Відео

I don't work for a federal agency, I work for a well known corporation. I have had an informal reasonable accommodation for the past 22 years of a later shift start time to manage a health condition covered by the ADA (I have 34 years total service). I've had approximately 18 managers in the 22 years and none of them cared about my later start time or even mentioned it -- except a recent manager. He got his manager and a fellow manager to gang up on me. I won't go into all the details, but to punish me for an assignment he thought I did wrong, when I didn't, it was decided that I need to start coming in earlier when my shift time had no relevance. Year after year I have gotten excellent performance reviews and I've been able to perform all functions of my job, essential and more with the later shift time. It has had absolutely no undue hardship on the company or the organization. Rather I have had an excellent reputation, been very productive, and been a valuable asset because the quality of my work is exceptional. I tried to get a reasonable accommodation. My union gave me bad advice and said I should request a 2 hour window of time in which I can arrive to work -- 10 a.m. to noon. I consistently arrive between 10:30 and 11:00 for years. That's what I can manage consistently due to my health condition. My managers manipulated the intent of this request saying that they will accommodate my starting work by 10 a.m. The intent was to have a window of time in which I can arrive, not by the earliest time of that window which would actually mean arriving before 10 a.m. in order to be by 10 a.m. Their reason is that this is needed for the "essential" function of collaboration. This is pretext. I have never had a problem collaborating with anyone in order to do my job effectively and correctly. The accommodations focal did not do the interactive meeting correctly. She had an interactive meeting with my managers only where they decided without me what my accommodation would be. At the so-called interactive meeting she simply read a script of what my accommodation was decided to be. When I tried to interject my rationale, I was ignored. I hung up on them because it was pointless to continue. I submitted the matter to Ethics. They don't know what they're doing either. I did get additional health provider documentation and went ahead and filled out a new reasonable accommodation request form narrowing the window of time to when I actually arrive to work and clarify this is intended to be within a window of time, not by the earliest time of this window. I had to take this to the company Health Services clinic where the doctor, just like the first time, expressed skepticism that I would get the accommodation and if I don't then I will have to take a medical leave. My paper work went to the accommodations focal, the same one. I told Ethics, what is the point of having another interactive discussion when it is the same accommodation focal who botched it up last time, and the same managers. It seems to me that Ethics needs to intervene and say that I was wrongfully denied an appropriate reasonable accommodation last time, and this time it must be granted. I told Ethics too that the stress of this situation has worsened my conditions. The accommodations focal told me to go ahead and have the interactive meeting again and if I don't like how it turns out then I can file an Ethics case. That implies I probably am not going to like how it turns out, and I already have an Ethics case open. Ethics told me that if my managers again deny my request and my conditions have worsened, and I can't do my job according to their stipulations, then I can take a medical leave. That's insane. Because with my requested accommodation I can do all functions of my job with excellence. Furthermore, it is not right that their mishandling of this situation, which is at this point abusive, has caused my condition to worsen and they say I must take a leave for a condition they caused? This is clearly illegal what their tactics are. I have tried to find an attorney -- I have contacted about 20 different ones. They all say either they cannot take my case or they are too booked already. Where am I supposed to get an attorney? It seems most only want to take a case if they are ensured to get a huge settlement. I did file a complaint with our state human rights commission that addresses disability discrimination. They just started the investigation. I am going to take this to a higher manager who was my direct manager 20 years ago. If that doesn't work and the state complaint doesn't work then I'll try the EEOC, or may go ahead and file a complaint now anyway. I have spoken with some people in an disabled employees association. They told me they hear stories like mine all the time. WTH is wrong with this company?

I feel like I’m doing all the work for my lawyer.😢 My federal employeer gave me the same pretext, that leading 2/3 of the teams projects does fall within your essential duties even if you’re a GS-12 with 13s and 14s on the team who have never lead the project. I was basically given a second project to lead after requesting an RA and that was their excuse. Then I requested an alternative assignment as an RA when they gave me that excuse. Nope! This falls within the scope of your duties.

Excellent presentation, thank you!

