Відео

Probably gotten these comments already but RGL is fairly light when it comes to weapon bans (see WildRumpus' video on said bans, you'll see that there aren't as many as you might think) but more so issues in community management.

TF2 competitive players when they have to actually let the meta develop instead of just banning any new strat before seeing how it develops (It's the worst thing that has happened to them)

I agree with other comments that you should change the title to better reflect what the video is about, specially the dumb bannings

Weapon bans are so stupid. God forbid the meta becomes interesting, but no just stock items and maybe some unlocks.

Competitive scenes on casual games was a fucking mistake

First, thank you for the video. Second, I think your anger and frustration with the leagues (while very valid) kind of led you to make some misjudgements. I think all of your individual points on balance are valid, eg weird and unjust reasoning for banning loch load. But I think your criticism gets lost in these points. More generally, the leagues seem to be lost in the sauce. When you get lost in the sauce, the bigger picture and taking a step back becomes vital to getting out of the pudding. That's valves lack of support for the game. The leagues can only do so much short of modding the game. Overall, it's hard to have a standard when the comp scene has basically grown without support from the game dev. Comp match making didn't help. Also, it's been a very long time since I've played the game so um. What I'm saying might not be valid.

Competitive mode should be removed from TF2 and instead be a purely community thing.

Seeing competitive weapon bans feels like a watching kid trying to build lego house, not using half of the provided details and then crying that they can't finish a building

I don't know why all the bad bans are in normal 6v6, I mean the rest of the formats have bans that are more understood due to the number of players or the objectivity of how broken they are. But in 6v6 it seems that they don't like TF2 and want to play cartoon quake

Nearly seventeen minutes talking about a dead gamemode that nobody plays in a dead game that's in the throws of another silly protest. What was the point of this video, anyways? To remind people that, yes, Valve Comp sucks? We've known that for years now. Why do you think it takes even longer than usual to find a server for it than it does to find one for something like Watergate or Degroot Keep?

flasre$h upload :D

I am a map maker myself, I made pl_eruption for competitive after I was approached to improve it for higher divisions. Some people were amazing and helped me a ton. But I reached a place where I am even concerned to test the map. The feedback I am getting is insane sometimes. For instance "Stop mapping for tf2" isn't the best kind of feedback to receive. Other people were complaining that they were even playing the map. (Again not everyone is like that, but a big majority is). Such a behavior makes me "NOT" want to map for competitive anymore. When eruption was in alpha where frankly it's super easy for me to make changes, only a small minority of comp players were willing to play and test the map. Players want the map to already be textured and detailed and look pretty in order to consider giving it a shot, but that's super hard for me cause I have to make huge changes afterwards while worrying about balance, detailing, clip brushes, the skybox etc. And even when I am testing the map on Beta I am not getting informed that they are playing the map, nor am I receiving any feedback. The environment sometimes is toxic AF. Thankfully there are some really good people in the comp community, they were responsible for helping me reach eruption on Beta. Wish more people would be as kind and helpful as them. (I don't want to name either parties here for obvious reasons). I want to point out how such behaviors can really discourage other people in creating stuff for your community, If I am feeling bad for even mapping or putting my map for testing, do you really think I will put the time and effort for anything else in the future?

Not to take away from this video because ETF2L is garbage and the only way to play 6s if you're stuck in Europe so these are all super valid, but I do think it's important to point out that other regions are way more reasonable on pretty much all of this. Most negative stereotypes about competitive are really just true things about ETF2L that don't apply elsewhere

First of all I'd like to apologize, this video was not supposed to be a hit piece or a boycott of the league. I wrongly painted the comp and top players as 'evil people' for lack of better wording, and made a wrong assumption of how the league thinks. Although I still agree with what I had to say in the video I admit that I poorly worded various points I made in my video. In one of the first comments I had I replied that I was open to being wrong, this sadly got drowned out by cheer amount of commenters. For example the "is the market garden unbeatable" wasn't meant to be me making the point for unbanning the MG. Something that I also worded poorly is that "Lower division players should be treated equally as experienced players" Obviously in the context of voting this is not a good idea. I'd like to apologize again for my statements, I didn't realize what kind of damage I could or have done by making such a emotional, mean video. I do also agree with what a lot of the people had to say in my comment section (mainly the people that are actually prem or similar). For the title of the video "The ugliest of competitive TF2" yes this is a bad title, people are arguing that I should have been talking about "the history of nonces, rapists and cheaters plaguing the game" This is obviously the ugliest side of competitive TF2, however this is not for me to talk about, this is either for the law or the admin team as I am not informed on this side of the league. I have changed the title to "My issues with competitive TF2" I was very frustrated with how the league was managed and that everything seemed to be word of mouth. I love ETF2L and Competitive and I want it to change for the better. I did not mean to create a fucking reddit comment section on my video of all the people blaming competitive for the current state (casual) tf2 is in. I hope my video can still be used as healthy discussion about transparency and or trying some new things. I'm sorry. -flaresh.

