and Noricum." ... "The name "Bavarian" ("Baiuvarii") means "Men of Baia" which may indicate Bohemia, the homeland of the Celtic Boii..." ... "The Boii (Latin plural, singular Boius; Greek Βόϊοι) were one of the most prominent ancient Celtic tribes of the later Iron Age. (Rankin, D. (1996). Celts and the classical world (2nd ed.). London)
@MattSteidl Ok so - Cite a peer reviewed journal to back up your claims. Similarities in languages does not imply shared roots, anymore than it implies a geographical influence between two different languages.
I would assume the Irish spoken in County Down was very similar in sound to Manx
No idea. I know there are conversational groups and what not, but you'd have to ask someone living there to get a clearer picture of the current state of the language. I would say it is better than it was doing 10 years ago. So, that's a start I guess.
I still think you don't need to be insulting.
Also, Welsh Cornish, Irish, Scottish, Breton, Manx are in different sub-groups, yes (Brythonic vs. Goidelic). But they are all still part of the larger family of Celtic languages and have shared influence.
Scots is a Goidelic language which is in the Celtic language family so it which is related to Irish and Manx. Scots I believe has had a lot of English and Norse influence though, which may make you believe so. =)
@Solstisol question 1: he was the last NATIVE BORN speaker,he learned it from childhood. He isnt the last to speak the language. Usually there is death involved when you name some one "The last XX" otherwise it would be rather stupid. Question 2: Usually you have information about the dying language and can tell what is silly noises and what isnt. just beacuse he is dead, doesnt mean you can't find information about the language. e.g. the Rosetta stone or this recording.
@xhemexx That's a pretty ignorant comment. Firstly - Celtic languages are in no way related to Germanic languages. Languages are group by branches based on what they descend from. Secondly, Manx has nothing in common with the Brythonic branch of Celtic languages - it is derived from a primitive form of the Irish language - So it shares alot in common with modern Irish and Scottish Gaelic.
@Hibernian hail, indo-european is a family of languages, not a branch. Germanic and Celtic are two of many branches of the Indo-European family, and are only very distantly related.
Here's a diagram for you:
upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/IndoEuropeanTree.svg
Very interesting diagram. Thanks.
@SeanOBriain I am German. Germany and France used to be Celtic territories before the Romans and Germans came. But there are quite a lot of similarities between older Continental "Germanic" dialects like Bavarian and Celtic languages. I mean, the Irish and the Brits didn't come from nowhere! They have their roots on the Continent.
I thought there was language continuity amongst the Rabbis regarding Hebrew? Is that not correct?
Great to hear Ned Maddrel speaking Manx Gaelg, but one thing I can't understand is why it is not written more like Scottish or Irish Gaelic, I feel it would benefit Manx Gaelg if it was more understandable ( particularly in writing) to other Gaelic speakers..
Ach le sinn raithe, tá súil agam go mbeidh sí linn go deo..
It appears to be phonetically spelled Irish. I can understand most written Manx; however, the quality of the recording is difficult to make out what he is saying.
Wonderful that it is being revived. RIP Ned Maddrell
The people who developed the orthography were familiar with written English and Welsh, not Irish or Scots Gaelic.I think it's cool--it makes it more distinctive. If you want it more like Scots Gaelic, just pretend every other letter is silent. :)
Te Me Galeg Dansee Ilaim!
You are correct, Germanic and Celtic come from a common root, but have since diverged in the last 2,000-3,000 years or so, and most of the territory of Celtic speakers has been taken by the Latins and Germanics.
Yes, Lorenzo, it's tragic. Where I live,(Sweden) we're slowly transforming Swedish into English, which is also sad and not good for any of the two languages,
because they are both distorted this way, not beautifully spoken or written.
Why is Swedish transferring to English? I thought there weren't many English immigrants in Sweden.
Tá sé sin go hallain ag éisteacht leis seo.
@michael1916 Well yeah - but it's not suprising, considering the population of the Isle of Man is only 80,000 - it doesn't take much to completely destroy it's culture and heritage.
im guessing he's the guy who sounds older in this conversation
Is there a transcription?
This would be fascinating to those of us who have some Irish or Gaidhlig, but could someone add subtitles in English? Go raibh mile maith agat!
Tá sé brónach go ndearna na Breataine riamh iarrachtaí cuí a shábháil ar an Manainnis.
@MattSteidl Parts of Germany and France may have had Celtic tribes - but that doesn't mean that German or French is related to celtic languages. Germanic languages share no similarities with Celtic languages. If you spoke any form of Gaelic, you'd understand.
@RaphaelIsASexyName
In 1964, shoe recording technology was at its apex! The following year shoe phone technology would be introduced, alas decades too early for Americans.
Subtitles would be nice.
Mar cainteoir na Gaeilge agus an Albainis féidir liom a thuiscint ar a lán de cad atá á rá ... tá sé níos cóngaraí don Albainis, tionchar Lochlannach teacht chun tosaigh.
As a speaker of both Irish and Scots I can understand a lot of what is being said...it's closer to Scots, the Norse influence come to the fore.
I guess by 1964 there were still other speakers.
@Solstisol um....