99.9% of the time you won’t get through a PIP it is used to try to get rid of someone, usually because you don’t fit in with the boss, not because you need to improve. HR will never support an employee they will only protect a company so going to them is an instant lose. External mediation, or new job is likely the best option. If you choose mediation, you should be looking to negotiate an exit package not keep your job. The company is not going to listen to you or your side. So don’t think they will be rational and do what is right, they just want you gone. The reason this advice in the video is false, is because it requires the company to do what is legally right, most companies will take the hit legally to get rid of you.

I was removed from my position and told to find a new role. Because of things out of my control. Missing work ticket (Managers & QC constantly take them), ground wire had the wrong crimp (I can't issue my own parts, im verbally told use what you got), over consumption of materials (drawing and design changes on the fly by engineers). Fact of the matter is my manager hates that I challenge him on what it means to be a electronics tech and a govt contractor. Manager and engineers find a problem with a design they work to change it and while im on work stoppage they instruct people to clean using machinery (floor scrubber, waxer) and charge to the govt project. I insist i can go home and clean because that's not what I was hired to do. Non experienced people were hired, i trained about 2 then boom PiP 😂 okay. Ill play your game, and now im going to make noise.

Pfft HR doesn’t do payroll or benefits at my company. Accounting does. & when you complain & struggle cos you’re an accountant not hr, you get put in a PIP.

Today, I was told about being on a secret PIP. In the same tone when you call someone out for something they say that's very rude, and then they tell you "calm down, it was just a joke". We all know it isn't a joke. I'm not taking it as a joke and I didn't even laugh. I continued being professional and am acting accordingly going forward. It's too fresh, being today, but I'm on this video, so that should tell you something.

I got a PIP because of retaliation based on me disagreeing my boss for one thing, her believing I spoke ill of her behind, which I have never done so, and my one simple mistake. My performance evaluation is "disrespectful and dishonest." I have never had such feedback in my 30 year career. HR director and my boss are friends. There is no time for me to provide my story about those incident. They already decided. The plan is super-vague and subjective and no success measurement. I'm now reaching out to my network for an opportunity.

PIP is your way out.

A PIP is basically your employer telling you they don’t like you there and they want you gone…but they want to get a paper trail going so it looks like they made the effort to work with you to improve. PIP’s are a dog and pony show. If you’re presented with one, your days are already numbered.

I think its best to not even contest it, just do it even if its bullshit which in my case it was. If youre "defensive" about it it never goes well. And i use air quotes because you have the right to defend yourself in that situation but at that point HR does not care and is there to support the supervisor and company not you. I almost beat mine and when i went into the room they told me they got rid of my position. Id rather have laid off then fired for cause and even if you were on a pip and you werent performing well that would still be better to other employers then being fired for cause or because you shyed away from adversity/difficult circumstances. That is a glaring character flaw. When times get tough you bail. Whether that was true or not if i quit or if i got fired i wouldnt have been eligible for a severence package or for unemployment.

Its just a paper trail to cover the ash of company HR if the victim makes any legal claim when fired. Act accordingly.

great thanks

These PIP plans are fishing expeditions used by management and HR to find enough cause for letting an employee go they don’t like. If you ever get placed on one, resign immediately.

Nope I got a PIP once because my new manager was interfering with my software engineer job and not letting me get stuff done. Old boss gave me great reviews. If they think that way I don't want to work for them. I had a 2 month plan. After a month I got told I was being better. A week after that I landed a great job. Went to my manager told her "I only stayed to get paid until I could find another job." and gave her a 2 MINUTE notice and walked out.

Hi Kyle, How can I reach out to you? I am in need of legal advice for a personal matter at hand related to PIP.

PIP - Here is a set of tasks and goals you can't possibly complete or meet in the hope you get demoralized and quit.

Even if you dont have a pension...force them to remove you, you get at least unemployment and possibly a severence package. This is the whole reason these employers try to intimidate people, so they dont have to pay that. Stay strong and firce them to do what they actually dint want to do which will trugger consequences for themselves. This is the only reason they are doing this shit and trying to bully and pin it on the employee, they want you to think they have all the power...they don't

This gets really dicey when your at a company for 30 years, with a pension. They want you to leave...DO NOT LEAVE. force them to wheel you out of there with a generous severence package.