fix your mic and get off your high horse

you've been playing comp for like 2 years opinion discarded

And this is why you Never listen to competitive players to balance a weapon. Valve nerfed BASE Jumper into the ground and yet.. NOBODY uses this and it sstill Banned. Nice balance. Also the Gas Passer is banned because it can go through tiny walls if throwing in a correct angle. Yes, its an overpowered strat so im glad its banned. Valve please nerf.

"The Ugliest Side of Competitive TF2" no talk about pedos on etf2l, only about bans XD

unrelated but I feel like a complete moron for not knowing that the gunboats resistance doesn't apply when rockets hit other players until like a month ago 5k hours in btw

......Holy hell and here I am thinking the smash bros stage list is too small

highlander lol

not a single commenter who agrees with this fake ass video has ever actually played 6s

Maybe the sheer degeneracy in the community but okay... On another note, I think this video is written very clearly to pander to uncletopian level players, and considering most of those people are tweens with no critical thought, they will just complain about comp more. (yay more flame wars and uninformed opinions!) I do agree we should shake up the meta, at least for some experimental cups, but I don't think adding back more random shit that makes the game slightly worse is the way to do it. The loch n load got banned not because of the sentries, it got banned because it's incredibly annoying to give demo another 100 damage long range projectile. The wrap assassin got banned because scout shouldn't have a random projectile he can just yeet across mid and have a 3-5% chance to hit the med with for approx. 70 damage. It just makes everything more fair since you just don't have these very annoying things you have to consider once you take 100 damage across mid with a mach speed projectile. I agree some of the bans are unfair, but I'd rather have a fun and fair game which takes skill instead of the market gardener. I don't understand this apparent obsession with random garbage that makes the game slightly worse. Even if we do fuck up sixes and make it more like pubs it's not like the pubbers are gonna start playing competitively. I don't mean anything mean, we need a civil discussion and I want to nurture that.

This is an ancient take, but I still hold it against Etf2l for arguing to play Vanilla+Kritz back in the day. Some items like the detonator could allow people to play in a totally different way, by allowing a full-time pyro. I think most of the voters want to ban these items before they affect the overall meta of comp 6s, not sure if that's a good or a bad thing, seems dogmatic. Playing against pyros, lochs, market gardeners, and snipers can be annoying; but after 17 years of Tf2 it is nice to try something new.

nothing can be worse than the nursey incident, and the people that continue to defend him

TF2's comp scene sours the game for everyone else. People endlessly parroting garbage like dane's 'trickle down balance' has done immeasurable harm to the community and the game itself. Valve bending over backwards to nerf fun weapons into the ground just for the sake of these turbo nerds is sad to see. These people should just play quake, because obviously that's the game they'd rather be playing.

the way that they handle bans is very dumb, but imo, it's fair to want to ban things that aren't particularly fun to use/fight and don't contribute anything interesting to the game (notably, base jumper and steak fall into this). they really should have a better system of voting though lol (p.s. greetings from 20BrassBeast)

Dont be deceived too much by RGLs experimental cups. They will unban things for the cup but will always say the didn’t get enough testing to unban them for the season

Wait, there's a _good_ side to Competitive TF2?