Personally, id have a lot of money in an emergency fund, and then wait ti get fired. The employer is doing this to avoid paying severence and unimployment. Fuck them, force their hand, they want you to quit/find another job so they dont have to ootentially pay severence and unemployment. Fuck them, force them to do want they dint want to do.

Im not on a PIP, im on a PAP, going on three years. After that amount of time it becomes clear as day to Stevie Wonder to see whats going on. The longer the employer pushes it the more obvious it becomes the employer is the aggressor. Im 55 snd have been at my employer for 30 years. They recently stopped offering pensions for new hires. I am in fact in the oensiin ststem. Ckearly they want old timers with pensions out of the place. Phuck them.

Get on FMLA each and every year for eternity. Anxiety and stress is enough. Get the medication and flush it down the toilet. You dont even have to use the days, just get on it on it.

Dont go to HR. i had HR come to me asking what the problem i had with my manager, i told them i didnt have a problem, that pribably totally perplexed them. Them coming to me puts me in the kings position. The peasants (in this case HR) petition the king, not the other way around

I trust the author of this upload means well, but any/ all of this will ONLY work if you are working for a huge company. In medium to smaller companies HR is working hand in hand with the supervisor/s and directing them on what they can get away with. Insisting on things in writing when HR is telling the supervisor to have the meeting via Skype will result in a black cloud over your head. This advice sounds reasonable and well and ultimately is, BUT PIP is not about being fair or reasonable. It's about justifying the company to fire you without legal recourse and setting up a case for you not to be able to file unemployment benefits. That is what PIP is really about. Never forget that, and don't think for a minute you will ever escape PIP because you won't. It is your surest sign you have to move on or at the very least talk to to an attorney who will ultimately tell you the same things at $350/ hour.

This was very helpful. Thank you for putting this together.

I don’t believe it is always misused. If used properly by a manager that has given past feedback and wants to use the PIP as a more robust tool to help retain an employee and correct performance issues, it is a right thing to do. I was put on a PIP in this context and had legitimate performance issues. I think though the trust/reputation impact from the performance issues that were corrected and the PIP, gave me a strong desire to reset at a different firm. But in my context it was used rightly. And I fully agree HR is not your advocate, or at least less so than management’s.

If you know your doing your job well and you think you can find a better one , than I would say just take that time and interview at other companies . Only stay on a PIP if there is a severance at the end of the tunel. Now if you know you messed up , or were not up to par. Than def focus on doing better . One because, trying to do better makes you better and 2 even if it doesn't work out atleast you gained more experience for your next role

Does a PIP follow you ? Even if you aren’t going into the same line of work?

1. Can an outgoing supervisor write the PIP and wait for the incoming supervisor to make him sign your PIP on his first day at work, before even meeting you? 2. And when the performance evaluation just received is "meets expectations", negative comments but not a single "fail" rating? 3. HR refused to remove one of the findings in the PIP even though I brought evidence that it is a complete lie? And the other two findings are minor but in an exaggerated written up? And I've heard later that the new supervisor who signed the PIP without even meeting me, was told by the outgoing supervisor who wrote the unsupported PIP to fire me, not to pass me Please address that in your video. Thank you, great job, excellent videos. Finding another job would be a good solution, but it takes more than six months to a year to find a new federal job. They can fire you in only 60 days when put on a PIP.

This guy is obviously a lawyer for a corp. Anyone else knows that this PIP shit is horseshit, including the HR golems. ESPECIALLY the HR golems.

why would you fight to stay somewhere that doesn't welcome you? If you've been pip'd, they don't want you there. It's best for everyone involved if you leave and find somewhere you're appreciated.

Question-School HR only offered me to take unpaid medical leave and I had to use 26 sick days over four months to maintain my medical insurance . They knew my disability was based on not being able to wear a mask. They warned me that I would have to pay full med benifits as of End of year if I didn’t come back to work. Masks were still required to enter the building. The previous year I worked from home for mentioning i could not wear a mask. Is no pay accommodation effective? Well not for this 62 year old single woman. That was my job they didn’t like my view on mask efficacy. Terminated me for job abandonment because they didn’t want me to work from home. Paraprofessionals dont abandon their students. We get kicked bit hair pulled spit on yelled at hands mauled by students nails and still go back to help.

My manager harassed me and put me in PIP... I have done all what you said in my email reply to manager copying HR DIRECTOR but guess what I am still on PIP and I am working one to most renounced non profit organization. I am.so disheartened by this and I have taken stress leave now... but I have to be back I have to be in PIP again... my manager is still working without any problems.. guess she has been appreciated of the abuse she did to me

(16:50) I got surprised by a PIP without the manager telling me. The lack of feeback and transparency made me angry. Now, I also surprised them a resignation. What comes around goes around.

I honestly never seen a PIP used in good faith. If you know your craft, don’t waste any more energy proving yourself to a company that doesn’t value you. If you are on a PIP, start looking or another job. Most companies use PIP for that exact reason - for you to get the hint and quit

I was placed on a plan for requesting FMLA by HR..A month later FMLA was approved and Retroactivly approved...instead of removing the PIP, when I completed it My manager said I never shoukd have been on one...so they fired him and started another PIP on me again. They refused to remove it even after approving my FMLA...HR...will not listen and did not listen in fact he said my conditions weren't as bad as a water heater busting..So HR can but won't remove it.

I have a question, i had to exhaust all of my leave/vacation time at the beginning of the year due to major surgery/FMLA. i came back to work in April, with zero sick time or vacation time. It refills yearly, in january. So as of now, any sick calls or time off has to be approved and unpaid. I heard rumors of a PIP for attendance, which hasnt been horrible since surgery but its unreasonable to expect that i never have to call in. Would this be unfair/illegal since my time was exhausted initially due to FMLA?

Awesome video!

it's so sad to know there are so many horrible bosses.

What if there's no HR?

You forgot #1 mistake "assuming you shouldn't look for other jobs and leave your employer soon as possible". Even if you pass PIP, they will know that they can bully you into squeezing more work out of you (especially if this is a salary position), and will make your life living hell.

My manager tricked me to sign the PIP after an informal meeting. Lucky enough I signed the document half way and realized that I hadn't even read what was written. It was shocking to find out the document was PIP. I rejected all the allegations and very quickly it was withdrawn. My manager did not consult HR before issuing PIP. I'm just wondering if HR needs to be informed before manager issuing PIP? Also I got this PIP because my line manager made mistake, so I was the one to be blamed. The reason was I spent too much time to fix her error. What can I say 😨

Lol, just got a “Pre-Pip”. Already looking for another job. I’ll beat the PIP easily and leave anyway. Ironic for a company motto being “Employees First”, yet not even taking the time to understand why the employee may not be performing up to standard, even after having stellar performance marks until that point, and even making them aware of the personal reason for the temporary decline. Oh well, its like they always say- “People don’t leave bad jobs, they leave bad management”. ✌🏾

My sister is an HR manager and they had multiple cases of employees undergone a PIP who passed and kept thier jobs. Thier purpose of the PIP is to really fix what is wrong and to improve employees work performance. In other organizations maybe their purpose is different. The key is to look at the PIP details if the goals and expectations are reachable.

Can a employer denied you a reasonable accommodation for a reason and when you explain them, can they then change the reason after you appeal the denial?

Thank you so much for this. I missed an urgent email from a boss while I was away sick. My inbox receives 1300 to 1500 emails a month. It's unmanageable but I am suddenly due to that 1 missed email "not doing my job". Upsetting. I am a documenting queen who does nearly double the workload of my predecessor. Your advice was greatly helpful on how to proceed with caution now. No PIP yet, but I'm preparing as if it was happening just so I am protected.

Constructive dismissal.

Thanks for your work 🙏🏻

There is no surviving a Pip. Your mgt has decided to terminate you and are just doing the legal CYA as requested by the HR dept. Why try to stay with people who want you gone? Use the time to find another job and say goodbye to these crumbs.

If I get PiP'd, I'm going to rip ALL of their skeletons out of the closet.