There is literally no point in unbanning weapons that just make the game worse to play lol

inb4 stocks ban

etf2l is such a joke with bans already that finding out the reasons (lack there of) makes it just come off as genuinely fucking insane like having the reason to ban the loch be the sentry damage reads like an april fools joke. Also 6:34 detonator got unbanned in ozfort around s37 same time the loch got banned in ozfort lol

Wow they got the Base Jumper nerfed (a parachute mind you) so you can open it once(a long while ago) and then they still banned it.

cowards, i play against 15 wrangled level 3 sentries on the shounic trenches 100 player tf2 server and i never complain or demanded a wrangler ban

DOWNWARD SPIRAL DOWNWARD SPIRAL DOWNWARD SPIRAL

ETF2L is just a miniature world order. The 1% control the World!

Great video! These would probably make more people interested in playing comp too

Hey hi there. Comp is a lot of fun, just make sure you don’t live in the EU

I remember back in like 2014 or 2015 I had my one and only discussion I had on a comp forum and it was about banned weapons. Banning items was mostly done to "overpowered and overcentralizing weapons", so I did the forbidden thing and mention that the crusader's crossbow and ubersaw are exactly that and are not banned (you WILL run the crossbow you WILL run the ubersaw). Boy, did they get butt hurt. Ever since, I realized a lot of my favourite weapons are banned and there's no chance for things to get better, and I lost interest in playing competitive TF2 forever.

12:04 Wait what is gunboats plugin? Does it make it so even if you take dmg while hitting someone you still take reduced self dmg? I thought you always take reduced self damage with gunboats 😅

Comp is just a dogshit little mod that people who hate the normal game play.

2025: banned all unlockable weapons

They basically ban every weapon that makes Heavy viable in 6s because he isn't fun to fight against and then call him a trash class.

“Due to how close it was, we decided to go with what premiership voted on.” This is the electoral college all over again.

you are a bottom div player

meow

Hey, a few things are speculations in this video and are indeed wrong. Firstly, every suggestion brought up by prem players is first discussed internally and in-detail with prem players, even holding meetings at some points to get in depth info about whether the gun is indeed OP or not, the reason this is first only brought up with the top 8 teams is because it is very unlikely a player in mid will have the same level of game knowledge as those who are in prem. Also having thoughts from those who have been top 3 for a while helps a lot, because the game knowledge from bottom and top prem is also night and day. There might have been some polls that were prem players only (?), but for as long as I have been a part of the discussion, in my personal experience, every issue is addressed with those that bring it up and then polled on the entire league (I was indeed a part of polls that were vast majority prem in favour of banning, but the weapon stayed unbanned because of the rest of the league voting against it) To simplify it: the prem division's opinion is weighted so heavily because those at the top understand the full potential of what's being discussed, therefore can better judge if it too strong As for the loch-n-load, the reasons you stated are the correct ones and those that were brought up for why it should be banned. Everybody said the reasons etf2l named on their post were dumb, and they were as you pointed out in the video. Now, battalion's backup was VERY strong, way too strong, hence why I, along with many others used it and have been for a while (not just wG and tf2easy). As much as I miss it, the ban is justified. I used to think winger was just a tool that made 1v1ing a scout as a projectile impossible, and while the jump boost might seem minor for repositioning, it can completely change the trajectory of fights in situations where instead of just shaving off 0.5 sec it has you completely avoid a route and saves MANY seconds. Also, the angle you approach highground from and whether you are seen approaching it is very important. Not to mention gaining access to areas you can't get to otherwise (also, scout is the most powerful 1v1 class yes, that's what he was designed for, but in 6s is far from being the most powerful or impactful class. Scouts carry in lower divs but good projectiles will always win you the game) I really do understand your confusion about the weapon pickups, solemn vow, etc. but I won't go in depth on every discussion that was held to potentially ban or keep a weapon, there can be a lot said about each of these things I already broke down, and even more about the ones I just mentioned. Because this game has unbelievable depth making these choices is very tough. I feel like a lot of your points were thrown away for meme material, swept under the rug as "this is useless" or just biased without taking any consideration of what implications it might have on teamfights. (i.e. gas passer) Overall it's good you brought up these things, although it feels like the video was only made to shit on etf2l and "prem players evil" as you only gave a side that benefitted your arguments. I'd say the only worthwhile takeaway from this video is that we need more communication and reasoning on changes, which is fair. Everything else you mentioned has been discussed in detail, and syncing RGL and etf2l whitelists would be awesome :) (as previously mentioned many times as well) p.s.: the game is in a really good state right now, and the league is seeing improvement going forward

7:16 sun lamp tf2